The authors of the Western canon are given a script of Breaking Bad. For the purposes of this thought experiment, they can comprehend everything that occurs and everything about the setting and language. How do they rate it?

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Anonymous Sat Jul 30 00:32:06 2022 No.20757579 [Reply] [Original]

The authors of the Western canon are given a script of Breaking Bad. For the purposes of this thought experiment, they can comprehend everything that occurs and everything about the setting and language.
How do they rate it?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 00:33:24 2022 No.20757582 >>20757579 That 4th season, especially the second half was pure unfiltered kino

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 00:43:09 2022 No.20757617 >>20757579 I was going to write a large effortpost on what Dante, Virgil and Sophocles would have thought about it but I decided against it

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 00:45:05 2022 No.20757627 >>20757579 They would rate BCS higher BB to BCS is what Romeo and Juliet is to Hamlet /thread

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:36:36 2022 No.20757833

>>20757579
>le drug man cool
>le cancer make someone completely change their personality
>you can be a dormant druglord criminal mastermind sociopath but never know until you are in your late 40's
>you can go your entire life without any exposure to crime or poverty or anything that makes someone turn to crime and then when you get cancer you learn perfect criminal instincts
>le cancer drug man scientific genius chemist make money by selling drug instead of just getting a job as a pharmacist, or starting his own business, or being a consultant or something
>mr fring cool businessman straightens his tie a a corpse after blowing up in an explosion
>drug addict guy say bitch a lot and drive in go kart sad because not happy from money. he float to ceiling while on drug because drug make feel good
>look at this foreshadowing of a cool massacre. actually it's just a plane crash :)
i gave this stupid fucking show a chance when it got all popular back in like 2013... i watched four and a half seasons of this garbage. it has the literary merit of a low tier anime... something for children... like a marvel movie or something like that. any great writer would see it as the garbage that it is. in the words of nabokov "a laughable mediocrity”

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:40:26 2022 No.20757849 >>20757833 imagine bothering to write this and imagining its incisive cynical critique when such a reductive runthrough could be written of any novel or fictional work imaginable

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:48:22 2022 No.20757874 >>20757833 >le cancer make someone completely change their personality They made it very clear he was always a prideful asshole anon. The cancer did not change his personality it just took away fear of acting out.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:51:43 2022 No.20757880 >>20757849 >ALL ART IS EQUAL CHUD ah yeah i remember the part in "In Search of Lost Time" when the guy exploded and had all of his skin burned off and then straightened his tie.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:53:22 2022 No.20757887

>>20757874
i'm sorry bro but it would take more than a curable cancer diagnosis to make a middle aged person go from being a doormat to a doer in the such a short span of time. i understand that people can change and get their limits pushed, but in real life, how many curable cancer patients really do anything similar to this? if any?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:53:46 2022 No.20757890 >>20757833 retard

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:55:53 2022 No.20757899 >>20757833 this desu, it's just slme wacky cartoonist low brown entertainment, pretty good for what it is. Hilarious some people think it's some deep masterpiece.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:55:57 2022 No.20757900 >>20757627 Go to sleep, Mr. Gould.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:55:59 2022 No.20757901 >>20757890 >NOOOOOOO MY MOMMY AND DADDY JUST BOUGHT ME A BREAKING BAD POSTER FOR MY ROOM BECAUSE I CUT DOWN MY SCREEN TIME TO 14 HOURS A DAY WEHHHH keep crying child. you will discover better tv shows eventually

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:56:52 2022 No.20757905

>>20757887
He was not told it was curable in S1 anon, he believed he was going to die.

There's lots of unrealistic shit in the show, like the mercury explosion, Gus death scene, the fact that Walter didn't just get shot before he ever got so far, but I think the personalities/motives of the characters were handled well.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:58:32 2022 No.20757912 >>20757887 >how many curable cancer patients really do anything similar to this? that's why it's fiction, you fucking retard

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:59:12 2022 No.20757916 >>20757899 Vince Gilligan is literally modern, inferior Shakespeare, that still makes him the greatest artist of the modern era

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:59:33 2022 No.20757918 [DELETED]

>>20757833
This desu, it's just some wacky cartoonish low brown entertainment, pretty good for what it is. Hilarious some people think it's some deep masterpiece. I guess it makes sense considering the average person isn't capable of appreciating truly great art and so something as silly as BB seems incredible to them. Also a lot of pathetic wish fulfilment.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:59:55 2022 No.20757919 >>20757912 at what point did i say it wasn't fiction? take a long hard look in the mirror..

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 01:59:59 2022 No.20757920

>>20757579
>The authors of the Western canon
anon, that's hundreds of people
>For the purposes of this thought experiment, they can comprehend everything that occurs and everything about the setting and language.
anon, the limits of one's knowledge defines you as an individual. If they know more than they did in life then they are not the authors of the western canon anymore, but bizzare humonculi

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:01:41 2022 No.20757928 >>20757880 >when the guy exploded and had all of his skin burned off and then straightened his tie. look at the le list you typed and think again whether this accurately reflects your position faggot

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:02:33 2022 No.20757933 >>20757918 Vince Gilligan is literally modern, inferior Shakespeare, that still makes him the greatest artist of the modern era >>20757920 based BTFO of OP

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:03:52 2022 No.20757939 >>20757918 >>20757899 does breaking bad have anti-bots?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:04:00 2022 No.20757940 >>20757933 Television is generally inferior and will never exceed film in artistic merit. And even then there are better television dramas than BB or BCS.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:04:15 2022 No.20757942

>>20757905
if they read true to you then maybe i'm being too harsh on it... but i just don't buy his character arc. he goes his entire life being a fairly sensible guy who keeps his head down, yet he's a chemistry genius. instead of accepting "charity" (or rather, the money he was technically owed by his old science biz partners) he chooses to become a criminal. when he could've just put that type of effort into like becoming a consultant, or inventing a new drug, or becoming a pharmacist... all types of jobs which would make him more money than the meth business. like how would a sociopath swallow their pride for 40 years of their life and then suddenly unleash it on the world ? idk

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:04:58 2022 No.20757947 >>20757933 >>20757916 bots

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:07:00 2022 No.20757953

>>20757928
>such a reductive runthrough could be written of any novel or fictional work imaginable
this is the point i'm responding to^

my position is to point out specifically ridiculous, stupid, mediocre scenes and plot points within breaking bad that make it less than worthy of examination by the authors of the western canon. great works of fiction do not contain so much
ridiculous, out of context garbage. let me know how that doesn't support my position and i will attempt to clarify

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:07:34 2022 No.20757958

>>20757942
retarded critique of a work of fiction considering what all happens in the real world. for example, the movie compliance: everyone would say the plot is shit and unrealistic, that is if they didn't know all that happened for real. So there's nothing at all inconceivable and something "not-to-buy" about Walter's decision (there are, however, other non-realistic parts of the show like Gus not killing them instantly when they start messing with him just because of a few percentages)

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:10:17 2022 No.20757970 >>20757579 Lmfao look at all these pseuds and baiters trying to be all contrarian and shit. Reminds me of that tine when puppies were trying to gnaw at my pants

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:10:20 2022 No.20757971

>>20757942
He didn't live his entire life being a nice/reasonable guy. This is the whole reason they put the scene of him telling his old friends to fuck off early in the show, so you would know oh this isn't just about money this about his pride.

