/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.19134523]

So I just bought the Alexiad by Anna Komnene. Do I need to be familiar with any other Medieval sources to read it? Have any anons here had any experience with it?

[Anonymous No.19134534]

>>19134523
Just read the introduction in your edition of the book, mayne. The author probably alluses to other relevant medieval sources in it.

[Anonymous No.19134541]

>>19134523
If you're asking these questions, you'll be frustrated reading this book.
fucking ignorant larpers

[Anonymous No.19134555]

>>19134541
Larpers?

[Anonymous No.19134570]

>>19134523
No you don’t need to be

[Anonymous No.19134581]

>>19134570
Nice, that’s good. Which translation is best by the way? I got one by Frankopan.

[Anonymous No.19134600]

>>19134523
Read the intro and you'll be fine, getting any source written by a historian is basically overkill for a source like this, it follows more closely the Roman and Greek tradition of writing histories so if you have read anything like Livy or Herodotus you'll be fine.

[Anonymous No.19134623]

>>19134600
This is my first translated primary source. I haven’t even touched the ancient world.,

[Anonymous No.19134654]

>>19134581
Not sure. I just got the penguin translation.

[Anonymous No.19134661]

>>19134623
I think the only problem you will have is lots of names, but besides that you won’t have any problem understanding the text.

[Anonymous No.19134686]

>>19134623
>didn't start with the greeks

[Anonymous No.19134699]

>>19134654
Yeah thats the one I got too. It says who translated it at the back

[Anonymous No.19134700]

>>19134686
>He started with the Byzantines

[Anonymous No.19134705]

Here’s some of my favourite passages

> This Robert was a Norman by birth, of obscure origin, with an overbearing character and a thoroughly villainous mind; he was a brave fighter, very cunning in his assaults on the wealth and power of great men; in achieving his aims absolutely inexorable, diverting criticism by incontrovertible argument. He was a man of immense stature, surpassing even the biggest men; he had a ruddy complexion, fair hair, broad shoulders, eyes that all but shot out sparks of fire. In a well-built man one looks for breadth here and slimness there; in him all was admirably well-proportioned and elegant. Thus from head to foot the man was graceful (I have often heard from many witnesses that this was so). Homer remarked of Achilles that when he shouted his hearers had the impression of a multitude in uproar, but Robert’s bellow, so they say, put tens of thousands to flight. With such endowments of fortune and nature and soul, he was, as-you would expect, no man’s slave, owing obedience to nobody in all the world. Such are men of powerful character, people say, even if they are of humbler origin.

> Bohemond resembled his father [Robert] in all respects, in daring, strength, aristocratic and indomitable spirit. In short, Bohemond was the exact replica and living image of his father. He at once attacked Canina, Hiericho and Avlona like a streaking thunderbolt, with threats and irrepressible fury. He seized them, and fighting on took the surrounding areas bit by bit and destroyed them by fire. Bohemond was in fact like the acrid smoke which preceded the fire, the preliminary skirmish which comes before the great assault. Father and son you might liken to caterpillars and locusts, for what was left by Robert, his son fed on and devoured.

[Anonymous No.19134708]

>>19134523
Anna Comnena is awesome. I would suggest reading Psellus and Attaleiates, the two historians of the immediately previous period (i.e. how Alexios inherited a such a shitshow)

[Anonymous No.19134718]

>>19134708
Nice, thanks for the rec!

[Anonymous No.19134733]

>>19134705
Based and BAP-pilled.

[Anonymous No.19134734]

>>19134686
>Starting with the Medieval Romans

[Anonymous No.19134746]

>>19134718
Also while we are here - Byzantine epic poetry (Digenis Akritas) is of very high quality.
From there you can move on to modern Greek folk poetry - Goethe loved it!

[Anonymous No.19134751]

>>19134746
That’s cool. I will mark that down too. Never heard much about Byzantine poetry.

[Anonymous No.19134755]

Also what the hell did the pope do that was so bad that Anna couldn’t say? I still haven’t figured out.

> Meanwhile there occurred an event which it is worthwhile to record, for this too promoted his good fortune. Indeed, I calculate that the inability of all the western rulers to attack him contributed very much to the smooth course of Robert’s affairs. In everything Fortune worked for him, raised him to power and brought about whatever was to his advantage. For example, the Pope of Rome 41 (this is a noble office, protected by soldiers of many nationalities) had a quarrel with Henry, the King of Germany, and wanted to draw Robert into an alliance with himself (Robert had already become very famous and attained great power). The reasons for this quarrel between pope and king were as follows: the pope accused Henry of accepting money for church livings instead of appointing incumbents freely; he also blamed him for entrusting the office of archbishop on certain occasions to unworthy men, and he brought other charges of this nature. The German king, on the other hand, indicted the pope of presumption, saying that he had usurped the apostolic chair without his consent. What is more, he had used the most insulting and reckless language, threatening that if he did not resign his self-appointed office, he would be expelled from it with ignominy. When the pope heard these words, he immediately expended his wrath on the envoys sent by Henry. To begin with, he outraged them savagely, then cut their hair and beards, the one with scissors, the other with a razor, and finally he did something else to them which was quite improper, going beyond the insolent behaviour one expects and then sent them away. I would have given a name to the outrage, but as a woman and a princess modesty forbade me. What was done on his orders was not only unworthy of a high priest, but of any man at all who bears the name of Christian.

