I'm about half way through Mein Kampf and it's very annoying.

[Anonymous No.19812458]

Either Hitler loved to hear himself talk, or the publisher of the book couldn't translate for shit. It's nothing but jargon non stop. The way it's written is something along the lines of Nietzsche. Every page is run on sentences, and there's about 3 to 5 semicolons in every paragraph. Hitler gives example after example after example about why this or that should happen, instead of just getting to the fucking point.
The he has to try and sound pretentious by capitalizing the word "Fate" and referring to it as a female entity, or constantly referring to Germany as "The Fatherland".
I just roll my eyes every time I see it. I was excited to read it because it we all know how much leftists seethe over nazis, but now I just can't wait to finish it. If Hitler couldn't ramble like he does in this book then WW2 would've never happened, because he would've died a nobody

[Anonymous No.19812471]

As usual, I try to make a thread on a blue board and I get no responses. It's bullshit.

[Anonymous No.19812484]

>>19812458
English translations are infamously bad. It removes lots of jokes (yes, there are actual jokes), lot of irony and it really shallows out his otherwise fairly excentric (in a good way) writing style. Earlier translations were so bad they even mangled names and whole sentences. Either read original or get actually good translation (which I don't know even exists in English).
>Fate
Case in point. It should be more along the lines of "Providence".
>Fatherland
Again, original Vaterland is used with capital letter and it does not have any connotations like in English.
>rambling
There are definitely rambly parts even in the original, but again - plenty of them are tongue in cheek or later capitalized with a joke.

Anyway, even Hitler himself later stated he would change a lot about the book. That is why he started writing Zweites Buch (unnamed second book), yet regrettably never finished it.

[Anonymous No.19812495]

>>19812458
Hitler dictated the book; he never *wrote* anything. That adds to the rambling style

[Anonymous No.19812534]

>>19812495
That makes no sense.

[Anonymous No.19812623]

>>19812458
>Hitler loved to hear himself talk
He's a narcissist, what did you expect?

[Anonymous No.19812627]

>>19812623
>Hitler
>narcissist
Plenty of bad things could be said about the dude, but not that he was a narcissist.

[Anonymous No.19812662]

>>19812627
He was arrogant, overconfident, a manipulative attention whore, had Unwarranted Self-Importance so huge that he perceived himself to be a literal Messiah/Übermensch/Wagnerian Hero and the embodiment of Germany itself, and when things went wrong, he was quick to blame others for his own faults. Heck, when Germany was obviously losing the war, he planned Operation Nero, to burn everything to the ground like the finale of Gotterdammerung. The catchprase of abusive entitled narcissistic partners: "If I Can't Have You (Germany), No One Will!"

[Anonymous No.19812664]

>>19812458
Sounds awful. I'll definitely give it a miss. I'm actually concerned that reading about WW2 will red pill me too much. I'm currently a third of the way through a biography of Allen Dulles who worked in the OSS doing intelligence during WW2 and later was CIA director.
I'm getting pretty fed up of the cohen-cidences. For instance, did you guys know that it was Dulles, while at a diplomatic station in Constantinople after WW1, that helped deboonk the protocols of the learned elders of zion!? Heckin based! What a true American hero that totally didn't off JFK!

[Anonymous No.19812666]

>>19812458
Didn't read a single line of OP but I can already tell you're a huge faggot. Imagine getting filtered by the simple idea of loving your own people.

[Anonymous No.19812672]

>>19812534
He spoke to someone and they wrote it down for him. Learn your fucking language retard.

[Anonymous No.19812866]

>>19812662
Operation Nero wasn't "burning everything to a ground", it was destruction of strategic targets, basically same burned ground tactics as Soviets deployed.
>he was an attention whore self-believing messiah, my favorite pop-sci website told me
Anon, he initially had troubles when someone called him a "führer". If anything, him (and possibly Stalin) were one of the most spartan and modest totalitarian leaders.

