/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.1769373]

i need haiku recs please? thank you!

[Anonymous No.1769377]

Well, Basho is the obvious choice.

You could also look into Ihara Saikaku, Kobayashi Issa, and Buson (the later two are often paired with Basho). If you want a cheap introduction to a wide range of haiku poets, definitely get this: http://www.amazon.com/Classic-Tradition-Haiku-Anthology-Editions/dp/0486292746/

There's also an awesome four-volume haiku anthology that begins with this one: http://www.amazon.com/Haiku-Eastern-Culture-Japanese-English/dp/4590005727/

For more modern, look into Soseki's haiku.

[Anonymous No.1769385]

>inb4 someone posts the refrigerator one and proves they think haiku is only about 5-7-5 and thus revealing themselves as an imcompetent uneducated faggot

[Anonymous No.1769388]

>>1769385

Well, I could post those haikus that are in Fight Club. Take that!

[Anonymous No.1769390]

>>1769377
Oh, and to add to this - if you've already read Basho and want to go a little deeper into him, check out Matsuo Basho by Makoto Ueda. It has a /ton/ of information on him, including his biography, all his different types of poetry, his criticism, lasting influence, pretty much everything you'd ever want to know about the guy.

[Anonymous No.1769402]

dammit OP, say something.

[Anonymous No.1769403]

thank you for the recommendations >>1769390 and >>1769377 - i'm reading the book i posted in the OP pic so i get a bit of general write up and a mini explanation for each haiku at the end as well. i didn't know soseki wrote haiku. will pick up the smaller book first. the big one is tempting but kind of broke right now haha.

this thread can become Japanese literature general as well if you guys want.

[Anonymous No.1769413]

>>1769402
i'm sorry mate, i keep getting 403 errors.. have to backspace and keep trying to get through.

[Anonymous No.1769417]

>>1769403
I didn't know he did either until recently! This is the only Soseki-specific collection I know of though (it's kind of expensive too): http://www.amazon.com/Zen-Haiku-Letters-Natsume-Soseki/dp/0834803240/

Are you interested in haiku only or Japanese poetry in general? I've only read the classic stuff like the Man'yoshu poetry-wise. I've been thinking of reading the more modern poets like Kenji Miyazawa and Sakutaro Hagiwara soon though.

[Anonymous No.1769428]

>>1769417
ah. i'll hunt around in my local libraries. well, poetry and normal novels in general. i really love kusamakura by soseki. a lot of folks only talk about murakami - i love him to bits but i'm afraid of the day i finish reading all his works [in english].

[Anonymous No.1769433]

>>1769428
Well, at least Murakami is still alive! So there's at least the possibility of more books. I'm a huge lover of Kawabata, and I've been holding off on two last novels of his that I haven't read yet, since I know there won't be any more.

I've actually only read Kokoro and Botchan by Soseki, even though I own like. everything translated. Planning to read either I Am a Cat, Sanshiro, or The Miner by him sometime this summer (on top of a ton of other Japanese stuff).

[Anonymous No.1769454]

>>1769433
they're expensive to buy new and the used book stores run out of them very fast here [singapore]. i rely heavily on our local libraries. but i'm collecting the vintage Murakami books - 7 down, the rest to go - http://www.flickr.com/photos/eugchan/4232399046/

[Anonymous No.1769455]

>>1769454
er that's the edition i collect - not actually my flickr stream.

[whiterainbow No.1769460]

IMO Issa is the haiku master. Kerouac also has an excellent book of haiku.

[Anonymous No.1769468]

>>1769454
Wah, very nice! I like those a lot more than the colorful American editions. Those seem much more refined. (also I love that kitty picture you have! :D )

Here's what I own Japanese literature-wise. I've got a much less Murakami, but I'm pretty stocked in Kawabata, Mishima and those guys!

[Anonymous No.1769471]

>>1769455
Oh, hah, well it's still a cute cat!

[Anonymous No.1769482]

>>1769468
very jelly of that collection. and i need to find better thrift stores. are you a lit major specializing in japanese lit or something?

