/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.17087044]

are there any video games with writing and storytelling that could genuinely hold a candle to literature?

[Anonymous No.17087050]

>>17087044
Here we go again.

[Anonymous No.17087065]

>>17087044
Knights of the old republic 2 is almost there, if it was finished properly I think it would be up there with planescape.
Mask of the betrayer is very good as well. Disco elysium is the best written game that I have played in a while.

[Anonymous No.17087067]

>>17087044
There's the entire game genre of text adventures (or interactive fiction if you're gay) that fuses the two ideas.

Not exactly literature but if anyone's interested in them, try playing 9:05. It's short, witty and a good litmus test if you'll enjoy them.

http://adamcadre.ac/if/905.html

[Anonymous No.17087087]

>>17087044
No, because video games were born as a product and literature was born as art. That being said, there probably are many that hold a candle to modern """literature""" (i.e. commodified McLiterature® McArt®).

[Anonymous No.17087145]

>>17087044
No, because video game writing has a different purpose from literature. Both artistic, but they work with different materials; video game writing has audiovisuals and a player to accommodate for, which literature doesn't have.

[Anonymous No.17087163]

>>17087044
Also to actual answer the question, no video games often have terrible writing. This is because the resources required to produce a game are large enough that some expectation of making the money back is inherent. This influences the story from the offset, and it's why every mainstream game in the last 10 years has had essentially the same cinematic tropes that are proven to rope in midwits. This is also why indie game often excel in story etc.

[Anonymous No.17087178]

metal gear solid 2 as post-modern fiction
prove me wrong

[Anonymous No.17087186]

>>17087178
How about prove yourself right. The games suck ass.

[Anonymous No.17087194]

>>17087186
lots of bad books out there too, yet they're literature still

[Anonymous No.17087206]

>>17087178
>>17087186
i agree that the game sucks ass but some of the shit discussed in the game are definitely pomo.

wait does this prove that video games are not a good medium for real storytelling?

[Anonymous No.17087214]

>>17087044
Witcher 3 is up there.

[Anonymous No.17087217]

>>17087206
>wait does this prove that video games are not a good medium for real storytelling?
No, but that's the case either way. Video games are about story-making, not story-telling.

[Anonymous No.17087220]

>>17087206
I don't think it does, I'm just short on examples of traditional storytelling

[Anonymous No.17087235]

>>17087206
They've never really been a good medium. Everyone expected them to be like movies in which the player was involved, but fell massively short.

In terms of "shit people would rather play", Tetris is infinitely more enjoyable than any story driven game.

>>17087214
Does it count if the Witcher was originally a book?

[Anonymous No.17087254]

>>17087044
To real literature? Not really. None I know of anyway.
Movies attract far greater writers and only a very few have writing that can compare to true literature.
But thats fine, because those mediums are not primarily about the writing.
Films are a melding of sight and sound into an emotional experience. Something like a David Lynch movie couldn't work as a book. That's why it's a movie, a moving painting with music and sound.
Similarly a video game is about the interaction, the exploration. The story of Dark Souls could be turned into a boring fantasy novel, but it would totally lose what makes Dark Souls great: the feeling of choice, freedom, adventure, and challenge.

TLDR Different mediums are different stop being autistic

[Anonymous No.17087255]

>>17087235
a) the witcher series is a departure from the books in terms of content
b) just because, say, lord of the rings is an adaptation doesn't invalidate it being a fine example of film

[Anonymous No.17087264]

>>17087255
>b) just because, say, lord of the rings is an adaptation doesn't invalidate it being a fine example of film
It's not a fine adaption, you just saw it when you were 10.

[Anonymous No.17087285]

>>17087264
more like I saw it for the first time when I was 19 within the year of me reading the book
it did what it set out to do and I still enjoy talking about it with my friends

[Anonymous No.17087288]

>>17087264
Well it’s the best adaptation we’re gonna get you ungrateful monkey

[Anonymous No.17087292]

>>17087264
lotr is just an example, really, fight club is an adaptation and it's great and I could probably fight you in real life for that one

[Anonymous No.17087302]

>>17087292
>I could probably fight you in real life for that one
You sound so confident and intimidating, I'll probably have to pass.

[Anonymous No.17087318]

>>17087044
Bloodborne, Legacy of Kain series. Defiance in particular. Last of Us 1 and 2.

[Anonymous No.17087360]

>>17087318

[Anonymous No.17087566]

"A man has a choice, I chose the impossible. I built a city where the artists would not fear the censor, where the great would not be constrained by the small, where the scientist would not be bound by petty morality. I chose to build Rapture. But my city was betrayed by the weak. So I ask you my friend, if you live with pride, would you kill the innocent? Would you sacrifice your humanity? We all make choices, but in the end, our choices make us." ―Andrew Ryan

[Anonymous No.17087571]

>>17087318
Last of Us is good film tier writing, nowhere near literature. They're fun action movies. Like darker Spielberg.

[Anonymous No.17087582]

>>17087065
Does anyone else feel like KOTOR 2 was quietly extremely influential on the Millennial generation?

Or, maybe tons of people didn't play it, but it feels like everyone who did went on to have some kind of impact or influence on modern culture.

[Anonymous No.17087591]

call of duty modern warfare is better than anything homer wrote

[Anonymous No.17087679]

Played Deus Ex recently as it was pitched to me for having a deep story (spoilers below). Admittedly it does a great job of this at the start, but only declines as the game goes on and UNATCO turns out to be unambiguously evil. People always cite the NSF leader in the statue of liberty for his interesting statistics as evidence of the game addressing something novel, but it's the only time it does that and you eventually side with the NSF anyways so the terrorists become the unambiguous good. All the redeeming members of UNATCO violate company policy and eventually ditch it, while the evil ones stay behind to act as stereotypes of power-obsessed authority. For the game to really have a great plot, it should have taken out the aliens and Illuminati, and adjusted the scales to make UNATCO's authoritarianism morally defensible. This is actually how it appears at the start until you meet Paul on the plane, after which it becomes less interesting. If they had even stopped at "the government engineered this virus as a roundabout way to limit human freedom" it would have been fine.

It's a great game but it's not saying anything interesting. In most respects Metal Gear Solid 2 tries a similar thing and does it better. What you really learn from the praise given to this game's plot is that the mainstream video game industry is so stale and conformist that to even address conspiracy theories in earnest is something special. That's pretty rough

[Anonymous No.17087738]

You're just gonna have to trust me on this one....

[Anonymous No.17087754]

>>17087044
Yeah, not sure why you're asking since you provided an example.

[Anonymous No.17087778]

>>17087679
Your assessment of Deus Ex seems fair, but I'm surprised you have nothing to say about its endings. The endings are some of the best writing I've seen in a video game IMO.
Also some of the random NPCs aside from the Statue of Liberty guy are really good in my opinion. Like Morpheus and Chad Dumier.

