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Anonymous Wed May 19 23:20:49 2021 No.18278014 [Reply] [Original]

Not a single marxist has even read a single austrian book while austrians have usually read most marxist literature.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:23:51 2021 No.18278023 >>18278014 Austrians don't read anything more than the form guide and a bit of bush poetry, mate.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:24:50 2021 No.18278028 File: 31 KB, 500x304, basic-economics-advanced-economics-29949763.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] cope thread

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:26:38 2021 No.18278044 >>18278028 >advanced economics >It's all made up nonsense

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:26:38 2021 No.18278042 >>18278028 based unemployable liberal arts major retard

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:26:56 2021 No.18278045 >>18278014 >Austrian economics >Give rich old white guys all the money, that'll solve everything! So deep.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:28:01 2021 No.18278048 File: 24 KB, 471x388, 1578859531473.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>18278045 yes, because taxing everything ends up in argentina.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:28:49 2021 No.18278053 >>18278014 Can you recommend me some books about autrian economics for a beginner? I searched the books of mises but i'm lost of what book would be an easy introduction to the philosophy

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:29:31 2021 No.18278060 >>18278053 tomas sowell.

Anonymous Wed May 19 23:30:28 2021 No.18278064
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>>18278028
Austrian economics may have some problems and oversimplifications, but Commie "economics" is absolute bullshit if you think about it for more than a second. Marx establishes the entire category of value to explain exchange ratios, then proceeds to later explain exchange rations perfectly well with Prices of Production in Capital volume 3! Why couldn't he have gone with cost price + average rate of profit in the first place? Not to mention the transformation problem. Marx's equation for transformation simply does not work if run more than once. If inputs are in prices of production rather than value, then total price diverges from total value even in the case of simple reproduction. The whole thing is based on retarded humanist assumptions too, the kind of thing you want to keep out of you economics entirely. Why can only human labor create value? It can't be the wage relation, as slaves can also create value, so the only explanation is some bullshit about man's relation to nature that somehow gives his labor magic value generating properties even when his relation to production is IDENTICAL to that of an animal (see the case of slavery, unless you want to claim that slavery only appropriated profit from other sectors, in which case, LOL).

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:44:51 2021 No.18278155 >>18278060 I appreciate it, but anyone other than Sowell?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:49:03 2021 No.18278188 >>18278053 Man, economy, and state

Anonymous Wed May 19 23:56:18 2021 No.18278222

>>18278064
I’m not a Marxist, but I think the response would be that the value apparently produced by an animal, like that apparently produced by a machine, is really the value of the human labor it took to produce that animal. In other words, if you could only employ animals without any humans at all, and you had to buy those animals at their value, you couldn’t make any profits.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:56:38 2021 No.18278224 >>18278014 One possible explanation is that literally no one cares about Austrian economics, especially when contrasted with Marxism.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:58:20 2021 No.18278228 >>18278222 >produce that animal I beg your pardon

>>	Anonymous Wed May 19 23:59:48 2021 No.18278233 >>18278045 >give you're confusing Austrian economics with taxation

Anonymous Thu May 20 00:00:01 2021 No.18278236

>>18278222
But then why doesn't the same apply to the slave? Why is the value produced by the slave not equal to his cost of production, the labor required to "produce" him, or essentially to capture him and feed him and drive him, why is there an extra surplus over this cost that takes the form of profit even when the wage relation is not present? Only a privileged metaphysical position for humans explains this assumption,

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:02:44 2021 No.18278250 >>18278224 Marxism is the retarded existential threat that haunts all civilized societies which is literally the only reason we pretend to care about it. Austrian economics on the other hand is based, especially Hayek, who is extremely influential.

Anonymous Thu May 20 00:03:44 2021 No.18278255

>>18278236
I mean I agree that value seems like a metaphysical category for Marx. But if there was an animal or a machine you could buy that would make you more than what you paid for it, it would produce surplus value too. Is there an animal or machine you can buy that will make you more money than you paid for it? Why doesn’t everyone own one?

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:06:06 2021 No.18278268 >>18278064 Just read Eugene von Bohm-Bawerk 'Marx and the close of his system', he dismantles Marxist economics, value of labor and Kapital piece by piece.

