/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.17409327]

>revive marx
>tell him about identity politics
what happens
does he immediately kill himself?

[Anonymous No.17409349]

Karl Marx would support trans folx.

[Anonymous No.17409359]

>>17409349
Unironically this. He'd see where Liberalism had taken his people and the goals he had in mind, and have dropped labor and "the workers" like a sack of hot dogshit.

[Anonymous No.17409361]

He already had to deal with anarchists, social democrats and other types of leftists that he considered to be wrong and counter productive. It wouldn't surprise him really.

[Anonymous No.17409362]

>>17409349
Troons will always be lumpenproles.

[Anonymous No.17409363]

>>17409327
Nah he was a sardonic moody fuck but he wasnt suicidal. I think he would probably just sulk, throw out some meanspirited personal insults, two years later write a 700 page treatise destroying it which takes the intelligencia several years to fully process and incorporate.

[Anonymous No.17409365]

He would be closer to bunkerchan autists than BLM twitter libs

[Anonymous No.17409367]

lefty/pol/ proving that they're not marxists

[Anonymous No.17409370]

identity politics literally only exist as a weapon that capitalists use against the working class, mad to see what degree /lit/ is full of useful idiots

[Anonymous No.17409390]

>>17409370
this

if blm/intersectionality were truly a threat against the system they wouldnt be endorsed by and receiving donations from every major corporation

[Anonymous No.17409399]

>>17409327
as long as the blacks and trannys are willing to axe the capitalists, why would marx care how people identify?

[Anonymous No.17409402]

>>17409390
>>17409370
>>17409367
You can't be socialist and racist. We don't want bigots on our team.

[Anonymous No.17409414]

>>17409390
They really just want to sell you shit. Being woke is now trendy, so they're riding it to get more sales. It's also easier to market to people with atomized identities.

[Anonymous No.17409431]

>>17409402
IRL socialists just destroy each other. Humans hate other humans. Always was, always will be. Your ignorance must extract a high price. You never get to the root of the problem. It's you. But keep projecting.

[Anonymous No.17409434]

>>17409399
The problem is that if there is more emphasis on their identity issues than the broader working class struggle or economic issues they may be willing to side with capitalists of their own identity group (like Obama or Oprah for example) or placated by gestures of "representation" such as quotas or favorable media coverage that doesn't actually fundamentally challenge the economic system but appeals to their identity.

White identitarians are also a problem for this reason. They are more concerned about Jewish capitalists than capitalism as a whole, and don't seem to mind capitalism if its primarily WASPs or if Trump panders to them. My point is identity politics make identity supersede class struggle in terms of importance which makes the working class more fragmented and economic concerns secondary to culture war issues integrated into the system.

[Anonymous No.17409438]

>>17409402
This guy doesnt know what hes talking about, we love racists. Theres literally nothing wrong with being racist.

[Anonymous No.17409441]

>>17409402
>You can't be socialist and racist.
Explain that too Nationalsocialists, Stalinists, Maoists, a large chunk of the Old Left before the 70's and a whole bunch of artists and intellectuals.

The Dutch Socialist Party was a hard red party, which opposed mass-immigration, long before the Centre Democrats did the same thing on the right.

Their argument, mass-immigration, feminism etc are tools used by big capital to undermine the solidarity between the working class.

[Anonymous No.17409453]

>>17409441
>Nationalsocialists
not socialist
>Stalinists
not racist, ussr was multiracial and multicultural but unified under socialist state
>Maoists
not racists
>old left
Maybe isolated cases

[Anonymous No.17409465]

[Anonymous No.17409470]

>>17409327
he doesn't care

[Anonymous No.17409477]

most "leftists" today are bernie sanders aoc supporting teens and college kids on twitter using commie aesthetics to be edgy (at best)

[Anonymous No.17409487]

>>17409327
He'd probably be too depressed by the total defeat of his ideas to care about identity politics. I would be more interested in his response to AI/automation and the impending disfranchisement of a majority of the workforce.

[Anonymous No.17409492]

>>17409453
You obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

1. Nationalsocialism isnt just the ideology of Hitler, its a collection of related ideologies, some of which like Strasserism are completely socialist.

2. Both Stalinism and Maoism had a monoculture build around a single ethnic group, the first Russians the second Chinese.

3. A large amount of old union leftists, where opposed to mass-immigration, seeing it and feminism, sexism, etc as tools to divide the working class.

PC culture is the main reason there is not communist movement in the West. Because without White working class males to form a united and constructive front you just have woman, gays, blacks, muslims and other unconstructive groups, fighting each other.

In a genuine Marxist society, all sexual degenerates, parasites, religious fanatics, lazy people, etc are seen as the lumpenproletariat and are not welcome in such a society.

This would include all Muslims, almost all blacks, all gays, a large amount of feminists.

Therefor socialism and communism are inherently racist, and therefor antiracism is a bourgeoise, capitalist idea designed to destroy worker solidarity.

[Anonymous No.17409513]

>>17409327
he would propably identify that identity politics are often used as a tool by the owner class to further divide the proletariat, like anyone with half a brain should

[Anonymous No.17409548]

>>17409513
marx supported the owner class though, his communist manifesto literally demands central banking

[Anonymous No.17409559]

>>17409370
Marxism literally only exists as a weapon that capitalists use against the working class, anon. That's the entire point.

[Anonymous No.17409560]

>>17409327
Why would I revive Marx of all people ... ?
Let him rot in hell.
Much rather I would bring someone from heaven to guide us in these dark times like the founding fathers or certain other people.

[Anonymous No.17409562]

>>17409327
ehh idpol seems nonexistent in the left to me so where are you looking OP? doesn't the left by definition hate idpol because it's a distraction from the means of production question? idpol is a much bigger problem for the right if they ever want to separate themselves from the capitalist owner class

[Anonymous No.17409574]

>>17409492
based

[Anonymous No.17409576]

>>17409399
blacks and trannies are pawns of globalists/capitalists which is why their organizations get their support
>>17409402
t. globalist pawn who knows nothing of socialism

[Anonymous No.17409579]

>>17409327
>I told you about Americans, bro.

[Anonymous No.17409588]

>>17409327
He would not kill himself and he wouldn’t even be surprised. He would be disappointed at the fact there are 0 genuine Marxist movements at the moment that aren’t just larping liberals.
>>17409349
He hated idpol when he was alive, actively opposing socialist segments that cared about women’s rights or ethnic issues instead of the cause of the proletariat, which idpol groups always oppose, Ive known plenty of “Marxists” who are far more happy with an Indian woman ceo than a white delivery man, it’s because they aren’t actually Marxists.
>>17409402
The ruler of the worlds most powerful communist party, along with most successful communist leaders and Karl “the most anti-Jewish Jew since Spinoza” Marx all disagree with you. Additionally, being racist in another direction doesn’t mean that you aren’t racist, a pure global socialist would by necessity ignore the existence of race entirely.

[Anonymous No.17409605]

>>17409560
>Germany controls Europe through the EU
>American influence waning
>Muslim population of Europe growing
>Jews leaving Europe for Israel
Hitler would unironically be thrilled with the current state of the world. Everything he ever wanted is happening.

