Appreciating the Quran: Judgement

[OP No.17587890]

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم

What the Qur'an and Sunnah have to say about death and final judgement. A promised continuation of the thread on Eschatology
>>17488162

Links for those interested in Islam (update attached to bottom)
https://pastebin.com/CKbsaqE0

When someone sleeps, their soul is seperated from their body. Some might wonder how is the body still operating. Well a headless chicken still operates for a time, but even so we're not talking a complete seperation, there's still a sort of link when you sleep even though your soul is away. And, btw, it's still haram to have an abortion before ensoulment of a fetus and it is still haram to kill someone in their sleep. Goes without saying. Anyway though, when you are dead dead, you are visited by the, or a, angel of death who is either comforting, or terrifying, depending on what your past and consequently your future holds. If comforting then your soul will slide out of your body like, according to Muhammad ﷺ, water from a jug. But he says if it's terrifying then your soul will recoil from leaving and cling to your body like wool on a thorn bush. The process is excruciating either way. Then the soul is taken up through all the heavens toward Allah, عز و جل. If the reception is good the soul is joyfully greeted by the angels. If not then it is cursed and the angels look horrific. Upon going before Allah the sentence is pronounced and the soul returns to the body where it remains attached for three days after death (unless the body is dispersed), maintaining a very faint awareness of its surroundings. Upon the conclusion of the three days the soul is deposited in the place the body is at the time. At this time one lives in a sort of dreamworld except it's actually real, but this is how a soul without a body lives. It can be very pleasant, or a torment, depending on one's life. For martyrs they receive the company of two virgins, for others their deeds are made into beings which are either pleasing, or repulsive.

Once Allah ends the world and kills everything through the shreik of the appointed angel through the trumpet, then the planet is stretched out into a long plane and every human or animal that ever existed is resurrected at the call of another shriek. This process is similar to growth in the womb, only quicker and you come out if the ground, with
Cont

[OP No.17587893]

>>17587890
clumps of cells forming and a body rapidly developing. A'isha, رضي الله عنها, on learning that everyone will be naked expressed concern about how women can stay modest. Muhammad ﷺ said no one will be thinking about that, they'll be too terrified. The sun will be brought within a mile of the earth and because of the new bodies created to be able to endure hellfire it will only cause them to sweat but the sweat will be such as according to their guilt,some it will nearly drown. This is judgement day, and though it is only one day it is 50,000 years long in our time. Most martyrs will skip it but almost everyone else will have to endure it to some extent. A big part of it is auditing every cent you ever consumed, acquired or spent. The extremely virtuous yet wealthy will have to go through this process for forty years the virtuous poor don't (the not so virtuous but wealthy will have to go through much more).

Those in hellfire can be temporary or permanent. Muslims who kept their prayers and faith can be rescued eventually, the angels it is said will recognize marks of prostration stamped on their head and will take them out at appointed times. The punishments of hell are many and varied, Muhammad ﷺ was shown it in his dreams and one example is a man who tells a lie that gets continually repeated by others, his cheeks are torn out again and again by hooks. Paradise by contrast had a beatific vision and endless countries which are beyond our wildest imaginations

Questions and comments welcome, there's actually a lot of literature on this

[Anonymous No.17587915]

>>17587890
Quran DESTROYED.

[Anonymous No.17587923]

>>17587915

[OP No.17587947]

>>17587890
>Links for those interested in Islam (update attached to bottom)

I forgot to mention, some topics addressed here are restraining from sex before marriage, freemasonry, and human rights

>>17587915
>>17587923
Take a break from the internet bucko, especially 4chan. You're the first to respond in every single thread I see on Islam, you need to go outside

https://youtu.be/3zguEv70K1c

[OP No.17587992]

>>17587915
>>17587923
Anyway
Two threads dealing at length with the beauty of the Qur'an
>>/lit/thread/S16511592

>>/lit/thread/S17183069

And two others dealing at length with the rest of the points
here

>>/lit/thread/S14651153

https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/8248530

[Anonymous No.17588070]

>>17587890
The Qur'an is a terrible piece of literature. The rest of it is nonsensical bullshit, you don't even have to be anti-Islam to know this: you just have to have read it.

[Anonymous No.17588073]

>>17587992
BTFO by

https://archive.4plebs.org/pol/thread/205462290

No one cares about your backwards religion.

[Anonymous No.17588085]

>>17587915
>>17587923
Brutal stuff man. I'd like to add that in the Jungian view of religion as a system of evolutionarily constructed and stored knowledge Islam doesn't seem to qualify as a religion at all. He didn't talk about it too much but this passage here is interesting:

"We do not know whether Hitler is going to found a new Islam. He is already on the way; he is like Mohammad. The emotion in Germany is Islamic; warlike and Islamic. They are all drunk with a wild god. That can be the historic future.”

[Anonymous No.17588088]

>>17588085
>>17587923
>>17587915
Here is the full thread if interested.

>>/lit/thread/10010639?__cf_chl_jschl_tk__=e94344147db45c2e511dbbe22c48ae481318d462-1613570279-0-AV_HKB1Hoo1oFOpMN2cvpsK6beafKKr25uqQu22GjDLLljBRAVxpWv7dGtO4a3LO9jEor63NyGEQOKWsSScRh0psu5lEumS_U5qIZejfwxumqYzS_4wpiJMjliA6S8RaSAilTNbtUe_B7eiVMDhv9jTDUTTzpODvglNI1ma_NYlrgVVVlshPMeaCcXM8WC4z8_k0N9m_Tnpq5OfEuKd_WyPlGMnxdx2AbVNO83LJKVkQ_saPur1v3xBk1sekDzMgXhcM9S5Jbw3jlXVbE06DEx-nTZXMXUQ3H9m44mSLrGgBgJNIpNIB0CuKXPe6wcQAJfAQ53JThDNCXjUTFrQ6tyI#p10013199

[OP No.17588091]

>>17588073
This doesn't address anything and regurgitates banalities like the moon God accusation whereas anyone who knows anything at all about Islam knows the moon god was hubal and was worshipped by the Arabs who opposed Islam

[Anonymous No.17588102]

>>17588091
Rope for the cope

[Anonymous No.17588133]

>>17588091
Hey op I am seeing you in a /pol/ thread where you are admitting that people who insult muhammad are to die.

At least be honest in your belief's at this point.

[Anonymous No.17588161]

>>17588073
Holy kek Prof Kaffir obliterated islam.

[Anonymous No.17588163]

>>17588133
>Muslims
>honest
Lul

[Anonymous No.17588177]

>>17587947
how about you just fuck off?
islam is filth and muslims are pedo rapists. this shit doesn't belong here. it doesn't belong in a civilised world.

[OP No.17588212]

>>17588133
Not sure what you're talking about, I have discussed this issue in a prior thread and very frankly. That you think I'm dishonest or a modernist is a mistake on your part

[Anonymous No.17588228]

>>17587890
The biographical details of Muhammad's life are just so ridiculous. Given the competition of men like Jesus or Buddha it's astonishing that this faith persisted into the 21st century.

[Anonymous No.17588238]

>>17588228
Because Muhammad literally didn't exist and it's a compilation of stories

[Anonymous No.17588248]

May Allah reward you for making dawah here, akhi

[Anonymous No.17588261]

>>17588073
noigiler?

