What is manly writing?

[Anonymous No.20200366]

>I write like a woman

Please help me.

[Anonymous No.20200379]

Use proper grammar and punctuation. Be clear and concise. Be convincing and confident. Be kind and compassionate.

[Anonymous No.20200385]

>>20200379
Wouldn't that restrict what I can do with my prose though?

[Anonymous No.20200389]

>>20200385
Isn't that what you are doing by limiting yourself to masculine writing?

[Anonymous No.20200398]

>>20200385
as;kdjf a;kldafsd as;dlfjsla;
That's what unrestricted writing looks like. There can be no creativity without limitation.

[Anonymous No.20200399]

>>20200389
There has to be a way for me to write incredible prose without every fucking sample of my writing coming up as female.

[Anonymous No.20200407]

>>20200366
Women tend to emphasize descriptions of things and the subjective emotions they're "intended to invoke." Men tend to emphasize direct actions and the objective qualities of things that engender certain reactions.

[Anonymous No.20200410]

>>20200399
>soi rage
>passive, both in voice and in wanting someone else to fix it
Kek.

[Anonymous No.20200412]

>>20200399
Who is telling you your writing is female?

[Anonymous No.20200433]

>>20200412
http://www.hackerfactor.com/GenderGuesser.php

It said Moby Dick was written by a guy, and pegged George Saunders as a weak male, so it seemed pretty accurate.

>>20200407
I just checked, and it seems like my older writing comes up as male. I switched writing styles to show and invoke emotions recently, and my newer samples drift between weak male and female.

[Anonymous No.20200441]

>>20200433
Who cares what a writing program things just be yourself.

[Anonymous No.20200445]

>>20200441
Yeah, true. I've just always been insecure about my masculinity, so any indication that I might not be a man sends me off the fucking rails.

[Anonymous No.20200446]

>>20200441
*thinks

[Anonymous No.20200454]

>>20200445
If you're self-aware of this, why not work towards changing it? You know you're a man, so the next time something suggests you aren't, just shrug it off, see how it goes.

[Anonymous No.20200456]

>>20200445
I know, if you can write a joke the program will have to recognize it as masculine because it is commonly held that women are not funny.

[Anonymous No.20200467]

>>20200433
>http://www.hackerfactor.com/GenderGuesser.php
FUCKING KEK

[Anonymous No.20200468]

>>20200379
>kind and compassionate
Kek. Have you read any book ever? This is one of the most moronic takes about writing I've ever seen

[Anonymous No.20200475]

>>20200468
Fuck you kill yourself

[Anonymous No.20200481]

>>20200475
See? He's getting the hang of kindness already!

[Anonymous No.20200485]

>>20200475
Where is your kindness and compassion, fag? kek
What a fucking retard. Go commit yourself in a mental institute, mentally challenged person with mentally challenged opinions

[Anonymous No.20200487]

>>20200485
That's the joke. Here have a (you)

[Anonymous No.20200492]

>>20200485
Go to sleep dad

[Anonymous No.20200494]

>>20200366
make sure you describe how all the characters have huge dicks and giant muscles.

[Anonymous No.20200501]

>>20200494
Kek

[Anonymous No.20200505]

>>20200467
>weak female

[Anonymous No.20200507]

>>20200505
It's over

[Anonymous No.20200529]

>>20200454
>If you're self-aware of this, why not work towards changing it?
Solutions fall into two schools of thought. One is the Reddit/therapy solution, where you taught to believe you're a man for having a penis, or just because you want to feel like a man. The other is the redpill/sigma shit commonly found here, which usually amounts to 'just ignore it bro', or some generic bullshit. >>20200379 is a retooling of that advice to fit writing (which I think was supposed to be the joke.)

Neither of these are helpful. Unfortunately, it's all you'll find.

>You know you're a man, so the next time something suggests you aren't, just shrug it off, see how it goes.
This isn't just a feeling I don't like. I've had fears that I might be intersex or one of those XX men without realizing it. There's been other shit that relates to it that I don't remember right now, but it's well past being 'just an insecurity.'

>>20200456
I hope not. Some of my pieces come up as strong male, and I hope that's not just for the jokes.

>>20200505
Try other samples. I think it's geared towards people with well-developed and practiced writing styles, since they have less variation and their style is deliberate.

