/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.20122092]

Where would he stand on the Special Operation in Ukraine?

[Anonymous No.20122171]

>Special Operation
It's a failed attempt of War, anon. Call it what it is.

[Anonymous No.20122200]

>>20122092
Who?

>>20122171
It’s nazis hunting. Very difficult when they keep using human shields

[Anonymous No.20122234]

>>20122200
>It’s nazis hunting. Very difficult when they keep using human shields
cope

[Anonymous No.20122240]

>>20122234
>A wild glowie appears

[Anonymous No.20122260]

>>20122234
Z

[Anonymous No.20122286]

>>20122092
For the beleaguered people of the Donbass, for the newly freed people of Mariupol, for the memory of those brutally murdered in Odessa

[Anonymous No.20122291]

>>20122200
I also support Russia, but why are they taking so long to take the major cities? I thought this would be over in a month or so but now I’m getting anxious. If this war takes years, or if Russia loses, then that’s a huge victory for the degenerate western social order. It seems they’re not making any progress for ages though.

[Anonymous No.20122325]

>>20122291
There’s two fronts, the battlefield and the peace talks. The battlefield has a mandate to avoid civilian deaths. The peace talks just reveal how deeply corrupt Zalinsky and the rest of them are. They out and say they need to consult with foreign interests.
I doubt this can go on like a Vietnam or Soviet/Afghan war. But a cooling occupation of the eastern largely Russian speaking end is likely to remain for a long while.

Provided they avoid a lone loony nazi releasing bio weapons on everyone.

[Anonymous No.20122388]

>implying human shields are bad

[Anonymous No.20122454]

>>20122325
Well they should hurry up in my view. The refugees have left why don’t they just take the city. Clearly they’d have more leverage in the peace talks if they took Kiev. Also they look weak now on the international stage, all the media outlets are showing how their advance has stalled, and how they’re losing tanks and soldiers.

[Anonymous No.20122545]

>>20122454
Not all of them have been allowed to leave. Nazis keep them in building as cover.
The international stage is going to make them look weak and like brutal monsters. They’ve been demonizing slavs and Chinese for years now. Doing things carefully with the best intentions will be a reward in itself for the people that witness it. Western oligarchs (MIC) will never let up that it was an unprovoked act of a mad dictator.

>>20122388
Spoken like a cowardly nazi

[Anonymous No.20122777]

>>20122545
It seems to me that it’s coming close to a strategic disaster. If they don’t take the cities soon enough Russia will appear weak, even to sympathisers like me. If they’re using human shields they’re never going to throw their shields away and face off directly. So what’s Putin going to do? Wait forever? I don’t get it.

[Anonymous No.20123520]

Wow I came back and my thread is still up. No one recognized young Dostoevsky?! I actually did kinda want some attempts at replies but it looks like a bunch of angry shitflinging

[Anonymous No.20123528]

>>20123520
wasn't he kind of a christian anarchist or was that someone else?

[Anonymous No.20123535]

>>20122092

He would support it, and he would be livid at the sight of Kiev being controlled by western-controlled homosexuality-promoting globalist Jews!!!

[Anonymous No.20123546]

are the ukrainians jews or nazis?

[Anonymous No.20123576]

>>20123520
If you’re interested in Dostoevsky’s politics, look up his book Diary of A Writer which is his journalism he published during the 1870’s.

[Anonymous No.20123578]

>>20123546
Both. Israel is also a neo-Nazi state, even though most people who live there are Jews. Anyone can be an ultranationalist/jingoist authoritarian.

[Anonymous No.20123593]

>>20123528
He seems to have been a slavophilist, believed that Russians had a special historical mission, repeatedly made fun of liberals/Westernizers. Also believed democracy was incompatible with Russia because Middle Russians would always be in love with their leaders

[Anonymous No.20124705]

>>20122092
He would definitely support it. He was a hardcore slavophile (which is an euphemism for Russian imperialist). The invasion is a logical continuation of that mindset.