[GuyPearce !!ZtvgFSMPGNm No.1769485]

>>1769468
mfw you have The Host by Stephanie Meyer

[Anonymous No.1769487]

>>1769482
Hoping to be! I'm just a general English undergrad right now. But I want to go on to specialize in Meiji and Taisho era literature (thinking maybe at University of Michigan), and teach or something.

Of course, I don't even know Japanese yet, so. Gonna have to power through that barrier sometime soon here.

[Anonymous No.1769495]

>>1769485
>mfw you recognized it from a blurry spine picture

But nah, I haven't read it. It was like $1, so, well, I had to! /hoarder shame

[Anonymous No.1769501]

>>1769487
ah i'm an otaku and i roam /cm/ and /a/ usually. i got away from the reading habit and wanna get back in. that pesky short attention span - that's why i'm starting with the haiku. even if you're not so free, don't push off learning it.

[Anonymous No.1769515]

>>1769501
Ah! I used to be a /cm/ and /a/ person too (not included in that picture were the 500 or so volumes of manga). I haven't been so much into that the past few years though.

I'm taking classes for it, but I'm just hitting intermediate level right now. I've still got a ways before I can read most of these authors in the original. But that's why I like haiku too - if it's a dual translation edition and the words in the poem are simple enough, I can almost understand it in Japanese! Which makes me all giddy.

I have a sort of short attention span too, which I think Japanese literature tends to cater too. The majority of novels on my shelf aren't even over 250 pages, which is pretty much the perfect length for me.

[Anonymous No.1769545]

>>1769515
ah i'm collecting manga as well - not as much as i'd like - i'm just using allowances and don't work yet. i'm probably taking it this summer - weekend classes. i hate that guilty feeling of not even learning a language i love [i started getting into anime in 2008 but have been a somewhat light follower since 2001].

[Anonymous No.1769562]

Anyway, since Japanese lit general, here's what I'm reading right now!

I've already recognized several of these from Akutagawa's short stories, like Rashomon and The Nose, and others like The Tale of the Bamboo Cutter just from general knowledge. But other than that, all of these are completely new to me.

I'm about 110 pages in right now; just got to the fox-related tales. The Monk tales were by far the most hilarious, while number 57, Elimination, was the most disturbing/disgusting. ugh. I loved all the ones related to mythological beings - there are sections dedicated to tales on dragons, tengu, general gods, etc.

Going into this, I think I was expecting something more, well, divine or horror related. So far I'm getting a lot of poop jokes and sex-related mishaps (like the goddess returning two bucketfulls of semen to her cheating husband, wtf). They are still hilarious and disturbing though, especially imo because of the ancient times they were written in.

They're all rather short too - none over 4 pages so far - so they're good for quick reading inbetween other stuff. The tales get more recent as the book goes on I'm pretty sure, so it'll be interesting to see how the book progresses.

[Anonymous No.1769564]

>>1769545
I have no clue how I amassed so much, really. I'm pretty sure it was the only thing I spent my allowance money on for about 6 years. So! What are you going to college for?

[sage No.1769571]

>>1769562
coolio. i own that book but haven't read it yet.

[Anonymous No.1769597]

>>1769564
i'm studying computer engin.. mainly because i love computers not because i can do math and physics like my peers [ass kicked everyday]. it kind of adds up. i got a nice library of non-fiction stuff and engineering textbooks that i will sell when i get out of school.

>>1769562
have you read the kwaidan? http://www.sacred-texts.com/shi/kwaidan/index.htm and in ghostly japan? http://www.sacred-texts.com/shi/igj/index.htm

the ones that get me are the quiet ones where you don't expect anything.

[Anonymous No.1769836]

>>1769597
Haven't read them yet, but I do own them (along with A Japanese Miscellany by Hearn also). I think I'll be reading those next then!

[Anonymous No.1770059]

>>1769836
try this story called Mujina/badger. Creepy... I kind of avoid horror.

[Anonymous No.1770204]

a Japanese literature chart i found here - http://4chanarchive.org/brchive/dspl_thread.php5?thread_id=37691183&x=Recommendation+Charts

[Anonymous No.1770458]

>>1770204
That seems to be the precursor to this one

[Anonymous No.1770584]

>>1770458
thank you! Was wondering why there was no mishima in the smaller chart...