He wanted to be a big powerful man his whole life and he goes into crime to fulfill that. He likes how it makes him feel.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:13:20 2022 No.20757980 File: 21 KB, 300x300, 96AE29E1-0522-41B2-A5FE-43AB64AA2F95.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I would rather see the authors of the western canon react to this.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:14:06 2022 No.20757984

>>20757953
ok lets try it in a shorter way
metamorphosis
>le man wakes up and he's suddenly a cockroach (unrealistic) and this is anxious for him!!!
don quixote
>le man is delusional and fights against his illusions but these are le meaningl!!! repeat for 700 pages
moby dick
>man goes after le whale because...well he just does because yarr!! because whale is a whale and you need to avenge le missing foot instead of, say, quit being a sailor

etc. etc.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:14:24 2022 No.20757986 >>20757970 >Reminds me of that tine when puppies were trying to gnaw at my pants is that your fetish or something?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:19:30 2022 No.20758002 >>20757579 I've always thought BB would make a good novel; surprising there isn't a fanmade novelization, considering how many autists are out there.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:25:03 2022 No.20758018 >>20757986 Its not my fault if you've relegated yourself so deeply in your basement, spending your life away cooming to porn, that you can't even contextualize a bunch of puppies without thinking of it as a fetish. Go outside anon.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:31:05 2022 No.20758056

The fly episode would be removed for the filler it is, of course.

The only thing that I think anyone would be tempted to change is the ending. Television as a format often struggles with endings. Breaking Bad has a good ending by TV standards, but it isn't the apotheosis of all its themes and just feels like a pittering out.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:32:31 2022 No.20758065 >>20757970 Do all BB fans have such a laughable superiority complex about their glorified soap opera?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:32:42 2022 No.20758067 >>20758018 >reddit spacing yeah, it's a fetish

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:35:15 2022 No.20758082

>>20757833
What did you honestly expect, it's television. It's purpose is to entertain you like a dumbass while trying to come off as sophisticated. You can't make anything deep with it.

I feel the same way as you do, I really wish TV/film was half the medium people think it is.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:35:53 2022 No.20758086 Shakespeare would steal the plot and write a tragedy with it. Just imagine how great the poetry would be.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:38:16 2022 No.20758092 >>20757940 >And even then there are better television dramas than BB or BCS. it's like saying there's better dramas than Shakespeare

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:40:04 2022 No.20758103 >>20758056 >a pittering out. that's literally what spiritual death is. that's literally what moksha is

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:40:28 2022 No.20758106 >>20758092 Sopranos and Mad Men shit all over breaking bad

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:40:38 2022 No.20758107 >>20758056 nothing wrong with fly. idk what else you could do with then end, they checked all the boxes >Walt finally admitted he did it for himself >Jesse got away >Walt died That's the important stuff

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:54:36 2022 No.20758172 >>20757579 Not as good as The Shield

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:57:41 2022 No.20758180 >>20758106 Sopranos suffers from the Seinfeld syndrome and Mad Men is way inferior to both BB and BCS on every single aesthetics level

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:57:51 2022 No.20758182 >>20758107 I think the final conflict should've been with Hank and the DEA rather than the neo-nazis, who were minor villains in the grand scheme of things.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 02:59:36 2022 No.20758194 >>20758182 I mean sure, it was little weird to have them as the "final boss" since they came in so late but I'm just saying thematically the ending was good. It hit on all the things it needed to.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 03:08:38 2022 No.20758236 >>20757579 i think they would consider it kitsch with missed potential - clearly made by talented people but limited by commerce

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 03:16:32 2022 No.20758267 >>20758236 >clearly made by talented people but limited by commerce Literally most of shakespeare.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 03:20:15 2022 No.20758288 >>20757579 That 4th seasons, especially the second half was pure unfiltered kino

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 03:44:51 2022 No.20758401

BB-BCS is the Greatest Work of Art in the 21st century

BB & BCS taken together as 1 complete work represent the best of TV, the best of Film, and really the best of all Art of the 21st century for Vince Gilligan is the 21st century Shakespeare with all that this title implies.

Let's begin by acknowledging the obvious. Gilligan is not Shakespeare. Although Shakespeare wasn't merely a writer but a playwright and thus also basically a show-maker (the plays last as long as TV shows), TV is fundamentally inferior to Theatre

Vince Gilligan's genius was in treating the forces of capitalism behind TV to deliver theatric, dramatic genius, which is basically the same struggle Shakespeare had to contend with (the capitalism of *his* era).

That's why Vince Gilligan is the William Shakespeare of the 21st century. No other work of TV comes close. The Sopranos suffer from the Seinfeld effect, and other examples, like Mad Men, are inferior to BB-BCS in every aspect that pertains to Aesthetics

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 04:33:18 2022 No.20758547 0/10. This show is normie goy garbage

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 04:38:15 2022 No.20758556 >>20757579 Absoulte solid 10/10, best TV series ever, it is good even on a /lit/ standard

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:04:04 2022 No.20758633

>>20757887
It's well established that he wasn't always a doormat, dumb faggot. Even stoners can comprehend this show, it's not exactly subtle.
The show is just a character study of a dude who was once upon a time on his way to being a big shot, then choked because of his own ego and was so incredibly butt devastated that he spent the next 30 years avoiding any and all risk while his life crumbled around him, telling himself it was everyone else's fault until he was handed on a silver platter the ultimate an excuse to lash out.

>but in real life, how many curable cancer patients really do anything similar to this? if any?
I know more than one dude who's gone off the rails just because they got a bit too old for their liking. Not drug lord shit, that requires drive and competence, but going full coke and hookers and blowing up their entire life.
It's a well worn cliche that people who play it safe for too long can eventually break and go nuts, Walt's just a catholic schoolgirl who got his first taste of dick.
Most people don't have such a clear, singular catalyst for going off the rails (welcome to fiction, life simplified), but every fucking day someone's had enough and decides to shoot up a school or inject heroin into their balls or have an affair.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:14:21 2022 No.20758664 >>20758547 This. Anyone rating it higher than this is a retard and needs to get off this board. The "greatest show ever" is still lowbrow normie goyslop.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:18:14 2022 No.20758671

>>20757942
>he goes his entire life being a fairly sensible guy
So you didn't watch the show.

> instead of accepting "charity" (or rather, the money he was technically owed by his old science biz partners)
Yeah, he did feel he was owed, which is why he wouldn't accept it as charity, dumbfuck. If someone smashes your car and refuses to acknowledge it for 20 years, are you really going to smile and say "thank you" if they make a big song and dance about "gifting" you a new car out of the kindness of their heart, knowing that they actually believe that? Maybe, if you're a more well adjusted person who lets shit roll off their back, but not if you're a pathological egomaniac like Walt.
Add to that, Walt wasn't owed shit, he smashed his own proverbial car and left the company, the fact that he felt like he was wronged is just further evidence of the very maladjustment that caused him to break bad.

>when he could've just put that type of effort into like becoming a consultant, or inventing a new drug, or becoming a pharmacist... all types of jobs which would make him more money than the meth business.
He already tried that, got burned once, and is such a bitter faggot that he noped out of the game. The criminal game appealed to his ego because it allowed him to say "fuck you" to the estalbished systems that he felt had let him down, and allowed him to make his own rules.

