/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.17962624]

Hahaha, very proud! So long western civilization!

[Anonymous No.17962634]

The Iliad is better anyway

[Anonymous No.17962640]

>>17962624
Hahahaha we did it fellow Jews we got another book removed haha!!

[Anonymous No.17962648]

Nobody with a shitty, reactionary, regressive take on the classics in the classroom today actually knows a GODDAMN THING about literacy or the point to English instruction in public schools. Hint, dumbasses: it's NOT to churn out English majors. We teach English to foster reading & writing in young people's lives, to guide them to mastery of skills they really need, to instill in them a love for and ability to use written language that will last them a lifetime. We don't need the old books y'all fools love for that.

In fact, studies have shown repeatedly that forcing kids to read work well outside their zone of proximal development, books that have no relevance to children's lives, actually HAMPERS their literacy. It raises their affective filter, turning them AGAINST reading & writing. This is especially true for children from communities of color, where different dialects of English or different languages may be the principal means of communicating.

Literature that isn't even written in the PRESENT-DAY VERNACULAR / TARGET DIALECT consigns them to failure. THERE IS NOTHING INHERENTLY IMPORTANT ABOUT YOUR GODDAMN FAVORITE CLASSICS. Have you read THE TALE OF GENJI? JOURNEY TO THE WEST? POPOL VUH? RAMAYANA? NO? Then please shut the fuck up. You know a tiny fucking SLIVER of the world's literature, ignorant assholes. You disgusting worms, I can read in TWELVE DIFFERENT LANGUAGES. I have a MA in English and a doctorate in Education and EVEN I think that the "classics" are shit for modern kids. You're not on my level, trust me. So take a MOTHERFUCKING SEAT & leave my people alone.

Your supercilious, privileged, frankly RACIST tirades against middle-grade and young-adult literature come from a place of DEEP IGNORANCE about the books that have been written over the past 30 years by writers that could MOP THE FUCKING FLOOR with your out-dated asses. The teachers you're attacking? Fools, they KNOW PEDAGOGY. They understand that their job is to TEACH KIDS TO READ, deeply and critically, and then to set those kids free in the world to dive into the books THEY choose, not what your simple-minded adherence to custom dictates.

They need literacy, not to conform to your egregiously backwards notions of literary quality, BUT TO LIBERATE THEMSELVES FROM PEOPLE LIKE YOU!!! Written language is a tool. A tool we wield: to carve our happiness out of the crude stuff of reality, to stave off the darkness of existential despair, to fight against those who would snuff out our spark, our essential dignity & humanity, to assert our right to EXIST in the face of fools like you.

So curl up with the books you love & let us help young people discover the ones THEY love. They won't be the same titles, I'm afraid. Millions of books exist. We're not sticking to the few dozen you've declared holy writ. Our kids deserve more. They deserve freedom.

[Anonymous No.17962650]

>>17962624
It's not like they were reading the real Odyssey anyway. They would need to learn ancient Greek for that first

[Anonymous No.17962652]

>>17962624
leftism is anti-civilization. but not in the cool kaczynski way, but in the disgusting fat-black-trannies around the campfire "sharing" kind of way. this is fundamental to leftism.

[Anonymous No.17962653]

Is Handmaids Tale taught in schools like I've been hearing?

[Anonymous No.17962661]

>>17962624
>western civilization
Fiction

[Anonymous No.17962677]

i love modern anti racist education

[Anonymous No.17962688]

>>17962648
I love how this basically just admits their shit teachers. Tell me how for centuries classics like the Iliad and Odyssey were important parts of any (with access to education) person’s early education if kids can’t handle it?

[Anonymous No.17962693]

>>17962648
>3 minutes after thread is posted
This is OP posting bait pasted from Reddit

[Anonymous No.17962826]

The anti-bias approach is about actively taking steps to change education so as to counter the effects of inequality and produce better members of society.
>>17962688
>were important parts of any (with access to education) person’s early education if kids can’t handle it?
Were they actually important parts of children's education? Sure teaching the classes gives children an appreciation for their own literary culture, but they can do this at home or in the later years of their schooling. Surely there are far more relevant and better texts out there for engaging young students in reading to produce lifelong reading habits and engagement?

[Anonymous No.17962827]

Why do they always have THOSE surnames huh?