[Anonymous No.20200533]

>>20200529
I'm sorry you didn't have a positive strong father figure while growing up.

[Anonymous No.20200547]

>>20200533
I didn't, which is part of the issue. I'm convinced my father, who wasn't always around, actually has similar issues himself, which would mean it's upbringing and passed down. That's also a big part of why I want to fix it, and not just suppress it like >>20200454 suggests. If I can end it here, my children won't have to deal with it.

I thank my lucky stars every day that I didn't troon out as a kid. Not that I ever wanted to do that, but I seem like the prime candidate for it.

[Anonymous No.20200550]

>>20200529
You're definitely insecure like a woman. Quit being a faggot. The chances of you being intersex or an XXY aberration are astronomically low, and if you have actual cause to believe you might be aside from insecurity and hypochondria, go to a doctor.

[Anonymous No.20200560]

>>20200547
My brother solved it by seeking out father figures to learn from and was lucky enough to find some who weren't rapists. You probably won't have much luck here.

[Anonymous No.20200562]

>>20200550
>Quit being a faggot.
Read the post again. I've tried this but there's always some shit that crops up out of nowhere. And >>20200547.

'Just stop thinking about it bro' doesn't work here. I've used it in other areas of life, but it hasn't worked for this one. In fact, it only makes it worse.

[Anonymous No.20200566]

>>20200550
Just keep thinking about it bro

[Anonymous No.20200572]

>>20200566
Meant for>>20200562

[Anonymous No.20200578]

>>20200529
>This isn't just a feeling I don't like. I've had fears that I might be intersex or one of those XX men without realizing it. There's been other shit that relates to it that I don't remember right now, but it's well past being 'just an insecurity.'
You might actually benefit from therapy.
>>20200547
>not just suppress it like >>20200454 suggests.
That's the thing, I'm not talking about suppressing it, and it's not supposed to be a permanent solution. If you believe you are acting insecurely, you can test whether it's something you can change by not taking those actions, as an experiment.
Let me put it this way, what would happen if you *didn't* go off the rails if something suggested you weren't a man?

[Anonymous No.20200588]

>>20200578
>You might actually benefit from therapy.
I sure hope so. I've been debating it, but I'm worried that it'll either amount to 'you choose your definition of a man' or 'you might actually be a woman and repressing it.' Those seem to be the likely outcomes. Hopefully, I'm wrong.

>If you believe you are acting insecurely, you can test whether it's something you can change by not taking those actions, as an experiment.
This was a change. I usually just keep it to myself. First I used to suppress the thoughts, then I tried to deconstruct them by staying rational. Seeking out help, even if in the dumbest way possible, was the change.

>what would happen if you *didn't* go off the rails if something suggested you weren't a man?
The anxiety of secretly being a woman or a failed man of some sort would eat me from the inside for days. Either that or I'd try to prove that the thing was lying, over and over again until it either says I'm a man or I'm able to find a flaw.

[Anonymous No.20200600]

>>20200588
>>20200578
I'm going to bed now, but it's gotten to the point of concern. Spoilers for nsfw stuff, it's affecting my sexual health. I can't consciously get boners to women. I have no problem getting erect to the idea of a woman, or getting an erection while I'm too lost in some fantasy, but if I look at a woman and consciously think 'yeah, that's hot', any erection in my dick immediately disappears. I don't understand any of this, except for the fact that all the symptoms seem to feed into the problem. I just want to feel like a man.

[Anonymous No.20200601]

>>20200366
After reading this thread, post your writing. I'm genuinely interested in seeing what you've wrote.

[Anonymous No.20200610]

>>20200600
Your mentality is probably fucking with your boner more than anything, but it might also be T levels. You unironically need to get some help, anon. This is really neurotic behavior

[Anonymous No.20200612]

>>20200366
Get mistaken for a man everytime I write. Just write in short sentences. Don't key smash like a retarded zoomer. Apparently that's all it takes.