[Anonymous No.17087787]

NIER

[Anonymous No.17087809]

>>17087065
>>17087582
Came here to say this. It definitely had a profound impact on a certain type of kid (that you and i both were). It's sort of the best you can get of the fantasy genre, and for some reason it,has to be done as a video game (because that's how fantasjes can be lived out)

[Anonymous No.17087952]

>>17087778
The ending choices are great, I went for Tong's myself. I suppose it really is a highlight of the writing, because each is fully justifiable and it's tied to the gameplay in an interesting way. It would have been amazing if they put a tech-skeptical bent to the rest of the writing, since Tong's ending throws it straight into your face that tech progression is the cause of all these problems, which is a very solid idea and something I accept to a degree in real life. Nothing is wrong with the writing in all honesty, games aren't great for expressing complex ideas to begin with, so if a game accomplishes anything in this regard it speaks very highly of it. The real standout success of games as a storytelling medium has been that blend of gameplay and cutscenes from the late 90's where you finish a section of gameplay and are rewarded with a cutscene that advances the story, giving you something to fuel your interest as you keep playing (ex. Silent Hill or MGS). Even if one part of the formula is subpar, like SH's gameplay, it works really well. Modern cinematic games fuck up in this regard by mixing story in with gameplay, or the story is just dull. What people who play games as a hobby tend to miss is that cinematic games don't suck because they're cinematic, but because they take as models Hollywood blockbusters rather than Jacob's Ladder or Escape From New York. There are many avenues of advancing the medium open, but the market is not conducive to it, and it's worse than even the film industry who still has its set of independent studios to rely on. Although, now and then something good is bound to get made anyway. I've been thinking of trying Disco Elysium for that reason.

[Anonymous No.17087981]

>>17087050
DRUK

[Anonymous No.17088053]

>>17087582
>>17087809
Who are some people who were so influenced by kotor 2? I'm curious to hear your thoughts.

[Anonymous No.17088072]

Heavy rain is like a graphic novel if that counts

[Anonymous No.17088085]

Pathologic and Pathologic 2 are up there, though they're helped by the fact that they where originally supposed to be a stage play. The first game is probably one of the greatest artistic achievements of the 2000s.

[Anonymous No.17088116]

>>17087952
>What people who play games as a hobby tend to miss is that cinematic games don't suck because they're cinematic, but because they take as models Hollywood blockbusters rather than Jacob's Ladder or Escape From New York.
Well put. Though parallel to movies, I find most of the good video games today are indie. I'm looking forward to playing Disco Elysium as well.

[Anonymous No.17088136]

Silent Hill 2 has actual characters that develop and explores themes and uses symbolism.

Lots of games have stories but there's no literature that does the whole "silent protagonist" thing like Link or Gordon Freeman where they have literally no character. Not many games have symbolism, and when they try they fail spectacularly like Bioshock Infinite. And most games with developed characters are done really ham fisted like Quiet in Metal Gear Solid.

[Anonymous No.17088147]

>>17087044
The medium you're using determines the storytelling tools available. While this might sound like a conveniently evasive stock answer, it's mostly futile to compare apples to oranges by crossing mediums the way most people do it. A game can have the kind of simplistic writing that couldn't carry a novel and still tell an excellent story by using immersive and expressive mechanics. I do like some game writing, but I'd much rather see something that uses the means of interactivity to tell the story.

[Anonymous No.17088159]

>>17087952
>>17088116
disco elysium is great and got mentioned for good reasons. in terms of pacing, it is somewhat like an adult planescape torment.
i like the persona series but i might also be an irredeemable japfag.

[Anonymous No.17088180]

>>17087679
There was a lot the developers had to cut from the game due to time, they originally had planned for you to be able to stay on the side of UNATCO if you wanted. Generally when people talk about the game being written well they're talking about stuff that's actually tangential to the main plot. There are several other NPCs like the NSF leader who will talk to JC about real-world issues, and there's also some fairly prescient stuff hidden in emails. The problem is that it's all easy to miss if you don't know where to look, and that it's mostly in the first half of the game.

[Anonymous No.17088219]

>>17088136

Silent Hill 2 is basically Crime and Punishment with spooky ghosts. The problem is even when the story in a video game is good, the game becomes a distraction to the story, and I'm left feeling like I'm stuck doing a chore to get to the next story beat. Almost every time I find a game with an interesting story I end up feeling like I wish I could just read the book. Games are a tedious method of telling a story.

[Anonymous No.17088223]

>>17088136
The story is great but beating the same stupid monsters all the time is quite boring desu

[Anonymous No.17088255]

>>17088180
That is pretty cool. You can definitely tell they were passionate about it. I read quite a few of the emails but many were pointless which probably dissuades some people from checking them more.
>>17088219
SH2's story and execution is amazing while the gameplay is a poor Resident Evil ripoff, but still it kind of works. I never felt annoyed or limited by the gameplay even if it became a little repetitive, which is great in retrospect. Games are still a good medium for this kind of thing since the game part helps you feel more involved in what's going on.

[Anonymous No.17088392]

>>17087044
Dude, the cover literally says "Dungeons & Dragon's" on it. It is impossible for that game to have good writing, and if we may say it has good writing regardless it only shows how dreadful games are as a medium.
You should be playing for gameplay and atmosphere anyway, you fag. Silent Hill 1 is the best game of all time.

[Anonymous No.17088409]

>>17087264
He said it's a fine film, not a fine adaptation. How the fuck do you speedread 4chan posts, you double nigger?

[Anonymous No.17088424]

the 'writing' and 'storytelling' of a video game is its programming, where the actual craft of a game lies

[Anonymous No.17088438]

>>17087087
Literature wasn't born as art. Art was born as a product

[Anonymous No.17088445]

>>17087254
>emotional experience

What a fucking cop out. If I'm hate-watching Marvel movies it doesn't make them good

[Anonymous No.17088447]

>>17088392
>It is impossible for that game to have good writing
Why?

[Anonymous No.17088466]

>>17087044
The Witness

[Anonymous No.17088480]

>>17088219
This is hilarious because it's the exact reason I don't like SH3 nearly as much as 1 or 2. I actually love the gameplay in the first two, the wonky combat reflecting the everyman protagonists' relative weakness in the face of weird psychic monsters. And th exploration of the town is nice as well. SH3 is incredibly linear and reuses the shit out of SH2's assets, on top of the designer trying WAY too hard with creature design. I was actually hooked with the story when Heather finally gets to the apartment, retarded boss fight notwithstanding, but I just wanted to blaze through and see what happens rather than take my time with Harry or James.
For reference, I like 1 most, where you can straight up miss half of the story if you don't do the Kaufman side quests.

[Anonymous No.17088486]

bioshock was cool

[Anonymous No.17088498]

>>17088447
It's fantasy written by someone not named JRR Tolkien, and the work is titled something other than The Hobbit; or, There and Back Again.