[Anonymous No.17962846]

>>17962826
>to more efficiently and completely indoctrinate them

[Anonymous No.17962864]

>>17962624
I can’t wait until KARA BOGA warbands kill all these faggots after civilization collapses

[Anonymous No.17962873]

answer the question faggots

>>17962728

[Anonymous No.17962880]

>>17962624
God help us

[Anonymous No.17962888]

>>17962648
Have you tried excluding the results for whites only? Surely you'll see the opposite result to this.

[Anonymous No.17962889]

>>17962846
The thing you have to realise is that bringing children up on a diet of the classics is also a kind of indoctrination. It just has different goals and outcomes. Do you actually want to live in a more moralistic society where people respect one anothers humanity, and strive for academic excellence?

[Anonymous No.17962916]

>>17962624
>A movement to rebuild the literary canon using an antibias, antiracist critical literacy
How is it possible for someone to be this much of a moron? Whenever I see people advocating antibias, antiracism, and so on, I remember that part from the Unabomber Manifesto:
>Feminists are desperately anxious to prove that women are as strong and as capable as men. Clearly they are nagged by a fear that women may NOT be as strong and as capable as men.
Leftists are so obsessed with equalizing everything, disregarding important criteria in the process. Absolutely absurd.
>inb4 Kaczynski ywnbaw stupid manifesto
I'm not saying Kaczynski is right about everything, nor that his writings are original, but he compiled a nice set of ideas in a short text; the parts on leftism in particular are absolutely spot on, the other parts are debatable.

>>17962653
>implying
Posting on twitter how reading the classics doesn't make you a better person doesn't make you a better person. And saying that the classics are unimportant and outdated doesn't make you a better person. Why do they have to be such smartasses?

>>17962826
>Were they actually important parts of children's education?
Yes, they were.
>but they can do this at home or in the later years of their schooling
At home, that's kind of ridiculous. In the later years of their schooling, that can make sense.
>Surely there are far more relevant and better texts out there for engaging young students in reading to produce lifelong reading habits and engagement?
That is debatable, and I agree with you to an extent; some books are too difficult for a middleschooler or highschooler to understand, but are they worse and less relevant than other works? No.

>ANTI-BIAS
This pure nonsense, there is no such thing as anti-bias, everything is biased, and by putting equal measure of gay, trans, women, black, and white male literature you are disregarding the actual quality. Yes, women and minorities were getting fucked for the past couple millennia, but now we finally have equal opportunities for writing literature, and we should support people to write good books, not try to throw out old good books and put some other ones in their place. Perhaps, in my opinion probably, in the near future there will be a great number of high quality literature produced by women and minorities, but by fucking around with the western canon you are achieving nothing.

[Anonymous No.17962922]

>>17962889
>indoctrination
into civilization and culture, not screeching chimp outs and degeneracy and nigger monkey entitlement and being tools of leftists.

[Anonymous No.17962929]

>>17962826
>anti-bias approach
>have clear bias

What did he mean by this?

>to counter the effects of inequality and produce better members of society.
>effects of inequality

What effects, specifically? And how does removing a book directly affect this? And since when is the school the place of parenting? Since when is it the place for psychological counseling, rather than learning?

I largely just see narcissists marketing themselves and am truly unsure if their intention is what they say it is. Eitherway, a child will learn more from playing with his friends than a middle-aged Twitterati.

[Anonymous No.17963027]

>>17962929
>What effects, specifically? And how does removing a book directly affect this? And since when is the school the place of parenting? Since when is it the place for psychological counseling, rather than learning?
Classic texts often reinforce ideas about rigid social heirarchies. A feminist reading of many classic texts would critique the lack of power women have over their own destinies.
Texts are products of their society and in turn reproduce society. Books are admittedly a pretty small piece of the puzzle, but I think they can be useful to get students to be critical and ask questions about why things are a certain way, why they are portrayed a certain way, and who benefits from controlling the narrative. If we look at ideas from Bourdieu, we can say that books are a form of social capital, and in particular by claiming that there is a classical canon, power groups in society can claim certain ideas as more valid than others.
Schools have always been contested zones dude. They have often been places for indoctrinating students into good little workers. You ask whether school should take the role of parenting and it is a good question. Simply put, parenting fails children. Where are the parents? They're at work 40 hours a week, and so the remit falls onto schools to facilitate children's ability to participate in society and think critically. What you fail to realise is that this stuff is learning. A child's ability to learn is greatly tied to their wellbeing. Creating educational spaces in which ALL children feel a sense of wellbeing and belonging is instrumental in supporting learning to take place. I would trust that teachers implementing an anti-bias reading approach in their classrooms which be encouraging students to offer their own perspectives and insights, not just embrace a monolithic feel-good take.
>>17962922
Whose civilisation and culture? Basically, we live in a pluralistic world. And either we create spaces where everyone can participate and build towards the future. Or shit is fucked and everything breaks down into sectarian conflict and social divide.
>>17962916
I will agree with you that a lot of anti-bias approaches are basically shooting in the dark and hoping to hit something.
>Yes, women and minorities were getting fucked for the past couple millennia, but now we finally have equal opportunities for writing literature, and we should support people to write good books, not try to throw out old good books and put some other ones in their place.
The last last little bit of creating equal opportunities for writing literature involves actually holding texts from other worldviews are equally valid, and not just adding them in as another genre or category.