[Anonymous No.20200619]

>>20200600
I'm sorry for your situation. You need to get help. Talk to some men you trust first before therapy, but don't give up. Please be strong, I hope you find peace and stability

[Anonymous No.20200621]

>>20200600
>nsfw stuff
bruh, ED is not nsfw
just quit being a bitch
nice numbers tho

[Anonymous No.20200626]

>>20200600
If you decide to go to therapy do not go to a woman for the love of God. I'm not even the usual woman-hating type on here but they will not understand or be able to help your situation. Make sure to get a male therapist who doesn't look like a fag

[Anonymous No.20200632]

just start lifting
train both body and mind

[Anonymous No.20200634]

>>20200588
>>20200600
>The anxiety of secretly being a woman or a failed man of some sort would eat me from the inside for days.
I agree with >>20200610, that's something for the professionals.
>Those seem to be the likely outcomes. Hopefully, I'm wrong.
Keep in mind that if you are really sure you're being steered wrong, you can get a different therapist.

[Anonymous No.20200636]

>>20200626
This is important. All council I have received from women is worthless compared to men's. Not even being sexist. It just makes things worse.

[Anonymous No.20200786]

>>20200487
So
>say that men are kind and compassionate and write books that are like that
>get called out
>kys, but you know it's a joke because hahaha I did sth against what I'm advocating

Truly, hang yourself dumb faggot

[Anonymous No.20200950]

Dude! Why are you complaining? Treat this as a blessing, explore this ability to develop different characters/perspectives in your writing, and have fun with it. Apply it with direction and discipline to become a better writer.
I have no idea what intersex is, sounds like yet another psy-op to keep zoomers weak and narcissistic, but treating it at face-level, I would argue that reading is an intersex activity, so again, use this to your benefit.
If you’re really concerned about being XXY, chances are you’re not. There are distinct physical traits, look them up (spoiler: they tend to look long-limbed like basketball players but with hips) or get a test if you think it’ll help with the neurosis. If you think you might be gay or bi, who cares (as long as you don’t become some groomer)? There are plenty of good writers from these camps. Cope or rope, man.
>>20200612
Good advice.
>>20200626
Also good advice.
>>20200632
Best advice, unironically. Going along this vein, you may also want to check out Wim Hof’s channel and try his breathing exercises.

[Anonymous No.20200981]

>>20200467
Just realized what prompted this reaction.

> About Gender Guesser
>In 2003, a team of researchers from the Illinois Institute of Technology and Bar-Ilan University in Israel (Shlomo Argamon, Moshe Koppel, Jonathan Fine, and Anat Rachel Shimoni) developed a method to estimate gender from word usage. Their paper described a Bayesian network where weighted word frequencies and parts of speech could be used to estimate the gender of an author.

OP, are you trolling us (if so, we’ll done), or did you fall for a psy-op by non-native English speakers?

[Anonymous No.20201712]

>>20200601
Give me some time. Or better, give me a prompt so that I can write something that I won't use later.

>>20200610
I was going to get them checked out.

>>20200619
>>20200626
Okay, I'll see what I can do. I don't trust therapists at all though. Even going to one feels unmanly.

>>20200632
I'm already doing that. Sometimes it feels like cope.

>>20200981
Not trolling. It seemed accurate to me, but it can't place my writing. I'm hoping that's a good thing. See the last reply in >>20200529

[Anonymous No.20201804]

>>20200601
>>20201712
Here's a shitpost from an old /wg/ thread that I wrote, according to the gender guesser it's my most masculine work by far. It's also one of my favorites for unrelated reasons.

--------

Paul's deepest meditations came at the commode. The act was the highest form of the visceral. The one tangible divide between himself and the good Lord in heaven, yet the only thing that crossed the barrier between creation and creator. In these ignoble motions lay the first metaphor conceived by man. Far before the Bible, Gita, or Quran came the daily release. It forced life to wait. Meditation for soul and body at once: the entirety of one's being sat cleansed, languorous, enlightened. Paul desperately desired this cleansing after dinner with his family: the twins were fighting over pudding again. His wife asked him to help mediate.

Paul quietly backed away from the breakfast table and into the washroom. With his wife and children in full view, he closed and locked the door with utmost care. Screams made it through; no ritual was complete without an altar sacrifice. He dropped his pants and - somewhat stimulated by his excitement - hopped towards the bowl with a bouncing semi.

He took a deep breath as he wiggled his buttocks to position the commode's hole under his own. The sacred transference always began with an unknowable force. It came from nowhere, with no counterpart, to press the contents of his stomach into his solar plexus. This force always travelled straight down: in his teens, Paul had conjectured that sinuous intestines existed to mystify the tsaheylu of man and porcelain throne. The solar plexus, not the stomach, turned wine to water.

