/wg/ - Writing General

[Anonymous No.17307744]

prev:>>17280419

Any progress on your novels?

For Prose:
>The Art of Fiction
>On Becoming A Novelist
>Writing Fiction: A Guide to Narrative Craft
>How Fiction Works
>The Rhetoric of Fiction
>Steering the Craft

For Poetry:
>The Poetry Home Repair Manual
>Western Wind: An Introduction to Poetry

Related Material:
>What Editors Do
>A Student's Introduction to English Grammar
>Garner's Modern English Usage

Suggested books on storytelling:
>The Weekend Novelist
>Aristotle's Poetics
>Hero With a Thousand Faces
>Romance the Beat

Suggested books on getting your fucking work done you lazy piece of shit:
>Deep Work
>Atomic Habits

Traditional publishing
> Formatting manuscript
https://blog.reedsy.com/manuscript-format/
> Write a query
https://www.janefriedman.com/query-letters/
> Track your query
https://querytracker.net/


Other Resources
>General grammar/syntax/editing help
https://owl.purdue.edu/owl/purdue_owl.html
> When/where/how should I write?
https://jamesclear.com/daily-routines-writers
> What software should I write with?
https://self-publishingschool.com/book-writing-software-best/
> Amazon Publishing to make that KDP monie
https://kdp.amazon.com/en_US/help/topic/G200635650
> Be like Charles Dickens and write serially
https://www.royalroad.com/
> Basic overview of the Screenplay format
https://screenwriting.info/

[Anonymous No.17307817]

Which events are the best at generating emotion(as in raw happy/sad tearjerking, not things like suspense or anger)?

- deaths
- births
- goodbyes
- reunions
- underdog injustice
- underdog victory

what else?

[Anonymous No.17308733]

I've been planning my book for 2 years now, almost 20k words worth of just notes on characters, worldbuilding, plot etc. I've made a couple attempts at writing scenes of it but never been happy with any of them, but a couple weeks ago I got a new job and started focusing on that, during that time, my interest in my writing just faded. I was no longer obsessing over it. At most I could hold an interest for two days, and then it deflated and I was back to feeling soulless. My passion as an author is just dead, and I don't think it's coming back no matter how much I want it to. Should I come to terms with it and accept it, or just I still make an attempt at writing?

>>17307817
All of those events are subjective and need context, not to mention a great writer for them to be tearjerkers. I’ll also add betrayal.

[Anonymous No.17308827]

>>17308733
It's safe to say that I've no idea about your experience, method or progress anon, but two years and 20k words of planning sounds fucking insane to me. I feel like you've been procrastinating more than anything else, as though you're trying to hide from actually writing the book.

The fact is, a job is going to provide the best possible excuse to procrastinate and time away from a project will always dampen your momentum. You've either got to get going and get that momentum started again, or accept that you never had what it takes in the first place. Actually write the fucking book and stopping dicking about with intricacies nobody truly cares about, or abandon all of the hard work you've put into it thus far. Only you can really decide.

[Anonymous No.17308844]

>>17307817
>glorious doomed last stand
is also a good one.

[anonymous No.17308873]

If you've been "planning" for 20K words, you probably aren't really that into writing but just daydreaming. Just write a scene sometime if you truly enjoy writing. Planning is OK but that's a LOT.

[Anonymous No.17308896]

>"Dragging them behind him against sand and stone would have done the meat no favours, but Kindo was in no position to worry about that at present."
Bit of a specific question, but can I use 'at present' in the past tense like this? I've never really thought about it before. Apologies in advance for the shitty first draft prose.

[Anonymous No.17309027]

>>17307817
An artfully articulated presentation of parent/child dynamics is always emotional. Everyone alive has both a father and a mother, and they're powerful connections with a lot of a priori weight to them. Even if you were orphaned at birth and grew up on the streets, there existed at one point two human beings who contributed the genetic material that became you.

[Anonymous No.17309034]

>>17308896
Yes, that's fine. What's less fine is:
>Dragging them behind him

[Anonymous No.17309300]

>>17307817
defeat and failure

[Anonymous No.17309312]

Just need 500 more words to finish a chapter bros
Send me your fucking energy

[Anonymous No.17309384]

>>17307744
Much too big.

[Anonymous No.17309405]

>>17309384
AHAHAHAHAHAHA I WENT TO HIGHSCHOOL WITH HER HER TITS WERE MASSIVEEEE

[Anonymous No.17309555]

>>17309384
Shit ain't right

"My back hurts" bitch just do some pullups

[Anonymous No.17309695]

How to stop writing like a woman/fanfiction writer?

[Anonymous No.17309705]

DIRK DAGGER: NO TIPS

Dirk could not believe was he was seeing. He suddenly released a large groan of indignation and sadness. In his arms was his lover, but in his heart was rage, because his lover was dead. Dirk cried as he suddenly began to cry and let her one last time and let her down on the ground. He knew he would never see her again, would never smell or feel her soft large breasts or perfume ever again. Dirk’s rage reached unbelievable amounts inside him. And now it was time to let it out.
He knew who did this and now all that was left was to find the son of a bitch. It was The Agency and this time they had gone too far. This time they had to pay, and they had run out of checks, so Dirk would make them pay instead in cash: No tips.
A short flight later he arrived in Paris. He admired the gargoyles on the church when a woman walked up to Dirk with a sultry smile and low cut dress. “Monsieur”, she said and put her arms on his shoulder. Dirk sucker punched her quickly but she was too quick.
“Don’t think you can fool me, Madeleine”, Dirk said, “I know your smell anywhere. Calvin Klein.”. The woman laughed and took off her wig to reveal her head and who she was. “Glad to see you aren’t getting rusty, Mister Dagger”.
“Your accent needs some work” Dirk said.
“I’m surprised to see you here in Paris” Madeleine said charmingly, “tell me Mr. Dagger, what brings you here to Paris?”
Dirk sneered and said, “Well it’s been a long time since I’ve seen you. But I have to be going”.
Madeleine was sad and said, “Wait!” But Dirk was already gone. Soon he would be back but first he had business to take care of.

[Anonymous No.17309709]

>>17309695
Read Hemingway.

[Anonymous No.17309826]

>>17309709
Hemingway was one of the greats for sure, but his influence on English language prose has been overall negative. He's held up now by legions of wannabe, petty academicians as the exemplar of "the rules" of writing. It's led to a glut of derivatives spouting the most mundane, workmanlike prose. Now that prose is dead, the industrious little editors and publishers have chosen to erect a McDonald's on its corpse with drivel like "own voices," which is essentially a targeted dilution of literary standards. Hemingway was possibly the single worst influence on American writing there has ever been.

[Anonymous No.17309860]

>>17309826
How is prose dead? Do people just write in verse now and I somehow didn't notice?

[Anonymous No.17310173]

>>17307744
bump

How detailed do you guys plan things out? I mainly write short fiction and for that I never plan things out past a few brief sentence fragments. I'm working on my first novel and I'll jot down scene ideas as they come to me during work or whatever, and I'll keep track of a few key points and events I want to hit.

[Anonymous No.17310217]

>>17307744
I hate pictures like this, not only is the anatomy stupid as fuck (Seriously, follow the back of her neck down, or under her breasts, they think that's where the waist is? Or even her the fucking top of her tits) but the type of person who enjoys is just fucking mentally retarded. WHY IS THERE FLYING PAPER TOO

[Anonymous No.17310314]

>>17310173
So I've done different things based on what I am writing and how the inspiration hits.

I've worked on my first piece that I essentially wrote out beat for beat in terms of story all the way through with what characters need to be where and character notes on brief backgrounds and descriptions. It was a noir genre piece set in 40s L.A. centered around a lot of sort of "#MeToo" stuff as a background with women being brought in by studios as potential actresses only to end up being blackmailed and put out to powerful people in the city as part of a corruption scandal.

A lot of the character notes had research based on real things that happened so if a character had served in the war and thinks about it a lot it had what battles they took place in, descriptions of the scenes and the actions from real accounts.

The abuse too was based on real allegations in the newspapers that I had adapted to fit the characters and setting.

The only problem with this is there became so much that I wanted to explore after researching that the piece became almost more of a serial with long stretching plotlines and characters who although interesting appear once and never again.

I'm about 200k words in with about 50k notes in research, I spend chapters looking into the treatment of native Americans in the film industry, or on the expansion of these religious and immigrant communities because I became so enamored with the research and with the fact that I felt I had to include it when writing despite it being a tangent to the main plot and would be much better suited to a sequel or side project.

