Books of Refutations of Sufism

[Anonymous No.19168297]

Which are the best books refuting Sufism and its dangers for the Westerner? I read Guenon, but was unconvinced of Sufism as something good.
It seems Muhammad was just confused by a demon, and believed in this himself before he was convinced otherwise by a heretical Christian (!).

>- But Muslim preachers now often say that the Koran contains some knowledge about the world, which became known to science only in the twentieth century.

>- Even if this were the case, in itself it does not yet testify to the inspiration of the scriptures, since, as you know, demons have more knowledge about the structure of the created world than humans, and there is nothing unusual here.

>That is, the criterion is not to know the hidden things, which a person does not know, but to know the future, which is known only to God alone?

>- Yes, that's it. Demons do not know the future, because for this you need to be above time. They can give short-term and long-term forecasts, but the more long-term the forecast, the more often they are wrong - remember the "prophecies" of Nostradamus. And to know about the structure of the temporal created world is not difficult for them. However, as far as the Koran is concerned, most often its "scientific predictions" are simply absurd.

[Anonymous No.19168298]

>>19168297

>- Finally, fourthly, it is necessary to talk about the personality of Muhammad. Even an ethnic Muslim just needs to hear in detail how the first "revelation" took place on Mount Hira, how the "Archangel Jibriil" literally squeezed out the first chapter of the Koran from Muhammad. This is a very striking evidence. Here you can also recall the name of Sura 74 - ""the Cloaked One", which, as you know, reproduces the situation of receiving "revelations" when Muhammad fell in convulsions, blew foam at his mouth, which from the point of view of the Gospel is a classic case of demonic possession. As a matter of fact, Muhammad himself believed so until he was deceived. And so, just a story about it is quite enough. Even convinced Muslims, after such a story, begin to think.

>- I know of cases when people were voluntarily seduced into Islam, and these cases have not yet ended in a return to God. These are cases among a special type of "advanced" Moscow intelligentsia, people who converted to Islam of the Sufi persuasion, they still remain there, and for them Islam is rather one of the forms of occultism, as they themselves say, one of the forms of the "primordial tradition ". They convert to Islam following the example of René Guénon. These are the so-called traditionalists, they often mimic the Orthodox (a famous example is Alexander Dugin). At the same time, they sometimes do not hide their sympathy for Satanism. One and the same person can approve of Sufi Islam and at the same time approve of Aleister Crowley's activities. So this tendency really takes place among certain circles of the patriotic intelligentsia. For them, seduction to Islam often occurs under the slogan of anti-Americanism. I have personally met such people. Most of them are unlikely to return to the Church. They consider themselves already enlightened, superintellectuals who do not need such a "trifle" as Truth. They are not interested in the Truth.

[Anonymous No.19168304]

would love to break this fag's fat slav(e)shit pig face

[Anonymous No.19168307]

Didn't take long for the demons to announce themselves.

[Anonymous No.19168327]

>>19168297
I don't think you need a book to identify the non-sequiters on the epistemic framework of their theology.
Unlike Orthodoxy, it has weak philosophical justification such as Allah essentially being rationalized into Natural Theological monism i.e. an uncarrying unpersonal force that can't enter space & time due to his indivisibility and thus can never experience his Creation. Also Allah isn't omnipresent since he apparently can't exist by bathrooms since they are "unclean".
My God is fine when I shit; in fact I do my best thinking/praying on the "throne".

Anywho, you can tear Sufism up with a kid's mind.

[Anonymous No.19168338]

>>19168327
Not to mention that Islam is essential Neo-Manicheism where they are stuck in such pointless dialectic tension that they consider Creation (and thus humanity) to be inherently evil. But it begs too many questions in its metaphysical conclusions that the whole thing collapses on itself
e.g.
Why would Allah's creations be evil?
How is Allah's actions (energies) indistinct from his essence (no essence/energy distinction)?
How can man compare themselves to Allah if Allah is unknowable in essence & energy?

[Anonymous No.19168344]

>>19168327
>I do my best praying in the shitter
state of christcucks

>Why would Allah's creations be evil?
Why wouldn't they be? You believe that "Satan rules this world" or other such drivel?