[Anonymous No.17963056]

>>17962916
I just had a look at the blog for this disrupttexts group, and in one of their posts, even they were saying that we shouldn't get rid of all classic novels from the syllabus, but rather teach them in new ways.

[Anonymous No.17963064]

>>17962826
>produce better members of society
This combination of words really seems sinister but it wouldn't register as such to the average person.

[Anonymous No.17963084]

>>17963056
>but rather teach them in new ways.
Like saying everything is racist and bad and you shouldn't respect Aristotle cause he was a shitlord?

[Anonymous No.17963089]

>>17963027
>holding texts from other worldviews are equally valid, and not just adding them in as another genre or category.
Absolutely agree with you here.
>>17963056
My bad for assuming they want to get rid of the classics, it's the vibe I got from the picture.

[Anonymous No.17963117]

>>17963027
>Whose civilisation and culture?
europeans obviously.
>everyone can participate and build towards the future
lie. leftists are excluding and tearing down europeans and european civilization and culture. "everyone" here means grifters and mediocrities and select leftist pet populations.

anyway to the extent that "everyone can participate and build towards the future" can be realized it means aggressively asserting europe. if you can't conform you can leave.
>shit is fucked and everything breaks down into sectarian conflict and social divide.
shit already looks pretty fucked to me with the niggers in the streets and the leftists tearing down statues and crying about everything historically european. conflict and divide are prevented by undisputed superiority.

kill yourself tranny. you will never pass.

[Anonymous No.17963141]

>>17962889
Not really. Introducing them to classics provides them with insights into the difficulty of life and acknowledges its ambiguities. Reading James Baldwin and whatever YA novel is trendy this month gives you a set of questions, the answers, and calls it a day.

[Anonymous No.17963186]

>>17962648
Your idiocy is beyond comprehension. I’m all for maximising literacy as an objective function, but there is an evolutionary aspect to texts that have stood the test of time that you are entirely discounting. There’s a reason that the Odyssey is still being read today thousands of years after it’s inception and these writers that you speak of from the past 30 years won’t be.

Your saying these teachers understand pedagogy. They don’t. They are entirely motivated by untested political beliefs that will severely hamper the education of our youth and anyone with 2 braincells to rub together can see that. If communities of colour are disproportionately affected by hampered literacy rates because of differences in dialect, then the solution is introducing them to literature earlier not removing the Odyssey from their curriculums. I don’t even think you see how ironically racist your statement is. Instead of equipping poc kids with a toolset that they have been deprived of socioeconomically to eventually tackle books like the Odyssey, you think it would be better to confine them to a subset of the literary paths they could choose to explore from. So much for “our kids deserve more; they deserve freedom”.

The limits of one’s language are the limits of one’s world. The utility of literacy is more Wittgenstein and not so much the nauseatingly pseudo-egalitarian bullshit you’re saying about “liberation” and “happiness”. It serves an analytical and tangible function comrade. Do you want a society that can describe the world in 144p or in 4k? The fact is, no matter how intuitive or consciously discernible, some things are just too complex to be said simply and this is why a large vocabulary and the ability to communicate a narrative effectively are important among other things.

[Anonymous No.17963198]

>>17963186
Bro. That was a bait copypasta.

[Anonymous No.17963203]

>>17963084
eg. consider how this text portrays 'x' value.
>>17963089
I think they probably would still want more new texts, but their initial broad statements do read a bit stronger than their elaborations.

[Anonymous No.17963227]

Can't we just get rid of the U.S. already?

[Anonymous No.17963228]

>>17962624
Good, next burn the Parthenon, so it saves me the time of doing so.