[Anonymous No.17409607]

this entire thread is cringe

[Anonymous No.17409611]

>>17409327

>sees that morons actually followed up on his brain farts
>kills himself

[Anonymous No.17409613]

>>17409327
>revive Marx
>kill him again for the satisfaction
This post brought to you by Proudhon gang

[Anonymous No.17409621]

>>17409562
"Left" is a wide term that can include both hysterical, moralistic sjw and brutal, pragmatic marxists. Just as "right" can include both nazis and liberals.

[Anonymous No.17409622]

>>17409605
>Everything he ever wanted is happening.
Yes, Hitler would have loved Germany turning into a slum where brown hordes can rape German woman with impunity.

[Anonymous No.17409628]

>>17409621
Ever wondered if perhaps regimes like that of Stalin, are closer to authoritarian imperial states, then too squishy, washy modern liberal states?

[Anonymous No.17409664]

>>17409622
I genuinely think he'd see it as a win-win. Either the German race violently reacts and breaks free of the guilt that's consumed them since the end of WWII, or Germany grows more Muslim in nature, something he wanted to happen.

[Anonymous No.17409665]

>>17409605
>American influence
I think the US was not really something he thought about too much, correct me if I'm wrong.
>Muslims
If this is not a troll: The arabs wanted alliances with Hitler but he was not really interested in that as far as I know, if he wanted muslims in Germany he could've easily made that happen.

[Anonymous No.17409699]

>>17409548
>marx supported the owner class though
are you sure youre not just pretending to have read it?
>his communist manifesto literally demands central banking
he demands a state bank to replace all private banks, doesnt seem to be in favour of the bourgeoisie especially since marx wants the state to be in the hand of the proletariat.

the manifesto was written so that any barely literate factory worker could understand it, maybe you should try again.

>>17409492
a genuine response to this brain rot would be a waste of time but holy shit
>In a genuine Marxist society, all sexual degenerates, parasites, religious fanatics, lazy people, etc are seen as the lumpenproletariat and are not welcome in such a society.

>This would include all Muslims, almost all blacks, all gays, a large amount of feminists.

>Therefor socialism and communism are inherently racist, and therefor antiracism is a bourgeoise, capitalist idea designed to destroy worker solidarity.

how can you be this fucking wrong
have you ever actually read any socialist theory? or do you get your worldview from pol?

[Anonymous No.17409734]

>>17409327
I used to think leftists were wrong to criticize "idpol" but they're not. marxism is not simply promoting working for the interests of the working class against the bourgeoise. marxism includes all of humanity in its vision, it's just that it sees the proletariat as the mechanism which is going to overthrow the current system. afterwards both proletariat and bourgeoise will be liberated from their alienation owing to the division of labour. of course the vast majority of self-proclaimed marxist have absolutely zero understanding of marx and probably adopt the ideology purely on the basis of resentment. these "marxists" have no right to criticize idpol.

the whole thing that makes marxism "work" (it doesn't irl of course) is the materialist foundation of division of labour. there's just no way to take marxism and replace the proletariat with blacks or trannies and still have it make sense as marxism.

we have a good sense of what karl actually would have said about modern idpol, based on what he wrote. he criticized the other young hegelians focus on political emancipation as naive, seeing it as merely fighting the symptoms of division of labour. no doubt he would have felt much the same about the lefts modern obsession with trannies and blacks.

[Anonymous No.17409759]

>>17409402

Marx himself pushed to purge anti-racist and feminist elements from the early movement.
Jesus fuck the things you read on this site.

[Anonymous No.17409765]

Marx would sit down to write and come out with some far more well articulated version of this:
>The rise of trannies is based in the neoliberal ideological imperative of profit over all else. The fact is, if you have a larger market share, more people are going to buy your product. If your business supports specific groups, then those groups will most likely support your business. Within a capitalist framework, the easiest political position for a business to support is one of identity politics. To discriminate between peoples and cut ties to those possible customers isn't advantageous to the bottom line, but support for identity politics also doesn't fundamentally change the economic system in any sort of class warfare, in fact, it divides these groups even more than before so that the poors can't do anything about it. The poors are more obsessed with the propagandized inner reflection of who they are within this hellscape then they are when it comes to legitimate grievances against the government and these corporations. Sow discord amongst the people, yet profit off them. Hell, tranny culture is profitable in and of itself. Of course the corporations are going to be in support of it. News and media outlets are going to cover it because it pretends to be empowering and riles up the people that hate trannies, and yet it continues to perpetuate the messages of neoliberal ideology without affecting the inherent economic structure. It's been the same way with gay marriage. With interracial couples. And basically everything after the civil rights movement.

[Anonymous No.17409816]

>>17409327
>This Appeal -- and the formation from it of all sorts of middle-class humbug sections, free-lovers, spiritists, spiritist Shakers, etc. -- caused the split, and the demand by Section 1 (German) of the old Council that Section 12 be expelled and that no section be admitted to membership unless it consisted of at least two-thirds workers.

You know he actually had to deal with these people during his lifetime?

[Anonymous No.17409824]

>>17409765
no he wouldn't fucking cringe fucking retard.

these fucking 16 year old dumb fucking faggots from leftypol haven't read a book in their fucking lives jesus fuck. why do they come here.

[Anonymous No.17409840]

>>17409824
Kek, I'm not from /leftypol/. I check it sometimes, but it's just too much tankie larping shit for me.

[Anonymous No.17409842]

>>17409327
He'd write that down as a manifestation of Capitalism, describing it as another one of the bourgeoisie's ways of diverting attention from the international class struggle.

[Anonymous No.17409853]

>>17409759
It's truly amazing how many people who comment on Marx -- whether it's to critique him or to lament him -- have ZERO idea of what he actually said. They read quotes or second/third/fourth-hand points, which sometimes are things not even said by him.

[Anonymous No.17409932]

>>17409699
excerpt from 18th brumaire of Louis Bonaparte, Marx, p. 295
>Alongside decayed roues with dubious means of subsistence and of dubious origin, alongside ruined and adventurous offshoots of the bourgeoisie, were vagabonds, discharged soldiers, discharged jailbirds, escaped galley slaves, swindlers, mountebanks, lazzaroni, pickpockets, tricksters, gamblers, maquereaus (pimps), brothel keepers, porters, literati, organ-grinders, rag-pickers, knife grinders, tinkers, beggars – in short, the whole indefinite, disintegrated mass, thrown hither and thither, which the French term la boheme...

excerpt from Engels's Preface to The Peasant War in Germany (1874, p. 646)
>The lumpenproletariat, this scum of the depraved elements of all classes, which established headquarters in the big cities, is the worst of all possible allies. This rabble is absolutely venal and absolutely brazen. If the French workers, in every revolution, inscribed on the houses: Mort aux voleurs! Death to thieves! and even shot some, they did it, not out of enthusiasm for property, but because they rightly considered it necessary above all to keep that gang at a distance,, Every leader of the workers who uses these scoundrels as guards or relies on them for support proves himself by this action alone a traitor to the movement

[Anonymous No.17409966]

>>17409932
>quote about some ruined offshoots of the bourgeoisie
>quote about how the lumpenprole sucks

and? how does this in any way show that marx and engels were supportive of the owner class and didnt care for the poor?
youre dimissing practically everything else ever written by them and you seem to be completely oblivious to the fact that the lumpenproletariat and whatever offshoots of the bourgeoisie are only products of a capitalist mode of production, which both sought to destroy
this is some advanced mental gymnastics youre attempting here

[Anonymous No.17409974]

>>17409932
your point? only /pol/tards would think this is some gotcha moment or whatever, if you think this somehow can apply to black people then it's just you buddy
black people and other poc are just as educated if not more educated than people like you are, you're just pushing your racist beliefs onto dead people from over 2 centuries ago

[Anonymous No.17409987]

>>17409966
im not the anon you're arguing with
im just posting evidence that marx and engels would disapprove of the current antifa and blm hordes of peabrained activists and rioters, instead of glorifying them like hacks like clr James did

[Anonymous No.17410018]

>>17409327
he reads settlers and sees that the real class struggle is now third world vs first world

[Anonymous No.17410059]

>>17409824
>that pic
Leftypol is the singularly most cringe site on the planet, even more so than /pol/. Why can't they just fucking stay where they are and leave us alone? It's all so tiresome. I just want to read and discuss books.