>like how would a sociopath swallow their pride for 40 years of their life and then suddenly unleash it on the world ? idk
He's not a sociopath, he's just a faggot and a coward. The whole thing is just a metaphor for a midlife crisis, lesson being: don't be a cowardly faggot or you might wake up one day to find you're everyone's buttmonkey, and when it hits you that life is finite and you were too scared to actually do anything with yours you might blow the whole damn thing up.
Fucking autists shouldn't be allowed to engage with fiction.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:18:47 2022 No.20758673 >>20758664 >>20758547 quality criticism anons, keep it up

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:19:06 2022 No.20758674 >>20757627 BCS is trash for trash people Nobody cares what happens to a born psychopath.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:20:36 2022 No.20758678

>>20758633
Breaking Bad's greatest sin isn't that the script is full of cliches, one-note psychology, and stupid melodramatic plot developments, but that all of it is expressed in this overtly derivative overtly slick Western television style where everyone has the same dramatic cadence. Compare Tennessee Williams or Eugene O'Neill or Arthur Miller or Edward Albee's dialogue to Breaking Bad, Last of Us, MCU films, and a whole lot of modern television 'masterpieces' and you'll see how homogeneous and stultifying everything is. Television has never been in a worse state than now but nobody realizes it because the endlessly remixed spectacle garnished with slight 'depth' and 'characterization' (though expressing little genuine psychological reality) is enough to fuel pseuds to churn out video essays praising things that have been done better basically everywhere else.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:21:11 2022 No.20758679 >>20758056 What did you think the ending lacked? Seemed like a pretty solid wrap up to me. What do you think would have served it better?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:22:56 2022 No.20758682 >>20758674 except Jimmy McGill wasn't born a psychopath, hence the tragedy. it's why BCS is the Hamlet to BB's Romeo and Juliet (Romeo being Heisenberg, Juliet being Walt)

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:25:01 2022 No.20758687

>>20758678
Good criticism, but I think it's more a fundamental problem of TV in general rather than Vince. Vince is an artist who's trying to achieve art—essentially an episodic Shakespearean play—in TV, with all that this format implies

it's incredibly hard and Vince is truly a genius to get pretty much everything exactly correct

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:32:47 2022 No.20758706

>>20758182
I think that would have validated Walt's ego too much. The fact that it wasn't any massive organisation like Gus or the DEA to take him down, but a few nazi hicks, is the final blow to Walt's ego. He basically just failed to learn the first lesson with Crazy8/Tuco and ended up back in the same situation with a bunch of unpredictable violent types who can't be reasoned with. He built himself up into this massive kingpin and felt big enough to handle anything, but no amount of insulation can protect you from random crap in life, whether it's the whims of the thugs who ended things or the same freak cancer diagnosis that started it.
Same goes for Hank, who was also struggling with his ego and wanting the satisfaction of taking down Heisenberg despite the cost to his career, family, and mental/physical health. For him to come out alive or even to have sacrificed himself in service of victory would be to justify the extent of his obsession.

Walt justified his actions with the pretence of protecting his family, but he ended up alone in new hampshire with his family either dead or despising him, and destitute on top of it. Hank justified his actions with the pretence of wanting more for Marie and wanting his macho power back after getting his ass beat in el paso, and in the end he gets killed and Marie is left a widow, with his death serving no purpose since Walt could have gone on living incognito indefinitely.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:36:47 2022 No.20758715 File: 355 KB, 750x993, 9ABC7EEB-BB5E-4ACD-B73A-2BF0D68810E1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Give the script to F Gardner

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:40:12 2022 No.20758724

>>20758678
I don't necessarily disagree with any of this. I'm not arguing that BB is deep or masterful, I'm arguing that it's excruciatingly simple and thus it's mindboggling that anon somehow managed to miss its painstakingly spelled out point just because "hurr but is not real life???"

>Television has never been in a worse state than now
Maybe I don't watch enough TV but I kinda disagree with this, has TV ever been good? I'd agree moreso with >>20758664 (even though they're obviously avin a giggel). As far as TV goes, I'd rate BB as pretty damn good, but it's still just TV, and only as complex as it can be when it also has to be easily digestible and entertaining enough to justify the costs that come with TV.
If you can recommend better, please do.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 05:40:35 2022 No.20758725

>>20758687
The thing is, all that 'powerful art in an episodic format stuff' was already done in the past. Compare any show now to this single teleplay:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kL2afMZ9SQ

That deals with a human issue anyone can experience and tells a whole story in less than an hour. Not a moment wasted. No cliffhanger fluff. No overexaggerated hijinks. Just pure focus on a human experience.

Or this Rod Serling teleplay that deals with themes of corporate power:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEUHl8RGrpk

Of course, none of these are as superficially slick in terms of visuals and spectacle as the current fare, but they are infinitely more profound and elegant, without that feeling of overbearing self-consciousness that seems to permeate current television, where you can tell everything is written by people who are utterly immersed in tropes. I can't even think of anything from contemporary television that matches the philosophical conciseness, voice, and wit of this single paragraph from O'Neill's Iceman Cometh (a play that, in three-four hours, shows lays out the psychological landscape of pipe dreams and wasted lives for THIRTEEN CHARACTERS without season after season of drawn-out shit):

LARRY--Then you can blame your imagination--and forget it. (He changes the subject abruptly.) You asked me why I quit the Movement. I had a lot of good reasons. One was myself, and another was my comrades, and the last was the breed of swine called men in general. For myself, I was forced to admit, at the end of thirty years' devotion to the Cause, that I was never made for it. I was born condemned to be one of those who has to see all sides of a question. When you're damned like that, the questions multiply for you until in the end it's all question and no answer. As history proves, to be a worldly success at anything, especially revolution, you have to wear blinders like a horse and see only straight in front of you. You have to see, too, that this is all black, and that is all white. As for my comrades in the Great Cause, I felt as Horace Walpole did about England, that he could love it if it weren't for the people in it. The material the ideal free society must be constructed from is men themselves and you can't build a marble temple out of a mixture of mud and manure. When man's soul isn't a sow's ear, it will be time enough to dream of silk purses. (He chuckles sardonically--then irritably as if suddenly provoked at himself for talking so much) Well, that's why I quit the Movement, if it leaves you any wiser. At any rate, you see it had nothing to do with your mother.

(incidentally the full thing can be watched here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etEFM_B9YS0 -- the Robards version is the best IMO)

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:01:54 2022 No.20758771 >>20758725 >Of course, none of these are as superficially slick in terms of visuals and spectacle as the current fare that's the crux dude. i'm not talking about "teleplays," i'm talking about the fuckin TV. America, yknow?

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:20:04 2022 No.20758808

>>20758771
Sure there was trash in the past, but TV America could also pull off moments like this:

https://youtu.be/GHcfW4No274?t=959

Can't say I've found anything as affecting in any TV nowadays. Even when something like Bojack Horseman tries to pull off the same amount of emotion, it overdoses on the self-consciousness and comes off as ungodly forced.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:23:48 2022 No.20758814

>>20758808
i'm not sure why you consider this as more authentic than BB-BCS. especially BCS. you're focusing on BB too much. BCS is Vince's artistic maturity and sincerity with himself and his vision but also, of course, BCS cannot exist without BB, which was also a good character study, but with lesser artistic depth. as one work, BB-BCS is the greatest work of art of the 21st century

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:35:11 2022 No.20758843

>>20757627
BCS is trash. Like watching West Wing. Ungodly boring half the scenes are just lawyers doing lawyer speak "hey Branmy did you get the TOS out on the O Brien case " etc etc. Suffered through two seasons of this God awful show before giving it up.
Also Saul doesnt work as a main character. He was always comic relief In BB.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:38:12 2022 No.20758847 >>20757579 Nabokov hates it David Foster Wallace loves it

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:39:37 2022 No.20758850 >>20757880 No one said all art is equal. Also youre being an insuffefable pseud faggot namedropping shit. Woah bro so cool that you read "In Search of Lost Time" You want a little gold star faggot?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:40:07 2022 No.20758851 >>20758843 it definitely could be cut in half but Vince is a maximalist and wanted to develop all characters, in a way BCS is Vince's Suttree to BB's Blood Meridian

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:40:13 2022 No.20758852 File: 1.00 MB, 1284x1732, Holy fucking lmfao HAHAHAHAHA.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>20757579 Given that they built a statue of Walter White and Jessie Pinkman, I have to agree with you OP.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:43:30 2022 No.20758859

>>20758814
I don't care about mere authenticity. The writing here is far more nuanced and plain rhetorically powerful in how it leverages so much emotion with a few simple motifs, which is kind of amazing given that the show it belongs to is an exaggerated parody of soap operas. Here's the excerpt of the text:

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0703747/characters/nm0332390