[Anonymous No.19813249]

>>19812866
>initially

Yes, like the earlier anon stated. He started off with some potential which reached it's potential when he tried taking advantage of parliamentary problems and then he got up so full of himself especially as the war progressed and became fully mental and delusional by 1945.

[Anonymous No.19813259]

>>19813249
This is a very old meme. However also untrue. There are transcripts of majority of his important meetings from pretty much whole 12 years of the Third Reich, including the last days in the bunker. Even these last days, he is very rational, collected and nowhere near the "shouting, self-messianic, narcissistic madman" nonsense.
Majority of the transcripts are translated, you can read them yourself.
If something, he made honest mistakes along the way, some of them very early and those dictated what ultimately happened. I'm fairly certain he was aware and played along, but aware how it will probably go. It always seems funny to me, that people will rather go to some lengthy demonization process of a "shouting crazy person", than to just accept he simply made mistakes which in his zero sum game had extremely harsh consequences.

[Anonymous No.19813281]

>>19813259
Lmao, there's many 'transcripts' and accounts from people who spent the last days with him revealing him as the addled mind he is.

Not sure why you think 'shouting crazy person' is necessary to indicate problems, the shouting only really happened during the last day.

[Anonymous No.19813296]

>>19812484
Second book is a meme we will never know the truth about.

[Anonymous No.19813305]

>>19813281
Accounts from people who spent the last days constantly with him are very few, basically limited to his driver, bodyguard(s) and secretaries. Only one secretary ever claimed what you are claiming, rest of them (and transcripts concur) say otherwise. Like I said, you can read this all yourself, it seems strange to me that you are so ready to discuss thing like this without doing so.
The shouting most probably did not happened at all, as it wasn't transcribed for unexplained reason (why everything else was) and again only stands on contradicting testimonials.
Beyond that, what is there to prove what you claim?

>>19813296
Not particularly, everything around the draft is very clear.

[Anonymous No.19813320]

>>19813305
>Not particularly, everything around the draft is very clear.
It's hardly clear that it was going to be a 'second Mein Kampf'.

[Anonymous No.19813328]

>>19813305
>Accounts from people who spent the last days constantly with him are very few

False, there's several generals and also his architect as well as foreign collaborators or high-post nazis or subordinates such as Heinz Linge or Otto Günsche. Again the decline was present much before the last days.

He was very kind to his secretaries and clerks, so there's no reason for him to be documented as a yelling madmen. The point is that he was delusional not that he was a constantly yelling madman like how the media is keen to portray him.

>Like I said, you can read this all yourself, it seems strange to me that you are so ready to discuss thing like this without doing so.

Seeing how you are totally unaware of that side of his character, maybe you are the one who needs to do more reading.

[Oh No.19813335]

>>19813328
>there's several generals etc.
Usually turned around the doors, anon. Take a note I said constantly.
>The point is that he was delusional
Can you provide example of those delusions?
>unaware of that side of character which is hardly ever present in any primary source
Hmmm.

[Anonymous No.19813355]

>>19813335
>Usually turned around the doors, anon. Take a note I said constantly.

Not sure what you mean here

>Can you provide example of those delusions?
Yes, blindly trusting a very sketchy man like Theodor Morell who was feeding him essentially rat poison against the advise of all the seniors.

Or thinking that Friedrich Paulus wouldn't surrender just because of a promotion when all the odds were stacked heavily against him and his army was in no shape to fight.

[Anonymous No.19813361]

>>19813335
>unaware of that side of character which is hardly ever present in any primary source

*Present in pretty much every primary source except his secretaries.

