Curious implication of the Death of Music

[Anonymous No.18193162]

Music began to die (in the Fisherite sense of lack of original, creative output that typified the previous decades, NOT the "le wrong generation" sense that pertains to "quality" itself) around the year 2000, but there still was a lot of scenes to develop, for young people to cling to. Rap was still somewhat new, and developing.

However, by the year 2010, creative output of the music industry had diminished severely, and the process of death of music was almost complete.

The 2010s were the first decade in almost 100 years of recent human culture that had nothing exceptional about it, no zeitgeist, no teenage spirit at all. The only other similar period that I can think of, within the aforementioned last 100 years (history before WW1, and especially before the industrial revolution, flowed in a much more different, and unrelatable to Now, way), with the exception of jazz, blues and the avant-garde, was the one after WW2 and before the explosion of rock.

Popular culture of that time, popular music in particular, had that specific aura of static stagnation. A few years had to pass, perhaps even a dozen or more years, before the youth would actually detect this music as stagnant, and feel as if this music (a commercialized, less live-played-at-a-speakeasy and more pre-recorded-mass-produced-for-jukeboxes take on 1930s pop music) was not relatable to their frenetic teenage experience. Additionally, a strong counter-culture was overdue after being suppressed for almost 2 decades, because of the monoculture-inducing nature of common struggle that was the domain of the Great Depression and WW2. This is what gave birth to rock'n'roll. Stagnation led to a creative explosion, fueled by the ever-present urge of the youth to listen to something maybe a little different than what their so clearly uncool mom and pop listen to.
1/3

[Anonymous No.18193164]

2/3
One disclaimer: what I said here does not describe the entire youth experience of the 1940s and 1950s, just the *popular* youth experience. What I did not mention is that stagnation in popular music around that time led to a revolution within a different genre - jazz. It led to bebop. It led to one of the first modern subcultures - the hipsters of the 40s. And then to the Beat subculture of the 50s. All centered around jazz music, sexual liberation, decadence and heavy drug use - quite cool for the 40s and 50s, eh? The reason we don't really associate the 40s and 50s with that kind of "cool" social behavior (whatever that means) is because, for its time, it was very alternative and underground, limited to the utmost hedonistic youth and artistic cliques. All of it was really reminiscent of the original rave culture of the late 80s and early 90s. Very underground, very alternative, very hedonistic, very influential, but ultimately remaining in that sphere. Anyway - that was for the cool kids. The average kids wanted to have fun too. And *thats* how rock'n'roll was born.

I feel like after the 2010s, we're left in the same position as the average populace of the 40s and 50s. With one caveat.
There isn't much we can invent anymore.

This is the primary reason why music might seem "dead." Looking back, almost every genre of modern music arose thanks to technological improvements in music production. But after the 1990s, music production technology seems to have hit a peak, especially with the rise of DAWs and other such sophisticated computer-generated or -manipulated sound technology. We have essentially become able to produce any sound one could imagine, there's no longer a limit. What has that resulted in? Basically - no new genres. The only genres popping up now are either rehashes or blends of older styles.

[Anonymous No.18193167]

3/3
This has a curious implication for youth culture.
If music is dead, and we have stopped innovating (not long ago enough for us to witness any drastic social consequences of that), then what will young people of the future listen to? Young people are arguably the driving force behind music innovation, but if music innovation is technically impossible, and young people desperately want to dissociate from their older folks by listening to different music, then what will happen? No matter where they go, they will have to either listen to the music of their parents, or of their grandparents. That is fundamentally uncool, at least compared to the possibilities young people had between the 1920s and 2000s, arguably with a break between the mid 40s and mid 50s.

What do you guys think? Is there any hope for the youth of the future (perhaps as soon as the mid 2020s)? Hope that they will have to create themselves, of course. Or will they be forced to be forever stuck with the "oldies" or "music in the style of the oldies" that their old folks, the unfortunate "boomers" (current millennials, and later on even current zoomers), listened to?

Discuss.

[Anonymous No.18193193]

You should've posted this on /mu/

[Anonymous No.18193194]

>before I read your blogpost:
Explain hyperpop, explain the uptick in more experimental high skill guitarplay
Just because they arent mainstream and studios dont sign them (or just small ones) doesnt mean they dont exist.

[Anonymous No.18193195]

>>18193162
What book is this

[Anonymous No.18193205]

Gen Z are the Artist Generation in the Fourth Turning theorem, so I imagine they’ll figure it out. But first it’s up to the Millennials as the Hero Generation to end all the Crises we find ourselves in.

[Anonymous No.18193220]

>>18193162
Not going to read this, can smell another "<artform> is dead and there's been nothing worthwhile since WW2" formalist rant from someone who's wilfully ignored anything that doesn't have either the epic western culture canon or 4chan tick of approval and is intent on making a political statement out of it

[Anonymous No.18193221]

>>18193205
Hi, we don't discuss pseudoscience on this board you need to go to >>>/x/

[Anonymous No.18193236]

>>18193205
>the Hero Generation to end all the Crises we find ourselves in
thought your post was interesting till I saw this.
So obviously the gen z being artists is a meme too.

[Anonymous No.18193244]

>>18193236
Be careful it's bullshit in the order of astrology, darwinism, iq, flat earth. Steve Bannon believes in it.

[Anonymous No.18193254]

>>18193221
>>18193236
Sociology isn’t a hard science obviously, but that doesn’t mean it’s straight up wrong. The Straus-Howe model is just a more detailed version of “good times weak men bad times bad times strong men.” You’d have to be blind to not see Gen Z’s massive creative output; they’re artists just as much as the Silent Generation who created rock and roll.
As for the Heroes, my prediction is that millennials will, in the next ten years, be able to break the spell of media brainwashing and globohomo and elevate public consciousness to a level where they can’t be manipulated any more.

[Anonymous No.18193256]

>>18193162
There's more music being made than you can listen to in your lifetime you fucking retard.

[Anonymous No.18193265]

>>18193254
>You’d have to be blind to not see Gen Z’s massive creative output;
i dont know if you are not a zoomer yourself or if you are a dreamy zoomer. Plus most of the art you still see today falls in the late millenials generation since they can reach as young as 22 still.
> be able to break the spell of media brainwashing and globohomo and elevate public consciousness to a level where they can’t be manipulated any more.
ok. you are just retarded.

[Anonymous No.18193266]

>>18193254
Shut the fuck up with your pomo arguments, faggot. Don't derail the thread.

[Anonymous No.18193306]

>>18193265
Not a zoomer, born in ‘94, but I’ve recently started working with some and I’m seriously impressed with them. If the shit they’re throwing around on TikTok is anything to go by, they’re only going to get more creative. Now obviously that doesn’t mean you have to enjoy what they produce, but the output is there.
>>18193266
You’re lucky I’m here bringing the thread back on track or it would’ve been moved to /mu/ already.
I’m not saying our struggle is going to be easy. But as more and more people become alienated from the two sides of politics, they’re going to flee to the high ground. We’re actually going to burn the system down and rebuild it, actually learning from the mistakes of the past. But it’s going to take a lot of reading and writing, and fighting.

[Anonymous No.18193344]

>>18193194
>hyperpop
Corporate rubbish. People only listen to it because they're told it's good by culture vultures.
>experimental high skill guitar play
We get it, you watch YouTube, listen to King Giz and think that playing a funny looking guitar is a revolutionary act. Nothing that progressive groups haven't been doing for decades.