Just by playing with a few ideas like the motif of 'song', the plainspoken wit of "I ate, I slept, I went to the bathroom" referred to as the 'three major activities', and how this joke shifts to something more emotional in the later part of the monologue: "since then, I have eaten, I have slept. Occasionally, I went to the bathroom, and I... I had a heart attack". Just a small twist of phrase conveys the entirety of the ups and downs of human life. Where in Modern Television do you see words being used in such a subtle manner, rather than subject to either a constantly moving narrative-thrust, overblown emotion, dramatic slickness, or hyperexaggeration? The only show that comes to mind is The Wire.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:47:33 2022 No.20758874 >>20757579 I think they would find it respectable. Some parts are less well written than others but there are riveting moments like this: https://youtu.be/UyvFiG1K0W0 Walt’s maniacal laughing towards the end is kino.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:49:00 2022 No.20758879

>>20758814
Or, if you want to keep it simple, give me an example of any moment of dialogue in BB-BCS that has the same sort of maxim-like elegance as the earlier excerpted O'Neill:

"When man's soul isn't a sow's ear, it will be time enough to dream of silk purses"

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:49:50 2022 No.20758883

>>20757942
>instead of accepting "charity" (or rather, the money he was technically owed by his old science biz partners) he chooses to become a criminal.
I don't see why this is ridiculous or unbelievable. It's primarily his pride and resentment towards his former friend. I agree that its irrational but people often are irrational.
>when he could've just put that type of effort into like becoming a consultant, or inventing a new drug, or becoming a pharmacist... all types of jobs which would make him more money than the meth business
Almost like it's a fictional tv show.
But even to humor you on the realism aspect here, you seriously think a high school teacher can just easily pick up a job like that with zero prior experience. Maybe he might be able to if he were lucky but he also has cancer too. So not much time.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:53:19 2022 No.20758893

>>20758879
literally all Mike Ehrmantraut utters are maxims like this

or this scene from BCS:
https://youtu.be/5X9XqD_k6TQ

or the entire motive of wolves and sheep in BCS, the questioning of the morality of both the wolf and the sheep is literally the enlightenment that led Nietzsche to his philosophy

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 06:56:49 2022 No.20758907

>>20758056
>The fly episode would be removed for the filler it is, of course.
It's not. Fly episode is actually one of the best episodes in the series. Clearly a metaphor for both his itching guilt for letting Jessica girlfriend die. Another possible interpetation is that Jessie is the fly right under his nose that he cant quite get.
It encapsulates Walt's increasing sense of entrapment. He started willigly but by that point he is practically Gus' slave.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:07:49 2022 No.20758934

>>20758893
Lol funny you mention Nietzsche. O'Neill was actually influenced by Nietzsche and that philosophy is far more pertinent in any of his works. The excerpt you posted shows me you don't really understand what my critique is. I went to look for an excerpt of the BCS text:

> But listen - Listen! It doesn't matter. It doesn't. Because you don't need them. They're not gonna give it to you? So what? You're gonna take it. And you're gonna do whatever it takes, do you hear me? You are not gonna play by the rules. You're gonna go your own way, you're gonna do what they won't do. You're gonna be smart, you are gonna cut corners... and you are gonna win. They're on the 35th floor? You're gonna be on the 50th floor, you're gonna be looking down on them. And the higher you rise - the more they're gonna hate you. Good. Good! Rub their noses in it. You make them suffer. You don't matter all that much to them - so what? So what. Screw them. Remember. The winner takes it all.

O'Neill was modifying a pre-existing proverb, "you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear", in a new witty way. Every line in the O'Neill paragraph I excerpted is full of interesting twists of phrase, metaphors, expressions. This excerpt of text isn't doing any of that. It's literally just using pre-existing maxims wholesale:

>You are not gonna play by the rules
>You're gonna go your own way, you're gonna do what they won't do
>You're gonna be smart
>you are gonna cut corners
>and you are gonna win
>Rub their noses in it
>make them suffer
>You don't matter all that much to them
>The winner takes it all

All of these are just thrown out there wholesale without any modification. How is any of this novel in terms of literary expression? Even in terms of this sort of punchy faux-motivational speech, Alec Baldwin's monologue from Glengarry Glenn Ross pulls it off far better:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkjfZctGMq8

You know, when you call someone 'Shakespeare' that implies they, at the very least, have to be innovating on the level of the word.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:09:23 2022 No.20758941 >>20757579 I don't think the authors of the Western Canon would agree on the Western Canon let alone the worthiness of Breaking Bad. What a stupidly loaded question.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:18:53 2022 No.20758963

>>20758934
Because the context is that Jimmy McGill was born good but became evil, and the artistic genius is in Vince's exploration of what it means to be good and what it means to be evil, he first attempts this with Walt->Heisenberg and then perfects it with Jimmy->Saul

This speech is literally the creation of Saul, the devil, the Lucifer. Saul is Jimmy who used personal liberation, who realized the power that enlightenment brings, to do evil things. Saul is literally Lucifer in the most biblical sense. I wonder if the biblical name was preconceived, clever symbolism, clever satire of Christianity (creation of "evil" Saul turning into "good" Paul), or just a stroke of luck. in any case, Jimmy McGill is way more complex a character than Walter White, for sure. It might not even be the result of Vince's more developed maturity, people themselves are not all uniquely complex, some are simpler, some are more complex. BB is the character study of the simple man, BCS is the character study of the sophisticated man

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:24:42 2022 No.20758971

>>20758843
It definitely picks up in season 3 (but not permanently, it goes up and down).
But yeah, I'm inclined to agree, it's very slow, and strangely for a prequel it lacks a clear trajectory. All the gangster stuff also suffers from shonen anime escalation, where it has to start at a point already beyond anything we saw in BB due to audience expectations and avoidance of retreading old territory. Not to cartoonish degrees, but we see more of what used to be behind the curtain and it feels like a lot of the mystique is gone.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:26:47 2022 No.20758978 >>20758971 as the guy behind this post: >>20758963 honestly i'm just waiting to see how Vince will resolve BCS. this question will answer whether he's truly a genius or "just good"

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:35:58 2022 No.20759003

>>20758879
Not that anon, but this isn't quite a fair expectation, considering BB/BCS are grounded more or less in reality. None of the characters are poets, they're not going to be throwing out lines like this.
The cleverness of the writing is in the subtext, character development, and story structure, as well as the way it's all expressed visually - the latter of which all your examples from the early days of TV can't hope to live up to. All in all, this is just a matter of apples and oranges.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:38:05 2022 No.20759009

>>20758963
Take a step back and look at that word-salad you just wrote and explain how any of it links to my observation that that entire BCS speech was just a whole bunch of cliches strung together (which, mind you, you used as proof that Vince Gilligan is a sort of wordsmith).

BCS could be doing all of that thematic stuff (which isn't even particularly new in the context of the entire history of Lit), but to be the 'Shakespeare' of TV you actually have to, you know, do all of the things Shakespeare does, like play with words and find fresh forms of expression. Not scatter a bunch of random vague Biblical references so that a bunch of video-essayists can go back to the mental-masturbation mill and churn out fresh fodder for this generation's pseuds to feel smart while watching the new hot middlebrow thriller that will likely be forgotten decades later once the novelty of it wears off.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:45:36 2022 No.20759030

>>20759003
My point is it isn't even realistic. It's the overtly slick dramatic Hollywood style that one finds in every single show nowadays, modified from crime novels, where everyone speaks in this overtly punchy cadence.