I need to edit it all down at some point into a more streamlined, shorter, plot, but I feel like it's going to take a lot of effort that I'm not entirely willing to spend at the moment.

[Anonymous No.17310469]

>>17310217
second for terrible picture. I appreciate a big titty anime pic, but this one has terrible anatomy

[Chad Gardner No.17310635]

I implore you, /lit/, to listen to my story in its entirety before shrugging this off as another Gardner post.

The man parading himself as the titular, F. Gardner, is a fraud, a miscreant, and any other roguish epithet that could befit a man of such ill-repute. He is not the original thought-mind behind. What he has peddled to you all, like a snake oil salesman, is a fraudulent product. A Chinese counterfeit. He has advertised a sham on our dear board. MY rough drafts.

I am the real creator of the Horror's Call series: Chad Gardner.

You see, F. Gardner was an associate of mine. We graduated together as Chicago Film School Alumni in 2012 and have kept in sporadic touch throughout the decade. Recently, we had been shooting creative ideas back and forth and he relented that he had hit a sort of stint in his life. Film school had not gained him the necessary connections nor ability to pursue a career in screenwriting, and he feared that he would never have a chance to put his name out into the world.

I told him: "Worry do not. You and I, Gardners, are bred from patterned stock. Our skin, our blood, a tapestry woven. If I, Chad the Gardner create, then so too can the Frank. Come my brother and we will envision paradise, or envision hell, together."

And so I showed him my work. My magnum opus. The Horror's Call series.

Something changed in Frank that day. A darkness glazed his eyes and I knew in the back of my mind, even then, that I had lost my friend forever.

The next day, I logged on to rework my rough draft and found that all my files were gone and I found the Horror's Call series being advertised all around the world. My life's work, raw and unfinished as it was, marketed under another man's name. I had never experienced infidelity until now.

I take pride in my work. Love, affection, honor, all these qualities I pour into my writing. That is why my series has taken so long to come out. That is why I have a stolen rough draft wading through the market as I pour the finishing touches into Chad of the Crocodile. And I am heartbroken.

I hope that you believe my tale, but worry not, faith alone is not what I require. I shall leave you with evidence: a comparison of Chad and Frank's work, so you will see the difference between the two and decide for yourself.

Please, do not ask me to post my entire work. I can't risk my life's work to be stolen yet again. I think in just one comparison, you will see a marked difference.

This is not bait, this is not shitposting, nor shilling. As ludicrous as this tale is, it is true. Thank you for listening to my words /lit/.

[Chad Gardner No.17310648]

>>17310635
Here is the opening scene of F. Gardner stolen rough draft.

[Anonymous No.17310649]

>>17310635
Shut up.

[Chad Gardner No.17310661]

>>17310635
>>17310648
And here is my work. The exact same scene, yet refined by its original creator.

[Anonymous No.17310679]

>>17310635
Big if true

[Anonymous No.17310689]

>>17310635

[Anonymous No.17310690]

How do you write a sex scene if you've never had sex?

[Anonymous No.17310712]

>>17310690
I learned from visual novels.

[Anonymous No.17310771]

>>17310690
Pay for a prostitute or study it. Read how others describe sex and watch videos (amateur porn). Try to avoid going into too much detail about something you don't know, or the the cracks in your knowledge will show.

[Anonymous No.17310818]

>>17310690
You unironically can't. This isn't just about the actual physical sensation, which is unique, but the myriad emotional and mental felicities which you undergo during intercourse. Sex is incredibly complicated. Someone can consent willingly, for thousands of reasons, and not enjoy it, and regret it; likewise someone can ostensibly NOT consent, but their body tells another story, and afterwards are pleased (and no, this does not make me a rape apologist). Mental prudence versus carnal desire is always at work, like a pendulum swinging this ay and that. You learn things about yourself during sex that you never would otherwise.

If you're stubborn and want to include sex scenes anyway, you're better off fading out or glossing over it, like all the greats do in their novels (most recent example I can think of is Tolstoy in Anna Karenina. Madame Bovary, which includes scores of 'sex scenes' which are themselves integral to the plot, likewise does so without once describing actual sex). It's all suggestion and allusion, no actual graphic descriptions.

[Anonymous No.17310820]

>>17310818
Lucifer is handsome af

[Anonymous No.17311165]

>>17310314
that's a good idea. you got feminism and now native americans, all you need is something BLM related and the system may reward you with a pulitzer or something.

[Anonymous No.17311298]

>>17307744
What's the next step after I've got a decent outline?

[Anonymous No.17311314]

>>17311298
you can start writing the first draft now, although you deserve a break first. Maybe work on it tomorrow instead.

[Anonymous No.17311412]

>>17311314
thanks bud. should i read people i want to sound like or is that a bad idea? also would it be crazy to write it in 2nd person

[Anonymous No.17311519]

>>17309705
>In his arms was his lover, but in his heart was rage, because his lover was dead.
I laughed out loud when I read this. It reads like an autist cataloguing his emotions in a technical report.
>...her soft large breasts...
Your horny level is showing. It kills any emotional impact you try to convey.

The scene between Macgruber and sex-object female also reads like "007: Autism Speaks Another Day". Tell you what though, you only get better through doing, so go ahead and keep writing on. After a while you'll start noticing your word flow improving, then you can go back and rewrite this section. In the meantime, thank you for this absolute gem of prose.

[Anonymous No.17311772]

how do I go from a loose idea into a coherent outline?

[Anonymous No.17311880]

>>17311772
I don't use an outline, personally.

[Anonymous No.17311904]

>>17311880
yikes and cringe

[Anonymous No.17311918]

>>17311904
Cope. I've published two novels. Outlining is just another form of procrastination.

[Anonymous No.17311943]

>>17311918
>I've published two novels
and neither is worth a shit

[Anonymous No.17311957]

>>17311918
self publishing doesn't count

[Anonymous No.17311979]

>>17311943
>>17311957
Cope.

[Anonymous No.17312133]

>>17307744
any steampunkish style book i can read for ideas

[Anonymous No.17312162]

>>17311904
>>17311943
>>17311957
Why don't you fags answer >>17311772 and give some practical advice then?

[Anonymous No.17312168]

>>17312162
he writes

[Anonymous No.17312188]

>>17311772
Just write a chapter-by-chapter synopsis bro, anything else is tryhard crap.

[Anonymous No.17312220]

Is there money on writing a novel for preteen girls?

I want to write the story of a couple of twin sisters who arrive at a new farm, to break a clay cat that frees a loli demon who curses the farm to be assaulted by evil dust bunnies and pets.

[Anonymous No.17312246]

>>17312133
I don't think I've ever read anything good in the Steampunk genre.

[Anonymous No.17312495]

>>17312220
you might find an audience with frogposters who drank too much bleach

[Anonymous No.17312552]

>>17312246
I really think my idea is good whether it involves that genre or not. It's time that genre gets it's neuromancer

[Anonymous No.17312668]

>>17312133
Jules Verne, The Difference Engine (Gibson), Boneshaker

[Anonymous No.17312684]

Why is the "don't have too many POV characters" rule even a thing?

[Anonymous No.17312912]

Where do you guys post or publish your stories?

[Anonymous No.17313056]

Can some anon help me?

To conquer all
To reach the last frontier
()cease to exist

I quite like this poem, but I need something to fill the brackets. A "to" would make sense, but it's too repetitive. Any ideas? Maybe:

(At last,
I)

[Anonymous No.17313360]

So do I just send my text to all possible publishers in my count-tree or one at a time? They take months to respond though

[Anonymous No.17313514]

>>17312912
I publish mine on royalroad

[Anonymous No.17313544]

Any good depictions of dementia in literature? I'm writing a character at the minute who is a POV.

[Anonymous No.17313993]

>>17312684
People who think it's just a suggestion end up like GRRM

[Anonymous No.17314133]

How do you write dialog? I'm pretty decent with regular prose, but I'm always at a loss of ideas when it comes to dialog

[Anonymous No.17314513]

>>17314133
Each character has their own goals and personalities. Make sure that most of what they say is an attempt to progress towards those goals in some way.
If someone says more than three sentences in a row, chances are that it can be condensed into a single sentence. If it can't be condensed then consider giving that character a proper monologue instead.
Realistic dialogue is a meme. Realistic dialogue is people stuttering, talking over each other, and your mom spending 9 hours yapping on the phone to her friends about shit that doesn't matter. Don't listen to anyone who tells you to write realistic dialogue.
"Said" is an invisible word. People only notice when it isn't there. Don't get hung up on trying to give every quote a unique synonym for "said."
Long sections of dialogue can be tiresome to read. It's a good idea to have something to help with the pacing, like scene descriptions or characters preforming actions that indicate the tone of their voice. Just don't put one after every quote.
Don't let your protagonist be that guy who always asks questions. Can't tell you how many stories I've read where the protagonist is some misguided everyman who asks questions for the sake of the audience rather than the story. Your protagonist is going to have to ask questions, just make sure that he also has something interesting to say along with it. Try asking questions without using the question mark.
These are common mistakes that really annoy me slightly and I definitely don't see them in my own writing all the time I promise.