[Anonymous No.17410074]

>>17410059
/pol/ is worse. at least /leftypol/ reads about their ideology. /pol/ just reads media propaganda and shitposts

[Anonymous No.17410095]

>>17410074
>at least /leftypol/ reads about their ideology
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
sure bunkertranny, those discords truly are the modern day agoras and fori romani

[Anonymous No.17410103]

>>17410074
/leftypol/ are genius compared to the qanon schizos

[Anonymous No.17410104]

>>17409399
have you been living under a rock for the last 10 years? the class conscious movements following the 2008 crash were virtually eliminated by the systematic implanting of obsession with trannies and niggers and importing as many brown people as needed to prop up the lifestyles of rich and powerful capitalists at the expense of the white working class

[Anonymous No.17410107]

>>17409327
Marx would have supported marginalised groups, because he did in his time. You do realise "identity politics" is when you use your identity as an appeal to authority and not just when you're a feminist or anti-racist.

[Anonymous No.17410121]

>>17410104
bernie sanders movement was a class first oriented movement that would have won had the dnc not rigged it for hillary. trump also ran on a populist economic discontent but governed more like a neocon capitalist

[Anonymous No.17410136]

>>17410095
How do you know what goes on in a leftist tranny discord?


On a different note, it is realllllly funny that the one leftist discord I was on, 50% were trannies. Didn’t realize how real the joke was til I was in it.

[Anonymous No.17410140]

>>17410121
>bernie sanders movement was a class first oriented movement
yet he also fell back to bashing on le evil white people for clout, and he sucked off the DNC twice after getting rigged out of the game. He's nothing but a slimy rich bastard using class rhetoric for his personal gain
>neocon capitalist
at least he didn't start a new war in the ME, but yeah, it's not a high bar

[Anonymous No.17410141]

>>17410121
>would have won had the dnc not rigged it
WOAH how DARE you question the results of our holy democratic process! Are you some kind of CONSPIRACY THEORIST? What do you mean during the primary the DNC stopped the count in Nevada to kill Bernie's momentum just like happened to Trump in Georgia and Michigan? I think you might be a domestic terrorists and I hope they put you on a no-fly list.

[Anonymous No.17410152]

>>17410107
>Marx would have supported marginalised groups, because he did in his time. You do realise "identity politics" is when you use your identity as an appeal to authority and not just when you're a feminist or anti-racist.

[Anonymous No.17410153]

>>17410136
Lmao

[Anonymous No.17410157]

>>17410074
>at least /leftypol/ reads about their ideology
they don't lol.

[Anonymous No.17410160]

>>17410121
youre delusional if you think sanders wouldn't have been just as tied down by the democratic party as trump was tied down by republican neocons, a huge portion of which tried to throw him under the bus

[Anonymous No.17410174]

>>17410160
the nytimes ran as many nasty misleading stories about bernie as they did about trump, but lefty libs are too stupid to put two and two together and realize if bernie won, he would just have been demonized like trump and probably impeached over a fake scandal.

[Anonymous No.17410189]

>>17410152
Had you been around in 1870 you absolutely have been saying Marx and Engles were derailing the first international by focusing on feminism and racism. Engles literally wrote a book about women's issues and the family. The difference is, they tied it back to class and showed how the class structure generated these oppressions and not just to nebulous nonsense.

[Anonymous No.17410199]

There are STILL people who have not condemned Bernie Bro behavior! In fact, some are still engaging in it RIGHT NOW!

[Anonymous No.17410229]

>>17410189
>Engles literally wrote a book about women's issues and the family
And what?

>Had you been around in 1870 you absolutely have been saying Marx and Engles were derailing the first international by focusing on feminism and racism
You mean two years before they purged Americans from IWA precisely because they focused on feminism and other useless shit?

[Anonymous No.17410236]

>>17410121
>bernie "white privilege" sanders
no thanks, he's trash who would have been eaten up by the sjw types like AOC who is currently leeching off of him until she doesn't need him anymore

[Anonymous No.17410262]

>>17410229
They didn't "purge Americans", they purged a particular group I forget the name of because they were basically using the IWA to grift for an election and didn't have any actually socialist beliefs.

[Anonymous No.17410275]

>>17410199
Bernie is the most retarded candidate to come by in decades. He's wholly unviable.

[Anonymous No.17410295]

First of all he'd be pretty shocked and appalled at the influence Jews have come to have in modern society, and the degree to which negros are paraded about in consumer culture.

[Anonymous No.17410317]

he'd feel vindicated and disgusted

then we tell him of the ussr
then we resurrect lenin

[Anonymous No.17410401]

>>17410262
The group he sought to purge was " almost exclusively consisting of middle-class humbugs and worn-out Yankee swindlers in the reform business" and he did so because they focused on free love, feminism and spirituality.

[Anonymous No.17410432]

>>17409434

This, 1000 times.

Also, before someone tells me I'm "a bigot" or "a racist", let me quote a "latino" (sic, I hate this word, it makes no sense) rapper song called "Poverty of Philosophy" (that may sound familiar, I guess)

>My enemy is not the average white man [...] In fact, I have more in common
With most working and middle-class white people
Than I do with most rich black and Latino people
As much as racism bleeds America
We need to understand that classism is the real issue

[Anonymous No.17410483]

>>17410401
He didn't do it because they focused on "free love, feminism and spirituality", he did because that's all they focused on and had no interest in socialism as a concept. Also, he had good instincts, because the female leader of group later on became a complete reactionary traditionalist who thought women should stay in the home and be baby making, which is a symptom of her being middle class. Middle class and bourgeois women generally promote the nuclear family because its the model family of capitalist society.

[Anonymous No.17410528]

>>17409441

Ahh, yeah, let's just put NS and Stalinism in the same pot.

Imagine thinking that publishing schoolbooks in 104 different languages is "racist".

[Anonymous No.17410532]

>>17409349
He didn’t even support homosexuality.

[Anonymous No.17410535]

>>17410483
>he did because that's all they focused on and had no interest in socialism as a concept
They did have interest in socialism, but only nomical. Which means that M&E were not derailing IWA with feminism and race, they fought against people who tried to do so.

>complete reactionary traditionalist who thought women should stay in the home and be baby making
Did she?

> promote the nuclear family
I dont think one can be "complete reactionary traditionalist" in 19th century and at the same time promote nuclear family.