[Anonymous No.1770597]

This is quite simple.
I just count the syllables.
Mmm, mmm. Time for pie.

[Anonymous No.1770719]

>>1769385
What is a haiku then? It does that 5-7-5 thing in japanese...

>>1770597
Bees are bros.

[Anonymous No.1770788]

>>1770584
There's this one too!

[Anonymous No.1770793]

>>1770719
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku

enknowledge yourself. It's very much not just about how many syllables a line has.

[Anonymous No.1770840]

>>1770788
that looks gorgeous. Thank you! See the usual suspects and then some.
>>1770793
I left that article very confused and will need to revisit it again (I'm sorry mate - never taken lit beyond basic Lower secondary level). why did the american haiku people set that 5-7-5 standard instead of following the 'on' count?

[Anonymous No.1771105]

its good

[Anonymous No.1771168]

>>1771105
What is?

[Anonymous No.1772290]

up

[Anonymous No.1772863]

Bumping with this, in case anyone missed it in that other thread: http://www.learner.org/courses/worldlit/the-tale-of-genji/

Really great introduction (~26 minutes) to a lot of aspects of The Tale of Genji, with speakers like Donald Keene and Haruo Shirane!

[Anonymous No.1773373]

I'm typing up the short story The Dancing Girl of Izu by Yasunari Kawabata so I can stick it in the Japanese lit .zip. Thought I might as well post it here (if anyone cares to proofread for me, that would be nice too!).

THE DANCING GIRL OF IZU

1

About the time the road began to wind and I realized that I was finally near Amagi Pass, a curtain of rain swept up after me at a terrific speed from the foot of the mountain, painting the dense cedar forests white.

I was twenty years old. I wore my school cap, hakama over my indigo-dyed kimono, and carried a student’s bag over my shoulder. It was the fourth day of my solitary journey down the Izu Peninsula. I had stayed at Shuzenji hot Spring one night, then two nights at Yugashima. And now, wearing high clogs, I was climbing Amagi. Although I had been enchanted by the layers upon layers of mountains, the virgin forests, and the shades of autumn in the deep valleys, I was hurrying along this road, my chest pounding with a certain expectation. Before long, great drops of rain began to pelt me, and I bolted up the steep, twisted road. I was relieved to reach the teahouse on the north side of the pass at last, but stopped short in the doorway. My expectation had been realized all too splendidly. The troupe of itinerant performers was inside, taking a rest.

As soon as the dancing girl noticed me standing there, she pulled out the cushion she had been kneeling on, turned it over, and placed it near her.

“Yes.” That’s all I said before I sat down. The words “thank you” stuck in my throat. I was out of breath from running up the road and from my astonishment.

[Anonymous No.1773376]

>>1773373

Sitting so close, facing the dancing girl, I fumbled to pull a cigarette from my kimono sleeve. The girl took the ashtray sitting in front of her female companion and placed it near me. Naturally, I did not speak.

The dancing girl looked to be about seventeen years old. Her hair was arranged elaborately in an unusual old style unfamiliar to me. Although it made her striking oval face look quite small, it created a beautiful harmony. She gave the impression of the girls from illustrations in old romances who were depicted with an emphasis on their extravagant hair. The dancing girl was accompanied by a woman in her forties, two older girls, and a man of about twenty-five, who was wearing a jacket with the insignia of Nagaoka Hot Springs on it.

I had seen this troupe twice previously. The first time I encountered them, near Yugawa Bridge, I was on my way to Yugashima Hot Springs while they were going to Shuzenji. There were three girls in the group. The dancing girl was carrying a drum. After we passed, I looked back at the again and again. I had finally experienced the romance of travel. Then, my second night at Yugashima, the entertainers had come to the inn to perform. Sitting halfway down the ladderlike stairs, I had gazed intently at the girl as she danced on the wooden floor of the entryway.

“If they were at Shuzenji the other and Yugashima tonight, then they would probably go to Yugano Springs on the south side of Amagi Pass tomorrow. Surely I could catch up with them along the fifteen miles of mountain road over Amagi.” Thus I had been daydreaming as I hastened along the road that day. Now we had ended up taking shelter from the rain at the same teahouse. My heart was pounding.