[Anonymous No.17314590]

Is she right /lit/?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0i3Xs1BTNYQ

[Anonymous No.17314606]

>>17314590
>~10 minute video filled with filler no doubt
Urgh URGH I'd just read a book at that point. I'm SICK of these fucking booktubers.

You shouldn't write themes. Themes should happen naturally and be refined later. No idea what she rambled about in that video, but it probably wasn't that i.e. correct.

[Anonymous No.17314627]

>>17314606
>10 minute video filled with filler no doubt
>he doesnt watch videos on 2x speed

[Anonymous No.17314655]

>>17314590
maybe a bit simplistic and overly formulaic but surprisingly she nailed the gist of it

[Anonymous No.17314700]

>>17314590
what is up my friend, abby here and I'm going to waste your time with platitudes

[Anonymous No.17314701]

>>17314627
>he
Don't presume.
But I'm not gonna give that drivel ad revenue, even at 2x speed. I ain't got no time for platitudes.
>>17314700

[Anonymous No.17314720]

^ this is bait

[Anonymous No.17314761]

>>17314590
yes but I want to shave her eyebrows

[Anonymous No.17314977]

Tvtropes is the most powerful research resource in the history of storytelling.

There I said it

[Anonymous No.17315212]

>>17314720
>Doesn't agree with me
>MUST BE BAIT
Never change, simpletons.

>>17314977
This honestly has some truth to it.

[Anonymous No.17315368]

Any advice on writing fictional factions? Seems like when people discuss this the focus is on filling out the blanks from a template about basic societal traits with worldbuilding jargon.

We're writing stories, not encyclopedias.

[Anonymous No.17315392]

>>17315368
you've already got your mind in the right place. You're so close to discovering that worldbuilding is a psyop by big fantasy to cripple new writers who aren't a part of their elite in group

[Anonymous No.17315430]

>>17315392
okay...

so any advice on doing it right?

[Anonymous No.17315480]

>>17309384
>Much too big.
Faggot. She was perfect before.
>>17309555
Exactly. I know plenty of girls with tits like hers and once they started actually exercising their upper body a little they had no complaints.

[Anonymous No.17315587]

>>17309384
this shit should be illegal.

[Anonymous No.17315614]

>>17309405
why'd she do it

[Anonymous No.17315642]

Indecision sucks

[Anonymous No.17315661]

17308195▶

>>17307807
>>17307813
>try too recall
It's 'try to recall".
>After twenty or minutes or so...
"After twenty minutes or so..."

I like it, anon. I'm really intrigued to read the rest.

Woah someone actually read it, thanks lmao. Yeah, I made mistakes it was late and I just wanted to write whatever came to mind, I didn't really go back and edit to anything. Dude, I'm glad you liked it. I'll work on it and see If I can add some more to it.

[Anonymous No.17315964]

Can someone explain to a brainlet like me, how I'm supposed to outline.

I mean git the gist of it, but i can put anything on document

[Anonymous No.17316040]

>>17315964
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KcmiqQ9NpPE
Here's brando sando's best buddy explaining how he learned to write by reading the star trek RPG

[Anonymous No.17316114]

>>17316040
Thank you, i'll check it out.

[Anonymous No.17316250]

New prose, what do you think?

Pain, it was incessant.Permeated by an entropic universe, both physical and spiritual. Forever burrowing its way into men’s hearts until their will snapped back with a maelstrom of force. Charle’s empathized with losers and outcasts for this reason. Failures of an ambiguous game with undefinable rules. Ostracized for their inability to conform and considered unworthy of existence. Expected to accept their burdens silently while carrying a gnawing itch for change.Bludgeoned with lies justifying their fate and scorned for any transgressive attempts to escape. Violence became a final desperate act for the downtrodden. He saw bits of himself in these individuals, yet could offer no solution.

[Anonymous No.17316713]

>>17309860
Minimalism killed prose. Hemingway is to blame. He was too good.

[Anonymous No.17316751]

>>17316250
The tone doesn't match the content. I hate the phrase """"purple prose"""" with a burning passion, but I think it applies in its most lenient definition here. I don't mean, BIG WORDS = PURPLE like your average MFA grad does, but I mean it in the sense that your writing reads like you've got a mouthful of your own cum through which your words gurgle like diarrhea. It's fine in and of itself to let your writing breathe a bit. The mainstream school of literature is trying to slurp up the last few remaining drops of cum from Daddy Hemingway's shriveled balls, but despite their attempts to nominalize/reify the art of writing, there are no concrete rules to the discipline. You're going in the right direction by having a gutful of your own cum rather than someone else's, but remember this: cum is sticky, pungent, and difficult to clean up. Your reader isn't going to want to take your cummies unless you hit them with some foreplay first. You can't just come rolling up with your cock out and hose em down.

[Anonymous No.17316786]

>>17310820
yes, faggot

[Anonymous No.17316791]

>>17310818
idk have you heard of the Bad Sex Awards? There's plenty of shitty sex scenes written by people who've actually had sex. Meanwhile the hottest erotica is undoubtedly mostly written by virgins.

[Anonymous No.17316795]

>>17314606
this. If you set out to write a novel about a theme, you're writing propaganda.

[Anonymous No.17316875]

I'm having a problem writing the female lead who felt guilty for using the male lead, and couldn't answer his feeling when he confessed to her. However at the same time I feel like this is some emotional baggage that has no place in the novel besides being some cheapass drama.
Any advice on this? Or is there any example of the female character wronged the male lead and felt that she didn't deserve him?

[Anonymous No.17316892]

>>17310690
Like this
>Why do these characters have sex? Con or non-con?
>Do they enjoy the sex? Why?
>Do they have foreplay? Do they use toys or other tools to enhance the experience?
>Do they have a long session or quicky?
>Do they enjoy the afterglow or have to do something else?
>What's the result of sex? How do they feel?

[Anonymous No.17316895]

>>17316875
Sounds like you're having some cognitive dissonance. Ask yourself if the scene follows logically from the last scenes. If it does, it's the chain of scenes behind it that let to that situation in the first place. If it doesn't follow logically—as in, if a reader couldn't have written that scene themselves at that point—then find a way to bring it back. From a position of complete ignorance, it sounds like you're writing a "cheapass drama" novel and are only now realizing it.

[Anonymous No.17316957]

>>17311519
kek'd hard at this post

[Anonymous No.17317047]

>>17309705
>Dirk sneered and said, “Well it’s been a long time since I’ve seen you. But I have to be going”.
This is amazing

[Anonymous No.17317194]

Morning lads

https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/37998/wish-mountain

12 followers. Was at 9 last week. Looking up!

New chapter out today.

[Anonymous No.17317222]

>>17317194

[Anonymous No.17317261]

>>17317194
Is that art commission or did you find it somewhere?

[Anonymous No.17317262]

>>17317261
Cost me 200 bucks

[Anonymous No.17317585]

>>17308827
planning a book is much more satisfying than writing it, having it set in stone, unchangeable and a barrier to things you could have included. i've been planning one for about ten years, now, and i never intend to set it down.

[Anonymous No.17317611]

>>17317585
this is going in my cringe compilation

[Anonymous No.17317926]

>find a few hundred pages of various thing a friend and I wrote all the way back in middle school
>start reading through my teenage writing expecting to cringe
>memories of the sheer joy of writing with no regard for anything other than my own enjoyment overwhelm me and I realize I will never have that much fun writing again
Huh.

[Anonymous No.17317951]

>>17307744
>Any progress on your novels?
no, I can't figure out what I want to write so my book is hodge podge of random stuff I write whenever I have the energy

[Anonymous No.17317969]

>>17317951
Sounds based

[Anonymous No.17317976]

>>17317951
>>17317969
A Fernando Pessoa sort of thing?

[Anonymous No.17317983]

>>17307744
Im using google docs to write a book but it doesnt have novel sized book pages, what should I be using?