[Anonymous No.17410538]

>>17410121
>bernie sanders movement was a class first oriented movement
Lol no. Not for a Marxist who have read Marx. Bernie sanders is political economy. Capital reformism.

[Anonymous No.17410539]

>>17409613
Irrelevant dipshit gang

[Anonymous No.17410552]

>>17409327
he would literally start weeping and begging you not to tell anyone that you refuted his entire life's work in a single stroke.

[Anonymous No.17410587]

>>17410535
I wouldn't even call that group "derailing" to be honest. I forget the details about them because it was a minor event, but they were pretty much just election grifting and didn't actually give a fuck about the IWA or engage in it.

>Did she?
Yeah, I can't remember her name though, it was Victoria W-something.

>complete reactionary "traditionalist" in 19th century and at the same time promote nuclear family.
You can if things are changing and you're resisting it. Remember,m the capitalists don't actually give a fuck about the nuclear family for the working class, its mostly a middle-upper class thing to keep their private property within the family.

[Anonymous No.17410615]

>>17409327
marx was anti racist

[Anonymous No.17410661]

>>17410587
>Yeah,
I asked for a source.

>You can if things are changing and you're resisting it.
Things were changing in the sense nuclear family was becoming the dominant form of family, replacing the traditional forms. The term nuclear family emerged only by 1920s.

[Anonymous No.17410666]

>>17410615
Unless you were a jew

[Anonymous No.17410668]

>>17410661
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Woodhull#Religious_shift_and_repudiation_of_free_love

[Anonymous No.17410728]

>>17410668
so she hit the wall and started trying to act like wife material, many such cases

[Anonymous No.17410747]

>>17410728
Nah, she had a phase and then went back to traditional bourgeois life.

[Anonymous No.17410812]

>>17410668
Yes, she abandoned free love views, but thats a different thing. She remained a suffragete, trying to candidate as US president in 1884 and 1992.

[Anonymous No.17410842]

>>17410812
Nothing wrong with suffragetism, even if it is being espoused by a bourgeois tradwife, the "bourgeois" part is what I take issue with, not the suffrage.

[Anonymous No.17411134]

>>17409613
hell yeah

[Anonymous No.17411353]

>>17409402
All races are racist. You mean you can't be "pro-white", right?

[Anonymous No.17411414]

How can you cunts be so wrong?

[Anonymous No.17411461]

>>17409559
This but unironically. Why do you think (((bankers))) financed the 17 red revolution?
>pic very related

[Anonymous No.17411487]

>>17409349
Engels? Yes. Marx? He wouldn’t. I don’t think he’d be transphobic but he wouldn’t support LGBT bullshit either.

[Anonymous No.17411507]

>>17409453
>not racist, ussr was multiracial and multicultural but unified under socialist state
So much they banned jew from universities. Why don't you read a fucking book, nigga?

[Anonymous No.17411606]

>>17409974
>only /pol/tards would think this is some gotcha moment or whatever,
It does, most blacks are sexually loose, criminal, lazy etc they are the lower elements of society and any genuine Marxist regime would start removing the majority of them.

[Anonymous No.17411617]

>>17411414
We've already been over this. Notice even this quote doesn't say they were purged for feminism.

[Anonymous No.17411626]

>>17411617
Yes, 19th century feminism wasnt about taking three dicks at the same time, modern feminism is.

No Marx would not approve anything the modern left is doing now.

[Anonymous No.17411680]

>>17411626
Where is modern feminism about "taking three dicks at a time"? Engles' (and therefore Marx's since the two worked in close conjunction) opinion of sex is that it should be a private arrangement. If you want to be monogamous fine, but I women wants to "take three dicks at a time" and basedjack wants to watch, that's fine to. And that the position of modern feminism and its the correct position.

[Anonymous No.17411720]

>>17409327

Imagine thinking identity politics is not a precise, direct, and predictable consequence of automated cultural co-optation of Capital and degeneration of psychology in political discourse towards the optimal level of consumption of surplus low effort intellectual stimulus products, such as this very retarded post by yours truly, OP.

[Anonymous No.17411830]

>>17409363
This is what would actually happen, then 200 years after that again, people would alternately attempt to critique it or claim to follow it, despite only having read at best a summary from whatever the future equivalent of wikipedia is.

[Anonymous No.17411923]

He wrote volumes on Idpol

[Anonymous No.17411948]

>>17409560
Hitler already killed himself, why bring back to do it again?

[Anonymous No.17412044]

>>17411680
I bet you'd be fine with everyone fucking your mom too, freak

[Anonymous No.17412050]

>>17409362
What does this sentence even mean?

[Anonymous No.17412061]

>>17409349
Kek. Trans are the fucking lumpenproletariat, you freak retard

[Anonymous No.17412070]

>>17412050
Lumpenproletariat.
Read Marx

[Anonymous No.17412071]

>>17412044
thats 100% her decision

[Anonymous No.17412153]

>>17412044
My Mum can have sex with whoever she wants provided its not illegal, I don't give a fuck. Its not like its anything to do with me, we generally don't share our sex lives because that would be wierd.

[Anonymous No.17412156]

>>17412071
>>17412153
cucks

[Anonymous No.17412161]

>>17412156
I don't have sex with my mother. I'm not a right winger.

[Anonymous No.17412166]

>>17409974
>black people and other poc are just as educated if not more educated than people like you are,
I sometimes forget that there are Libs who unironically believe this, it is just wild

[Anonymous No.17412177]

>>17412166
a black university student is definitely more educated than a redneck trumper

[Anonymous No.17412179]

>>17412156
Why the fuck would I be a "cuck"? The only way I could be a cuck is I wanted to fuck my Mum or something. Although you probably do want to fuck your own Mum like most right wingers so that makes sense at least.

[Anonymous No.17412185]

>>17412179
>>17412161
Read Freud. You want to fuck your mother, you just don't realize it

[Anonymous No.17412221]

>>17412177
No not definitely, the average SAT score to get into university for blacks is way lower than for whites

[Anonymous No.17412228]

>>17412185
I'm not a Freudian so why should I care. Like have read Freud, I've even studied Freud in my Psychology module, psycho-sexual theory is scientifically disproven. Well, maybe its valid for right wingers, but only in the sense they want women to be their mothers rather than wanting to literally fuck their own mothers.

[Anonymous No.17412250]

>>17409349
Unironically true

[Anonymous No.17412304]

>>17409327
He would probably try to spin it as a bourgeoisie invention.

[Anonymous No.17412321]

Leftism is about equality, decency, and human liberation. Marx would see that marginalized identities are being oppressed by the white male patriarchy and are a designated underclass subordinate to the white male capitalist class extracting their value to get wealthy. Marx would side with the marginalized minority identities as the true revolutionaries against white male capitalist society.

[Anonymous No.17412367]

>>17412321
actually impossible to tell if this is satire

[Anonymous No.17412368]

>>17409365
This, he wouldn't care and use the average mutt liberal as useful idiots.

[Anonymous No.17412387]

>>17412321
Pol Pot was just trying to liberate the peasants from the bourgeoise's tyranny. You cant have cultural revolution if you dont root out the intellectuals and city bourgeoise pushing the capiatlist propaganda of old. Pot knew this and had to take action to restore power to the oppressed peoples.