[Anonymous No.19813376]

>>19812458
Test

[Oh No.19813405]

>>19813355
>Not sure what you mean here
That they have been guests who went in for specific purpose and then left, they werent constantly there.
>honest strategic mistake is somehow a proof of delusions
Exgf cheated on me once, I guess I suffer from delusions now. I really recommend you to read those transcripts, you will be very surprised.
>Morell
Morell was highly respected man back then, requested by literal kings, politicians and nobles from all around the world. He literally saved life of one of Hitler's inner circle, I can't remember whose now. He also treated sucessfully many of Hitler's ailments too. He was most certainly a controversial figure, but also one who did plenty of real work. There is even a high possibility that if they would listen to him, he could have saved Heydrich's life after the assasination attempt in Czechoslovakia. Controversial, yes. Insane witch doctor you seem to present him like, no. One should also remember that this was a time when methamphetamine was readily available in any pharmacy.
Funnily enough, with a respect to anon I also reply to, majority of his bad name comes again from Speer.

>>19813361
Then you start checking out these sources and find out they usually lead to one or second "source", that is either said one secretary or Speer, trying to get good boy points with Allies after the war. While literally every other primary source claimed otherwise.

[Anonymous No.19813424]

>>19812458
filtered

[Anonymous No.19813426]

>>19813405
>That they have been guests who went in for specific purpose and then left, they werent constantly there.

Well yeah and the best judges for those reasons alone. He was just quiet father figure to secretaries or whatever clerks.

>Exgf cheated on me once, I guess I suffer from delusions now. I really recommend you to read those transcripts, you will be very surprised.

ex gf is not on the same level not even comparable in action to the point I mentioned.

>Controversial, yes. Insane witch doctor you seem to present him like, no.

It's funny you think that because 'kings and politicians' requested him that he was competent. Yeah no, the Russian monarchs fell for a con man like Rasputin, people in powerful circles often do.

And even homeopathy doctors or snake oil men have a bunch of people they reportedly cured.

>Then you start checking out these sources and find out they usually lead to one or second "source", that is either said one secretary or Speer, trying to get good boy points with Allies after the war. While literally every other primary source claimed otherwise.

We also have accounts from much before the war from people who lost faith in him, written way before the war.

[Oh No.19813461]

>>19813426
>He was just quiet father figure to secretaries or whatever clerks.
He was very much like that in general, if people kept a certain stature he required. If they did not, he usually was strict, but never really emotional or irrational about it.
>if you make a mistake during a war, it is sign of mental illness
Come on. Not everything has to be inherently some socio-pathological issue.
>Russian monarchs fell for a con man like Rasputin, people in powerful circles often do.
That is my whole point. Because they are ultimately also just people, not infallible machines or godlike figures. Still, I don't think it is really on point to compare Rasputin and Morell.
>reportedly cured
I meant actually really cured.
>people lost faith in him
Which is hardly anywhere near close related to the debate itt.

[Anonymous No.19813493]

>>19813461
>He was very much like that in general, if people kept a certain stature he required. If they did not, he usually was strict, but never really emotional or irrational about it.

You seem to be under the impression I'm talking about his interactions with others, he was a statesman he kept a certain level of professionalism like any other statesmen. And he was also a human in the end. My points are about his faulty decision making and obstinate stubbornness to stick with wrong ideas.

>Come on. Not everything has to be inherently some socio-pathological issue.

Love how you like to belittle it by making it war decision when invading Russia was on his mind ever since the early 20s but he never had a good plan on it.

>That is my whole point. Because they are ultimately also just people, not infallible machines or godlike figures. Still, I don't think it is really on point to compare Rasputin and Morell.

Yes which is my point on Hitler, he declined over the course of the war as when nearing defeat compared to his decision making at his prime. He had a side to him which was the main reasons behind the failures in him as a person and that hastened the decline of his Empire.

Just because he is not shrieking madman that is often portrayed in media, doesn't mean he had no faults. The Rasputin point was just to illustrate how common it was among high statesmen to trust random folk legends or pseuds.

>I meant actually really cured.

Well that's the thing, medical health is really complicated. People report losing all kinds of illnesses after random homeopathy, it doesn't mean anything.