[Anonymous No.17318057]

Give me some ideas for a story about tradition

[Anonymous No.17318070]

>>17318057
Genital mutilation of children is a tradition, but in some countries immigrants are told they are no longer allowed to do it. How will the old ways survive in the new country that is hostile to them?

[Anonymous No.17318091]

>>17317976
Never read Pessoa but maybe? If I expand on some random thoughts it could easily be in the 100 page range but right now its at 30 because I'm never finding the time to back and expand on those things. Not sure if I want to make it a story and change all the irl names, a book of essays or some prose surrealist thing like Maldoror. The thing is idk what i'd do with these seemingly random and out of place pieces of poetry or rants i have, maybe that'll make it all the more interesting who knows

[Anonymous No.17318100]

>>17318091
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Book_of_Disquiet

[Anonymous No.17318102]

>>17317983
Just format it as a manuscript. https://www.google.com/amp/s/en.softonic.com/articles/novel-manuscript-format-google-docs%3famp=1

[Anonymous No.17318127]

>>17317983
Stop counting the pages retard

[Anonymous No.17318148]

>>17318127
B-but then how do I know how long it is?

[Anonymous No.17318259]

>>17309705
>Dirk cried as he suddenly began to cry

[Anonymous No.17318287]

>tfw you finally think how to tie that bunch of interesting but separate ideas without it being a frankenstein monster

[Anonymous No.17318367]

>>17318259
kek

[Anonymous No.17318633]

I have so many ideas in my head that I just don't know what to write anymore so I don't write at all

[Anonymous No.17318643]

>>17318633
Make a list of your ideas, then use a random number generator to pick which you will write.

[Anonymous No.17318655]

27k words now. As expected, schoolwork is slowing me down. Still hoping to wrap this baby up by March.

[Anonymous No.17318661]

>>17309705
peak comedy

[Anonymous No.17318705]

>>17318148
ctrl+shift+c for wordcount

[Anonymous No.17318718]

>>17318705
But then I would have to take another book and count the words per page on that to know how long my book would be as a book

[Anonymous No.17318758]

>write something
>it's shit
>read good classic books
>they're great
>feel unmotivated because no matter what you will never be as good as their authors

[Anonymous No.17318768]

>>17318758
>read shit book
>feel like you could do better
>do
Try this instead

[Anonymous No.17318772]

>>17318718
are you retarded or what
google shit like "average novel length wordcount"
"average chapter length wordcount"
pages can vary from novel to novel based on formatting anyways, wordcount is always the same

[Anonymous No.17318950]

>>17318768
This is what I do by reading all the isekai and litrpg novels on royal road.

[Anonymous No.17319012]

Thoughts on a foreword? I have a journal full of thoughts, monologues and some depicted situations with dialogues. Let's say my mc gives it to someone before something, and from his perspective I'll write a foreword, something like Lolita. What do you think?

[Anonymous No.17319040]

>>17319012
My only foreword will be letting the reader know my book is based on real experiences and events but that the names of the people involved have been changed to maintain privacy.

[Anonymous No.17319139]

Sup Writing General

Any good resources for constructing plots?

I'm having some trouble with it.

[Anonymous No.17319187]

>>17319139
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrIogch5DBU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qgbsz7Gnrd8

[Anonymous No.17319238]

>>17316751
>purple prose
Thank you. I'm mainly struggling to express the idea precisely. I would be fine with reducing it.

[Anonymous No.17319244]

>>17319187
>sanderson
lol
how to create uninspired novels with characters that just move from outline point A to outline point B

[Anonymous No.17319253]

>>17319244
Fortunately you are better than him, you should be teaching this class.

[Anonymous No.17319261]

>>17319244
Why are you trying to learn how to run before you know how to walk?

[Anonymous No.17319268]

>>17319244
his advice is solid even if he's not good at writing himself. it's like when an heavy smoker warns you not to take up smoking. he makes the mistakes so we don't have to.

[Anonymous No.17319510]

>>17319253
sanderson writes for a career with an entire religious community to help circulate/advertise his first books and get him off the ground
i write for a hobby
as a reader, i can tell that his books are YA garbage
i think my writing is better than his, but if market success is your only metric, i guess i'll give it to you
even if his success in a dying market is something you want to try to copy though, you're better off learning from his work ethic and realizing that there's nothing else there worth emulating

>>17319261
i didn't ask for advice

>>17319268
i watched some of his videos in that series (before i tried to read any of his books) and i disagree. it's been a couple years so i'm not going to categorically tear down his advice but from memory it's very useless shit. even ignoring what he says about SF/F in particular with hard/soft "magic systems" and worldbuilding and etc., there's nothing there to provoke the gears of your brain into turning. the only decent piece of advice i retained was an anecdote he gave about another author who wrote a book where 1/3 of the way through it changed genres. the book failed, and he basically used that to say readers don't really like that. which, yeah, sure. otherwise, his outlining strategies aren't anything better than what you'd get in 5 minutes reading about the hero cycle or something. his advice on making deep characters is not good, as is evidenced by his inability to make deep characters.

[Anonymous No.17319524]

>>17319510
>i think my writing is better than his
lol
post it

[pip No.17319549]

>>17319268
tourche. obely titts

[Anonymous No.17319638]

>>17319524
no
i think that maybe half of the amateur writing i see in these threads is better than his, in terms of prose. (half is at least more interesting.) there's my barometer if you need one. if you're defending brandon sanderson on the internet i don't really want you to read anything i've written.

[Anonymous No.17319650]

>>17319638
you just admitted that i am better at writing than brandon sanderson so please post your stuff anon lol

[Anonymous No.17319743]

>>17319650
i said half, but i'll believe it. you're probably better with prose and dialogue than sanderson. sure! plenty of fanfic trash is, too. if you're in the other half, god help you. anyways, no. sanderson's advice is shit and just goes to show that work ethic and good marketing are king. even if i never wrote anything at all, that's still true.

[Anonymous No.17319852]

>>17319187
>>17319244
Brandon Sanderson should be opposed to his Mormon faith, which is essentially a cult in my opinion. It also gave him an unfair advantage as explained here.
>>17319510

The only good thing about him is the work ethic. That's quite good. Everything else is trash. Mistborn was a fun read though at least, albeit cliche as all hell.

And yeah, as that one anon said before, who the flying fuck cares about hard/soft magic systems. Normal readers don't obsess over the intricacies of a magic system; they just read the book and enjoy the story, characters, and cool stuff going on. If one of the mistborn characters broke the magic rules in a cool way without any explanation, then I genuinely wouldn't notice or care

[Anonymous No.17319911]

>>17307744
>A strong wind was blowing in from the southwest, carrying with it red dust and withered leaves. Amid rolling red hills and shrubby outcrops lay a humble tin-walled home with a well in the yard and a chair on the porch. The one window, right in front of the kitchen sink (it was the only sink- there was only one room), had collected a thin patina of ashy red soil. It hadn’t ever been cleaned. High up in the sky, well-beyond scattered clouds, beat the giant red sun. The sun made life possible in the desert. The sun made life hard. To the left of the makeshift deck where the old rocking chair swayed in the breeze two jeaned legs stemmed with blackened leather boots stuck out from under the house, straining as their torso reached for something impossible far underneath. Grumbling curses came from the man below, violating the quiet of the desert. The legs struggled and fussed, kicking up more and more dirt- giving the oppressive air a salted taste. In the center of the dirt pad under the house there was a steady drip of clear, life-affirming water. The water tank had obviously sprung a leak, probably from rust and neglect. What a waste it was for the painstakingly collected water to soak the bone dry soil, which spit up as it received each drop.
Here's the first (and only) lines from something I'm planning on writing. Worth pursuing or do I trash it?

[Anonymous No.17319949]

>>17319852
from what i recall in those videos, in his eyes, satisfaction is king. he has magic systems for sf/f because he feels that it's impossible to resolve a conflict in a satisfying way if magic is used without rules to govern the magic. his goal with outlining is to create satisfying conclusions. if you read any of his writing, he will constantly repeat himself to reiterate the things that are going to make up the resolution in the conclusion. it's so readers don't forget that there are individual pieces, and are satisfied rather than surprised when they come together.

this is not how you probably want to write. it's a very specific thing. i think it's shit and that if you try it you will be rejected by every agent, unless you and the agent are both mormons/scientologists/whatever. if people really want to write like sanderson specifically, follow his advice, but know that much of it is not as general as he makes it seem.

[Anonymous No.17319977]

>>17319949
>he feels that it's impossible to resolve a conflict in a satisfying way if magic is used without rules to govern the magic
I definitely disagree yeah. Very powerful entities (Arch Wizards, Gods etc.) don't play by any stated rules in a slew of fictions both book and otherwise and people aren't unsatisfied.