[Anonymous No.19168348]

Don’t Google “sufi shahid bazi”

[Anonymous No.19168369]

>>19168344
No arguments.
Typical cope of a butthurt coward.

Just ask the question: What if this anon I'm talking to is right?

[Anonymous No.19168372]

>>19168369
I have, the answer is no
not an argument by the way, lol

[Anonymous No.19168377]

>>19168372
>sophistry
So you lose the argument.
Great now go post of another Guenon thread.

[Anonymous No.19168380]

>>19168327
>Anywho, you can tear Sufism up with a kid's mind.

[Anonymous No.19168388]

>>19168377
I'm not a sufist or a sophist

[Anonymous No.19168390]

>>19168338
Also not to mention asking a muslim about the uncreatedness of the Qur'an.

[Anonymous No.19168399]

>>19168390
you mean asking a christcuck about the uncreatedness of jesus

[Anonymous No.19168401]

>>19168399
We don't believe in a simplistic monad with no distinction, so this is not a problem for us. Christ's hypostasis is uncreated, but His human nature is created.

[Anonymous No.19168408]

>>19168297
a must watch takedown of a debate
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wdut7k3njZs

[Anonymous No.19168412]

>>19168401
why does god need a son and why doesn't he have a daughter

[Anonymous No.19168419]

Is it fair to say there are three major islamic understandings?
No philosophy or theology, just a literal understanding of Allah's hands without asking how.
Natural philosophy mixed with gnosticism masked in the Arabic language and Qur'an.
Estoeric new-age perennialism stuff (sufism).

[Anonymous No.19168422]

>>19168412
He does not "need" a Son, but since the Father is Father He has a Son, it is purely by virtue of who the Father is.

[Anonymous No.19168425]

>>19168422
now THIS is sophism

[Anonymous No.19168431]

>>19168419
the latter two can be merged together imo
you either "get it" or you don't

[Anonymous No.19168440]

>>19168425
>sophism
Not under any definition of the word I know. That is how God revealed Himself to us and this is what we know. It's absurd to say that God "needs" a Son, as if He has something He lacks.

[Anonymous No.19168443]

>>19168440
>it say so in the biblerino therefore it true
lol

[Anonymous No.19168452]

>>19168443
>>it say so in the biblerino therefore it true

[Anonymous No.19168457]

>>19168419
I don't like to post in this satanic thread, but you got it halfway right. There are three major kinds and a lot of minor kinds: Purely exoteric legalistic Islam, which is Sunnism; the variant that privilages esotericism and inward spirituality over legalism, Sufism and Ismailism fall into this kind; and there is one that puts equal focus on exoteric and esoteric practice, namely Twelver Shiism.

[Anonymous No.19168464]

>>19168412
Chrono-Ontological justification.
If God can exist both inside and outside of space & time (as in Christ taking on both Human & God Natures (Dyophysitism)), then God ages through space & time as well as we've seen with Baby Jesus and Adult Jesus and the Ancient of Days.
Logically it is required so that personhood/identity is maintained in the Trinity:
The Father sees His Image in a possible world (let's say this reality), recognizes his Son as Himself, and is reciprocated in agape through the Holy Spirit between them. Thus the relationship between Divine Father & Son is always connected and recognized through the Holy Spirit in a regeneratively circular process known as Perichoresis: every interaction of and between the Trinity justifies their divine relationship further, eternally, and in all realities within an infinitely expanding omnipresence. Thus the Trinity is always in a state of maximized potential through this mechanism where the Son proceeds from the Father and together with the Son is worshiped and glorified; it acts as a Divine Polygon, thee metaphysical building block, on which all Creation is built upon.

[Anonymous No.19168469]

>>19168464
>words words words words
there is no deity but god, simple as

>>19168452
I accept your concession

[Anonymous No.19168471]

>>19168464
>Thus the Trinity is always in a state of maximized potential through this mechanism where the Son proceeds from the Father and together with the Son is worshiped and glorified*
*through the Holy Spirit

[Anonymous No.19168482]

>>19168469
Which God?
I hope you pick the one that offers you legitimate theosis/transcendence.
Also you don't want a monistic God that's too simple, else you'd have no complex ontological justification for yourself and thus would limit your own potential as a creature.