>Which is hardly anywhere near close related to the debate itt.
No, the point is it's the works by the people who interacted with him personally. Again there's no real point to the debate if you discount virtually anyone who lists out Hitler's faults.

[Oh No.19813525]

>>19813493
>faulty decisions
No, that was my point. Your point was some claim about various slew of mental issues and illnesses.
>when invading Russia was on his mind ever since the early 20s
Hedin talks say otherwise. And them being double-referenced, I think it is fairly clear.
>doesn't mean he had no faults
I claimed literally otherwise, anon. Again, the original claim of yours was very different.
>medical health is complicated
Yes. And Morell did plenty of factually good healthcare too.
>if you discount virtually anyone who lists out Hitler's faults.
I never did that. I literally claimed he was human who did plenty of mistakes, which implicitly means faults as well. I however decline all claims of mental illness and typical tabloid tier nonsense about him. Which, again, is what started this debate. Not me saying "Hitler was faultless".

[Anonymous No.19813535]

>>19813525
Also, why the fuck I have been namefagging this whole time? Lmao, my bad.

[Anonymous No.19813564]

>>19813525
>No, that was my point. Your point was some claim about various slew of mental issues and illnesses.

He was mentally ill, no doubt about it. Yeah I never listed any 'various slew of mental issues and illnesses.'. You did that all on your own.

>Hedin talks say otherwise. And them being double-referenced, I think it is fairly clear.

Yeah what does it say? Was that in the early 20s and clearly planned?

>I claimed literally otherwise, anon. Again, the original claim of yours was very different.

Yes I pointed out a side of him was mentally ill, you want to pretend he is totally normal wholesome dad figure just because he acted that way to his secretaries and you are amazed or something by it,

>Yes. And Morell did plenty of factually good healthcare too.

Veneral diseases was his only reptutation, making him a personal physician to administer every single medicine is stupid. And he was always unconventional treatments.

>I never did that. I literally claimed he was human who did plenty of mistakes, which implicitly means faults as well. I however decline all claims of mental illness and typical tabloid tier nonsense about him. Which, again, is what started this debate. Not me saying "Hitler was faultless".

He was not neurotypical by any means and he likely would have agreed himself.

[Anonymous No.19813601]

>>19813564
>He was mentally ill, no doubt about it
>he was, simply because I said so
You are going in circles.
>Yeah what does it say
That is is a nonsense, that invading Russia is historically a fallacy and undertaking such task would be probably the death knell for the whole Europe. Pretty much what you said previously. When Hedin talks to Goering, Goebbels and military leadership, they say similar. This implies that either invasion of Russia was largely unplanned and stemmed from some urge, or it implies some massive, impossible conspiracy kept in insane secrecy (through numerous actual NKVD agents in top Nazi ranks). Who knows. You should read the book, it is a great primary source.
>you want to pretend he is totally normal wholesome dad figure just because he acted that way to his secretaries and you are amazed or something by it
If I wanted retarded strawmen, I would go to /pol/.
>He was not neurotypical by any means and he likely would have agreed himself.
See above.
>Veneral diseases was his only reptutation
It was his specialization, not only reputation.

[Anonymous No.19813610]

>>19813601
>stemmed from some urgent crisis*
fixed.

[Anonymous No.19813622]

>>19813601
>>he was, simply because I said so
Says the mentally ill retard who ignores every source that says otherwise because muh secretary. Just ignore every leading psychologist or psychiatrist or academic source that says otherwise.

>That is is a nonsense, that invading Russia is historically a fallacy and undertaking such task would be probably the death knell for the whole Europe. Pretty much what you said previously. When Hedin talks to Goering, Goebbels and military leadership, they say similar. This implies that either invasion of Russia was largely unplanned and stemmed from some urge, or it implies some massive, impossible conspiracy kept in insane secrecy (through numerous actual NKVD agents in top Nazi ranks). Who knows. You should read the book, it is a great primary source.