[Anonymous No.17319986]

Big boob
Drippy drippy milky
Sip sip

[Anonymous No.17320253]

>>17314701
>Don't presume.
Tranny

[Anonymous No.17320394]

I need a word with a similar meaning to 'trouble' and 'hassle' but also ends with '-le'. Any ideas?
Something along the general meaning of 'inconvenience', can't find anything appropriate in the thesaurus, if there truly isn't any word than what rhyming word would fit? Thanks and have a good one

[Anonymous No.17320411]

>>17320394
wrangle?
>It was quite a wrangle.

[Anonymous No.17320412]

>>17320394
squabble
i expect royalties

[Anonymous No.17320676]

>>17320394
quibble sounds most appropriate to me if you can make it work

[Anonymous No.17320703]

>>17318633
Here, let me give you and everybody else here that seems to be struggling some solid advice from Woody Allen:

>I think that the biggest life lesson I learned as a boy that has helped me and is still with me is that you really have to discipline yourself to do the work. If you want to accomplish something you can't spend a lot of time hemming and hawing, putting it off, making excuses for yourself, and figuring ways. You have to actually do it. I have to go home every single day, no matter where I am in a world, no matter what I'm doing, and putting 30 to 45 minutes of practice on my clarinet because I want to play. I have to do it. When I want to write, you get up in the morning, go in and close the door and write. You can't string paper clips, and get your pad ready, and turn your phone off, and get this, get coffee made. You have to do the stuff. Everything in life turns out to be a distraction from the real thing you want to do. There are a million distractions and when I was a kid I was very disciplined. I knew that the other kids weren't. I was the one able to do the thing, not because I had more talent, maybe less, but because they simply weren't applying themselves. As a kid I wanted to do magic tricks. I could sit endlessly in front of mirror, practicing, practicing, because I knew if you wanted to do the tricks you've got to do the thing. I did that with the clarinet, when I was teaching, I did that with writing. This is the most important thing in my life because I see people striking out all the time. It's not because they don't have talent, or because they don't want to be, but because they don't put the work in to do it. They don't have the discipline to do it. This was something I learned myself. I also had a very strict mother who was no nonsense about that stuff. She said "If you don't do it, then you aren't going to be able to do the thing." It's as simple as that. I said this to my daughter, if you don't practice the guitar, when you get older you wouldn't be able to play it. It's that simple. If you want to play the guitar, you put a half hour in everyday, but you have to do it. This has been the biggest guiding principle in my life when I was younger and it stuck. I made the statement years ago which is often quoted that 80 percent of life is showing up. People used to always say to me that they wanted to write a play, they wanted to write a movie, they wanted to write a novel, and the couple of people that did it were 80 percent of the way to having something happen. All the other people struck out without ever getting that pack. They couldn't do it, that's why they don't accomplish a thing, they don't do the thing, so once you do it, if you actually write your film script, or write your novel, you are more than half way towards something good happening. So that I was say my biggest life lesson that has worked. All others have failed me.

[Anonymous No.17321354]

>>17318758
Same.

[Anonymous No.17321415]

Translation and ESL question:

To what extent should you translate things? There's always the limit in lbrands or let's say eau de toilette mfw water of toilet but to what extent do you find it suitable to mix languages in a book?

This problem arises from me writing in my native tongue but having to deal with written things in english, like signs or instruction manuals. Wat do?

I personally feel like i could mash as much enligsh in there as i wanted since everyone i care about knows enligsh, but for some reason i've had some feedback that this is bad. What gives?

[Anonymous No.17321593]

>>17317194
Hell yeah, dude! My balls have been blue since I read the first two chapters you posted in the last thread.

[Anonymous No.17321698]

This is a passage from a short story I'm working on. If anyone has any suggestions, I'd appreciate it.

[Anonymous No.17321834]

>>17310217
>>17310469
.t boomers who've never seen a high waisted skirt before

[Anonymous No.17321848]

>>17321834
my main character wears a high waisted skirt but she has little tiddies

[Anonymous No.17321871]

Do your characters ever say or do something so shitty that it shocks even you? I wrote something down that he was thinking and I was like "Holy shit, that's fucking terrible," but it just flowed out naturally.

[Anonymous No.17321904]

>>17321871
>shocked by the things you created
ngmi

[Anonymous No.17322775]

>Time to go to sleep
>Start thinking about novel
>Wide awake until LITERALLY 3AM

Every time...

[Anonymous No.17322965]

I know everything about my book but the place. What country should I choose? My country? Maybe France? France looks cool. What will be best?

[Anonymous No.17323023]

>>17322965
what is the genre

[Anonymous No.17323025]

>>17309705
>no tips

[Anonymous No.17323026]

>>17322965
The one you can write about

[Anonymous No.17323222]

>>17322965
If in doubt pick the one you are most familiar with

[Anonymous No.17323864]

Anyone else struggle with deciding what to write?

I might start off with my fantasy novel, but then very quickly turn to my crime fiction, and then want to write something else completely.

I struggle to commit.

[Anonymous No.17324051]

>>17323864
Don't "commit", don't constrain yourself by genre from the outset: whatever is going to be written will be regardless of your intervention. If you have a definitive idea you'd like to express at first then by all means say as much as you can about it, but keep your ears attuned to the next note lurking immediately after you've exhausted this initial image.

[Anonymous No.17324137]

>>17321593
Awesome (not about the blue balls, but about the enthusiasm of said blue balls). My editor is working on the next 10,000 words so the first episode will be done soon-ish.

[Anonymous No.17324143]

>>17318070
Add in the hypocrisy that trannies think that inverted their penises will give them a vagina. Or taking a slab of meat from their body and making it into a frankenstein cock is somehow medically okay.

[Anonymous No.17325186]

>>17324051
This is good advice. The big thing is to just get something on paper. Your first draft is like a swirling maelstrom of competing storylines and themes. Your first job as a writer is just to commit them all to paper. Once you've done that, you start the editing process. You go back and read your own work as if it were someone else's and identify the things you like about your work, then you figure out how to emphasize them while diminishing the parts you don't like. The first draft is probably your most important draft, but the revision process is where your novel will actually start to take a recognizable form.

[Anonymous No.17325281]

Do you guys have a specific place you use only for writing? I've been reading Atomic Habits and I'm trying to follow his advice and do it by the book. Problem is, I'm just not sure what space I could use that I don't already use for something else. I really don't want to use my computer because I've got so many firmly ingrained habits related to it that in fifteen minutes after sitting down I'd probably have already jerked off and booted up a game. I've been thinking of buying a tablet just for writing, but that seems a little excessive. What's your set and setting for writing?

[Anonymous No.17325349]

>>17325281
Just sit down and write faggot

[Anonymous No.17325469]

>>17325349
I'm building a habit. "Just do it" isn't that great a foundation for a habit.

[Anonymous No.17325970]

I'm taking a break from my novel to participate in a local writing competition. I intend to write about how I helped tadpoles survive a dry summer and why I felt I was morally obligated to do so.
Wish me luck broskis.

[Anonymous No.17326051]

>>17325970
Haven't you already written this in the form of fiction? Or posted an idea based on it? Sounds very familiar

[Anonymous No.17326066]

>>17326051
I talked about writing it last summer, yes. You have good memory. I didn't end up writing it then though, since this is an annual contest and I thought I'd save it for this exact occasion.

[Anonymous No.17326111]

>>17314761
Send the hairs to me, anon

[Anonymous No.17326131]

>>17316892
If your sex scene has "toys" your novel is a lost cause. Fading to black is best, but if you insist on the grimy details at least keep it vague.

[Anonymous No.17326217]

>>17326131
American Psycho

[Anonymous No.17326785]

>>17326217
This.

[Anonymous No.17326910]

Can I get some crit/feedback plz?

https://pastebin.com/rE8Lz9Pr

[Anonymous No.17326988]

>>17326910
This is a Warcraft fanfic?

[Anonymous No.17327018]

>>17326910
Seems slightly intense for Fantasy

[Anonymous No.17327052]

>r8, h8, evalu8
took me a little over 2 hours
>650 words. i guess the influence is obvious

Anamaria first thought about getting a piano three years before their house fell into the sea. She would place it in the drawing room at the back of the house, facing the tip of the cliff where her husband fell into his death in the middle of the night. She thought the sound of the waves below that made the windows quiver ever so slightly would do good for the strings.

https://pastebin.com/6iMmMNUY

[Anonymous No.17327099]

>>17326988
Warhammer 30/40k
>>17327018
heh yeah it's tryhard but 30/40k tries to be

[Anonymous No.17327352]

Posted a new story. Tried to get it published for awhile but nothing doing. Reviews welcome.

https://awfiction.wordpress.com/2021/01/19/protest-pussy/

[Anonymous No.17327390]

>>17327352
Pathetic

[Anonymous No.17327425]

>>17314590

this is bait, right?