This, from the same play, is what actual poetic realism looks like:

JOE--(to Captain Lewis who has relapsed into a sleepy daze and is listening to him with an absurd strained attention without comprehending a word) Dere. You see, Captain. I went to see de Chief, shakin' in my boots, and dere he is sittin' behind a big desk, lookin' as big as a freight train. He don't look up. He keeps me waitin' and waitin', and after 'bout an hour, seems like to me, he says slow and quiet like dere wasn't no harm in him, "You want to open a gamblin' joint, does you, Joe?" But he don't give me no time to answer. He jumps up, lookin' as big as two freight trains, and he pounds his fist like a ham on de desk, and he shouts, "You black son of a bitch, Harry says you're white and you better be white or dere's a little iron room up de river waitin' for you!" Den he sits down and says quiet again, "All right. You can open. Git de hell outa here!" So I opens, and he finds out I'se white, sure 'nuff, 'cause I run wide open for years and pays my sugar on de dot, and de cops and I is friends. (He chuckles with pride.) Dem old days! Many's de night I come in here. Dis was a first-class hangout for sports in dem days. Good whiskey, fifteen cents, two for two bits. I t'rows down a fifty-dollar bill like it was trash paper and says, "Drink it up, boys, I don't want no change." Ain't dat right, Harry?

or

CORA--No, dis round's on me. I run into luck. Dat's why I dragged Chuck outa bed to celebrate. It was a sailor. I rolled him. (She giggles.) Listen, it was a scream. I've run into some nutty souses, but dis guy was de nuttiest. De booze dey dish out around de Brooklyn Navy Yard must be as turrible bug-juice as Harry's. My dogs was givin' out when I seen dis guy holdin' up a lamppost, so I hurried to get him before a cop did. I says, "Hello, Handsome, wanta have a good time?" Jees, he was paralyzed! One of dem polite jags. He tries to bow to me, imagine, and I had to prop him up or he'd fell on his nose. And what d'yuh tink he said? "Lady," he says, "can yuh kindly tell me de nearest way to de Museum of Natural History?" (They all laugh.) Can yuh imagine! At two A.M. As if I'd know where de dump was anyway. But I says, "Sure ting, Honey Boy, I'll be only too glad." So I steered him into a side street where it was dark and propped him against a wall and give him a frisk. (She giggles.) And what d'yuh tink he does? Jees, I ain't lyin', he begins to laugh, de big sap! He says, "Quit ticklin' me." While I was friskin' him for his roll! I near died! Den I toined him 'round and give him a push to start him. "Just keep goin'," I told him. "It's a big white building on your right. You can't miss it." He must be swimmin' in de North River yet! (They all laugh.)

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:48:59 2022 No.20759040
File: 652 KB, 1138x717, Grimmer death.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>20757833
>it has the literary merit of a low tier anime...
>low tier anime

This is the truth that most want to deny. That literally one of the best TV shows that America has to offer is only on par with a mediocre anime. American television will never reach the levels of Utena, Lain, Berserk, or even the original Evangelion + EOE movie.

Even Monster, which in many ways is written like a western TV drama, absolutely mogs all the highly acclaimed TV dramas.

The only caveat is that anime sucks now too, but TV was never good in the first place

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:50:27 2022 No.20759043

>>20759030
Yeah, I'm not reading all that. Like I said, it's apples and oranges. It's not trying to be realistic (hence 'more or less') and it's not trying to be poetic. Slick, punchy and dramatic is exactly what it intends to be and what it succeeds at being. Dialogue has never been what these shows have been praised for, and dialogue is only one small part of storytelling devices available for use in a visual medium.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:51:48 2022 No.20759047 >>20758808 Thats a lovely scene, yeah I get where you're going, lots of old tv shows have humanity too them thats missing in modern shows. Most of these modern shows are made for autists and working class bumkins that need a power kick.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:53:05 2022 No.20759052

>>20757833
>Le drug man cool
You really got filtered hard, huh?
Walter literally goes from having a loving family and a stable job to having everyone he loves either get killed or hate him and reject him, breaking bad is the story of how Walter ruined his life.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:53:47 2022 No.20759056

>>20759043
Yeah but even visually it's not like it's pulling off anything like Kieslowski's the Decalogue or Bergman's Scenes From A Marriage or even the new season of Twin Peaks. Most of it is still conventional standard fare. So how can it be the greatest TV has to offer if the script is cliched and the visuals are conventional?

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:56:34 2022 No.20759062

>>20759040
>American television will never reach the levels of Utena, Lain, Berserk, or even the original Evangelion + EOE movie.

Jesus Christ, grow-up, there are people, emotionally mature, who like to watch something that isnt somekind of power kick.

Try a british comedy or a detective show, perhaps something older.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 07:59:10 2022 No.20759073 >>20759056 I never personally argued that it was the greatest, just that it's relatively very good and achieves its aims.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:00:20 2022 No.20759074

>>20759062
One thing I wish current TV had that Anime has boatloads off though is Slice of Life. Back then America had stuff like The Waltons. Nowadays, you'll rarely see anything that simply deals with the small moments in life. Sitcoms have to be overexaggerated and quirky.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:01:00 2022 No.20759076

>>20759062
>Try a british comedy or a detective show, perhaps something older.
christ, you sound like my 70 year old mother
(i'm not the anime anon though, he sounds like my 12 year old cousin. the right age/mindset to be is the one i am right now and no one will convince me otherwise, everyone is cringe except me).

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:04:11 2022 No.20759083 >>20759076 >christ, you sound like my 70 year old mother Your mother is right.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:05:12 2022 No.20759087 >>20759074 Nice, try british shows, or something from the continent, not sure what would be easy to find.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:08:49 2022 No.20759099

One old show I love to watch occasionally is "That Girl", I just love the actress with her black hair, tinted skin, beautiful brown eyes, her voice that goes hoarse occasionally and her slightly neutoric demeanor.

aaahhhh

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O--khcBgT14

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:09:07 2022 No.20759100 >>20759087 If there was a British show as calm as like Aria or Bartender or something, I'd be into it. But don't know of any.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:17:18 2022 No.20759123 >>20757833 Filtered pseud spotted

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:17:49 2022 No.20759127

>>20759100
look i am going to completely straight forward, cartoons are for dadaist comedy, politically commentary and weird psychedelic episodes, outside of that any sane non autistic human being needs to see real emotions, on real human faces.

Stop pretending that blank puppets on a screen are in any sense valuable.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:18:47 2022 No.20759137
File: 452 KB, 671x1024, Vladimir_Nabokov_1973.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>20757984
>cockroach
A cockroach is an insect that is flat in shape with large legs, and Gregor is anything but flat: he is convex on both sides, belly and back, and his legs are small. He approaches a cockroach in only one respect: his coloration is brown. That is all. Apart from this he has a tremendous convex belly divided into segments and a hard rounded back suggestive of wing cases. In beetles these cases conceal flimsy little wings that can be expanded and then may carry the beetle for miles and miles in a blundering flight. Curiously enough, Gregor the beetle never found out that he had wings under the hard covering of his back. (This is a very nice observation on my part to be treasured all your lives. Some Gregors, some Joes and Janes, do not know that they have wings.) Further, he has strong mandibles. He uses these organs to turn the key in a lock while standing erect on his hind legs, on his third pair of legs (a strong little pair), and this gives us the length of his body, which is about three feet long. In the course of the story he gets gradually accustomed to using his new appendages—his feet, his feelers. This brown, convex, dog-sized beetle is very broad.

In the original German text the old charwoman calls him Mistkäfer, a "dung beetle." It is obvious that the good woman is adding the epithet only to be friendly. He is not, technically, a dung beetle. He is merely a big beetle. (I must add that neither Gregor nor Kafka saw that beetle any too clearly.)

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:28:58 2022 No.20759166 >>20759127 Then recommend me Slice of Life shows played by real actors.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:30:21 2022 No.20759171 >>20759127 I'm imagining the real emotion on your face and all I see is seething.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:32:37 2022 No.20759182 >>20759166 >>20759171 See the links I posted to a youtube episode of "That Girl", the actress is nice and quirky, enjoy.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:39:09 2022 No.20759204

>>20759062
>>20759076

It's obvious you guys haven't watched the shows I listed, so your opinions are uninformed. I'll grant you this, the Brits do have some good comedies, but it's clear in my post I was talking about dramas not comedies. So bringing that up is irrelevant.