[Anonymous No.17963230]

>>17963141
I think there is probably a middle ground here somewhere. Classics have stood the test of time, but challenging them is a good additional test as to whether or not they do hold value over something else.
>>17963117
I think about my own context, and a lot of people don't give a shit about european culture and civilisation - because they don't come from europe. So teachers, who have a professional obligation to teach all of their students, do need to come up with ways to either engage students in existing classic texts, or some up with a canon that has a broader appeal for all students.

[Anonymous No.17963239]

>>17962648
You didn't have to yell at me....

[Anonymous No.17963250]

>>17962624
Literally who cares. Lies collapse under their own weight

[Anonymous No.17963252]

>>17962864
Same

[Anonymous No.17963279]

>>17963230
>So teachers, who have a professional obligation to teach all of their students
They don't. They have an obligation to teach what they're told to teach. The students have an obligation to learn it. They have no obligation to teach african dances in european history classes no matter who they're teaching.
>either engage students in existing classic texts
Try actually teaching them. Not kvetch about their being toxic. That will work on the bright and studious kids. As long as there are leftists like you, the other kids will blame their failure on muh oppresshun and leftist grifters will see their oppurtunity. That doesn't matter.

[Anonymous No.17963328]

>>17963230
>I think there is probably a middle ground here somewhere. Classics have stood the test of time, but challenging them is a good additional test as to whether or not they do hold value over something else.
There isn't. The classics have established value, and what's being proposed is a single minded propaganda campaign to make pressure kids into adopting a particular political position and a cynical, utilitarian view of art and culture. If what's being proposed is designed to transform you into a shallow person, then it has a clear negative value.

[Anonymous No.17963344]

>>17962916
>Leftists are so obsessed with equalizing everything, disregarding important criteria in the process. Absolutely absurd.
What fucking criteria??

[Anonymous No.17963348]

>>17962624
They stay winning, you stay mad. As it should be.

[Anonymous No.17963351]

>>17963279
>They don't
In my jurisdiction, it is a professional obligation to ensure that the teacher considers the best interest of every child and affords them opportunities to participate. Of course, whether or not this actually happens is a bit difficult to assess. And yes, teachers do have to teach the curriculum. eg:
>Students engage with a variety of texts for enjoyment. They listen to, read, view, interpret and evaluate spoken, written and multimodal texts in which the primary purpose is aesthetic, as well as texts designed to inform and persuade. These include various types of media texts including newspapers, film and digital texts, junior and early adolescent novels, poetry, non-fiction and dramatic performances. Students develop their understanding of how texts, including media texts, are influenced by context, purpose and audience.
According to this curriculum, teachers also have to ensure that each subject area allows for the consideration and inclusion of different cultural perspectives. But I acknowledge that this is going to vary according to country, school and teacher.

I think there is something powerful and liberating for students in learning about different social, cultural, political and economic forces which impact their participation in society. I think by being aware of potential difficulty, an individual can actively work to counter its influence on their own life.

[Anonymous No.17963360]

>>17963328
>The classics have established value
To a certain group of people. Which is the whole debate. These classics are not universally valuable for all people and in all contexts. The classics are valuable for middle and upper class europeans, as it gives context to the beginning of their own literary traditions.

[Anonymous No.17963426]

>>17963351
Your laws were made by leftists. Your curricula were made by leftists. I disagree with both of them just as I disagree with the leftism in the OP.
>I think there is something powerful and liberating for students in learning about different social, cultural, political and economic forces which impact their participation in society
Meaningless leftist platitudes.

[Anonymous No.17963455]

>>17963360
Complete destruction. Because some illiterate groid nigger doesn't care about european philosophy, universities should no longer teach anything at all (other than leftist grievance studies of course).

[Anonymous No.17963477]

>>17962648
Nobody with a shitty, reactionary, regressive take on the classics in the classroom today actually knows a GODDAMN THING about literacy or the point to English instruction in public schools. Hint, dumbasses: it's NOT to churn out English majors. We teach English to foster reading & writing in young people's lives, to guide them to mastery of skills they really need, to instill in them a love for and ability to use written language that will last them a lifetime. We don't need the old books y'all fools love for that.

In fact, studies have shown repeatedly that forcing kids to read work well outside their zone of proximal development, books that have no relevance to children's lives, actually HAMPERS their literacy. It raises their affective filter, turning them AGAINST reading & writing. This is especially true for children from communities of color, where different dialects of English or different languages may be the principal means of communicating.

