Joining a Catholic seminary -- books to make me ready

[Anonymous No.19146087]

What books do I need to read before joining a seminary?
I am reading the Catechism and the Canon Law and learning Latin and some theology + history of the Church and Christianity. What else do I need?

I am 27, I want to change my life and become a priest.

[Anonymous No.19146096]

Good luck with all the rape.

[Anonymous No.19146100]

>>19146096
You will never be woman.

[Anonymous No.19146103]

>>19146087
Did you read Saint Augustine, Thomas Aquinas, and Thomas à Kempis yet?

>>19146096
Shalom rabbi!

[Anonymous No.19146113]

>>19146103
Saint Augustine, yes, I love the guy.
I am currently reading Aquinas, going through Aristotle's Metaphysics took me some time.
I haven't read Kempis but he is on my list, thanks anon.

[Anonymous No.19146163]

>>19146087
Are you a practicing catholic or are you just in it for the epic trad bullshit

[Anonymous No.19146181]

>>19146163
I am, and I truly believe.

[Anonymous No.19146184]

>>19146163
He's posting on 4chan, do you even need to ask?

[Sage No.19146195]

>>19146163
Epic trad bullshit?

[Anonymous No.19146203]

>>19146163
>practicing
You mean the practicing Catholics in the United States who believe gay marriage is fine and it's her body her choice? Stop LARPing, the state of your religion is a joke.

[Anonymous No.19146220]

You'd be better off just trooning out. I can forgive that, but this is going too far.

[Anonymous No.19146229]

>>19146087
Vonier, The Human Soul
Vonier, A Key to the Doctrine of the Eucharist
Fr. Gabriel, Divine Intimacy -- **excellent** daily devotional readings.
Sr. Faustina, Divine Mercy in My Soul. Can't recommend this book too highly. There is no doubt in my mind the Faustina book, and its revelation/prophecy of Divine Mercy Sunday, was closely connected, in Divine Providence, with the election of JPII as Pope.
JPII: You can't go wrong with becoming a student of his very profound encyclicals.
Marmion, Union with God; Christ, the Life of the Soul; Christ in His Mysteries
John Hardon, The Catholic Catechism (published before and entirely different from, but compatible with, the Vatican volume, which of course is a must read)

[Anonymous No.19146263]

Before you throw your life away, ask yourself: do you REALLY believe that some guy in the middle east born during the reign of Augustus was the son of God, and that he walked on water? That's way more insane than thinking that you're a woman trapped in a man's body.

[Anonymous No.19146276]

>>19146263
Yes, I do believe.

[Anonymous No.19146286]

>>19146276

[Anonymous No.19146305]

>>19146276
God bless you, and I hope you find whatever it is you seek.

[Anonymous No.19146384]

>>19146087
They do psychological tests to filter pedos
Be careful...or not idk

[Anonymous No.19146444]

>>19146087
book about sucking cock. also you're not joing a catholic seminary, you're joing a vatican ii sect seminary, get it straight. stop calling yourself a catholic when you worship an antipope and a robber council.

[Anonymous No.19146464]

>>19146203
Euro priests and bishops are doing that too

[Anonymous No.19146471]

>>19146229
>There is no doubt in my mind the Faustina book, and its revelation/prophecy of Divine Mercy Sunday, was closely connected, in Divine Providence, with the election of JPII as Pope.
yeah his election as an apostate antipope, possibly the most evil man in history so far and precursor to the antichrist. divine mercy is an abomination and faustina was a heretic in prelest.
>“When I took the Messenger of the Sacred Heart into my hand and read the account of the canonization of St. Andrew Bobola, my soul was instantly filled with a great longing that our congregation, too, might have a saint and I wept like a child that there was no saint in our midst. And I said to the Lord, ‘I know your generosity, and yet it seems to me that you are less generous towards us.’ And I began again to weep like a little child. And the Lord Jesus said to me, ‘Don’t cry. You are that saint.’”
> “Jesus transform me into another host!…. You are a great and all-powerful Lord; you can grant me this favor. And the Lord answered me, ‘You are a living host.’”
>“Jesus” says: “And know this, too, my daughter: All creatures, whether they know it or not, and whether they want to or not, always fulfill my will… My daughter, if you wish, I will this instant create a new world, more beautiful than this one, and you will live there for the rest of your life.”
>“… and the host came out of the tabernacle and came to rest in my hands and I, with joy, placed it back in the tabernacle. This was repeated a second time, and I did the same thing. Despite this, it happened a third time…”
>“The moment I knelt down to cross out my own will, as the Lord had bid me to do, I heard this voice in my soul: From now on, do not fear God’s judgment, for you will not be judged.”
>“Jesus” supposedly said: “I bear a special love for Poland, and if she will be obedient to My will, I will exalt her in might and holiness. From her will come forth the spark that will prepare the world for My final coming.”
she thought she was a saint, she abused the Eucharist, she thought she was above God's judgement, and she affirmed jpii as you said, but it was false, a deception by the devil to legitimize jpii.

[Anonymous No.19146474]

>>19146444
>CATHOLICISM IS DA BES BECAUSE MUH COUNCILS MUH BISHOPS MUH POPE
>WHAT?! THEY HAD A HECKIN' ECUMENICAL COUNCIL WHERE THEY TRIED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH BEING ECUMENICAL INSTEAD OF DIVISIVE?! THAT'S NOT HECKIN' EPIC AND TRAD ENOUGH
ok schismatic

[Anonymous No.19146476]

>>19146087
Catholicism is a larp, my guy. Just like Orthodox, it's nothing more than a fad among zoom zooms (yeah you're a zoom zoom bitch) who are conservative-leaning and fed up with the modern left. Catholicism is just an occult meme religion that was used as a means of social control. Lots of made up shit that contradicts the bible and a faggy ass pope. Literally everyone I know who was raised cath disavows it once they're teenagers and ends up hating religion. Honesty smells like one of (((their))) tools used to make people fall into Godlessness. Don't waste your life being a shabbos goy, retard.

[Anonymous No.19146481]

not a shitpost or bait, check out the Seminaries chapter for some insight. probably the most practically valuable info you'd get.

[Anonymous No.19146486]

>>19146474
you're just a retard who doesn't receive the love of the truth. vatican ii contains blatantly heretical material and claims to be infallible, either you throw out everything pre-vatican ii or you throw out vatican ii. you can't have it both ways, it's logically inconsistent.

[Anonymous No.19146491]

>>19146476
This. Based post anon.

[Anonymous No.19146493]

>>19146476
what you know as catholicism is actually the vatican ii sect and that is what people disavow rightfully, because it is an abomination.

[Anonymous No.19146508]

>>19146493
so what are the major differences between pre- and post-vatican ii?

[Anonymous No.19146512]

>>19146087
I got you OP

[Anonymous No.19146528]

>>19146486
>>19146508
gimme a rundown on this

[Anonymous No.19146537]

>>19146512
>mfw no christwave web1.0 eden
why die

[Anonymous No.19146540]

>>19146087
I hope you do well anon. I am also 27 but considering going to a Protestant seminary soon.

You probably want to read Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma by Ludwig Ott along with the CCC. I've really enjoyed it.

[Anonymous No.19146549]

>>19146486
>>19146493
so what do you propose?
read the Catchism of Pope Pius X and seek out an SSPV/Sedevacantist parish?

[Anonymous No.19146566]

http://iteadthomam.blogspot.com/2017/03/new-downloadable-pdf-collection.html
https://www.fisheaters.com/catholiclibrary.html

[Anonymous No.19146567]

>>19146508
>>19146528
>Mass completely changed
>rites of priestly ordination and bishop consecration changed
>sacrament of extreme unction changed to "annointing of the sick"
>sacrament of penance changed to "confession/reconciliation"
>sacrament of the Eucharist changed to "communion" (given in the hand which was always forbidden)
>calendar changed, ember days gone, rogation days gone, octaves and vigils almost all gone, fasting no longer required during Lent, abstinence no longer required on fridays
>new code of canon law
>new catechism that only refers to vatican ii documents and vatican ii papal encyclicals
>allowance of "natural family planning"

[Anonymous No.19146572]

>>19146444
>kissing the Koran
I'm curious about how he justified this.

[Anonymous No.19146587]

>>19146572
>I'm curious about how he justified this.
I'm curious how modern Catholics cope with their religion. Seriously. How do they do it? Is lying to yourself that easy? Am I just retarded?

[Anonymous No.19146596]

>>19146549
best catechism is the Roman Catechism aka the Catechism of the Council of Trent. a good basic catechism is the Catechism of St Thomas Aquinas, which is a collected work of his sermons. the Catechism of Pope St Pius X was not even written by him and it's not the best anyway, i think there is still some modernism in that. SSPV is heretical, they believe in salvation outside the church, so you can't be in communion with them. the only hope is to find an independent sedevacantist parish which is very hard to do and you have to do your due diligence on the priest. like i said, they changed the rite of ordination, so vatican ii priests/bishops ordained in the new fashion are not valid, which means the priest you find has to have been ordained by a bishop consecrated in the traditional rite. there are two bishops who most contemporary valid bishops and priest derive their succession from: Archbishop Pierre Martin Ngô-Dinh-Thuc and Archbishop Marcel-François Lefebvre, C.S.Sp., although the SSPX is heretical, i'm just saying that bishops he consecrated are valid. here's a list:
http://romancatholicfaith.weebly.com/apostolic-succession.html

[Anonymous No.19146609]

>>19146572
he didn't have to justify it because no one cared. he held the assisi prayer meeting and no one cared either. this was an event held at a cathedral dedicated to St Francis where clerics from all religions were invited to pray together for peace. in fact, an actual statue of Bhudda was place on the tabernacle and incense was burned. there was a monastery building where the clerics were invited in to pray as well and each sect was given a room to prayer where crucifixes were removed or covered up so they false religions wouldn't be offended and could pray without an image of Christ present, including jews.

[Anonymous No.19146611]

>>19146476
there are countries where the only people who are religious are Catholics. there are countries in Europe that have been Catholic since antiquity, just go outside bro.

[Anonymous No.19146622]

>>19146609
So all this happened, and now he's considered a saint? How is this justified?

[Anonymous No.19146630]

>>19146087
You’ll probably want to get this for your parents.

[Anonymous No.19146665]

>>19146567
no offense but that doesn't materially change my views of Catholicism. It may matter to you that they changed some rules and rituals-- but to me, that's just the new boss same as the old boss. still full of teachings that contradict the bible and led by corrupt and evil men.

>>19146611
I assumed OP was an American, like most people on this site. I don't give two shits if that was a wrong assumption, Sheldon. That's not the point of my fucking post lol.