>>20759074
God, you're even worse then the first person who responded to me. Moeshit and SOL is what killed anime

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:41:47 2022 No.20759215 >>20759204 >>20759204 We dont watch animes, because we arent autistic, do you have any ideas how much horror normal people experience from watching those puppets?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:47:10 2022 No.20759231 >>20759215 Meanwhile 'normal people' are lining up to watch the next new entry in spandex cosplay action porn.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:50:16 2022 No.20759239 >>20759231 No they are not, marvel fans are still a small part of the population, as are anime addicts, most people dont watch that, get out, talk to people, touch grass.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:50:53 2022 No.20759241

>>20758671
>Walt wasn't owed shit, he smashed his own proverbial car and left the company
He got pushed out actually, or "urged strongly" due to a personal falling out with his partners.

>and is such a bitter faggot that he noped out of the game.
He didn't "nope out of the game", he decided to take stable work instead of pursuing due to a personal belief that he would never be justly rewarded for his work (not unreasonably so mind you).

>he's just a faggot and a coward
The only way to properly describe what I think of this statement is to use your own words:
>Fucking autists shouldn't be allowed to engage with fiction.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:51:06 2022 No.20759242 >>20759231 There may be as few as one hundred normal people alive today

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:52:51 2022 No.20759245

>>20759239
The playboy in my bunk during bootcamp who told me about how his dick got teethed by some girl in a club giving him a blowjob watched Attack on Titan. Afterwards when I was assigned as a combat medic my doctor apparently watched Log Horizon.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:54:36 2022 No.20759249 >>20759241 Thanks for rewording everything I just said less irreverently and pretending it's different in any meaningful way, bitch.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:54:49 2022 No.20759250 >>20759245 >my doctor apparently watched Log Horizon. Based doc

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:56:20 2022 No.20759253 >>20759245 >>20759245 I love it, some dudes you know watched an anime, therefor anime and i guess marvel movies arent some kind of wacky thing a small part of the population watches, but real legitimate forms of art. aahahahaha

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:58:22 2022 No.20759255 >>20759239 I work in media so granted it's a slanted sample size but literally everyone at work under 25 is obsessed with marvel an anime

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:58:54 2022 No.20759260 >>20759253 I mean not just some dudes, but people who quite literally have rubbed their entire bodies in grass while doing leopard crawl during infantry practice.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:59:23 2022 No.20759261 >>20759260 kek

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 08:59:30 2022 No.20759262

>>20759249
That's my point retard, you're framing it as if it's some completely pathological garbage that only bad people do, when in fact it's quite a normal if not reasonable reaction.
Lets take you're "HE'S A FUCKING COWARD FOR BEING CAUTIOUS WHEN HE GOT BURNED BADLY FOR TOUCHING THE STOVE!!!" "point". Oh look at that, now you're the unreasonable faggot.
Stop playing frame games.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:00:31 2022 No.20759263 >>20759260 Yes, those nice soldier boys dying for Israel. You arent autistic, you epic aaahhhh

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:00:32 2022 No.20759264

>>20759241
>He got pushed out actually, or "urged strongly" due to a personal falling out with his partners.

Where does this happen? From what I saw of the show, he left because he felt uncomfortable remaining at the company because of Gretchen, who he felt inferior to after learning about her wealthy family.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:01:15 2022 No.20759266 >>20759263 Sounds like you need to touch grass big boy.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:03:10 2022 No.20759270

>>20759255
> literally everyone at work under 25 is obsessed with marvel an anime

This is the truth that other people in this thread are denying. Just because anime was niche to Millennials and Gen-Xers, doesn't mean it isn't extremely mainstream among Zoomers

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:03:20 2022 No.20759271

>>20759264
>Where does this happen?
Season 2 I think goes into it. Dunno the exact time, haven't watched it in a while.

>he left because he felt uncomfortable remaining at the company because of Gretchen
Yeah, due to a romantic falling out, then she started fucking that other guy.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:03:30 2022 No.20759272 >>20759266 ahahahhaha

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:04:21 2022 No.20759275 shows like The Sopranos, Mad Men, and Deadwood far surpass breaking bad. Breaking Bad will be categorized with other schlock like walking dead, hbo watchmen, etc.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:04:28 2022 No.20759276 >>20759266 Sounds like you need to die for Israel.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:06:05 2022 No.20759281 >>20759276 If it'll help the country, why not? Better than wasting away attempting to screen out the world with media.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:08:01 2022 No.20759287 >>20759281 >Doesn't deny it >Tries to justify Ayy lmao

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:09:20 2022 No.20759294 >>20759287 There are no justifications. If death shall come, let it come. Only those in battle know.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:11:17 2022 No.20759297

>>20759262
Think about it, anon. Does it make any fucking sense for me to be aruging "Walt is a bad person and BB is clever because it shows a bad person being bad because they're bad"? Does that sound like a very good show to you?
Of course Walt's actions can be viewed in a way that's justified, that's why he's an interesting character. Sorry you're so fucking sensitive that you can't handle it being simplified via shitposting to explain it at a level that a drooling retard like >>20757833 might be able to understand.
Go suck some Walt dick, faggot.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:12:26 2022 No.20759299 >>20759281 >I liek anime and dyin for pisrael lol

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:14:07 2022 No.20759302 >>20759287 Its hilarious, he is so deep into his schizoid fantasies, that instaid of wanting to life, he just wants to die, I bet he thinks the afterlife has lolli's in it.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:19:04 2022 No.20759313

>>20759302
There is no afterlife. Only the void. Yet mere life for its own sake is meaningless, merely accruing quantitative, ephemeral pleasures. Thankfully, my position is far from the frontlines, so I do not have to worry about that. In fact the medical centre is probably the safest place to be in a war since it doubles as a bomb shelter. When shit goes down you will have to bear the brunt of the shelling, while I'll be there saving the injured. But for my brethren in the fields, dying for that great cause, I understand them.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:20:03 2022 No.20759317 >>20759313 >Be faggot >Watch anime >Think life has no purpose >Go and try to die for pisrael.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:22:16 2022 No.20759322

>>20759317
Life has purpose only in the company of others. No man is an island. We are social animals who have forgotten what that means, in love with our loneliness. Unfortunately, one has to experience it for themselves, what it means to break that solipsistic shell so many in modern society are inured to. I cannot help you find the way. Only you have the strength to find it yourself.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 09:36:45 2022 No.20759357

>>20757579
This thought exercise doesn't make any sense. How would the authors receive the script? Would you time travel and hand it to them personally? Wouldn't you need to translate the script to their respective languages? Would they be willing to accept it from a stranger? How would they understand everything from it? Wouldn't you need to spend several weeks with them in order to explain whatever they couldn't understand? In that case, where would you stay? In their homes? Would they take you in as guest?
You weren't clear enough, OP.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 12:18:28 2022 No.20759779

>>20759297
Think about it, faggot.
If we're talking about the same type of drooling retard audience, I do need to point it out, because otherwise they might be convinced by your "LOOK AT ME CALL THIS THIS GUY A FAG, AREN'T I JUST THE EDGIEST" "rhetoric".
Seethe more nigger.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 12:31:53 2022 No.20759830 It’s not even good as a show. Let alone literature. It is trash.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 12:34:05 2022 No.20759838 >>20759779 Well thanks for the spirited discussion then, cuntfart!

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 12:36:17 2022 No.20759848

>>20758018
ts not my fault if you've relegated yourself so deeply in your basement, spending your life away posting on online forums, that you can't even contextualize normal paragraph writing without thinking of it as specific practice to a certain website

Go outside anon

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 12:49:21 2022 No.20759893 i think Homer would like it

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 12:59:13 2022 No.20759930

>le TV bad
>le obviously popular and critically acclaimed TV show bad

This has easily got to be one of the pseudest threads on /lit/ without going all the way into parody territory.