[Anonymous No.17088527]

>>17088480
I've held since I first played it that 3's weakness is almost all of it is rehashed. The soundtrack and characters are phenomenal, but after playing 1 & 2 it's very easy to predict the flow of gameplay including all the alternate world transitions and end area. My favorite part of the game is still the car ride with Douglas as it transitions to the second part of the game. It's weird to think a cutscene could be the highlight of a game, but it feels true here.

[Anonymous No.17088539]

>>17088498
What makes your opinion better than Gary Gygax's, exactly?

[Anonymous No.17088963]

Xenoblade 2 for me, the writing isnt always great but I love the storytelling

[Anonymous No.17088999]

>>17088438
>Art was born as a product.
Hey Grug, how much for your last cave painting?

[Anonymous No.17089033]

>>17088498
Fantasy didn't even peak with Tolkien you pleb.

[Anonymous No.17089034]

>>17087163
big money always involves bad, almost standardised writing. who tf are they hiring for this shit it's so bad.

[Anonymous No.17089049]

>>17088999
Making images is not making art. Cave paintings are considered 'art' in a way that primarily uses the metaphysical model of art invented in the renaissance that values theory (as a product of history) instead of various materials and labour used to produce the work. It's the same reason why we hang the results of little Suzy's arts and crafts afternoon in the window of the classroom, not the Louvre.

[Anonymous No.17089159]

>>17087044
Defnitely not that tripe.

[Anonymous No.17089454]

>>17087044
Bloodborne

[Anonymous No.17089460]

>>17087067
This is great. Where can I find more?

[Anonymous No.17089770]

>>17087044
Blood Omen/Legacy of Kain games

[Anonymous No.17089990]

>>17087087
Cinema was also born as a product.

[Anonymous No.17090188]

>>17087044
The Grand Theft Auto series is a brilliant satire of 21st century American society. Show me a post-2000 novel that's comparably entertaining and does as much to expose the futility of the American Dream

[Anonymous No.17090274]

>>17087044
Universal Paperclips tells its story better than literature could. There's no better way to explain a state of mind than putting you in it in an active role.
Rain World is similar, I think, at least the half of it that I've played. It's one thing to tell you what it's like to forage for food and avoid predators, it's another to make you do it and let you arrive at the behavior yourself.
Those are fairly pure examples, but I think the same can apply to a mix with more traditional writing and storytelling. Video games can do worthwhile things that literature can't do (and vice versa, of course).

[Anonymous No.17090384]

>>17087044
Hotline Miami has kino storytelling.

[Anonymous No.17090404]

portal
thirty flights of loving/gravity bone
quadrilateral cowboy
lisa

>>17087145
>>17087163
these. emphasis on
>This is also why indie game often excel in story etc.

[Anonymous No.17090412]

>>17087044
who fucking cares, they're different mediums.
"are there any books with interactive systems that could genuinely hold a candle to videogames?"

in both cases there is some crossover (CYA books and IF games) but on the whole theyre two different mediums that do different things

[Anonymous No.17091425]

>>17090188
true, especially the iv in that regard. very pessimistic.

[Anonymous No.17091485]

>>17089990
Yeah, and flicks ain't art either.

[Anonymous No.17091491]

>>17087163
I wonder why big game companies don't hire novelists to punch up their scripts like Faulkner writing movies back in the day.

[Anonymous No.17091494]

>>17087679
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b-bijO3uEw

Denton's discussion with Morpheus is the best part of the game, if you missed it.

[Anonymous No.17091663]

>>17087044
stop fetishizing literature.
yes, even the best videogames can't compare with the greatest works of fiction ever written, but Planescape is leagues above mediocre "classics" like Gatsby, picture of Dorian Gray or even Shakespeare's weaker plays.

[Anonymous No.17091699]

I guess the Pathologic games, but in general, video gamer writing is a fucking joke.

[Anonymous No.17091740]

>>17091699
>but in general, writing is a fucking joke.
fixed that for ya, no problem bro

[Anonymous No.17091837]

>>17087214
it really isn't. TW3 is a great game, but it definitely isn't because of its story or writing. Its trite fantasy schlock and the story suffers heavily from rushed rewrites and last-minute cuts.
TW3 only works as a video game, because it's fun to play.

[Anonymous No.17091857]

Is Umineko a videogame?

[Anonymous No.17091907]

>>17091740
Thanks

[Anonymous No.17091919]

>>17087044
plenty, but the best in terms of writing and story imo are Pathologic 2 (a remake of Pathologic 1) and Disco Elysium.
There is another game, called Outer Wilds. It doesnt hold a candle to Patho2 or Disco in the writing department, but the story ended up affecting me a lot more. I would almost call it a life changing experience. so thats something to keep in mind.

[Anonymous No.17091955]

>>17088085
>The first game is probably one of the greatest artistic achievements of the 2000s.
lol the same studio one upped themselves just a few years after.

[Anonymous No.17091962]

>>17091919
I started playing this disco game and then my buff pink schizophrenia thoughts tried to make me a fascist and called me a pussy. It's a fun game because I relate to the protagonist (this is bad) and like the buddy cop thing with Kim. It's actually pretty nice that they didn't try to put in combat, because as much as I love Fallout that shit would be a detriment to this game.

[Anonymous No.17091969]

>>17091919
yes, but do you actually read books or are you just a crossboarder who somehow stumbled upon this thread?

[Anonymous No.17091980]

I'm fairly sure 90% of the people who mention pathologic in these threads just watched the hbomberguy video.

[Anonymous No.17091982]

>>17087044
Reminder, the only /lit/ genre of vidya are shooters and actions games, because it would be pointless to play vidya for their stories when you have books.

[Anonymous No.17091996]

>>17091980
I played Pathologic before Mandalore made his video on it
Hbomberguy did unfortunately bring trannies into the community, but at least those trannies are giving their money to IPL, so its not all bad.

[Anonymous No.17092004]

>>17091969
this is the last book I read.
And I have read all the well known authors like Dostoyevsky, Cormac Mcarhy, all those guys.

[Anonymous No.17092071]

>>17091919
>disco

commie trash

[Anonymous No.17092139]

>>17092071
hardly
try arguing your case instead of throwing around buzzwords like a political drone.

[Anonymous No.17092145]

>>17089460
There's more on that site. You might like 'Hadean Lands' as well.

[Anonymous No.17092175]

>>17091663
Hahahah... this is bait, right? Right?

[Anonymous No.17092205]

>>17092175
sounds like you fetishize literature, friend.

[Anonymous No.17092213]

>>17091955
Meaning that they made TWO of the most significant artistoc achievements of the 2000s, no?