[Anonymous No.17588263]

>>17588238
Nah, he did. The stories clearly portray a human being who abuses his position to satisfy base passions. You would never invent a horrific person like that to illustrate an ideal of human behaviour.

[Anonymous No.17588269]

>>17588263
They're a collection of stories. I used to be one who believed he existed, but I no longer am. An increasing number of people now doubt his existence. The issue with the stories being bad are because they are a compilation and because they didn't see them as bad.

[OP No.17588273]

>>17588228
>doesn't know the difference between Hubal and Allah
Dropped

[OP No.17588280]

>>17588248
و إياك

[Anonymous No.17588309]

>>17588133
>>17588212
Muslims are allowed to lie if it advances the goals of their religion, don't trust anything out of this shill's mouth. Same goes for judaism by the way, but then again islam is just judaism for the dumb masses made to serve the jewish god.

[Anonymous No.17588310]

>>17588248
>Dawah on /lit/
I doubt it will work. Invincible ignorance is prevalent in every ideology in 4chan, all religions included.

It is extremely likely I will never be a Muslim, and in a reciprocal way, it is extremely likely that OP will never become a Christian, or a Hindu, or a Jew. Our ignorance will continue to the grave.

[OP No.17588369]

>>17588309
>Muslims are allowed to lie if it advances the goals of their religion
This is incorrect, there is no such ruling

>>17588310
I'm pretty well read on Christianity and somewhat well read on Judaism compared to most

[Anonymous No.17588373]

>>17588269
I think you underestimate human beings. We've understood concepts like greed or hatred for a long time and our stories have warned us against these impulses. A kind being that was invented 4,000 years ago tends to be kind even when viewed from today's perspective. A miraculous person like Jesus Christ preceded Muhammad by centuries, the Buddha by a thousand years.
What's convincing about the islamic stories is that the guy appears as a bumbling degenerate who receives revelation whenever his previous short-sighted dictates conflict with his current agenda. He behaves like a charlatan would and you wouldn't make that up. I'm btw not talking about all the stories, clearly there's invention involved.

[Anonymous No.17588383]

>>Muslims are allowed to lie if it advances the goals of their religion
>>17588369
>This is incorrect, there is no such ruling
What a surprise, a lie to cover up the lies. This is common knowledge, muslism will laugh about it and tell you about it openly.
>I'm pretty well read on Christianity and somewhat well read on Judaism compared to most
And you all worship the same jewish god

[OP No.17588393]

>>17588383
You should be able to show me a fatwa if it is

I worship the God of Adam, Noah, Ishmael, Enoch and Abraham, none were Jewish. The first Jew was Jacob, عليه السلام

[Anonymous No.17588400]

>>17588369
>I'm pretty well read on Christianity and somewhat well read on Judaism compared to most

Definitely not what I was talking about. Certain people know basically everything about Judaism yet they’re atheists, or some people basically know everything about Christianity yet they’re Hindus or Agnostics. Simply reading and knowing a lot about a religion (I.e., it’s texts, scholars, philosophers, theologians, history, ect.) still does not extinguish the invincible ignorance established by common cognitive dissonance.

[Anonymous No.17588402]

>>17588393
>You should be able to show me a fatwa if it is
It's in the Quran, or have all the muslims who told me this been lying? You don't say...
>I worship the God of Adam, Noah, Ishmael, Enoch and Abraham, none were Jewish. The first Jew was Jacob,
Kek, keep telling that to yourself, jew worshiper. How does it feel to not be the chosen people of your god?

[OP No.17588415]

>>17588400
Seems you are begging the question and dismissing conviction as synonymous with ignorance

>>17588402
The Qur'an says the Jews were chosen until they rejected Isa, عليه السلام. Similarly Iblis, Lucifer, was chosen once above all others

[Anonymous No.17588426]

>>17588415
>The Qur'an says the Jews were chosen until they rejected Isa
Wait so muslims are just crypto-christians? Lmao it gets better everytime
Deep down you know he's still the jewish god, though. Wuite painful that must be.

[Anonymous No.17588434]

>>17588373
I understand why you'd think that but I'm pretty certain he didn't exist. What we do know for sure is if he did he was an absolute joke

[Anonymous No.17588436]

>>17588415
I am not begging the question at all. You are obviously unfamiliar with the term ‘invincible ignorance’ in the way I’m using it. I am simply using it in the manner of (basically) understanding something, yet still rejecting it due to instinctual conviction.

[OP No.17588448]

>>17588426
He's the only and universal God and was God before creation and was worshipped before there were Jews and will be worshipped after they're gone

>>17588436
You are begging the question by presuming instinct, not that fitra is irrelevant but plenty of people become Muslim and Christian

[Anonymous No.17588450]

Since someone in here might actually have an answer, what is the best single volume of Hadith translated into English?

[Anonymous No.17588455]

>>17588448
>presuming instinct
I’m not presuming anything. The basic state of a believer of a religion is that religion, that is what I am talking about when I say ‘instinct.’ Saying I am begging the question is definitionally incorrect.

[OP No.17588462]

>>17588450
What kind of Hadiths were you looking for? Narrative? Praxiological? Rhetorical?

[Anonymous No.17588465]

>>17588448
>He's the only and universal God and was God before creation and was worshipped before there were Jews and will be worshipped after they're gone
So you worship the jewish god? Got it. You can play word games all you want but you're no better than christians, stealing a people's (evil) god and appropriating him for youself. Disgusting.

[OP No.17588471]

>>17588455
The basic belief is what is believed in all cases, I'm not sure there is a lot of content in this understanding though

[Anonymous No.17588472]

>>17588369
>This is incorrect, there is no such ruling

Op is lying as always.

r8.2 The Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace) said,
``He who settles disagreements between people to bring about good or says something commendable
is not a liar.''
This much is related by both Bukhari and Muslim, with Muslim's version recording that Umm Kulthum
added,
``I did not hear him permit untruth in anything people say, except for three things: war, settling
disagreements and a man talking with his wife or she with him (A:in smoothing over differences),''
This is an explicit statement that lying is sometimes permissible for a given interest, scholars having
established criteria defining what types of it are lawful. The best analysis of it I have seen is by Imam
Ghazali. If something is attainable through both telling the truth and lying, it is unlawful to accomplish it
through lying because there is no need for it. When it is possible to achieve such an aim by lying but not by
telling the truth, it is permissible to lie if attaining the goal is permissible (N:i.e. when the purpose of lying
is to circumvent someone who is preventing one from doing something permissible), and obligatory to lie if
the goal is obligatory. When for example one is concealing a muslim from an oppressor who asks where he
is, it is obligatory to lie about his being hidden. Or when a person deposits an article with one for
safekeeping and an oppressor wanting to appropriate it inquires about it, it is obligatory to lie about having
concealed it, for if one informs him about the article and he then siezes it, one is financially liable(A:to
the owner)to cover the article's cost. Whether the purpose is war, settling a disagreement, or gaining
the sympathy of a victim legally entitled to retaliate against one so that he will forbear to do so; it is not
unlawful to ;lie when any of these aims can only be attained through lying. But is religiously more
precautionary (def:c6.5) in all such cases to employ words that give misleadng impression, meaning to
intend by one's words something that is literally true, in respect to which one is not lying (def:r10.2)
white the outward purport of the words deceives the hearer, though even if one does not have such an
intention and merely lies without intending anything else, it is not unlawful in the above circumstances

Lying mod shit spotted.