[Anonymous No.18193353]

>>18193194
>hyperpop
Hauntology in the Fisherite sense. It's basically Brokencyde or Dot Dot Curve. Except these (and the rest of crunkcore) was universally derided as the worst music ever at the time. Hyperpop is the same, but it's critically acclaimed because "ITS SO BAD ITS GOOD LOOOL IM SO RANDUMB AND POST-IRONIC"
>explain the uptick in more experimental high skill guitarplay
i dont see that

[Anonymous No.18193376]

>>18193256
Quantity does not say anything about diversity, originality and creativity. In fact, quantity very often goes against quality

[Anonymous No.18193465]

Do you think there will ever be a return to acoustic and analog music? I think it's possible, maybe not this cycle of generations, but perhaps the next, that the youth will reject electronic music and embrace fuzzy imperfection. Will chamber music come back? Will Generation Gamma buy harpsichords for their pods and play their own sheet music? Will there be marching bands of horns and flutes and drums roaming the mean streets of Neo Tokyo, annoying the shit out of sleeping Alphas? Will huddling masses of revolutionary Christians meet in abandoned factories to perform motets and chorales? Will they wear powdered wigs and lace and hose and duel each other with 3d printed sabres and pistols?

[Anonymous No.18193468]

>>18193194
>>18193344
>>18193353

i don't really care for hyperpop but this is precisely why it's pointless engaging with this "decline of western cuilture???" tripe. anything you cite as a counterexample will be met with a short, glib dismissal

[Anonymous No.18193482]

>>18193162
nnnnnnnnoooooo how will i live if i can't consume new music

[Anonymous No.18193523]

Who cares about this shit? If you don't like modern music then just listen to older stuff. Maybe if you commies would actually focus on overthrowing the bourgeoisie rather than whining about how pop music isn't the same as it was in the sixties you would have actually achieved something by now. Better yet, stop consuming all pop culture and read a fucking book, maybe then you won't keep making shitty off-topic threads.

[Anonymous No.18193528]

I'm not sure you are correct. I've heard the same about fashion except in both 2010 about the period between 2000 and 2010 and in 2020 on period between 2010 and 2020. It's almost as if in the 2nd decade of 21st century, the first one has gained distinct fashion on its own.

Then there's also a matter of massive fragmentation of everything coming with internet. In all likelihood new music styles do show up, but they're never called such, because there are total of 2 outfits doing each of them, at best.

[Anonymous No.18193533]

OP is uncultured swine.

[Anonymous No.18193545]

>>18193376
With quantity what is truly original is harder to find. So shitters get filtered in the search.

[Anonymous No.18193565]

>>18193545
>>18193376
Quality doesn't require originality

[Anonymous No.18193578]

>>18193306
>>18193254
>The legendary millenial boomer
I bet you dominate facebook, embarrasing.

[Anonymous No.18193599]

It's like you didn't even read Spengler. Culture is dead, long live Civilization.

[Anonymous No.18193601]

>>18193599
this

[Anonymous No.18193822]

>>18193465
i dont think harpsichords would fit in pods desu

[Anonymous No.18193912]

Mark Fisher wrote about this in 2009
https://www.newstatesman.com/music/2009/05/culture-technology-energy-rave

That being said, 2010s had new retrowave, vaporwave, witch house, cloud rap/phonk... You could say the first two indicated cultural stagnation, but most people who enjoy that crap never lived in the 80s, and, honestly, 80s revival that has been haunting the pop culture for the last decade has nothing to do with genuine 80s experience. If it's stagnation, then so was the XIX century romanticism. And I don't care if somebody 'invented' cloud rap or any of the miriad other subgenres spawning from it in the 1990s or whatever. You know what I mean. Nobody knew what it was until the 2010s, and everybody knows it now. And what difference do new instruments/sounds make, anyways? Who the fuck listens to music just to hear new sounds? Not that you can't create something unique that majority of people never heard before, of course. If you're talking about the zeitgeist, then what matters is collective experience, and there are a lot of cheap tricks that can surprise the majority of humans and/or come off as innovation.

Although I live in Russia, so I might have different experience from the Americans. I didn't enjoy the cultural landscape of the past decade, but I can't in good conscience call it stagnation. There have been a lot of new names that came and went. And America had alt-right/MDE/frogtwitter cultural spark that maybe wasn't that fruitful in terms of cultural output but definitely planted itself in the zeitgeist as something new, enjoyable and indicative of a generation.

[Anonymous No.18193958]

>>18193912
>retrowave, vaporwave,
hauntology in the Fisher sense
>cloud rap
indeed, one of the last modifications to rap possible
>phonk
again, hauntology (memphis revival)

[Anonymous No.18194025]

>>18193468
you got btfo because ypu troed to pretend hyperpop was something new, anons replied with arguments explaining why it's just hauntology liked by the ironic zoomer crowd.

[Anonymous No.18194049]

>>18193958
>>18194025
>hauntology
How is it different from Renaissance or Romanticism?

[Anonymous No.18194105]

What happened in the 2010s is that we entered a landscape of post-scarcity in access to recorded music. No need to hunt up (and pay for) physical media, no need to even scour illegal download sources and maintain a massive hard drive archive. Everything is available to listen to, now. This is overwhelming and has a paralysing effect on creativity. We will process this, but it is an entirely novel and overwhelming environment.

[Anonymous No.18194118]

the teenager must die

[Anonymous No.18194164]

>>18193344
>King Giz
i would never call them a high skill guitar band.
I mean more independant guys 8yes on youtube) who play 1-2 min riffs requiring high skill or at least high amounts of practise.

[Anonymous No.18194177]

>>18193162
>Fisherite
What?

[Anonymous No.18194189]

>>18194049
wdym? renaissance took things from antiquity but it obviously wasn't the same as antiquity. rock took things from blues and jazz but it's obviously neither.

modern hauntology is either a 1:1 revival (copy) of older sounds or a retro-ified (modified to sound like how we "imagine" retro/vintage music to sound) version of them

[Anonymous No.18194199]

Would genuinely be interested to hear about the listening habits of the crowd convinced that nothing interesting is being created anymore.

>your favorite album, and why?
>what was the most recent album to feel like an interesting work of art, and why do you think nobody has evolved or developed on that style since?
>do you follow any music news at all, how do you hear about new releases?
>which albums released in 2021 have you listened to, and what did you think of some of them?
>your top 5 albums from 2020, if applicable?
>your top 5 albums from the 2010s, if applicable?

[Anonymous No.18194201]

Lol this nigga missed out on 2013-16 Thugger. No excuse

[Anonymous No.18194224]

>>18194164
there’s nothing 100% unique about those ichika nito guys, in fact it’s reminiscent of gimmicky davie501 memeshit

[Anonymous No.18194242]

>>18194199
OP here. I'm like a fucking encyclopedia on music history and music in general. I don't have a favorite genre, I only have least favorite genres. I don't share the views of scaruffi, but if I could use an analogy, I have a similar breadth of knowledge (or at least ambition) despite being over 2x younger

I find that the more one knows, the less one can be impressed

[Anonymous No.18194250]

>>18194189
>>18194025
>>18193344
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rj6dwEBmBJA
what older sound is this copying?

[Anonymous No.18194258]

>>18193162
>>18193164
>>18193167
Take your gay essay to /mu/ retard.
>All centered around jazz music, sexual liberation, decadence and heavy drug use - quite cool for the 40s and 50s, eh?
No. Retard.

[Anonymous No.18194272]

>>18194242
please share your last.fm or some way we can have a look at your listening data. it would give your opinion a lot of weight, and make you look less like a mf who read one book and tried to mangle it to fit some /pol/ talking point

[Anonymous No.18194279]

>>18194250
Take your trannyshit somewhere else. Go listen to some Beethoven and stop ruining Western culture.