Yet something he planned on since the early 20s

>If I wanted retarded strawmen, I would go to /pol/.

Yes that's where mental simps for retarded 20th century leaders reside.

>It was his specialization, not only reputation.
Yes, unconventional treatments for skin and veneral diseases clearly means he was clearly the guy to treat any illness or problem.

[Anonymous No.19813906]

>>19813622
>everyone who disagrees with me is mentally ill
No anon, you are just double-digit cretin who talks about stuff he has no clue about.
>leading psychiatrists blah blah
Fallacy. I already repeatedly asked you to provide specific proofs of your claims. Kershaw (that Kershaw, yes), Lutz, Walters and other mainstream big name researchers also do not agree with your claims. This also concludes with most findings of newest German research.
>Yet something he planned on since the early 20s
Proof being?
>s-simp
Use more triggerwords, retard.

[Anonymous No.19815038]

>>19812672
>I have to learn German to understand what he means

[Anonymous No.19815046]

>>19812458
Better book.

[Anonymous No.19815342]

>>19812458
>Either Hitler loved to hear himself talk, or the publisher of the book couldn't translate for shit.
Its the former
>source: am german
I quit the book after 1/4 or so, this Hitler fella is just too far his own arse

[Anonymous No.19815355]

did you guys know that hitler was so blitzed on painkillers, cocaine and meth by the end of the war that he was a completely bumbling, stumbling incoherent mess

[Anonymous No.19815381]

>>19815355
>How then did Germany “break the bondage of interest”? Few now know. Rearmament is not a sufficient explanation. Prof. A. J. P. Taylor, the eminent British historian, and hardly a Nazi sympathizer, writes:

>"Fascism, it was claimed, represented the last aggressive stage of capitalism in decline, and its momentum could be sustained only by war. There was an element of truth in this, but not much. The full employment which Nazi Germany was the first European country to possess, depended in large part on the production of armaments; but it could have been provided equally well (and was to some extent) by other forms of public works from roads to great buildings. The Nazi secret was not armament production; it was freedom from the then orthodox principles of economics . . . the argument for war did not work even if the Nazi system had relied on armaments production alone. Nazi Germany was not choking in a flood of arms. On the contrary, the German Generals insists unanimously in 1939 that they were not equipped for war and that many years must pass before “rearmament in depth” had been completed."

>Answering predictions of ruin by orthodox economists throughout the world, Hitler explained that Germany had not withdrawn from world trade but had bypassed the international financial system by means of barter, stating:

>"If certain countries combat the German system this is done in the first instance because through the German method of trading their tricks of international currency and Bourse speculations have been abolished in favor of honest business transactions. . . . We are buyers of good foodstuff and raw materials and suppliers of equally good commodities!"

[Anonymous No.19815576]

>>19812627
You must be over 18 to post here.

[Anonymous No.19815639]

>>19812623
>He's a narcissist, what did you expect?

spot on


People who define him as a psychopath or monster or sociopath and all sorts of bizarre deviations should read articles on Narcissistic Personality Disorder, especially the covert type.

It is ironic that someone like Hitler is mentally healthier than, for example, many of the drug traffickers who are locked up in Latin America's horrendous prisons (who are capable of dismembering other people by themselves, of ripping out still-warm hearts with their bare hands, and then sleep without any trauma after it), and yet the impact of pain and suffering he caused on the globe is far greater than any Druglord would be able to accomplish.

A narcissist in the wrong place at the wrong time can create oceans of suffering.

[Anonymous No.19815647]

>>19812458
You have to understand that from literature point of view mein kampf is nothing special, the writing objectively is self help book tier, however as a personal guide to National Socialism and Hitlers ideals and various viewpoints it is an excelent read.
Also read Fords translation while it is not exactly true to original german is probably best english translation out there.

[Anonymous No.19815690]

>>19812458
Which translation are you reading OP? You make it sound like it's the Stalag one, the Dalton translation didn't have those issues.