/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.18384470]

After reading the Greeks (not finished yet) and some other works, my belief in some kind of divinity and afterlife was cemented, but this did nothing for me on a practical level. I'm still a depressed and neurotic blackpilled loser.
I have nothing to look towards aside from death. I cannot kill myself, because I believe I was put here for a reason, but I don't know where to go from there, as I can't bring myself not to suspend judgment regarding metaphysical matters (and so I can't adhere to any religion).
Have any of you dealt with a problem like this and how did you fix it?

[Anonymous No.18384479]

>>18384470
Desu change your diet and lifestyle. Depression is strongly linked to gut biome

[Anonymous No.18384482]

>>18384479
I eat healthy and exercise, and don't consume alcohol or drugs on a regular or even occasional basis. I've always been like this, it's just gotten worse during my twenties.

[Anonymous No.18384493]

>>18384470
Well that's a first step anon, it builds upon itself exponentially. I'd take the victory and keep going unless I'm misinterpreting something.

[Anonymous No.18384502]

You don't even know what a body can do.

[Anonymous No.18384504]

>>18384493
There was no victory. I already believed in those things before reading philosophy; I still believe in them afterwards, philosophy only served to make me doubt everything at first, then refine my thoughts when I realized my initial beliefs were right. Nothing really changed on any level in the end.
>>18384502
I haven't read Spinoza yet but at this point I'm starting to doubt that philosophy can have a tangibly beneficial impact on my life.

[Anonymous No.18384541]

>>18384504
If judging by your post is anything I'd say you have a bit to work on. It doesn't have to be philosophy but that's got a lot of potential especially if you're looking for something to hold onto. You may have found the start of that but don't be afraid to explore other avenues. A lot would probably tie in together.

[Anonymous No.18384570]

>>18384541
Well at this point philosophy is the only halfway productive thing I do anyway, so I'll keep doing it, if only because I find it interesting. Holding onto it hasn't brought me the impression of moving forward, it just feels like I'm endlessly refining concepts, but it remains intangible and elusive. Surely it's good in that it prepares me for death, but in the meantime, my life is shit.
The strangest thing is the discrepancy between my beliefs and the fact that I despise being alive most of the time. I don't think that's normal, people who realized this material existence is not the only thing to exist are usually hopeful and optimistic but my view of life is just that of a temporary hindrance, in which I understand neither my reason to be nor the reason for my misery.

[Anonymous No.18384571]

>>18384504
>I haven't read Spinoza yet but at this point I'm starting to doubt that philosophy can have a tangibly beneficial impact on my life.
No it's not going to be some magical self help that changes anything in itself but so much of what we take to be just-so is a matter of affects upon us, and you may better understand why your everything sucks pov is crowding out others.

[Anonymous No.18384578]

>>18384570
You might have negative symptoms psychosis. If not I took testosterone and it cemented my life either way there's some biological variable here

[Anonymous No.18384611]

>>18384571
>so much of what we take to be just-so is a matter of affects upon us
This is something I already understand. Acknowledging it does not change much in itself, especially when you have a propensity for irrationality. I'll still read Ethics when I have the time though.
>>18384578
I was diagnosed on the spectrum but I think it's bullshit, or not very accurate. There's something wrong with me for sure though.
>testosterone
I'd do that but doctors don't prescribe it easily here.

[Anonymous No.18384622]

>>18384611
You might have to go to a different country. Test was important for me coming out of prison because I had the emotional responses of a brick. Just make sure the doctor prescribes a good anti est blocker

[Anonymous No.18384640]

>>18384611
>Acknowledging it does not change much in itself, especially when you have a propensity for irrationality.
Rationality is cultured and the product of thousands of years of husbandry. It was never meant to be a source of happiness but of utility, of putting things to use for a future benefit. Embrace your irrationality and affirm it as a will.

[Anonymous No.18384658]

>>18384622
What did you go to prison for?

[Anonymous No.18384662]

>>18384658
Distro of ex served 3.5 years year of probation

[Anonymous No.18384680]

>>18384640
I have nothing against irrationality in itself, it's just that I would rather not have it make me stubbornly incapable of appreciating life.