[Anonymous No.18194315]

>>18194201
nigga im a crack addict

[Anonymous No.18194335]

>>18194242
You are a conceited cunt and I bet you don’t even know how to play an instrument. Go on zoomie tik tok and listen to their crap music, sure its wack but its different than something from the 2000s you fucking moron. Yes music is post scarcity, yes corporate music is ass, but zoomies like billie eilish and identify as the artist generation: just because you are too old or too lonely to know whats hip since 2010 doesn’t mean there ain’t new things. Fucking moron that thinks micro analyzing the vague changes in pop rock fusion hop every ten years makes any sense at all.

[Anonymous No.18194347]

>>18194258
What I meant was that the 50s are typically seen as a very bland and "orderly" decade

[Anonymous No.18194354]

>>18194242
Fucking conceited post teenage cunt. I bet you can’t even read music. Just because you have no friends to show you popular music doesn't mean the zoomies aren’t listening to new things and have identity. Go on tik tok and see the stupid shit they do, they’ve got tons of identity despite corporate music decay and digitization. What a fucking moron

[Anonymous No.18194358]

>>18194189
New Retrowave/Vaporwave are meant to be nostalgic, but they would sound completely alien to a listener from the 80s or 90s, and they are not trying to recreate the old music, just to evoke emotions through retro samples. I brought up romanticism in particular because they were also obsessed with the past to the point of building fairy tale castles and decorative fake Roman ruins. Yes, there is a lot of pessimism and apathy in the Western zeitgeist nowadays, but there isn't anything special about such state of affairs.

[Anonymous No.18194362]

>>18194279
utterly schizophrenic post

[Anonymous No.18194365]

>>18194347
Beatnik retards drugging themselves is also pretty fucking bland desu. So is everything else about America.

[Anonymous No.18194397]

>>18194365
>So is everything else about America.
OP here. I'm not even American. I'm European. Your superiority complex (or perhaps self-hate?) is so baseless lmao
>>18194354
nice projection, but i'm well exposed to the music of today, from top40, through tiktok, to local and more obscure shit

it's all wholly rotten and dead.

[Anonymous No.18194409]

>>18194397
feel free to respond to either of these!
>>18194199
>>18194272

[Anonymous No.18194413]

>>18193162
>2000
>rap was still somewhat new
Lol

>>18193465
Probably not, and anyway what you're describing is just nostalgia, it's not new music. But I do think that a new instrument, which sounds good in many contexts and is relatively cheap, portable, and easy to play (like the electric guitar was), could jumpstart a new genre

>>18194242
>dodging the question

[Anonymous No.18194431]

>>18194413
>>2000
>>rap was still somewhat new
>Lol
yeah? 2000 was still fairly old school. that's 1 school (2 schools if you think mid-school is a thing) away from where we're at now. hip hop had been mainstream for perhaps not even 20 years in 2000.
>dodging the question
i'm not dodging the question. i just don't wanna list like 20 albums and artists like that guy wants me to lmao

[Anonymous No.18194430]

>>18194397
So you can't read music or play an instrument then?

[Anonymous No.18194456]

>>18194397
>OP here. I'm not even American. I'm European. Your superiority complex (or perhaps self-hate?) is so baseless lmao
Good on you retard, I don't care. Go post your gay essay to /mu/, maybe someone there gives a shit. Personally, I have never met anyone who thought the Beatniks were anything other than obnoxious, half-rotten scum.

[Anonymous No.18194470]

Why the fucking fucking is this music blog post on a literature board

Delete this diarrhoea mods

[Anonymous No.18194495]

You make the mistake of believing that jazz and rock music had any real cultural value. It’s all been empty consumer art and nothing more.

[Anonymous No.18194499]

>>18194456
>Personally, I have never met anyone who thought the Beatniks were anything other than obnoxious, half-rotten scum.
the beatniks were the best "counterculture" far better than the hippies

[Anonymous No.18194501]

>>18194470
>mark Fischer did not write a book
Retard crawl back to your cave faggot

[Anonymous No.18194517]

>>18194499
That's not saying much, anon.

[Anonymous No.18194534]

>>18194499
Some of them were good writers, but their talent was squandered by wasting their time with bebop.

[Anonymous No.18194719]

>>18194250
>what older sound is this copying?
Alvin and the Chipmunks.

[Anonymous No.18195023]

>>18194431
>2000 was still fairly old school
>mid-school
What the fuck man, none of this is right. If 00s are old school then Public Enemy is prehistoric.

[Anonymous No.18195039]

Fisher was stuck in the boomer/gen x mindset that expects superficial cultural innovation every half decade because that's what he grew up with

[Anonymous No.18195116]

Any new genre that has ever been invented has just been a reinvention or melding of several different previously existing forms together. How do you think making music works? The blues was was just folkified old negro traditionals, rock was just faster blues, metal was just harder rock, and so on and so forth. From those divergences you start to get all the offshoots like folk rock, punk rock, funk rock, post rock, etc etc. on down the rabbit hole. So on that basis music has been dead since way before Y2K. No art form ever dies it just evolves. Someone out there right now is conceptualizing a way to push the ball forward. It might not be something you personally like or enjoy, but it's happening.

[Anonymous No.18195153]

>>18194250
New or not hyperpop and all the recent trannycore electronic genre's are fucking garbage.

[Anonymous No.18195169]

>>18195153
The 28 year old boomer

[Anonymous No.18195186]

I agree music is dying but hip-hop is still going on and evolving, there were a lot of good projects in the last 10 years. Also if you recognize the death of music you should be obliged to resurrect if instead of being a critic

[Anonymous No.18195191]

>>18194242
>I don't have a favorite genre, I only have least favorite genres
so you're a genre tourist, just like scaruffi, lol

[Anonymous No.18195223]

>what is regeton
Lmaoing

[Anonymous No.18195233]

>>18194242
funny how mad everyone gets at you lol, you must be on to something

[Anonymous No.18195278]

TLDR zoomer wanna-be millennial OP is trying to legitimize trannies and queers by making them "60s cool" and presenting them as the harbingers of cultural revolution akin to the fucking hippies, which, news flash, were a multimediatic diversion to overturn the real revolution. OP also ignores the fact that every avenue of communication is now compromised, that the "industry" is more manipulated and marketing-focused than ever, and that the CIA niggers live in everyone's minds. Before you discredit me for "CIA niggers", the term represents well the shadow element of three letter agencies who, little by little, have invaded the public's spirit.
That being said, there is an element of hauntology to most of what's "new" today, but your analysis fails on so many levels that it should be wholly dismissed.

[Anonymous No.18195303]

>>18195153
completely besides the point

[Anonymous No.18195312]

>>18195023
2000, not 2000s, you illiterate nigger. the year 2000 drags on its back only the 80s and 90s in rap history. this is old school

[Anonymous No.18195319]

>>18195039
whats wrong with that?

[Anonymous No.18195326]

>>18195278
This

[Anonymous No.18195334]

>>18195319
because it's an illusion.

[Anonymous No.18195339]

>>18194199
Drag-on Dragoon complete soundtrack Vol 1 & 2

[Anonymous No.18195391]

>>18194362
>Waaah, I can't dilate in peace without a strong Western man putting me in my place
Shut the fuck up before I embarrass you again, leftist fag.

[Anonymous No.18195436]

The most based post on all of /lit

[Anonymous No.18195442]

>Fisherite
kys

[Anonymous No.18195544]

>>18195334
we could make it for most of the 20th century. what happened?

[Anonymous No.18195549]

>>18195436
thanks dewd

[Anonymous No.18195551]

>>18193162
What is Mark Fisher's favorite album of all time? This will seal his fate for me.

[Anonymous No.18195567]

>>18195391
youre responding to imaginary voices in your head rather than the content of my posts

[Anonymous No.18195584]

What is the newest artist/album you've listened to?