[Anonymous No.19168483]

>>19168452
he looks like those monks at the top of the mountain in Skyrim lmao

[Anonymous No.19168493]

>>19168482
>Which God?
there is only one
>your own potential as a creature
materialist bullshit

[Anonymous No.19168497]

>>19168483
Except these ones are real and can perform high level miracles.
The West has kept them hidden from you.

[Anonymous No.19168503]

>>19168483
The other way around. The Skyrim people are a satanic inversion of him who pray to dragons and demons.

[Anonymous No.19168506]

>>19168493
>there is only one
What's his name?
>materialist bullshit
We live in the material world dum dum. This isn't some fake and gay illusion world, it's REAL.
So are the other composite layers that form our realities hypostasis like the spiritual/metaphysical layers.

[Anonymous No.19168507]

>>19168493
>materialist
Did the one God not create matter?

[Anonymous No.19168511]

>>19168507
yes and?

>>19168506
allah of course

[Anonymous No.19168513]

>>19168507
This is what Western Natural Theology/Philosophy has wrought: Monistic worldviews where they can't even determine if they themselves are real or not.

[Anonymous No.19168521]

>>19168511
>allah of course
But it's not justified and you're living in bad faith constantly having to settle for a weaker and weaker God because you can't theologically & philosophically justify believing the stories about him.
Hence why I called you a sophist earlier. I can see you are a man that is struggling with his faith and trying to ignore the truth to preserve the small honor of holding onto a arab big lie.

[Anonymous No.19168522]

>>19168511
The Muslim Allah is a creation though.

[Anonymous No.19168530]

>>19168521
*checks watch*
time for your pills

>>19168522
um, no, he isn't

[Anonymous No.19168534]

>>19168530
I know that this is cope and that's ok.
Having your worldview shatter like that is a big existential undertaking that most aren't willing to take.
But your here and you've taken the first step.

[Anonymous No.19168555]

>>19168534
stop appealing to the audience, christshit

[Anonymous No.19168558]

>>19168530
>he isn't
He either doesn't have perfect knowledge or is malicious, since he lies about the Old Testament many times, twisting God's words like a certain creature does.

[Anonymous No.19168560]

>>19168297
>the dangers of x spiritual tradition
Why is it only Christians that sperg out like this?

[Anonymous No.19168563]

>>19168560
Because only we really take it seriously that there are evil spirits in the world (most people knew this but still prayed to them). We care for your salvation, anon.

[Anonymous No.19168566]

>>19168555
don't you want to win too?

[Anonymous No.19168570]

>>19168566
I've already won though, by being a muslim

[Anonymous No.19168571]

>>19168570
You will be damned for not believing in Christ's words while claiming to believe in Him. What kind of victory is this?

[Anonymous No.19168572]

>>19168563
>t. possessed by satan without realizing it

[Anonymous No.19168573]

>>19168558
the "old testament" is fake you retarded christshit

[Anonymous No.19168584]

>>19168573
Brother please stop using vulgarities next to Prophet Isa's (a.s.) name. These idolators have nothing to do with him.

[Anonymous No.19168586]

>>19168570
Well I'm gonna go with the Omnivictorious God that actually interacts with me and helps me win.
Not some metapolitical war deity that theologically won't/can't even look at you. It's the equivalent of worshiping Ares or Tiamat and ascribing extrapowers and necessity onto them.

[Anonymous No.19168589]

>>19168304
>He was killed in a Russian Orthodox Church by a masked gunman on November 19, 2009. Sysoev was known for his missionary activity, including among Russia's Muslim community, neo-Pagans, and Protestants. In December 2009, Sysoev's murder was claimed by a militant Islamic group based in the North Caucasus.

too late, someone did it already

[Anonymous No.19168593]

>>19168584
allah knows my intention

>>19168586
you're a muslim too? nice

[Anonymous No.19168601]

>>19168573
Just because it's Jewish didn't mean is fake

[Anonymous No.19168603]

>>19168593
How does Allah win if he can't even play his own game?
How can the muslims win if their god doesn't even want to play with them?
Hence why your religion revolves around Muhammad because you're ashamed of your own deity.