[Anonymous No.17588477]

>>17588471
>basic belief is what is believed in all cases
Yes.

[Anonymous No.17588479]

>>17588462
I couldn’t really tell you. What would your average Sunni consider most important?

[OP No.17588482]

>>17588472
This is a lot more circumscribed than what you said. I think Christians would concur with lying under all those circumstances as well

[Anonymous No.17588484]

>>17588415
>>17588448
So muslims are like the 4th choice for chosen people? Only after pagans, jews and christians failed, your god thought "well it seems these desert dwellers are the only ones left". I'm here waiting until he abandons you too and declares himself the god of the aborigines.

[Anonymous No.17588490]

>>17588482
Lying will get you in hell in biblical scriptures, your allah described itself being a maykr aka a deciever and the fact this exists in your sharia ruling that lying is permissible when under war (which islam is at right now because it is secretly at odds with everybody) and if it is to attain a certain goal they will take that route whether it be misdirection or other wise.

You are now lying, if lying didn't exist in islam neither would kitman, taqqyia and other practices or forms of lying.

[OP No.17588491]

>>17588479
"Fiqh According to the Qur'an and the Sunnah" and "Gardens of the Virtuous" might be commonly found in a religious household

>>17588484
The Prophet ﷺ was sent to the whole planet, being the last

[Anonymous No.17588496]

>>17588482
So lying is okay because you think the christians do it too? The absolute state of muslims.

[OP No.17588499]

>>17588490
I very much doubt as Christian has an issue with lying in a situation like " we have you surrounded" when you don't

None of this is related to war, it's on 4chan. If you asked me to disclose the local of our fighters then lying might make sense but this conversation doesn't fall under war

Taqiyyah is from Shia fiqh

[Anonymous No.17588502]

>>17588310
>I doubt it will work. Invincible ignorance is prevalent in every ideology in 4chan, all religions included.
He's more preaching to the choir imo. I'm a Muslim though not a scholar and I keep learning a great deal about Islam ITTs

[Anonymous No.17588503]

>>17588491
But the christians claim the same about Jesus. Why should I believe you over them? Also doesn't change the fact that you're still appropriating the god of the jews, an etnic god, for the entire world and wonder why they don't like you.

[OP No.17588507]

>>17588496
Rather I think Muslims circumscribe it much more. Even lying as a joke is considered haram

[Anonymous No.17588508]

>>17588499
>I very much doubt as Christian has an issue with lying in a situation like " we have you surrounded" when you don't
That's the difference, as much as I despise christians, the real ones don't lie under any circumstances. They'd rather die than lie.
>If you asked me to disclose the local of our fighters then lying might make sense
Wait I thought you said you weren't allowed to lie? Were you lying?

[Anonymous No.17588514]

>>17588507
>Even lying as a joke is considered haram
Yes, to other muslims. Not to non-muslims, you lying fuck. Stop playing jewish word games.

[OP No.17588518]

>>17588508
I can lie in a situation of warfare as you mentioned, that wouldn't apply here. This really isn't complicated

[Anonymous No.17588519]

>>17588228
Damn Muhammad was truly a demonic being. He committed every crime in the book: murder, torture, rape, pedophilia, theft, racket, perjury.

[Anonymous No.17588521]

>>17588514
>Stop playing jewish word games.
Islam(Quran) is as anti-jew as it gets.

[OP No.17588523]

>>17588514
No, to kuffar it is as well

[Anonymous No.17588529]

>>17588523
That's a lie. Muslims are allowed to lie to non-muslims if it advances the goals of islam.
>>17588521
Then why worship the jewish god and do their work for them?

[Anonymous No.17588533]

>>17588518
Who decides when that is? Isn't this part of the holy war to save the infidels? See how easy that was. Stop lying, pig.

[OP No.17588539]

>>17588529
>That's a lie. Muslims are allowed to lie to non-muslims if it advances the goals of islam.
This is ludicrous and incorrect, that's obviously not even a legally functional phrase because it is utterly subjective. You are the one who is lying here

[Anonymous No.17588542]

>>17588529
>worship the jewish god
That "jewish" god sent dozens of verses dissing jews in the Quran

[OP No.17588543]

>>17588533
No it's not. This doesn't fall under jihad in any fiqh

[Anonymous No.17588545]

>>17588514
>>17588507
Deceitfulness does seem like a muslim attribute. It's very unsympathetic.

Christians get taught things like that:
"No one who practices deceit shall dwell in my house; no one who utters lies shall continue before my eyes."

[Anonymous No.17588554]

>>17588542
I would too if I were him, yet you still worship the jewish god. If you're so anti-jewish, why not ditch their god and go back to the gods of your ancestors? They were actually anti-jew.
>>17588539
As if subjectivity ever stopped muslims from playing jewish word games lmao, you've been at it this entire thread
>>17588543
How do I know you're not lying now?

[Anonymous No.17588555]

>>17588529
>>17588542
Honestly it doesn’t make sense, considering obviously “Allah” comes from the Abrahamic tradition, but “Allah” is so irreconcilable to the God seen in the Old and New Testaments. It just confirms that Islam probably comes from the deluge of confusion and heresy that is speculated all the time.

[Anonymous No.17588559]

>>17588545
>Deceitfulness does seem like a muslim attribute
The Quran and the Hadith(saying of Muhammad pbuh) is filled with sections on how bad lying and deceitfulness is.

[OP No.17588565]

>>17588545
Muhammad ﷺ was asked can a coward be a Muslim. He said yes (in other words though it is listed as a major sin it isn't apostasy). Can a miser? He said yes. Can a liar? He said no.

[Anonymous No.17588566]

>>17588555
>but “Allah” is so irreconcilable to the God seen in the Old and New Testaments.
Allah is literally the God in the Old Testament

[Anonymous No.17588569]

>>17587890
Fuck the so-called Sunnah. It’s a satanic perversion of the Quran’s message. The only Sunnah you need is in the Quran. Muhammad wasn’t a pedophile and he didn’t advise people to drink camel piss.

[Anonymous No.17588571]

>>17588559
Then why do so many muslims lie? I know more deceitful muslims than those who are true to their word. Are you saying your religion is as subverted and decadent as all the others?

[Anonymous No.17588572]

>>17588499
>None of this is related to war, it's on 4chan. If you asked me to disclose the local of our fighters then lying might make sense but this conversation doesn't fall under war

>Taqiyyah is from Shia fiqh
BULL FUCKING SHIT!

If taqyiaa was not allowed pic related would not exist.

And yes it doesn't matter the circumstance in christianity you lie?
You have sinned and liars go to hell.

[Anonymous No.17588585]

>>17588565
What's the definition of liar though? You keep proving it's very subjective and subject to changing around different circumstances.

[Anonymous No.17588587]

>>17588559
Unless of course it is furthering the cause of Muhammad. Think about what sort of a statement that is. From his perspective: lie whenever it is advantageous to myself.

[Anonymous No.17588592]

>>17588566
No, I don’t think so.

[Anonymous No.17588594]

>>17588587
That describes muslims perfectly. They lie about lying.

