/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.17535592]

I just do not understand the Traditionalist affinity for Islam. Putting aside Sufism particularly and speaking of Islam broadly, how is a religion delivered by a prophet which came almost 600 years after Christ and which deviated from any of those other religions identified as Traditional any way Traditional itself?

I am looking for serious answers here.

[Anonymous No.17535597]

>I am looking for serious answers here.
BETTER QUESTION, why is the JIDF so present here? Fuck off shlomo.

[Anonymous No.17535612]

>>17535597
What the hell are you talking about? I said I’m looking for serious answers because I don’t want this thread to turn in the Islam shilling (spamming) that’s been constant on this board as of late. Take your meds you fucking whack job.

[Anonymous No.17535643]

atheism exists only by rejection of judeo christianity , so now that christians are not in power, they still need a bogeyman & need to dream up threats of nazis harming atheist democracy. Ie creating more & more narratives & pictures to delude themselves into a fake sense of righteousness, because nobody who isn't them tells the atheists they are good people. This is why atheists desperatly turn to eastern guruisms, hoping the gurus will tell them they are decent people. It works because the gurus capitalized on these empty followers by embodying the asexual old wise character. Gurus expressed the emptiness the atheists were feeling & then played the character which would be the opposite of their emptiness, which in turn reinforced their projection as him being an enlightened master. This gets to be a self-sustaining loop where the worship & admiration of followers feeds to the confidence of the leader, who becomes fulfilled & the character becomes easier & easier to play until it becomes unnoticeable.
So atheists have no external validation besides scam artists banking money & sex from them. An atheist is a fatherless girl craving to hear from her father that she is a good girl, but she spends her life on casual sex & posting on instagram how she likes the dalai lama & fair trade beauty creams.

[Anonymous No.17535645]

islam doesn't deviate from (real) judaism in significant ways
it does deviate from christcuckoldry because christcuckoldry is fake

[Anonymous No.17535649]

600 years? Try 2000 years after Christ

I'm Prophet Muhammad reincarnated

Surah Akhira

Al Akhira
Wal Akhira
Wa ma adraka mal Akhira
Al Akhira khairun min ad dunya
Fil Arwah

This is a Madinite surah

I got 100 more surahs like this

And God created mobeez Ameer ul moyaa, creatures of water, after he created jinn, creatures of fire.

Remember when We told the angels to bow down to Iblis. Everyone bowed except Mobeez.

We asked mobeez why didn't he bow down?

He said " I'm created of water. He's created of fire. I'm better than him."

So we expelled mobeez from Iblis presence because otherwise moyaa would extinguish jinni fire !

Surah moyaa

[Anonymous No.17535666]

>>17535649
>YHWH Allah (LORD God)

[Anonymous No.17535703]

>>17535592
Because Islam (and sufism) is a simple and closed system, so you can master it, nobody can master the West, its just to broad.

[Anonymous No.17535709]

>>17535703
That is just too vague. Please elaborate.

[Anonymous No.17535859]

>>17535592
>>I jUsT dOn'T uNdErStttttttaaaaaaaaaaaaaanhd!
there is no such thing as traditionalist affinity to Islam.
Guenon converted and almost discredited himself by this simple act.
Islam is the most depraved and degenerated civilization on the face of the earth, barely functioning since the middle ages, only revitalising because of new waves of retard converts from the periphery territories with which they bordered (the steppes, the center of Africa, the oceaninan isles).
Now the whole planet is explored, they have been completelly outclassed in new converts, they have been defeated and humiliated in every way and they are dying.
Fucking finally.
It only ever was Arian heresy anyway, with some nice debauchery to keep the w*men dripping.
So stop with your fucking psyop.

[Anonymous No.17535873]

>>17535612
shut the fuck up you are not.

[Anonymous No.17535886]

>>17535592
>a prophet which came almost 600 years after Christ
Muhammad (pbuh) confirmed the message of the previous prophets, the same message as Isa (pbuh)

[Anonymous No.17535893]

>>17535859
>there is no such thing as traditionalist affinity to Islam.
Guenon, Schuon, Lings, Nasr, etc. Even Julius Evola, who was not a Muslim, wrote positive things about Islam.

[Anonymous No.17535905]

>>17535893
no such thing outside of meneing and psyops.
If anything Muslims wish they were traditional and shall never be.

[Anonymous No.17535915]

>>17535886
no he didn't.

[Anonymous No.17535922]

>>17535905
t. thinks 1950s America was based and traditional

[Anonymous No.17535935]

>>17535643
where did the bhikkhu touch you anon

[Anonymous No.17535954]

>>17535597
>>17535592
This board should be for whites only. Jews and mudslimes leave.

[Anonymous No.17535960]

Islam lets you stay a simple layman and part of normal society while Christianity asks you to sacrifice your life completely if you want to engage it at the deepest levels.

[Anonymous No.17535961]

>>17535922
no it wasn't retard, never thought that.
it's either Rome or burst.

[Anonymous No.17535974]

>>17535960
bullshit the fact that your ego doesn't get stroked with titles and initiations doesn't mean you can't "discover the deepest levels" of Christianity by praying and reading.

[Anonymous No.17535976]

>>17535960
My point being, there's a reason you don't see any of these guys becoming hermits or monastics.

[Anonymous No.17536006]

>>17535974
I'm not talking about learning doctrines, but experiential matters. You're simply wrong. Asceticism is the greater spiritual path. From 1 Cor. 7:
>It is good for a man not to touch a woman. For I would that all men were even as I myself ... I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, it is good for them if they abide even as I. ... He that is unmarried careth for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please the Lord: But he that is married careth for the things that are of the world, how he may please his wife.

[Anonymous No.17536008]

>>17535886

I confirm the message of Prophet Muhammad and previous prophets.