[Anonymous No.19146670]

>>19146087
MIGHT WANT TO READ UP ON ANAL SEX AND HIV INFECTION
PROBABLY CHILD PORN BUT ONLY FOR BOYS
MIGHT WANT TO ALSO READ THE TALMUD AND THE ISRAELI CONSTITUTION BECAUSE THAT IS WHO YOU SERVE
HA HA HA HA HA HA

[Anonymous No.19146733]

>>19146087
Guys just asking here, what was the name of that polish woman that wrote like a diary explaining her relationship with God, I don't remember if she was a mystic or a saint. Pls help :C

[Anonymous No.19146756]

>>19146609
wtf? any sources for this?

[Anonymous No.19146761]

>>19146609
Galatians 1:10
Am I now trying to win the approval of human beings, or of God? Or am I trying to please people? If I were still trying to please people, I would not be a servant of Christ.

[Anonymous No.19146767]

> chantards LARPing as the devoutly religious

When will this meme end?

[Anonymous No.19146772]

>>19146733
This?

[Anonymous No.19146775]

>>19146772
Yeah this one thanks very much. God bless you anon.

[Anonymous No.19146788]

>>19146767
>When will this meme end?
It will again be socially acceptable to mock religion on here in about 5 years, give or take. Just watch as these institutions crumble under the weight of their own pathetic conformism and all the e-converts will realize how retarded they were for LARPing with dead churches.

[Anonymous No.19146843]

St. Gregory’s 150 Chapters

[Anonymous No.19146895]

>>19146788
I'd give it a year max before atheism is trendy again.

[Anonymous No.19146926]

Read anything by Marcel Lefebvre to understand the council and the crisis of the Church.

[Anonymous No.19146952]

>>19146622
>>19146756
sorry i was getting lunch, source is here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qcgm0Jiy5jA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbqslK_Y_ww

[Anonymous No.19146960]

>>19146733
>>19146772
>>19146775
she is considered a "saint" only in the vatican ii sect. in reality she was a heretic and a false prophet, see her own words:>>19146471

[Anonymous No.19146964]

>>19146952
Again, how is he even a saint? How do Catholics justify this? I seriously cannot wrap my head around it and I want to understand. Do they just not care and cope?

[Anonymous No.19146973]

>>19146964
do you not consider yourself a catholic at all? are you just on the outside looking in?

[Anonymous No.19147013]

>>19146471
Textbook prelest. It's pretty insane that people consider this a saint.

[Anonymous No.19147031]

>>19146973
I was baptized as an infant went through the motions all the way through confirmation. Although now I do feel like an outsider looking in, I'm not practicing and haven't been in years, even when I did go to church, I can't really say I truly believed in the ritual or sacrifice of the mass, just being honest.

[Anonymous No.19147037]

OP here, there were some interesting book suggestions itt, I thank you for that.
However, I haven't read all the posts, because it seems to me a few anons started, for some reason, hurling insults and trying to convince they are right. I'm not sure why they are doing this. I just wanted to ask for help in preparing for seminary.
I feel warm in my chest, imagining myself following the path of the priesthood. It's not a larp thing or other buzzwords some anons are using here, it's just who I am and what I believe in. Not every Catholic around the world is a funny person pretending to be religious on an anonymous board, no, I lurk lit for books, nothing else. So I asked for books to prepare me more. The path I'm reaching for is hard and needs thorough preparations.
Also, I am not from the US but from Poland.

Thank you once more for recommendations. If you have any more, please post them.

[Anonymous No.19147050]

>>19146471
JPII was a great Pope. The criticism of him is weak and thin.

>From her [Poland] will come forth the spark that will prepare the world for My final coming.
Sr. Faustina is a great saint, and in the above words she likely prophesied the papacy of JPII, or perhaps the message of Divine Mercy which Christ gave to the world using her as an instrument.

[Anonymous No.19147072]

>>19146587
In all seriousness, by willful ignorance and mental gymnastics. They indulge in a labyrinth of “theology” to justify this or that. You see it all over from the sedevecantists, sspx, TLM, eastern rite and so on. They’ll come up with some sort of excuse for why they don’t have to recognize Vatican II or why the filioque doesn’t matter or whatever, but the thing is they don’t even agree on these and the irony is that they’ll tell you in the same breath how the Roman church is a unifying force. All while Francis continues his purge of tradition, and whoever comes next will almost certainly take up his mantle. I guess it takes a while to run out of copes.

[Anonymous No.19147082]

>>19147050
I love JPII's theology of the body.

[Anonymous No.19147100]

>>19146952
If non Christian religions are true, then that is basically stating that Christianity is false because it clearly states multiple times in the Bible that the Lord God is creator of all things and the One true God. I tried attending a local Catholic Church and I'd feel a very strange sensation from within that I shouldn't be in there. I knew there was something strange about it, I'll just continue to adhere to the faith as spoken of in scripture. Thanks for sharing this.

[Anonymous No.19147114]

>>19147072
>In all seriousness, by willful ignorance and mental gymnastics.

Nonsense. It is in fact the only Christian religion that is logically consistent and coherent.
Pic related.

Virtually every objection raised to Catholicism on the various 4chan boards is answered with clear and convincing evidence on the catholic.com website.

>>19147082
I have only just dipped my toes into the waters of that particular subject, but it gives every evidence of being profoundly insightful.

[Anonymous No.19147125]

>>19146087
Why would you ask 4chan this question when you could ask your priest, a vocation director, or the priestly fraternity/religious order that you're interested?

[Anonymous No.19147126]

>>19147114
>Virtually every objection raised to Catholicism on the various 4chan boards is answered with clear and convincing evidence on the catholic.com website.
True, you can copy the answers from there and btfo literally everyone on 4chan lol

[Anonymous No.19147134]

>>19147037
http://www.u.arizona.edu/~aversa/scholastic/
http://www.morec.com/nature/river.htm
https://aquinas101.thomisticinstitute.org/saint-and-scholar
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL_kd4Kgq4tP8e1BBGrC-eFlp86fqyvGex
https://www.appii.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/The-Dumb-Ox.pdf
https://www3.nd.edu/~maritain/jmc/etext/thomas.htm
http://www.catholictheology.info/summa-theologica/index.php

[Anonymous No.19147143]

>>19147031
it's easy for people who don't have a stake in the vatican ii sect to see the contradictions. people who are actually invested in it refuse to face the truth though, basically because the TV says that Francis is the rightful Pope and he occupies the Vatican after all. they don't actually focus on the Faith and dogma, they focus on what "feels" legit in the same way that some people will only buy coca cola and never buy a store brand, or people who only buy apple products. they have to feel like they're buying (into) the most legit product that the world accepts as legit. the implications for the Vatican II Sect being anticatholic are huge as well, and people don't want to face that - the "trads" at least. these are the people who realize Vatican II was fucked up but think it was still valid and just interpreted wrong or something. then there are the full blown Vatican II lovers who have no love of the truth at all and are only in it for the social aspect, it makes them feel good. these are the vast majority who use birth control, sin like crazy unrepentant, and generally go to a novus ordo "mass" a couple times a year. in short it's a mass delusion set upon people by the Lord for the unfaithfulness. they are blinded to the truth.

[Anonymous No.19147155]

>>19147050
>JPII was a great Pope. The criticism of him is weak and thin.
KEK, see >>19146952, >>19146444

>Sr. Faustina is a great saint
NO, see >>19146471

YOU CAN'T JUST IGNORE THIS SHIT

[Anonymous No.19147161]

>>19147143
there are also people who are not retarded 4chan battle dumbasses spreading venom and just love God, the Eucharist and the Church
I know anon, weird, innit?

[Anonymous No.19147171]

>>19147161
If you actually care for your faith and adhere to the Lord's teachings, that is all that matters.

[Anonymous No.19147175]

What are the pre-reqs to join a seminary in the US?

[Anonymous No.19147176]

>>19147100
yes i had that feeling to, even as someone who is catholic. it's because the Vatican II Sect is evil, not actual Catholicism. it's very natural for prots to hate the Vatican II fake Catholic Church as they do and i don't fault them for it at all. if you go to a Novus Ordo "mass" you will literally notice that when the "transubstantiation" happens, all the babies start crying. why? because an abomination is taking place. the novus ordo priests are mocking the Passion and the Blessed Sacrament by performing this fake ceremony which, luckily, is not even valid. if it were valid, the abuse happening to Our Lord's flesh and blood would be incomprehensible.

[Anonymous No.19147183]

>>19147082
>theology of the body
>theology
>study of God
>study of God of the body
JPII literally taught that man is the Christ, because he is antichrist. it's right there in the title of the book.

[Anonymous No.19147188]

>>19147176
>if you go to a Novus Ordo "mass" you will literally notice that when the "transubstantiation" happens, all the babies start crying. why? because an abomination is taking place.
Kekd
A bit too obvious bro

[Anonymous No.19147190]

>>19147161
This feels like a gargantuan cope. What God do you love? Clearly post-vatican ii represents a different God than the one who condones the slaughter of heretics and various other infidels. Sorry, but that's just what I see. What church do you love? The one which tells you homosexuals are your brothers, and that transgenders need a home, too? Are you on drugs?

[Anonymous No.19147192]

>>19147114
>Nonsense. It is in fact the only Christian religion that is logically consistent and coherent.
Vatican II is not logically consistent at all. it contradicts the entire magisterium prior.

[Anonymous No.19147195]

>>19147176
I was born a Catholic, never cared for my faith until I had the urge from within to read it. That's why I gave the Catholic Church another chance, but yea. Ever since I came to the faith I always had the feeling that it wasn't about attending mass every sunday; it was about who you are as a person, how you reflect and put your faith to practice in the real world that makes all the difference. Actually adhering to the teachings, actually following the Lord Jesus Christ. That's what I got out of it.

[Anonymous No.19147197]

>>19147190
I think you hate the idea of the church you created in your head, not the actual church.
Leave the basement, go to mass, read theology, pray, you will be fine.

[Anonymous No.19147201]

>>19147197
I'm not that guy but he somewhat has a point. gender neutral bathrooms were implemented in my local catholic church if i'm not mistaken.

[Anonymous No.19147202]

>>19147175
It's like joining the military with a security clearance. Background check, mental health check, etc.

[Anonymous No.19147215]

>>19147161
>and just love God
you love the same "God" as the muslims and jews, as Vatican II states. your god is satan.
>The Church regards with esteem also the Moslems. They adore the one God, living and subsisting in Himself

[Anonymous No.19147218]

>>19147202
Do you a need a specific level of education? What do you do with all of your stuff? House, possessions, debts, etc.

