/lit/ - Literature

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Anonymous Wed Oct 13 03:28:46 2021 No.19219272 [Reply] [Original]

Stop rrrrreading Milton.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 03:44:51 2021 No.19219317 >>19219272 Did British aristocrats trill their R's or did Pound OD on the ancient Greek and Latin r?

>>	Anonyzza Wed Oct 13 03:55:17 2021 No.19219351 Likely a result of OE/ME influence, vulgar, not aristocratic.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 03:56:26 2021 No.19219356 >>19219351 this

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 04:44:13 2021 No.19219459 >>19219317 Conservative RP (upper class/aristocratic) uses the trilled r for words with two successive R's like in married. Look up Lady Silvia's recording.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 04:53:16 2021 No.19219475 >>19219317 The English not rolling r is a comparatively new phenomenon.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 07:48:27 2021 No.19219967 >>19219475 Because we realised how silly and pompous it all sounds.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 12:42:52 2021 No.19221157 File: 615 KB, 895x1001, worry.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>19219967 What "silly and pompous" things will we do away with next?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 12:59:54 2021 No.19221226 >>19219272 Can't stop what I never started B)

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:00:59 2021 No.19221229 >>19219459 So like Spanish RRs?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:05:18 2021 No.19221244 >>19219272 I love pound because he was insane

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:06:33 2021 No.19221254 >>19221157 Anglos are currently in the process of doing away with the th sounds (they pronounce bathe like bave and think like fink).

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:08:16 2021 No.19221259 >>19221254 Anglos are currently niggerizing English. Getting rid of "is" and favoring caveman-like constructions. It's a sorry sight.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:11:45 2021 No.19221278 >>19221259 Dropping the copula ("to be") is common in many languages, including Russian, Arabic, and Tamil.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:32:17 2021 No.19221343 He didn’t like Milton?

Anonymous Wed Oct 13 13:35:09 2021 No.19221357

>>19219317
>>19219272
yeats had been an inspiration and a mentor to pound and poud strove to imitate yeats' accent, like something between anglo irish and the declamation of a shakesperean actor. I mean nobody wants to be from bumfuck, idaho.

there is something quite hypnotic to pound,whether hes talking about the troubadours, or sculpture or chinese ideograms, the philistines and (((usurers))), it doesnt make any sense, but the sheer conviction is hypnotic.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 14:15:26 2021 No.19221514 >>19221157 You.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 16:59:50 2021 No.19222324 I still enjoyed Paradise Lost but I think he had a point about Milton. His verse comes across quite stilted at times.

Anonymous Wed Oct 13 17:10:38 2021 No.19222386

>>19221278
I prefer my synthetic languages thank you very much.

>To be or not to be.
and all
>>19221259
It really isnt. You dont really see it in any sort of higher dialogue. Its only used very informally or among particular lowclass groups. The only time you actually see it used seriously is when when some african American studies or whoever wants to prove a point then goes back to writing articles in standard "to be" English.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 17:20:40 2021 No.19222450 Far too many great writers have retarded opinions about literature (see: Nabokov). I'll keep reading Milton.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 17:35:49 2021 No.19222521 >>19222450 Luckily Pound had some good opinions too.

Anonymous Wed Oct 13 17:39:39 2021 No.19222540

>>19222450
Nabokov wasn't a great writer he was a hack. Truly the most overrated author I can think of. On top of, of course, having god awful literary opinions. Pound has some of the best literary criticisms, and essays on poetry in the English language, on top of being the most important poet of the 20th century.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 18:04:54 2021 No.19222632 >>19221343 Although he was a romance languageboo, Pound preferred the Anglo-Saxon side of English. He found Milton shaped his English in a much too Latinate form.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 18:06:45 2021 No.19222640 >>19219272 Poor guy

Anonymous Wed Oct 13 18:11:42 2021 No.19222660

>>19222324
The older I get the more I realize Paradise Lost is basically bottom of the barrel (right next to the Faerie Queene) for epic poetry. So many other better ones. Hell even ones that aren't talked about very much like Orlando Furioso and Jerusalem delivered absolutely mog Milton.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 18:27:01 2021 No.19222725 >>19221229 yeah, trill the r when it is doubled but the English trilled r is more subtle and shorter in duration

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 22:13:17 2021 No.19223631 File: 133 KB, 1231x493, literaryessaysintroductioneliot.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>19219272 eliot said he took it back

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 13 23:01:17 2021 No.19223786 >>19222660 have a few suggested epic poems, anon?

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 14 00:17:51 2021 No.19224173 >>19222540 >Pound has some of the best literary criticisms, and essays on poetry in the English language What do you recommend?

Anonymous Thu Oct 14 00:29:56 2021 No.19224225

>>19223786
Sure, the two I mentioned, do Barbara Reynolds Translation of Orlando Furioso, and Esolens translation of Jerusalem Delivered. Milton took a lot from Jerusalem Delivered in the depiction of demons and the like. You have ofc, the big boys:
>Iliad
>Odyssey
>Aeneid
>Divine Comedy
Additionally, you'll find smaller works of Arthurian and "the matter of french" epics. Wikipedia has a solid list under epic poems. If you look outside Western Lit, you might feel alienated from the writing and how different it is culturally (assuming you are western) but I enjoy the Mahabharata in the--abridged--version I read. Tolkien wrote epics ( two unfinished set in middle earth, and two complete ones in the Legend of Sigrund and gudrún). I used this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_epic_poems and started with the Greeks. If you're interested about a specific work let me know and I should be able to tell you about it.

Anonymous Thu Oct 14 00:32:40 2021 No.19224234

>>19224173
Read these. You can try google searching stuff, like "t.s eliot on milton" and you'll get his essay, it works with Pound but its harder.
https://www.amazon.com/Literary-Essays-Ezra-Pound/dp/0811201570

https://www.amazon.com/ABC-Reading-New-Directions-Paperbook/dp/0811218937

freebie for T.S Eliot and Milton: https://pages.mtu.edu/~rlstrick/rsvtxt/eliot.htm

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 14 00:48:04 2021 No.19224293 >>19223786 >>19224225 This isn't a poem necessarily, but also Shakespeare. Just all of him. He has two long narrative poems, and his history plays are basically an Epic (The Henriad).

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 14 01:09:41 2021 No.19224364 >>19221244 Honestly a good reason

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 14 01:38:14 2021 No.19224460 >>19219272 anyone telling someone else what NOT to read is defeated from the start. Just provide something better and make me read THAT instead of Milton (or whatever).

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 14 04:56:50 2021 No.19225002 >Him who disobeys me disobeys DROPPED

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