The Emperor has no clothes

[Anonymous No.18276108]

There is 0 wisdom in this book, it's just the nonsensical ramblings of a senile old fool that live in the bronze age.
The only reason i can see that you woul hold this piece of garbage in high regard is if you read a secondary source that provided you with knoweledge that is supposedly in this book, but in actuality is nowhere to be found within the book, this secondary source without doubt kept emphasising after every third sentence how important and influential this books is.
You were gaslighted into believing that this book holds value, if all philosophy is like this, than you can keep it. No wonder art colleges keep pumping out liberal docile intellectual zombies, if you can convince yourself that this book of ramblings is important than you can probably be guided into beleiving anything

[Anonymous No.18276119]

It's a work of fiction, comfy and a nice journey into 'truth.' You don't need to take what they say literally, but there's linguistic construction in there. Obviously, Timaeus and Laws is Plato's finest.

[Anonymous No.18276136]

>>18276108
Don't care, Plato is fucking based. Even if there was nothing of value in any of his works - and that is a big if - I would still find a way to discover that value.

[Anonymous No.18276145]

>>18276119
Phaedo is finest, I also won’t be (you)ing OP becuase Plato was not Bronze Age at all and also becuase it’s classic Reddit ad hominem and he should go back

[Anonymous No.18276347]

>>18276145
I barely remember Phaedo, it's being and un-being, eternal reccurence. Right? Remember very little about it. Should re-read

[Anonymous No.18276352]

>>18276108
It was the golden age, retard.

[Anonymous No.18276409]

>>18276108
People treat the republic as if it were a genuine attempt at statecraft but that's not really what it is. Statecraft is used as a vehicle to explore the concept of justice and at the root of this problem lies the question of education. His attack on poetry in book 10 (and more subtly throughout the rest of the text) isn't just some afterthought, it's central to the problem he's addressing. Plato lived during the twilight of mass literacy but the greek preliterate mindset was very much alive and homeric poetry (and its progeny) was at the center of the athenian educational apparatus (mass literacy wouldn't be achieved until the middle of the 3rd century, 100 years after plato had already died). Homeric poetry was poetry of action and memory. Because of the way these things were performed and written, there was no separation between the listener and the poem itself. There was no 'distancing' which allowed for critical thought or introspection. This diffusion of the listener into the poem is what plato means by 'imitation'. His forms are a manifestation of a new imaginative and syntactical reality. The myth of er that ends off the work demonstrates an effort of plato's in wielding this new reality and using it to redirect poetry not towards imitation or action or war, but towards truth itself.

>>18276119
>>18276136
>>18276352
>>18276145
you have done nothing to demonstrate the value in the work

[Anonymous No.18276414]

>>18276108
>Plato
>Bronze Age
What a retard

[Anonymous No.18276471]

>bronze age

Nice credibility.

[Anonymous No.18276486]

>>18276108
>knoweledge

[Anonymous No.18276487]

>>18276108
>>18276409
Allow me to try demonstrating why I find Plato's works valuable.

The dialogues are very clearly intended to be a teaching tool. They instruct and edify. Individually, they make specific points about various fundamental issues of importance in living the right kind of examined life.

Beyond their immediate subjects, the dialogues provide a meta education, even an auto-education. Socrates teaches us how to teach ourselves by using a skeptical, critical, questioning approach that weighs all sides of an argument. Reading Plato teaches you to read, as you learn to pay attention to the individual threads of the argument and the
overall direction and outcome. Socrates teaches you how to talk (logically, clearly) and, more importantly, how to listen (with patience and an open mind).

Taken as a whole, Plato’s dialogues teach you how to think. That is perhaps their greatest significance and why they have always stood at the center of the Western intellectual tradition.

Furthermore, you should not take the endings of these dialogues literally. Sometimes a dialog will end with an ironic conclusion or even non-conclusion. When this happens, Plato is trying to tell us something important. The breakdown occurs most typically because his interlocutors do not understand how to engage in true philosophical discourse. Socrates often fights fire with fire by appearing to argue as his interlocutors do. But this is a ruse. Dialectical break-down tells us we are still in the state of ignorance, and it is from this point that Socrates begins to draw us, via a renewed dialectic, up towards the deeper understanding that is the point of the dialogue.

[Anonymous No.18276510]

>>18276108
You should've read Leo Strauss first.

[Anonymous No.18276524]

>>18276108
You gotta be trolling OP. None of us are old enough to be aged enough for the wisdom so succinctly stated in easily digestible conversational tone. What you want some math problems? Knock yourself out on empty value cognitive loads. You literally cannot name a more influential wise man.

[Anonymous No.18276534]

I mostly agree. Chadistotle was better

[Anonymous No.18276875]

What you're saying is more or less true, but you're saying it on a website full of people who have been taught that "the greekz have ancient wizdom mane!!!" since they were children, and who've had that belief reinfocred by other people (this includes the retarded philosophers, dead or alive, who praise these ancient idiots for the same reasons) who have bought into the same bullshit. It's very important for people who have wasted their time - even paid large amounts of money and gone into debt in some cases - on this absolute bullshit. Plato and other ancient philosophers are interesting as historical figures, and because they give us some insight into how people back then thought. Many people on /lit/ who don't know how to engage with philosophy or historical texts end up believing stuff like "Plato was right", "Plato was btfo/proven right by X philosopher or event", "Forms literally exist", "Greek men with cool looking marble busts were the smartest people in history" and such retarded nonsense.

[Anonymous No.18277045]

>>18276108
OP, this depends on how you define wisdom, if you could, would you expand on this for me please so I can better understand why you think this way about Republic.

>>18276875
I lean to agree with your point about the fanatical praise over certain philosophers being kind of bullshit, however, I don't think it wrong to reflect and turn to thinkers like these for insight into the nature of things - I feel its a little bit misplaced to say they are purely historical figures. Many ethical systems developed by Plato and Aristotle are still relevant today and we can find out a lot by looking back on their works for guidance. Anyways, I would like to hear you talk more about wisdom as well and where you think we can find it, you didn't really go into it in your reply, just touched on it.

[Anonymous No.18277063]

>>18276875
This. The Greeks are historical/literary curiosities.

[Anonymous No.18277391]

It's satire

Plato was the Coen Brothers of his time

[Anonymous No.18277394]

>>18276875
Idiot.

[Anonymous No.18277395]

>>18276875
By all means: enlighten us with your evidently boundless knowledge and wisdom.

[Anonymous No.18277406]

>>18276108
honestly philosophy starts with Nietzsche, no i’m not a tranny but the Greeks are only useful if you want to understand the source (or at least earliest recorded source) of many of our beliefs, you probably already know all these beliefs anyways so it’s not too insightful to read them

[Anonymous No.18277462]

>>18276108
Maybe Kant is more in your speed since you lack the imagination

[Anonymous No.18277741]

>>18276108
If this is the only Plato you’ve read then I can understand where you’re coming from. If you haven’t read anything else from Plato then I recommend you read the Last Days of Socrates and the Symposium before making your final judgment on Plato. I honestly think Republic is a bad place to start, I think it’s the one most often cited because it’s long and ties together many of Platos ideas. Other dialogues investigate each specific idea more satisfactorily imo.

[Anonymous No.18277760]

>>18277406
No it doesn't, what was said in the OP can be applied to Nietzsche too.

[Anonymous No.18277762]

>>18277760
hardly

[Anonymous No.18277764]

>>18276108
i thought it was good