[Anonymous No.17092237]

>>17091857
no, but it is literature

[Anonymous No.17093139]

>>17087087
Literature was born as purely functional writing

[Anonymous No.17093484]

IMO storytelling in video games is at its best when the game tries to immerse you in the environment to let you "experience" the world rather than forcing this "great story" on you via cut scenes, lines, etc. Games are getting better and better at doing this too. The new zelda game on switch is a great example of using adaptive sound system to subtly let you know of the things that are happening in the game world. About to see the sunrise? Here's a chord change. Engaging the enemy? Here's a smooth transition to the fight song.

Games like ABZU and What Remains of Edith Finch also do great jobs at conveying stories in ways traditional literature cannot even attempt. Most other video games that are advertised to have great story and world like Halo inevitably feel lame compared to real literature, because they try to force watered down literature into video game format.

[Anonymous No.17093494]

>>17087065
>Star Wars
Kill yourself tranny.

[Anonymous No.17093503]

>he plays video games
>he thinks he's allowed to hold opinions on the literature board

[Anonymous No.17093510]

>>17093494
still spamming that word? 2020 is almost over

[Anonymous No.17093517]

>>17093510
Cope.

[Anonymous No.17093524]

>>17093517
cease

[Anonymous No.17093529]

>>17091663
>but Planescape is leagues above mediocre "classics" like Gatsby, picture of Dorian Gray or even Shakespeare's weaker plays.
oh my god the gall of the nigger midwits on this board to suggest something as vapid and uninteresting as planescape is on par with fucking shakespeare's "weaker plays".

[Anonymous No.17093552]

>>17087065
>Knights of the old republic 2
Dude objectivism lmao!!! Literally a game for anglos.

[Anonymous No.17093563]

>>17091491
Novelists probably don't want to be associated with video games generally, and the ones that do are genre fiction authors (so barely a step up really).

[Anonymous No.17093577]

>>17093529
>wtf how could you say that? it's SHAKESPEARE, he's a literal god who shat out nothing but pure gold
like I said, pure idol worship. I bet you didn't suffer through the two gentlemen of verona or taming of the shrew

[Anonymous No.17093589]

>>17093577
even shakespeare's worst plays holds infinitely higher literary quality than planescape. planescape is a glorified CYOA novel.

[Anonymous No.17093608]

>>17093589
it's pretty clear you've never read planescape either. you're the biggest pseud in this thread.

[Anonymous No.17093622]

>>17091485
Your definition of art must be some postmodernist revisionist idiocy if you think that.

[Anonymous No.17093641]

>>17093608
>it's pretty clear you've never read planescape either.
cope.
>you're the biggest pseud in this thread.
you still haven't given me a single reason why i should uphold planescape higher than even Henry VIII.

[Anonymous No.17093655]

>>17093622
>everything anti-modern is postmodern

[Anonymous No.17093665]

>>17093655
>defining art in a way that excludes movies
>anti-modern
lol

[Anonymous No.17093675]

>>17088409
It's not a fine film though. Watch more films.

[Anonymous No.17093686]

>>17088136
Silent Hill is too hypersexual. Feels like I'm playing a game for teenage girls with everything being an allegory for lust and rape. Basically I hate Japanese horror, period.

[Anonymous No.17093739]

>>17093665
You are exceedingly stupid.

[Anonymous No.17093769]

>>17088963
fuck yeah xenoblade 2. i consider it High Shonen.

[Anonymous No.17093774]

>>17093739
This is coming from the fool who thinks his definition of art isn't a direct consequence of the modern lol. Not an argument, by the way.

[Anonymous No.17093823]

>>17093774
>This is coming from the fool who thinks his definition of art isn't a direct consequence of the modern lol.
I have never paid attention to any modern definition of art in my life. Flicks are decadent garbage for the proles.

[Anonymous No.17093831]

>>17093823
>I have never paid attention to any modern definition of art in my life.
>Flicks are decadent garbage for the proles.

[Anonymous No.17093906]

>>17093831
Cope. Film is still and lifeless, merely a false substitute of live performance. There's no artistry, it's just a commercial product.

[Anonymous No.17093916]

>>17093906
How are you so self-unaware as to not even realize that your own definition and view of art is modern? Or are you just disingenuous?

[Anonymous No.17093935]

>>17093916
>you're a postmodernist for hating film
>you're a modernist for hating film
Fucking imbecile.

[Anonymous No.17093941]

>>17088136
Silent Hill 2 is one of those rare games where every aspect feels as though it has meaning and thought behind it. I think this is why games, and to a lesser extent films, can feel less like art and more like entertainment, the design by committee development structure feels like it strips out any subtext or deeper meaning because everybody has different ideas. SH1-3 feel like they was made by a group of people on the same wavelength.

[Anonymous No.17093958]

>>17093935
Your idea of art couldn't negate movies if it wasn't modern, dumbass. It is literally, 100% modern. Ideas of art that are pre-modern would have no acknowledgement of movies either way (they would neither affirm nor negate them) because you can't account for something that doesn't exist yet.

You also appear to negate them with the belief that your view is pre-modern, which is what makes your view revisionist idiocy.

[Anonymous No.17093960]

>>17088136
>Silent Hill 2 has actual characters that develop and explores themes and uses symbolism.
Well in the most heavy handed and unsubtle manner possible, yes.

[Anonymous No.17094002]

>>17093958
Your perspective of the argument is banal and not at all relevant as to what we are talking about. I dislike film, as I like dislike modern art. This is a anti-modern stance. Your sophist aphorism that my opinion is a modernist one is utterly irrelevant to my feelings on film as a medium and it's clear association with modernity.

[Anonymous No.17094055]

>>17094002
>I dislike film, as I like dislike modern art. This is a anti-modern stance.
It's not, retard. Your point of view is a result of the modernism that you think you rail against, except you don't even realize it, which makes you a part of its decadent side. You're a decadent, and people with a positivist definition of art that includes modern art like movies are the opposite of decadents.

[Anonymous No.17094109]

>>17094055
>It's not, retard. Your point of view is a result of the modernism that you think you rail against, except you don't even realize it, which makes you a part of its decadent side.
All this projection and not a single argument to dignify your stance, just harebrained insights that only make sense in your head.
>You're a decadent, and people with a positivist definition of art that includes modern art like movies are the opposite of decadents.
"Positivist definition"???

[Anonymous No.17094161]

>>17094109
>and not a single argument to dignify your stance
My argument was here >>17093958, you can't call your stance properly antithetical to the modern when it could only ever exist within the modern context (making it a result of it). You're pulling linguistic trickery to reach such an internally contradictory stance, and this is decadent behavior. Feel free to argue against this claim.

>"Positivist definition"???
That's what a definition of art that includes modern art necessarily must be. Your definition is loaded up with metaphysical baggage, in other words, which is the source of its absurdity. Basically, you're a nihilistic twerp and the cut of your jib offends me.