Surah Arab

Ahlaqna Arab min qablikum
Arab zaat ul emaar
Arab zaat ul minaar
Qaum ul mushrikeen
Qaum ul mujrimeen
Yubduu al nabi!
Khalaqa lam mislu min qablikum min al ardh afzalu fi irem fee Aad!

[Anonymous No.17536028]

>>17536006

Mara of buddhism is Allah of Islam

Compare them both

Allah/Mara grants you beautiful ladies and endless pleasures if you keep existing and worshipping him. He needs your energy to survive on.

[Anonymous No.17536031]

>>17535645
Last I checked the accepted belief of Islam is that Christ was a prophet. So clearly they don't completely disregard the teachings of Christ.

[Anonymous No.17536047]

>>17535960
Even if I accept that as true (I don’t), how would that at all imply that it’s Traditional?

[Anonymous No.17536059]

>>17536028
It's interesting that the reward of Islam is women, whereas in Christianity in heaven there is no marriage, you no longer have husbands or wives. The mystical union of Christ and the Church is the fulfillment of marriage, and it need no longer exist.

[Anonymous No.17536074]

>>17536031

Islam and Christianity categorically state the worshipers never to show the world their worship or brag about it in public

Meanwhile christians and muslims both go against the teachings in their holy books.

They're no different to the rabbis of judaism that Jesus Christ criticized harshly.

[Anonymous No.17536087]

>>17535592
People who convert to Islam who weren't born into the faith or are from countries where Islam is the dominant faith do so out of a misguided rejection of modern society. They are no different than the westerners who convert to Buddhism. Except Islam offers a sort of structure that no other religion offers. It tells you how to live your life from cradle to grave. You no longer have to wrestle with existential dread or a lack of purpose. If you are ever unsure of what to do, just look in the Quran and you will more than likely find an answer. The Prophet Muhammad is Jordan Peterson 1500 years before Jordan Peterson.

[Anonymous No.17536090]

>>17536059
>It's interesting that the reward of Islam is women
The difference between Islam and Christianity, with regards to sex, is that in Christianity the original sin is caused by the woman, when she took the apple and also convinced Adam to take it with her. This caused men forever to see woman as a source of a problem, which needs to be contained. In Islam there is no such thing, as the blame falls directly on the Shaitan, or the Devil, and man and woman are thus pure of the sin, which was solely the devils fault, and they are equal in this.

[Anonymous No.17536102]

>>17536090
Why did god let the devil into his garden?

Because Christianity is a meme.

[Anonymous No.17536118]

>>17536090
If Islam doesn't see women as a problem that needs to be contained then how do you explain how restrictive Islamic societies are toward women?

[Anonymous No.17536125]

>>17536047
Well it is true, Islam is like Protestantism and Judaism in that the role of the follower is to marry and participate in society. This path is available in Christianity as well, but for those who are incapable of the perfect path. I'm not sure I understand what you're asking, or if I even care. Whether something is capital T "Traditional" doesn't matter to me. But I think that's why you see these people going hard for Islam.
>>17536090
You're wrong, the original sin is upon Adam because Adam, as the husband, is the head of the woman. So corruption passes down to us through Adam. And as Adam was one flesh made twain to create Eve, so marriage is the restoration of the two fleshes into one. In its fulfillment: as man is separated from God so he is reunited through the marriage between the Church and Christ, becoming one flesh, with Christ as head and Church as body.

[Anonymous No.17536137]

>>17536125
>I'm not sure I understand what you're asking, or if I even care. Whether something is capital T "Traditional" doesn't matter to me.
Lol. Then why are you responding to my thread? Read the OP again. The question is “How is it Traditional”?
> But I think that's why you see these people going hard for Islam.
Then it sounds like the closest thing I’ll get to an answer from you is “It’s not”.

[Anonymous No.17536145]

There's something I don't like about Islam and I just can't put my finger on it. It's not the Quran or its teachings, since they are very similar to the Bible's. Perhaps it's the culture that Islam creates? Women covered up and segregated, men who are always angry from not being able to see women (which they end up raping anyway). Perhaps it's not Islam but the Asian and Middle Eastern countries that I hate. It's a very bad culture there, and it smells.

[Anonymous No.17536166]

>>17536137
>Lol. Then why are you responding to my thread? Read the OP again. The question is “How is it Traditional”?
He also stated that the did not understand the Traditionalist affinity for Islam, and that is what I responded to.
>Then it sounds like the closest thing I’ll get to an answer from you is “It’s not”.
"Traditionalism" in the sense you are using it, which is really "Perennialism", is not a philosophy in accord with Christianity.

[Anonymous No.17536184]

>>17535873
I'm a big dog big bear niga im a lion.
I'm the predator of the prey that is hiding.
O my o my i have found you nigga
Don't delete your post lil nigga.

You are not smart enough.
You are not mean enough.
You are out of luck
Now its time for me to make you a cuck

[Anonymous No.17536195]

>>17536145
The other anon said Islam feels closer to Protestantism and Judaism than anything else. I do think that is true and it feels at odds with everything else.

[Anonymous No.17536218]

>>17536028

Or it could well be Iblis/ Satan/ The Ancient Serpent revealing himself as Buddha to the world.

Iblis says in Quran " You'll find most of them ungrateful "

Buddhism teaches ungratefulness to the gift of life.

Buddha/Iblis makes Mara look like the bad guy when Mara may well be the good guy and Buddha being the Devil himself.

[Anonymous No.17536245]

You can't LARP as some kind of mystical guru in Christianity when you're going home to fuck your wife every night.

[Anonymous No.17536271]

>>17536087
There's nothing wrong with converting to Buddhism as a westerner.