[Anonymous No.17327446]

>>17327352
>Tried to get it published for awhile but nothing doing
kek i wonder why

[Anonymous No.17327449]

HOW DO I PICK A PoV?? Is 3rd person omniscient really the only choice?

[Anonymous No.17327457]

>>17327449
I'm always drawn to first person but I feel like a lot of people dislike it for some reason

[Anonymous No.17327467]

>>17327457
I used to be like that. Then I took Book of the New Sun to the brain and now 1st person is the most appealing to me.

[Anonymous No.17327470]

>>17314590
I looked her up and she wrote one self-published book
rate this random fragment

Tessa's bedroom looks like something from a home decorating magazine. Everything is white and organized: no clothes lying around, no evidence that anything about her life is out of the ordinary.

She's standing at a window, with her back to me. Sweatpants, T-shirt, messy golden hair. She just stands there, silent and still.

Never mind.

I don't know what to say.

I don't know what to do.

This was a stupid idea.

"Hi, Tessa," I start off, sounding just as unsure as I feel. "It's... good to meet you. I'm Weston."

She doesn't speak. She doesn't move.

"Your grandmother was just telling me about the accident and what happened to you." I pause, not because I should, but because I sense that feeling in the air again--even denser in this room. Despair. "It sucks."

Tessa exhales a sharp, sarcastic laugh. That one little sound tells me a lot about her. And then, after a few seconds, she speaks.

"Listen," she begins, still facing the window. "I don't care what my grandmother told you. I don't want help. I don't need help. And I certainly don't need you."

"I know. I know you don't need me. But you need to write."

She shakes her head, rigid and sure of herself.

"Tessa... I know this must be hard for you--"

"You don't know anything!" she explodes, spinning around to face me. "You don't know anything about me!"

For a moment, I'm speechless.

It's the first time in three years anyone has ever met me without that look of pity on their face. The first time anyone has ever looked at me and not seen me. The first time anyone has stood before me--with perfectly normal legs--and complained about their own problem.

The feeling is exhilarating.

"Are you blind, Weston?" Tessa screams. Her eyes are filled with tears, and the tears are spilling down her face.

"I said are you blind?!"

"No," I reply, my voice not much louder than a whisper.

"So you have no idea what this is like, do you?"

She's looking at me. And she can't see me. She can't see This.

"DO YOU?"

[Anonymous No.17327580]

>>17319911
I like it anon. The prose is pretty nice, it's a little elegant without sounding like you're trying too hard or going overboard with bIg WoRds AnD pUrPlE. It seems like every word there haa a purpose and wasn't just picked to sound good. The setting is cool too. I get the feeling it's on a desert planet considering the red sun and i immediately got an idea of what kind of person the man is from his introduction (he seems like an only man who doesn't really care about much and can only be bothered to do something when it's life-threatening)

I don't wanna jump the gun here, but if i read this as the first page off a shelf i might consider buying it (i have bought a book based mostly off the first sentence before so that's not just me trying to jerk off your ego)
Keep it up, i like it

[Anonymous No.17327601]

>>17327580
>I don't wanna jump the gun here, but if i read this as the first page off a shelf i might consider buying it (i have bought a book based mostly off the first sentence before so that's not just me trying to jerk off your ego)
This is what we call normal consumer behavior

[Anonymous No.17327639]

Is it true that Americans can't just send their work to the publishers? I've heard they need to find an agent who will do everything for them.
Why? In my country I just send things per mail and everything's cool.

[Anonymous No.17327880]

How to put into words the humility you feel when realizing the majesty of spehhs?

[Anonymous No.17327923]

>anon, your book reads like an old man's writing from 1800

[Anonymous No.17328305]

Somebody left a lot of nice comments on my story. Feels good.

[Anonymous No.17328329]

>>17327639
They don't answer the mail because of Ted

[Anonymous No.17328638]

Any anons writing in Polish?
I'd like to exchange emails to share and review our works if someone is interested.

[Anonymous No.17328748]

post more boobs, kill the thread faster.

[Anonymous No.17328988]

>>17328305
There are few better feelings.

[Anonymous No.17329099]

>>17327923
Thank you. That's the greatest compliment someone's ever given me.

[Anonymous No.17329124]

How do I know if the story I'm writing is actually worth writing or if I'm just getting lost in the weeds?

[Anonymous No.17329165]

>>17329124

are you having fun while writing it? Your image indicates you aren't but... some people are dramatic. So, are you? Having fun with it?

[Anonymous No.17329179]

>>17329099
yes, unironically this

[Anonymous No.17329214]

>>17329165
I feel it's the best thing I've ever written(tho I feel I'm getting a little lost now, but that's fixable in post), but I guess I don't trust my own judgement.

[Anonymous No.17329442]

>>17329214
you shouldn't

[Anonymous No.17329484]

I think I'm too inside my own head when it comes to writing. I can't turn off that distorted creator's perception of the work and see it for what it really is.

[Anonymous No.17329519]

>>17329484
put it in a drawer and come back to it in a few months. Obviously, finish it first, but once you do, put it away, out of sight and out of mind.

[Anonymous No.17329573]

which dictionary or glossary or encyclopedia of literary terms should I buy?

[Anonymous No.17329658]

>>17329124
>>17329165
>>17329214
>>17329442
I think the problem is I fucked up a couple days back, and I'm trying to tell two stories at once in what should only be a short story.

I have this recurring problem of wanting things to improve and not wanting bad things to happen to my characters. How do I fix this? Is there anything I should read to learn how to crush my characters better? I've heard Russian lit is pretty harsh like that.

[Anonymous No.17329664]

People who wax poetically about the struggles of being a writer are fucking cringe retards. You're not doing anything special, and you most likely aren't good at it yet if you still feel the need to whine about this Dumb Shit. You'll get over it after you've written enough words in your life.

[Anonymous No.17329710]

>>17329664
People who complain about building furniture are fucking cringe. They aren't doing anything special and most likely aren't good at it yet if they still feel the need to whine about it. They'll get over it after they've built enough.

Nigga, stop acting so fucking superior. You're no better than the rest of us.

[Anonymous No.17329792]

People who wax poetically about the struggles of being a fisherman are fucking cringe retards. They're not doing anything special, and they most likely aren't good at it yet if they still feel the need to whine about this Dumb Shit. They'll get over it after they've caught enough fish in their life.

[Anonymous No.17329806]

People who wax poetically about the struggles of composing are fucking cringe retards. They're not doing anything special, and they most likely aren't good at it yet if they still feel the need to whine about this Dumb Shit. They'll get over it after they've composed enough pieces in their life.

[Anonymous No.17329840]

>>17329710
>>17329792
>>17329806
I've made you bothered.

[Anonymous No.17329885]

>>17329840
I only made one of those posts, but I have the feeling this is a new copypasta lol

[Anonymous No.17329939]

>>17329658
write a lot of different bad things happening to every character you like. Worse things than you plan on having in your stories. Then you'll get used to it and thus overcome your reluctance to it.

[Anonymous No.17330504]

>>17327449
Third person limited is much more commonly used.

[Anonymous No.17330532]

>>17327449
1st PoV for MCs and 3PoV limited for side characters/literal whos. But whatever you do, don't do more than one PoV in one chapter.

[Anonymous No.17330604]

>>17329664
True and based. If anyone calls themselves an "ink-stained wretch" they should rightfully get dropped and I swear I've heard that from like 5 different authors.

[Anonymous No.17330655]

How do I merge absurdist third person perspective omniscient writing with realistic first person in-universe writing? Is it possible? I have tried doing this in my novel and it is very hard, the tonal shift is very abrasive.

[Anonymous No.17330858]

>>17330504
yea sorry I meant a 3rd person narrator that knows everything about the MC, thats 3rd person limited right?

[Anonymous No.17330887]

>>17330858
Yes.

[Anonymous No.17330920]

>>17310635
Every time I see an ad for your god awful amazon stories I want to kill myself.