[Anonymous No.19168606]

>In sha'Allah

[Anonymous No.19168610]

>>19168603
thought I already told you to take your meds

[Anonymous No.19168627]

>>19168589
>known for his missionary activity, including among Russia's Muslim community, neo-Pagans, and Protestants
Extremely based.

[Anonymous No.19168628]

>>19168464
>If God can exist both inside and outside of space & time
That’s violating the law of non-contradiction by ascribing mutually-exclusive statuses to the same entity.

[Anonymous No.19168632]

>>19168627
based means high on crack, christcuck
it's not a compliment

[Anonymous No.19168644]

Can people on this board stop pretending that they actually believe in any abrahamic faith and admit that it's larp made to cynically self medicate their modern nihilism? True faith is not the domain of analytical spergs who pour over texts to argue doctrine and live out none of it. If you try to tell me you're a devout Catholic and you're not a border jumper or an Italian grandmother then I immediately know to write you off as a disingenuous dork who has nothing of interest to say. I want the post Charlottesville, tradcath deradicalization op to finally come to an end.

[Anonymous No.19168663]

>>19168644
>True faith is [...]
says someone who has no true faith...

[Anonymous No.19168670]

>>19168644
fuck off, amerishit retard
your opinion on anything is worthless

[Anonymous No.19168672]

>>19168644
It seems to genuinely anger the demon-influenced to see other people have a healthy faith in Christ.

[Anonymous No.19168677]

>>19168644
>""abrahamic faith""
This is how I know you are a of the bugman ethos.

[Anonymous No.19168679]

>>19168644
I agree. Debates are usually a waste of time, especially on places like this where people change their views like socks.

[Anonymous No.19168709]

>>19168672
>Posts closeted fag who was autistic
accurate representation of the personality type who decides to adopt these trad denominations

[Anonymous No.19168718]

>>19168677
Does it bother you that your religion is only one piece in a broader Jewish trend, Christcuck?

[Anonymous No.19168753]

>>19168644
Yeah. The teachings of Christ, Mohammed et al don't really chime with being a chantard.
There's a strange lack of self-awareness in these threads.

[Anonymous No.19168759]

>>19168644
>mfw spreading hate on the internet before I stop for prayers

[Anonymous No.19168829]

>>19168327
None of these arguments are convincing because you are responding to things no actual intelligent Muslim uses as an argument against the trinity or God's omnipresence. We don't say Allah doesn't enter space and time because He is indivisible, we say that attributing a son to Allah is a lie against Him because Allah owns all the glory in the heavens and the earth, and when you have a son, your glory is naturally shared with that son, and that son inherits your Godhead, which is why the Qur'an says that if Allah were to have a son, Muhammad would be one of his worshippers, peace be upon him. The problem is He doesn't have a son, and people are given less for disbelieving in Allah, let alone attributing to Him lies that He never claimed for Himself.

Anywho, we have the Qur'an and the messenger of Allah as our criterion, which is how we filter through the truths and the lies about Allah, since it is His direct uncreated word and testimony concerning Him and His works.

[Anonymous No.19168848]

>>19168464
Again, all of these are lies that you are going to have to answer to, since none of this was revealed by Allah. This is just your apology for a belief system that Allah did not legislate. If Jesus Christ is not God, and was just a Prophet like Allah and His messenger claim (and Allah's testimony is sufficient), your "chrono-ontological justification" completely falls flat on its face.

[Anonymous No.19168874]

>>19168571
>not believing in Christ's words
you mean not believing in what people put into his mouth?

[Anonymous No.19169076]

>>19168521
>because you can't theologically & philosophically justify believing the stories about him.
Islamic theology is strictly prophetic. Saying that we have to justify prophetic teachings philosophically is a non-sequitor. Allah sent prophets, not philosophers. We do not need to justify what they say philosophically because we have faith in their message like elderly desert women. It seems you haven't had Pascal's night of fire yet! "God of Abraham, God of Isaac, God of Jacob/not of philosophers and of the learned"