/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.17366056]

I heard that Christianity and Abrahamic religions are uniquely flawed, and have been uniquely regressive to the Western spirit, in that they recognise the transcendent dimensions of spirituality, divinity, and a sort of non-dual consciousness where one is one with the godhead, yet they limit these dimensions to a kind of "divine otherness" found only in the heavenly realms, with Jesus being a kind of earthly facilitator who has the sole monopoly on this sort of experience. Essentially they recognised the divine, but then cut humanity off from it by saying it was something accessbile only to one Special Saviour.

What are your opinions on this?

[Anonymous No.17366068]

>>17366056
Try esoteric Christianity

[Anonymous No.17366077]

>>17366056
It seems arbitrary. Considering in Christianity there is the concept of sainthood, where normal people achieve holiness, and this has been applied to millions of people across time and cultures. Why is the concept of divinity inherently better than the concept of holiness?

[Anonymous No.17366082]

Anything mainstream is diluted. Try the Gospel of Thomas or gnosticism to get a better, more concentrated version of spirituality that is more about consciousness, divinity, kingdom of heaven within rather than jesus being the SON OF GOD!! Who is inherently better than everyone else.

[Anonymous No.17366097]

>>17366056
>>17366068
>>17366082
So I guess you guys love Mormonism

[Anonymous No.17366102]

>>17366097
I don't really know much about mormonism, can you give me the gist of it?

[Anonymous No.17366108]

>>17366097
Eww no

[Anonymous No.17366109]

>>17366082
>gnosticism

Based Plotinus rekt them almost 2000 years ago:

Do not suppose that a man becomes good by despising the world and all the beauties that are in it. They [the Gnostics] have no right to profess respect for the gods of the world above. When we love a person, we love all that belongs to him; we extend to the children the affection we feel for the parent. Now every Soul is a daughter of the [Godhead]. How can this world be separated from the spiritual world? Those who despise what is so nearly akin to the spiritual world, prove that they know nothing of the spiritual world, except in name. . . .

Let it [any individual soul] make itself worthy to contemplate the Great Soul by ridding itself, through quiet recollection, of deceit and of all that bewitches vulgar souls. For it let all be quiet; let all its environment be at peace. Let the earth be quiet and the sea and air, and the heaven itself waiting. Let it observe how the Soul flows in from all sides into the resting world, pours itself into it, penetrates it and illumines it. Even as the bright beams of the sun enlighten a dark cloud and give it a golden border, so the Soul when it enters into the body of the heaven gives it life and timeless beauty and awakens it from sleep. So the world, grounded in a timeless movement by the Soul which suffuses it with intelligence, becomes a living and blessed being. . . .

It [Spirit/Soul] gives itself to every point in this vast body, and vouchsafes its being to every part, great and small, though these parts are divided in space and manner of disposition, and though some are opposed to each other, others dependent on each other. But the Soul is not divided, nor does it split up in order to give life to each individual. All things live by the Soul in its entirety [i.e., ultimately there are no degrees, no levels, but simply pure Presence]; it is all present everywhere. The heaven, vast and various as it is, is one by the power of the Soul, and by it is this universe of ours Divine. The sun too is Divine, and so are the stars; and we ourselves, if we are worth anything, are so on account of the Soul. Be persuaded that by it thou can attain to God. And know that thou wilt not have to go far afield.

[Anonymous No.17366121]

>>17366102
They believe in secret knowledge (you earn this secret knowledge at your endowment ceremony) and believe if you follow all their teachings you become God of your own planet

[Anonymous No.17366128]

>>17366109
Yeah I think some gnostics take the

''World is a corpse, whoever has found that corpse, the world is not worthy of him'' idea too far

But personally I think the world he refers to is the deadened, conceptualized reality that most of mankind lives - in which they label and negate everything without experiencing it. Essentially an unconscious, anxiety laden reality.

Jesus points to nature with his lillies in the field, trying to get people to live the tao. Anything extreme is probably a warping of his teachings. Kind of a no true scotsman fallacy but oh well.

[Anonymous No.17366131]

>>17366068
What esoterics can you recommend who weren't condemned as heretics like Giordano Bruno and Meister Eckhart were?

[Anonymous No.17366138]

>>17366128
So if you discover the world that you live is not the ''world'' - but just your mind projecting everything on everything, you realize that it's ''dead'' (stale, not living) you drop the mind and experience being rather than thinking.

Upon achieving this state through meditation and prayer the world (mind, thinking, labelling, dualism) is not worthy of you any longer.

[Anonymous No.17366144]

>>17366128
>only these very specific sayings of Jesus are legit. Please ignore the God claims and talk of the holy spirit aiding the apostles....pls

[Anonymous No.17366151]

>>17366144
Can u be specific so I can reply rather than snarky thnnxx

[Anonymous No.17366161]

>>17366131
Agrippa, John Dee, Swedenborg, Eliphas Levi was very Catholic but remains a controversial figure, really look into Rosicrucianism and Martinism

[Anonymous No.17366170]

>>17366121
>believe if you follow all their teachings you become God of your own planet
Sounds kind of like a strange mix of left hand path and right hand path

[Anonymous No.17366209]

In as much as Abrahamism takes Plato's ideas of transcendent realms (and just things in general) and runs it into the fucking ground with very little of the "safeguards" that Plato put in place, I'd be inclined to agree.