Anonymous Thu May 20 00:06:23 2021 No.18278272

>>18278255
Nobody purchases a machine for their factory unless it makes profit rates go up. Is it so hard to believe I could install a machine which would otherwise keep costs down but increase output? That would be an increase in constant capital leading to an increase in profit rate. Marx might say this is only short term super-profits which go away once the technology is equalized across the market or whatever, but I don't see any reason to believe that necessarily without the metaphysical notion of value he is using.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:07:48 2021 No.18278281 >>18278053 'Free our makets' by Howard Baetjer jr, 'Economics for Real People' by Gene Callahan

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:09:02 2021 No.18278289 >>18278224 The people who would implement economic policy do not benefit for using Austrian economics. They have no opportunity to extract (steal) wealth from people. Austrian economics is not for politicians and cronyism so they avoid it.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:09:49 2021 No.18278295 >>18278281 THANK YOU

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:19:18 2021 No.18278352 >>18278014 Keynes is all I need to stay based

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:22:35 2021 No.18278370 >>18278028 Show me one Marxist in the face of the Earth who can pass a mid-level econometrics exam

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:24:46 2021 No.18278381 >>18278014 read a book about keyesian economics and i swear you will never talk about this horse shit ever again

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:33:52 2021 No.18278435 >>18278370 hello t. economics phd

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:45:27 2021 No.18278487 >>18278014 You give us too much credit. Im an austrian and I have only read a few things by marx. and 1 thing by lenin.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:47:30 2021 No.18278492 Since we are having this thread can someone spoonfeed me basic Keynes and Austrian? I know some very basics but not much.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 00:49:01 2021 No.18278500 >>18278060 Sowell is not an Austrian economist. He's a Chicago guy.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 01:01:37 2021 No.18278529 >>18278500 This. rothbard is where its at. read him not sowell.

Anonymous Thu May 20 01:03:28 2021 No.18278536

>>18278250
Only retarded beliefs become really influential, because they give themselves over easily to simplifications. Christianity, Islam and Marxism can be simplified in a way the plebeians will understand, while it's rather hard to simplify Kant or even Mises.
Even the syntax of the categorical imperative is hard for imbeciles to understand.

>Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law.[1]
vs.
>Love yourself as they neighbor
>The point is to change the world! Proletarians of the world, unite!

Orangutans can understand the last two, but not the first one.
(I don't mean that those simplifications are faithful to the original doctrine, just that they are easy to make; a good philosopher should be able to make his doctrines hard to simplify; it's hard to reduce Frege to a slogan.
This applies even in epistemology: logical positivism is very popular because it can be reduced to a slogan.)

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 01:04:59 2021 No.18278546 >>18278435 How are you an economics PhD and a Marxist? Do you live in the third world? Or do you just mean Marxist in a religious/philosophical sense?

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 01:05:22 2021 No.18278547 >>18278370 me t.CFA

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 01:06:21 2021 No.18278550 >>18278487 Marxists have usually read even less, though. Most Marxists I know have only read the Manifesto.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 01:10:21 2021 No.18278571 >>18278546 Bro labour theory of value is real you dont need a phd to know that. Marx explenation of it is retarded but its still real.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 01:14:14 2021 No.18278584 >>18278289 >Austrian economics is useless and only appeals to losers as a form of cope

Anonymous Thu May 20 01:14:45 2021 No.18278588

>>18278546
>How are you an economics PhD and a Marxist?
No economic theory is infallible and I think that the LVT is sound enough to be considered
>Do you live in the third world?
I'm from the Anglosphere
>Or do you just mean Marxist in a religious/philosophical sense?
Both economically and philosophically

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 02:03:49 2021 No.18278762 >>18278064 Finally someone actually bothered reading Capital

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 02:15:54 2021 No.18278803 >>18278014 >>18278028 Both are contrarian meme trash. Read orthodox neoclassical economics for a basis, keynesian/neokeynesian for an alternate perspective.

>>	Anonymous Thu May 20 05:45:57 2021 No.18279467 >>18278571 I'll bite. Why is it real?

Anonymous Thu May 20 09:46:01 2021 No.18280569

>>18278014
You should notice than that both Marxists and Austrians constantly claim radical reform is inevitable (not just desirable) because current social policies aren't "sustainable" and yet the inevitable doom and gloom is always just a little bit off

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