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/lit/ - Literature

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19416149 No.19416149 [Reply] [Original]

>casually revolutionizes storytelling for the next century, maybe even the next two

How did he do it?

>> No.19416267
File: 66 KB, 601x323, Tolkien We have come from God.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19416267

>>19416149
Tolkien is a special combination of talent, passion, intelligence, and creativity that we rarely get. I don't know how he did it but I'm glad he did.

>> No.19416320
File: 230 KB, 1280x571, lotr hobb.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19416320

his son annoyed him too much

>> No.19417910

>>19416149
what did he do that was so revolutionary?

>> No.19419617

>>19416149
He was a Catholic CHAD

>> No.19419622

>>19416149
He was a clever boy.

>> No.19419663

>>19416149
>how did he do it?

He didn't.

>> No.19419672

>>19417910
He allowed people to create their own worlds using folk tales and traditions of Europe or whatever other shitty ethnicities there are.

>> No.19421168

>>19416149
By being a britbong

>> No.19421172

but, he didn’t. all he did was make up some tropes that unoriginal fantasy authors copy ad nauseam.

>> No.19422013

>>19416149
He was obsessed with creating a world of his own, and he used christianity and native European folklore to do so.

>> No.19422910

>>19419617
he hated Vatican II though

>> No.19422923

>>19416149
His 'revolution' of storytelling consists of reproducible knockoffs growing in popularity, rather than a truly unique and creative artistic tradition such as Monteverdi created with opera, or Aeschylus with drama.

>> No.19422925

>>19419617
lotr is pagan though

>> No.19422927

>>19422910
What good, from a Catholic perspective, has come to the Church after the council?

>> No.19422932

>>19422923
>reproducible knockoffs growing in popularity
it's not Tolkien's fault that his work spawned a bunch of knockoffs.

>> No.19422936

>>19422925
The creation story of the Silmarillion is a pretty overt stylization of traditional Catholic theology.

>> No.19422939

>>19422925
larpagan copium dispelled by about 5 minutes of googling tolkien + lotr + christianity

>> No.19422969

>>19422932
I know but it's not like his 'revolution' (as Op puts it) of storytelling was particularly positive.

>> No.19422978

>>19422936
>Silmarillion
Who cares about that? Not I. LOTR and The Hobbit are heavily influenced by pre-christian ideas through his linguistic and philological studies. It's pretty clear just from the names of the characters alone...

>> No.19422989

>>19422978
The lotr also has a ton of christian stuff. the protagonists whole struggle is to resist the temptation of power and sacrifice himself

>> No.19423002

>>19422910
Doesn't change he was a catholic

>> No.19423005

>>19417910
He made Wagner-like shit without music.

>> No.19423008

>>19422978
Pre-modern, certainly, but hardly pre-Catholic. And that's just the names. The actual message of the books is overtly Catholic.

>> No.19423011

>>19423005
I don't think Tolkien was primarily motivated by a hatred of jews

>> No.19423021

>>19416320
People gave Christopher alot of shit in the 2000s as if he just picked up where his father left off after the fact but he really was instrumentally involved with TLOTR.

>> No.19423036

>>19423011
Neither was Wagner. I mean what's the point of such a statement

>> No.19423054

>>19423011
But he was motivated by a desire to endlessly ripoff Wagner under the guise of 'saving' European stories.

>> No.19423062
File: 40 KB, 460x620, 1636872034543.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
19423062

>>19423011
Wagner was motivated by the creation of true art.

>> No.19423084

>>19422989
>>19423008
What about Gandalf's (Gandálfr) cleansing by fire? What about the ring itself and the Nibelungen? What about the burial mounds and the treasures found within? He was inspired by all of Europe's pre-judeo-christian mythology and intended for LOTR to be a mythology for his own Britian

>> No.19423091

>>19423084
I said there was also christian stuff, and in prominent places, not that it was all Christian. The very defining quality of the Lotr universe is the marriage between Christianity and Pagan myth.

>> No.19423104

>>19423091
judeo-christians assimilated just about everything they had to in order to assimilate Pagans, ergo, judeo-christian symbolism used, more often than not is actually Pagan

>> No.19423114

>>19422925
Great we have the obligatory Varg-tier poster of the thread.

>> No.19423126

>>19423104
Yes but the arc of Frodo I mentioned is clearly more Christlike than reminiscent of a typical Pagan hero.

>> No.19423169
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19423169

>>19423114
based duuuuuude deus vult!!!
>>19423126
I don't see it

>> No.19423177
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19423177

>>19423169
>based duuuuuude deus vult!!!
You are just an obtuse idiot if you can't see the christian message of Tolkien. He was someone that converted himself into the catholic faith and most his writting have a christian message conscious and subconscious
I repeat, you are an idiot.

>> No.19423200
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19423200

>>19423177
you seem confused. If you reply again please try and refrain from insults, you might lose credibility

>> No.19423231

>>19423169
You dont see how a struggle to resist the temptation of power is more Christian than Pagan?

>> No.19423297
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19423297

>>19423231
yeah

>> No.19423495

>>19423200
I'm not looking for credibility. I'm just calling you an idiot (which you are).

>> No.19423749

>>19423084
>Cleansing by fire
Catholic
>All seeing evil eye
Catholic
>A ring symbolizing mammon
Catholic
>The corruption of nature is caused by sin
Catholic
>Pure evil
Catholic
>Humility as the all conquering virtue
Assuredly Catholic

There is a long history of Catholic writers using familiar folk tropes to demonstrate new values, from Cynewulf through the Pearl poet and onward. It is almost impossible to know if Arthur is a pre or post Catholic development. Even Beowulf bears the mark of Catholic culture. As a great lover of English and the languages that led to it's development, Tolkien followed in a long tradition of English Catholic literature.

>> No.19423910

>>19416149
name five non-genreshit storytellers that were influenced by his writing. He's worthless and only propped up by manchildren who only read fantasy children's novels or watch Star Wars.

>> No.19425328

>>19423910
DFW is one

>> No.19425784

>>19423084
LotR is a Catholic story with pagan aesthetics. Simple as.

>> No.19426277

>>19416149
>casually
>literally his profession
>took decades to do