[Anonymous No.19147220]

>>19147201
I've never heard of that, literally all the priests in my area and the Catholic radio warns against the "gender ideology". Even the Pope said it's an annihilation of man as image of God, here's some dumb lib article about that
https://www.deseret.com/2016/8/3/20593175/pope-francis-wades-into-transgender-debate-laments-annihilation-of-man-as-image-of-god#pope-francis-is-cheered-by-faithful-as-he-arrives-to-celebrate-a-mass-at-conclusion-of-the-world-youth-day-inkrakow-poland-sunday-july-31-2016

[Anonymous No.19147226]

>>19147197
>I think you hate the idea of the church you created in your head
No True Scotsman. Which is the real Christianity? I keep hearing about it, yet I see different things everywhere. Sorry, bud, but I'm not taking religion seriously when your priests and pope go on and on about the virtues of immigration, love for homos and trannies, and niggers as if they deserve some social justice. Your church is a vehicle for the political destabilization of civilized countries, just stop fucking coping. It's a bad joke.

[Anonymous No.19147227]

>>19147220
Gender neutral as in, removed the signs that have a male and female on it. I could be wrong though. I even recall a priest talking about the current pope and not being sure about some of the things he was saying on the t.v or something like that. I don't think a lot of Catholics agree with how the current pope is handling things.

[Anonymous No.19147229]

>>19147220
see this is what you do, you ignore all the heretical apostate bullshit Francis does like bring false idols into St Peter's and just latch on to the one sort of sane thing he says. you people don't want the truth you just want excuses. it's like talking to a brick wall.

[Anonymous No.19147241]

pic related is the Catholic church
the following is the Vatican II Sect (Nostra Aetate from the V2 Council itself):
>True, the Jewish authorities and those who followed their lead pressed for the death of Christ;(13) still, what happened in His passion cannot be charged against all the Jews, without distinction, then alive, nor against the Jews of today. Although the Church is the new people of God, the Jews should not be presented as rejected or accursed by God, as if this followed from the Holy Scriptures. All should see to it, then, that in catechetical work or in the preaching of the word of God they do not teach anything that does not conform to the truth of the Gospel and the spirit of Christ.

>Furthermore, in her rejection of every persecution against any man, the Church, mindful of the patrimony she shares with the Jews and moved not by political reasons but by the Gospel's spiritual love, decries hatred, persecutions, displays of anti-Semitism, directed against Jews at any time and by anyone.

YOU CANNOT FUCKING RECONCILE THIS SHIT

[Anonymous No.19147261]

>>19147114
>Nonsense. It is in fact the only Christian religion that is logically consistent and coherent.
>Pic related.
Insane cope and ironically, exactly the sort of mental gymnastics I mentioned. You have so many dissident factions and barely know your own theology. Reminder that the Catholic Church gave rise to Protestants in the first place. To think this is “consistent” or “coherent” is beyond ridiculous. It’s literally blatant lies and ignorance at this point. No one should feel bad for you as things only get worse.

[Anonymous No.19147274]

>>19147241
>>True, the Jewish authorities and those who followed their lead pressed for the death of Christ;(13) still, what happened in His passion cannot be charged against all the Jews, without distinction, then alive, nor against the Jews of today. Although the Church is the new people of God, the Jews should not be presented as rejected or accursed by God, as if this followed from the Holy Scriptures. All should see to it, then, that in catechetical work or in the preaching of the word of God they do not teach anything that does not conform to the truth of the Gospel and the spirit of Christ.
Something very wrong about this. The Bible says something entirely different.

[Anonymous No.19147278]

>>19147261
i assume you're an ortho. i'm the sede. you guys always say that the protestant revolution came from catholicism as if it's some damning piece of evidence. well if a heresy arising from a religion makes the religion false, then by your own logic eastern orthodoxy would be wrong as well since catholicism arose from it in your perspective.

[Anonymous No.19147280]

>>19147261
>Insane cope and ironically, exactly the sort of mental gymnastics I mentioned.

No mental gymnastics involved. Joyce did not believe in God, so he left the Church. Nonetheless, his penetrating intellect saw that the Catholic Church was indeed "logical and coherent," whereas Protestantism is "illogical and incoherent."

Simple as.

Again, virtually every objection people raise to Catholicism is addressed on catholic.com

[Anonymous No.19147284]

>>19147280
catholic answers is heretical as fuck. fuck jimmy akin specifically. i have literally been banned multiple times from their forums for quoting saints lol.

[Anonymous No.19147285]

>>19146788
>>19146895
I don't think so. I give it 50 years before all the atheists have fewer children than the Muslims and it becomes trendy to censor unbelievers.

[Anonymous No.19147312]

>>19147280
>using some random author as justification for your supposedly sound bedrock foundation 2,000 year old religion
The absolute state of cathcucks.

[Anonymous No.19147314]

>>19147284
be honest though, were you being hostile or respectful?

[Anonymous No.19147320]

Nostra Aetate from Vatican II:
>We cannot truly call on God, the Father of all, if we refuse to treat in a brotherly way any man
Bible from God:
>Bear not the yoke with unbelievers. For what participation hath justice with injustice? Or what fellowship hath light with darkness? [15] And what concord hath Christ with Belial? Or what part hath the faithful with the unbeliever?
>[16] And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? For you are the temple of the living God; as God saith: I will dwell in them, and walk among them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. [17] Wherefore, Go out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing: [18] And I will receive you; and I will be a Father to you; and you shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

[Anonymous No.19147321]

Aren't sedevacantists and trads basically admitting the church is false? If the lineage of St Peter is broken and the church us astray then the gates of Hell have prevailed against the church, which is meant to be impossible.

[Anonymous No.19147329]

>>19147321
no, so long as there are still valid bishops the church is still not defected. a new pope can still be elected.

[Anonymous No.19147331]

>>19147312
After all, this is the /lit/ board. And Joyce is quite correct, regardless of whether he is merely "some random author," as you put it.

[Anonymous No.19147333]

>>19147314
>be honest though, were you being hostile or respectful?
Why would it matter? Being respectful while quoting some Saint saying something anti-semitic or homophobic or whatever is still going to garner the same vitriol, because in the end, you can't justify it. Admitting an ineffable God just changed because dude weed kumbaya modernity is admitting the religion is false.

[Anonymous No.19147335]

>>19147320
Ah, but the parable of the good Samaritan says something else. Jesus also says love your enemies and if He wants us to love our enemies, what about the individuals who still accept Jesus Christ as Lord, Savior and Son of God?

[Anonymous No.19147336]

>>19147278
It’s more like it’s just another card on the floor, which suggests the crumbling house of cards that is Roman Catholicism. So that wasn’t my point at all actually but again, we have another mental gymnastic cope equating the schism to the reformation, which is just not true as a matter of fact. It’s even deceptive to suggest such a thing.

>>19147280
It is littered with contradictions and you know it. From trads who cope and accept Vatican I but not Vatican II even though Vatican I makes it explicit they would have to accept Vatican II and beyond. I mean, which is it? Your own church doesn’t even know and is in fact one more reformation away from reforming itself into oblivion just like the Protestants did.

[Anonymous No.19147339]

>>19147314
does it matter?

[Anonymous No.19147343]

>>19147333
You know exactly why it matters. If you go barging in to a discussion you're not a part of and start yelling at people and telling them your opinions, they will not want to hear anything you have to say. Don't act like you don't understand basic social etiquette.

[Anonymous No.19147344]

>>19147331
>The wisdom of this world is foolishness to God
This is what you believe. The opinion of some atheist mick shouldn't mean shit in the justification of a 2,000 year old eternal religion.

[Anonymous No.19147346]

>>19147321
Yes. That is insane irony of the trad and sedevevantist position.

[Anonymous No.19147348]

>>19147335
considering all men your brothers is a far cry from loving your enemies. they're literally talking about the freemasonic concept of fraternity.

[Anonymous No.19147351]

>>19147348
Brothers in the faith. Jesus Christ, through His parable of the good Samaritan tells us we should be kind and helpful to anyone in need of it, regardless of what they believe in. Now, no where is Jesus saying we have to believe in their beliefs. But the basic act of expressing love and compassion to all human beings is crucial to the Christian faith.

[Anonymous No.19147352]

>>19147343
>it's ok to delete the words of a Saint if i don't like the person quoting them
how the FUCK do you seriously consider yourself catholic???

[Anonymous No.19147359]

>>19146087
all of them

[Anonymous No.19147363]

>>19147336
>It is littered with contradictions and you know it.

No it is not. Far from it. It is the only Christian Church which in fact is *not* littered with contradictions.

> From trads who cope and accept Vatican I but not Vatican II even though Vatican I makes it explicit they would have to accept Vatican II and beyond. I mean, which is it?

The Church is what it says it is, including Vatican II, whatever problem a relatively small number of trads (in a Church with some one billion members) may have with that.

>Your own church doesn’t even know and is in fact one more reformation away from reforming itself into oblivion just like the Protestants did.

The Church well knows. Read the Catholic Catechism. And the Catholic Church, being protected by the Holy Spirit and the promises of Christ will never reform itself into oblivion.

>There is not and there never was on earth a work of human policy so well deserving of examination as the Roman Catholic Church. The history of that Church joins together two great ages of human civilization. No other institution is left standing, which carries the mind back to the times when the smoke of sacrifice rose from the Pantheon, and when cameleopards and tigers bounded in the Flavian Amphitheater.
>The proudest royal houses are but of yesterday, when compared to the line of Supreme Pontiffs. That line we trace back to an unbroken series from the Pope who crowned Napoleon in the nineteenth century to the Pope who crowned Pepin in the eighth; and far beyond the time of Pepin the august dynasty extended till it is lost in the twilight of fable.
>The church saw the commencement of all governments and of all the ecclesiastical establishments that now exist in the world; and we feel no assurance that she is not destined to see the end of them all.
>She was great and respected before the Saxon set foot on Britain, before the Frank had passed the Rhine, when Grecian eloquence still flourished at Antioch, when idols were still worshiped in the temple of Mecca. And she may still exist in undiminished vigor when some traveler from New Zealand shall, in the midst of a vast solitude, take his stand on a broken arch of London Bridge to sketch the ruins of St. Paul's.
-Thomas Maculay, Protestant historian

[Anonymous No.19147366]

>>19147352
I'm not saying it's okay to delete the words of a Saint, I'm saying; there's much more proper ways about proving a point. Stop acting like you can't see why it'd be a problem to act extremely hostile in regards to trying to explain something. That forum isn't 4chan. Have some awareness and see that different communities have their own ways of going about discussion. Even St. Paul explains this perfectly, and I'm surprised you don't see this yourself.

1 Corinthians 9:20-22
20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law. 21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law. 22 To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some.

[Anonymous No.19147367]

>>19147351
Nostra Aetate goes on:
>No foundation therefore remains for any theory or practice that leads to discrimination between man and man or people and people, so far as their human dignity and the rights flowing from it are concerned.
>The Church reproves, as foreign to the mind of Christ, any discrimination against men or harassment of them because of their race, color, condition of life, or religion.

you realize the Catholic Church has banned the public practice of islam and judaism before, right? Vatican II literally condemns traditional, historic Catholicism.

[Anonymous No.19147369]

>>19147343
>being nice is more important than truth
Keep on LARPing. Also, even if you were nice, you would get the same response. Dressing anti-semitism or homophobia or whatever buzzword you want to call it under the veneer of niceness will garner the exact same response. Stop being disingenuous.