>>20122291
>but why are they taking so long to take the major cities
Because they're a corrupt shithole through and through, including the military. Though it shouldn't be overrated, there's too many signs of them being unprepared and incapable of something as complex as claiming entire cities with millions of inhabitants. (To compare: my country was invaded in the 90s, and a key part of the invasive force was wasted on attacking and ravaging a mere 46k-citizen town for three months. Cities are a tough nut unless you just bomb them to ashes.) Not to mention that taking any significant parts of Ukraine would amount to the most massive military conquest since the WWII. They don't have the capacity for it. They're already backpedalling and announcing that they've succeeded in their initial goal, which is (supposedly) disabling of Ukrainian military, and will now focus on claiming Donbabwe.
You're unironically a retard or blind if you think Russia is not also degenerate and corrupt to the bone. Simping for that country currently is on the level of people for whom De Niro from "Taxi Driver" is a role model.

>>20123528
That was Tolstoy, who was a radical pacifist. Also excommunicated from the Orthodox Church.

[Anonymous No.20124778]

>>20124705
Nazis took France and Poland in a little over a month. US took Iraq in about a month. Granted Nazis and the US are probably more willing to kill civilians than Russians, but at this point they have to do something otherwise it’s going to turn out bad for them.
Yeah Russia is corrupt but it represents a challenge to the degenerate liberal west. Besides, this invasion is justified by objective standards.

[Anonymous No.20124789]

>>20124778
>sure they're degenerates but they're standing up to the degenerates

[Anonymous No.20124821]

>>20122291
> I’m getting anxious
Yes fellow russia supporters, we are anxious, russia is losing, i am distraught at how badly russia is losing my fellow russia supporters

[Anonymous No.20124832]

>>20124821
Yeah anon I get paid by NATO to pose as a Russian supporter on 4channel and pretend Russia is losing

[Anonymous No.20124900]

>>20122092
Thw incompetence of the Russian military makes me wonder, what armies wouldnt make a fool of themselves in a war? The us? China?

[Anonymous No.20124942]

>>20124778
>Nazis took France and Poland in a little over a month. US took Iraq in about a month.
And that has literally zero to do with the current situation because US and especially 3rd Reich were immensely better organised forces, not led by the president's asslickers and supported by Muslims acting like tough guys, etc.
>Yeah Russia is corrupt but it represents a challenge to the degenerate liberal west.
It literally does not. It was politically and culturally solipsistic, isolated, and now will be even more so. Bribing a few illiberal politicians to gain some foothold in the west was a minor influence (unless you're a reddit schizo and imagine they put Trump in power), and is being undone as we speak. It is entirely likely Russia will become China's bitch in the following decades. As for the degeneracy, I'd say corruption and nepotism on every level of life is much more dangerous than a minority of faggots who wave rainbow flags once a year. The corruption is, after all, a large part of the reason why the invasion is not going well, as I've already said. They make up fake jobs for their relatives to suck off the state's funds while the actual soldiers are not being trained well and the machinery is rotting and outdated.
Mind you, many of the more sincere Russian nationalists are also critical of the regime, which has been described e.g. by Yegor Prosvirnin as a mafia that has hijacked the state away from the people. Putin simply uses the "conservative" social mechanisms such as the church and nationalism because they give him efficient control of people's thinking. Indeed, now they are barely complaining even as any luxury and increasingly many basic goods are becoming absurdly expensive.
>Besides, this invasion is justified by objective standards.
There are no "objective standards" in politics, you fool, only more or less convincing propaganda. And you are falling for a very unconvincing sort.

[Anonymous No.20125050]

>>20124942
>US staged coup d’etat ejects democratically elected leader in Ukraine in 2014
>Leaked phone conversation between US diplomats shows they knew the coup was going to happen before it occurred
>Same phone conversation shows them deciding whom they will put in government, eventually choosing Yatsenyuk to be prime minister.
>New fascistic government pursues heavy “Ukrainification” policy, bans Russian language in schools and discriminates against the huge Russian population of Ukraine
>Some Russian majority regions rise up in rebellion, others like Crimea vote to join the Russian federation.
>Ukrainian army and neo-Nazi militias, supported by Western powers, assault the separatists, shelling their homes and resulting in over 10,000 civilian casualties
>Minsk agreements seek to end the conflict but this resolution is ignored.
>Azov Battalion, the neo Nazi militia known for torturing the separatists, and even raping them in some cases, is incorporated into the Ukrainian armed forces.
>Meanwhile NATO is making Ukraine a de-facto member, saying Ukraine has the right to join NATO, shipping them weapons, training their soldiers, and speaking of them as “partners” — a clear threat for Russia.
>Putin decides enough is enough and steps in to defend the beleaguered separatists and stop NATO expansion onto its borders.
Now even if you hate Russia you have to admit the invasion was justified. A ceasefire with the separatists had already been attempted, but they were still being shelled by Ukraine. There was no other way for Putin to defend his suffering countrymen in Donbas.