[Anonymous No.18195666]

>>18195544
stagnation of technological development

[Anonymous No.18195682]

>>18195584
https://youtu.be/3S9sxSQs5lE

[Anonymous No.18195689]

>>18195312
You're still wrong, there's a world of difference between the 80s/90s stuff and Stankonia for instance. Not very long after that you have the first instances of trap music.

[Anonymous No.18195690]

>>18193162
music died with the advent of popular music, read adorno. not that pop music isn't fun, but it's not comparable to the classical tradition. there hasn't been a great composer born since the early 1900s. music is over for the time being.

[Anonymous No.18195711]

This raises a question. Will the zoomer be able to resurrect art music? With a zoomer composer bring the symphony or the opera back from the dead? There seems to be so little of this today (at least of music that isn’t deliberately dissonant or obscure) that there is a void waiting to be filled. The academic composers who promote contemporary works do not care that their work is not accessible to the public in any way, and is in no way pleasing to the ear in any traditional sense, because this is not their standard.

[Anonymous No.18195744]

>>18195690
Thoroughly, irrevocably, and infinitely incorrect
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqayDnQ2wmw

[Anonymous No.18195772]

>>18194199
Who is this beautiful woman?

[Anonymous No.18195780]

>>18195711
There are some neo-romantic composers but all of their music sounds like a melodramatic film score. The world has moved on, there's no point in going back to an old paradigm other than nostalgia

[Anonymous No.18195783]

>>18195744
i like this, it's fun. but it replaces genuine creativity with formal experimentation. all the effort goes into the production/arrangement, very little into the actual song. read adorno

[Anonymous No.18195806]

>>18195780
agreed. it's sad to think that literature is probably going the same way. i think the early 1900s were humanity's cultural peak in a lot of ways. probably our greatest concentration of good literary, visual, and musical achievements came then

[Anonymous No.18195865]

>>18195780
>>18195806
I respectfully disagree. I am certain that tonal music still has much to offer, and that it is only a matter of time before someone creates orchestral/instrumental art music that very much their own and does not sound derivative. You can say that it is over and done, but one could look back to the golden age of art music in the same way the artists of the 19th century looked back to medieval/classical art forms and breathed new life into them. It would be a revival.

[Anonymous No.18195917]

>>18195865
You could be right. But as far as I can tell tonal harmony has been stretched to its limits, that's why composers sought out more intense dissonances and eventually ditched tonality altogether.

[Anonymous No.18195998]

There's plenty of new original music all around you, with more coming out every day. Basically all the top 40s in the US is the same trash over and over again (Taylor Swift. Maroon 5, etc), true, but hardly any young people listen to the radio. It's all on Spotify, where if I don't want to listen to anything besides black metal and classical music if I don't want to. So I would reframe your post as the end of popular music.

[Anonymous No.18196030]

>>18195998
>It's all on Spotify, where if I don't want to listen to anything besides black metal and classical music if I don't want to.
Yeah man let your music taste be arbitrarily shaped by an impersonal algorithm. This is way better than the top 40 radio picks shaping music. Fuck them both. Listen to good local radio stations.

[Anonymous No.18196133]

Let's use Fisher's own thought experiment for this hauntology argument: I think if you travelled back to the 70s and showed people today's vaporwave (2814, death's dynamic shroud, eccojams etc.) they definitely would think that it's from the future.
>inb4 it's just a tranny variation of past genres
so what? You could make that argument for almost any genre. The fact of the matter is that they have a distinct and original quality that music from previous generations did not have.
Do you seriously think that if you played this song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GTVEh7FfC4 to someone from the 70s their initial reaction would be "huh, sounds just like our music. Is this really from the future?" I seriously doubt it

[Anonymous No.18196147]

>>18193162
the only thing that has died is a false unitary vision of Music as decided by the big four, MTV, and radio

[Anonymous No.18196245]

>>18196030
Since when does local mean good? My local radio stations play the same shit that's on the top 40. At least Spotify's algorithm makes an effort to appeal to me instead of shoving nigger bops down my throat.

[Anonymous No.18196257]

>>18196147
Exactly. A shared media experience is dead. Good fucking riddance.

[Anonymous No.18196563]

>>18196147
>>18196257
If there's now so much more freedom in what you can listen to why does it seem music is becoming more homogenized by the day?

[Anonymous No.18196625]

>>18196563
Proofs?

[Anonymous No.18196680]

>>18195584
OP here
bright green field by squid. came out today

it was ok. had some great moments desu but also some embarrassing moments. musically. a bit confused at times.
it's being a bit overhyped now.

[Anonymous No.18196687]

>>18195690
popular music has always existed. before the 20th century, popular music hid in folk ballads

[Anonymous No.18196698]

>>18196133
>I think if you travelled back to the 70s and showed people today's vaporwave (2814, death's dynamic shroud, eccojams etc.) they definitely would think that it's from the future.
I dont think so, but alright, let's say they would.

What about someone from 1999?

[Anonymous No.18196718]

>>18196133
OP here, cont.:
>that link
OMEGALUL. if you think that anyone from even 40 years ago would be shocked, then think again. this is literally blade runner soundtrack tier, and that came out almost 40 years ago on the dot:
https://youtu.be/6uXnXEdXGJY
https://youtu.be/C1dvb2FgBEM
https://youtu.be/Llf6t6KgQqY

[Anonymous No.18196735]

>>18196687
yeah, and i would say pop music is our folk music to a large extent. while it's great, it also doesn't take the place of classical music, which is a very unique and beautiful thing. a similar phenomenon is seen in literature with the modern novel, although the difference isn't as pronounced because there are literary epics going back a long time, which you don't see with music.

[Anonymous No.18196812]

>>18196735
I think there's a greater genius (in the sense of capturing human experience) in folk music than classical music. Music of the 99% vs music of the 1%

[Anonymous No.18196838]

>>18196687
>Pop and folk categories that denote different stylistic qualifies and not categories based on method of production and social function
C'mon, use your head a bit.

[Anonymous No.18196891]

>>18196812
Most musical geniuses were attracted to creating classical music due to its breadth and complexity, so I’m not sure if your statement is true.

[Anonymous No.18196909]

>>18196812
Classical.music was often times heavily influenced by folk music. I actually think part of the decline of classical music is derived from the way pop music has displaced folk music.

[Anonymous No.18196929]

>read through thread
>it's literally all people offering obvious rebuttals to op being met with "doesn't count"
This is retarded

[Anonymous No.18196932]

>>18196929
>obvious rebuttals
Lol what? Like what?

[Anonymous No.18196936]

>>18193353
50 dollars bet you have not actually seriously engaged with Ag cooks output. He is a legitimately great artist, no irony involved. you probably listened to 100 gecs and assumed you were an expert on "hyper pop" (terrible genre name also)

[Anonymous No.18196944]

>>18193533
based, faglords who cannot seriously engage with art they don't understand will forever stay filtered by DG's legendary run in the 2010s.

[Anonymous No.18196945]

>>18196936
autists love making this argument when someone doesn't like their favorite band/genre etc. 'but if you heard *this* song.'
>t. been there

[Anonymous No.18196960]

>>18196932
Why would I bother to give you any more examples than you've already had? You are set in your opinion and will dismiss every new genre posted

[Anonymous No.18196967]

>>18196245
>My local radio stations play the same shit that's on the top 40
Usually when people talk about local stations being better they mean ones that have DJs who are actually knowledgeable and play interesting music, like college stations or ones that have public funding and therefore don't have to play ads. There are usually only a handful, even in big cities.