[Anonymous No.19147375]

>>19147363
do you realize that there's a commonly held theological position in the Vatican II Sect not condemned by the Vatican called "fundamental option theology," where a person can be saved so long as they accept Jesus Christ in their hearts, no matter how much they sin. it's literally protestant theology and it's accepted.

[Anonymous No.19147376]

>>19147321
No, it's just that the See has transferred to Topeka, Kansas under Pope Michael.

[Anonymous No.19147378]

>>19147369
How do you not see that how you go about spreading information makes all the difference in regards to how people are going to take it in? There's no way you can be this ignorant and unaware of how ones behavior and hostility can negatively impact people in regards to being willing to listen to what you have to say. C'mon, stop being intentionally obtuse.

[Anonymous No.19147381]

>>19147329
So when Jesus said "You are Peter and on this rock I will build my Church" what he actually meant was that Peter's heir could be ignored and a handful of bishops are the real church if they decide so?

[Anonymous No.19147386]

>>19147366
you're just not a Christian at all, it's so obvious. you probably spend more time argueing with people like me who actually have the Faith than you do rebuking and trying to correct people in error.
>"He that sees another in error, and endeavors not to correct it, testifies himself to be in error."
St Leo the Great

[Anonymous No.19147391]

>>19146087
Don't do it. Most people who join are gay or mentally disturbed

[Anonymous No.19147394]

>>19147386
>people like me who actually have the Faith than you do rebuking and trying to correct people in error.

Luke 18:10-12
10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’

[Anonymous No.19147396]

>>19147363
>using a protestant to justify catholicism
Why are you so obsessed with finding people who disagree with you to validate your religion?
>>19147378
You don't understand that even with that veneer of decency people will still spew vitriolic hatred at you. Politics has raped minds. Being firm and assertive instead of being obsessive about rethpect matters much more, especially today.

[Anonymous No.19147400]

>>19147378
you have this conception that i just posted some edgy shit. i said i had been banned multiple times, one of which was for quoting Unam Sanctam in regards to no salvation outside the church.

[Anonymous No.19147407]

>>19147321
Yes that's why sedevacantism is trash. It's a self-refuting position.

[Anonymous No.19147408]

>>19147394
that Scripture is regarding sin. i am a sinner. we're talking about the Faith here though. the thing you don't have.

[Anonymous No.19147411]

>>19147363
It’s not just the various factions who do or don’t reject this or that. Even Catholic fundamentals are deeply flawed. There are problems with Thomism, natural theology, the fact that even Vatican recognizes explicitly heretical views. The common denominator across the Catholic Church is precisely inconsistency everywhere you look. From its fundamentally Christology and failure to distinguish essence from energies to the coping and politically minded internet cult sedevecantists. If you’re going to cope, cope with something that’s at least believable because saying the Roman Catholic Church is consistent is a blatant lie.

[Anonymous No.19147412]

>>19147386
If you can't see that I'm not against you, then what left is there to say?

>>19147396
>You don't understand that even with that veneer of decency people will still spew vitriolic hatred at you. Politics has raped minds. Being firm and assertive instead of being obsessive about rethpect matters much more, especially today.
You will never know unless you try it yourself. Something tells me you are dead set in your ways and refuse to attempt a method of passing information in a respectful and peaceable manner. You don't alter the truth, you don't twist it to satisfy their ears; but if you can't be respectful to a community who still accepts the same Lord Jesus Christ and has their own rules and methods of doing things, then you won't convince anyone. I'm not against you, I'm trying to help you see that a lot of what you're trying to do is going unnoticed due to your hostile and aggressive nature.

[Anonymous No.19147413]

>>19147407
no it isn't, i've literally posted multiple examples of Vatican II completely contradicting previous Catholic teaching. that's the real self-refutation.

[Anonymous No.19147417]

>>19147396
>Why are you so obsessed with finding people who disagree with you to validate your religion?

I like /lit/ and I like the Joyce quote. It's right to the point. Deal with it.

[Anonymous No.19147419]

>>19147400
I can only go by what you have told me.

>>19147408
Faith is not revealed by words, it is revealed by ones life and decision/actions in life. Grow up.

[Anonymous No.19147426]

>>19147412
dude, you are arguing with us and saying that you aren't against us. you conscioulsy know that we do not hold the same beliefs and yet you aren't against us? you're on our side? you're delusional.

[Anonymous No.19147434]

>>19147413
Do you mean previous Catholic teaching such as Vatican I which makes it explicitly clear that you need to concede to the Bishop of Rome and thus Vatican II or do you have another logical labyrinth for that too?

[Anonymous No.19147435]

>>19147426
I'm on God's side. I serve and honor the Lord Jesus Christ, but I'm not going to please man when I can clearly see a fault in your mentality.

[Anonymous No.19147436]

>>19147412
i mean me and the other guy probably don't even hold the same beliefs as eachother either, so you're on the same side as me, a sede, and the other guy, a non-catholic or maybe the ortho, while also being on the side of Vatican II. it's nuts.

[Anonymous No.19147439]

>>19147412
>same Lord Jesus Christ
Is it really? Are Catholics who think gay marriage is fine and her body her choice and the myriad of other inane political positions you can have today really worshiping the same God? They see God as someone ostensibly different from what is reality, according to your own doctrine.

[Anonymous No.19147446]

>>19147411
>There are problems with Thomism, natural theology, the fact that even Vatican recognizes explicitly heretical views
>saying the Roman Catholic Church is consistent is a blatant lie.

I disagree with you 100%. That's all there is to it. The Catholic Church has been around for 2000 years - no other organization in the history of the world is like it - and it will be around long after you and I are dead.

Why is that? Because it is the only and only Church established by Jesus Christ when He walked the earth.

The Catholic Church is the real deal, if anything is. Read Macaulay's remarks: >>19147363

You are the one who's in denial, anon, not me.

[Anonymous No.19147452]

>>19147439
Not every Catholic is like that, though. Just like not everyone who says "Lord Lord" does the will of God. Not everyone who claims to be a Christian understands their faith. I don't agree to homosexuality, it is clearly a sin. All I'm saying is, being respectful to those who acknowledge the same God is important. Regardless of their politics or the amount of faith or level of understanding they even hold. How can you not see the importance of respecting your fellow man as a Christian? It baffles me to no end how you cannot see the wrong in this.

[Anonymous No.19147458]

>>19147419
>Faith is not revealed by words
so if someone preaches heresy, that doesn't matter? lol
>>19147434
>Vatican I says listen to bishop of Rome
>John XXIII is falsely elected to the Papacy
>John XXIII is an antipope
>i don not have to listen to an antipope, only an actual Bishop of Rome
if you consider this a logical labyrinth, you're retarded.
>>19147435
you think i'm against Jesus then, and Jesus said that he who is not with Him are against Him, so by your perspective i am against Jesus, yet you are somehow on my side and Jesus' side. completely illogical

[Anonymous No.19147464]

>>19147452
the Bible teaches that homosexuals are reprobates. you cannot be a homo and a christian at the same time, it's impossible.

[Anonymous No.19147466]

>>19147375
>there's a commonly held theological position in the Vatican II Sect not condemned by the Vatican called "fundamental option theology,"

Yeah, no.

>While John Paul admitted that this theory has some valid elements, including the reality of a “fundamental option” for or against God, he pointed out that it is in the application of this theory that some theologians go awry. “To separate the fundamental option from concrete kinds of behavior means to contradict the substantial integrity or personal unity of the moral agent in his body and in his soul” (VS 67). The human person, or moral agent, the Pope taught, is a unity of body and soul, not soul alone. What a person does with his body partially constitutes who he is and whether he is moving toward increased virtue or vice. We cannot posit an “interior transcendent” realm of freedom that determines our eternal salvation in opposition to an “inner-worldly” exercise of freedom in our everyday ethical choices.

The Pope, in other words, reaffirmed the possibility of mortal sin—the choice that extinguishes the life of grace in a person, the choice that, if not rejected through repentance and conversion, leads to the permanent exclusion from the life of grace we call hell.
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/the-truth-will-make-you-free-0

>The effect of fundamental option theory ... is to minimize people’s awareness of mortal sin and the danger it poses to their souls.
>It was this teaching, which undermines what the Church always has taught concerning sin, that the pope condemned (Veritatis Splendor 65-70).
https://www.catholic.com/qa/what-is-fundamental-option-theory

[Anonymous No.19147468]

>>19147458
>so if someone preaches heresy, that doesn't matter? lol
Stop with these empty arguments.
Matthew 15:8
“’These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.

No, I don't think you're against Jesus; at all. You are making a lot of blind assumptions here.

>>19147464
You cannot partake in homosexual acts and be a Christian at the same time, that I agree with.

[Anonymous No.19147469]

>>19147434
and also, here's a prophecy made by St John Bosco in 1862:
>“There will be an Ecumenical Council in the next century, after which there will be chaos in the Church.”

[Anonymous No.19147475]

>>19147452
I'm not a practicing Christian. I'm the lapsed catholic from earlier ITT. I'm more aligned with you than you think, that's the problem here. I don't like what's become of my country, of Christianity, it's sick and twisted and abominable. You should understand why people are angry and refuse to respect those who tarnish what was once sacred.

[Anonymous No.19147484]

>>19147466
>allow heresy to pervade your false sect
>if anyone starts asking questions, tell them they just don't understand it properly
>let bishops and priests preach it anyway
>>19147468
we're not talking about lip service to Christ, we;re talking about holding to De Fide beliefs. this is what heresy is called.

[Anonymous No.19147485]

>>19147458
> I accept that you have to concede to the Pope
> I don’t accept that you have to concede to the Pope
> This isn’t a logical labyrinth

[Anonymous No.19147489]

>>19147475
I agree with you and feel the same way. But there's one way to go about exposing certain truths. You don't go on an enclosed forum and start shouting kike this and kike that. No one is going to bother listening to you. They are going to automatically make the assumption that you are an ignorant fool. Regardless of what you are trying to teach. You can still be respectful and expose certain people and speak certain truths.

[Anonymous No.19147499]

>>19147484
I said earlier, words mean nothing to prove ones faith. By their fruits you will know them.

