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/lit/ - Literature

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19082317 No.19082317 [Reply] [Original]

Determinism is true and we don't have any free-will

>> No.19082326

Read Bergson

>> No.19082332

>>19082317
read epictetus

>> No.19082338
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19082338

>>19082317
>Determinism is true and we don't have any free-will

>> No.19082339

does it even matter

>> No.19082353

>>19082317
Yes, and even worse, it probably all repeats this making the concept of hell very real.

>> No.19082457
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19082457

>>19082326
Read *insert some shit here*

>> No.19082463

>>19082332
see
>>19082457

>> No.19082465
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19082465

>>19082457
Welcome to /lit/ - Literature, enjoy your stay

>> No.19082480

>>19082317
Makes no difference

>> No.19082484

>>19082465
Its not about /lit/, it*s about /lit/ past 23:00 MESZ thats when it becomes worse, nobody in america has ever read a book, that is the problem.

>> No.19082501

>>19082317
If anything, determinism should be an optimistic outlook on life. Utopian societies are possible when determinism is true; all you would have to do is excise all the degenerate influences. When there is free will, however, there will always be criminals, miscreants and general injustice. Luckily, free will is an incoherent concept anyway.

>> No.19082508

>>19082484
Not true, every American has read Harry Potter

>> No.19082514

>>19082501
You have stirred shit in your head, instead of a brain.

>> No.19082521

>>19082508
Cinema is not reading you big dumdum!

>> No.19082535

>>19082514
Am I wrong? If so, do tell me - I did not choose to be ignorant after all.

>> No.19082544
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19082544

>>19082317
If and only if we take mechanistic hard materialism and reject entirely the possibility that we are supposed to turn the dialectic within and without, yes.

Turn the dialectic within, Wojak.

>> No.19082559

>>19082501
>Utopian societies are possible when determinism is true
Impossible. Dostoevsky literally talks about Man's irrationality and his favoring towards it over a rational world. Don't believe me? Look at all the the people denying IQ as a credible predictor of life outcome. It's an understandable cope because the thought of being bounded to a narrow path of life is absolutely horrific, but that's just the state of things.

>> No.19082605

>>19082544
Huh, can you sum up hegels position on determinism please?

>> No.19082643

>>19082605
All things are surdetermined, as if the Geist determines prior to their being a determination, and then that there will be a simultaneous determination by beings in the world merely in happenstance with the Geist. This is because the Geist presupposes itself as the synthetic apriori of all beings in the world.

/me unbuttons breeches

To continue this Geist is the Prussian State in the formation of Napoleon inverted-inverted, that is Napoleon correctly considered not considered falsely (Frenchly) in that the genius of the military aristocratic state creates a revolution in a restoration of Europe for Europe and the correct ordering of the world, rather than an incorrect ordering of Europe in revolution creates a military aristocratic state genius.

/me emits.

As it will be for all time for ever and ever as a result of history in the world.

>> No.19082966

>>19082643
Thank you very much, just what I have expected.

>> No.19082981

>>19082317
Naive of you yo believe you have an independently constructed will gor it to be either free or not free

>> No.19083032

>>19082559
Doestoevsky did talk about it, but whether it was true is a different man entirely. Irrationality is nothing more than a label for what man cannot yet comprehend.

>> No.19083135

>>19082317
>Determinism is true and we don't have any free-will

This is only true under a materialist framework of reality. If you take the idealist view that Mind is primary, and the physical world you see around you is generated by the mind, then there is no contradiction between free will and determinism.

>> No.19083166

>>19082317
Wait why is this a bad thing?

We still have free will insofar as we don't know what the future holds - it's not fate as much as chance (higher chance I'll coom tonight than find a girlfriend but both are theoretically possible)

>> No.19083177

I'm so angry God gave me this stupid fucking shitty life and made me type this post

>> No.19083375

No it isn't. But we indeed do not have free will.

>> No.19083382

Compatibilism is irrefutable.

>> No.19083568

>>19082317
Does it matter tho?

>> No.19083580

>freewill
what wills the will? if I were to dissect this free will, what would I find? it's a nonsense term whose purpose is not to free us, but to provide us license to condemn

>> No.19083769

Spacetime is imagined by Mind. It's one moment of all events superimposed upon each other stretched out extremely far. All events are already written. Without spacetime there could not be experience and without experience there is eternal nothingness which is impossible.

How could an object (the mind) alter the creation of what we term "awareness"? The objects themselves including thoughts are a projection of it.

>> No.19083869

>>19083177
lmao
>>19083769
Damn son

>> No.19083968
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19083968

>>19082317
Determinism is true, and we do have free will.

>> No.19084117

>>19082317
Anon, that's not a problem. Even if the choices that you make don't matter because they have been preordained; the fact that you made those choices do matter

>> No.19084143
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19084143

>>19082317
Parametric determinism is true and you are only free embracing the dialectic.

>Dialectical determinism as opposed to mechanical, or formal-logical determinism, is also parametric determinism; it permits the adherent of historical materialism to understand the real place of human action in the way the historical process unfolds and the way the outcome of social crises is decided. Men and women indeed make their own history. The outcome of their actions is not mechanically predetermined. Most, if not all, historical crises have several possible outcomes, not innumerable fortuitous or arbitrary ones; that is why we use the expression ‘parametric determinism’ indicating several possibilities within a given set of parameters.

>> No.19084150

>>19084117
this

>> No.19084166

>>19083968
This. These two concepts do not have to be mutually exclusive. Think of a life as a video game sim where the possibilities are limited by the programmers design, but you are free to pick your own journey within the game's parameters.

>> No.19084169
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19084169

Determinism is true! It's all in the hands of God almighty.

>> No.19084633

This thread was moved to >>>/his/11962606