[Anonymous No.19134773]

>>19134755
Man I was reading the Alexiad for a university project and I had the same reaction. What the hell happened here?

[Anonymous No.19134782]

>>19134755
Probably something like 'Whore' or any other insult. The entire Crusade was a massive power play which broke Emperor Henry's balls, it changed the investure controversy from being nearly dominated by the Emperor to the Pope getting away with whatever he liked.

[Anonymous No.19134788]

>>19134773
What did you study?

[Anonymous No.19134831]

>>19134788
International Relations. I did an essay about the 1st Crusade

[Anonymous No.19134865]

>>19134831
Pretty cool, what was the thesis statement for your essay? My intrest in the Crusades mainly lie with the states but the First Crusade is always the epitome of the Norman adventure to me.

[Anonymous No.19135886]

>>19134705
YOU
JUST
KNOW

[Anonymous No.19135905]

>>19134705
Came here to post this. She wanted the BFC

[Anonymous No.19136011]

>>19134555
I have absolutely no idea what he means by that, LARP means Live Action Role Player, but a person reading a book isn't roleplaying anything. I don't get it.

[Anonymous No.19136020]

>>19134523
You should know basic history of the crusades and that the Alexiad is basically Byzie butthurt manifest. Literally written to make a claim for her husband.

[Anonymous No.19136754]

>>19136020
Huh? Is it?!?

[Anonymous No.19137249]

>>19134523
>The Emperor's daughter, Anna Comnena, leaves a portrait of him in her Alexiad. She met him for the first time when she was fourteen and was seemingly fascinated by him, leaving no similar portrait of any other Crusader prince. Of Bohemond, she wrote:

>"Now the man was such as, to put it briefly, had never before been seen in the land of the Romans, be he either of the barbarians or of the Greeks (for he was a marvel for the eyes to behold, and his reputation was terrifying). Let me describe the barbarian's appearance more particularly – he was so tall in stature that he overtopped the tallest by nearly one cubit, narrow in the waist and loins, with broad shoulders and a deep chest and powerful arms. And in the whole build of the body he was neither too slender nor overweighted with flesh, but perfectly proportioned and, one might say, built in conformity with the canon of Polycleitus... His skin all over his body was very white, and in his face the white was tempered with red. His hair was yellowish, but did not hang down to his waist like that of the other barbarians; for the man was not inordinately vain of his hair, but had it cut short to the ears. Whether his beard was reddish, or any other colour I cannot say, for the razor had passed over it very closely and left a surface smoother than chalk... His blue eyes indicated both a high spirit and dignity; and his nose and nostrils breathed in the air freely; his chest corresponded to his nostrils and by his nostrils...the breadth of his chest. For by his nostrils nature had given free passage for the high spirit which bubbled up from his heart. A certain charm hung about this man but was partly marred by a general air of the horrible... He was so made in mind and body that both courage and passion reared their crests within him and both inclined to war. His wit was manifold and crafty and able to find a way of escape in every emergency. In conversation he was well informed, and the answers he gave were quite irrefutable. This man who was of such a size and such a character was inferior to the Emperor alone in fortune and eloquence and in other gifts of nature."

[Anonymous No.19137282]

>>19137249
Really based

[Anonymous No.19138342]

>>19135905
bentucky fired chicken

[Anonymous No.19139062]

>>19134865
Did you do a degree in this?

[Anonymous No.19139081]

>>19134708
>Comnena
Jews have been everywhere. See Khomeini

[Anonymous No.19139086]

>>19139081
what are you on about schizo?

[Anonymous No.19139096]

>>19137249
Cute

[Anonymous No.19139440]

>>19134865
I was researching the way Alexios Komnenos managed the Crusader armies and leaders, incorporated western institutions like vassalage and oaths of fealty, and tried to create a hierarchical system with the crusader states. I also dealt with how his successors, Ioannes and Manuel, had to use both diplomacy and force of arms to keep Antioch and Jerusalem under their sphere of influence.

Seeing thing from the Byzantine point of view, I was very fascinated by Alexios' skill and cunning (and how Byzantium was able to halt the Normans, the greatest warriors of the Middle Ages).

I agree that the First Crusade was one of the greatest adventures of all time. Bohemond (and his father Robert), Godfrey of Bouillon and the others were true titans among men, legends in will, mind and power.

[Anonymous No.19139443]

>>19139081
take your meds

[Anonymous No.19139595]

>>19136011
>a person reading a book isn't roleplaying anything
Someone posting about buying a book isn't reading

[Anonymous No.19140248]

>>19139440
Nice, sounds like an interesting thesis

[Anonymous No.19140259]

>>19134705
You just know she wanted them to make it to Constantinople and depose her family, capture all the women etc.

[Anonymous No.19140638]

>>19139595
I am literally reading it right now.

[Anonymous No.19140740]

>>19139062
No, I just really love doing the stuff. Learnt Latin to read primary sources even.
>>19139440
Oh very interesting. Did you do any comparisons with the traditionally Byzantine concept of oaths and vassalage and the Western ones? I'd kill to read it, I love seeing others points and arguments.

[Anonymous No.19140947]

>>19140740
>Learnt Latin to read primary sources even.
Damn, nice. I’ve been trying to get into it, but I can’t think of any good book for it. How long did it take you to get comfortable in such a way you can read primary sources?