[Anonymous No.1773378]

>>1773376

In a moment the old woman who ran the teahouse led me to another room. It appeared it was not used regularly and had no sliding paper doors. When I peered down into the magnificent valley outside the window, I could scarcely see the bottom. It gave me goose bumps. My teeth chattered and I shivered. The old woman came back to serve tea. I told her I felt cold.

“You’re all wet, aren’t you, sir?” She spoke with great deference. “Come in here for a while. Dry your clothes.” Reaching for my hand, she led me into her own parlor. There was a hearth in the middle of the floor of her room. When she opened the sliding door, the hot air flowed out. I stood at the threshold, hesitating. An old man sat cross-legged by the fire, his body pale and swollen like a drowning victim. He turned his languid eyes toward me. They were yellowed to the pupils as if putrefied. Around him lay piles of old letters and scraps of paper. They almost buried him. I stood stiff, staring at him, wondering how he could be alive, this mystery in the mountains.

“I’m embarrassed to have you see him this way. Don’t worry. This is my old husband. He may be unsightly, but he can’t move. Please be patient with him.”

After thus apologizing, the old woman explained that her husband had suffered from palsy for many years and now his whole body was almost paralyzed. The mountains of papers were actually correspondence from every possible source describing treatments for palsy and packets of medicine the old man had ordered from throughout the country. Whenever he heard of a treatment from travelers who came over the pass or saw an advertisement in the newspaper, he never failed to send for it. He kept the papers around him in heaps, staring at them, never disposing of a single one. Through the years he had accumulated mountains of aging scrap paper.

[Anonymous No.1773379]

>>1773373
there's a zip like that???

>>1772863
thank you! er what other thread are you referring to if i me enquire please?

[Anonymous No.1773383]

>>1773378

Without a word to the old woman, I bent over the hearth. An automobile navigating the pass rattled the house. I wondered why the old man did not move down to a lower elevation, with the autumn already this cold and snow soon to cover the pass. Steam rose from my kimono. The fire was hot enough to scorch my face. The old woman went back out to the shop, commenting to one of the female entertainers.

“So this is the little girl you had with you before. She’s turned out to be such a nice girl. That’s good for you. How pretty she’s become. Girls grow up so fast.”

About an hour later, I heard the entertainers preparing to leave. I had not settled in to stay either, but I was so anxious that I did not have the courage to stand up. Although they were seasoned travelers, they would be walking at a woman’s pace, so I was certain I could catch up even if I left a mile or so behind them. Still, I grew impatient sitting by the hearth. Once the entertainers had left, my daydreams began a vivid, reckless dance. The old woman returned from seeing the entertainers off.

“Where are they staying tonight?” I asked.

“There’s no way to tell where people like that are going to stay, is there, young man? Wherever they can attract an audience, that’s where they stay. It doesn’t matter where it might be. I don’t think the likes of them would have a place already planned.”

The scorn that lurked in the woman’s words so stirred me, I thought to myself: If that is true, then I’ll have the dancing girl stay in my room tonight.

The rain abated and the mountain peak cleared. The old woman tried to detain me longer, telling me the sky would be completely cloudless if only I would wait ten more minutes. But I just could not remain sitting there.

[Anonymous No.1773386]

>>1773383

“Please take care of yourself,” I said to the old man. “It’s going to get colder.” I spoke from my heart as I stood up. His yellow eyes lolled in his head, and he gave a slight nod.

“Sir! Sir!” The old woman followed me outside. “This is far too much money. I just can’t accept it.” She picked up my bag in both hands and refused to give it to me. She would not listen, no matter how much I tried to dissuade her. The old woman told me she would accompany me up the road a bit. She repeated the same words as she tottered along behind me for a hundred yards.

“This is much too generous. I’m sorry we didn’t serve you better. I’ll make certain to remember your face. When you pass this way again, we’ll do something special for you. Be sure to stop by next time. I won’t forget you.”

She seemed so overwhelmed, as if she were on the verge of tears, just because I had left a fifty-sen coin. But I was eager to catch up with the dancers, and the old woman’s doddering pace hindered me. At last we reached the tunnel at the pass.

“Thank you very much,” I said. “You’d better go back now. Your husband is there all alone.” The old woman finally released my bag.