[Anonymous No.19147505]

>>19147485
HE'S NOT A POPE
>"There will be an uncanonically elected pope who will cause a great Schism, there will be diverse thoughts preached which will cause many, even those in the different orders to doubt, yea, even agree with those heretics which will cause my Order to divide, then will there be such universal dissension and persecutions that if those days were not shortened even the elect would be lost."
St Francis of Assisi
>A pope who is a manifest heretic automatically (per se) ceases to be pope and head, just as he ceases automatically to be a Christian and a member of the Church. Wherefore, he can be judged and punished by the Church. This is the teaching of the ancient Fathers who teach that manifest heretics immediately lose all jurisdiction.",
St Robert Bellarmine
>"In the case in which the pope would become a heretic, he would find himself, by that fact alone and without any other sentence, separated from the Church. A head separated from a body cannot, as long as it remains separated, be head of the same body from which it was cut off. "A pope who would be separated from the Church by heresy, therefore, would by that very fact itself cease to be head of the Church. He could not be a heretic and remain pope, because, since he is outside of the Church, he cannot possess the keys of the Church."
St Antoninus of Florence
>"Now when the Pope is explicitly a heretic, he falls ipso facto from his dignity and out of the Church . . ."
St Francis De Sales
>"If ever a Pope, as a private person, should fall into heresy, he would at once fall from the Pontificate." If, however, God were to permit a pope to become a notoriously and contumacious heretic, he would by such fact cease to be pope, and the apostolic chair would be vacant."
St Alphonsus Ligouri

[Anonymous No.19147507]

>>19147475
And when I say respectful I don't mean it in a manner of praise or anything, I mean respectful as you'd treat any other person on the street.

[Anonymous No.19147514]

>>19147499
words can prove that someone doesn't have the faith though, when they preach heresy.

[Anonymous No.19147521]

>>19147514
Yes, they certainly do. But when it comes to proving ones faith, as you have accused me earlier of having none; I said in response, words mean nothing to prove ones faith.

[Anonymous No.19147522]

FULL PROPHECY OF ST FRANCIS OF ASSISI
>1. The time is fast approaching in which there will be great trials and afflictions; perplexities and dissensions, both spiritual and temporal, will abound; the charity of many will grow cold, and the malice of the wicked will increase.

>2. The devils will have unusual power, the immaculate purity of our Order, and of others, will be so much obscured that there will be very few Christians who will obey the true Sovereign Pontiff and the Roman Church with loyal hearts and perfect charity. At the time of this tribulation a man, not canonically elected, will be raised to the Pontificate, who, by his cunning, will endeavor to draw many into error and death.

>3. Then scandals will be multiplied, our Order will be divided, and many others will be entirely destroyed, because they will consent to error instead of opposing it.

>4. There will be such diversity of opinions and schisms among the people, the religious and the clergy, that, except those days were shortened, according to the words of the Gospel, even the elect would be led into error, were they not specially guided, amid such great confusion, by the immense mercy of God.

>5. Then our Rule and manner of life will be violently opposed by some, and terrible trials will come upon us. Those who are found faithful will receive the crown of life; but woe to those who, trusting solely in their Order, shall fall into tepidity, for they will not be able to support the temptations permitted for the proving of the elect.

>6. Those who preserve in their fervor and adhere to virtue with love and zeal for the truth, will suffer injuries and, persecutions as rebels and schismatics; for their persecutors, urged on by the evil spirits, will say they are rendering a great service to God by destroying such pestilent men from the face of the earth. but the Lord will be the refuge of the afflicted, and will save all who trust in Him. And in order to be like their Head, [Christ] these, the elect, will act with confidence, and by their death will purchase for themselves eternal life; choosing to obey God rather than man, they will fear nothing, and they will prefer to perish rather than consent to falsehood and perfidy.

>7. Some preachers will keep silence about the truth, and others will trample it under foot and deny it. Sanctity of life will be held in derision even by those who outwardly profess it, for in those days JESUS CHRIST WILL SEND THEM NOT A TRUE PASTOR, BUT A DESTROYER."

[Anonymous No.19147525]

>>19147505
So let’s be clear. You accept Vatican I, but not Vatican II and think every Pope since at least Vatican II is illegitimate…?

[Anonymous No.19147526]

>>19147521
you've proven that you don't have the faith. you haven't referred to a single St, yet you've referred to multiple non-believers to support your arguments.

[Anonymous No.19147533]

>>19147525
Pius XII was the last true Pope

[Anonymous No.19147534]

>>19147526
So St. Paul is not a Saint? I have made many scriptural references to explain my position. You are being needlessly aggressive.

[Anonymous No.19147541]

Reminder that Catholics believe a statue of Mary magically squirted breast milk into the mouth of saint Bernard

[Anonymous No.19147548]

>>19147533
And you don’t think you sound ridiculous? Vatican I establishes that you have to concede to the Bishops of Rome and you accept that, but you deny Vatican II and everything since on the basis that they’re not legitimate Bishops of Rome because…?

[Anonymous No.19147554]

>>19147534
>needlessly aggressive.
aggression is needed to correct error.
>So St. Paul is not a Saint? I have made many scriptural references to explain my position.
you've misinterpreted Scripture which every prot also does. it's hard to misinterpret a subsequent Saint or church father whose duty it was to properly instruct the faithful in the meaning of St Paul's words.

[Anonymous No.19147557]

>>19147554
God bless you and have a great rest of your day.

[Anonymous No.19147561]

>>19147541

[Anonymous No.19147568]

>>19147548
see>>19147505
or continue to ignore every time i post the words of a Saint. man you really hate the words of Saints don't you? you don't listen to them, you favor the words of prots and infidels and you defend catholicanswers for deleting the words of Saints. what is your fucking problem with Saints?

[Anonymous No.19147571]

>>19147541
Wait until you hear this one.
https://gloria.tv/post/UoGNHpSXU6PM16d9YSuZ9j1wB

[Anonymous No.19147573]

>>19147557
YOU THINK I'M WRONG AND PREACHING HERESY YET YOU BLESS ME!!!! YOU'RE FUCKIN NUTS!!!!

[Anonymous No.19147578]

>>19147568
They don’t even justify your position. Just answer a simple yes or no. Yes, you believe every Bishop of Rome from Vatican II to present has been illegitimate or no, only some have been illegitimate and then explain what made them
Illegitimate and why.

You can’t seem to do this.

[Anonymous No.19147586]

>>19147578
i literally already said Pius XII was the last valid pope. >>19147533

[Anonymous No.19147593]

>>19147578
You can’t do it because either some are illegitimate on the basis of what you like or dislike and thus you don’t actually accept Vatican I or you all are illegitimate and thus you don’t even recognize the post-Vatican II See of Rome at all.

[Anonymous No.19147597]

>>19147586
And on what basis is he legitimate but all the other Bishops illegitimate?

[Anonymous No.19147632]

>>19147597
John XXIII was not canonically electes as St Francis predicted. try researching your own church history.
https://www.catholicireland.net/the-unlikely-election-of-john-xxiii/

[Anonymous No.19147650]

>>19147632
https://novusordowatch.org/2016/10/smoke-signals-white-smoke-1958/

[Anonymous No.19147674]

>op asks a question about books and tips
>retards are trying to prove him wrong nooo you cannot be a priest because this and that is false nooo!
why is lit so shit lately

[Anonymous No.19147684]

>>19147632
Then what makes Pius XII valid? What you’re suggesting should render every Pope since at least John XXIII invalid, but you don’t hold that view. Why won’t you just be honest and say that you consider the Pope illegitimate when they have bad disciplinary, juridical, and liturgical decision and that’s what gives you the right to rebel or not?

[Anonymous No.19147687]

>>19147674
>why is lit so shit lately
This is /lit/'s best. We're trying to prevent OP from joining a bunch of faggots adhering to a faggot promoting faggot shit ruining civilized societies.

[Anonymous No.19147697]

>>19147684
>roncalli elected under suspicious conditions
>immediately starts the Vatican II Council which preaches heresy while claiming to be infallible
>all subsequent "popes" uphold this council
what is so hard to understand about this?

[Anonymous No.19147704]

>>19147687
this. sadly OP is a faggot as always so he'll probably go through with it.

[Anonymous No.19147744]

>>19147697
The fact that by this logic you clearly reject the post-Vatican II See of Rome in its entirety. I don’t know if you’re SSPX or sedevecantists or some generic trad or what. Octorum fide of Pius VI, condemned the proposition that the Roman See can hand down bad disciplines, juridical decisions, and liturgical decisions specifically because of Jansenist heresies that proposed your could rebel against the Roman see if it had a bad position, which is the exact same position of SSPX, sedevecantists, etc. Vatican I made it clear that you must follow the decisions of the Roman pontiff in disciplinary, juridical, and liturgical decisions. That means that includes Vatican II. And by the way, John XXIII is accepted canonization by way of ordinary magisterial teaching and is infallible. You literally have no right whatsoever to reject Vatican II or anything after it. The Catholic Church right now holds SSPX in schism if that’s what you are. So how are you even Catholic if you maintain what was clearly condemned as heresy and are regarded as in schism by the Pope? You’re not.

[Anonymous No.19147778]

>>19147744
If this is true then it says all I need to know about Catholicism being completely false on its face. Keep following a Pope that kisses nigger feet and tells you faggots and trannies are your brothers, retard.

[Anonymous No.19147784]

>>19147744
nah

[Anonymous No.19147805]

>>19147778
Why would I argue all of that if I were a Catholic, genius?

[Anonymous No.19147817]

>>19147805
Ahh I thought you were someone else, apologies for the slander

[Anonymous No.19147832]

>>19147744
And this is the inconsistency rife within Catholicism. The Roman Catholic Church regards these positions as in schism and heretical. What’s implicit here is the idea that the Roman see has defected and Vatican I maintains that the Rome cannot defect. You cannot hold these positions while remaining in communion with the Roman Catholic Church. You are de facto in schism, even if you deny it (and you do) so to claim that this is somehow consistent is a blatant lie.

[Anonymous No.19147905]

>>19147261
explain all the variations of Orthodoxy and sects/schismatic Orthodox groups that are separated from their national denominations and Constantinople

[Anonymous No.19147927]

>>19147778
But here’s the real problem. This doesn’t speak so much to having wrong theology, wrong Christology or anything like that. It’s more that it speaks to the fact you have to accept these things like Vatican II or else you are de facto not a Roman Catholic. Now, you can say “what does it matter if you’re a Catholic as long as your views are right?” Well, that’s the Protestant position. So if you accept that, you’re a de facto Protestant, which they likewise regard as heresy, or else you’re without a Church, which is explicitly against their position as well. So they’re trapped whether they’re “right” or “wrong”, they’re always wrong.

[Anonymous No.19147935]

>>19146203
I'm a latinamerican catholic and here we always hear that "USA catholics are the real catholics. They're scarse but they live the faith very well" as oposition to the widespread of catolicism between hispanics with the result of a poor practice.

How are the USA catholics? Are you brainwashed by the liberationists jesuits? Or is it by the episcopalist? Is Joe Biden the typical american catholic?

[Anonymous No.19147940]

>>19147905
I could and I could address why this challenge is totally irrelevant but I’m not Orthodox, this thread isn’t about Orthodoxy, and the deflection doesn’t change anything at hand so I will not.