[Anonymous No.17412405]

>>17412387
pol pot was a revisionist. not a true marxist >>17412321
youre not a marxist. you are a progressive radlib

[Anonymous No.17413598]

>>17412050
The proletariat is the working class, right? Emphasis on "working".
The lumpenproletariat is the underclass, basically human garbage devoid of or poisonous to class consciousness. Druggies, NEET trannies, prostitutes, thieves, etc.

[Anonymous No.17413608]

>>17412405
Pol Pot was right with one thing, bourgeois radlib "intellectuals" like >>17412321 should be rusticated.

[Anonymous No.17413635]

>>17409327
He would write a novel about how they're midwits. That's what he did when he was alive. He devoted most of his life to just btfo other people. Then midwits like Lenin bastardization his writings and started what we know as Marxism/Communism today.

[Anonymous No.17413817]

>>17409327
Knowing Marx he'd immediately head straight to the library to research it.

[Anonymous No.17413822]

>>17409327
>does he immediately kill himself?
He'd become a tranny so yes

[Anonymous No.17414865]

mark

[Anonymous No.17414885]

he'd be a r/stupidpol regular alongside mullen

[Anonymous No.17414916]

>>17409414
>Being woke is now trendy,
no it's not
they lose mountains of money all the time by being woke

[Anonymous No.17414922]

>>17412321
Again, most minority groups would be targeted by genuine marxists, because they are either or both highly religious, degenerate and lazy. Blacks dont belong in a genuine marxist state.

[Anonymous No.17414933]

>>17412177
No, because universities lower the average level of education, replacing it with propaganda.

[Anonymous No.17414944]

>>17411680
>but I women wants to "take three dicks at a time" and basedjack wants to watch
Thank you for making my point. Good luck creating the next generation of progressive capitalists with that mentality.

[Anonymous No.17415113]

>>17414933
cope from a retarded trailer park denizen

[Anonymous No.17415117]

>>17409477
all that needs to be said

[Anonymous No.17415210]

>>17409327
Karina Marx would in fact become transgender herself. She would use she/they pronouns, march with Barack Obama and Mitt Romney in the radical BLM revolution, and vote for Joe Biden to prevent the fascist takeover of America. During this pandemic she would even use Etsy to sell Hello Kitty ACAB stickers like a true communist

[Anonymous No.17415216]

Karl Marx would be part of the #resistance

[Anonymous No.17415230]

>>17409699
who's gonna manage the central bank? random plebs? construction workers and cashiers?

[Anonymous No.17415252]

>>17409327
He would do what he always did. Subvert and control the opposition through his seductive ideas and writing.

[Anonymous No.17415281]

>>17409402
Both are variations on collectivism tard. Guess what isn't a variation on collectivism.

[Anonymous No.17415296]

>>17409621
>it's not a wide term anon, it's an anticoncept that should not, ever again, be used.

[Anonymous No.17415555]

There is so much we have learned from Karl Marx and his writings, his analysis of history, the manner in which Marx actually lived his revolutionary practice and studied the changing world, the theory he helped to create, his approach to praxis, the material relations he named. The world has his fingerprints all over it. He's needed now more than ever

[Anonymous No.17415578]

>>17415555
get a fucking job hippie

[Anonymous No.17415585]

>>17415578
I'm a Philosophy adjunct

[Anonymous No.17415594]

>>17415555
all wrong. he's a past chapter of the history of thought. he has essentially zero relevance to the present.
>>17415585
probably continental "philosophy". probably can't do math. that's why your thinking is confused, imprecise and worthless.

[Anonymous No.17415596]

okay what books should i read on marx ?
i stayed away from him because /pol/ told me commies are idiots but im interested in him nw

[Anonymous No.17415639]

>>17415596
either kolakowski or sowell. anyone trying to tell you to start with primary sources are trannies from twitter more interested in signalling true faith than understanding.

[Anonymous No.17415647]

>>17415639
>sowell
eww

[Anonymous No.17415652]

>>17415596
Marx reading list:

Brumaire
Manuscripts
Value, Price, and Profit
Gotha
Grundrisse
Capital 1, 2, and 3 (yes you need to read all of them. 1 is not self-contained.)

Further Reading:
Michael Heinrich's Introduction (note: not an introduction)
Heinrich's 3-4(?) volume biography of Marx that he is still writing (vol 1 is out)
Love and Capital (another biography)
Isaak Illich Rubin's Essays on Marx's Theory of Value
Time, Labor, and Social Domination by Postone
Value by Diane Elson
Workers and Capital by Tronti
Law and Marxism by Pashukanis
Notebooks by Gramsci
The Principle of Hope by Bloch
Arcades Project by Benjamin
The Production of Space by Lefebvre
The Making of the English Working Class by Thompson (also read his essay on time.)
Poverty of Theory by Thompson
The Black Jacobins by C.L.R. James
Hobsbawm tetralogy
Antiquity to Feudalism and Lineages of the Absolutist State by Perry Anderson
The Essential Lenin
The Essential Stalin
On Contradiction and On Practice by Mao
Dialectical Logic, Intelligent Materialism, and The Dialectics of the Abstract and the Concrete in Marx's Capital by Ilyenkov
Lenin and Philosophy and Other Essays, I and IS Apparatuses, and Philosophy of the Encounter by Althusser
H and CS by Lukacs
Marx: Towards the Centre of Possibility by Karatani
Eclipse by Gilles Dauve
What Was the USSR? Towards a Theory of the Deformation of Value Under State Capitalism by Aufheben
Reading Marx Politically by Cleaver
Marx's Inferno by William Clare Roberts
Moneybags Must Be So Lucky: On the Literary Structure of Capital by Robert Paul Wolff
In the Long Run We Are All Dead: Keynesianism, Political Economy, and Revolution by Geoff Mann
Crack Capitalism by John Holloway
The Origins of Capitalism as a Social System: The Prevalence of an Aleatory Encounter by John Milios
Critical Theory and the Critique of Political Economy: On Subversion and Negative Reason by Bonefeld
The 4 volumes of Open Marxism
There's No Such Thing as "The Economy": Essays on Capitalist Value by Samuel A. Chambers
Marx at the Millennium by Cyril Smith
Critiquing Capitalism Today: New Ways to Read Marx by Frederick Harry Pitts
The Dialectical Imagination by Martin Jay
Money and Totality by Moseley
Marx's Capital and Hegel's Logic: A Reexamination by Moseley
The Constitution of Capital: Essays on Volume 1 of Marx's Capital by Bellofiore
The Origin of Capitalism: A Longer View by Ellen Meiksins Wood

[Anonymous No.17415660]

>>17415652
this is a tranny who hasn't even read a third of those books.
compiling long lists of primary sources they themselves have no intention to ever read is a commie pseud sacrament.

[Anonymous No.17415668]

>>17415660
reading marxists texts for yourself and coming up with your own opinion about what they say is a better idea than reading biased anti marxist lolbert ideologues like sowell

[Anonymous No.17415673]

>>17409402
>You can't be socialist and racist. We don't want bigots on our team.
Workers of the World Unite!*
*(you must subscribe to our changing views on what it means to be united, or we won't consider you a worker worthy of protections - accept these terms or die, yes we'll endlessly splinter over this in to uselessness, but you said something bad once that offended The Party so we have to liquidate you, on the other hand you never existed, mentioning you is now a crime worthy of liquidation, wait a sec someone at the door)

[Anonymous No.17415703]

>>17415652
wtf thats a lot

[Anonymous No.17415711]

>>17415703
it's a tranny. he hasn't read much of it himself.
>>17415668
dumb fucking tranny.
>I want to learn about marxism
>just start by reading 3000 pages of mid 19th century primary sources
do you really think people don't see through your larp?