[Anonymous No.17588599]

>>17588592
yep

[OP No.17588606]

>>17588569
The Qur'an says follow the Sunnah

>>17588572
Ibn Taymiyyah gave a detailed fatwa on this. It is indeed the hood, this is based on a Hadith when Muhammad ﷺ saw a circumcision of a girl and said do not cut too much which has been unanimously understood to mean the hood and not the clitoris proper, I have written on this topic extensively already, familiarize yourself with the classical fatwas and Hadiths before this

[Anonymous No.17588634]

>>17588572
>>17588587

+again the Christian view:

"But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God's word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone's conscience in the sight of God."

[Anonymous No.17588635]

>>17588606
HAHAHHA you realize your sharia is the final interpetation of everything right and it gives the exact rulings on these things explicitly?
And the fact umdat al salik is one of the most popular sharia manuals.

[Anonymous No.17588650]

>>17588634
>"But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God's word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone's conscience in the sight of God."

Ah yes cherry picking bible verses?

revelations 21:8
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

1 timothy 9:-10
Understanding this, that the law is not laid down for the just but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who strike their fathers and mothers, for murderers, the sexually immoral, men who practice homosexuality, enslavers, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound doctrine,

[OP No.17588660]

>>17588635
Why do I bother

I have explained this passage before and it's not my fault you can't read Arabic and you're too lazy to look at the links I supplied at the outset of this thread. You are dishonest, I take considerable time to address every point in detailed manner from this exhausting cluttered garbage text and you can't even bother to read them, then don't expect me to read your rambling foolishness

[Anonymous No.17588665]

>>17588634
Here you go the Muslim view:

"Only they forge the lie who do not believe in Allah’s communications, and these are the liars."

"Surely Allah does not guide him aright who is a liar, ungrateful."

"the curse of Allah be on him if he is one of the liars."

"Falsehood is absolutely an evil and a sin."

"...the curse of Allah be on him if he is one of the liars."

"Beware of falsehood! Because falsehood blackens the face."

"It is recorded in a tradition that on the Day of Judgement the mouth of a liar will give an awful smell."

""The smell of a liar’s mouth would be so disgusting that even the Angels will not go near him. They will keep away from the liars. This is not only for the Day of Judgement. Even in this world, the Angels can smell the foul odour from the mouths of the liars. In a prophetic tradition it is said,

“When a believer utters a lie, such a bad smell emanates from his mouth that even the Angels move away.”"

"Lying destroys Faith"

etc

[Anonymous No.17588693]

>>17588650
I have no problems with those verses but see no relation to what I have written.

[Anonymous No.17588707]

>>17588665
Sure but there is exemption for whatever furthers the cause of Muhammad (like getting rid of unbelievers). There's no such exemption in Christendom, just forgiveness.

[Anonymous No.17588723]

>>17588212
Ok so you want me to be murdered. Why should I listen to you?

[Anonymous No.17588726]

>>17588693
Let me guess is it the one paul talking to some other people using their own logic against them?
That wasn't being promotive of lying.

[Anonymous No.17588732]

>>17588726
It's not lying if you manipulate your opponent into believe otherwise

[Anonymous No.17588744]

>>17588726
Just random verses against sinful behaviour, presumably expecting that I was some nihilistic liberal who would be opposed to that. This btw if posted by a muslim was a direct example of taqiya since Islam shares these prohibitions.

[Anonymous No.17588751]

>>17588599
How

[OP No.17588752]

>>17588723
Why should I listen to you if you think blasphemy is a human right?

[Anonymous No.17588791]

>>17588751
I'm just saying that because I've read some of the both of books, as I am no scholar I can't represent it quite bountifully. But for example these verses from John:

>1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
>2 The same was in the beginning with God.
Can be contrasted with those from the Quran:

>31:27 And if whatever trees upon the earth were pens and the sea [was ink], replenished thereafter by seven [more] seas, the words of Allah would not be exhausted.

This shows how the word is from God, and the word is God, but also complements is by saying the words of God are unlimited, portraying the fact the God is limitless

[Anonymous No.17588858]

>>17588791
Dude the guy said the Old Testament, but even if we were to take this verse seriously we have to understand that the two theologies of what (or who) the Word of God is differs completely in the Qur’an and in the New Testament.

To quote the entirety of the prologue of John involving the Word,
>In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life, and the life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it... The true light, which gives light to everyone, was coming into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.

The Word of God in the Qur’an is a sort of complete and sufficient revelation from God, meant to be inexhaustible in its usage. The Word of God in the Bible is a person who is completely God, who incarnate as a person in the world through Jesus Christ. Completely incomparable tbqh.

[Anonymous No.17588868]

>>17588606
The Sunnah from the Quran, retard. Enjoy your camel piss.

[Anonymous No.17588903]

>>17588858
They're the same God, just the one in the testament incarnates as the person. Same object, different interface, if you will.

[OP No.17588909]

>>17588868
Sunnah means wont

Certain things taken from urine are actually an ingredient in even clinical medicine. Your entire objection here is about it being unpleasant rather than incorrect.

[Anonymous No.17588925]

>>17588903
>just the one in the testament incarnates as the person
I think that’s a huge difference.

[Anonymous No.17588939]

>>17588909
>muslims unironically defending camel piss drinking because their VIIth century prophet told them so
It's like endless comedy.

[Anonymous No.17588947]

>>17588925
It's the same entity. Just that once it was put into a body of a person, the other time wasn't.

[OP No.17588950]

>>17588939
Don't kuffar praise consuming human semen? Not even for medicine but for kicks?

[Anonymous No.17588955]

>>17588554
>How do I know you're not lying now?
By doing basic research?

[Anonymous No.17588956]

>>17588947
>Just that once it was put into a body of a person
Well it’s not like some modalistic God. Only one person incarnated not the Father or the Spirit, both devoid concepts in Islam

[Anonymous No.17588961]

>>17588939
What exactly does that can even say?

[Anonymous No.17588964]

>>17588950
Why, muslims also drink human semen as MEDICINE lmao?

[Anonymous No.17588966]

>>17588950
Sorry akhi but whataboutism isn't a strong argument for your case

[Anonymous No.17588974]

>>17588964
>Kuffar
>Muslims

[Anonymous No.17588976]

>>17588961
Guaranteed 80% pure camel piss.

[Anonymous No.17588977]

>>17588955
And when I present it, you'll lie and tell me I'm interpreting the wrong way or don't understand it because I'm not a muslim, funny how that works. See this thread for examples. It has been shown that islam is a religion of liars and hypocrites.

[Anonymous No.17588981]

>>17588950
Your form is dropping OP, low quality bait

[OP No.17588984]

>>17588966
I'm pretty sure it's not whatboutism. Whataboutism would be pointing out mare urine is used in medicine of the kuffar (which it is). This is however is rather different since kuffar suffer from an STD epidemic whereas camel urine is clearly not causing a public health issue

[Anonymous No.17588993]

>>17588984
>kuffar suffer from an STD epidemic
Are you ignorant or lying again? Muslims in Europe are known for being walking STD repositories

[OP No.17589007]

>>17588993
Hm, I look at STD rates in Muslim countries compared to non Muslim and it's just evident to me that glorifying and worshipping homosexuality and harlotry or feminism or whatever it's called may not have been the most civilized course after all

[Anonymous No.17589013]

>>17588984
Holy cope lmao.

[Anonymous No.17589025]

>>17589007
I don't disagree there, yet your precious religion seems to be falling prey to the same ills. Not so great after all huh?