[Anonymous No.19147950]

>>19147935
lol US catholics are trash

[Anonymous No.19147965]

>>19146476
>everyone I know who was raised cath disavows it once they're teenagers and ends up hating religion.
>teenagers

What a good parameter dude.
Sure, being raised as a catholic gives you a lot of issues, but when you mature, you realize that it was good. Maybe it's not easy to find the faith again, but a goos catholic raising is what everyone shoul receive

[Anonymous No.19147972]

>>19147935
>Is Joe Biden the typical american catholic?
See for yourself.

[Anonymous No.19147994]

>>19147935
>>19147972
This is even more telling.

[Anonymous No.19148001]

>>19146087
Nice LARP. Seminaries usually take people in their teens and early twenties. Also they give you a list of shit to read. It isn't that hard.

[Anonymous No.19148006]

>>19146476
And they're both still better than protestantism, which is nothing more than judaism for Europeans.
>Honesty smells like one of (((their))) tools used to make people fall into Godlessness.
All non-Judaic Abrahamism is.

[Anonymous No.19148012]

>>19146087
>I am 27, I want to change my life and become a priest.
>I want to change my life

You're just a trad larper. A person with real vocation enters the seminar becauae God called him, not for an egotistical decision like "change your life"

[Anonymous No.19148022]

>tfw my childhood priest is an avid 4chan user

[Anonymous No.19148037]

>>19147972
>>19147994
What about abortion?

[Anonymous No.19148042]

>>19148001
Secular priests take people up to 55, and will sometimes make exceptions for older people anyway. Though the kind of person accepted in this case is usually a widower. Most fraternities/religious orders will take people up to 30 (Carthusians go up to 40 and Carmelites cap out around 25 I think).

[Anonymous No.19148057]

>>19147965
This. I especially enjoyed being raped. It really helped me improve as a person.

[Anonymous No.19148065]

>>19147965
>being raised as a catholic gives you a lot of issues
how could you possibly be thinking this is a good thing lol. catholicism's condemnation of sin makes it exciting and taboo, its ritualism makes people think God isn't real, it's hypocrisy makes people think God isn't trustworthy.

It's much better to raise kids with a proper understanding of the gospel, as opposed to exposing them to catholarpers who added on their own fanfic to the source material.

>>19148006
>protestantism, which is nothing more than judaism for Europeans.
of course, you couldn't explain this if your life depended on it because it literally makes no sense.

[Anonymous No.19148136]

>>19147965
>>19148057
i never got diddled but i really enjoyed being treated like cattle by this privileged caste that simply assumes they are owed money and services from the population like they're feudal lords and i'm a peasant. you WILL memorize this prayer, you WILL go into the dark box and tell the stranger if you masturbate, your WILL NOT ask what any of this is for or why the priest drives a better car than your family can afford and still pressures your parents into giving him cash in an envelope for every sacrament. one really needs to see how the church behaves in countries they have complete control over to appreciate its loving ways.

[Anonymous No.19148243]

>>19146163
No, not OP. I'm an atheist. I deny any greater metaphysical reality or diety. I entered seminary in 2020 and am still in it. I struggled severely on the job market and was unable to secure gainful employment so for me it is a matter of economic necessity. I'm paid a stiped of $1000 a month and am given my own dormitory and three meals a day. I enjoy philosophy and religion, and poverty precluded any other path for me in life so I chose to become a priest. A practicing catholic is not valid defense of wanting to enter seminary. The saints considered the majority of man, indeed the majority of catholics to be damned, and scripture itself validates this idea. Most practicing catholics are so in name only. Practicing catholic is an oxymoron as receiving the sacraments in their wretched state confirms them in their sins and they are clothed with a veil of hypocrisy.

[Anonymous No.19148427]

>>19148243
If this isn't a LARP it's honestly pretty smart. You're better than the so-called practicing catholics adopting liberal politics to justify their religion to people who hate them.

[Anonymous No.19148440]

>>19146540
>Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma
That fact that it took a pr*t to recommend this tells me everything I need to know about /lit/ "Catholics"

[Anonymous No.19148599]

>>19146203
>>19147972
>>19147994
>practicing Catholic in communion with the Church
>embracing heresy in any capacity
pick one and only one retard

[Anonymous No.19148666]

>>19147972
I need to move to Poland...

[Anonymous No.19148693]

>>19148599
>pick one and only one retard
No True Scotsman. Again. Reality says otherwise, nigger. Everyone points and screams about who the real catholics are, and you are no different. You claim to have tradition on your side, and yet nobody but a small minority of freaks (as seen that way by your fellow catholics and clergy) thinks that way. Everyone else believes in the social progression of religion. Keep coping. Keep coping. Keep on fucking coping. It will never change the reality of your religion.

[Anonymous No.19148707]

>>19148666
Checked, but Poland is fucking retarded, man. Moving won't change the inevitability of things. Just stick around and enjoy the ride.

[Anonymous No.19148715]

>>19148707
Nah, Poland is still fighting against the slide into abomination. Things are definitely different..

[Anonymous No.19148781]

>>19146087
Dude I went through a religious phase when I was your age too. Don't throw your life away on silly nonsense. Go out and get your slice of the pie. Fuck a woman, travel, experience life in its fullness. Don't lock yourself away in a seminary with other fuck ups just because you don't like modern society.

[Anonymous No.19148800]

>>19148781
It's not even a dislike of modern society. Think about how many Catholics are more progressive nowadays. Also, think about how many before deciding to become priests had stints of promiscuity, or whatever else, maybe experience watching porn -- who knows? The issue is, what happens if there's a relapse going on, or maybe something worse, and you don't feel as though you have the means to deal with it? Then you're in a fucked situation. I'd stay away from places like that now, OP. Modernity has raped religious-minded people too. Best to stay clear.

[Anonymous No.19148810]

>>19148693
>No True Scotsman
HAHAHAHAHAHA
your reddit fallacy is only valid when no objective basis for the "scotsman" exists
retard

[Anonymous No.19148825]

>>19148810
There is no objective basis for Catholicism according to your own faggot Pope. According to most Catholics today. Look around you, reality completely disagrees with your group of retards LARPing. The only objectivity recognized is by this small group which is completely ignored at best and at worst insulted by clergy.

[Anonymous No.19149096]

The Church always outlives heresy. Today is no different.

[Anonymous No.19149652]

>>19148781
You're going to hell and this post will be burned into your mind for forfeiting eternal life for this temporary one.

[Anonymous No.19149785]

>>19148825
>lots of people who claim to be Christian are actually not following the infallible doctrine of the ancient church founded by Jesus Christ!
there is nothing new under the sun. lack of historical perspective is the only thing that could make somebody type such a useless post

[Anonymous No.19149796]

>>19149652
He can be saved whenever he wants to be, christer. Universal salvation is your belief system.

[Anonymous No.19149812]

>>19149796
>implying Catholics believe in universal salvation
are you pretending to be retarded, or do you seriously think this?

[Anonymous No.19150938]

God why do americans love to invade and ruin things and places that don't belong to them.
Catholicism is not for you, its not part of your culture. You're irremediably anglo and always will be. Catholicism is not your new budhism, fuck off.

[Anonymous No.19151023]

>>19149812
95% of antichristian posters don't actually understand Christianity, they just base their ideas of it off of pop culture portrayals of Protestantism.

[Anonymous No.19151050]

>>19148693

>You claim to have tradition on your side, and yet nobody but a small minority of freaks (as seen that way by your fellow catholics and clergy) thinks that way. Everyone else believes in the social progression of religion. Keep coping. Keep coping. Keep on fucking coping. It will never change the reality of your religion.

You really have no idea what you're talking about.

Most Traditional Latin Mass churches have doubled in size in the last year, some tripling. If you had any connection to Catholicism you would know that there is currently an unprecedented return to the traditional practice of the faith. Go to any of these parishes and you will see them full of young families.

My church holds hundreds of people and it is filled to capacity every Sunday for Sung Mass. There are literally people standing at the back because they have nowhere to sit.

[Anonymous No.19151054]

>>19150938
I'm a Western Catholic.

[Anonymous No.19151060]

>>19147541
Yes

[Anonymous No.19151091]

>reading will make you a priest
If you want to be a Shaman, I'm afraid more arduous initiations will be required

[Anonymous No.19151280]

>>19151050
TLM Attendance has nothing to do with what I mentioned. You know exactly what I'm referring to but it seems you'd prefer to dodge the question. Bergoglio even put limits on your beloved Latin LARP. Stop coping. Even the average Catholic in attendance to these TLMs thinks 'trads' are giving the 'church' a bad name. Hell, you might even, too. Most of your fellows in the faith think you're racist, misogynistic, homophobic.

[Anonymous No.19151295]

>>19151280
>Stop coping
>t. sperg who's done nothing but seethe in every response
you will never be a woman

[Anonymous No.19151320]

>>19149785
Yet that is my entire point. Most of your fellow Catholics, and your clergy think you're bigoted, and ruining the church. All of this is a fat LARP. Even the head of your church believes that your kind aren't even real Christians, so clearly the idea of who the real Christians are is something Christians themselves disagree on, when you also consider these people to be churchgoing Christians who pray everyday and yet have contradictory views on important political issues, do you realize how it personally makes you look if you claim they aren't a Christian? This is my point. Basically most Christians existing today think you're insane, wrong, and want you far away from their families. There is no roman catholic church anymore, it's dead. If you understand that, good for you.

[Anonymous No.19151327]

>>19151295
>you will never be a woman
That wasn't very charitable of you.

[Anonymous No.19151332]

>>19151295
>>19151327
You should have more respect for your trans brethren. They're just as capable to get to Heaven as you.

[Anonymous No.19151374]

>>19151332
>>19151327

Look, I can do it too!

"Pope Francis says 'Gender Ideology is Demonic'."

[Anonymous No.19151386]

>>19151374
The most famous. Catholics have been coping ever since.

[Anonymous No.19151388]

>>19151327

You help the trans community just as you help any other group of mentally ill people

>>19151332
See above. Mentally ill sinners are capable of salvation, it involves them repenting and renouncing their life of sin.

[Anonymous No.19151393]

>>19151374

[Anonymous No.19151396]

>>19151388
>You help the trans community just as you help any other group of mentally ill people
Cope.
>See above. Mentally ill sinners are capable of salvation, it involves them repenting and renouncing their life of sin.
Cope. You don't care about these people at all, stop pretending like you do. You hate them and want them dead just like me.

[Anonymous No.19151404]

>>19146087
Read the nicomachean ethics of aristotle.
Thank me later.

[Anonymous No.19151406]

>>19151374

[Anonymous No.19151408]

>>19151393
Great, you found media headlines in which the Pope says a liberal sounding platitude. The Church's teachings on homosexuality are unchangeable.

[Anonymous No.19151414]

>>19151408
>The Church's teachings on homosexuality are unchangeable.
You went from killing them to showing them the respect they deserve because human dignity. Cope.