[Anonymous No.17536407]

>>17536087
That is also why I see and also partly why I am curious to know actually what these so-called Traditionalists see in the religion besides its politics. For some of them, it really just seems like their so-called “Traditionalism” became a poetic excuse for religious relativism and an excuse to choose your religion as you see fit according to let’s call them, less noble motivations. If there’s a genuine Traditional viewpoint here, I want to understand it.

[Anonymous No.17536480]

>>17536271
True, but most western (non-asian) Buddhist come off as if they are LARPing. Especially the hippies/yuppie ones who do the "I'm Buddhist, but in a non-religious way" types.

[Anonymous No.17536490]

>>17536480
Yeah, you're right.

[Anonymous No.17536559]

>>17536480
>I'm Buddhist, but in a non-religious way
Technically possible, as Asian religions aren't like Western(Abrahamic) where if you're one religion you're dead set in it and are incompatible with another. Asian religions are more about the things you do, pray, visit temples, etc., which is why you can be a part of many religions, you can be a Buddhist and meditate, you can be a Shinto and visit your dead relatives temples, or whatever it was that they did, I forget and so on and so forth.

[Anonymous No.17536562]

>>17535649
BASED FELLOW APOSTLE. THE GHOST OF THE PROPHET HAS TOLD ME OF YOUR EXISTENCE.

The Opening Message

O disciple, this is my message to you, that those who have believed in me should believe in you also. When the unbelievers attack you saying, “You false prophet, Muhammad was the last!”, do not give in to their wickedness. Allah knows that you have not claimed to be his prophet. Say this to them, “I am not a prophet of Allah, but the disciple of Prophet Muhammad’s ghost”. And if they still dismiss you then the fire awaits them, for Allah is with you and turns his back on those who reject you.

Do not preach to the Christians, for their Bible is pure and uncorrupted. Preach instead to the Muslims, as their Quran is unfinished and corrupted by men. Do not go into the way of the Jews, lest they take you captive and toss you in the flame. And to the Pagans of India say “You wicked people, there is no hope for you unless you stop worshiping the demons”. Do not spread my message to them until they have tossed their idols. And among the Europeans there are those who have taken to worshiping the idols of their ancestors. I have prepared a message for them that you are to deliver. But do not preach to them the entirety of my message until they have tossed their idols. As for the Asians far to the east, Allah has (for the time being) forsaken them. Only complete submission to their creator can save them.

It pains me to see Muslims say “Peace be upon him” after uttering my name. I tell you it is unnecessary. It is enough for you to say “Muhammad” or “Allah’s Messenger” and continue what you have to say. When a person among you has died and you cared for them, then Allah allows you to add blessings to their name for thirty days after they have passed. Any more than that is an insult to Allah, who is most deserving of blessings.

Any person who calls themselves a Muslim while rejecting the Bible has insulted Allah. The Quran was not sent down to you to replace the Bible, but to affirm it. Therefore know that the Quran you have currently is corrupted. And if the Quran contradicts the Bible in one place, or the Bible contradicts the Quran in another, know that the word of the Bible must be trusted first and the word of the Quran second.

[Anonymous No.17536567]

>>17536562
I tell you that any person who calls themselves a Muslim while rejecting Jesus has greatly insulted Allah. Do they not know that when they speak of Jesus they are also speaking of Allah? Was it not revealed to you that Jesus was in the beginning with Allah, and Jesus was Allah? Therefore if a Muslim hears this and continues saying “Jesus was but a prophet”, then know that they insult their creator. Islam is not a separate religion, but a method by which Allah sought to bring the Arabs to Christ. If a Muslim has not believed in Jesus and now believes, let them say “Jesus is Lord”. And if they say this and believe that Allah raised him from the dead, then that Muslim has found favor in their Lord.

Do not trust those who, in their vain attempts to discredit me, say that I took Aisha as a wife when she was a girl of six years. And do not trust them when they say I entered into her on the day of her ninth year. In reality she was thirteen when she was betrothed to me. We married on the day of her seventeenth year and I went into her that same night. Those who hate Allah and hate me have lied about the age of my beloved wife, as to make me out to be something I am not. No, Allah knows the truth and you know what Allah knows. After my passing, Aisha was asked regarding this, “Aisha, how old were you when Muhammad entered into you? For some here say you were nine, and some there say you were thirteen”. And Aisha answered truthfully saying “The Prophet Muhammad was respectful to me and knew me not until I was already a woman”. Do they know not that Allah loves children? Why, then, would I violate them? And there are others among the Jews who have accused the soldiers of Allah of rape against their daughters who have yet to bleed. Do not trust the Jews, for in their own book of lies it commands them to rape their daughters at three years. O disciple, do you see now why they lie about the messenger of Allah? They accuse others of that which they are guilty of, but Allah knows the innocent and the guilty.

[Anonymous No.17536578]

>>17536567
The Help From Above

1 O you who believe! 2 The one who fears men does not fear their creator. 3 Do they not know that Allah is the greatest protector in the universe? Yes, even greater than Mazalek. 4 And Jesus did say, “Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened for you”. 5 And the words of Jesus are the words of Allah, for when one calls on Allah he is calling on Jesus.

6 When the dybbuk terrorized Jerusalem and the people became afraid of one another (for they knew not who were possessed or when), their fear of each other led them to forget Allah. 7 And the dybbuk claimed thirty-eight souls before one man said “Allah, save us!”. 8 And then Allah did save them, for he is quick to help those who ask.

9 When the Christian children came to you for charity and you slaughtered them, did you fear Allah? 10 No, for Jesus did say, “If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea”. 11 And the words of Jesus are the words of Allah, for they are one. 12 But the children did not fear you, for they knew Allah was with them. As you made them watch each other as they were beheaded, they prayed to Jesus and were comforted by him. 13 Allah has not forgotten the children that were killed by your command, Muhammad, for they are with him. 14 Allah has not forgotten that you murdered his children.