[Anonymous No.17589031]

>>17588977
I mean the fact that Christians constantly (and I would wager, purposefully) misinterpret what taqiyya is makes me think you're quite deceitful and cunning yourself. Like, this argument was had in the Christian world with the Donatist controversy, and they seem to have come to the conclusion that someone can deny the faith for fear of death. Yet Muslims can't? Because that's literally what taqiyya is, lying under fear of death or persecution. Yes someone can misuse this doctrine for their own nefarious purposes, but that can be said of literally any religious doctrine. Someone can commit the most horrific sins imaginable but certain Christians believe faith in Christ alone absolves them of all sins, would I say all Christians interpret this doctrine in such a way as to allow them to sin as much as humanely possible? I think that would be a bad faith interpretation. If you don't believe me, you are free to look it up.

[Anonymous No.17589044]

>>17589025
>citation not found

[Anonymous No.17589055]

>>17589031
I'm not a christian and I don't pretend I'm above lying. I'm just calling out muslim hypocrisy on the lying, saying lying is haram yet having loopholes to allow lying to non-muslims. In that, I'm more honest than the average muslim.

[Anonymous No.17589062]

>>17589044
Have you seen muslims in Europe? Apart from a few conservative sects they're just as degenerate as the average atheist.

[OP No.17589081]

>>17589025
By ills you mean western civilization?

>>17589031
Taqiyyah is really about epistemology more than practice. The fact that Ali praised Umar and married his daughter to him and his accounts completely contradict the Iraqi shia account of Umar beating up his wife, is addressed by Shia by claiming Ali was doing taqiyyah. Taqiyyah might have happened in practice somewhat but this was more Shia hiding things from Sunnis than either hiding things from others. Christians don't really care if Shia curse A'isha or Umar

[Anonymous No.17589084]

>>17589055
Like I said, why is lying in the face of death or persecution wrong?

[OP No.17589090]

>>17589062
Generally less religious Muslims move to Europe as it is seen as not an optimal environment at least compared to Pakistan. Though there are exceptions but I would say on average an immigrant is much less religious than a non immigrant

[Anonymous No.17589092]

>>17589081
>By ills you mean western civilization?
Yes. You pretend you're going to save the world from decadence and degeneracy, yet when placed in that circumstance you're even more easily subverted than christians. Islam won't do shit but be the useful idiots for globo-zion.

[Anonymous No.17589098]

>>17589062
>just trust me bro
Yeah okay man.
>>17589081
I only recently learned that Ibadis also believe in something called Kitman, it's interesting how taqiyya is used by persecuted denominations historically.

[Anonymous No.17589104]

>>17589084
Because you're lying to save your body? You're placing materialistic aims over spiritual aims? If you were so set upon being truthful, why not die a truthful person instead of live as a liar? It just proves again islam is a religion of hypocrites.

[OP No.17589107]

>>17589092
I don't know, is any Christian willing to die to defy it?

[Anonymous No.17589109]

>>17589092
>even more easily subverted than christians. Islam won't do shit but be the useful idiots for globo-zion.
Man I could have spent this time doing something useful

[Anonymous No.17589112]

>>17589090
Point taken. Still shows your religion is just as susceptible to subversion as all the others, if not more.
>>17589098
>just trust me bro
Just like this entire thread then? Great point, retard.

[OP No.17589114]

>>17589104
Being truthful is better, but being tortured isn't always easy

[Anonymous No.17589122]

>>17589104
Because the preservation of life is more important than not lying? Why throw away the one life God gave you so easily? If it was o defend someone or something, yes a heroic death is beautiful, but just to be honest? I don't see why death is preferable in that situation.

[Anonymous No.17589123]

>>17589107
Not anymore, in history they definitely were. Look at all the saints and martyrs. But at its core christianity is just as bad as islam, they're both judaism for the dumb masses.

[Anonymous No.17589132]

>>17589112
I mean I've told you to look up my claims multiple times, you're commenting on societal trends without a lick of evidence. If you want I can copy and paste the Wikipedia article for taqiyya lol, if that would make me less hypocritical.

[Anonymous No.17589133]

>>17589114
Lmao there goes your integrity, this is why muslims are seen as shifty and deceitful. "yes we're true to our word, unless we get resistance" The absolute state kek
>>17589122
>Because the preservation of life is more important than not lying?
See this is why muslims can't be trusted, thanks for proving it. If you're not willing to die for truth, truth doesn't mean a thing.

[OP No.17589142]

>>17589123
I'm talking about picking up a weapon not just being rounded up

[Anonymous No.17589149]

>>17589132
>wikipedia
No thanks
>you're commenting on societal trends without a lick of evidence.
G to any European city and see for youself, you don't have to believe me. You know statistics are horseshit anyway.

[OP No.17589151]

>>17589133
I personally would try to stay true but if you get tortured into denying your faith it's not considered apostasy no

[Anonymous No.17589155]

>>17589142
Given every time muslim take weapons they get thoroughly BTFO they'd better stop.

[Anonymous No.17589160]

>>17588744
> mean the fact that Christians constantly (and I would wager, purposefully) misinterpret what taqiyya is makes me think you're quite deceitful and cunning yourself. Like, this argument was had in the Christian world with the Donatist controversy, and they seem to have come to the conclusion that someone can deny the faith for fear of death. Yet Muslims can't? Because that's literally what taqiyya is, lying under fear of death or persecution. Yes someone can misuse this doctrine for their own nefarious purposes, but that can be said of literally any religious doctrine. Someone can commit the most horrific sins imaginable but certain Christians believe faith in Christ alone absolves them of all sins, would I say all Christians interpret this doctrine in such a way as to allow them to sin as much as humanely possible? I think that would be a bad faith interpretation. If you don't believe me, you are free to look it up.

Then don't lie mudshit that simple.

[Anonymous No.17589162]

>>17589142
My point still stands even if you don't know enough about christian history

[Anonymous No.17589168]

>>17589151
Then you can't say muslims are not allowed to lie. Because that would be a lie. And just like jews, you stretch the limits of interpretation to be allowed to lie in any situation.

[Anonymous No.17589173]

>>17589149
>You know statistics are horseshit anyway

[Anonymous No.17589178]

>>17589173
Yes?

[Anonymous No.17589184]

>>17589133
Well I mean I don't fell that my life is under threat when some randos online call me a goat fucker lol, so I can be trusted then at least.

[OP No.17589191]

>>17589155
Infantry wise Muslims have the best but lack artillery and drones

>>17589168
Source?

[Anonymous No.17589202]

>>17589184
No you can't. I've heard muslims make (variations) of this argument. You can't be trusted.
>>17589191
You, retard. You first say lying is not allowed but then say it's allowed under certain circumstances, thus proving you a liar.

[Anonymous No.17589214]

>>17589191
>Infantry wise Muslims have the best but lack artillery and drones
They're the best of the best and proud and fierce and still are getting BTFO by Israel, BTFO by NATO, BTFO by Russia, BTFO by China, BTFO by hindus, even BTFO by Africans.
Muslims are good at killing each other though.

[OP No.17589225]

>>17589202
I said there is no such ruling that lying is permissible based on "advances the religion". When lying is permissible I already covered in the last thread linked here
>>17587992

[Anonymous No.17589228]

>>17589191
>Infantry wise Muslims have the best but lack artillery and drone

LMAO

[Anonymous No.17589231]

>>17589228
>islamic values

[OP No.17589232]

>>17589214
I don't think Russia or NATO can sustain it. Theoretically the U.S. in Vietnam and Russia in Afghanistan used air support to great power but they didn't turn out as victories

[Anonymous No.17589244]

>>17589225
But that when is very broadly intepretable, making you untrustworthy. And lying to save your life is advancing the religion, no? Why else would you?