[Anonymous No.18384746]

>>18384680
What is life to you that you do not appreciate it? If you are not affirming it, what is causing you to deny it? There is some combination of forces that is giving you a sickly attitude towards it; you need to figure out what those are in order to overrule them.

[Anonymous No.18384789]

>>18384746
I just don't know what I'm supposed to do. I know that I am here for some reason, but I can't figure out what it is. Watching others, it's like they're actors in their lives and I'm a spectator in my own. I started getting interested in philosophy thinking it would help me find a purpose, but I was wrong. I'm not inspired, interested or driven by anything and never was, it's like I'm here only to watch things unfold around me while I wait for death.
I don't know what specific combination of forces, as you say, gives me that outlook. Observing my own thoughts never brought me to any kind of epiphany.

[Anonymous No.18384794]

> my belief in some kind of divinity and afterlife was cemented
belief is toxic waste that jews use on goys
if you believe in the afterlife then you will be depressed
stop taking jewish lies as truth

[Anonymous No.18384800]

>>18384794
I went through a nihilist, physicalist phase and was even more miserable.

[Anonymous No.18384803]

Honestly you need to be anti-semitic. Jews spread death, disease, violence, hatred, and depression. They are a horrible pest.
You need to realize that the people who say the afterlife exists are sick and twisted pests.
Stop giving these pests authority.

[Anonymous No.18384838]

>>18384803
If anything aren't the Jews the ones currently pushing for secularism, atheism and hedonistic lifestyles?

[Anonymous No.18384998]

bump

[Anonymous No.18385746]

Bump

[Anonymous No.18387621]

bump

[Anonymous No.18387691]

>>18384470
OP, yes I've been there. I think reading Saint Maximus the Confessor would be very helpful for you. He helped me quite a bit when I was searching for faith above deism and the blackpill. He basically answers and completes all of Greek thought and shows Christ to be the fullness and completion of all philosophy. Take a read and see for yourself though, it's pretty incredible stuff.

some recs:

https://www.amazon.com/Disputations-Pyrrhus-Saint-Maximus-Confessor/dp/0990502945/ref=sr_1_17?dchild=1&keywords=maximus+the+confessor&qid=1622846523&sr=8-17

https://www.amazon.com/Cosmic-Liturgy-Universe-According-Confessor/dp/0898707587/ref=sr_1_9?dchild=1&keywords=maximus+the+confessor&qid=1622846523&sr=8-9&asin=B00BW7IWCS&revisionId=f30419b8&format=1&depth=1

https://www.amazon.com/Cosmic-Mystery-Jesus-Christ/dp/088141249X/ref=pd_sbs_1/141-6654314-9488427?pd_rd_w=5ML1V&pf_rd_p=43345e03-9e2a-47c0-9b70-a50aa5ecbd5c&pf_rd_r=TG3SX7ACBNBHZQG76KJ2&pd_rd_r=0fe565f1-c6d1-439b-845a-1f6c8926cf90&pd_rd_wg=VC6f2&pd_rd_i=088141249X&psc=1

Here is a good Orthodox channel which helps to delve into Christ as the completion and fullness of all Greco-Roman philosophy:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4kg2auHKKU&t=3714s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bNj7a2a6hw&list=PLYmIBQRIOqKmuEp8cNmEd8cg42LTSUVOO

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPwBJSCPWPU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ7EkvhzQYs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmRgAFrWkOs

[Anonymous No.18388244]

>>18384470
You actually read the greeks?

[Anonymous No.18388361]

>>18384470
Bro, I will be just fucking honest with you, I had felt the way you feel, I can emphatize with you easily, but now I hold a prespective.
I started studying about a lot of philosophy books about metaphysics, ethics, and existencialism. I was trying to find the meaning of life.
Btw I still studying philosophy in college.
And the conclusion, if you want to feel happy dont read philosophy.
I got my conslusions in my deep studies, and I got a prespective from there, but legit it isnt making me happy (btw I dont give a shit about my feelings) but Im depressed and feel empty. So dont search any 100pcent truth teory or some shit cause u will just get frustrated. Its better to believe in some random bullshit to be happier or to dont thinhk about those things too much and just live like almodt everyone does. Philosophy help me to cope but Im still unhappy. Good luck, any question just ask, i will watch the tread

[Anonymous No.18388568]

Don't just READ the Greeks, LIVE the Greeks.