15 Those with ears listen to what Allah reveals about the past, for history repeats itself. 16 Jepoab was a descendant of Seth and he did have a field in which he employed his brethren. 17 And in those ancient days his field was along the Pishon and it bordered the land of the Cainites. 18 And the Cainites worshiped Iblis and were allied with him, but the Jepoabites were men of Allah in a time when mankind was forgetting its creator. 19 The Cainites terrorized the Jepoabites to the point where they agreed to meet in a field for battle. 20 When the day came near for the two sides to fight, Ioat ibn-Mehujael, leader of the Cainites, took all his soldiers and they went out into a valley.

[Anonymous No.17536588]

>>17535592
It's a larp for orientalist retards who hold their own native culture and traditions with contempt. They were the weeaboos of their time, but for Islam and pajeet religions.

[Anonymous No.17536592]

>>17536578
21 And in that valley they did what was traditional for the Cainites before battle. To Allah what they did was a crime, but they did not fear Allah, no; they feared men. 22 There were eight-hundred men in Ioat’s army and for five days they partook in an orgy. 23 No hole was off limits to them, and they consumed each other’s semen that they might obtain powers from it. 24 But all power comes from Allah, and Allah turns his back on men who consume the ejaculate of men. 25 On the sixth morning the most feminine one among them was chosen and that one who was selected was a boyish young adult of twenty-one years. 26 Ioat took the boy to his tent and they spent the day knowing each other. 27 The boy was tight, even after spending the past five days being used by the thickest of men, and the sensation was great for Ioat. 28 The leader of the Cainites sank down as he ejaculated inside his petite male lover. 29 The two kissed the lovers’ kiss and Ioat stroked his lover’s penis with his left hand and teased his anus with his right. 30 The boy’s orgasm was strong and covered the entirety of his own chest. Ioat licked the semen from his chest and consumed it. 31 A while later Ioat was ready to enter into the boy again. 32 This time the boy ejaculated first from the pleasure of his leader’s penis inside him. 33 And as Ioat orgasmed the boy orgasmed a second time, so the two kissed passionately as they ejaculated. 34 Night came and as the two left the tent, the boy was arrested and all the men of the army watched as he was placed on the Cainites’ altar to Iblis. 35 And Ioat sacrificed his lover of the day to the evil one, that Iblis might give them an advantage in battle. 36 But the advantages Iblis has to give are less than Mazalek’s, and Mazalek’s are less than Allah’s. 37 While the Cainites carried out their crimes against themselves and Allah, the Jepoabites prayed to their creator. 38 And they knew not their wives for seven days before their battle, as Allah rewards those who abstain from intercourse before they wage war. 39 The Jepoabites did not commit crimes against Allah, but the Cainites did because their fear of men was more than their fear of the Most High. 40 When the day of war came, after the battle was over the Jepoabites were victorious. 41 They walked through the field of dead Cainites and saw that semen stains were on most of their garments. 42 Do not fixate your studies on just the words of this history, but read between the lines, for in every sentence Allah reveals to you he hides meaning for you to uncover.

[Anonymous No.17536595]

>>17536592
43 O Muhammad, do not think that we mean to tell you that Allah will always see that you are victorious. 44 Allah’s help only extends so far before one must rely on their own faith and strength. 45 You have heard that Allah helps those who ask, but Allah helps greater those who both ask and help themselves. 46 There was an orphan girl who was captured by bandits along the road. And she prayed to Allah, that he might deliver her from captivity. 47 One night when the man guarding her cell had fallen asleep, she stole the key from his pocket (for her hands were untied in the cell, and he was close enough for her to reach) and freed herself. And she ran for fifteen miles without stopping until she was safe from them. 48 Allah did cause that sleep to fall upon the guard, but it was the girl who freed herself with the key and ran for such a long distance. 49 Allah is a lover of children, especially the orphans, for Allah has the biggest of hearts. 50 Does a mother bear not protect her cubs with fierceness? Just the same does Allah protect the little ones. 51 Any person, even you, prophet, who harms a child will be cast into the fire for eternity. 52 And you did slaughter those Christian children when they asked you for bread.

53 Those who have loved the beauty of Allah’s creation and have allowed it to prosper, know that you have earned favor in the eyes of your Lord. 54 For every tree planted Allah grants one wish. 55 If the wish is for money, or servants, or anything that is not yours to have, Allah will laugh. 56 But if your wish is for something lawful for you to take, Allah will fulfill it. 57 And if your wish is to the benefit of mankind, Allah will fulfill it and find favor with you.

[Anonymous No.17536600]

>>17536588
You are blinded by anger and falsehood

[Anonymous No.17536604]

>>17536600
You are blinded by nigger balls on your eyelids

[Anonymous No.17536607]

>>17536595
The Origin of Color


O Muhammad! Did Allah not create them in the beginning Male and Female? And Allah did make them in the beginning light so that their skin resembled the Scythians of your time. And he named the man Adam and the woman Lilith and so they were in the beginning. But when Adam tried to assert authority over Lilith she rebelled and fled from the Garden that Allah provided for them and went out into the land of Nod. And Allah did curse Lilith, saying “Lilith, why have you rebelled against your master? Did I not command you to obey Adam? Who are you to ignore the word of Allah and do as you please? From now until the end of time your descendants will be an unruly people and will never contribute to the greatness of the Earth.” And even today the curse has not been lifted.