Cold drops of water plopped inside the dark tunnel. Up ahead, the tiny portal to southern Izu grew brighter.

[Anonymous No.1773395]

>>1773386
And that's the ending to part one (there are seven parts in the story) and all I've got typed so far.

>>1773379
Yep! It's at http://www.mediafire.com/?ca1q1oeyzgypdv3

I'm trying to get some stuff off JSTOR, as well as typing the shorter stories like this up to bulk it a bit. >>1771587 is that other thread with the stuff on Genji and other world lit classics.

[Anonymous No.1773429]

Hey guys, so I am getting into poetry, and while I enjoy haikus I don't know much of anything about them. You all seem to know a ton on the matter, any good intro book for the haiku or something of that nature you think would help me?

[Anonymous No.1773450]

>>1773429
I mentioned this guy up in the first post: http://www.amazon.com/Classic-Tradition-Haiku-Anthology-Editions/dp/0486292746/

That one is a good, cheap introduction to the actual poetry itself. Are you looking for haiku or history /explanation of haiku stuff? That one has a three page forward that works as a pretty concise and informative introduction.

[Anonymous No.1773451]

>>1773450
Well I guess I was interested in explanations, rules, history and of course some examples haha =D

[Anonymous No.1773464]

>>1773451
Hm, well I'll still stand by my rec on that one (I mean come on, it's $3). I think it's also appropriate in showing the differences in interpretation for translating them.

In addition to that one, maybe check out: http://www.amazon.com/Essential-Haiku-Versions-Basho-Buson/dp/0880013516/

That one will give you a good background on those three haiku masters - translations of their poetry, prose, and some biography/background on the poets themselves.

For actual history, maybe this: http://www.amazon.com/One-Hundred-Frogs-Renga-English/dp/0834801760/

I have not actually read this one yet, though I probably will soon (I trust the author, since I've read a number of his other translations and they were excellent). It seems to be very scholarly-worded, but it looks like a very good history on haiku and it's origins.

For rules and stuff, I'm not sure. There are probably some How to Write Haiku books out there that do that good, but I don't have any/know about them. You'd probably get a sufficient feel for the structure through those other books though!

[Anonymous No.1773471]

>>1773464

Thats great man, thanks a lot. I have to head out but I'm going to look at these! Thanks again.

[Anonymous No.1773499]

So, almost done typing up Dancing Girl of Izu. Brainstorming which other stories I should include. I want to get in some important stories, while also representing the major authors who aren't already in the .zip.

So far I'm thinking:

Lifeblood by Tamura Toshiko (just because I love this one)
Kuniko by Shiga Naoya
The Quilt by Katai Tayama
Aghwee the Sky Monster by Kenzaburo Oe

Any thoughts, /lit/?

[Anonymous No.1773520]

>>1773395
thank you!

>>1773499
try Oe?

[Anonymous No.1773535]

>>1773520
I was going to do the Aghwee one for Oe. That or Prize Stock, not sure.

[Anonymous No.1773560]

nice books

[Anonymous No.1773620]

>>1773520
Oh, derp, I think I misunderstood you. I meant I was going to try all four of those, and was meaning to ask if anyone had any other exceptional authors/stories that may be hard to get ahold of to suggest. I accidentally thought you were re-suggesting Oe.

[Anonymous No.1773787]

lol

[Anonymous No.1773854]

why long?

[Anonymous No.1773972]

>>1773854
Huh?

[Anonymous No.1774013]

>>1773620
ah no worries. thank you for doing this :)

[Anonymous No.1774026]

etheridge knight did my favorite non-basho series of poems

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/poem/177057

[Anonymous No.1774028]

>>1774026

of haiku*, rather

[Anonymous No.1774655]

haiku

[Anonymous No.1775089]

say, those who read haiku in the original language like japanese or spanish - does the feel change too much when it's translated in english? My book - in OP - gives me the english pronunciation of the japanese and I'm a weeaboo who hears it almost everyday in anime so I can sort of compare if it's accurate.
Do any other books do that - give the japanese and then the translation?

[Anonymous No.1775816]

How's this one: Dewdrops on a Lotus Leaf: Zen Poems of Ryokan (Paperback)

[Anonymous No.1776553]

up