[Anonymous No.18196970]

>>18194201
based. this thread is just losers who don't understand art and think they're experts on this shit. I agree that stuff like Film is dead, but this decade (especially he beginning and middle) had some genuinely high tier pop artists, enough that I was pretty satisfied desu. these last few years have been kind of rough though but there's still worthwhile artists. DV-i is a current favorite

[Anonymous No.18196975]

>>18196680
Guy sounds like the singer from Cake sometimes

[Anonymous No.18196980]

>>18194279
t. midway who doesn't understand music but thinks that they do.
they didn't post the best Charli or PC music song but you clearly are not engaging with it on any level

[Anonymous No.18196981]

>>18193162
electronic and jazz completed music.

[Anonymous No.18196991]

>>18194354
>tiktok
im a zoomer itt who has been defending modern music, but tik Tok is devoid of any artistic merit

[Anonymous No.18196995]

>>18194279
as someone who loves Beethoven and has written classical pieces and plays violin, DG and PC music are legit excellent artists

[Anonymous No.18197002]

>>18194719
retard who listened to the first ten seconds

[Anonymous No.18197018]

>>18195339
lmao based

[Anonymous No.18197023]

>>18196936
i'm familiar with ag cook. and it's not like i just like rock and shit and am a boomer. nah. i fuckin love hardcore, house, techno, idm a bit too (gets a bit too fast sniffy and unfun tho).

ag cook tries to do what has been done in the past. as i said, brokencyde level shit + attempts at merging electronic with pop. to someone unfamiliar with rave culture he might seem rad but i see through his milquetoastedness and how his music actually isn't harsh or radical but actually WATERED DOWN electronic

[Anonymous No.18197030]

>>18196970
>DV-i
What the fuck man, this is awful

[Anonymous No.18197040]

>>18195783
Jesus Christ. no one likes aphex twin because he's experimental, he just is a great pop songwriter with great aesthetic and rhythm sensibilities. Obviously he's not Bach or anything but pop songwriting can be enjoyable and great in its simplicity

[Anonymous No.18197044]

>Music using twelve tone equal temperament
>100% cringe and derivative tripe.

[Anonymous No.18197045]

>>18195783
also apex has much better tunes than that

[Anonymous No.18197057]

>>18196929
The problem is that OP doesn't understand that the changes in music he perceived are completely superficial, and that the cultural stagnation he complains about began with the popularization of jazz and has remained ever since. The difference between Schoenberg and Duke Ellington is greater than that between Ellington and 100gecs or whatever is popular these days.

[Anonymous No.18197059]

>>18197040
>>18197045
yeah i like aphex twin. i like alot of popular music. but it's not comparable to classical music, which is what really matters. read adorno

[Anonymous No.18197060]

>>18196812
I think both are pretty genius and I love them alot. Even this decade has had some truly all time worthy pop artists like DG. classical has been dead since the 1970s though sadly unless im just really missing out on something

[Anonymous No.18197061]

>>18193167
I'm fairly confident that the music of the future will be a revival of classical. This was one of my takeaways from Spengler even though he did not say it. According to Spengler Western art music is equivalent to Greek sculpture in its importance as a cultural form. The Romans famously did not produce any original works of sculpture, preferring to copy everything from the Greeks.

Once the 400 year common practice period of classical ended, music turned into fleeting styles and fashions that changed every decade. To me this represents nothing but uncertainty, music being unsure of what to do with itself. Now even this period has ended, for reasons you say in your second post, so the inability to innovate must necessarily lead to a revival of old music.

But, as you also mention, the music of parents and grandparents is "uncool". So where do you go from there? Modern trends have left no way forward. So it is necessary to go back further. You revive the main musical tradition that Western civilization has historically known. But now innovation is a thing of the past, so it's going to look very Roman in its formulation. I think this is a pretty good estimation of the future of Western music.

[Anonymous No.18197070]

>>18197023
I never said he was harsh or radical. he just makes great music.

[Anonymous No.18197077]

>>18197030
nah

[Anonymous No.18197099]

>>18197061
>You revive the main musical tradition that Western civilization has historically known
So ballads, jigs, polkas, and the like?

[Anonymous No.18197104]

>>18197077
It's weeaboo trash

[Anonymous No.18197122]

>>18197099
Thinking now of all the great and influential polka composers. Don't be facetious. Even the most uneducated among us today know well who Mozart and Beethoven are.

[Anonymous No.18197129]

>>18197104
ill admit that its heavily influenced by Jpop music and even jap video game music (gasp!) but I don't think that really has much to do with the quality. They are good songwriters, cool melodies and sounds. im not saying they're amazing or anything, just solid music

[Anonymous No.18197137]

>>18197122
My point is that the "main musical tradition" of the West, if it can be said to have such a thing, is folk music in its many forms.

[Anonymous No.18197188]

>>18197137
Folk music has always been localized and never had any great singular influence in the public consciousness like classical did. The fact that it consists of so many forms and not one unitary form is testament to this fact. There is a similar thing with 20th century music, where each decade has a type of sound that never leaves that decade.

[Anonymous No.18197238]

>>18197188
Classical music also consists of many forms

[Anonymous No.18197306]

>>18197238
He’s also ignorant of the fact that classical composers frequently drew inspiration from folk music.

[Anonymous No.18197334]

>>18197137
western languages don't even have their native word for music, what folk tradition are you talking about?

[Anonymous No.18197626]

>>18193162
What?

[Anonymous No.18197865]

>>18193162
Music died in the late 90s. Nothing has been innovated since then.

[Anonymous No.18197902]

>>18193167
Two letters: ai
I am pretty sure music is the first art medium where we will see ai being succesfully applied to. Everything after that will change. 10-30 more years though depending on how fast we continue innovating machine learning techniques

[Anonymous No.18198060]

>>18197057
Finally someone with sense.

[Anonymous No.18198188]

>>18193162
It's an interesting question, worthy of discussion, but your pic related only deals with unce-unce shit.

[Anonymous No.18198289]

>>18197061
Music is now a lucrative business, and it sells mostly to teenagers who happen to be the easiest to influence category of people, so, no we will not return to ancient, more complex musical traditions. We will just continue to shit simplified craps that sell millions to untrained ears.

[Anonymous No.18198321]

>>18193205
The four generation cycle theory has one major hiccup: it does not account for the technology of the internet. Global instant communication has really upset the fruit basket.

[Anonymous No.18198332]

>>18194250
It’s a smoother variation on was lots of glitchy stuff that came out in the 90s-2000s. I hear bits of Mego label music, basic glitchy circuit-bending or laptop stuff, etc. You can call it by whatever hipster genre brand you want to to make it seem fresh to kids who have no sense of history, but it’s not brand new.

[Anonymous No.18198336]

Electronic music don't require virtuosity

[Anonymous No.18198339]

>>18193306
You're 27 years old and wrote all of this in good faith? This is embarrassing and the best case scenario is that you are a woman (real). That would at least go a long way towards explaining your immaturity.

[Anonymous No.18198385]

>>18198336
>t. has never listened to the square pusher or the aphex twin

[Anonymous No.18198401]

>>18198336
Shit take and probably shit taste as well
https://youtu.be/VchTZG2oYf8

[Anonymous No.18198499]

>>18198401
>wow he played 8 notes and looped some of them XD

[Anonymous No.18198545]

>>18198401
is this link supposed to be ironic or something

[Anonymous No.18198661]

>>18197057
Is 100gecs actually popular? I like experimental music, so am willing to listen to it. But it is hard to imagine them filling a stadium or even a large nightclub.

>>18197099
I am ready for the polka jig and ballad revival.