Literature that isn't even written in the PRESENT-DAY VERNACULAR / TARGET DIALECT consigns them to failure. THERE IS NOTHING INHERENTLY IMPORTANT ABOUT YOUR GODDAMN FAVORITE CLASSICS. Have you read THE TALE OF GENJI? JOURNEY TO THE WEST? POPOL VUH? RAMAYANA? NO? Then please shut the fuck up. You know a tiny fucking SLIVER of the world's literature, ignorant assholes. You disgusting worms, I can read in TWELVE DIFFERENT LANGUAGES. I have a MA in English and a doctorate in Education and EVEN I think that the "classics" are shit for modern kids. You're not on my level, trust me. So take a MOTHERFUCKING SEAT & leave my people alone.

Your supercilious, privileged, frankly RACIST tirades against middle-grade and young-adult literature come from a place of DEEP IGNORANCE about the books that have been written over the past 30 years by writers that could MOP THE FUCKING FLOOR with your out-dated asses. The teachers you're attacking? Fools, they KNOW PEDAGOGY. They understand that their job is to TEACH KIDS TO READ, deeply and critically, and then to set those kids free in the world to dive into the books THEY choose, not what your simple-minded adherence to custom dictates.

They need literacy, not to conform to your egregiously backwards notions of literary quality, BUT TO LIBERATE THEMSELVES FROM PEOPLE LIKE YOU!!! Written language is a tool. A tool we wield: to carve our happiness out of the crude stuff of reality, to stave off the darkness of existential despair, to fight against those who would snuff out our spark, our essential dignity & humanity, to assert our right to EXIST in the face of fools like you.

So curl up with the books you love & let us help young people discover the ones THEY love. They won't be the same titles, I'm afraid. Millions of books exist. We're not sticking to the few dozen you've declared holy writ. Our kids deserve more. They deserve freedom.

[Anonymous No.17963512]

>>17962648
Simultaneously based and cringe

[Anonymous No.17963996]

>>17962624
And then when the next generation of kids comes through this imageboard.
>There is no white culture what are you talking about

[Anonymous No.17964082]

>>17963186
Just wanted to say it was a good comeback.

[Anonymous No.17964168]

>>17962653

It does though.

[Anonymous No.17964250]

>>17962624
The more I saw this kind of bullshit the more I need to read that Ted K. book

[Anonymous No.17964257]

>>17962653
Lmao yes it does. There are no equivalent or replacement to Plato, Aristotle, St. Augustine, and all the endless authors that lived by their ideas

[Anonymous No.17964260]

>>17963996
It's true, future generations will be completely and totally ignorant of Western/European cultural heritage

[Anonymous No.17964268]

>>17962653
It does by proxy, that's why they are the classics.

[Anonymous No.17964270]

>>17962648
Suck a dick faggot.

[Anonymous No.17964279]

>>17962624
Shut up Britisher cocksucker, Western civilization is a meme invented by the EIC.

[Anonymous No.17964290]

>>17964279
WTF I love the East India Company now.

[Anonymous No.17964299]

>>17962624
anti-racists are violent, dangerous lunatics
I have no idea why anyone would listen to them.
we need to start making lists of anti-racists and encourage terrorists to violently attack them
I’m 100% serious. Encouraging attacks on anti-racist is legal. Viewing anti-racists as people who don’t have the authority to benefit from law and order is a serious narrative that the Republican party can develop and spread throughout the USA.

[Anonymous No.17964300]

>>17962624
(((Levine)))

[Anonymous No.17964306]

>>17964299
(((anti-racists)))

[Anonymous No.17964314]

>>17963426
(((leftists)))

>>17963351
This is a jew.

[Anonymous No.17964322]

>>17964299
Yeah theyre getting to pretty unhinged levels. Not even a secret that anti racist just straight up means you hate white people at this point and hate all the gay ass gaslighting they do about this fact

[Anonymous No.17964335]

>>17962634
This. Why the fuck do we have to read the Odyssey instead of the Iliad?