[Anonymous No.17331093]

>>17327639
This is true. You'll be laughed out of the place if you go to the publisher directly. So we have big lists of agents you can query, and they're all ridiculous and cunty. You basically have to suck their clam to get in. Look at places like manuscriptwishlist.

example:
>cunt likes horses and scotland
>omg lmao send me books involving horses and/or scotland!
basically you're at the mercy of their personal subjective obsessions and need to either write an entire book merely to cater to them, or hope and pray what you wrote happens to match the ridiculously niche interests of some blue haired agent. This is one of the many reasons the american publishing market is in the shitter, this and the endless sjw pandering. the ONLY books you are allowed to write about are either brown people whinging about being brown, wammenz whinging about being wammenz, the protag is katniss everdeen or harley quinn, or you hit some agent's personal interest in cottage cozies set in 1500s western bavaria with a character who is a fisherman but also a catholic feminist.

Welcome to hell.

[Anonymous No.17331125]

>>17319510
this. doesn't matter how good you are, it matters what marketing budget you get. the world is utter shit, and this is why everything on the shelves is absolute garbage. most people on /lit/ suck even worse but there are a few legitimately good writers here who can't get off the ground because the publishing industry is so far up its own rectum.
>>17316875
please don't write about romance until you've had sex.

[Anonymous No.17331233]

>>17331093
just tell them you're bi or something in your message and you'll be in

[Anonymous No.17331258]

My first draft is done (120K words) but I've got no idea how to go about rewriting. Does anyone know any good guides for editing a novel and doing a 2nd draft?

[Anonymous No.17331283]

>>17331258
If you haven't already been following any kind of plot guide, go ahead and get one now and make sure your story has a definitive through-line imo

[Anonymous No.17331317]

>finally reached 10k on my first book.
I know it's not much, but It's felt like a huge undertaking just getting all of my ideas segmented and on paper (or in word).

[Anonymous No.17331421]

>>17331233
you're joking but it doesn't work. this is a serious issue i wish you guys would pay more attention to. you can't get published if the publishing industry is in such an absolute STATE.

[Anonymous No.17331447]

>>17331421
i'm gay married if i sneak that into my email will it work

[Anonymous No.17331496]

>>17331447
I'm an actual biological woman and even I don't get a pass. Just being a checkbox isn't enough anymore, you need to be a nepotistically connected mosaic of checkboxes with a social media account of 100,000+ followers.

What a joke. Pubishing is dead, America is a sick and disgusting place where culture and beauty go to die.

[Anonymous No.17331514]

>>17319986
Based

[Anonymous No.17331559]

>>17327601
I guess I should just bury my disposable income in my backyard instead of trying to find things that I like
Cope poorfag

[Anonymous No.17331575]

>>17327601
Nigger, how else are you supposed to decide if you buy a book or not? Other than word of mouth.

[Anonymous No.17331633]

>>17331496
>biological woman
Just a correction, transwomen are biologically women too. The correct term you wanted was "cis woman" if you were trying to differentiate yourself there.

You're right that America is kind of shit in terms of the publishing scene, among other things.

>>17331258
Do a reread first thing and see if your plot makes sense. Mark any major issues you see. Feel free to mark minor issues too but don't fret them too much. That all done, fix them and read it again. Eventually you will have to fix only single chapters or minor spelling issues, and at that point you're near finished.

[Anonymous No.17331649]

>>17331496
tbf i think there are rarer conditions than being a woman

[Anonymous No.17331680]

>>17331633
>even on 4chan i can't get away from sjw nuspeak
I'm going to learn Polish and converse entirely on polechan.

[Anonymous No.17331691]

>>17331680
Except for /pol/ and /b/, you can expect that kind of lingo anywhere you go on the internet. Also, a very high possibility this person is shit-posting bait.

[Anonymous No.17331708]

>>17331691
I'm not. I'm being sincere. Quite frankly I can't see how anyone other than a snowflake would be upset by anything I posted.

It's ultimately just a correction. No need to get all upset or anything.

[Anonymous No.17331763]

>>17331633
>Just a correction, transwomen are biologically women too.
I don't care if this blatant bait. kill yourself nigger

[Anonymous No.17331824]

>>17331763
Despite how you may tantrum, it's a consensus among most first-world medical professionals and academics that transwomen and transmen are factually women and men respectively.
Brain gender differentiation happens in the womb and can mismatch with how the body develops. There's studies on it. Transitioning is a proven therapy for gender dysphoria, and trans-people post transition have quality of life about equal with cis people. There's also studies for this too.

>>17329664
I think in general, time spent whinging is better spent writing. At the same time, everyone is human and flawed in some way.

[Anonymous No.17331836]

Don't even give them a (you), at least they know how to write fiction.

[Anonymous No.17331892]

>>17331836
Seems like you don't have an argument of your own anon, and this is your way of coping.
I don't need (You)s. I don't even want to discuss this, but I'm gonna point out misguided trans bigotry if I see it, anon, since it's the right thing to do.

>>17315368
I agree with
>>17315392
Only in that trying to worldbuild too much is a recipe for disaster. It's more important to have a good story than anything else, and the world should be shown through that alone.
>>17315430
I think it's valuable to have some worldbuilding notes, such as names of areas and details about them.

[Anonymous No.17331963]

>>17315392
>worldbuilding is a psyop by big fantasy to cripple new writers who aren't a part of their elite in group
Mostly
I have been preparing to write books in my own setting and I've only done some world building because I'm the kind of writer that needs to plan things before I write the first draft. I was coming up with ideas for characters as will as the "lore" so I wasn't wasting time with things like detailed maps or family trees. Nobody cares about that until you have a good story.
Personally, I'm crippled on what bookone should be. I have some ideas but can't narrow it down to one project to start outlining.

[Anonymous No.17331966]

@17331824
>trans-people post transition have quality of life about equal with cis people
No matter which side of this debate you're on this is just offensively wrong lol

[Anonymous No.17331987]

How to write comedy, fellas?

[Anonymous No.17331996]

>>17331987
Just write about society

[Anonymous No.17332018]

>>17331996
>you drink water, I drink anarchy
ya know... I feel if that was delivered right(and very specifically in the right context) that could be an amazing line. Would need to be very self aware tho

[Anonymous No.17332038]

>>17331824
There is a big difference between real gender dysphoria and autogynephilia, a difference that has been forgotten in the modern political climate. Most modern transgenders are the latter.
And I'm really not sure where you read that pos-ops are equal in happiness and fulfillment to CIS. Their suicide attempt rate is only down like 3% (37->34 or something) and you could easily attribute that to being in a better socioeconomic state where you can transition.

[Anonymous No.17332056]

>>17331996
>Batman looks around for his parents, but they are still dead.

Kek

[Anonymous No.17332080]

>>17310690
Just talk about fat pink masts

[Anonymous No.17332124]

>>17331824
I'm abandoning the English language.

[Anonymous No.17332274]

I implore you, /lit/, to listen to my story in its entirety before shrugging this off as another Card post.

The man parading himself as the titular, J. D. Card, is a fraud, a miscreant, and any other roguish epithet that could befit a man of such ill-repute. He is not the original thought-mind behind. What he has peddled to you all, like a snake oil salesman, is a fraudulent product. A Chinese counterfeit. He has advertised a sham on our dear board. MY rough drafts.

I am the real creator of the Tsalxhaan series: John David Card.

You see, J D. Card was an associate of mine. We graduated together as Wharton School of Finance alumni in 2017 and have kept in sporadic touch throughout the years since. Recently, we had been shooting creative ideas back and forth and he relented that he had hit a sort of stint in his life. Finance school had not gained him the necessary connections nor ability to pursue a career in screenwriting, and he feared that he would never have a chance to put his name out into the world.

I told him: "Worry do not. You and I, Cards, are bred from patterned stock. Our skin, our blood, a tapestry woven. If I, David the Card create, then so too can the John. Come my brother and we will envision paradise, or envision hell, together."

And so I showed him my work. My magnum opus. The Tsalxhaan series.

Something changed in John that day. A darkness glazed his eyes and I knew in the back of my mind, even then, that I had lost my friend forever.

The next day, I logged on to rework my rough draft and found that all my files were gone and I found the Tsalxhaan series being advertised all around the world. My life's work, raw and unfinished as it was, marketed under another man's name. I had never experienced infidelity until now.

I take pride in my work. Love, affection, honor, all these qualities I pour into my writing. That is why my series has taken so long to come out. That is why I have a stolen rough draft wading through the market as I pour the finishing touches into PEOPLE MOVER. And I am heartbroken.

I hope that you believe my tale, but worry not, faith alone is not what I require. I shall leave you with evidence: a comparison of John and David's work, so you will see the difference between the two and decide for yourself.