[Anonymous No.18198672]

was gonna post this on the last thread but it got archived before i submitted

>>18179465
this reads like a copy pasta

>>18179827
>The dreampunk collective certainly encompasses that, and I think the recent development in the breakcore scene also.
> she expresses a certain isolating, postmodern vibe that emerged from the cyberspace subculture, a kind of character that especially younger and lonely people who grew up with the internet can relate to.

well put. if anything, the “new” in new music is the new sounds we can manipulate and create with computers, and the ever-growing pool of data we can resample and remix, *leveraging this as a new base from which to create* — this is not a regressive act (when done with intent)

2814 and machine girl are good examples of each polarity of these sounds. theyre digital collages, densely textured wall-of-sound sort of things, computerized. machine girl replicates the manic overstimulation of cyberspace / hyperlinking, jumping between samples ad naseum, like how we close browser tabs while opening new ones on entirely different subjects — occasionally lingering on a thought for long enough to feel something. whereas, 2814 grabs the post-modern isolation we all seem to relate to. the sound is progressive (as vaprowave is to something like indie rock), but it isn’t optimistic; it points out the quiet parts of our otherwise amplified lives—loneliness, 0 texts, connected, and simultaneously disconnected.

[Anonymous No.18198826]

>>18193167
>>18193164
>>18193162
I feel the bigger problem why the 2010s felt so culturally bland from some perspective is the massive individualization and splintering of media consumption due to the absurd amounts of content available online and the disappearance of local scenes due to the internet and other factors.
On the surface there's not really much going on anymore, but looking below you find sprawling subcultures and niches like never really seen before or even technically possible.
For example take a look at the absurd amounts of just hentai and subgenres and communities for it floating around.
And this doesn't just extend to japanese (style) cartoon pornography nowadays but absolutely everything, arts, crafts, movies, music, literature, video games, sports, sexual practices, drugs, news media, and probably a dozen of other interests to get invested in I forgot to mention.

[Anonymous No.18198878]

>>18193162
I don't think you're being fair as far as the timeframe goes. We just got out of the 2010s, more time will be needed for academia and musicians themselves to reflect on what innovations came up in that time. Also, there are far less barriers for people to post original music content, and with the now widespread use of samples, as well as the concept of memes, it makes ascribing the creation of anything to anyone much more difficult than it was in the past. An inverse of this is the recording ban in the US from 1942 to 1944, which was around the same time that bebop supposedly started, but because of the recording ban we don't have as much confidence in saying who started it and when that was exactly.

[Anonymous No.18198885]

>>18195689
Hes quite right about 2000.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVLjASpN6eY&list=PLkVSzrKdeIKU91qTjdaJW6POp96tF7hWt&index=11
The basket ball siren shit didnt start happening until the mid 00s.

>>18196944
2020 is gonna be even greater imo

[Anonymous No.18198909]

>>18196698
I have a hard time believing something like this wouldn't sound at least very new to someone from 20 years ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjUimgWH6gY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfEr6BSuNpY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoLPYT4y6kQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWNRfNsfjfw

[Anonymous No.18198940]

>>18198332
if we're going to be that tenuous in our connections then academic computer music already did everything in the 80s and all popular music since like the 1970s has basically been rehashed minimalist and electroacoustic techniques

[Anonymous No.18199359]

>>18193162
For me, it's goa.

[Anonymous No.18199371]

>>18199359
goa is a city in india not music you dumb retard

[Anonymous No.18199372]

>>18193306
If you’re being sincere, and for your sake I hope you aren’t, you really come off like a cunt.

[Anonymous No.18199385]

>>18199371
Seethe and cope pajeet, your shithole nation is literally less important than a shortlived sub-subgenre of electronic music.

[Anonymous No.18199429]

>>18198826
this.
music got atomized

[Anonymous No.18199458]

>>18197902
people wanting AI music is literally the most soulless shit ever

[Anonymous No.18199467]

>>18198885
I said 2010s because I haven't strongly enjoyed a DG or Sb project since E

[Anonymous No.18199488]

>>18199385
keep crying india is a world class power and the most likely country to be the most powerfull country this century while yours country crumbles apart and you get yours woman raped by niggers lmfao white boy crying

[Anonymous No.18199500]

only takeaway from this shitty thread is that OP is a humongous retarded faggot but not as much of a faggot as people who unironically enjoy vaporwave and think it's anything more than dumbed-down elevator music for aesthetically stunted retards

jannies do your job ffs, i know the pay isn't much but still

[Anonymous No.18199506]

>>18199500
agreed, vaporware sucks

[Anonymous No.18199519]

>>18199467
Fair enough. Their style has changed a lot since like rainworld era but I think Thaiboy just keeps getting better. 2020s the decade of Dj Billybool.

[Anonymous No.18199527]

>>18199488
Long life india im also from india

[Anonymous No.18199535]

>>18199519
yeah thaiboy is based as ever, excited to see his next album. i wish bladee would actually write and put effort in, in all his interviews he says he used to spend alot of time on each track but now he just freestyles off the cuff and it really shows imo. plus I like the sad rap vibes more than the weird pop vibes (Ecco and thaiboy and lean do pop well tho)

[Anonymous No.18199606]

>>18199535
>i wish bladee would actually write and put effort in, in all his interviews he says he used to spend alot of time on each track but now he just freestyles off the cuff and it really shows imo
Yeah I agree. It worked for projects like exeter and trash island but recently it shows as lazy, especially on blue summer.

[Anonymous No.18199653]

>>18194242
Answer the questions then jeez

[Anonymous No.18199719]

>>18196563
Because what you're looking at is the homogenized corner of new music

[Anonymous No.18199800]

Didn't read the thread, only OP's mesage.

If the future of music is to be achieve through technical exploration, then we've hit a ceiling and the only way I can think of that doesn't involve remixing old genres would be to redefine the medium of music itself.
For instance: interactive music. A song that reads your brainwaves and generates patterns live, but with some sort of algorithm. Writing this algorithm to produce certain patterns that appeal to people would be the artistic part. And different patterns of algorithm would emerge, forming new genres.
Another example would be tactile music. Maybe we'll both hear and feel patterns at the same time as a way to enjoy music.

The other path is exploring other cultures. Maybe Arab music and its different musical scale will become the new rage, and even though it's "old news", no one has any clue about this sort of music, so it could easily be pushed as something new and fresh to the entire Western world.
Much of this has been explored, but there is still a lot to be recycled here. We hear a lot of Arab music featured here and there, but all in a traditional context. Get those unfamiliar notes and turn them into electronic sounds, chords, what-have-you and BAM, a new trend.

As an afterthought, there ARE some new genres here and there like all the memewaves and the retarded monotonic raps like those "This is America" short shouted sentences genre. I don't follow trends and am still stuck in 2015 with my music backlog, so I can't comment much.

[Anonymous No.18200042]

>>18198385
you think using the pencil tool on 1/64 grid is virtuosity? you probably think venetian snares is a god tier drummer of a "drum machine" too

actual virtuous music is on a decline because people like you keep on rewarding "idea people" rather than mechanical skill

[Anonymous No.18200137]

>>18194189
You have made the decision to believe your thesis is true without actual supporting evidence because you did not do any actual research or you think yoir personal tastes define reality. Now when everyone has counterexamples that prove you wrong you simply say "nuh uh" or "th-thats hauntology" even though for the most part it is not. You were absolutely BTFO by the anon bringing up romanticism.

[Anonymous No.18200160]

>>18195039
Also while he calls out corporatism he fails to realize any art from the past was corporate produced and anything he was introduced to was decided on by them. adopting the anti-corp attitude and hating on anything new but failing to see how all old music was created and marketed to people in the same ways in the past is pretty juvenile.

[Anonymous No.18200170]

>>18195711
No because OP woupd just claim it is hauntology.

[Anonymous No.18200358]

>>18193195
Read the title.