[Anonymous No.17964340]

I do wonder if it might be better to assign specially written children's and young adult literature in primary and secondary school instead of the classics. I say this because we have lately gotten a much better understanding of developmental psychology than when these works were written, and it would be a huge coincidence if Homer and Shakespeare were exactly the right works to assign in order to best develop the verbal reasoning skills of adolescents, when this wasn't even the purpose for which those works were written. And if what we really care about when we assign Homer is to teach students the facts of the stories, e.g. that Odysseus spent twenty years away from Ithaka, then we can convey those facts in adaptations written to be suitable for high school classrooms. If reading is a skill, then we should look at it like other skills, for example playing basketball. In order to get good at playing basketball, you don't just play a bunch of basketball games. If you truly want to excel, you spend most of your time rather shooting free throws, lifting weights, running, and practicing set plays and special scenarios, because playing full-length games doesn't give you a chance to develop the skills and abilities you need to be a good player. I think assigning kids unadulterated Homer might be like having them play full-length basketball games before they've practiced shooting or dribbling.

[Anonymous No.17964342]

>>17962624
The anti-racists think they can abuse law enforcement to demoralize the people they have demonized: the so-called racists. The courts know this. Law enforcement knows this. The Academy has absolutely no clue what is going on. The people who should be studying the negative outcomes of anti-racism were victims of academic bullying. As a result, the Academy lacks sufficient strength to study anti-racism seriously. The anti-racists will continue destroying the Academy if they aren’t stopped. The Republican party can save the Academy. in order to be worthy of such salvation, the Academy must stop pressuring its members (professors staff students) to spread far-left propaganda. Here is someone who should be targeted by anti-left violence: a certain notable professor at UC Berkeley I have in mind. UC Berkeley is notorious For tolerating violent left-wing para military organizations. UC Berkeley is ground zero for the infiltration of the Academy by left-wing terrorists.

[Anonymous No.17964349]

>>17962648
>the classics
>in english
LA-MAO

[Anonymous No.17964359]

>>17962648
They don't teach kids to rationally engage with the text, but deconstruct them instead. All that critical theory does is try to invalidate those authors by questioning their motives, psychology, and whatever beliefs they held that were indicative of their time. It's the equivalent of flipping the chessboard over when losing the game.

[Anonymous No.17964384]

>>17962624
I know this may sound insane, but mutilating professors in the Academy and murdering anyone in law-enforcement who attempts to interfere with such mutilation is a reasonable strategy for attacking anti-racists. By mutilating the professors and forcing them to stay alive, the entire world will be terrorized. The anti-racists are part of a far left terrorist organization. By mutilating their allies in the Academy, the anti-racists will become weak and cowardly. This will make the anti-racists much easier to attack in the future. As a matter of efficiency, the desired outcome is mass anti-racist suicides. That may seem like a far away off, but a few signature acts of mutilation and forcing the mutilated to stay alive can go a long way. The trick is exploring the capacity of the imagination to produce the effect of demoralization.

[Anonymous No.17964392]

>>17962624
there seems to be a trend to make it seem reasonable to give the anti-racist everything that they want. This is known as “appeasement“ and it is the disastrous strategy chamberlain used on Hitler. Now, one could say that appeasement has been totally destroyed as a reasonable strategy, So why would anyone think it is reasonable to appease anti-racists?

[Anonymous No.17964396]

>>17962916
but Ted was right about everything

[Anonymous No.17964409]

>>17962624
change will happen when law enforcement is forced to stand down while anti-racists are violently attacked. The alternative to appeasing anti-racists is attacking them violently and making it impossible for law-enforcement to originate criminal charges for such violent attacks. This can be done through changes in Law that strip anti-racists of The right to personal safety and other civil rights. Such changes can be made by Congress. The path to making such changes involves getting leverage over Congress.

[Anonymous No.17964439]

>>17964396
Women are extremely nasty and will tell lies in order to destroy the reputation of men for the sake of gaining clout among other women. I know this may sound harsh, but I would never trust a woman. If you want to contact the cycle of life, just rape a woman and force her to take care of the child. The correct way to reproduce is by raping women. Everything else encourages antisocial behavior in the woman. It is heedless to leave yourself unprotected from women. They will sense it and attack you because this is how women alter their position in the social hierarchy. The woman sees you as a means of attaining a higher social position. Women are basically not human beings. They are insane, violent psychos.