>eat a Mediterranean diet
>lift weights naked in the sun
>participate in high culture
>compete in feats of physical endurance (your chosen sport)

>>18384482
sounds like you're in a negative feed back loop.
I also don't truly believe you fully committed to healthy eating and exercise.

Have you truly exhausted the information available to find what not only works, but what works for you and makes you feel the best? or have you just eaten up the standard advice from government "health" organizations?

In regards to gut biome, eatr lots of fermented things.
Kim Chi, Kefir, Sauerkraut etc.

Besides, happyness isnt the point and should never be your purposes in life. It is fleeting, and always will be. It's meant to be. You need to find meaning, purpose.

[Anonymous No.18388673]

>>18388568
Nihilist here, have to say that thats how I feel the human condition, but that image and the lifestyle recomendation made me smile.

[Anonymous No.18390198]

>>18388244
>he didn't

[Anonymous No.18390242]

>>18384504
Read David Goggins and MAN UP bitch... seriously

t. reader of ancient greeks in their native tongue

[Anonymous No.18390567]

>>18387691
I'm not convinced by Christianity (I read some of the OT, Matthew and Luke, and come from an Orthodox family) but I'll take a look at this with an open mind, thank you.
>>18388361
What are your conclusions? Have your studies not given you a bit of stability at least, are you more confused than before even now?
>>18388568
I did make drastic lifestyle changes about a year ago for about three months. Right now I turned it down a notch (still exercise and eat well, but I'm not obsessive about it) and my mood is about the same. Was three months not enough?
I know happiness is fleeting, but I'm merely seeking to be satisfied, to know where I'm going, why I'm here, what I need to strive towards. But there's nothing that makes me feel any kind of pull, I'm just obsessed with trying to figure out some kind of truth about existence but every step forward only makes me more confused.

[Anonymous No.18390813]

>>18384470
>but this did nothing for me on a practical level.

Good.

[Anonymous No.18390948]

>>18390813
Why?

[Anonymous No.18390989]

>>18390948

The world is Evil.

[Anonymous No.18391087]

>>18384470
Only you can fix that, deep down you know.

[Anonymous No.18391139]

>>18391087
I wish I knew how though.

[Anonymous No.18391156]

>>18390567
>I know happiness is fleeting, but I'm merely seeking to be satisfied, to know where I'm going, why I'm here, what I need to strive towards. But there's nothing that makes me feel any kind of pull, I'm just obsessed with trying to figure out some kind of truth about existence but every step forward only makes me more confused.

Kinda reminded me of this great writing:

"When I was seeking an employment adequate to the powers of human life and righteous in itself, whether prompted by nature or suggested by the researches of the wise, whereby I might attain to some result worthy of that Divine gift of understanding which has been given us, many things occurred to me which in general esteem were thought to render life both useful and desirable. And especially that which now, as always in the past, is regarded as most to be desired, leisure combined with wealth, came before my mind. The one without the other seemed rather a source of evil than an opportunity for good, for leisure in poverty is felt to be almost an exile from life itself, while wealth possessed amid anxiety is in itself an affliction, rendered the worse by the deeper humiliation which he must suffer who loses, after possessing, the things that most are wished and sought. And yet, though these two embrace the highest and best of the luxuries of life, they seem not far removed from the normal pleasures of the beasts which, as they roam through shady places rich in herbage, enjoy at once their safety from toil and the abundance of their food. For if this be regarded as the best and most perfect conduct of the life of man, it results that one object is common, though the range of feelings differ, to us and the whole unreasoning animal world, since all of them, in that bounteous provision and absolute leisure which nature bestows, have full scope for enjoyment without anxiety for possession..."