BB is kino and no amount of contrarian seething will change that fact. It has great writing lmfao and most of you trannies are ignoring aspects besides writing that makes good TV/Movies good. Like direction, acting, soundtrack. BB nails it all.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 13:06:25 2022 No.20759965 >>20758859 Any specific examples of this from the Wire?

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 13:31:23 2022 No.20760051

>>20759040
I watched Eva, Monster, and read Berserk till Conviction. They’re all trash just like every other anime, Breaking Bad obviously mogs it in the writing department, which in turn is mogged by high literature. Stop trying to force this anime = le good meme, it’s not good. Anime is all just cartoons written by autistic nips with the depth of a puddle. Now fuck off back to /a/, this is a literature board.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 13:34:44 2022 No.20760064 File: 10 KB, 650x650, 0F3F4087-2F51-46A2-ABA7-3395C5BBB61A.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>20759040 >pretending anime is any better Found the weeb

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 13:43:37 2022 No.20760090
File: 66 KB, 599x680, 1651076978233.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>20759040
I watched about twenty episodes of Monster because I thought that the premise sounded interesting but it actually was extremely boring. I kept waiting for it to get good and after about twenty episodes I gave up on it.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 14:07:22 2022 No.20760175

>>20757833
Anybody who posts this sort of snarky extreme deductionism needs to be euthanized.
>>le drug man cool
I don't care for BB but even I know that Walter is not supposed to be "cool", he is a nerdy fuckup who ruins his own life. Blame the redditors who idolize anti heros as the reason you see Walter this way.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 14:11:18 2022 No.20760189
File: 53 KB, 258x387, FD601C24-462F-4C54-AB01-AD8C2B0FC269.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>20760064

Anime can be kino when it wants to, like pic related.

Most of the time it’s horrible in it’s own way, usually by castrating the source material for the sake of appeal and runtime.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 14:22:28 2022 No.20760220 >>20757579 What point in the series was Walter a clear cut villain? For me it’s the lily of the valley poisoning

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 15:06:03 2022 No.20760416 >>20758401 >That's why Vince Gilligan is the William Shakespeare of the 21st century. No other work of TV comes close. True detective season 1. It totally crush breaking bad in every aspects. And i'm saying this as a BB and BCS fan.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 15:27:39 2022 No.20760479

>>20759009
>how any of it links to my observation that that entire BCS speech was just a whole bunch of cliches strung together
you're retarded. he's a crook. a con man. he failed his ambition and turned to the underworld and has great persuasive skills and is "slippin jimmy." a malevolent improviser. literally the devil, he will bring you down when you're close to him emotionally without even knowing what he's doing is bad, as hell is paved with good intentions

so the speech is composed of cliches, obviously. he's a salesman. but the genius is how he's obviously channeling his flawed personality into that weird idiosyncratic personal attempt at a motivation speech. it's basically Saul speaking (subvocalizing) to Jimmy

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 16:24:33 2022 No.20760709 >>20760416 >True detective season 1. That first season is truly kino.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 16:36:55 2022 No.20760763 >>20760220 For me he falls in the dark side when he kills jane.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 16:44:17 2022 No.20760804 >>20760189 >Anime can be kino when it wants to, like pic related. let me guess, you also like angel eyes.....

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 16:57:13 2022 No.20760889 >>20760763 He was definitely heartless there and the scales tipped towards him being evil, but he wasn’t the active cause of her death. He just didn’t take action

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:05:33 2022 No.20760930 >>20757980 A lot of famous authors already did review films, most weren’t impressed by things like Citizen Kane

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:23:40 2022 No.20761014

>>20759930
The only pseuds in this thread are the people claiming that Breaking Bad is the greatest work of art in this century so far. A commercial television program. I enjoy it a lot too, but seriously? It doesn’t even hold a candle to some of the finest films of the past couple decades

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:23:57 2022 No.20761018 >>20760930 citizen kane is probably more overrated than BB

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:25:49 2022 No.20761023 >>20761018 It was groundbreaking at the time hence the acclaim

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:31:30 2022 No.20761061 >>20761014 >the people claiming that Breaking Bad is the greatest work of art in this century so far. literally who?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:33:16 2022 No.20761067 >>20761061 did you read the thread? >>20758401

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 17:39:37 2022 No.20761093

Everything else aside, the plot undoubtedly got a bit stupid in the later seasons. Do they really expect anyone to believe that LYDIA of all people has connections to Czech drug kingpins? Also I never liked how literally everyone in Gus' crew wears leather jackets. I feel like that's what some costume designer thought criminals wear and just put it in the show

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:02:40 2022 No.20761212 >>20761023 Only midwits say this. It's still an amazing film now.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:04:54 2022 No.20761221 >>20758401 BCS and BB are both 6.5/10 which is a pretty nice score. Saying they're masterpieces is just being an american that hasn't watched too many shows. Lars Von Trier's Riget is way better.

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:08:45 2022 No.20761240

>>20758401
They all lose points for subject matter. Sopranos and Breaking Bad are popular and beloved by Americans specifically because they are crime shows, and these things give them excitement in their boring lives. It's the same reason Mad Men is filled with so many sex scenes, it is because that is what sells, not because it's some sort of artistic exploration into the world of crime and sin or something like that.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:14:20 2022 No.20761265 Soap operas use dramatic tropes that are closer to literature, why aren’t those as praised?

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:25:44 2022 No.20761318

>>20761014
>The only pseuds in this thread are the people claiming that Breaking Bad is the greatest work of art in this century so far.

Literally no one claims that. But BB does come pretty close. I'm open to better pieces of art that aren't pseud circlejerks

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:26:47 2022 No.20761325 >>20757579 test

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:27:41 2022 No.20761330 >>20761318 Have already shown that people are indeed saying that. Retard. >>20761067

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:28:41 2022 No.20761338 >>20761221 no it isnt, youre just an idiot thats brainwashed by auteur status because you lack the means to grapple with art yourself, all that youre left with is institutionalism. repulsive 100iq.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:32:16 2022 No.20761353 >>20758971 >it picks up Don't listen to him, I fell for the same meme I can tolerate a show being slower, but fuck me...

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:46:05 2022 No.20761397 Wow, this thread is faster than any discussion about literature

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:52:30 2022 No.20761419 >>20761397 Television is the new literature

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:53:43 2022 No.20761427 >>20761397 rip /lit/, lost its last vestige of credibility with this fact.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:54:47 2022 No.20761429 File: 13 KB, 474x266, OIP (63).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>20761318 No it doesn't, just watch the shield

Anonymous Sat Jul 30 18:56:05 2022 No.20761437

>>20761427
>>20761397
Well what do you expect. Literature is a largely dead medium and television/film are the dominant forms of fiction. This board is primarily used by a handful of trad schizos, zoomers “getting into reading” by asking about Dostoevsky and Stoicism, and /pol/ users posting about nonfiction books

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 19:02:56 2022 No.20761480 >>20761427 Lit has been dead for some time so who cares?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 19:48:39 2022 No.20761707 >>20761437 If a medium is dominant, then its the expression of the masses and then its death, if a medium is practised by a small group of intellectuals, it means its alive, because its a genuine expression of a creative minority.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jul 30 21:56:20 2022 No.20762364 >>20761707 There’s not much of a creative minority writing great books anymore. You get a small handful every year. There are way more quality films being released every year even as most movies are commercial zogslop

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 03:41:42 2022 No.20763689

>>20760479
I asked for dialogue proving the uniquity of BCS' writing, was given writing full of cliches, pointed this out, and now am told the cliches are the point. I think the retarded one here is you. There are ways to use cliches artistically, which is why I gave the example of Glengarry Glen Ross, where the writing and acting is clearly much much better than the BCS example and the menace and faux-inspirational wisdom is all too clear.