I'm not so much criticizing Plato here as I just have to pin it on him because, as far as I'm aware, there's nowhere else in the world that this idea of transcendent things totally divorced from humanity at an ontological level crops up.

[Anonymous No.17366295]

Isn't devine experience a central component to Christian philosophy?

[Anonymous No.17366490]

>>17366056
Seems more like the Abrahamic religions, Christianity in particular, have made it easier to concentrate the spiritual and transcendent experiences in the world through one fundamental person who is above all comprehension and therefore even above metaphysics (the Father), with this person having a unique attribute of generating other persons (the Son and the Spirit,) with the Son’s unique attribute being His ability to communicate the Father in a comprehensive way to creation while being above creation and equal to the Father in essence; In this instance, the Son is also above metaphysics, but He is also able to exist in metaphysics and physics through the Incarnation. The Spirit also generates from the Father and passes through the Son, touching and gifting everyone in the age after the Son’s resurrection and in the age preceding the Son’s second coming. This ‘Trinity’ gives a supralogical and suprarational explanation and model of why the Christian “monopoly” on such transcendental realms, as you put it, is so important—The being that is above all quantification and conceptual recognition (God), also has the ability to incarnate into creation while also remaining transcendental to creation, also gifting, sustaining, and filling creation itself. This process is distinct, yet also united, through the distinction of persons in this being, yet all three persons also share the same will and essence and action, hence being one being shared by distinct persons.

This complex yet simple ontology explains why the transcendental dimensions of spirituality is somewhat ‘cut off’ from Humanity in a conceptual level, but is also connected to Humanity in a level above the conceptual. It is through Christ that Humanity has found a representative to the divine, for Christ is divine and yet is also man, destroying any chain of thought that states that all of humanity is cut off in an unrighteousness way.

[Anonymous No.17366507]

>>17366056
That's autistic and stupid anon.

[Anonymous No.17366530]

>>17366507
>not being down with autistic stupidity

do you even /lit/?

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !!Fdjwhocst8j No.17366544]

>>17366056
>laughing jesus.jpg
That’s Aphex Twin

[Anonymous No.17366571]

>>17366544
Hi butterfly :-3

[Anonymous No.17366578]

>>17366068
>my wacky secret christianity for faggots is way better

[Anonymous No.17366591]

>>17366578
Whatever you say, hylic

[Anonymous No.17366600]

>>17366591
Shit nigger, you must be retarded

[Anonymous No.17366606]

>>17366600
>what are you doing
Being a real wizard, bitch

[Anonymous No.17366616]

Well, *chuckles*, perhaps if you had my ancient esoteric knowledge you wouldn't think Christianity was so retarded.

[Anonymous No.17366634]

>>17366056
>I heard that Christianity and Abrahamic religions are uniquely flawed, and have been uniquely regressive to the Western spirit,
There was no “Western Spirit” before christianity or abrahamic religion, so make of that what you will.

[Anonymous No.17366648]

>>17366131
Bruno was literally antichristian, even platonists would burn him (for his own cosmological views). Eckhart was not condemned, he was in trial. Mysticism is not esoteric in the common exo-eso-teric reciprocal dichotomy (one is inseprable from the other), but only in the subjective, experiential sense.

[Anonymous No.17366658]

>>17366295
This is true.
>>17366056
I wouldn't say that Christianity is "uniquely flawed" this way. The central rite of Christianity allows you to take part in the Godhead by literally eating it. I'm not really sure what you're arguing, honestly

[Anonymous No.17366664]

>>17366068
More like esonerdic

[Anonymous No.17367393]

>>17366056
That's actually the point, to give people doctrines where people actually are confronted with their insufficiency, their inability to measure up to the divine, or have a truly spiritual experience. Christ is the good shepherd because he tried his best to make people grow the fuck up instead of babbling useless shit and inhaling their own farts like Indian Brahmans. Far from being a flaw, one of the best things Christ ever said was that he alone is the way, that way people would have less opportunity for pseudo-spiritual wankery.

[Jesus No.17367987]

>>17366056
dude, while it's legal, mainstream, it is bullshit. literally.

[Anonymous No.17368374]

>>17366056
>Essentially they recognised the divine, but then cut humanity off from it by saying it was something accessbile only to one Special Saviour.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theosis_(Eastern_Christian_theology)

[Anonymous No.17368422]

>>17366056
>I heard that Christianity and Abrahamic religions are uniquely flawed
I think you meant uniquely based.

[Jesus No.17368936]

>>17368422
no. uniquely bullshit for stupid faggots.

[Anonymous No.17370009]

https://boards.4channel.org/vg/thread/321786805#lr322031131

[Anonymous No.17370035]

>>17366634
t. has never read a single history book

[Anonymous No.17370045]

>>>/vg/322030495

[Anonymous No.17370428]

>>17366056
what part of
>If you want to discuss history, religion, or the humanities, go to /his/
you don't understand?

[Anonymous No.17370512]

This thread was moved to >>>/his/10318920