[Anonymous No.17094205]

>>17087044
I'll add Kentucky Route Zero.

>>17093941
Bloodborne succeeds at this too, and it's even more impressive because it's a much bigger game.

[Anonymous No.17094468]

>>17087582
I can honestly say it had an impact on me. Also ".'s" Kreia video has like 6 Million views on YT right now so clearly a lot of people are interested and being influenced by the ideas posited in that game.

[Anonymous No.17094527]

>>17094468
good thing he retained the top spot in terms of reach, plenty of copycats shallowly imitating his analysis and trying to put some kind of political spin on it started cropping up a few months later. too bad he's fallen down the twitter self-indulgence rabbit hole

[Anonymous No.17094581]

>>17092205
Nah, it's you fetishizing emo-tier pseudcore like PST, not friend.

[Anonymous No.17094743]

>>17094527
I did not even know of those others and I was happier for it. Makes sense I guess, grifters seizing the moment. Did not know about his twitter either and can't find it in a quick search, any chance you could give me a link?

[Anonymous No.17094752]

>>17087582

WTF, care to give a quick rundown on what you think is the influence?

[Anonymous No.17094755]

>>17094743
>https://twitter.com/mr__cynical
please don't enable him

[Anonymous No.17094759]

>>17087050
Remember this scene very vividly even though it's just a few seconds.

[Anonymous No.17094826]

>>17094755
damn I scrolled for 5 minutes reading his tweets only to find I only went as far back as Dec. 20th. He's tweeting like 30 times a day.

[Anonymous No.17094839]

>>17094826
twitter is addicting. I'm just a small-time artist and not a big internet personality, and it took me years to finally deactivate my account and wait out the 30 days until it's deleted. it's like the lottery, you always feel like your next tweet might be the one that blows up.

[Anonymous No.17094881]

>>17094839
I won't lie I've been spending a lot of time on it since the pandemic, but I don't actually post. I just retweet stuff I want to come back to later, or save threads with the threadunroller app etc. I'm sinking way to much time into it though as I'm starting to get more info from it daily. Will probably cut it out completely in summer time as the things I stay on twitter to see updates on finish up. Then I can go through and save all the tweets/studies/takes/whatever else I decided to save and move on. That being said, I think it will be more difficult than just walking away, I can already tell it's an addicting platform and I'm spending more and more time on it.

[Anonymous No.17094882]

>>17094839
this also plays into the famed twitter paranoia. people always feel like the eye of the world is upon them and wonder what might happen if someone finds out they liked that blue lives matter tweet in 5 years when they get into a controversy. I'm convinced the site is deliberately engineered to produce that effect.

[Anonymous No.17094884]

>>17087566
I never really got why people hold this game's storytelling up so high. Maybe it's because I was about twelve when I played it, and don't get me wrong I liked it, but I never understood why it's proclaimed as this modern classic

[Anonymous No.17094909]

>>17094884
it's mainly lauded for the art design and environmental storytelling. it was a beautiful game for its time, and it still holds up today. The story is just competently executed and has some themes, which is enough. it's the equivalent of a classic YA book.

[Anonymous No.17095480]

>>17087044
Silent Hill but wrote by Kafka

[Anonymous No.17095577]

Someone convince me that this is actually worth playing
Also
>same off topic thread this board has every day
>150 replies

[Anonymous No.17095648]

Video games that try to have good writing are usually shit. You play them getting the feeling that the creators are failed authors or filmmakers, picking their old ideas and shoving them into a different medium where they just don't belong.

And yes, people like that shit, but that's only because vidya largely still lacks a narrative language of its own, so when the gameplay is interrupted for a cutscene that is trying to emulate a movie or a dialogue that is trying to emulate a novel people think that's "good writing" because they don't have a better frame of reference. But good writing doesn't exist in a vacuum, in order to be good it has to match with the psychology and overall experience of the medium, which is why every artform pushes storytelling into something different and unique over time. But vidya is stuck in time, it's as if movies as recorded plays had worked so well that there was no incentive to develop its own storytelling techniques and devices. You get a story that belongs to another medium, except you're given the choice between 20 different endings to give the illusion of a different experience.

[Anonymous No.17095665]

>>17088053
>Who are some people who were so influenced by kotor 2? I'm curious to hear your thoughts.
Seconding this.

[Anonymous No.17095674]

>>17095648
I think Half-Life, generally, got the correct gist down of how to present a videogame plot: it's not halted by cutscenes or having to interact with some via dialogue trees, etc. It flows with the player.

Videogame plots, however, aren't really above B-grade film or barrel-bin novels. Some of the games I see lauded, if they were made in those other forms, wouldn't even get recognized; which just goes to show how low the standards for videogames are.

[Anonymous No.17095694]

>>17095648
the whole premise is bad since the point of games isn't to "tell a story". it's like asking if the cover design on any novels is high art. yeah, probably some, but that's missing the point of the medium.

[Anonymous No.17095735]

>>17087044
Happy wheels

[Anonymous No.17095773]

>>17087566
I’m sorry but I prefer Infinite... maybe because I I played it first, but the gameplay is so much better, Rapture is too claustrophobic (which I guess it was supposed to be) but Columbia is beautiful. The writing is meh, but still BI is one of those few leftyish pieces of media I have a soft spot for, simple because I had a good time playing it.

[Anonymous No.17095878]

>>17088392
>You should be playing for gameplay and atmosphere anyway, you fag.
Based and redpilled.

[Anonymous No.17096929]

bump

[Anonymous No.17097094]

>>17091837
Couldn’t be more wrong if you tried

[Anonymous No.17097448]

>>17088392
>Silent Hill 1 is the best game of all time.
Guess how I know you're a faggot.

[Anonymous No.17097482]

>>17088072
no. it does not. heavy rain is shit game with shit story. NEXT

[Anonymous No.17097671]

>>17097448
It's definitely up there as one of the most visceral experiences you can find in any medium, even if some of its individual components are rather pedestrian.

[Anonymous No.17097800]

>>17087318
LOU2 sucked, especially with the writing.

[Anonymous No.17097809]

>>17088072
David Cage games are the worst example of video games trying too hard to be cinematic. Dudes a shitty writer.

[Anonymous No.17097826]

>>17088223
For me, I felt like there was enough variance in the environment/settings so it didn’t feel repetitive for me. You can beat the game in like 5 hours if you know what you’re doing.

[Anonymous No.17097837]

>>17088527
In retrospect it’s good Team Silent started to experiment with Silent Hill 4: The Room. Even if that game isn’t the greatest and can be annoying at times, it is still a very interesting game.

[Anonymous No.17097842]

>>17090188
Ehh, I mean many of them just rip-off gangster movies.

[Anonymous No.17097862]

>>17093484
I feel like Silent Hill, while still having a straightforward story with lines and cutscenes, still puts in you into a great environment to “experience” it.