[Anonymous No.18200364]

>>18194118
this

[Anonymous No.18200523]

I don't really care about music, so what do I know, but judging by the music I'm exposes through my younger friends, I'd say music has indeed entered a period of mannerism. There's nothing that sounds distinctively new in the way previous movements did. Sure, if you sent a lot of contemporary music to the past people would find it strange, but so would people for most of the renaissance if you showed him a painting of El Greco, but that doesn't mean his work wasn't derivative, and I say this as a massive fan of his.

[Anonymous No.18200769]

OP is a huge faggot since he laments that
>Ah yes we need new 3 minute songs with new hip sounds with mass appeal to replace the old, uncool 3 minute songs with boring sounds with mass appeal but maybe we can't get that
He's a faggot who thinks democracy can fix the problems of democracy.

[Anonymous No.18200781]

>>18198909
are you saying autotune didn't exist in 1999?

[Anonymous No.18200782]

this hacks whole project is rebranding fukuyama for scene kids

[Anonymous No.18200792]

>>18199800
OP here. Your idea sounds very interesting.

Regarding Arab music, yeah, this is one thing I've been thinking about - as zoomers (and gen alpha) begin to exhaust the last possible re-iterations of music that was already made decades ago, due to globalization, i see the future of music, possibly, in regional scenes from around the world. possibly some regional african music, or regional music from asia. of course, adjusted to western palates (kinda like afrobeat)

development of new instruments is always a possibility. we can create every sound possible with a DAW, but maybe it's our modes of reasoning that are stagnant, and not the technology? maybe the fact that we can produce every sound isn't whats stopping us, but rather the fact that our imagination of what sounds to produce is limited?

[Anonymous No.18200800]

>>18200769
OP here. Music isn't about consooming itself, music is quite literally one of the most if not the most important human expressions. Distinct human expressions lend themselves for distinct identities. If new generations have no distinct human expressions (distinct music) to cling to, their identities are stunted. This could lead to a wholesale existential/identity crisis

[Anonymous No.18200811]

>>18200800
How is this different than the rampant existentialism in the first half of the 20th century.

[Anonymous No.18200822]

>>18200811
1. the concept of the teenager largely didn't exist before the war
2. there was jazz

[Anonymous No.18200828]

>>18200822
There's a pretty big gap between Nietzsche and jazz lmfao

[Anonymous No.18200845]

>>18200828
again:
1a. the concept of the teenager LARGELY did not exist before the war
1b. as i said at the beginning, time flowed in a different way before WW1 (and therefore before jazz), music was more static and most of all - there was no recorded music, it was all live. so yeah, music was not the go-to carrier of identity.

what carried youth identity before developments in music was ideology - philosophy, politics. and also sport. the anarchist movement was mostly a youth movement

with the development of music, young people became obsessed with it. it's hard to imagine an identity without music nowadays. it's something that came, and we're stuck with this outlook. so what do we do now, that music stopped progressing but we so dearly want to come back to when it was still a meaningful carrier of inter-generation tension?

[Anonymous No.18200847]

>>18193194
>the uptick in more experimental high skill guitarplay
Like? Rehashes of avant-garde jazz and free-improv guitar techniques?

[Anonymous No.18200869]

>>18195690
Cope, classical is pop

[Anonymous No.18200876]

>>18200845
You're almost there, just follow your logic to the end. Due to algorithms like Spotify people no longer listen to a particular genre. Many examples all around you. If I'm bored, I can go on a Soca binge and involve 0 other people. Music <-> identity is a dead formula. Music <-> group identity even deader.

You say "teenagers = music youth movement" and then say teenagers are a "concept". Ok, but both are, and if the equality is there and the RHS dies, the LHS dies. Just think about it, I won't spell your conclusions out for you.

[Anonymous No.18200890]

>>18200792
There's still loads of possibilities for new interface/interaction design
We're still using the same DAWs and drum machines as 20 years ago

[Anonymous No.18200894]

>corporations aren't picking up on youth trends and making them available to people
>also the corporations are at fault for picking up on youth trends and making them available to people

There's no pleasing you retards

[Anonymous No.18200985]

>>18196812
Bullshit, classical mysic was the music of the 2% or 3% of the population with the ability to educate themselves, folk is the music of the more serious elements of farmer or fishermen communities. Maybe about 10%

Fuck of with your 99%!

[Anonymous No.18200998]

>>18196133
70's the decade of kraftwerk and a few decades after they started making experimental electronic music?

[Anonymous No.18201018]

>>18200845
>1b. as i said at the beginning, time flowed in a different way before WW1 (and therefore before jazz), music was more static and most of all - there was no recorded music, it was all live. so yeah, music was not the go-to carrier of identity.
Yeah man, nothing says static like Liszt and Wagner, right?

[Anonymous No.18201021]

>>18199488
Indian woman also get raped by niggers all the time.

[Anonymous No.18201028]

>>18193162
>Fisher
Stopped reading there

[Anonymous No.18201030]

>>18200792

Worldmusic had been a thing now for half a century, just another scheme for innovation.

[Anonymous No.18201034]

>>18200845
>music was more static
I would switch it around and say music has been growing increasingly static during the 20th century.

[Anonymous No.18201043]

I'm not reading that.
>muh there's no new futures, waahh, I need humanity to be creative so I can perpetually consoom novel new artforms!
Who gives a fuck? For most of human existence people just repeated the same artforms that were passed down to them for generations, and any creativity and innovation was super incremental, but so what? People were happy and they still made some great stuff.

I dunno about spengler or anything like that, but way I see it we had an crazy wave of innovations across everything with the industrial rev. it was good while it lasted, but now it's coming to an end.
I mean I feel bad for Fisher that he got depressed and anheroed but I really don't see why people find him so profound desu.

[Anonymous No.18201204]

>>18200894
>he thinks youth trends start organically

[Anonymous No.18201674]

>>18193162
Dude Ishkur's Guide is from 1999-2001 you think that might have something to do with not listing any genres from the 2010s? Lmao holy shit what a fucking retard.

[Anonymous No.18201697]

>>18201204
yeah i'm like if there is a decline in microgenres in the 2010s it's probably just that that doesn't optimize discoverability on streaming platforms or something so it was dropped

[Anonymous No.18201871]

>>18200876
OP here

Indeed, it's increasingly looking like in the future we'll look back at the 20th century as mostly an anomaly rather than "the new normal" (new in contrast to everything that came before)

Interesting

[Anonymous No.18201881]

>>18201674
The original guide is. He updated it in 2005 and then scrapped it. But the screenshot is from the third version, on a new site, released 2019.

[Anonymous No.18201883]

>>18197129
>(gasp!)

[Anonymous No.18202022]

>>18193167
>Music began to die around the year 2000
If this statement is true then you can pretty much put the death of music down to the Oligopoly of companies who own radio stations (and what could be loosely termed the music industry establishment). They foisted a false counterculture onto the 00s generation through nu-metal bands such as Limp Bizkit because they thought that was what people wanted to hear over whoever would have been the authentic successor of 90s counterculture. Combine this with the recession in 07/08 and you have a generation of creatives moving into regular jobs instead of taking risks being creative.
In the same way that EA thinks singleplayer games are going out of fashion, that same oligopoly thinks anything with guitars in it has gone out of fashion and now won't even entertain such genres, which is why rap (the other main subculture developing from the 90s as you mentioned) has been so prevalent for the last decade.
>There isn't much we can invent anymore
Using genres is a very imperfect metric since genres are only created after the fact, so you'd have to wait for genres that have been created very recently to gain recognition. Who's to say there's not a lot of intra genre creativity vs the inter genre creativity your metric dictates as it's only standard?
If the number of genres left to be invented to fill gaps in your chart is limited perhaps you can enumerate them?
>Young people are arguably the driving force behind music innovation
This is a fairly romanticized notion, although I also partially buy into it as above. Most young people from the 60s were not hippies, most young people in the 70s didn't fight in 'Nam, most young people in the 80s didn't listen to michael jackson etc etc. DaVinci wasn't considered a good artist until he was almost 50, innovation could conceivably come from anywhere.
>what I said here does not describe the entire youth experience of the 1940s and 1950s
Exactly. But you forget that there is nothing new under the sun, and that most inventions are reinventions of the old. No one will ever wake up one day and think "Their is nothing new left to listen to."
>young people desperately want to dissociate from their older folks by listening to different music
Peoples musical taste is inherited somewhat reliably from their parents. Listening to music to fit in goes against the desire for authentic innovation.
>>18193353
Brokencyde were awful but also ahead of their time. That style of rap dominates the 10s, they were just an entire decade ahead of the curve.