[Anonymous No.19151417]

>>19151396
I want them to repent. Many "trans" people are kids who've been gaslit and driven insane by echo chambers and malicious media. Ideally, we'd have an ordered and healthy society with no incentives to be "transgender" and every incentive to be a functional person.

[Anonymous No.19151429]

>>19151417
The problem is your clergy and Pope with their sugarcoated language is that it makes people comfortable. Fire and brimstone screeds about the state of civilization, complacency among catholics, general apathy, would bear much better fruit. My opinion won't change, I believe your church is completely dead, but I don't think it can't be revived. But that requires something that would be seen as a grave sin by many of your fellow catholics, and clergymen, including Bergoglio. Which is why it won't happen, the West will continue its slow decline, and your church will remain conforming to the times as it slowly has over the years.

[Anonymous No.19151432]

>>19151414
>You went from killing them to showing them the respect they deserve because human dignity. Cope.
Why do you need to kill faggots again?
Im not the other anon, but i dont understand why you should kill crazy people... Isnt the church all about helping the ill ones?

[Anonymous No.19151438]

>>19151414
I'm not even sure what we're talking about anymore. You're criticizing traditional Catholics because the Church doesn't round up and exterminate homosexuals?

Sorry it doesn't quite meet your based standards. I'm sure you're doing all sorts of great stuff.

[Anonymous No.19151442]

>>19151432
Christians used to believe homosexuality was worse than murder. I use that point as proof Christianity is a malleable social institution used for universal social conformism. Paul calls them reprobates in the NT, man. There's no getting around how modern clergy, Bergoglio acts, and what is right there in plain print. I just don't like coping and larping, I want honesty and consistency.

[Anonymous No.19151443]

>>19147571
>I saw a beautiful blonde woman with breasts engorged with so much milk
This guy is just describing a wet dream.

[Anonymous No.19151446]

>>19151429
The problem is your clergy and Pope with their sugarcoated language is that it makes people comfortable. Fire and brimstone screeds about the state of civilization, complacency among catholics, general apathy, would bear much better fruit.
Doesnt this happen with any institutions? Moral tension is present in certain periods of time that are alternated with periods of cheapness... Like, if you think about it, the pope was not very religious right before the counterreform, but after it the "religiousness" of the catholic church was something amazing.

[Anonymous No.19151452]

>>19151438
I'm saying if there was ever a movement akin to the rise of fascism that occurred now in our polarized political atmosphere the church would condemn it despite it helping society. This is my entire point. Hell, you even condemned it last time, although Mit Brennender Sorge contained some things that would funnily enough be considered racist by modern Catholics, which draws back to my entire point about unchangeability being a retarded myth. I wonder what the clergy who condemned it then would think about our society now, and whether or not they made a mistake. Who knows?

[Anonymous No.19151457]

>>19151442
The same people you claim are LARPing (traditionalist Catholics) are the people wanting the same thing as you. You say "the Church used to be based, now it's gay" but then you accuse the people who want to restore it of being LARPers.

[Anonymous No.19151465]

>>19151457
I don't believe it can or will be restored, this is my entire point. I'm using these examples to point out religion's entire flaw as an institution, and the futility in LARPing with an institution whose adherents hate you, instead of doing something better with your time.

[Anonymous No.19151468]

>>19151442
>Christians used to believe homosexuality was worse than murder.
Catholic priests go to prisons to talk to murderers to make them convert.
Catholics even let murderers become monks in order to escape the death penalty (see manzoni).
There was the death penalty if you sold a loaf of bread to a muslim, though.
It almost looks like the church does whatver the pope wants. That's what i think youd call "the truth".
I think that "hate the sin not the sinner" is what the church is trying to do right now, and this principle doesnt go against the bible, so it can be done, because, if i recall correctly "the pope cannot be wrong".
Also, i ve just started looking for fags and the pope on google, and i found this quote.
>Non è lecito impartire una benedizione a relazioni che implicano una prassi sessuale fuori dal matrimonio, come è il caso delle unioni fra persone dello stesso sesso
Google translate translates it like this:
>It is not permissible to give a blessing to relationships that involve sexual practice outside of marriage, as is the case with same-sex unions.
So you are actually just an ignorant person.

[Anonymous No.19151477]

>>19151468
>n-no the pope is actually based
Stop with this nonsense. The Catholic Church has already irreversibly conformed to society, and these things take time. I can find 10 other retarded things he's said for everything 'based' you can find. Just face it, he's a faggot, and he's contributing to the decline of our societies.

[Anonymous No.19151500]

>>19151446
We live in unprecedented times. I don't think we can apply anything to a situation as unique as our own.

[Anonymous No.19151505]

>>19151477
>n-no the pope is actually based
Didnt say that.
>The Catholic Church has already irreversibly conformed to society, and these things take time
As it always did. Do you think christmas is not Yale: Christian Edition?
>I can find 10 other retarded things he's said for everything 'based' you can find.
Oh wow, you just found out my argument: christianity is both based and unbased.
Depends on what you like the most.
You cannot criticize what the pope says because the structure is too complex to come to a single sentence that encompasses the entire ideology of the catholic church (not even in regards to a single topic).
That's why catholics look at the current catechism in order to claim if the church is based or not.
>contributing to the decline of our societies
First question: what was the peak of human society?
Second question: when were you born?

[Anonymous No.19151511]

>>19151500
You can say the same thing about any other historical period.

[Anonymous No.19151517]

>>19151505
>yale
Yule*
Im phonefagging

[Anonymous No.19151522]

>>19151505
>what was the peak of human society?
Materially? mid-20th century I would say, I mean, we went to the moon. Even now though, this is a peak if we're talking purely materially.
>when were you born
Before the turn of the millennium, so, the peak of human society. Ha ha ha, very funny. It still doesn't mean we're living through a decline morally. This place is a depraved filthy shithole.

[Anonymous No.19151538]

>>19151465
>the futility in LARPing with an institution whose adherents hate you, instead of doing something better with your time

I already said I meet regularly with hundreds of other Europeans who have very similar beliefs and desires and engage in a beautiful shared ritual where we orient ourselves to something greater than ourselves.

What are you doing with your time, oh based one?

[Anonymous No.19151540]

>>19151511
>You can say the same thing about any other historical period.
Any other historical period had something in common, but the changes in recent history that separate the 21st century from every other time in history make it that way. More or less, every other time had at least one or more things in common.

[Anonymous No.19151544]

>>19151477
>he's contributing to the decline of our societies.
>>19151522
>>what was the peak of human society?
>Materially? mid-20th century I would say. Even now though, this is a peak if we're talking purely materially.
>we're living through a decline morally. This place is a depraved filthy shithole.
Ok. I'll write my question differently:
What is the peak of human society, morally speaking?

[Anonymous No.19151551]

>>19151540
Wait, so you think that moral tensions cannot be predicted in a 100 years or so, because now we have computers?
Bro, i'll prove you wrong: people are becoming more religious.
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/aug/27/religion-why-is-faith-growing-and-what-happens-next

[Anonymous No.19151557]

>>19151544
>What is the peak of human society, morally speaking?
This is a weird question because for most of human history people generally agreed with basic moral principles, right? So, you would probably want a mix of technology to have a stable civilization and a general moral consensus about things, not the chaos we have today, so it would be somewhere between the late 19th century through early 20th century, going too far into the 50s would be "too late" so to speak, I'm not one for idolizing the time that directly preceded what was to become a stark decline. And sure, you could mention the World Wars, but if we're talking a time when there were general consensuses about moral things, it would have to be before the mid-late 20th c. when all these revolutions in morals occurred.

[Anonymous No.19151562]

>>19148243
So you're a modernist.

[Anonymous No.19151573]

>>19151551
>Bro, i'll prove you wrong: people are becoming more religious.
Where? Third world countries? Thanks for proving my point. Western youth are dead in the water, man. I know all about the rise in Christianity, and it's mainly Evangelicalism, Pentecostalism in South America. These aren't exactly what the tradlarpers ITT have in mind.

[Anonymous No.19151595]

>>19151557
>This is a weird question because for most of human history people generally agreed with basic moral principles, right?
About catholics:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Alexander_VI
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2024665/The-Borgias-An-orgy-loving-Pope-incestuous-daughter.html
About laical catholics, you can look up boccaccio, or any noble whatsoever. As an example:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_XIV
If you wanna talk about outside europe
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi
Etc.

But the thing is:
You didnt answer my question:
What is the peak of human society, morally speaking? And no, im not talking about "a mix of technology to have a stable civilization and a general moral consensus about things".
So, what is the peak of human society, EXCLUSIVELY morally speaking?

[Anonymous No.19151611]

>>19151595
If you're going to cherry pick forms of perennial degeneracy than there was never a perfect peak morally speaking, which I'm sure is the answer you were looking for. Sure, no matter how much you persecute for example fags, there will always be fags around because that's just how it is, doesn't mean you shouldn't try and fix the insanity as best you can.

[Anonymous No.19151623]

>>19151573
Aaaah so you are talking about the half a billion people living in north american and western europe?
So, among the 7.7 billion people you choose 0.52 billion people's habits to prove that society is declining?

[Anonymous No.19151636]

>>19151611
Bro, pls.
Dont put words in my mouth.
I asked for the peak of human society.
I didnt asked for a period of time that was the absolute perfection of morality.
I asked for the peak...
I asked for the point in humanity that in your opinion is what represents the moment that was the most filled with moralfags.
It looks like you just dont have an answer.

[Anonymous No.19151651]

>>19151636
>moralfags
That would be today, honestly. Which is ironic. But I gave you an answer, early-20th century. Rise of Fascism. I believe it was the last stand against the tide we have now.

[Anonymous No.19151676]

>>19151651
FINALLYYYYY.
>https://www.syracuse.com/vintage/2018/10/why_did_upstate_ny_women_send_their_wedding_rings_to_benito_mussolini_in_1936.html
>As a way to push back against the sanctions, and to fill Italy's war coffers, Mussolini asked Italian women to donate their gold wedding rings on "Faith Day," Dec. 18, 1935.
Putin didnt.
Although prostitutes found this regulated system oppressive, they developed ways to resist it. During the Fascist rule (1922–1943), more restrictive measures were gradually introduced in 1923, 1933, and 1940.

>Overall, the system was considered a failure, and as in other European countries with Réglementation, movement for its abolition started to grow from the late 19th century, supported by leftist and feminist groups. This abolitionism of the time is often considered confusing, since it has been applied to both the abolition of regulations restricting prostitution and the abolition of prostitution itself. However, these forces led to the introduction of a new system in Italy that abolished regulation, but not prostitution as such.[2]

Legge Merlin (1958) Edit
The Legge Merlin (L75/1958)[3] (the Merlin Law, named after its main author, the Socialist Party member of parliament Lina Merlin), came into power on 20 September 1958. This law, still in force today with very little changes, revoked the regulation system, banned brothels, and established a new criminal offence called "exploitation of prostitution" (sfruttamento della prostituzione) with the aim to punish procuring of sexual services.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_Italy
Commies banned prostitution in italy.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faccetta_Nera
song about how nigger women are beautiful.
And dont make me start about how they loved romans... And romans loved to fuck young male kids...

