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20402956 No.20402956 [Reply] [Original]

Why is there no Wagner chart?

>> No.20402974

>>20402956
Because no one under the age of 95 reads librettos or watches operas. Wagner is used as an aesthetic because of his antisemetic views

>> No.20402981

>>20402974
come on, the songs in meistersinger are fantastic poetry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrjnelUsbZI

Translation;

Shining in the rosy light of morning,
the air heavy
with blossom and scent,
full of every
unthought-of-joy,
a garden invited me

and, beneath a wondrous tree there,
richly hung with fruit,
to behold in blessed dream of love,
boldly promising fulfilment
to the highest of joy's desires,
the most beautiful woman:
Eva in Paradise.

In the evening twilight, night enfolded me;
on a steep path
I had approached
a spring
of pure water,
which laughed enticingly to me:
there beneath a laurel-tree,
with stars shining brightly through its leaves,
in a poet's waking dream I beheld,
holy and fair of countenance,
and sprinkling me with the precious water,
the most wonderful woman,
the Muse of Parnassus!

Most gracious day,
to which I awoke from a poet's dream!
The Paradise of which I had dreamed
in heavenly, new-transfigured splendour
lay bright before me,
to which the spring laughingly now showed me the path;
she, born there,
my heart's elect,
earth's loveliest picture,
destined to be my Muse,
as holy and grave as she is mild,
was boldly wooed by me;
in the sun's bright daylight,
through victory in song, I had won
Parnassus and Paradise.

>> No.20403006

>>20402981
Leaves my dick soft and my heart unaroused. I think everyone should do what they want, but be prepared for your peers to look at you like you have 3 heads if you’re into opera. It’s probably less social suicide to be a diddler

>> No.20403017

Are you listening to opera... not a good look bro

>> No.20403037

>>20402956
Because nothing really existed before him and everything since comes from him, he is like the cultural version of the big bang.

>> No.20403063

>>20403037
I get that but where’s his chart?

>> No.20403068

>>20402974
I watched Parzival three weeks ago.
I watched The Magic Flute with my gf two nights ago.
Opera is based.

>> No.20403092

I like opera but I'm not a plotfag so i only listen to the arias. Wagner ruined everything by getting rid of the clear divide between aria and recitative.

>> No.20403096

>>20402974
t . tasteless jew

opera is watched by youths who arent niggers around the world,

>> No.20403103

>>20403096
>racist incel meltdown
having a normal one my dude lmfao
we young people *hairline hidden by beanie* are outchea chillin with a blunt and listening to mofuggin Ye senpai, Fuck Wagner.

>> No.20403104

>>20403037

top kek

Nigger never's heard of bach

>> No.20403225

>>20402956
Because there's no easy way to get into his prose works, most people get filtered by his style and the Victorian translation. Plus the numerous amount with no clear place to start.

>> No.20403237
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20403237

Do I need to read The Nibelungenlied or The Völsunga saga before starting the ring cycle?

>> No.20403263

>>20403237
No, and in fact it might be more confusing if you do. (You should read them eventually though)

>> No.20403292

>>20403237
Even though Wagner's stories are different, you should still read the originals since Wagner is trying to capture elements of folk culture for the modern world. They're not 1:1 but how he adapts and changes the original stories is very interesting. For example his Tristan creates a dialogue with Strassburg's Tristan that deepens our understanding of both works.

>> No.20403594

>>20402974
Utter plebian take. Try again.

>> No.20403602

>>20403006
Plebian the post.
Three heads are better than one.

>> No.20403608

>>20403068
The poster we need but don't deserve. God speed anon.

>> No.20403659

>>20402956
Lets make one? I dont know much about him. Funnily enough I was just watching a documentary about the ring cycle last night. I was impressed by many things in it. He was influenced by Schopenhauer I've heard. Probably Fichte as well? We can all agree that if one likes the mythology in the operas then it makes sense to go onto The Nibelungenlied.

>> No.20403717

i want to enjoy classical music but fear that i'm not capable. i do however really like wagner's tristan und isolde. i listened to it after finishing Demons for the first time and cried, but that's the only time i've ever seen the appeal of classical. i wish i could re-experience that moment.

>> No.20403719

>>20403717
clarification: i only listened to the prelude. i don't enjoy opera, though i wish i could

>> No.20403742
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20403742

>>20403719
That prelude is absolutely excellent though. I haven't gotten around to watching Tristan und Isolde yet. Is it referenced in Demons?

tfw you get goosebumps during operas. Life with such art is good bros. We're all going to make it.

>> No.20403753

>>20402956
What kind of chart, for his operas or for his prose writing?

For operas I guess the common advice is to start with Tannhäuser since it's more accessible with the more traditional arias etc. While the top of the crop are his later works, the Ring, Tristand und Isolde, Meistersingers and Parsifal. He didn't make that many operas so I'm not sure a chart for that is necessary.

I've actually not listened to or seen any of his early operas before Tannhäuser though apart from the Rienzi ouverture, and his early operas are very seldom performed. But everything after that is worth seeing and listening to, even just reading.

>> No.20403759

>>20403742
nah it's not referenced in the book at all; but i after finishing the book i felt really gloomy, and had read Nietzsche describe the prelude in a way that struck me as very similar to how Dosto described Stavrogin's character, so i felt it would be fitting. it was

>> No.20403777

For his aesthetics:

The Destiny of Opera (lengthier continuation) --> Actors and Singers
The Music of the Future
On Poetry and Composition
On Opera Poetry and Composition in particular
On the Application of Music to Drama

For his politics:

Judaism in Music
What is German?

This is very basic, but it will serve as an introduction. His most important works being Art and Revolution, The Artwork of the Future, Opera and Drama, German Art and German Policy, Beethoven and Actors and Singers. But with the exception of Actors and Singers they're too be read last.

>> No.20403820

can i read the librettos while listening to the recordings or should i read the librettos first?

>> No.20403830

>>20402974
Bro, I have gone to see operas and classical music performances a bunch of times. You are being foolish.

>> No.20403831

>>20403820
Read the librettos while listening, then go back and ruminate on the words by themselves. There's no reason to not experience the Gesamtkunstwerk as it's intended (minus the visuals) for the first time when there are recordings.

>> No.20403849

>>20403831
i see, thank you
i actually got the libretto, cd and dvd for der fliegende holländer here so maybe i'll give it a try next week

>> No.20403916

>>20402956
Damn i still can't get to it, the 18 hour mark is kinda uhhh...

>> No.20404171

>>20403916
How much time have you spent looking at less quality content?