[Anonymous No.17415725]

>>17415711
>muh trannies
what are you on about retard

[Anonymous No.17415731]

>>17409402
>We
college students are not socialists.

[Anonymous No.17415732]

>>17415711
Better recs than that nigger lolbert hack Sowell

[Anonymous No.17415739]

>>17415652
fuck this shit im becoming a libertarian

[Anonymous No.17415741]

>>17415660
>compiling long lists of primary sources they themselves have no intention to ever read is a commie pseud sacrament.
lol

kind of true desu

[Anonymous No.17415753]

>>17415652
just get pussy instead

[Anonymous No.17415759]

>>17415732
nope. obviously you're not going to read several thousands of pages of marx unless you're already committed. which makes it a completely worthless suggestion.
you know this, but you're a commie tranny. the point for you isn't to actually learn anything, the point is to signal.

[Anonymous No.17415770]

>>17410074
You will never be a real woman.

[Anonymous No.17415772]

>>17415770
That's okay, because you'll never be a real man.

[Anonymous No.17415778]

>>17415741
this
i dated a "commie" and she had tons books on this and critical theory and i asked her which was her fav and she giggled she hasnt read any of it

[Anonymous No.17415782]

>>17415778
someone posted a twitter cap of some leftist pseud seething about muh drumpf or qanon boomers or incels or something. his handle? @readcapital

larping about books they don't read is an actual religion to internet commies.

[Anonymous No.17416152]

>>17409327
>Is /leftypol/ still crying
>checks /lit/
Yup

[Anonymous No.17417159]

>>17409327
Identity politics is a bourgeois ideology to keep the working class divided. Rich people advance identity politics or injected it into movements in order to break said movements down. I saw that Occupy Wall Street is being revived at this moment. That, however, is most likely not possible. Such a movement will be divided against itself along race and gender.

[Anonymous No.17417192]

>>17417159
occupy isnt back, but there is definitely a huge discontent and anger against the ruling class and capitalism, neoliberalism, etc that transcends the left and right. theyre both too divided by the culture war, trump/anti trump, blm, etc bullshit to work together of course, but they are both angry at the elites and high finance. there's a reason both of them rioted recently.

they could work together theoretically as a pro working class faction against big capital, but they wont because they'll just call each other nazis or commies.

theres been some effort to create a populist coalition though. this guy on youtube is a leftist who interviewed some trump militia guy about populist concerns
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZMB9052rEs

[Anonymous No.17417213]

>>17417192
I saw this. Jimmy Dore thinks he can push these right wing populist guys left economically because they're largely working class, just misled by propaganda in his view. He also thinks that the left spends too much time demonizing them instead of trying to engage with them which just radicalizes them further to the right. I don't know how effective of a strategy it is, but it might work better than just kneejerk calling them all Nazis. Of course Twitter is up in arms about this right now.

[Anonymous No.17417286]

>>17417213
>>17417192
This strategy ignores the effect on people of color and places too much importance on only the white working class. Many of the poor people of America are people of color or marginalized identities. They are doing a lot of work to advance the leftist cause that can't just be disregarded. Cozying up to fascists is naive and only serves to alienate PoC comrades.

The mythical "red brown alliance" is flawed because the social views of the right are too incompatible with the overarching goal of equality and the broad range of identities on the left. While identity politics in terms of putting identity before class is an issue, we should also not disregard the realities that minorities identities face or the systemic inequities against them. The white idpol adherents are more concerned with discriminating against others than fighting capital and only seek to co opt the anti capitalist cause to further nationalist goals. Their beliefs reinforce hierarchy and racial caste systems which are another form of class warfare.

Yes, it is true that many Trump voters were desperate poor people and working class whites who wanted to vote for a wildcard candidate. However, they are too ridden by the false consciousness of racial politics and American ruling class rhetoric to be of real use, which is why they are Trumpers to begin with and easily seduced by capitalism and nationalism's bourgeoise promises. Their social beliefs are fundamentally incompatible with the goals of the left and will drive away many working class people with their bigoted views. They will undermine the left if we give them a say in order to advance rightist nationalist goals.

[Anonymous No.17417318]

>>17417286
Most "PoC" are still christian and family oriented, the left, dominated by PMC whites and lgbtsjwtfnpc cultural marxist whackjobs has become so radical many of them are turning to the right(see latinos in texas and florida).

[Anonymous No.17417345]

>>17417159
Identity politics is just empathy and basic human decency. The mild discomfort you feel from beimg told to acknowledge your whiteness sit down shut up and listen is not even one millionth of the absolute terror and humilliation marginalized folx go through every instant of their conscious existence from living under christian cisheteronormative white supremacist patriarchy.

[Anonymous No.17417346]

>>17417286
if we want a true working class movement, we have to be willing to make some compromises. blacks, whites, hispanics, lgbt, everyone needs to put all that at the door and unite against big money to get anything done. emphasize our shared struggle as workers and american citizens getting fucked by elites.

like it or not, many white working class would be considered "racist" or "trumpers", but closing them off wont wake them up to the bigger picture. it'll just make things worse. we have to be willing to do the work to create an american left and deal with the reality of the american working classes beliefs. poverty knows no color, but the american ruling class have put a lot of time and effort to make sure that people dont realize that. this is just what you have to work with.

there will be some racial chauvinists in all these groups. part of the work is being able to put that aside and uniting as a class. otherwise we will just keep fighting amongst ourselves and looking for the differences rather than the common ground, which will make any working class movement DOA

[Anonymous No.17417349]

>>17409402
"Workers of the world unite for a White South Africa"

[Anonymous No.17417372]

>>17413608
ngl, I'd support Polpot because it would result in the smarmy cunts pushing internationalism being eaten by the poor.

[Anonymous No.17417378]

>>17417318
even if they are socially conservative, they are not on board with the quasi white nationalism some of the trumpers partake in. the far right is fundamentally built on inequality and discrimination. they arent willing to work

>>17417346
this is idealism. the far right doesnt even see the issue as capital but as immigrants and jews. trying to get them in a broad working class movement will only lead to them trying to undermine it by pushing racial struggles, and the effect will be fragmentation.

also, the identity politics exhibited by minority groups comes from a position of being subjugated and exploited, people fighting for liberation and rights rather than fighting to maintain dominance of other races. white supremacists simply want to control other races instead of free themselves from control. its a false equivalence to put them together

[Anonymous No.17417405]

>>17417286
The alphabet people are effectively purpose engineered biopolitical clientele for multinationals. Atomized victim patient consumer units who dont think dont read dont breed, can only communicate through corporate newspeak, can be relied upon to buy rainbow colored indulgences from disneygooglepepsico and shut down anyome who actually criticises the system. These so called anarchists and communists are undistinguishable from the hr and marketing departments of major corporations. By this point of late capitalism being homo or transphobic counts as a form of anticlericalism, the role of these people is to legitimate the system with their putrid aids liturgy.