A 'poot' emanated from his cleared passage. A vacuum akin to space had formed in his landlocked body. He released his breath; a baked bean incense signaled the coming of the divine. The smell enticed his mind, drowning out the sound of the fetters outside.

His buttocks spread as he sharted into the bowl. The ensuing backwash measured their separation in a process akin to sonar. He had also conjectured that technology often found its basis in shitting. A brown head peaked out of the widened hole. Divinity had been achieved; he was both man and mother. By way of water-birth, his head was cleared of all earthly thoughts, filling his mind with ecstasy and thoughts of kumbaya. Endorphins ran up his spine, down his arms; they whirlpooled in his skull as a rock hard penis pressed against the edge of the seat. Eyes closed, Paul projected to the end of time and humanity. It was nothing, it was everything; here, his spirit was reborn.

He emerged, renewed like the river that washed away his excrete. Past Paul had problems, present Paul had the moment. No woes or regrets for him. He tuned out his screaming family and left for work.

[Anonymous No.20202276]

>>20201804
Bump.

[Anonymous No.20202296]

>>20200399
>without every fucking sample of my writing coming up as female.
And yet, still not a woman. This is a validation-free zone, sir.

[Anonymous No.20202522]

>>20202296
I'm tired of this shit. I can't bring up any of my problems without people assuming I'm either a repressed tranny, or a baiting tranny. Or a porn addict.

How much more evidence do you want that this is a real problem for me?

[Anonymous No.20202646]

Don't speak in first person at all, except at the beginning when you summon the muses to aid you in recounting the forthcoming tale

[Anonymous No.20202706]

>>20200366
What kind of non-concern is this?

[Anonymous No.20202715]

>>20202522
What do you want people to say? You're heavily mentally ill with this obsessive-compulsive neurosis you have. Cool. Nothing works apparently. Pray to God, sir.

[Anonymous No.20202745]

>>20202715
>What do you want people to say?
Nothing, honestly. Some of the anons in this thread seemed to know more about this, so I figured they could help. Now I'm just bumping for the writing I posted.

[Anonymous No.20202755]

>>20201804
pretty decent, could be more specific at certain moments in my opinion.

[Anonymous No.20204287]

>>20202755
Thanks anon, but what moments? I know this thread is about something else entirely but I'm always taking writing advice.

[Anonymous No.20205521]

I'm bumping again for the anon that wanted to see my writing, this'll probably be my last bump.

[Anonymous No.20205865]

>>20200433
Oh, I'm quaking.

[Anonymous No.20205962]

>>20200433
Just pasted in a random passage. Not bad if I say so myself. If I were to intentionally write masculine it wouldn't be too hard to get a 90+% confidence in my literary manhood.

[Anonymous No.20206149]

>>20200366
Male: Elucidate by utilizing a technical style of writing which may noticeably heighten the possibility that the assessment provided by the program will render your gender as male.

Female: thats why i came here, 2 meet random ppl like me ^_^… im 13 years old (im mature 4 my age tho!!) i like 2 watch invader zim w/ my girlfreind (im bi if u dont like it deal w/it) its our favorite tv show!!! bcuz its SOOOO random!!!!

[Anonymous No.20206874]

>>20206149
Post writing.

[Anonymous No.20206996]

>>20200366
This anon it the nail on the head
>>20200410

To put it bluntly, you need to tear yourself down and rebuild. You need to cognate and think entirely differently.

Short solution: do psychedelics, if that's too extreme, meditate. Maybe join the Marines and get that shit POV on life bullied out of you.

Long solution: get a therapist, abandon your family and get new friends. Or just start acting different and "man-splain" everything in your head but try to put an effort to be just and kind to everyone (basically, "I know better than you, but I will put forth an effort to make you feel comfortable".)

Otherwise, stop thinking like you are the lowest tier cast in every room you go into. You're wasting your life no matter how young you think you are.

[Anonymous No.20207009]

>>20200366
>The nice man looked at the red cup.
That's a manly prose style.