[Anonymous No.19151683]

>>19146087

[Anonymous No.19151709]

>>19150938
No one is actually this retarded right?

[Anonymous No.19151711]

>>19151676
>commies banned prostitution
I don't see the point in this. Prostitution channels out that perennial desire I mentioned instead of letting it fester into worse things. The advent of high speed internet porn surely isn't worse than actually having sex with a woman. Women prostitute themselves in much worse ways now than they would literally in a brothel. Is it really much different?

[Anonymous No.19151795]

>>19151711
>Prostitution channels out that perennial desire
>perennial desire
Back in the days, everyone had a wife.
And if you didnt have one, it means you didnt want to. And if people didnt want to, then fucking syphilis filled hags isnt a perennal desire.
>The advent of high speed internet porn surely isn't worse than actually having sex with a woman
>surely isn't worse
Hahaha wtf. Fucking lol. It surely isnt. At least you dont get syphilis after jerking off to a scat fetish video. God bless the women that fucking actually did something against prostitution, instead of that faggot of a pope that did nothing.
Also, you have a very nice moral system, if you say that fucking prostitution isnt that bad.
>Women prostitute themselves in much worse ways now than they would literally in a brothel
Oh yeah hahahaha. Doesnt make it any different: commies achieved the peak of italian human society, exclusively morally speaking.
Communism in italy was the first one, modern days italy is second, while fascism is third. Filming porn in italy is illegal, just like working as a prostitute.
If now you can actually SEE that women are whores, and they can be whores doesnt make the human society as a whole less moral.
>Is it really much different?
What is your argument?
If now it's shit, and back in the days was shit, then neither of them is shit?
No anon, both are shit and back in the days was worse, because NOW you dont die of syphilis.
In conclusion: commies achieved a better society, morally speaking. You were wrong to claim that fascism did it.
Now go to /leftypol/ and ask them what to read to understand why the fuck did commies stop the plague of prostitution.

[Anonymous No.19151847]

>>19151795
If you want to talk about STDs then we should be exterminating homosexuals, but that's another story. The fact is you ban prostitution in the way it used to be, and it'll take another form, but only now it's in a more hyperreal aspect of human society. Are you telling me men who aren't brainwashed by excessive obsessions when it comes to sexual fantasies aren't more likely to rape women than those who aren't? Porn and online-prostitution creates a massive underclass of unhealthily touch starved antisocial men.

[Anonymous No.19151906]

>>19151847
>If you want to talk about STDs then we should be exterminating homosexuals
>if you want to talk about STDs then we should be exterminating one cause of the spreading of STDs among faggots, not the cause of the spreading of STDs among heterosexual people
Unless you think fags fuck heterosexual males
>The fact is you ban prostitution in the way it used to be, and it'll take another form
>The fact is you ban drugdealing in the way it used to be, and it'll take another form
>The fact is you ban homicide in the way it used to be, and it'll take another form
>The fact is you ban immigration in the way it used to be, and it'll take another form
I got it, you are an anarchist. Still, laws exist to punish the ones that make something (morally or not) wrong.
>Are you telling me men who aren't brainwashed by excessive obsessions when it comes to sexual fantasies aren't more likely to rape women than those who aren't?
Yes.
>He used the opportunity to make new claims about violence in the media and the pornographic "roots" of his crimes. "It happened in stages, gradually", he said. "My experience with ... pornography that deals on a violent level with sexuality, is once you become addicted to it ... I would keep looking for more potent, more explicit, more graphic kinds of material. Until you reach a point where the pornography only goes so far ... where you begin to wonder if maybe actually doing it would give that which is beyond just reading it or looking at it."
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Bundy
Killing is just another fetish. Do you think rapists are normal people? Every single person that isnt a normie is a (more or less) crazy person.
>Porn and online-prostitution creates a massive underclass of unhealthily touch starved antisocial men.
Kek.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/observer.com/2013/04/survey-finds-36-percent-of-americans-dont-watch-porn-and-are-total-liars/amp/
All male watch porn(except for me and some other nofapper on this website).
That means that there are too many males who watch porn to think that porn creates lonely males.
As i said, crazyfags existed always and will always exist. You cannot change it. Normalfags exist and will always exist. You cannot change it. These two categories of people will never be interchangable. They are complete opposites.

[Anonymous No.19151926]

>>19151906
Sure, they have always existed, but I think our current culture amplifies mental illness in ways that have never been seen before. Surely you think that our hyper fetishized deviant culture is a far cry from anything normal. Most people can watch porn and do perfectly well to separate it from their normal lives, yes, but some can't, and those people had they lived in a different time would not have the instant gratification, the means to delve deeper and deeper to manipulate their own mind into something far worse than it would have been had these things been either banned or severe limitations put on them.

[Anonymous No.19151944]

>>19151562
No. If it was up to me I would set society back another 1000 years. I read the old theologians. Modernists are fools that speak of wishy washy nonsense like union, universalism, ecumenicalism and other crap.

[Anonymous No.19151991]

>>19148243
we pay our priest like 2k a month. If you are an american, you are insane. You could have joined the military and be retired in 20 years with full pension; instead you will be hearing about teenagers whack off habits and grannies petty social grievances till you die.

[Anonymous No.19151994]

>>19151926
> I think our current culture amplifies mental illness in ways that have never been seen before
Think whatever you want, but at least prove it.
>Surely you think that our hyper fetishized deviant culture is a far cry from anything normal.
Hyperfetishized??? Where? Trannies are 0.3%, 1.4 million just like always. Fags are 0.7%,just like always. Lesbians are 0.3%, just like always.
NON BINARY PEOPLE ARE 1.2 MILLION. THOSE ARE FUCKING LESS THAN TRANNIES.
In art there was always a weird love toward sociopaths... Does that made normies more sociopathic? No.
>oh no, Ancillary Justice is written in a non gendered form because the protagonist is a robot that doesnt understand gender... Hyperfetish!!!
>oh no, this dude said that he likes feet. He is also doing rehab and is consulting a psychiatrist becuase of his various panic attacks... I guess now everyone is crazy....
>some can't, and those people had they lived in a different time would not have the instant gratification, the means to delve deeper and deeper to manipulate their own mind into something far worse than it would have been had these things been either banned or severe limitations put on them.
>but some cant
I'll have to stop you here.
Fags always existed. Now you know they exist. Jerking off to gay porn doesnt make them less fags. Having the pope telling them that they will end up in hell but "dont worry, we dont judge you" doesnt make the pope the devil, becuase if they read the bible they see that christians dont judge.
Limiting porn doesnt make them less fags, because if you are a deviant you cant stop being it becuase you didnt see 100 dicks instead of just one. Same logic can be applied to heterosexual people: you dont stop being het if you stop watching porn.
Watching porn that is more hardcore than your interests doesnt make it more appealing (unless you are a crazyfag). When i still watched porn, i once saw heterosexual porn: it disgusted be because i saw a dick. I watched lesbian porn: it disgusted me, because tearing of the pussy is painful. I watched solo porn: it disgusted me, because self inflicted painful acts on a pussy is disgusting. So i watched only naked women. Easy. If you like anything else, then it's because you are prone to be a cocksucker, a rapist, or a cuckold.

People dont do drug because they can buy them.

[Anonymous No.19152004]

>>19151994
>it disgusted be because
It disgusted me because*

[Anonymous No.19152009]

>>19148243
>>19151991
christ why a catholic priest? Currently we have 2000 catholics per priest, and it'll probably get worse in the next decade (after that, who knows, africa changes everything). Daily mass/confession, hospital visits, marriage counciling, mandatory prayers.... just being a decent priest is two full time jobs. You could have become an episcopalian, be responsible for like 40 souls (all rich shitlibs who will burn in hell anyway), get paid 4x as much and have the majority of the week to yourself. You should really re-consider your options as a mercenary non-believer!

[Anonymous No.19152032]

>>19152009
>>19151991
>>19148243
He is not catholic.
From the catechism of pius x
>Perchè sono detti santi i fedeli che si trovano nella Chiesa? I fedeli che si trovano nella Chiesa sono detti santi, perchè consacrati a Dio, giustificati o santificati dai sacramenti, e obbligati a vivere da santi.
>Why are the faithful in the Church called saints? The faithful who are in the Church are called saints, because they are consecrated to God, justified or sanctified by the sacraments, and obliged to live as saints.
He just googled the salary of a priest in europe (1.2k euros).

[Anonymous No.19152106]

>>19151991
$2k a month, free living quarters, a vehicle stipend and paid meals is really good. You don't need to worry about financial misery.

[Anonymous No.19152118]

>>19152106
they arent the only institution offering it, and they are the one asking the most for it.

[Anonymous No.19152119]

>>19151991
Now factor in you don't need to pay rent and all your bills are covered. Priesthood is the least financial stress of any job. You are taken care of.

[Anonymous No.19152127]

>>19152032
Seminarians receice a stipend. Priest's make a bit more and have basic allowances for phone and car.

[Anonymous No.19152152]

>>19152119
Right, but why not be an Episcopalian, earn 4x as much and work 1/20th of the time? You’ll get the same parish housing, car, etc, (except it’ll be nicer). You can even gay marry your Filipino boytoy.

[Anonymous No.19152163]

>>19152152
I hate sodomites and the liberal ideology of Episcopalians. You don't get parish housing, you are responsible for your own rent. It's possible to fall into destitution or unemployment easily.

[Anonymous No.19152171]

>>19152127
I know. 1.2k euros in dollars are 1.4k
They add 200 euros for every promotion.
1.2k dollars is the salary of a seminary student.

[Anonymous No.19152174]

>>19146087
Begin reading the Bible 4 times a year anon. That is the best way to prepare for seminary.
t. knower

[Anonymous No.19152299]

>>19152163
>i dont' beleive in god, but i'm afraid of being poor
>so i'm going to become a catholic priest and be pretty poor for my entire life
>i hate sodomites so thats why it has to be catholic and not far more lucrative routes
>that would require me a fraction of the work, several orders more cash, and the ability to be openly atheistic without getting fired
>ps i'll also give up sex for no particular reason because it has to be catholic

something about this story doesn't add up

[Anonymous No.19152358]

>>19148243
I sincerely pray you repent of your error and do not enter the priesthood in such a state of mind.

[Anonymous No.19152476]

>>19152358
>I sincerely pray you repent of your error and do not enter the priesthood in such a state of mind.
Honestly, is it really worse than liberal priests who deliberately mislead? The faithful wouldn't know the difference, and perhaps he would start believing as he went.

[Anonymous No.19152498]

>>19148666
Fuck you, we're full

[Anonymous No.19152985]

God Without Being by Jean Luc Marion