[Anonymous No.17417432]

>>17417378
Well, other groups would also have their identity politics and racial biases as well. This would be an issue with trying to organize the entire American working class

All racial chauvinism regardless would be overcome by the class unity. Call me naive, but again I think it's better to try and educate these people who are disgruntled workers on class consciousness rather than ignore or demonize them which would just lead them further into the racial ideology. Many of these people are simply victims of false narratives, not necessarily evil people or skinhead caricatures, but working people who perhaps consume certain media that leads them down a bad path. They may also be turned off by the left if the left is only hostile to them and not willing to listen to their concerns. Otherwise that hole will be filled by the fascists and GOP grifters selling them bullshit.

[Anonymous No.17417443]

>>17417432
im trying to tell you these people dont want to be convinced and arent going to be. they hate leftists with a passion. they are focused on white supremacism and racial dominance. working with explicit fascists and nationalists will only undermine any class struggle because the class struggle is secondary to them. the class struggle to them only matters as far as "jewish bankers" or "too many brown people", not capitalism in general.

[Anonymous No.17417445]

>>17417378
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/01/15/understand-trumps-support-we-must-think-terms-multiracial-whiteness/%3foutputType=amp

I mean maybe the left is bad at marketing. On one hand you must surrender your individuality to a shame based grievance identity that has nothing to do with your authentic culture, a product of democrat corporate ngo mobilization networks( to which the far left is effectively parasitic). On the other you can have donald trump recognize you as one of the good ones lay claim to the tradition of american aspirational individualism and fight evil satanic pedophiles.

[Anonymous No.17417456]

>>17417405
just because someone's gay doesn't mean they're a resentful leftist, gay people on average have higher standards of living than straights, why would they want communism especially when most communist states outlawed being gay

[Anonymous No.17417469]

>>17417443
Most leftists care more about suppressing the western cannon or getting a fabulous twerking troupe of boy catamites to twerk before the phallic missiles at the daily george floyd memorial prideblm mcdonalds parade than about getting litterally anything for the working class.

[Anonymous No.17417488]

>>17415555
>The world has his fingerprints all over it.
fingerprints of shit

[Anonymous No.17417513]

>>17417443
Do they hate the left, or what they think the left is (liberals, progressives, intersectionality, etc)?
Would they hate a classical, working class oriented left?
Are they largely working Americans who are desperate for change and getting back at the elites, or not?

These are questions I think are important to ask. I get your skepticism, but you have to realize millions of ordinary working Americans are being seduced by the Trump agenda.

These aren't all just rich people or neo nazis, many are just people who are down on their luck or feel wages stagnating and voted for the outsider. It would be foolish not to try to harness that energy and anger they have towards the ruling class and redirect it towards the broader struggle against the wealthy that most Americans regardless of political affiliation can get on board with.

[Anonymous No.17417516]

>>17410539
Seethe

[Anonymous No.17417517]

>>17417469
true leftists hate pride shit because it's not resentful enough. "nooo! you can't just celebrate your sexuality with a carnival!! you have to be angry and upset!!!!"

[Anonymous No.17417526]

>>17415555
Needed now more than ever to manage the retarded left, kick out the fetish weirdos and racewarriors.

[Anonymous No.17417537]

>>17417513
i dont agree with your idea. it just disregards the impact of racism on poc and ignores the fact that trump supporters are often more motivated by bigotry or irrational conspiracies. anti-liberal and anti progressive attitudes are a slippery slope towards encouraging bigotry. this would be a hindrance to any leftist movement. you brush their social beliefs under the rug without realizing how big of a deal it is. it would alienate non white men. the left cant compromise on the principle of equality or work with fascists. period.

[Anonymous No.17417553]

>>17417537
You don't get it. I feel like I'm talking past you. If you want action instead of jerking off in a book club or on twitter, you may have to work with people you don't like and who don't exactly like you.

[Anonymous No.17417561]

>>17417517
I mean its very clear these people are very disturbed and ideological and obsessed with sexualizing and normalizing children. I just dont want them around.

[Anonymous No.17417562]

>>17416152
Incredibly based

[Anonymous No.17417569]

>>17417561
there are more molesters in "trad" societies, i always find these guys who want to live in closed authoritarian religious communities highly sus

[Anonymous No.17417573]

>>17417553
alright buddy good luck trying to get fascists and people like this >>17417561 who think leftists are pedos on board with you through "emphasizing common ground against the elites" lmao like these people fucking care

[Anonymous No.17417582]

>>17417573
most working and middle class people don't care about "the elites" they just want to grill for god's sake

[Anonymous No.17417586]

>>17417573
Instead we should emphasise the common ground we have with the elites and against the unwashed masses

[Anonymous No.17417594]

>>17417586
based

[Anonymous No.17417609]

>>17417456
Did they get there by working hard or by playing identity politics?

[Anonymous No.17417615]

>>17417573
the liberal's true colors come out once again. stop play acting as a leftist for your gay ass university book club and just admit youre no better than some cunt who posts "yasss queen" on kamala harris tweets. workers arent the perfect little angels you want them to be.

[Anonymous No.17417627]

>>17417615
actually i do work and i do go to protests. i put in more work organizing than you most likely, and i see comrades of all races, colors, cultures, creeds, and identities. thats why i dont want to compromise to placate white nationalists. its naive, foolish, idealist, middle class white boy delusions

[Anonymous No.17417636]

>>17417609
they were already there, they're just out of the closet now

[Anonymous No.17417653]

>>17417627
do you have this same fervor against non white racial identitarians? don't answer that, because i already know the answer

[Anonymous No.17417670]

>>17417653
no, because its a false equivalence you are making. i can tell this is a sheltered white boy

[Anonymous No.17417694]

>>17415555
>There is so much we have learned from Karl Marx and his writings,
There is so much we have learned from redditors and their most upvoted posts
>his analysis of history
Like saying a magic man in the sky orders things
> the manner in which Marx actually lived his revolutionary practice
Supported by the wealthier Engels,truly an example of the working class
>inb4 not all his life

>He's needed now more than ever
Who?
Chirst?
Lmao

[Anonymous No.17417716]

>>17417694
>Chirst?
lel
Also can't wait for someone to say everything is wrong because of the calculation problem is somewhat mentioned

[Anonymous No.17417721]

>does he immediately kill himself?
No because he has no influence or impact over the development of identity politics, so it's not his responsability. He would just dismiss all of it as reactionary and move on to something more important.

[Anonymous No.17417722]

>>17417653
You're a retard.
One is based on maintaining power and a oppressive system
The other is based on dismantling that system

[Anonymous No.17417728]

>>17417670
>i can tell this is a sheltered white boy
And literally everyone who has ever interacted with you can tell this is a projection

[Anonymous No.17417731]

>>17417722
white girl logic

[Anonymous No.17417737]

>>17417286
>"peee-OH-ceee"
anyone who uses this word unironically is either a fat disgusting sub 90iq radicalized sheboon groid or a white self-hating leftist worm of the most disgusting squirming variety.

[Anonymous No.17417740]

>>17417627
That's nice and I agree with you about the importance of a diverse coalition. You kind of miss the guy's point though. I think he is trying to tell you to stop emphasizing things like white privilege, historical racial oppression, critical race theory, all that stuff so much because it just reinforces racial tension by bringing it to the forefront of everyone's minds which then in turn creates more identity politics movements in whites, blacks, etc. than anything bringing people together.