[Anonymous No.17589247]

>>17589191
>Infantry wise Muslims have the best

[Anonymous No.17589250]

>>17589228
>dat jiff
Based

[Anonymous No.17589254]

>>17589225
>I said there is no such ruling that lying is permissible based on "advances the religion". When lying is permissible I already covered in the last thread linked here

See
>>17588472
Lying is allowed if it obtains a certain goal that cannot be achieved by truth.

[OP No.17589261]

>>17589244
>that when is very broadly intepretable
Not really.

Lying to save your life is based on a particular hadith, a man was tortured into cursing Muhammad ﷺ and told Muhammad ﷺ and Muhammad ﷺ said if he is tortured again then he should do so again and there is no sin on him for it.

[Anonymous No.17589262]

>>17589254
>Lying is allowed if it obtains a certain goal that cannot be achieved by truth.
Every parent in the world is familiar with this notion.

[OP No.17589274]

>>17589254
I have no idea of the context of this or the daleel (nor do I particularly regard Ghazali as a jurist, I don't know who does), the Arabic isn't even furnished.

[Anonymous No.17589280]

>>17589274
>the Arabic isn't even furnished.
What an interesting phrase.

[Anonymous No.17589286]

>>17589232
I love how muslims brag about being the best warriors on earth and still manage to get destroyed by everyone else. You can't even get to expell a couple million jews. Muslim military achievments amount to bomb bus and kill people in bars. Whoah. So brave.

[OP No.17589291]

>>17589286
I suppose drones are?

[Anonymous No.17589295]

>>17587947
>please leave
Lmao and I thought muslims had honor

[Anonymous No.17589302]

>>17589261
COntext?
Dude is the ruling on permissible lying from your own sharia.

[OP No.17589304]

>>17589274
By regard here I mean highly regard. He was a jurist but I know of no work of his regarding jurisprudence that anyone reads

[Anonymous No.17589305]

>>17589286
>You can't even get to expell a couple million jews.
Not disputing other points, but that's unfair given the state of Israel is supported by the hegemon the US as well as various other agents

[Anonymous No.17589306]

>>17589291
Weapons.

[OP No.17589316]

>>17589302
This is supposedly from a fatwa by Al-Ghazali. This was a jurist who said music is halal based on the fact that birds sing. Obviously I'm going to need to see his whole fatwa to know if he even has daleel

[OP No.17589319]

>>17589306
As are suicide bombs and airliners

[Anonymous No.17589357]

>>17589319
Monkey weapons are meant to be used on the enemy. Jihadi bomb airliners and kill civilians because they're scared to fight actual militaries. They're so ball less the best they can come with is killing women and children in the rear. Muslim "bravery" what a joke.

[OP No.17589379]

>>17589357
NATO definately bombs civilians. And Muslims definitely fight soldiers but NATO soldiers generally don't like to come out and play until they have levelled the city first, see Fallujah

[Anonymous No.17589381]

>>17589316
The sharia is reliance of the traveler one of the most well known and the most popular.

[Anonymous No.17589385]

>>17589379
NATO doesn't bomb civilians, NATO bomb jihadis hiding cowardly among civilians.

[OP No.17589401]

>>17589381
Sharia means revealed law. Fiqh means jurisprudence or codification of it. The Reliance is the most famous fiqh manual of the Shafi'i school of jurisprudence

The Reliance of the Traveler's fiqh on lying I covered in the last link here
>>17587992

[OP No.17589406]

>>17589385
>NATO doesn't bomb civilians

[Anonymous No.17589425]

>>17589401
So do you agree that sharia permits lying yes or no?

[OP No.17589442]

>>17589425
I agree it does under a handful of circumscribed conditions, none of which is "advances Islam"

[Anonymous No.17589452]

>>17588212
>doesn't deny the murder accusation

Muslims, everyone!

[Anonymous No.17589457]

>>17589406
No it doesn't. NATO tries its best to avoid civilian casualties and that's actually a huge impediment. Jihadis take advantage of this to hide behind civilian population, then when civilian casualties happen they whine on TV. That's your best infantry on the world.

[Anonymous No.17589463]

>>17588269
Source on that?

[OP No.17589467]

>>17589452
Your society allowed religion to be treated like a toilet and see what happens

[OP No.17589490]

>>17589457
American sanctions cost the lives of half a million Iraqis and kissinger said starvation is our greatest weapon. America specifically targeted civilians in WWII and Vietnam and they just call it shock and awe. You are deluding yourself.

[Anonymous No.17589506]

>>17589490
Pure copana. NATO tries its best to spare civilians and it provides relief and aid to populations. Jihadis go to kill unarmed civilian, women and children in the rear because they can't do better.

[OP No.17589513]

>>17589490
This is from the Gulf War, nothing even involving jihadists at all
https://www.newsweek.com/how-us-made-use-radioactive-bombs-routine-443732

[OP No.17589520]

>>17589506
Jihadiste don't target women or children, this is pure propaganda

[Anonymous No.17589525]

>>17589442
Stop playing jewish word games, faggot. Those "handful of circumscribed conditions" are things that advance islam, such as lying because you're too cowardly to die for you convictions. The law doesn't have to literally state "to advance islam" in order to advance islam. Are you sure you're not just jewish entirely?

[Anonymous No.17589532]

>>17589520
Stop lying, they do, unless you're playing jewish word games again and don't count non-muslim women or children as women or children.

[Anonymous No.17589540]

>>17589520
You can check it yourself https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Islamist_terrorist_attacks

[OP No.17589541]

>>17589532
They don't target women and children of infidels or kuffar

[OP No.17589549]

>>17589540
I see,so when women and children are killed as collateral with jihadists they're targets but with NATO they're not

[Anonymous No.17589551]

>>17589541
Stop lying, they do and you know it. You're just reinforcing how deceitful you people are.

[Anonymous No.17589557]

>>17589549
>as collateral
So when it's collateral it doesn't count? I'm getting really tired of your jewish word games.

[OP No.17589560]

>>17589525
You're inferring a general from a particular which is not feasible here because particulars are listed distictly precisely because the prohibition is general

[OP No.17589574]

>>17589551
NATO does. You call terrorism "shock and awe"

>>17589557
You don't count it for you but you do for jihadists, how come?

[Anonymous No.17589575]

>>17589560
And yet it's being abused constantly. So either the laws are wrong, or muslims lie a lot. You're still playing jewish word games. Why are you like this?
You also still haven't addressed how islam is going to save the world from degeneracy and decadence when muslims fall prey to it just as easily unless they're in some faraway desert cave.

[Anonymous No.17589577]

>>17589549
You lie like a big fat whore. Collateral damages are due to jihadis hiding behind women and children. NATO avoids civilian casualties and provides relief. It doesn't go hunting for civilians randomly like jihadis do. Jihadis go to kill women, children and unarmed civilians

[OP No.17589579]

>>17589575
>And yet it's being abused constantly
You're making this up

[Anonymous No.17589584]

>>17589574
Stop assuming. I'm not pro-NATO, I do count it for myself. This is your thread, I'm just calling out muslims on their hypocrisy.