[Anonymous No.20207512]

>>20200366
Go read this.
https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/myl/IntroducingMyself.html

[Anonymous No.20207622]

>>20207512
>Verdict: Weak FEMALE
Jolly gee

[Anonymous No.20208464]

>>20202745
Anon this is pretty standard as a generic symptom of ED. Like it's almost a textbook symptom of midlife crisis. You should just go to an old school therapist that deals with boomer problems like someone suggested ITT

[Anonymous No.20208469]

>>20200366
Be humble and confident.

[Anonymous No.20208516]

>>20200379
Yep
>>20200366
Hemmingway, Steinbeck, George Orwell.

[Anonymous No.20208574]

>>20206996
>To put it bluntly, you need to tear yourself down and rebuild. You need to cognate and think entirely differently.
I've been doing that but I always hit a dead end somewhere.

>stop thinking like you are the lowest tier cast
It's hard not to do that, I'm a short guy, fat guy (working on it, down at least 30 pounds since I started), nothing special about me. Most men, and even some women, are more accomplished than me. Or at least that's how it seems.

>>20208464
All of this is a symptom of ED? Including the anxiety and gender crisis? If that was true, wouldn't it be more publicized?

[Anonymous No.20209369]

>>20208464
>midlife crisis
Also forgot to mention, I'm in my early 20s.

[Anonymous No.20209549]

>>20205865
>weak MALE
>could indicate European
I would laugh if the program wasn't made by kikes

[Anonymous No.20209777]

>>20200600
I kind of know how you feel anon. I don't really have any sort of gender issues but I feel like my sex drive is really fucked up. I suspect it's a result of finding porn way too early and watching it for years before I actually starting fooling around with chicks. I have no problem getting aroused by pictures of girls or by the idea of girls that are hot, but when I'm actually involved in the scenario and not just spectating some fantasy, I always start thinking, and there's nothing less arousing than worrying about getting a boner. I'm worried that I've cucked myself by training my brain only to get off on fantasies instead of actually being there.

[Anonymous No.20209884]

>>20200600
You're trans. That's ok.

[Anonymous No.20209913]

>>20200366
Sounds like something only a sensitive imbecile like the OP would take personally.

[Anonymous No.20209919]

>>20209884
groomer. he even says he's glad he never fell into that thinking when he was younger. for an ideology that seems so obsessed with one's own identification and experience, you 'egg' faggots seem awfully preoccupied with telling other people how to feel about themselves.

[Anonymous No.20209955]

Y'all niggas trying to "write like ____" are ngmi
You either got a voice or you don't, dawg.

[Anonymous No.20209967]

>>20209955
>y'all
>niggas
>dawg

[Anonymous No.20209977]

>>20209967
Good luck trying to write like Hemingway, dawg lmao

[Anonymous No.20210253]

>>20209777
I also found porn too early, but I jumped straight to fetish porn because of these issues. I have no doubt that made things worse, but there are definitely underlying problems that simply quitting porn will never solve. Unfortunately, there's always a couple of faggots that only recommend that as a solution.

>>20209884
I am not. I don't want to be a woman. If anything, I want to be more of a man.

>>20209913
Yeah. Read the thread, we've already been over this.

[Anonymous No.20210280]

>>20210253
>there are definitely underlying problems that simply quitting porn will never solve. Unfortunately, there's always a couple of faggots that only recommend that as a solution.
It's not the entire solution but it's definitely an important step to take. If you haven't even tried it then you don't have much room to criticize the people recommending it.

[Anonymous No.20210366]

>>20210253
I don't know man, ride the self-improvement train as far as you can I guess? I think every guy feels like they're larping to an extent, you just have to see if it really helps. If not, I guess try the therapy/prayer/exorcism/trepanning shit that everyone else has been suggesting. I'll pray for you tonight bro

[Anonymous No.20210835]

>>20200366
what is writing? just write and use a pseudonym of you're that concerned by gender judgments.

you throw like a girl too?
which girl? some would tear your head off.

[Anonymous No.20210863]

>>20210280
>If you haven't even tried it then you don't have much room to criticize the people recommending it.
I've tried it multiple times and gone way past the average reset point. I'm trying it right now, in fact. It's not enough.

>>20210366
>I think every guy feels like they're larping to an extent
I hope so. Knowing that everyone feels like they're larping would make me feel better, since that feeling is probably what started all of this.

>I'll pray for you tonight bro
Thanks.