Please, do not ask me to post my entire work. I can't risk my life's work to be stolen yet again. I think in just one comparison, you will see a marked difference.

This is not bait, this is not shitposting, nor shilling. As ludicrous as this tale is, it is true. Thank you for listening to my words /lit/.

[Anonymous No.17332305]

>>17332274
tld;r

[Anonymous No.17332602]

Hey jannie. I'd like to know. What was against the rules.
1. Telling that delusional idiot to go kill itself.
2. Telling that future suicide case that its a nigger.
3. Posting this image and making that crybaby bitch cry its eyes out.
I'd like to know. Thanks. It better not be the picture, that's all I'm saying. Blue boards are some shit, let me tell you.

[Anonymous No.17332615]

>royalroad

other than /lit/ is this a good site to post?

[Anonymous No.17332617]

>>17332602
I'm thinking it's number 2. for "racism outside of /b/"

[Anonymous No.17332635]

>>17332617
fair enough. I guess I'll tone it down.

[Anonymous No.17332709]

>>17332602
perhaps stop talking about trannies in a thread about writing

[Anonymous No.17332755]

>>17332602
>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.17333055]

>>17331708
Almost everyone on 4chan is a snowflake.

[Anonymous No.17333073]

>>17307744
Anyone else struggle with character names? Every name I give my MC feels like it's not his identity at all.

[Anonymous No.17333112]

MASSIVE SMUT WARNING

Sorry for the lewdposting anons, I'm trying to make an erotic story LOOSELY based on Degrees of Lewdity and I need an opinion
The character is a freshman schoolgirl, she's a teacher's pet, wears oversized glasses, freckles, braided hair, all that. She's also got a pretty slammin' body, she's thick in the right places and she's got a pretty modest pair of breasts on her. Obviously, the story is gonna end up pretty smutty, so I need to know what sounds hotter for character development:
>An apathetic school nerd who oftentimes wears skimpy, revealing, or otherwise promiscuous clothes unintentionally, which is motivated by said apathy about her wardrobe i.e. thin button-up school shirt with no bra and top couple buttons unbuttoned, pantyhose, tight thigh-highs, short skirts with nothing covering legs etc., eventually embracing her slutty side after receiving attention for her skimpy outfits and learning to use those skimpy clothes to her personal benefit at school
OR
>totally undercover secret slut who uses "lazy clothing" aka aforementioned school shirt, no bra, short skirts, etc. etc., as sort of plausible deniability for the fact that she wants to show off her assets in an inconspicuous way and is at heart a totally depraved whore, and that her plan from the beginning was to inconspicuously but intentionally reel in the attracted boys and girls for her own sexual pleasure

Note: She is a trap

Sorry for injecting my coomer fantasies into an otherwise serious thread, but it's hornyposting hours over here and I need to know what sounds the least retarded and gay.

[Anonymous No.17333281]

I need to come up with a name for a character that is ridiculously needy and love starved, to the point of it being pathological. Can I get any suggestions for one that fits, either as a reference to another literary work or because if its meaning? I thought of calling her "Soledad", but that's too on the nose.
I also need a name for an androgynous looking character whose gender is kept confusing for the reader and the rest of the cast on purpose.

[Anonymous No.17333287]

Where do I find some academic info on the basics of structuring a story?

[Anonymous No.17333360]

>>17333287
Depends on what you mean by academic

[Anonymous No.17333507]

>>17333360
How many are there?

[Anonymous No.17333541]

>>17333507
How many what are there?

[Anonymous No.17333777]

>>17333112
go to /trash/ bitch

[Anonymous No.17333894]

>>17327052
>no takers
damn that's a bad sign
let me try again

[Anonymous No.17334030]

>>17333894
Really has a strange sense of foreboding and hopelessness. At least, that's what I got from it.
It's good.

[Anonymous No.17334040]

I know the first draft is meant to just get the words out, but I can't shake a feeling and want to nip it in the bud early.
Am I over-explaining?

[Anonymous No.17334046]

>>17334040
Nevermind. Just figured out the problem the second I posted this. It's telling, not showing.

[Anonymous No.17334058]

>>17334030
thanks a lot for reading anon

[Anonymous No.17334288]

>>17327470
>?!
is this even allowed

[Anonymous No.17334680]

>>17317585
The opposite is true. Nothing beats having readers that can't get enough of your work

[Anonymous No.17334681]

How autistic should I be when it comes to fantasy languages? Or should I just ignore it in favor of convenience?

[Anonymous No.17334727]

>>17317585
I decided to write a book exactly two weeks ago and writing it feels good, very good.

[Anonymous No.17334732]

>>17334681
Are you a linguist? If you're not, you cannot create new languages like Tolkien did.

[Anonymous No.17334754]

>>17334681
The thing about alternate languages in a fantasy is that you never have a good reason to actually put that language on the page. If your protagonist speaks the language, then you should be writing it in the same language as the rest of the book. Your pov character understands the language, therefore the audience should too. Likewise, if your character doesn't understand the language, it would be weird for the character to hear someone speak it and perfectly understand how what those words are and how they're meant to be pronounced. It's always better to say something like "then they spoke a language I didn't understand." And if you're using a real language as a stand-in, readers who do speak your language will be able to understand things that your pov character doesn't, which spoils the surprises you're setting up with the use of an alternate language.
I would come up with a few prefixes and suffixes to denote things like towns, cities, villages, titles, jobs, etc. So that you can give proper nouns a consistent set of naming conventions. If you're not a linguist you shouldn't bother inventing an entire language. It's unnecessary even if you do know what you're doing.

[Anonymous No.17334761]

>>17316250
In addition to the other cummentary, you should study prose rhythm. Nearly all of your sentences have the exact same structure and length, which makes for a broken, annoying, staccato read that doesn't mesh with the scholarly platitudes about pain.
Also, Charle's, c'mon.

[Anonymous No.17334874]

>>17334681
Pretty autistic

[Anonymous No.17334970]

>>17334040
>>17334046
Telling isn’t bad, you know.

[Anonymous No.17335065]

>>17333112
>Note: She is a trap
So, he’s a guy?

[Anonymous No.17335090]

Are you all SF/fantasy writers or literary fiction writers?

[Anonymous No.17335118]

>>17335090
A little bit of both.

[Anonymous No.17335120]

>>17335090
I'm writing about my experiences in the army and trying to present it as a black comedy, is that literary fiction? I guess it could be categorized as a picaresque considering all the hi-jinks I get into in it.

[Anonymous No.17335121]

>>17334970
It is though.

Give three good reasons it isn't.

[Anonymous No.17335187]

>>17335120
Finnish army bro?

[Anonymous No.17335206]

New thread

>>17335156

[Anonymous No.17335207]

>>17335187
That's a me!

[Anonymous No.17335216]

>>17335207
Nice, I’m actually looking forward for your novel, if it’s ever translated to English.

[Anonymous No.17335225]

>>17335216
Well that I can't promise you, but if I ever get published I'll be sure to let you all know so I can gloat.
Currently at 27k words, took a break to write about them frogs.>>17325970

[Anonymous No.17335236]

>>17335225
Good luck with that competition, anon.

[Anonymous No.17335258]

>>17335236
Thank you very much.

[Anonymous No.17335301]

>>17331633
>transwomen are biologically women too
what a crazy world

>>17331649
nta but also a biological woman and a lesbian and also can't use that to get published apparently. so you're both right

[Anonymous No.17335696]

>>17331966
It seems like you might live in a country where, sadly, trans-bigotry is still rampant. Transpeople have a similar amount of internal struggles as cis people post-transition. Though quality of life can be lower, this is usually due to harassment and discrimination.
>>17335301
Gender identity in the brain is distinct from body during formation in the womb. Since gender is determined based on someone's identity, that person is biologically a woman even if their body doesn't match right away. Here's an article in case you are genuinely ignorant and not a bigot.
https://eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2020-02/mcog-gvp020420.php

The term you are looking for is cis. Some people disagree with all this, but they don't really have any arguments and studies of their own to counteract the consensus of medical experts with years of study and experience.

>>17334681
Put as much effort into it as you want, anon. If you want to prioritize getting the book finished, then I'd do what the one anon said and mention the people speaking in a language characters don't understand. That's easier and quicker to write.

[Anonymous No.17335746]

>>17332615
mostly only if u write shitty litrpg

[Anonymous No.17335761]

>>17333112
go away :((((

[Anonymous No.17336310]

>>17333281
Try Sam, Dani, Jo, or Micah.

[Anonymous No.17336319]

>>17334970
It isn't always bad. But it was bad there.