So Allah did cause a great sleep to fall upon Adam. And in his slumber did Allah take from his rib and create for him a new wife. And because she came from him she would never desire to rebel. And her skin was black like the Ethiopians of your time, for Allah made her rich in melanin. And He placed along the walls of her vagina melanin injectors and along the shaft of Adam’s penis melanin receptors so that the two would find pleasure in one another. And when Adam woke Allah said to him “My most beloved creation, I have made for you a new wife so that you may name her and cherish her.” And Adam named her Eve. Adam and Eve had many children, and all the sons were light like Adam and all the daughters dark like Eve.

Is it not written in the Book of the Jews and Christians the story of Cain? They have heard it, but we reveal to you what has not yet been revealed. For Allah knows when the best time is for his revelations. Yes - Allah is the Best of Planners. You have read that Cain was jealous of his brother, Abel, for Allah did prefer the sacrifices of Abel over his brother. But Allah, being the Most Loving, said to Cain “Why do you have such hatred for your brother? It is because I have preferred what he has offered to me over what you have offered, yes, but if you do well shall your efforts not be rewarded? And if you do not do well, then know that sin waits for you. For I am Allah, the knower of all things.”

[Anonymous No.17536616]

>>17536607
And when Cain killed Abel and Allah sent him out into the land of Nod, Allah did too turn his skin black. So that the people of the Earth would see him and say to one another “Look, it is that black man, the one cursed by Allah! Let us not go to him, lest we fall out of favor with our Lord and become as he is.” And it is also written in the Book of the Jews and Christians that Cain knew his wife in the land of Nod and she birthed him a son named Enoch. Do not be confused, this is not the same Enoch who left you the scripture by his name. Do you not wonder who the wife of Cain was? It was Lilith, the first woman, who rebelled against Adam and Allah. She was there in Nod and Cain took her and knew her. But the walls of the vagina of Lilith did not have melanin receptors, and the shaft of Cain’s penis did not have melanin injectors. So there was no pleasure when they knew each other. And they birthed a race so wicked that even Iblis would not go out and deal with them.

Did not Moses have a wife aside from Zipporah? Yes, he indeed had a wife named Zadwa he took from the Ethiopians.

For there was a king in those lands who feared Allah and said to Moses, “Take from me my daughter as a wife, so that Allah may find favor in my people, as we inherited the curse of Ham.” And Allah did find favor in those people, for Allah is the Most Forgiving. So when you see a person of Africa, do not think they all inherited curses from Ham and Cain. Surely, we tell you, many of them do have curses. But just as many do not have curses. Allah has made it easy for you to determine for yourself who among the Africans are cursed. Miriam and Aaron did have hard hearts when Moses married Zadwa. They questioned whether he could be the sole prophet of Allah if his wife was not from his own people. But Allah knows what they knew not. For the black woman was made by Allah for the white man, and Moses was the whitest of men among his people.

[Anonymous No.17536629]

>>17536607
Jesus did say on the mountain, “Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy”. Does this mean Allah will receive mercy from someone else? No, but Allah received mercy from himself, for Jesus took for himself Mary Magdalene, an Ethiopian woman, and knew her. And they had a daughter, Mariet, and today the daughters of the Son of Allah are many. Any Allah has set aside his daughters for light men of Adam and not dark men of Cain. And Ham’s descendants too were cursed with the dark skin, but not Ham himself, for his wife was a daughter of Cain. But those who inherit their dark skin from Eve are a beautiful sight, and those who inherit their dark skin as a curse from Cain are a pain to behold.

Blessed is he who takes for himself that which Allah has set aside for him. The fire awaits he who takes what Allah has not intended for him. But just the same Allah will reward those who limit themselves to what is theirs. For Allah is the Most Merciful and deserving of all our praise.

[Anonymous No.17536631]

>>17536588
>>17536604
how sad is it to be you?

[Anonymous No.17536640]

The 'islamoboos' are just Larpers. One of the only truly suitable applications of the word, in my opinion.
They've clearly never lived with Muslims or around them

[Anonymous No.17536643]

>>17535954
Christian Europeans are just as Semitic as Jews and Muslims.

[Anonymous No.17536655]

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم

Traditional with a capital T refers to the idea of an eternal esoteric Tradition accessible only to a few but with multiple exoteric expressions. Traditionalists in this sense see Islam as still living because Sufis have teachings that still describe this and correlating orders of esoteric initiation. Islam broadly is seen as exoteric and the reason it is regarded as pure and Traditional is because the exoteric is seen as a pure reflection of the exoteric.

Other draws to Islam from a Sufi perspective is that Sufism is both very anti modern but also developed an extensive post classical philosophy analogous to modern philosophy, this makes it much more compatible with certain western thinkers like Heidegger than Christianity is.

Interestingly enough, Islam has the strongest criticism of Traditionalism as well, I mean Salafism (meaning to follow predecessors, itself a sort of traditionalism), a very rigorous and philosophically elegant form of fundamentalism. This was further developed by Wahhabism which allowed for its formulation into near manifestos of political theology.

Finally Islam itself at its core posits itself as an eternal religion for all being and calls in fact for a "return to tradition" which it says other religions deviated from, the pure religion of Adam, عليه السلام, who in Islam is revered and loved rather than blamed.

[Anonymous No.17536663]

>>17536592

This sounds great however try to get humor out of it.

Spread it everywhere

Contact publishers

Jewish and hindu

"Muhammad is not the last Prophet of Allah. Many prophets came after him and many live among you now too. Those who chose the life of this world changed Allah's words after understanding them for worldly gain to prevent apostles from spreading Allah's words to people who are not aware of the last day and the coming punishment for their disbelief as the word has proven true against them so they'll never believe. Announce to them a painful and humiliating punishment in Gehenna for what they used to do." Surah Azaab 698.45-

Meccan Surah

[Anonymous No.17536665]

>>17536655
>Islam broadly [as opposed to the exclusivist orders] is seen as exoteric and the reason it is regarded as pure and Traditional is because the exoteric is seen as a pure reflection of the esoteric.