>>20210835
>you throw like a girl too?
Actually, yeah. I think so. I can do a lot of sports stuff normally but not throwing, I never learned it.

[Anonymous No.20210992]

>>20200410
The power of the passive voice

[Anonymous No.20212334]

>>20210992
Bump, I have something to say about this.

[Anonymous No.20212620]

>>20200410
>>20210992
The passive voice is intentional. People tell me I sound like an ass so I started doing it to mitigate that. Seems like I just can't win.

[Anonymous No.20213657]

Fuck it, another bump, this thread is keeping me sane.

[Anonymous No.20214238]

>>20208574
>All of this is a symptom of ED? Including the anxiety and gender crisis? If that was true, wouldn't it be more publicized?
It might be oversimplifying to boil it down to one thing, but I've definitely heard of this whole array of symptoms before. I would also call it a cultural trope I'm familiar with in that vague omnipresent way, I couldn't cite sources or examples from literature, though.
Here's sort of what I'm referring to. https://www.verywellhealth.com/psychogenic-erectile-dysfunction-5201654
"Gender crisis" is probably a less useful term than "emasculation" because from what I can see there's no kind of tranny sentiment in your posts, you're just afraid of being, well, metaphorically emasculated or castrated; or that this has already happened to you.

[Anonymous No.20215319]

>>20214238
>there's no kind of tranny sentiment in your posts
I do have those though. Not in the sense that I want to transition, just the bizarre and confusing sexual fantasies. And the fact that I sometimes feel like a woman, although I mean that as an insult and not as a gender identity.

[Anonymous No.20215332]

>>20215319
>I sometimes feel like a woman, although I mean that as an insult and not as a gender identity.

[Anonymous No.20215338]

>>20215332
I'm not sure what that image is implying.

[Anonymous No.20215347]

what the fuck is this thread

[Anonymous No.20215363]

>>20200433
>In 2003, a team of researchers from the Illinois Institute of Technology and Bar-Ilan University in Israel (Shlomo Argamon, Moshe Koppel, Jonathan Fine, and Anat Rachel Shimoni) developed a method to estimate gender from word usage.

[Anonymous No.20215386]

>>20215319
What kind of sexual fantasies? Please spoiler-tag them.

[Anonymous No.20215418]

>>20200433
>http://www.hackerfactor.com/GenderGuesser.php

Lmao caring about this sort of bullshit makes you 1000% more of a pof than anything you ever wrote would make you. You could be writing fucking Yaoi fanfiction from the third person limited perspective and still it would be more manly than actually giving a fuck as to what some machine learning bullshit thinks the gender of your writing style is you absolute prancing la-la homo faggot.

[Anonymous No.20215450]

>>20215319
>fetishism and insecurity
What a shocker.
Having been in a similar pathetic numale corner myself you just have to get rid of the insecurity and everything else will follow. how you do that is up to you

[Anonymous No.20215457]

>>20200379
>kind and compassionate
sounds like woman-write

[Anonymous No.20215463]

>>20200433
pure masculine speech

[Anonymous No.20215508]

>>20200366
as with men (testosterone) and women (estrogen) in general, men are more interested in world building down to the minute details, logic, justice, hierarchy, strategy, philosophy, in things and how they work, etc., while women are more interested in emotions, deception, drama, and how events and social interactions make them feel.

[Anonymous No.20215545]

>>20215386
Why do you want to know? I'm asking because if it's for personal interest, I'd rather not bring it up, it tends to derail everything.

>>20215450
I'm trying that right now. How did you do it?

>>20215508
That just sounds like fantasy versus realism to me.

[Anonymous No.20216000]

>>20215545

>I'm trying that right now. How did you do it?
From about 2019 to early 2020 I had this problem, including actual dysphoria at the worst of times. For me it was career success, nofap cutting back my porn use and eventually managing a 4-month abstinence (until the pandemic hit anyway), and taking care of my appearance. I would say this made it easier to maintain and trust in a healthy mindset.
My worldview before, during, and after this was very sex-essentialist. This led to cognitive dissonance during that time, which eventually resolved, and I stopped considering I could ever be anything other than a man. So, read the following according to the (correct) understanding that there are only men and women.