[Anonymous No.17097870]

>>17093960
You’d be surprised at how many people cannot see the “heavy-handed and unsubtle” symbolism.

https://youtu.be/-XmbrnirD0s

[Anonymous No.17097874]

>>17095480
I mean we could have gotten Silent Hills but Konami fucking sucks.

[Anonymous No.17097879]

The silver case is some of the best fiction from the last twenty years

[Anonymous No.17097880]

>>17095480
Play Silent Hill 4

[Anonymous No.17097885]

No. These threads are fucking stupid. You wouldn't say the same about movies so why video games? Some video games have better writing relatively but no they can't compare to lit. I loved vidya before I loved lit too, still do.

[Anonymous No.17097897]

>>17087044
Ico

[Anonymous No.17097928]

Wtf how has it not been mentioned yet?

[Anonymous No.17097937]

Still the best video game adoption of a piece of written literature. Point-and-click games are probably the best way to adopt short stories and novels.

[Anonymous No.17097990]

>>17097897
Ico's (and SotC) "storytelling" is great but so unique to the medium I would never compare it to literature.

[Anonymous No.17098445]

>>17091663
best post itt

[Anonymous No.17098897]

>>17087292
Correct take

[Anonymous No.17099130]

The Last of Us part 2

[Anonymous No.17099260]

>>17091663
Based

[Anonymous No.17099281]

>>17087044
Pathologic 2

[Anonymous No.17099335]

>>17092071
How is it commie trash? The game has multiple characters whom each express their viewpoints and understanding of the world. None is seen as the 'only right one'. Hell, the leader of the commie revolution pretends to be a commie only to push his own agenda.

[Anonymous No.17099356]

>>17099335
>espouse commie ideals
>this strengthens your morale
>espouse fascist ideals
>this decreases your morale
>espouse liberal ideals
>the game thinks you're a robber baron with no empathy
>espouse centrist ideals
>the game calls you a pussy who refuses to commit
Communism is the only ideology the game supports in any way, all others and presented as malicious and fundamentally wrong.

[Anonymous No.17099607]

Killer7 is a surreal masterpiece

[Anonymous No.17099615]

>>17093686
Maybe this is why it’s one of the most popular series among women.

[Anonymous No.17099627]

>>17088072
David Cage is the best example of a writer who was rejected from Hollywood so he instead made shitty video games that bash your brains in with its morals.

[Anonymous No.17099639]

>>17087591
Most of the Call of Duty games are basically the equivalent of Hollywood action blockbusters. The Black Ops games do try to be a bit interesting (They take elements from spy thrillers), but are far from the best writing in games.

[Anonymous No.17099660]

>>17091982
Are you the guy who thinks Spec Ops: The Line has the best writing in games?

[Anonymous No.17099662]

>>17099356
>espouse commie ideals
>this strengthens your morale
That's completely false. Not only does it do nothing to morale, it also damages your one of your intelligence skills. Believing it is literally making you dumber. The only benefit of taking up the commie idea is a minor xp bonus for some dialogue options. The whole point is that communism has failed and you would have to be a delusional idiot to think it can come back again. Fuck, the entire game is about failure and needing to move on from the past

[Anonymous No.17099667]

>>17093563
Earthbound was created by a writer who wanted to explore the format of video games.

[Anonymous No.17099669]

>>17099662
>a minor xp bonus for some dialogue options
Oh so being a commie gives you free xp too? And you're still saying tihs isn't a commie game?

[Anonymous No.17099674]

>>17099662
Didn’t the creators straight up thank Marx and Engels at an awards show?

Also, aren’t there voice cameos from people from leftist podcasts like Chapo Trap House and Red Scare?

[Anonymous No.17099686]

>>17087044
I thought that bioshock did a good job, even if it borrowed heavily from Ayn Rand's philosophy,I think it did something interesting with it.
I also remember being really invested into the last of us story. Elle and Joel had a strong dynamic. The game reminded me alot of the road

[Anonymous No.17099688]

>>17099662
he's just parroting shit he read on /v/.
the entire internet is being overrun by political busybodies who talk about things they have no personal knowledge of because they think it's their divine mission to stop the evil commie boogeyman they have been told is "hiding right over there in the bushes" from devouring more innocents. he probably means well, though doesn't change anything.

[Anonymous No.17099730]

>>17090384
Ild give it points for not needing to explain everything and it's use of surrealism. But there isn't much of a story there other than "go here and kill everyone"

[Anonymous No.17099804]

>>17099674
>didn't heidegger praise hitler and nazi ideology in his private writings? I am NOT reading Being and Time. The work of art is just the artists politics in a pretty dress.
remember when we weren't like this?

[Anonymous No.17099862]

>>17099669
And the liberal idea gives you free money, the centrist idea is the one which strengthens your morale for nothing, and lets you get smarter. The nationalist idea lets you get stronger. Does the game support those ideologies as well because they give benefits with their drawbacks?

>>17099674
Yes for "political education", as well as Vladimir Makovsky, and Viktor Tsoi. There is no denying the game is coming from the left, but to say it slobbers over Marx is false. What that anon is ignoring though the devs grew up in post-USSR Estonia, and they channel that and put nuance to it. In the game communism failed, it failed completely. Anyone that wants to bring it back is plainly ignoring reality. The main two communists you have in the game are a union boss so corrupt he makes Jimmy Hoffa look clean, and a broken old man who wasted his life consumed by his ideology.

[Anonymous No.17099883]

>>17099862
it's useless to try and reason with these people. they won't take your word for it, and of course they won't read anything for themselves either. they'll read god knows what into your post to prove that you're just a commie apologist.

[Anonymous No.17099916]

>>17099335
Not that guy, but the game is obviously sympathetic towards Bolsheviks.

[Anonymous No.17099926]

>>17099916
toward the people and their motives, yes, toward the ideology, not a chance.

[Anonymous No.17099927]

>>17099862
Damn, how did they get Felix Biederman to be in that game?

[Anonymous No.17099943]

>>17099926
Sympathy towards people is a stepping stone to sympathy towards their ideology. I like the game enough, but I'm not going to pretend that the writers aren't essentially communists.

[Anonymous No.17099949]

>>17099943
>Sympathy towards people is a stepping stone to sympathy towards their ideology.
what a disgusting statement

[Anonymous No.17099954]

>>17099949
Life's disgusting sometimes, deal with it.

[Anonymous No.17099967]

>>17099954
you can try to argue that not having sympathy for "bad people" is necessary for being a good person all you like, but in reality you'll just fall down a different rabbit hole and become a different kind of ideologue.

[Anonymous No.17099994]

Morrowind isn't written with as much finesse as a DE or PT but the lore is really solid.
Guess I'm just talking about the 36 Lessons. Go read the 36 Lessons.