[Anonymous No.17417769]

>>17417740
See>>17417345. Colorblind racism is still racism. Only cishet white males can afford not to think in terms of identity.

[Anonymous No.17417837]

>>17417740
White silence is violence. It is the duty of all white people to confront white supremacy. If leftists cant live up to the bare minimum of human decency followed even by capitalists what then?

[Anonymous No.17417853]

>>17417737
For extra diversity, I always make sure to refer to them as "POCs" (People of Colors), pronounced "pox"

[Anonymous No.17417975]

>>17409370
This. Look at the widespread support for the gamestop situation. When the identity politics wedge hasn't been firmly inserted beforehand, people you'd never see agree otherwise seem to be on the same side.

[Anonymous No.17418022]

>>17417975
White supremacy is insidious and subconscious.

[Anonymous No.17418051]

>>17418022

[Anonymous No.17418072]

>>17418022
White supremacy is conscious. Everyone is conscious of the fact that white people better

[Anonymous No.17418112]

being anti racist is non negotiable. if youre racist, youre not a comrade. period.

[Anonymous No.17418168]

>>17418112
I don't want to be anti-racist. I want to be explicitly pro-race. I want to live in a world where I can kill niggers, kikes, muslims, communists, and protestants with my brothers

[Anonymous No.17418275]

>>17418168
and you have proven why the idealist "red brown alliance" that sheltered white berniebros have a boner for will never come to fruition

[Anonymous No.17418285]

>>17418112
Why not have negroes live in socialist African states, Asians in socialist Asian states, and Europeans in socialist European states?

[Anonymous No.17418306]

>>17418285
because thats not the reality of the world. to enforce this would require ethnic cleansing. this is unacceptable.

[Anonymous No.17418827]

Social democracy > Marxism

[Anonymous No.17418976]

>>17409492
You're an out-of-touch moron. The working class, especially in the 21st century isn't comprised entirely of white male coal miners. LGBTQ people, people of colour, immigrants and women all make up a large chunk of the contemporary proletariat.

[Anonymous No.17419028]

>>17417716
>>17417694
While I think this anon is a little retarded,there are funny similarities between marxism and religion,quite a few actually.
Dialectical Materialism is indeed retarded,and plays a big enough part.

Even the marxists that are seemingly based,againts neo-liberalism,have a problem,a completely retarded ideology,many even result to denial of science,and they analyze Marx's writings like a theologian analyzes the Bible,their wisest minds unable to accept that their prophet might be wrong,and that his revelations do not actually have a basis in reality.

[Anonymous No.17419047]

>>17413598
>Druggies, NEET trannies, prostitutes, thieves, etc.
These people are based; they shouldn't find their salvation in the working class through; they should be using them just like the bourgeois do. Every man for himself. Fuck "revolution", fuck "the working class" ; I care more about my well-being than some two-bit "worker", and I don't accept the protestant work ethic assumptions of "society" because I don't value society or what happens to it. I only care about myself, and I how I can use people for myself.

[Anonymous No.17419050]

>>17418306
> people can't take a plane to their respective homeland

Idiot.

[Anonymous No.17419063]

>>17419050
That's not their "homeland" though, and you can't just force them to leave a country they are citizens of or were born in. Not all the non white people are immigrants even, some were born in these places and raised there.

[Anonymous No.17419073]

How do marxist feel about affirmative action? quotas for blacks and women?

[Anonymous No.17419078]

>>17419073
empty gesture of tokenism that doesnt change the system in the slightest but just the public face of it

[Anonymous No.17419918]

>>17419073
Does it really end racism? No
Does it challenge capital? No

[Anonymous No.17420158]

>>17417286
At least 40% of American "people of color" should not be here at all, desu...

[Anonymous No.17420423]

>>17420158
on what grounds do you base this claim?

[Anonymous No.17420424]

>>17417213
>>17417286
Let's think about what a hypothetical Red Nobility would do once they led a vanguard party to power in the US.
Are they going to reverse third-world immigration? (no)
Overturn the disparate impact state or reform the civil rights laws? (no)
Re-institute merit-based selection in the civil service? (no)
Roll back women's rights to get the birth rates back up? (no)
Cut boomerbucks so that we aren't strangled by the costs of caring for retiree civil servants? (no)
Under the Real Left you get all the same problems with the current New Left, whilst also having a Soviet-style planned economy with all the downsides that that entails.
There's no benefit for the vast majority of supporters of right-wing populism to support this, left-wing politics is based on equality and concern for victims to a fault, whereas right-wingers are less interested in this and want to get rid of the stifling egalitarianism of the post-war West in general.

[Anonymous No.17420430]

>>17420423
Take out all the ones who aren't black descendants of slaves or Amerindians, and some Mexicans in the Southwest. Maybe 40% is a bit of an underestimate actually.

[Anonymous No.17420439]

>>17420424
cutting social security is retarded but the others have some merit

[Anonymous No.17420497]

>>17420439
Civil servant pensions aren't paid by social security, I think. They wouldn't be earning $100k a year retiring at 50 if it was. Many of them, like my uncle for example, have 2 pensions paying 6 figures each and a third joke government job by 65.

[Anonymous No.17420689]

>>17409327
He'd unironically write a 500 page book autistically criticizing everything that's contradictory in idpol and then not publish the book

[Anonymous No.17420708]

>>17409613
Didn't Proudhon get btfo by Marx so hard he never wrote again because he couldn't come up with a rebuttal?

[Anonymous No.17421245]

test

[Anonymous No.17421314]

>>17417213
>He also thinks that the left spends too much time demonizing them instead of trying to engage with them which just radicalizes them further to the right
It will never work due to you fags only thinking
>I don't know how effective of a strategy it is
instead of actually giving a fuck about people. You'll never fool anybody. You're all just armchair strategist devoid of any actual passion for your ideals.

[Anonymous No.17421355]

>>17420689
>autistically criticizing everything that's contradictory
It would be mostly polemic rather than actual critique, like his book about Stirner.

[Anonymous No.17421388]

>>17419028
>While I think this anon is a little retarded,there are funny similarities between marxism and religion,quite a few actually.
>Dialectical Materialism is indeed retarded,and plays a big enough part.
I actually have a little list I'm working on, anon, of the similarities between puritan Christianity and Marxist ideologies. Take a little look and tell me if I should add anything:

-Struggle against sin and the devil is replaced by class struggle and struggle against the bourgeoisie
-Eschatology (day of judgement) is replaced by the day of class abolition and true equality (the afterlife on earth)
-Priests are replaced by Marxist intellectuals and political commissars who ensure everyone believes the correct ideology
-Love thy neighbour
-all are equal in Marx
-“False consciousness”: This is essentially socialism’s “demonism”, whereby anyone who does not see things in the same way as Marxist philosophical assertions, is branded as “possessed by the devil”, or in this case “possessed by false consciousness”, “possessed by the bourgeousie.”

[Anonymous No.17421552]

idk who this thread attracted but I'm looking for contemporary culture critique recommendations in the vein of Debord, Marcuse, Adorno, Gorz etc op ed journal articles are fine

[Anonymous No.17421555]

I need to escape California.