[Anonymous No.17589591]

>>17589254
>Lying is allowed if it obtains a certain goal that cannot be achieved by truth.
Like spreading islam

[Anonymous No.17589595]

>>17587890
OP, how can we prevent muslims living in the West from degenerating to a western lifestyle?

[Anonymous No.17589597]

>>17589579
No I'm not, this is from experience. I'm from a European city with many muslims who act exactly like this.
>but they're not real muslims
Fuck off, Karl Marxhammed

[Anonymous No.17589603]

>>17589595
By leaving the west, back to your desert safe space.

[OP No.17589605]

>>17589577
YOU COME INTO OUR LANDS AND LEVEL OUR CITIES AND DESTROY OUR INDUSTRY TO SATISFY YOUR LUST FOR PETROLEUM AND THE ONLY WAY WE CAN FIGHT BACK IS THROUGH DESTROYING OURSELVES IN MARTYRDOM OPERATIONS AND YOU ACCUSE US OF HIDING? YOU FIGHT BEHIND A COMPUTER MANNING A DRONE YOU GUTLESS FILTH

[Anonymous No.17589615]

>>17589603
>desert
>safe space
that's an oxymoron if I've ever seen one.

[Anonymous No.17589617]

>>17589605
Lmao take your meds, schizo
Also "we" don't come into your lands, our globo-zion overlords do. It's your people who literally come to our lands to destroy it further than globo-zion ever could. You're such a hypocrite and a liar, OP.

[Anonymous No.17589621]

>>17589291
Technology, something you had plenty yet even that couldn't help you beat Israel (3 times, even when you held the advantage in technology and numbers you got your shit pushed in).

I expect this comment to get ignored because you'll close the reply window in their rage.

[Anonymous No.17589631]

>>17589615
Apparently the west corrupts muslims but according to OP living far away from it makes you into a good muslim, so it works out

[Anonymous No.17589633]

>>17589605
They're not "your" land Paki larper not everyone there want your jihadi scum and go all caps as much as you want, jihadis bombing bus will forever be coward scumbags preying on defenseless innocents.

[Anonymous No.17589646]

>>17589621
OP ignores a lot because he gets triggered easily and doesn't know as much as he thinks he does

[Anonymous No.17589650]

>>17589467
Your demented religion stinks like shit, correct.
Understand that before you make any more womanly threats.

[Anonymous No.17589651]

>>17589605
Bro, you're letting your anger get the best of you.
>A Companion went to the Prophet Muhammad and asked him, “O Prophet, I seek advice!”, the Prophet replied: ” Don’t get angry.” Then the man asked him, “What else?”, the Prophet Muhammad replied for the second time: “Don’t get angry.” The man asked again “what else?”, and the reply again was ” don’t get angry.” Anger blights both sight and sightedness.

[OP No.17589658]

>>17589617
You're gutless for serving them and doing nothing

>>17589621
Those governments established by you don't fight on our behalf and never have

>>17589633
You are completely mistaken if you think people in Pakistan are more sympathetic to NATO than Bin Laden.

[Anonymous No.17589667]

>>17589658
>You're gutless for serving them and doing nothing
You don't know shit about what I do. At least I don't worship their god like you do, coward.

[Anonymous No.17589671]

>>17589658
I don't care about Pakistan.

[Anonymous No.17589678]

>>17589574
Lmao please keep talking, nothing as effective against islam as a squirming muslim.
So far you've
>condoned murder of dissentors
>condoned terrorism
>said that muslims don't really do terrorism
>exposed yourself as another haji liar

Keep on the good fight my muslim friend

[Anonymous No.17589683]

>>17589658
And you won't address the fact that "we" don't come to your lands but you literally come to ours? You're a massive hypocrite, OP.

[OP No.17589697]

>>17589683
You vote in the people who send your drones over

[Anonymous No.17589709]

>>17589605
HAHAHAHAHA
>my host country that tolerates me out of sympathy deserves to have its civilians killed because some sandnigs are blowing themselves up in a country I've no relation to except my larp

Based retard, this is going into the screencap

[Anonymous No.17589724]

>>17589697
I don't, retard. I've always voted for the most anti-globo candidates. I don't want to bomb innocent people on the other side of the globe. You do. And you still worship their globalist god. Lmao

[Anonymous No.17589754]

>>17589633
It's not the responsibility of other Muslims to denounce the actions of misguided terrorists. We don't hold westerners accountable to the same standards, if else there'd be war already for what you have done to Libya Iraq and Syria.

And Muslims in the west experience psychological murder every day from cartoons, stigmatisation and racism by interim offices that discriminate them despite their skill being adequate.

[Anonymous No.17589768]

>>17589754
Then why do they come in the West if they experience "psychological murder" through cartoons?
>you have done to Libya Iraq and Syria.
Three countries ruined by islamism.

[Anonymous No.17589773]

>>17589754
The terrorism is supported by your own islamic sources and the fact they happen daily.

[Anonymous No.17589811]

>>17589768
A lot oof them came here because they were invited to work, and others like Algeria were colonized by the French, you reap what you sow.

>>17589773
Which sources? Killing innocents is haraam and congrats there are 2billion Muslims, of course some are going to do wrong things.
If all Muslims were bloodthirsty you wouldn't exist.

[Anonymous No.17589825]

>>17589811
>they were invited
>also reap what you sow kafir
Typical muslim, can't even be somehow coherent and has to shift the blame for its own failures. No wonder muslim countries are shitholes.

[Anonymous No.17589827]

Note most Muslim countries don't condone ISIS and what they are doing

[Anonymous No.17589856]

>>17589825
They were invited en masse, then ridiculed, then their home countries destroyed.

You reap what you sow.

[Your fathers' mother No.17589872]

You are all under the cock of the zionist, suc or die.

[Anonymous No.17589875]

>>17589856
Either that or their countries are shitholes and they're desperate for the good life in Europe, though I admit that murder through cartoons is a serious risk.
Anyway,
>Libya
Sunni chimpout
>Syria
Sunni chimpout alawi man bad
>Iraq
Sunni chimpout shia man bad

I see a pattern here.

[Anonymous No.17589888]

>>17588752
Because blasphemy doesn't involve killing people. I want you to have the right to practise your religion, but not to have the right to kill people for making you upset.

[Anonymous No.17589930]

>>17589875
>I see a pattern here.
Yes, It's usually the countries that suffered for 400 years of colonialism and imperialism and neocolonialism by the some western agents

[Anonymous No.17589931]

>>17589875
Libya and Syria got CIA'd. Any small faction can win if they have CIA trining and free american weaponry.

[Anonymous No.17589935]

>>17589811
>Which sources? Killing innocents is haraam and congrats there are 2billion Muslims, of course some are going to do wrong things.
If all Muslims were bloodthirsty you wouldn't exist.