[Anonymous No.17099998]

>>17099967
>you can try to argue that not having sympathy for "bad people" is necessary for being a good person all you like
Has nothing to do with my posts, please fuck off now.

[Anonymous No.17100007]

>>17099998
>n-not what I was saying
>don't @ me
I knew you were a faggot already

[Anonymous No.17100042]

>>17099949
>what a disgusting statement
either a foid or a dude who has developed foid brain

[Anonymous No.17100082]

>>17100042
on the contrary, you would have to be a femoid to have trouble keeping your sympathy for peoples motives and your assessment of whether their beliefs are plausible, their methods sensible and the result they're striving for realistically achievable separate.

[Anonymous No.17100150]

>>17099356
>why is it that i keep on choosing option D?

>Does D make the world a better place?

>yes

>then you are a moral fag

[Anonymous No.17100159]

>>17099660
I only ever seen that posted as a criticism of the level of literary merit in vidya. Remember when Bioshock Infinite was called The Citizen Kane of videogames?

[Anonymous No.17100168]

>>17099667
While I still like Earthbound, it’s been weird for the best few decades.

It was basically an underground hit in the 2000’s because you needed to pirate it in order to experience it. For awhile, most people just knew about it through SSB Melee.

But in the 2010’s it became more well known, and every indie video game creator and their mothers made games they claim were inspired it. Earthbound clones just became a thing and were a bit over saturated.

YIIK is probably the worst example. That game is so cliche. Undertale being the best thing to come out of these Earthbound clones.

[Anonymous No.17100170]

>>17100159
I hate Bioshock Infinite, the people who made and the journalists who praised it with the fury of a million exploding suns
I will never get those hours back
Give them back to me goddammit

[Anonymous No.17100179]

>>17100159
Yep, and it only took like a year before everyone forgot about it.

Seriously, barely anyone talks about that game anymore.

[Anonymous No.17100182]

>>17100159
remember when Avatar revolutionized cinema? it's just fotm viral marketing campaigns, don't pay attention to them

[Anonymous No.17100186]

Reminder that as good as disco elysium is, if you were reading it as a novel it would be slightly above average sci-fi genre fiction schlock that you walk by in a barnes and noble (when there were barnes and noble). The skill system is what elevated the story.

[Anonymous No.17100194]

>>17100168
And while I do like Undertale, the huge fandom is a bit insane. It’s like Homestuck, but I feel like I’m more able to enjoy Undertale without acknowledging it’s fandom.

Tumblr ruins everything. I’m glad it’s dead.

[Anonymous No.17100195]

>>17100182
721 days until Avatar 2 revolutionizes cinema again.

[Anonymous No.17100203]

>>17100186
Ehh, when I think of sci-fi schlock I think of stuff trying to ripoff Star Wars.

Disco Elysium is the equivalent of like a JG Ballard novel. It’s literary sci-fi that has merit.

[Anonymous No.17100211]

>>17100186
>>17100203
please recommend more hardboiled detective dystopian novels

[Anonymous No.17100224]

>>17100211
Look up New Wave Sci-Fi.

[Anonymous No.17100227]

>>17100211
The Demolished Man by Alfred Bester
The Incal (comic book) by Alejandro Jodorowsky and Moebius
The Eisenhorn and Ravenor books by Dan Abnett

[Anonymous No.17100233]

>>17100168
YIIK is the one of worse games I’ve played and I don’t trust people who like it.

[Anonymous No.17100280]

>>17100203
Do you think the Planescape story has literary merit i think it is on par with 90s YA DnD novels, and only stands out due to how bad the writing is in most games

[Anonymous No.17100305]

>>17100280
against what standard are you measuring the writing?

[Anonymous No.17100331]

>>17100305
It's in a video game so it's bad, if it was good the writer would've gotten published traditionally.

[Anonymous No.17100336]

>>17100331
hurr

[Anonymous No.17100355]

>>17099660
>Are you the guy who thinks Spec Ops: The Line has the best writing in games?
Why care for writing in video games, when you have books?

[Anonymous No.17100406]

>>17100305
Planescape has, for decades, been the standard for videogame writing. But its just a scifi story. There is no sublime element, no elevation. The game functions on the trope of amnesiac protagonist and somewhat smartly uses the death and rebirth mechanic well. But is it as effective as using visual art like a From game, or pure gameplay like Hades, or cinematic effect like RDR1 or the opening of metal gear solid revengeance ? I dont think so. Disco Elysium is an extremely competent choose your own adventure book if we are discussing pure literary merit. But its real successes lie in mechanics and utilizing the medium. The problem with these threads is that many anons conflate story and literary merit/writing. This doesnt even get into the huge problems of writing by panel. I think one of the main reasons people suck Avellones cock so much when it comes to writing is that when he works for a company, they LET HIM WRITE.

Getting off topic I always wondered why a company like blizzard spends millions on a game like diablo 3. but let some producer who pays their dues make the story. What if Diablo 3 had hired JG Ballard or Abercrombie or erikson from the malazan series to write an entry? I am not being snobbish. Im actually confused and sad as to the state of writing in videogames.

[Anonymous No.17100424]

>>17100406
>But its just a scifi story
>story about an immortal wizard
>scifi
Dude...

[Anonymous No.17100440]

>>17100424
its multi dimensional, and i was trying to be charitable in not calling it unelevated genre fiction (which it is)

[Anonymous No.17100449]

>>17091663
Kek, still the best post itt. Many of /lit/s most active posters are frauds. They blindly idolise real books, traditional publishing, the canon, trying to stylise themselves as cultured, but they haven't read half the books they list off at parties as their all-time favourites, nor much of anything else.

[Anonymous No.17100485]

>>17100449
I don’t lie about the books I’ve read, because no one asks.

[Anonymous No.17101719]

>>17087044
Nier Automata has a lot of plot

[Anonymous No.17101832]

>>17087050
>>17094759
what movie?

[Anonymous No.17101897]

I'm thinking of the silver case and a plague tale: innocene
>>17087318
>>17089454
>bloodborne
based
>>17094205
kentucky route zero AND bloodborne
double based

[Anonymous No.17101991]

>>17087044
https://www.deviantart.com/uthp/journal/The-Legend-of-Twilight-Zelda-Princess-part-I-348420007

[Anonymous No.17102022]

>>17088963
Xenogears was good

[Anonymous No.17102032]

>>17087044
Final Fantasy Tactics

[Anonymous No.17102165]

>>17097094
not an argument

[Anonymous No.17102188]

>>17087679
At least in my opinion OG Deus Ex suffers quite a bit from the fact that devs tried to shove in every single hip conspiracy theory in it, the kitchen sink approach makes the plot feel somewhat busy and bloated at times. It could have used some more focusing for sure.