The Iceman Cometh is also about a crook and a con man called Hickey coming to a bar. He is probably the archetype of all American depictions of hoodwinkers, con men, and grifters. He also can be compared to the Devil. O'Neill came up with all the quirks of the style, as well as the themes, you're praising in BCS. BCS is just a derivative of a derivative of a derivative with added Western spectacle.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 03:46:16 2022 No.20763704 >>20763689 Not him but have you ever actually watched Better Call Saul? It's not comparable to Shakespeare or anything but it's still a great show with pretty well written characters, there's not that many cliches in it.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 03:46:55 2022 No.20763706 >>20763704 post-its

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 03:49:39 2022 No.20763712 >>20763706 ?

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 04:15:14 2022 No.20763771

>>20760051
>I watched Eva, Monster, and read Berserk till Conviction. They’re all trash just like every other anime

You must be an absolute retard to have watched those shows all the way through if that's your genuine opinion on them. Usually you can tell if something is worth watching after the first episode or 2. So you're either lying about having watched them, or you're a retard who forced yourself to so you could win le internet arguments against weebs.

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 04:18:14 2022 No.20763777

>>20763771
>Usually you can tell if something is worth watching after the first episode or 2
Yeah, "usually", not always, hence why I kept watching this shit people kept saying it would eventually get good, especially Eva which is supposed to be great in the second half. Nothing to do with winning arguments or anything, I just wanted to see what the best anime had to offer.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 04:22:39 2022 No.20763786 >>20759040 Anon, you have watched Rose of Versailles or read Kaze to Ki no Uta?

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 05:19:22 2022 No.20763938

>>20759040
Monster was bottom if the barrel procedural garbage. Like csi or bones or svu. The only thing you can say that it had over that other garbage was the overarching storyline but even that was trash since the doctor and the villain were completely boring and uninteresting. It's funny since breaking bad and monster are true pleb filters. Whoever says they like that shit exposes themselves as brainlets.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 06:18:31 2022 No.20764079 >>20761067 ok fair, one retard

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 06:57:04 2022 No.20764139 >>20760804 Didn’t watch it, thanks for the rec.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 07:03:55 2022 No.20764150 Plotfags abound. A script is not a novel. Plot is plot, prose is acting. They would look-say sure that's a plot but where's the novel? End of scene

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 07:34:09 2022 No.20764225 >>20764150 Breaking Bad is just as much a character study as it is a “plotfag show”, whatever that means

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 07:48:40 2022 No.20764252 File: 250 KB, 939x431, image_2022-07-31_024828831.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>20759099 lol

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 09:35:09 2022 No.20764500 >>20761338 what? why did you get so angry? BB isnt even audiovisually outstanding, how is it odd that I don't think it's that big of a deal?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 09:51:15 2022 No.20764547 >>20764252 That literally makes no sense.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 09:52:39 2022 No.20764550 >>20761419 >Television is the new literature You mean made almost completely out of cheap, suburban, novels for woman?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 09:53:57 2022 No.20764552 >>20762364 Nope, you just dont like reading that much, for example, I am sure you dont read a lot of nonfiction.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 09:54:08 2022 No.20764553 Masscult is inherently degenerate.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:18:36 2022 No.20764613 >>20764552 I read more nonfiction than I do fiction precisely because there’s very little new fiction worth reading. I only read classics.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:33:23 2022 No.20764648 >>20764500 you thunk crap like riget is audiovisually outstanding? Its worse than the most average film. Its objectively bad.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:37:29 2022 No.20764663 >>20758843 >Watched two seasons Shut the fuck up you dumbass you haven't even seen bagman you can't be in a discussion about how good it was

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:39:10 2022 No.20764666 >>20757833 You really think you're smart don't you cunt? You're post was word salad bullshit you'll never fucking get it

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:44:57 2022 No.20764679 >>20759009 >Not scatter a bunch of random vague Biblical references grade school analysis

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:46:49 2022 No.20764684 >>20759127 >non autistic human being needs to see real emotions, on real human faces. >Stop pretending that blank puppets on a screen are in any sense valuable. he says on the non-visual media board

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:48:06 2022 No.20764687

>>20759270
>This is the truth that other people in this thread are denying. Just because anime was niche to Millennials and Gen-Xers, doesn't mean it isn't extremely mainstream among Zoomers
zoomers are denying it too because they want to be special and unique for having le quirky interests

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:54:11 2022 No.20764699 holy shit I didn't know /lit/ users were this fragile over a freaking tv show lol

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 10:55:02 2022 No.20764701 >>20764699 >all dissenting opinions are X back to the NEETzche thread incel

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 11:06:29 2022 No.20764728

This should be called missing the point the thread.

Half the reason I watched BB is for Cranston's acting and how he brought life to the character, not to mention Esposito's potrayal of Gus. Half the reason I read Berserk is for Miura's art and story.

For a board about appreciating art this place is quite bad at it

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 11:06:57 2022 No.20764729 >>20758893 That girl had some nice BAZOOOOKAAAAS

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 11:36:57 2022 No.20764800 >>20757627 Breaking Bad is a power trip for atheists, like james bond

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 11:54:07 2022 No.20764865 >>20764684 kek

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 11:57:56 2022 No.20764882

>>20764728
This. To fixate on the writing is to miss the medium entirely.
Imagine how much would have to be lost or re-tooled if you were to try and adapt BB into a novel. That's like 50% of the storytelling gone, at least. The performances, the colour schemes, the shot choices, etc. To boil the series down to the words in the script is to miss the bulk of what makes it an achievement.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 12:23:37 2022 No.20764972 >>20764684 Are you insane? Do you think its sane to make the jump from discussing the art of a visual medium like film, with talking on an image board?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:07:01 2022 No.20765153 >>20757942 >ow would a sociopath swallow their pride for 40 years of their life and then suddenly unleash it on the world ? BECAUSE HE WAS A COWARD BUT SINCE HE WAS GOING TO DIE ANYWAY, HE WANTED TO GO IN STYLE

Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:17:48 2022 No.20765195

why the fuck did jack let walt live after killing hank? he was ruthless with hank because he knew it'd come back to bite him but somehow walt's different? he gives some pathetic excuse like "todd wouldn't like it and i'm having a good day." motherfucker you just stole tens of millions and killed the brother in law of a drug lord. that's not gonna come back around? bravo gilligan

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:20:11 2022 No.20765203 >>20757582 4th season was the worst most pandering cliched yellow Mexico bullshit

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:25:10 2022 No.20765222 >>20760416 >>20760709 The ending is total bullshit

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:26:47 2022 No.20765227 >>>/tv/

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:29:30 2022 No.20765240 >>20765222 can't disagree. kino show but the shittiest ending

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:34:19 2022 No.20765258 >>20765195 Jack underestimated Walt, which was a running theme theme in Walt's life.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 13:35:20 2022 No.20765263 >>20765240 It should have ended with Childress knocking them out to torture and kill them with Hart going mad in the process and Cohle with an air of resignation

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 14:01:40 2022 No.20765366 >>20765263 Well sometimes the non-pedo win. See Epstein. Or Jimmy Saville. >>20765263 Didn't Childress want to die, in order to escape the "loop"?

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 15:11:47 2022 No.20765633 >>20757617 :(

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 15:30:23 2022 No.20765710 >>20764550 90% of anything is trash

>>	Anonymous Sun Jul 31 17:20:19 2022 No.20766201 >>20764648 >its objectively bad not that I think you cannot objectively measure things in art but all people I've seen bringing this up without first explanining why are sub 80 IQ idiots trying to sound credible, so I'll just discard what you say

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/lit/ - Literature