[Anonymous No.18391157]

>>18391156
>>18391156

"I believe that the mass of mankind have spurned from themselves and censured in others this acquiescence in a thoughtless, animal life, for no other reason than that nature herself has taught them that it is unworthy of humanity to hold themselves born only to gratify their greed and their sloth, and ushered into life for no high aim of glorious deed or fair accomplishment, and that this very life was granted without the power of progress towards immortality; a life, indeed, which then we should confidently assert did not deserve to be regarded as a gift of God, since, racked by pain and laden with trouble, it wastes itself upon itself from the blank mind of infancy to the wanderings of age. I believe that men, prompted by nature herself, have raised themselves through teaching and practice to the virtues which we name patience and temperance and forbearance, under the conviction that right living means right action and right thought, and that Immortal God has not given life only to end in death; for none can believe that the Giver of good has bestowed the pleasant sense of life in order that it may be overcast by the gloomy fear of dying."

[Anonymous No.18391160]

>>18391157
"And yet, though I could not tax with folly and uselessness this counsel of theirs to keep the soul free from blame, and evade by foresight or elude by skill or endure with patience the troubles of life, still I could not regard these men as guides competent to lead me to the good and happy Life. Their precepts were platitudes, on the mere level of human impulse; animal instinct could not fail to comprehend them, and he who understood but disobeyed would have fallen into an insanity baser than animal unreason. Moreover, my soul was eager not merely to do the things, neglect of which brings shame and suffering, but to know the God and Father Who had given this great gift, to Whom, it felt, it owed its whole self, Whose service was its true honour, on Whom all its hopes were fixed, in Whose lovingkindness, as in a safe home and haven, it could rest amid all the troubles of this anxious life. It was inflamed with a passionate desire to apprehend Him or to know Him."

[Anonymous No.18391168]

>>18391160
"Some of these teachers brought forward large households of dubious deities, and under the persuasion that there is a sexual activity in divine beings narrated births and lineages from god to god. Others asserted that there were gods greater and less, of distinction proportionate to their power. Some denied the existence of any gods whatever, and confined their reverence to a nature which, in their opinion, owes its being to chance-led vibrations and collisions. On the other hand, many followed the common belief in asserting the existence of a God, but proclaimed Him heedless and indifferent to the affairs of men. Again, some worshipped in the elements of earth and air the actual bodily and visible forms of created things; and, finally, some made their gods dwell within images of men or of beasts, tame or wild, of birds or of snakes, and confined the Lord of the universe and Father of infinity within these narrow prisons of metal or stone or wood. These, I was sure, could be no exponents of truth, for though they were at one in the absurdity, the foulness, the impiety of their observances, they were at variance concerning the essential articles of their senseless belief. My soul was distracted amid all these claims, yet still it pressed along that profitable road which leads inevitably to the true knowledge of God. It could not hold that neglect of a world created by Himself was worthily to be attributed to God, or that deities endowed with sex, and lines of begetters and begotten, were compatible with the pure and mighty nature of the Godhead. Nay, rather, it was sure that that which is Divine and eternal must be one without distinction of sex, for that which is self-existent cannot have left outside itself anything superior to itself. Hence omnipotence and eternity are the possession of One only, for omnipotence is incapable of degrees of strength or weakness, and eternity of priority or succession. In God we must worship absolute eternity and absolute power..."

Saint Hilary of Pitiers, On the Trinity, Book I

[Anonymous No.18391240]

>>18390567

>what are the conlusions?
So, my conclusions (prespective) are that "meaning" and "truth" are just a concepts made by humans.
Meaning is a word to represent other concepts like: goal of an action, direction, the pattern of a system.
The things just happen in reality, and might have some "meaning" or not.
Probabily not, cause if they have that means that some kind of inteligence created everyting with some meaning/goal. And seems the concept meaning is a subproduct of humans to see pattern in things and of them having intentention in their action.
If they have some meaning you cant really now for sure what it is even if you now how the evolution process in nature work (darwinism, its a cientific teory based on solid evidence). Because you would have to acess the creating consciousness. I studyied also Biology and I dont believe in that creating consciousness. And by whatever ypu would do you would probabily following your determined meaning.
If there is no meaning in the universe, you can have your personal ones, but arent some true "meanings" based on universal truths. And events happen with no deep meaning, they can be preditermined but still have no meaninh, including your actions, so whatever you do isnt inherently right or wrong.
So you can decide to live however you do but that will just determine maybe your feelings, so you can control reality, it as some deep meaning?
With 99.[9]%, no.
So dont worry about meaning, maybe have some goals (meaning to yourself/meaningless to the universe).