Being feminine in certain ways does not mean you aren't a man. Also, you are almost certainly imagining at least some of that femininity. Lastly, some things that are characteristically more female are essential for male success, like empathy for being a good partner or a leader.
The model to keep in mind is one where there is actually zero causative consequence between myriad gendered characteristics, and the category of gender. In other words, your behavior and appearance has no bearing on your gender; these are categorized according to their gender association. There are two genders based on biological modules, with (for humans) one physicalist expendable male module with many sperm and intra- and inter-male competition, the Y-ch program; and one mentalist female module with a single expensive egg at a time, and dangerous childbirth, the XX baseline.
The only possible critiques of this model are based on chicken-and-egg arguments which are easily countered on an evolutionary basis (and which must downplay the reality of these modules), appeal to exceptions which does not contradict the possibility that exception is disease, or literal wishful thinking according to postmodernist principles of social constructivism. This is really what it comes down to, because in societies where infertility and all forms of parasite behavior are seen as generally harmless, exceptions must be beyond reproach.

When we accept this model, a weak or effeminate man is not any closer to being a woman. He is a failed man. But he is still a man, he has failed in a manner specific to his mode.
A strong man succeeds while being a man, a weak man fails while being a man. They are still MEN, if anything they have failed as humans, because our gendered tasks and traits are not self-justifying, they are measured against our humanity. A strong man does not just make more strong men, he makes more strong HUMANS. Same for women.

[Anonymous No.20216076]

>>20200468
How exactly are you supposed to write convincing characters if you're incapable of empathizing with them?

[Anonymous No.20216100]

>>20215545
>>20216000

That went a bit off-track. The thing is, if you believe in classical gender, the only reason to buy that what is happening to you is even possible is if you lack self-assurance and fall prey to propaganda and despair. Pathological belief in disappearing penises (underestimating ones maleness in a variety of ways) is actually pretty widespread in global cultures, and traditionally has been recognized as a completely baseless delusion.

Anyhow, once you have self-assurance everything else will be easier, including your self-image. And it will be easier to gain self-assurance if you stop beating yourself up about your masculinity which is literally essential to you and which can never leave you. These things all work on feedback loops; if you keep wallowing you will still have problems; if you don't, the improvement will exceed your expectation, because of the feedback loop.

Trooning out is what happens when sex-obsessed people dive deeper into bad habits in a society that has commodified aesthetics, even gender. Humans can self-destructively chase stimuli that scare us, and end up creating what we wanted to avoid. This is the foremost theory for the development of sexuality and fetishism in humans, earlier and later in life. That's how self-doubt can become sexually stimulating. Rape victims and partners of chronic cheaters have this tendency too. (rape fetishism is a whole other bag of worms)

I almost certainly have it worse than you because I have been a hypersexual transformation fetishist my whole life, at least since I was very little. I can literally remember how I developed that as a response to how much I was scared by the donkey transformation in the Pinocchio movie. Now if I watch the scene I reliably pop a massive hard-on

[Anonymous No.20216210]

>>20216000
>it was career success, nofap cutting back my porn use and eventually managing a 4-month abstinence
I relapsed after four months, I think. Also I've had successes but none of them have been enough to pull me out of this. I think it goes back to that idea of being a failed man.

I've got some physical traits that aren't particularly manly (short, body type, some facial features although overall I'd say I have a manly but ugly face) and several mental traits (overthinking, anxiety, zero confidence, tendency to default to others and not taking a leadership role.) The problem with fixing any one is that they all feed into each other.

>I don't see myself as a leader
because
>None one sees me as a leader
because
>I'm short and pear shaped
because
>I wasn't athletic as a kid
because
>I was too anxious to take risks

And so on. Although this loop is more complex than the greentext. I don't know how to kill these one by one, and killing them all at once is a tall order. I've tried several times but I suspect it's too much pressure, which leads to a porn relapse or severe depression.

I'll try to switch my brain to keeping this model in mind but years of growing up in a conservative household and jerking it to weird porn have conditioned me to believe that a failed man is essentially a woman. Hell, when I see men who aren't chads like this place describes, I automatically assume they're hiding the exact same fetishes and issues as me. That's how bad this is. Also, as long as I have fears of being secretly intersex or a woman with a penis-shaped growth, I doubt I'll be able to make this switch fully.