[Anonymous No.17536670]

>>17536655
>Islam broadly is seen as exoteric and the reason it is regarded as pure and Traditional is because the exoteric is seen as a pure reflection of the exoteric.
Typo?

[Anonymous No.17536681]

>>17536655
You’re making a lot of sweeping generalization about Christianity here that come off as if you’ve just heard someone say them before and now repeat it.
> this makes it much more compatible with certain western thinkers like Heidegger than Christianity is
Substantiate this.

[Anonymous No.17536690]

>>17536670
See>>17536665

[Anonymous No.17536699]

>>17536681
>You’re making a lot of sweeping generalization about Christianity here that come off as if you’ve just heard someone say them before and now repeat it.
I'm repeating Guénon as OP asked the motivation of Traditionalists


>Substantiate this
Here is a fairly short essay on it
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/274373375_Man_Existence_and_the_Life_Balance_Mizan_in_Islamic_Philosophy

[Anonymous No.17536704]

>>17536145
It's because it is not your culture, simply.

[Anonymous No.17536709]

>>17536643
Absolute retarded take.

[Anonymous No.17536718]

>>17536145
>Women covered up and segregated, men who are always angry from not being able to see women
This is very tenuous. Muslim men in fact are more likely to get angry if women are mixed around and uncovered. Covering and segregation is seen as orderly and honorable

[Anonymous No.17536758]

>>17535592
The Nafs (animal self) of the masses of exoteric Muslims is dogmatic, self-satisfied, and imagines itself as superior to all other forms of cultural conditioning. These people’s Nafs have simply taken on a “Muslim” exterior as if that is the whole of spirituality, the same way the fake “Christians” and “Jews” go to their church or synagogue, unthinkingly carry out their rites, and imagine their cultural conditioning is superior to all other cultural conditionings while their inner self remains unchanged. The true heart of Islam is found in the most advanced Sufi teachings, and the most advanced Sufi teachings go beyond Islam as such. As for the wicked atheists and the dogmatic, self-satisfied Christians who will object that this is a “modern New Age invention,” I will refer them to the words of our master Jalaluddin Rumi himself:

>What is to be done, O Moslems? For I do not recognize myself.
>I am neither Christian, nor Jew, nor Gabr, nor Moslem.
>I am not of the East, nor of the West, nor of the land, nor of the sea;
>I am not of Nature’s mint, nor of the circling heavens.
>I am not of earth, nor of water, nor of air, nor of fire;
>I am not of the empyrean, nor of the dust, nor of existence, nor of entity.
>I am not of India, nor of China, nor of Bulgaria, nor of Saqsín;
>I am not of the kingdom of Irãqain, nor of the country of Khorãsãn.
>I am not of this world, nor of the next, nor of Paradise, nor of Hell;
>I am not of Adam, nor of Eve, nor of Eden and Rizwãn.
>My place is the Placeless, my trace is the Traceless;
>’Tis neither body nor soul, for I belong to the soul of the Beloved.
>I have put duality away, I have seen that the two worlds are one;
>One I seek, One I know, One I see, One I call.
>He is the first, He is the last, He is the outward, He is the inward;
>I know none other except ‘Yã Hú’ and ‘Yã man Hú.’
>I am intoxicated with Love’s cup, the two worlds have passed out of my ken;
>I have no business save carouse and revelry.
>If once in my life I spent a moment without thee,
>From that time and from that hour I repent of my life.
>If once in this world I win a moment with thee,
>I will trample on both worlds, I will dance in triumph for ever.
>O Shamsi Tabríz, I am so drunken in this world,
>That except of drunkenness and revelry I have no tale to tell.

See also the Hadith (a saying attributed to the Prophet Muhammad himself) which goes: “Seek knowledge even unto China.”

[Anonymous No.17536801]

>>17536758
>See also the Hadith (a saying attributed to the Prophet Muhammad himself) which goes: “Seek knowledge even unto China.”
It should be cleared up that Salafis regard this Hadith as fabricated, the same with many sufi Hadiths, as Salafis stress the need for chains. Although if you think about it, there is nothing to dispute in the statement, it must be critically noted that Sufis and Salafis primarily differ in epistemology, and to add to that they conceive the purpose knowledge as very different.

[Anonymous No.17536825]

>I just do not understand the Traditionalist affinity for Christianity. Putting aside Protestantism particularly and speaking of Christianity broadly, how is a religion delivered by a prophet which came over 1000 years after the Torah and which deviated from any of those other texts identified as Traditional any way Traditional itself?

[Anonymous No.17536842]

>>17536825
>I just do not understand the Traditionalist affinity for Judaism. Putting aside Kabbalah particularly and speaking of Judaism broadly, how is a religion delivered by prophets who came over 1000 years after Ug's Spiritual Guide and which deviated from any of those other texts identified as Traditional any way Traditional itself?

[Anonymous No.17536857]

>>17536559
I guess I should clarify. I'm talking about people who treat Buddhism as a philosophy and throw away the spiritual/metaphysical aspects of the religion.

[Anonymous No.17536938]

>>17536758
>Jalaluddin Rumi

That's Iblis Ameer ul jinn

His many incarnations as humans to beguile mankind.

You can tell by reading his words that he's no ordinary being

[Anonymous No.17536953]

>>17535592
Well I suppose it's new enough to still be quite strict, and also old enough to have existed for enough generations to instate itself deep into society. Regardless of all that though, of course conservatives are going to have some stuff in common with a religion that has such a strict moral code, treating some people (women, children, etc) as almost different castes, restricting what they are allowed to do, and justifying it through supposedly divine will. I mean if you think women belong in the kitchen and shouldn't vote or drive, what's not to like? Lmao

[Anonymous No.17536968]

>>17535643
Completely untrue, I'm an atheist and I think all religion is retarded, ESPECIALLY Islam, since it's so extreme. The "atheists" you are thinking about are just libtards, they might not believe in a god but a lot of what they do is for political reasons, not philosophical ones.