[Anonymous No.18202104]

>>18193162
I'm listening to Nazeem (the annoying Skyrim Redguard) rap about his farm. You can't say there's nothing new under the sun

[Anonymous No.18202197]

>>18199458
I think it has potential as an interesting tool. I heard an "album" on youtube where some guy trained an AI on The Beatles discography. What it came up with was kind of uncanny, it definitely sounded like the source material but it was full of melodic and harmonic ideas that most musicians would never come up with because they don't make intuitive sense. Combining that with human input/curation could result in some amazing stuff.

>>18200985
>folk is the music of the more serious elements of farmer or fishermen communities
>Maybe about 10%
You're just making shit up

>>18201697
"Microgenres" boomed in the 2010s though

[Anonymous No.18202334]

>>18202197
>Combining that with human input/curation could result in some amazing stuff.

This is the first time the idea of AI-generated art has sounded like a good idea to me. Instead of getting the AI to shit out content by itself, use it to create weird musical/artistic/literary prompts which are then taken and fleshed out by a person.

[Anonymous No.18202337]

>>18202197
>"Microgenres" boomed in the 2010s though
not according to op's chart

[Anonymous No.18202376]

>>18202334
As of now this is how AI is actually being used to make music.

>>18202337
OPs chart is full of shit

[Anonymous No.18202423]

>>18202376
>As of now this is how AI is actually being used to make music.

I'm glad, but I don't have much faith in peoples ability to know when enough is enough when it comes to AI. Especially when there's potential money to be made. I have a bad feeling it will be 1% people using it creatively and 99% companies training AI on whatever the latest trend is, leading to some kind of insane feedback loop where we have AI being trained on content made my AI.

[Anonymous No.18202453]

Does that Pendulum line straight up refer to the band? I agree they're unique in d&b but idk if they're their own genre

[Anonymous No.18202460]

Post-modern music is just pure pastiche -- a thousand fragmented sparks that threaten to become a flame, but are instead extinguished, or sublimated. It's like a process of trial and error writ large, with the dregs being mixed together into a grey, mystery meat lowest common denominator that can easily be consumed by the masses. If the primary purpose of music is to sell records, then its no wonder that music would be reduced to something formulaic that can perfectly captivate our attentions (or some other such pretentious nonsense).

[Anonymous No.18202462]

>>18194199
There's a shitton of new good music and new good movies but for some reason the people complaining always ignore them

[Anonymous No.18202555]

>>18202337
>>18202376
>>18202197
OP here.

the chart is right. it just omits the microgenres of the 2010s completely because it's just too embarrassing

[Anonymous No.18202719]

Every generation has thought that they’ve exhausted all artistic possibilities. It is not until something revolutionary comes along that we realize how wrong we were, and even if that thing comes in our lifetime we would not be able to appreciate it fully. Hindsight is a privilege we have over the past so we can easily analyze it. We can’t do that with music that’s being produced everyday, things must set in. As much as I don’t like Hyperpop, as much as I don’t give a shit about the new popular artists, I’ll always keep myself open to the possibility that maybe they’re the defining artists of our generation. I’ll never like Eilish, 100 gecs, Dua Lipa, XCX, Bad Bunny, etc. Because I’ve tried them and realized it really isn’t for me anymore, but they are defining this era’s youth. It is not until 10 or 20 years from now that we’ll be able to look back and see just how much of them was revolutionary.

[Anonymous No.18202780]

Sounds like you're incredibly out of touch with current music production and trends.
Both Oneohtrix Point Never and John Maus, two of the greatest original artistic talents (in or out of music) of at least the past 30 years, both have their best releases after 2010. They both produce what can be considered "mainstream music" (despite John's recent PR fiascos), with millions of listeners. OPN (Daniel Lopatin) produces for/collaborates with The Weeknd, who played the Superbowl halftime show last year.
Also, the billboards have always been shit, with freak occurrences of talent topping them. This has always been the case, and won't change now.

>>18193193
>/mu/ knows anything about anything
This guy is stupid, but at least /lit/ will take the time to laugh at him

[Anonymous No.18202811]

>>18202780
>Both Oneohtrix Point Never and John Maus, two of the greatest original artistic talents (in or out of music) of at least the past 30 years, both have their best releases after 2010.
OP here

lol no

maus's best album remains the songs

[Anonymous No.18202814]

>>18194242
>similar breadth of knowledge
Clearly.
>over 2x younger
Clearly.

[Anonymous No.18202958]

>>18202197
I mean im fine with artists incorporating mild ai into their music. autehcre already does that I believe

[Anonymous No.18202964]

>>18202719
to be fair, as a boomer who defends todays music, I wouldn't consider any of those artists to be the top tier or what genuine music heads are super into. 100 gecs and xcx are cool but not the best hyper pop

[Anonymous No.18202970]

>>18202964
sorry, I meant zoomer

[Anonymous No.18202986]

>>18193162
Originality is extremely overrated and for some reason the pseud's eternal obsession.

[Anonymous No.18203025]

Is there any artform that isn't dead? Is there any hope for someone with creative urges? Is there any hope for anything?

[Anonymous No.18203087]

>>18193162
I think more chronological distance is needed to better judge a period of time.

[Anonymous No.18203151]

>>18194199
I guess I'll be the only person to respond to this.
>favorite album
Impossible question, obviously, but in the context of contemporary music, I guess I'll answer something quick. Probably A Love Supreme. It's just as good as any hymn, and often more transcendent. Listening to it alone, in the dark, is like handling snakes in God's presence.
>most recent album to feel like an interesting work of art
Last one to really, really strike me was probably the Uncut Gems soundrack by Lopatin. He's really something special, and he came into his own with this: more than any other musician, he breaks the musical dimension and brings it into space. It has a physicality that's incredible--you can feel (in stereo, obviously) the music warping around you exactly in the way he wants you to, in a way that transcends the normal idea of stereophonic music--that is, making it as true to a "live" performance as possible. Here, it's as if the music is issuing from clouds and sheets of light that surround you, shafts that strike you a la St. Sebastian, that pendulum between your temples and whir about your head like a halo.
>do you follow any music news
No.
>which albums released in 2021 have you listened to
A few, GY,BE's release, the new Pharaoh Sanders are the memorable ones. Too soon to tell what I think, frankly.
>top 5 albums from 2020
Still too early.
>top 5 albums from the 2010s
Uh, first that come to mind:
Steve Reich -- Pulse/Quartet
John Maus -- We Must Become the Pitiless Censors of Ourselves
Ernst Reijseger-- Cave of Forgotten Dreams
Ichiko Aoba -- qp (or Joanna Newsom -- Divers, but probably because I'm an incorrigible lover of beautiful women with angelic voices)
Daughters -- You Can't Get What You Want