[Anonymous No.17964543]

>>17962648
>Have you read THE TALE OF GENJI? JOURNEY TO THE WEST? POPOL VUH? RAMAYANA? NO? Then please shut the fuck up. You know a tiny fucking SLIVER of the world's literature, ignorant assholes. You disgusting worms, I can read in TWELVE DIFFERENT LANGUAGES. I have a MA in English and a doctorate in Education and EVEN I think that the "classics" are shit for modern kids. You're not on my level, trust me.
this. why get butthurt about some kids not reading the illiad when absolutely nobody complaining about this shit has actually read even the slightest fraction of world literature, not least because they're too busy sitting on fucking 4chan reading your post to begin with. stop coming to this board for a week, come back for a week, stop for a week, what have any of you lost? some of you have been reading posts on this board for over a decade, and what came from any of it? this is like eating a hamburger while feeling heartwarmed watching a guy save a dog from drowning. posters on this board need literally to just look in a mirror.

[Anonymous No.17964610]

>>17962648
>>17964543

[Anonymous No.17964615]

if the odyssey wasn't removed people would suffer as a direct result of it. of course the odyssey being removed has made people suffer. all in all more suffering on the human race is a net positive.

[Anonymous No.17964629]

>>17962916
>>17964168
>>17964257
>>17964268
Assuming the average /lit/ user DOES read the "Classics", then why are all of you insufferable aspies?

[Anonymous No.17964644]

>>17962826
>Surely there are far more relevant and better texts out there for engaging young students in reading to produce lifelong reading habits and engagement?
Such as?

Anyways, whenever this discussion comes up, I can't help but refer to Francine Prose's prescient essay "I Know Why the Caged Bird Cannot Read" that was published ~20 years ago now.

https://nj01001216.schoolwires.net/cms/lib/NJ01001216/Centricity/Domain/82/i-know-why-the-caged-bird-cannot-read.pdf

It speaks directly to these questions. I doubt that it would be published today, and if it were it certainly wouldn't be published in Harpers.

[Anonymous No.17964652]

>>17962648
suck a cock

[Anonymous No.17964670]

>>17962648
What's the point of teaching kids how to read and write if they are not educated enough to have anything meaningful to contemplate.and right about?

[Anonymous No.17964704]

>>17962648
kek

[Anonymous No.17964716]

>>17962624
(((Levine)))

[Anonymous No.17964718]

>>17962648
This is David Bowles, the guy who wrote this post.

[Anonymous No.17964724]

>>17964670
>if they are not educated enough to have anything meaningful to contemplate.and right about?
oh, but they are! they're educated enough to contemplate spreadsheets, and write reports! how wonderful is that!

[Anonymous No.17964726]

>>17963186
This was a nice response

[Anonymous No.17964751]

>>17963027
>Basically, we live in a pluralistic world. And either we create spaces where everyone can participate and build towards the future. Or shit is fucked and everything breaks down into sectarian conflict and social divide.
>We live in a pluralistic world
>We need to create spaces where the smallest groups are cemented in the social fabric of society
>we need to exalt the differences of every group irrespective of their size, relevance, orthodoxy, and general popular acceptance
>we need to do this because it will lessen the probability of social divides drawn exactly along the lines that we create and subsequently cement functionally making violence less visible by making the problem more visible
Good God anon, this is so discontinuous its laughable. I generally agree with what you're saying but if you cannot see the lack of rigour in your motivations—and the pure folly of perpetuating artifical divides in a climate of democracy and capitalism—you're mistaking stars reflected in a pond for the night sky. Think, please think, what system(s) (generally thought to be tautologous in historical developmental philosophy) benefit from pluralism

[Anonymous No.17964881]

>>17963186
>I don’t even think you see how ironically racist your statement is. Instead of equipping poc kids with a toolset that they have been deprived of socioecono... blah blah blah

The liberal globohomos are right. The weird brown creaturas they're importing by the Ryder truck really are too fucking stupid to read the classics. Everyone knows that, including you.


>>17964718
Pic related: every time.

[Anonymous No.17964960]

>>17962624
plot twist: she didn't do anything and lied about removing odyssey from the curriculum for twitter points

[Anonymous No.17964973]

>>17962916
Trannybomber isn't someone I'd take seriously

[Anonymous No.17965004]

>>17963360
>The classics are valuable for middle and upper class europeans, as it gives context to the beginning of their own literary traditions.
So why should they not be taught in countries which continue those same traditions?
It doesn't matter how black or brown someone is, if they live in an English dominated society, live and work in English, and think in English, they are functionally a European and trapped in a European worldview.
It's not like they read one book of Sufi poetry and suddenly understand the doctrinal nuances of al Ghazali. Distinct civilizations take thousands of years to build up, and you can't willingly remove yourself from one just by reading some books.
Its stupid to care about how alienating a particular cultural tradition might be to commoners, because it's not made for them in the first place. Rather, they have to rise to the occasion and demands of tradition.
What we have now is just the hollowing out of some of the very best aspects of European culture so it can be replaced with a disgusting American trash media-complex of softcore pornography and faux moral outrage. Pretending that this is done in the interest of black or brown people is an insult to black or brown people, and it really seems more like the elites have just decided to make white europeans the sacrificial offering for their brave new world.