[Anonymous No.17102201]

>>17102165
at least he didn't just quote your post and attach a funny wojac

[Anonymous No.17102210]

>>17087044
the masquerade: bloodlines

[Anonymous No.17102220]

>>17102201
If he did you'd have to pick up his teeth from the floor. Don't fuck with me.

[Anonymous No.17102276]

>>17102201
true, now that you're saying it I appreciate it a little

>>17102220
why are you speaking for me, anon? I am not a violent man and I'd prefer if you refrained from any further threats of violence.
Violence is the last resort of the incompetent after all.

[Anonymous No.17102410]

>>17099730
>But there isn't much of a story there other than "go here and kill everyone"
That's not true though. The plot has so many underlying meanings and interpretations.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eWfa2ouQooI

[Anonymous No.17102589]

>>17097937
I remember reading something about the writer begrudgingly admitting that the video game version was more complete/better than the book, despite the fact that he personally hated computers and gaming especially. He also voice acted AM and wrote most of the game. But don't quote me on any of that

[Anonymous No.17102615]

>>17099356
>communism makes you dumber
>fascisms makes you lose morale because the world you're living is diametrically opposed to fascism and completely degenerate
>dunno about liberal ideals
>the technocrat centrist is probably one of the only character that is ever kind and helpful to you

[Anonymous No.17102787]

>>17102615
don't forget that you don't have to choose to conform to any one ideology, the game fully supports (and I think encourages) going on a case-by-case basis unless you're role-playing a meme character. the ideologies, as portrayed in game, are all basically caricatures that no one in their right mind would want to model their behavior on.

[Anonymous No.17103311]

>>17102615
>>communism makes you dumber
>>fascisms makes you lose morale because the world you're living is diametrically opposed to fascism and completely degenerate
It looks like a fine game story-wise, put this way.

[Anonymous No.17103336]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/582270/Everything/
https://store.steampowered.com/app/709710/Jungs_Labyrinth/
https://store.steampowered.com/app/638230/Journey/

Games aren't art. But they can be artful.

[Anonymous No.17103385]

>>17102787
Well yeah, all of the thoughts are essentially copes for what happened to Harry pregame.

[Anonymous No.17103616]

>>17087044
Gothic. Gothic 2.

[Anonymous No.17103966]

>>17102589
harlan ellison was a mad fuck that hated most things, he was great

[Anonymous No.17104028]

>>17087566
The bioshock series is the equivalent of making a game based off of wiki quotes pages.

[Anonymous No.17104046]

>>17099356
Hahaha, typical dumb ass right wing victim complex.

You're so fucking stupid I'm laughing so hard right now. Holy shit.

[Anonymous No.17104179]

>>17099335
>It wasn't true gommunism: the game

[Anonymous No.17104192]

While it does pretty much rip-off Lovecraft, Stephen King, and Twin Peaks, Alan Wake is a pretty good story and pretty fun to play. Also kind of meta in a way.

[Anonymous No.17104202]

>>17104192
Haven't played Control yet though.

[Anonymous No.17104231]

To the moon

[Anonymous No.17104244]

Wasn’t the “I have no mouth and I must scream” script written by Harlan Ellison? Or did he just voice AM?

[Anonymous No.17104248]

>>17104244
Fuck me I didn’t read all the way down. Oh well at least I got digits.

[Anonymous No.17104314]

>>17102615
>>the technocrat centrist is probably one of the only character that is ever kind and helpful to you
This annoys me 10 times more than any praise for communism.

[Anonymous No.17104387]

>>17087318
Retarded genreshit

[Anonymous No.17104397]

>>17092004
>And I have read all the well known authors like Dostoyevsky, Cormac Mcarhy, all those guys.
Well, this is a self-evident lie, but even if it were true it would peg you as an outsider to this board.

[Anonymous No.17104445]

>>17104397
and how did you deduce that detective?
also, the question wasn't "have you read all the underground and ultra obscure books that /lit/ loves" it was "do you read and enjoy reading books?"

[Anonymous No.17104486]

>>17089033
Yeah it peaked before him.

[Anonymous No.17104521]

>>17095773
Nice opinion. Didn't know they allowed special ed kids near computers though.

[Anonymous No.17104534]

>>17088498
>complains about Planescape being fantasy genre shit
>favorite game is Silent Hill which is as typical Japanese horrorshit as it gets
What a FAGGOT.

[Anonymous No.17104542]

>>17097671
>It's definitely up there as one of the most visceral experiences you can find in any medium
t. retarded art ho

[Anonymous No.17104705]

>>17091857
It is. And a bad one, at that.

[Anonymous No.17104827]

>>17087044
I know of one, but only for those who were able to fully grasp the story.

[Anonymous No.17104834]

>>17103336
>Games aren't art. But they can be artful.
Only when they poorly take advantage of the format, judging by your examples.

[Anonymous No.17104869]

>>17093941
This is what the game and film industries are missing. What people call "soulless" is simply when projects get so big that not a single creative focus can be allowed to rule the design anymore and production must be subdivided among many semi-autonomous groups. Management is already so hard at this point just to get the product out by deadline X that infusing a creative vision into all this is mostly out of the question.

[Anonymous No.17104886]

>>17091982
>because it would be pointless to play vidya for their stories when you have books.
Even if this isn't completely wrong, the way you phrase your entire post makes you come off as an autistic midwit that probably doesn't even read books and just wants to feel smug over his bad tastes because he's self-aware his medium is lowbrow.

[Anonymous No.17104900]

>>17100449
>They blindly idolise real books, traditional publishing, the canon, trying to stylise themselves as cultured, but they haven't read half the books they list off at parties as their all-time favourites, nor much of anything else.
Pathetic gaslighting, /v/tard.

[Anonymous No.17104911]

Not a single poster ITT has an IQ above 110.

[Anonymous No.17104933]

>>17087067
This. Some are actually pretty well written.

Even though the prose isn't great (it's noticeable that it's not his first language) The Baron is still the game whose story affected me more than any other game and where the interactivity and ability to see and act from the perspective of the character you play is an important part of the experience.

[Anonymous No.17104948]

>>17100440
It's not sci-fi. Calling it sci-fi is stupid. You're stupid.

[Anonymous No.17104966]

>>17104948
Kill yourself genreshitter.

[Anonymous No.17104971]

>>17104911
Including (You) I assume

[Anonymous No.17104976]

>>17104966
Words need to maintain their meaning if we are to communicate purple monkey dishwasher

[Anonymous No.17105006]

>>17099667
>Earthbound was created by a writer
Just some essayist.

[Anonymous No.17105081]

>>17104534
Silent Hill basically invented Japanese horror video game tropes.

[Anonymous No.17105094]

>>17105006
Still, he was pretty well known in Japan by that point.

[Anonymous No.17105320]

>>17103616
Absolutely based. Embarrassing that it took this many replies for Gothic to appear. 2 is more generic than 1 when it comes to the story and atmosphere, but it's still a fantastic game.