[Anonymous No.20125576]

>>20125050
>>US staged coup d’etat ejects democratically elected leader in Ukraine in 2014
Sure, that's standard fare, but google "Surkov leaks" as well.
>>New fascistic government
LMAO, first complain about the overly liberal west and immediately turn to complaining about bad bad fascists.
>bans Russian language in schools
Russia does the same with minority languages, by the way. The country encompasses way more nations than Ukraine, yet they have equally rigorous language laws. Russian is mandatory in schools and all public use.
>others like Crimea vote to join the Russian federation
Forgot to mention the part where Russia had a "special operation" in Crimea?
>>Meanwhile NATO is making Ukraine a de-facto member, saying Ukraine has the right to join NATO, shipping them weapons, training their soldiers, and speaking of them as “partners”
Even though formally they wouldn't be able to enter NATO for at least a decade or so because the country is a corrupt shithole.
>a clear threat for Russia
This is what I'm talking about when I'm talking about unconvincing propaganda. Ukraine in NATO is not a real threat to Russia as a sovereign state. Yes, I'm sure NATO just can't wait to get into a war with a nuclear power. It's the idiotic Russian mindset "they're out to get us" even though nobody really wants your decrepit commieblocks.
What they are a threat to is the Russian imperialism and govts's/oligarchs' (no big difference between the two) standard games with trade of energy sources. The trick is in replacing the word "oligarchs" with "Russia", and you've already swallowed the Kremlin bullshit.
>There was no other way for Putin to defend his suffering countrymen in Donbas.
"Suffering countrymen", jesus, fuck off. I speak Russian, I know Russians, several are my friends and I've seen unfiltered opinions of dozens of them, as well as their news. They did not give a single shit about the suffering of anyone in Donbass until they suddenly had to pull a casus belli out of their ass. Nothing in the news, no Russian talked about the military conflicts, I've only heard about it from Ukrainians. The claim to the territory is just symbolic to Russians. (And at this point it's a barren hellscape that Ukraine would be smart to get rid of.)
The war is idiotic and will wreck the country. They had an economic crisis for two years when they just claimed Crimea. Had they played smarter, they might've been becoming the leading power in Europe (and actually dangerous to countries that aren't only bordering them). But instead they're forced out of it. If they cared about the poor poor Russians from Donbabwe, they would've played smarter and pulled them out, and live to fight an another day.
Anyway, wait a minute, so now you're saying the point of the invasion was to liberate Donbass? Weren't you initially complaining about why they failed to capture the large cities that are completely unrelated to Donbass?

[Anonymous No.20125801]

>>20125576
1) Liberalism and fascism are both revolutionary anti-Christian ideologies.
2) Almost 50% of Ukraine are native Russian speakers. You can’t ban the language without expecting unrest, which is what happened. These lands have always been Russian and were given to Ukraine arbitrarily by the conciliatory USSR leadership.
3) Your commie blocks argument isn’t convincing. The west routinely fucks with much poorer countries than Russia. They murdered Saddam Hussein and 1 million Iraqis on admitted false pretexts. They sponsored terrorists and revolutionaries all over the Middle East and Africa.
4) Russia is scared mostly of colour revolution, the new form of warfare adopted by the West, not direct invasion. Western sponsored colour revolutions have occurred across the world. But of course having enemy missiles on your border isn’t something to scoff at either, ask America when the same thing happened in Cuba.

[Anonymous No.20125822]

>>20125801
I should add that, since nobody has ever tried a nuclear surprise strike on a nuclear nation, it is impossible to know logistically how it would work out. Nations boast about having “the best missile defence systems”, but who knows whether they’d actually be able to detect and retaliate fast enough?

[Anonymous No.20126187]

>>20122454
>Clearly they’d have more leverage in the peace talks if they took Kiev.
Zelensky has gone on record, on every possible national and international stage granted to him, that every last ukrainian will die before an inch of ground is ceded to putin. He's a fucking lunatic who is both enabled and threatened by internal and external factions with their own interests beyond the given public interpretation of the situation. Ukraine diplomats are there just to waste everybodys time and will not agree to any formal declaration, not even ceasefires, beyond humanitarian corridors.