>>20216100
It's late here so I'll reply in more detail tomorrow but no, I've also had this all my life. That's my exact problem with NoFap fanatics. Even before I fapped or knew porn, I encountered at least three scenes in cartoons that provoked that exact reaction in me. I remember some details about them, but not everything.

As a kid I was terrified of losing my identity and becoming someone else, and was also constantly mocked for being unmasculine (bad at sports, cried a lot, afraid of physical confrontation among other things) so those two combined somehow and made me the unholy abomination I am today.

The first scene was in a cartoon I don't remember where some kid is forcibly crossdressed by his sister and two of her friends. The second one I remember was a possession, the Buzz Lightyear cartoon where one of his sidekicks is possessed and corrupted for a single episode; it didn't help that the fucking vampire that did it was scary as shit. I think the third was some generic boy-girl bodyswap thing, though that's happened so many times that I can't pinpoint which one it was. I didn't even know that it was possible to develop a reaction like this to more than one scene but four such incidents later, lo and behold, there I was, a raging feminization and mind control fetishist.

[Anonymous No.20216223]

>>20200626
>>20200636
This is very true. If you want to lose, take advice from a woman.

[Anonymous No.20216444]

>>20216210

This is the most important piece of advice: treat your anxiety and depression right away. Your unique problem synergizes directly with shame and self-pity, and nipping them in the bud will go a long way. try meds that dont have weight gain as a side effect.

start working out or dieting to tone down / even out the "pear shape", idk the specifics and I'm not an expert on that. When it comes to health, do as much as you can sustain to start.

As far as nofap goes, you have to understand that cutting back is a victory, you don't have to stop with anything less being a failure, especially when a psychological dependence is built up from a very young age. Four months is a really big deal for something as incredibly easy to access as porn. That's something to be proud of when usually most committed people can't even last a month. Don't think in terms of relapses wiping away progress, think of it as a massive improvement in times-weekly or -daily. Don't beat yourself up over breaking the streaks either. FFS getting rid of this idea will by itself get rid of one of your "failure states" for self improvement:
>which leads to a porn relapse or severe depression.

Don't go anywhere near a therapist for the spoilered stuff. Assuming you want to control that, and from what you've described, they are most likely to literally try to groom you.
An older man might be able to help with the more common self-image concerns, the ED definitely, and work with you on the anxiety. That will help.
get your testosterone levels checked.

Of the above, maybe try doing two at a time. Meds are passive, they don't count as a chore, get them and start on them. They're not a silver bullet or one-size-fits-all tho and you'll have to have followups for that. If you can afford it try getting therapy weekly for "psychogenic erectile dysfunction". Start counting calories (I found this to be really easy even when I was undiagnosed for ADHD, it's almost gamified on phone apps. Use MyFitnessPro and literally do the best you can, even with rough estimates and inconsistent logging, it is *very helpful and informative*, I cannot overstate that). If you can fit in nofap, do it. When you can't hold back, find some relatively vanilla thing you like and use that. I traded out for a foot fetish personally. Drink more water.

I know exactly how the cope spiral works, but it works the other way around, too. Breaking even one element will weaken the whole chain. building up a few positive elements will actively counter it. Of course it's fucking hard. It's frightening and intimidating but just take it a week at a time or a day at a time, if you gotta.
I guess you don't have to believe me, but please at least take my word that I've normalized my sexuality a lot compared to where it was. I'm not normal, but I'm better. That said, don't expect your dick and brain to magically reorient in a day, after years of fetish

[Anonymous No.20216461]

>>20216000
>>20216100
>>20216444
nice. witness me

[Anonymous No.20217413]

Bumping for later.

[Anonymous No.20217462]

>>20200433
>http://www.hackerfactor.com/GenderGuesser.php
Fascinating indeed.

[Anonymous No.20217479]

>>20200433
>http://www.hackerfactor.com/GenderGuesser.php
lmao

[Anonymous No.20217500]

>>20200366
Listen and read.
Listen to yourself as you listen to others. Hear the wants, the perspectives, the attitude. Know the words. Speak carefully and watch to speak calm and to fill the room.
Read what you are thinking. Read what you write, and write what you read.
Barthes says it well in his Writing Reading essay in The Rustle of Language. Very short. He explains that moment when, as you are reading a book, you stop and look up.

As you read, you will know what to say. As you listen, you will know how to.

[Anonymous No.20217500,1]

Faggot.