You are required to fight the non believers this is solid doctrine quit trying to lie my guy.

o9.0 JIHAD
(O: Jihad means to war against non-Muslims, and is etymologically derived from the word mujahada
signifying warfare to establish the religion. And it is the lesser jihad. As for the greater jihad, it is
spiritual warfare against the lower self (nafs), which is why the Prophet (Allah bless him and give him
peace) said as he was returning from jihad.
``We have returned from the lesser jihad to the greater jihad.''
The scriptural basis for jihad, prior to scholarly consensus (def: b7) is such Koranic verses as:
(1) ``Fighting is prescribed for you'' (Koran 2:216);
(2) ``Slay them wherever you find them'' (Koran 4:89);
(3) ``Fight the idolators utterly'' (Koran 9:36);
and such hadiths as the one related by Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet (Allah bless him and give
him peace) said:
``I have been commanded to fight people until they testify that there is no god but Allah and that
Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and perform the prayer, and pay zakat. If they say it, they have
saved their blood and possessions from me, except for the rights of Islam over them. And their final
reckoning is with Allah'';
and the hadith reported by Muslim,
``To go forth in the morning or evening to fight in the path of Allah is better than the whole world
and everything in it.''Details concerning jihad are found in the accounts of the military expeditions of the
Prophet (Allah bless him and give him peace), including his own martial forays and those on which he
dispatched others. The former consist of the ones he personally attended, some twenty-seven (others say
twenty-nine) of them. He fought in eight of them, and killed only one person with his noble hand, Ubayy
ibn Khalaf, at the battle of Uhud. On the latter expeditions he sent others to fight, himself remaining at
Medina, and these were forty-seven in number.)

What do you mean a few?
This happens nearly on a daily basis.

[Anonymous No.17589942]

>>17589931
>got CIA'd
I am definitely remembering this one

[Anonymous No.17589953]

>>17589930
>400 years of colonialism
The only empire that lasted 400 years there was the Ottoman empire.
>>17589931
CIA doesn't shit millions of angry sunni out of its headquarters.

[Anonymous No.17589975]

>>17589953
>CIA doesn't shit millions of angry sunni out of its headquarters.
They also don't shit out millions of angry Catholics out of its headquarters, yet that didn't stop them from demolishing regimes in South America

[Anonymous No.17589976]

>>17587890
I am done with western women, I know a fair bit about islam and islamic culture. How do I take the Islampill and where to find a QT3.14 grill

[Anonymous No.17589985]

>>17589975
That's some really stupid whataboutism anon.
The point is that it's not the CIA who taught sunni to hate rafidi and alawi.

[Anonymous No.17589988]

>>17589976
>How do I take the Islampill and where to find a QT3.14 grill
Go to mosque, get help with converting. Muslims are generally acceptable, you just have to put out a word, where they commune, once you convert, and they will all scramble to find you a girl to marry.

[Anonymous No.17589997]

>>17589985
Fine I get the point. CIA just ignited the powder keg.

[Anonymous No.17590028]

>>17589997
No muslims are the powder keg and ignited themselves.

[Anonymous No.17590040]

>>17589988
Based always kinda had a soft spot for the religion and culture but that sounds based af. Ive got blonde hair and blue eyes tho so I've always kept the powerlevel hidden, do you think this will be an issue?

[Anonymous No.17590056]

>>17589976
Hint: you don't need to convert to get a muslim wife.

t. deflowered a few, had 3 propose to elope with me

[Anonymous No.17590083]

>>17590028
Sure, but let's also acknowledge that various Christian sects also fought between each other for thousands of years, this went up until 1950s in some countries, and even later with the UK and Ireland disputes which saw terrorist attack even in 1997, which is not so long ago.

[Anonymous No.17590092]

>>17590056
There is only like maybe two or three mosques in my state but I will do what I have to. What would I say ? like Ive never been to a mosque who would I even have to talk to the first time.

Also Im gonna want more sweet details man how did you do it sorry for the stupid questions Im just genuinely interested

[Anonymous No.17590094]

>>17590083
More irrelevant whataboutism. Muslims are a living joke.

[Anonymous No.17590112]

>>17590040
>Ive got blonde hair and blue eyes tho so I've always kept the powerlevel hidden, do you think this will be an issue?
Nah, this is all irrelevant once you're a Muslim. Also don't listen to this anon>>17590056
Sure you can do that, but it won't give you lasting satisfaction in life that a community and marriage can provide.

[Anonymous No.17590122]

>>17590094
>whataboutism
Stop throwing this word around when you have no idea what it means, or I will bitch slap you so hard your grandchildren will feel it.

[Anonymous No.17590124]

>>17590122
You tough boy behind your screen.

[Anonymous No.17590209]

>>17590112
Turning your back on your country and family for a 5th column culture won't be spiritually healthy either. Stop trying to prey on those who see the West's degeneracy. Their duty is to make their home country better, not to betray it and join a bunch of foreign invaders.

>>17590092
I met them online as that's the most the place you'll find, but muslim women are just like any people and repression and the resentful young men in their community together with struggling parents will make them seek out more intelligent, archetypical men. Acvording to the muslim women I have been intimate with: despite all their shortcomings western men still fit that definition. I could have easily accepted their desire to elope and start a family with them, but didn't becauseI was still very young (19-23).

Just be yourself, be confident, and do dare to make a move when you feel like they are opening up. But let them open up first.

Tldr meet them on penpal sites, your uni, libraries or book clubs, anywhere you can find introverted intelligent girls and be genuine. Become friends first and then showcase your worldviews by engaging in fulfilling conversation with them, after a few weeks they should text you first frequently, keep on talking and talking but don't make a move until a few months in when they're really hooked.

[Anonymous No.17590219]

>>17590209
most discrete place*

[Anonymous No.17590234]

>>17590209
Also the first moves should have plausible deniability: go for walks together, offer to discuss something irl or play a game online. Small steps first, then when she confesses feelings you go all in.

[Anonymous No.17590271]

>>17590209
to add to this: the muslim women that I dated were all virgins, and it was their first relationship too.

[Anonymous No.17590401]

>>17590112
Thanks for the advice bro I could see a conversion maybe in the future when I am more sure of things Im still young (22) Ill see where life takes me

>>17590209
Any websites for penpals or other good places online in particular? Thank you for the advice anon

[Anonymous No.17590575]

>>17590401
Interpals and tandem
Also try use social community websites, or something like aiesec

[Anonymous No.17590593]

>>17590401
And you're welcome, just don't get stabbed by the likes of OP for stealing his women from under his nose. Not that he will, the only thing the donesticated seethers can do is yell something in Arabic when you walk hand in hand with their qts.

[Anonymous No.17590600]

>>17589090
Meanwhile in Pakistan
>Europe as it is seen as not an optimal environment at least compared to Pakistan

[Anonymous No.17590676]

>>17590575
>>17590209
If you don't mind, where (ballpark) do you live? And were you learning Arabic or anything when you had penpals?

[Anonymous No.17590699]

>>17590676
Germany
I just had an interest in their history, but never in Islam (the latter sucks)

[Anonymous No.17590746]

>>17590676
Im not >>17590699
I live in Maine so you can imagine there isnt much other than boring white women

[Anonymous No.17590756]

>>17590699
>>17590593
>>17590209
i am this guy

[Anonymous No.17590757]

>>17590676
>>17590746
Oh forgot to add I had an interest in learning arabic but that was like 7 or 8 years ago maybe longer

[Anonymous No.17590943]

>>17589090
regardless of being less religious or not (would explain why they go to europe even though they are explicitly told not to unless they are invading it.

[Anonymous No.17591495]

>>17589975
That is what I don't get about you muslims instead of sucking up to the fact you are what islam has been and has been for a long time why is it that you always result to tu qouque fallacies as if it makes your religion any less acceptable.