[Anonymous No.20126203]

>>20124789
Degenerate-on-degenerate violence is not only acceptable, it's encouraged, anon.

[Anonymous No.20126209]

>>20124900
Its times like these i think its important to take a minute to review how we came to our conclusions on the current snapshot of this invasion. Where did we get our information from? Are we sure we are being told cold hard facts straight from the battlefield? Is there any chance that soft power propaganda has been well established as an amazingly powerful force, doubly so during hot wars, but ultimately is nothing but smoke and mirrors? When in the past have we been told everything is all fine and dandy when, in fact, things on the ground were neither fine nor dandy?

[Anonymous No.20126226]

>>20124942
>As for the degeneracy, I'd say corruption and nepotism on every level of life is much more dangerous than a minority of faggots who wave rainbow flags once a year.
But anon, in typical american extravagance, corruption and nepotism in the USA is far beyond what russia could ever hope to achieve. So they have the corruption AND the fagflags. Its a no-brainer.

[Anonymous No.20126227]

>>20125576
>LMAO, first complain about the overly liberal west and immediately turn to complaining about bad bad fascists.
Yes anon, liberals AND fascists both deserve the wall. Or is this a new concept to you?

[Anonymous No.20126240]

Didn't know /lit/ was so full of FSB stooges.

[Anonymous No.20126267]

>>20126240
got a link to the thread?

[Anonymous No.20126302]

>>20126267
>>>/k/52597497

[Anonymous No.20126360]

>>20125576
Over 10,000 Russian-speaking civilians in the DPR/LPR part of Donbass were killed by shelling and other attacks since the Minsk agreement was signed, the USA invaded 2 different countries after around only 3,000 civilians died on 9/11.

>>20126209
This

>>20126187
This, the rootless cosmopolitans running Ukraine will fight Russia to the last Ukrainian, and then flee to other countries at the last minute without fighting themselves. It's really too bad because a lot of deaths could have been avoided.

[Anonymous No.20126371]

>>20126360
>killed by shelling

[Anonymous No.20126379]

>>20126371
Don't poke a bear if you aren't aware of what comes next

[Anonymous No.20126389]

>>20126360
> Then
> "THIS IS ABOUT DONBASS"
> Now
>“Russia may conduct a full-scale offensive on Poland, the Baltic states & Kazakhstan as part of a global military special operation on demilitarization & denazification,” - Russian MP Sergei Savostyanov

[Anonymous No.20126396]

>>20126389
Ill believe it when i see it. These are the same guys who said they WERENT going to invade; perhaps the opposite being true is the safe bet to make

[Anonymous No.20126407]

>>20126389
> Reciting the list of Russia’s future demands during Soloviev’s show, Matveychev became even more brazen: “We should be thinking about reparations from the damage that was caused by the sanctions and the war itself, because that too costs money and we should get it back. The return of all Russian properties, those of the Russian empire, the Soviet Union and current Russia, which has been seized in the United States, and so on.”

> The host chimed in to ask: “Are you including Alaska and Fort Ross?”

> Matveychev nodded: “That was my next point. As well as the Antarctic... We discovered it, so it belongs to us... Also, the return of all medals that have been unlawfully taken from our sportsmen during all Olympic games, as well as the extradition of [Grigory] Rodchenkov, along with the extradition of multiple other criminals we’ll want. I think we should start voicing all of that, so they understand what will be on the table. You didn’t want to talk to us about something small, like Ukraine’s neutrality, here’s what you get. And that’s not even all of it.”

[Anonymous No.20126459]

>>20126240
This seems to just boil down to "if you really don't like the government or are an extremist you are a russian bot". Everyone knows that Russia supports separatist, extremist, whatever groups in the West. Does that mean that we all just have to shut up and listen to SNL and the Pentagon i.e. "turn our brains off"? Democrats are already consistently accusing the whole right-wing (even fox news, boomers, center-right) of being russian bots now. Obviously the interests of radicals in a nation are going to align with the interests of that nation's enemies. This whole thing seems fairly banal. From what I've seen not many have unironic belief in Russian "basendess" and such. It's more that they feel Russia can be used as a blunt object, and Russia feels the same about them

[Anonymous No.20127373]

>>20126360
Wrong there were 10k civilian casualties but only 3k deaths