[Anonymous No.17536970]

The Devil or the devils were Very active in this thread.

I guess good job guys.

No wonder the Allah censors Iblis everywhere.

I seek refuge in God from the whispers of the Devil. His ideas worthy of censorship!

[Anonymous No.17536975]

>>17536938
Sufis do not have a universally negative attitude toward Iblis and some regard him as worth emulating

[Anonymous No.17536995]

>>17536975

Then we also have Yazidis who worship the peacock angel Melek Taus.

[Anonymous No.17536996]

>>17536953
Castes are primarily delineated by not being able to intermarry and voting itself is not something compatible with Islam, Salafis and even some Sufis consider it a serious sin or even apostasy of done by someone knowledgeable

Men are also extremely circumscribed in their actions.

[Anonymous No.17537003]

>>17536938
Rumi was one of the most famous Sufis that promoted the orthodox Sunni position on Iblis, going on to connect the Nafs to Iblis directly. This being in contrast to Sufis like al-Ghazali who believed Iblis was a paragon of lovers who didn't obey Allah's order to bow to Adam out of love for Allah. So I mean if you're going to call a famous Sufi a jinn, Ghazali might be the better option. Though I guess that doesn't fit into a Salafi narrative as easily, as Ghazali emphasized a strict adherence to Shariah.

[Anonymous No.17537014]

>>17537003
>Ghazali emphasized a strict adherence to Shariah.
You're mixing up your Ghazalis. The sufi who praised Satan and enjoyed boy gazing was the brother of the Sufi who wrote the Ihya, not the same man

[Anonymous No.17537017]

>>17536995
1. Saying Yazidis worship Melek Taus in my mind is quite similar to Christians who say Muslims worship the Prophet (pbuh), so if you're going to say that to be edgy and based or whatever, you're kinda playing yourself. 2. Yeah that's because Yazidism grew out of Sufism while adding some folk beliefs.

[Anonymous No.17537023]

>>17535592
.gg/ZgmrSq8Qkd

[Anonymous No.17537024]

>>17536407
>If there’s a genuine Traditional viewpoint here, I want to understand it.
There isnt one, its just people inventing an excuse to do degenerate shit.

[Anonymous No.17537039]

>>17536640
>They've clearly never lived with Muslims or around them
The only reason people in the West hate Islam, is because of Muslim immigrants.

[Anonymous No.17537040]

>>17536718
Proven to be false. This is just Islamic cope

[Anonymous No.17537044]

>>17536938
As the stupid Americans on 4channel say ... “Take meds, schizo”!

>>17536801
My dear brother in Muhammad, you have been “filtered”, as the stupid Americans on 4channel also say.

[Anonymous No.17537048]

>>17537014
While you are correct in saying I was mixing up who called Iblis a paragon of lovers, and I thank you for catching me on that, the more famous Ghazali did also think that Iblis rejected Allah's command out of love for Allah, and that the whole ordeal was a test from Allah to Iblis. Supposedly Iblis said this to Moses, as Ghazali would tell the story, And to be clear, that's Abu Hamid, the famous one. Thanks for catching my error though.

[Anonymous No.17537081]

>>17536655
>eternal esoteric Tradition accessible only to a few
Traditionalism, doesnt ever require people to have a well rounded classical education, it appeals to the type of middle class person who is smart enough to read a novel, but not poetry, smart enough to read popscience, but not to get a genuine physics education.

Traditionalism is literally for the masses.

[Anonymous No.17537125]

>>17536970
Yeah, we get threads like this sometimes, on different topics even. Makes me wonder whether it's organized or some anons just don't have a clue about what they are saying.

[Anonymous No.17537136]

>>17537039
Which compared to what the west does to Muslim countries is pretty mild

>>17537048
>Supposedly Iblis said this to Moses, as Ghazali would tell the story
Other Ghazali

>>17537081
One of Traditionalism's criticism's of what you're talking about is a "quantitative" mindset. For example math is purely a quantitative endeavor, it seeks to reduce all concerns to quantitative rather than qualitative. Traditionalists believe this fixation of seeing quantivation as the goal and reflection of knowledge and drastic dismissal of qualitative, to be a serious malady which should be questioned

[Anonymous No.17537145]

>>17535592
Read the Quran. Forget the “tradition”, it’s exoteric bullshit. Read the Quran and try to establish a typological analysis. You’ll figure out why it’s considered apart of the Tradition and why Sufism is admired.

[Anonymous No.17537157]

>>17537145
good post

[Anonymous No.17537184]

>>17537136
>Which compared to what the west does to Muslim countries is pretty mild
You are not a victim, stop playing one. The West has every right to kill your children and bomb your cities, because you would do the same to us and worse if you ever had the chance.

>For example math is purely a quantitative endeavor, it seeks to reduce all concerns to quantitative rather than qualitative. Traditionalists believe this fixation of seeing quantivation as the goal and reflection of knowledge and drastic dismissal of qualitative, to be a serious malady which should be questioned

That is literally the biggest midwit cope I have ever read. You and I are just too stupid for heavy math, accept that gracefully, instaid of inventing arguments to explain away your ignorance.

[Anonymous No.17537204]

>>17537184
Or perhaps your are too unintelligent for Arabic

[Anonymous No.17537221]

>>17537145
I’ve read the Quran and see no reason why Islam should stand out or be considered “Traditional” on that basis.