> final conclusion: if theres meaning, whatever you do is already inherently meaningfull cause you are just a part of a puzzle, if theres no meaning, its nonsense/ frustrating to search a "inherent meaning", still you can pick some personal arbitrary/subjective meaning.
I dont care about meaning anymore.

> Are you more confused?
No, cause I have my stable prespective.
Im still depressed , have fix goals, before I was always changing goals.

Hope I helped to clear something, stay well anon, he are humans and somethimes we have similar problems.
:)

[Anonymous No.18391484]

>>18391156
I think I understood what he means, but the high aim he refers to is something you should be guided towards, isn't it? Everyone's calling is different because everyone's circumstances are different, and it seems like he found his own path, perhaps through guidance, and it's precisely that guidance that I need; or at the very least, some kind of confirmation that I'm not headed towards a dead-end in my current trajectory of rejecting the world and researching spiritual matters.
>>18391240
I fundamentally disagree with relativism but I get where you're coming from. I don't think you can just create meaning especially if you operate under the assumption that there are no absolutes, there has to be some sort of an objective referential, otherwise it's pure chaos and delusion.
>>whatever you do is already inherently meaningful
I would assume that it's possible to fail at the task you've been given in life, whatever it may be, and that with meaning comes a sense of fulfillment. To feel unfulfilled seems like an indicator that you're failing to identify the meaning of your existence.
>I dont care about meaning anymore
>I have my stable perspective
I don't know how you managed to find stability without meaning, I think this eludes me completely, but godspeed anon.

[Anonymous No.18391708]

>>18384789
Stop being a spectator and become the director. I think most death bed regrets will come from letting life happen to you instead of you trying everything you can to get the outcome you want

[Anonymous No.18391822]

>>18384470
>tfw sophia aeonically sitting on your face

[Anonymous No.18391827]

>>18384470
>Have any of you dealt with a problem like this and how did you fix it?
I also disagreed with atheism but couldn’t identify what I agreed with more than that. Reading Guenon and seeing all the unity behind the esoteric metaphysics and symbolism of the worlds religious traditions helped

[Anonymous No.18392073]

>>18391822
There's no sex in the pleroma

[Anonymous No.18392175]

>>18384800
>Not embracing classical virtues and the value of good works

Ogey

[Anonymous No.18392368]

>>18384470
You need life, not philosophy. You need to live. IF you don't have the basics of life down you are gonna be depressed.

[Anonymous No.18392371]

>>18392368
What are the basics of life?

[Anonymous No.18392388]

>>18392371
job
family
friends
romantic partner
something to do outside of job

[Anonymous No.18392451]

>>18391708
Yeah I'd like to take the reins and do something but I have no vision. I told myself maybe I'd try to dedicate my life to philosophical and/or spiritual pursuits but I'm wondering if it's the right thing to do.
>>18391827
I enjoy reading Guenon but I don't really get his take on initiation.
>>18392388
Well, I have a family. I'm not too interested with the rest though and the idea that it's somehow mandatory doesn't sit well with me.

[Anonymous No.18392477]

>>18392451
Its not mandatory. Its more like human have basics needs that needs to be met. People are different but most are the same, and most people need the same. If you dont got friends, a job, nothing to do or no wholes to screw then its not really any wonder you are depressed. You have drives and instincts and if they don't get an outlet bad things happen mmkey. Anyways cheers

[Anonymous No.18392556]

>>18392477
>You have drives and instincts and if they don't get an outlet
Well I don't know why but my conscious mind rejects those instincts so I guess I'm looking for some kind of substitute if such a thing even exists. It also doesn't sound like a great long term plan to have your sense of purpose rely, even partially, on something as fickle as a job or another person.

[Anonymous No.18392654]

>>18392556
You got lot to learn young one.

[Anonymous No.18392673]

>>18392451
You can consider it something like the Pascal's wager - perhaps you don't need those things, but they will definitely help you in your life.

[Anonymous No.18392771]

>>18384470
Unironically try getting real friends, genuinely helps a lot with this kinda thing

[Anonymous No.18393012]

>>18392654
Meaning what?
>>18392771
How do you get friends? I'm in college but it's all online classes and I don't know anyone. I've lived like a hermit for the better part of the last decade.