[Anonymous No.17965247]

>>17962653
Yep. Read it my last year of hs. I hated that fucking teacher so much.

[Anonymous No.17965435]

>>17962648
>This is especially true for children from communities of color, where different dialects of English or different languages may be the principal means of communicating.

Don't speak for me, you pasty skinned leftoid faggot. All the books I read in highschool were YA trash that faggots like you would peddle to students, utterly unmemorable trash dealing with crude and simple emotions that I hardly even remember. It wasn't until I found /lit/ that my interest in literature was reawakened.

[Anonymous No.17965453]

>>17962648
>Reading the classics is racists and condems minority students to academic failure
Extremely based. We need less nigs in university.

[Anonymous No.17965582]

>>17964718
Holy shit this dudes real.

Libs are as bad as the Christ cucks round here.

[Anonymous No.17965730]

>>17962624
/lit/ status: BTFO
This may be one step closer to removing "literature" from any form of education.

[Anonymous No.17965758]

>>17962648
>y'all fools
Stopped reading there

[Anonymous No.17965823]

>>17962624
If you read the classics and can't see what unparalleled masterpieces they are, you're emotionally stunned or retarded

[Anonymous No.17965896]

>>17962634
fucking based and dangerous contrarianism

[Anonymous No.17966015]

>>17964960
lmao

[Anonymous No.17966216]

>>17962648
Why is it that teachers are always uncultured smooth-brains?

[Anonymous No.17966226]

>>17966216
One can't help being influenced by the group they spend their time with, and teachers spend most time of their lives with their students.

[Anonymous No.17966253]

>>17962648
end yourself you mindless faggot

[Anonymous No.17966277]

>>17962648
tl;dr but I think it is impossible to understand the history how we got to where we are today without an understanding of the past. Literature, culture and history cannot be understood without at least the Iliad and the Odyssey. I would say both of these works are indispensable even if you believe they promote reactionary beliefs.

European royal families literally claimed sovereignty because they purported to have been descended from families involved in the Trojan War. The influence of the Homeric epics permeates every single aspect of western culture.

[Anonymous No.17966287]

>>17962648

[Anonymous No.17966305]

>>17962634
The Iliad promotes homosexuality while the Odyssey is one of the most heterosexual works ever created. I simply must kneel for the odyssey. My man Odysseus just needed to get back home to creampie his beloved wife.

[Anonymous No.17966310]

>>17966287
It was actually copy pasted from a real guy on Twitter.

[Anonymous No.17966345]

>>17964314
that Du Bois quote is amazing. fantastic writing.

[Anonymous No.17966358]

>>17962648
hahaha shut the fuck you nerd XD

[Anonymous No.17966392]

Shakespeare is essential for understanding modernity. His plays are deeply psychological and form the basis of many philosophies. The transition from a medieval society to an early modern one during the Elizabethan renaissance cannot be better exemplified than with Shakespeare.

Shakespeare possibly more than anyone else, besides Martin Luther or Columbus, is more responsible for creating the modern world. I’m serious, every single famous person in history loved Shakespeare. From Freud to Goethe to Adolf Hitler to Lenin. The only person I know who openly disliked Shakespeare was Napoleon, kek

[Anonymous No.17966475]

>>17965004
They are taught in those countries. But there needs to be a bit of balance and the scope needs to be widened.
Anti-bias stuff is very grassroots in the education sector.

[Anonymous No.17966500]

What's the big deal, OP? Great books are not made lesser by being banned, burned or relegated to obscurity. In fact...

[Anonymous No.17966532]

>>17962648
So this was bait right? This can't be a serious post...
Right?

[Anonymous No.17966870]

>>17962648
Nice pasta faggot

[Anonymous No.17966956]

>>17965582
Secular liberals and Christians have the same moral code and both refuse to acknowledge it lol.

[Anonymous No.17967027]

>>17964629
You don't know me before I read them.