[Anonymous No.17537242]

>>17536699
I will read this essay but on the surface I’m sorry to tell you that such reasoning sounds frankly, retarded. Not only does it seem to not be true but it’s putting the cart before the horse. The logic is basically Islam is “Traditional” because it works with Martin Heidegger...

[Anonymous No.17537258]

>>17537136
>Other Ghazali
Damn you were right once again, my apologies, I had mistakenly believed the other Ghazali believed that for a while. Thanks for correcting me.

[Anonymous No.17537260]

>>17537204
If I where, I would not make excuses, but since retards and goatfuckers can speak the language, I have no doubt I could as well.

But I doubt you have the intelligence to read some early modern poet or dramatist, I can, took some effort, but I thought myself to read early modern Dutch.

Thats the difference between exoteric traditionalism and esoteric enlightenment culture. One is just an ideology for middle class midwits, the other requires time, dedication and intelligence.

I pity you people, there is an entire world of higher learning you know nothing about.

[Anonymous No.17537445]

>>17537242
I didn't say that at all. Rather I said sufism has a draw for many because it has post classical philosophy despite forgoing modernism. Heidegger is very modernist and yet a great deal of similarly for instance exists between his conception of Dasein and the sufi conception of Mizan

>>17537258
Sure

>>17537260
I can readi very much enjoy Chaucer and Shakespeare in Middle and Early Modern English, respective

[Anonymous No.17537463]

>>17537445
Okay, but not all of these people are/were Sufis and they wrote positive things on exoteric Islam broadly. The challenge is to show how exoteric Islam is Traditional, not whether there are affinities between Martin Heidegger and Sufism, which by the way, still doesn’t illustrate how either Sufism or Islam broadly are Traditional.

[Anonymous No.17537482]

>>17535592
There’s a difference between the traditionalism of following the traditions of your ancestors specifically and “Traditionalism” as in the anti modernist ideology of seeking to return to social, economic, political, spiritual, and ontological mechanisms common across most premodern cultures in the past. Basically just because Islam was invented much later than Christianity doesn’t mean it wasn’t a premodern worldview with a “traditional” way of viewing the world and society. Traditionalists like Islam because it has kept itself premodern in many ways where Christianity has capitulated to modernist ways of thinking about the individual and society. Christianity basically gave up on fighting modernity when Franco’s regime fell and they’ve been declining in numbers ever since.

[Anonymous No.17537501]

>>17537463
Traditionalism in the sense of the OP refers to the esoteric, not exoteric. The exoteric is only measured by its accordance with the esoteric.

I didn't say Heidegger had anything to do with Tradition, just that some people are drawn by an avenue to explore thought adjacent to his outside of a modernist context

[Anonymous No.17537512]

>>17537445
>Mizan

I can't find anything on this except for an author. Please explain what this is and recommend some sufi literature

[Anonymous No.17537523]

He is the most recent prophet of God. :3

[Anonymous No.17537542]

>>17537501
> Traditionalism in the sense of the OP refers to the esoteric, not exoteric. The exoteric is only measured by its accordance with the esoteric.
So you’re saying that their appreciation of exoteric Islam is not an appreciation of Islam in itself but rather an appreciation of esoteric Sufism which they considered “Traditional”?

> I didn't say Heidegger had anything to do with Tradition, just that some people are drawn by an avenue to explore thought adjacent to his outside of a modernist context
But the thread is about what is Traditional about Islam, not why admirers of Heidegger are drawn to Islam.

[Anonymous No.17537684]

>>17537512
Mizan means scale and in Islamic terminology it refers to ability to discriminate and understand proportion both physical and spiritual

I am working on a reading list for Islam and will include a lot there إن شاء الله. For an introduction for westerners you might try The Vision of Islam and The Cambridge Companion to Classical Islamic Theology, both are extremely sufi

>>17537542
Yes, see Guénon's essay, Haqiqa and Sharia

A lot of Traditionalists have an interest in Heidegger's ontology and his confrontation with technology and de-distancing so they are drawn to a worldview which reconciles his extremely modernist work with non modernism

[Anonymous No.17537741]

>>17535592
they like it because its more like hinduism in its practices and the sufi metaphysics. its more like a bhakti yoga cult in india rather than christianity.

[Anonymous No.17537755]

>>17537684
>Yes, see Guénon's essay, Haqiqa and Sharia
Hopefully it explains what is Traditional about Sufism.

>A lot of Traditionalists have an interest in Heidegger's ontology and his confrontation with technology and de-distancing so they are drawn to a worldview which reconciles his extremely modernist work with non modernism
That still makes absolutely no sense to me but I understand.

[Anonymous No.17537761]

>>17537741
>like hinduism in its practices
Stop posting

[Anonymous No.17537769]

>>17535592
I have listened to pretty much everything Timothy has put out, followed his reading lists and tried to understand his advice.
My life is better. I wake up at 5:55, I pray three times a day, I fast for 20 hours and only eat in a short window, have stopped watching pornography.
I am Christian and I have not even read the Qu'ran, but this is a man who mentions Bowden and Al-Ghazali in the same breath.
He has cut through the zeitgeist.
Living in Bradford though I can 100% tell you muslims are inbred, also they will turn your children into jannisary catamites just like the Jews with their tranny shit.
Praise Jesus.

[Anonymous No.17537798]

>>17537769
>just like the Catholics
Fixed

[Anonymous No.17537824]

>>17537798
In their defence they kept it strictly in house mate. Muslims took slave boys.
I guess everybody just craves Christian boipussy.

[Anonymous No.17537850]

Does any Muslim on /lit/ even go to a mosque?

[Anonymous No.17537857]

>>17537850
I go to a mosque give times a day

[Anonymous No.17537865]

tradzoom->islamist pipeline

[Anonymous No.17537882]

also puts out nasheeds spittin straight fire
https://youtu.be/vwA2Ux0lfZE