/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16965181]

Why are the ideas of this book even discussed post-Soviet Union? How isn't this treated in the way as Mein Kampf?

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !!oI3er5KKetj No.16965197]

>>16965181
>How isn't this treated in the way as Mein Kampf?
You mean like daily threads praising it?
The goals are radically different probably

[Anonymous No.16965203]

>>16965181
Because it’s easy for conservatives to point to, vilify, and not realize it was a pamphlet for steel mill workers.

[Anonymous No.16965205]

>>16965197
I don't mean here ofc, in the normally world

[Anonymous No.16965222]

>>16965181
>How isn't this treated in the way as Mein Kampf?
lol
The Communist Manifesto: "Workers of the world, unite!"
Mein Kampf: "Let's exterminate the Jew and invade other countries and exterminate their ethnic populations as well."

Rightists belong in camps. Disgusting people.

[Anonymous No.16965226]

>>16965181
Because the 'bourgeois' aren't actually real so are not an identifiable target

[Anonymous No.16965229]

>>16965181
>Communist Manifesto
Lol. Nobody takes this seriously past rightoids and college students. Marx's actual works like Capital have been influential and are far from "Mein Kampf" tier. Of course communism has been refuted by reality but that doesn't mean capitalism has been affirmed.

[Anonymous No.16965240]

>>16965226
>Because the 'bourgeois' aren't actually real
>Capitalists aren't real
Are you a retard?

[Anonymous No.16965243]

>>16965222
I'm referring to the consequences of ideas of both the books

[Anonymous No.16965249]

>>16965226
>bourgeois aren't real

Okay, this is epic

[Anonymous No.16965253]

>>16965240
have you ever met a capitalist

[Anonymous No.16965263]

>>16965240
This isn't the 19th century numbnuts

[Anonymous No.16965276]

>>16965253
>>16965263
>he thinks "bourgeoise" only refers to industrial capitalists
Based retards. Btw industrial capitalists do still exist they just open factories in China now.

[Anonymous No.16965283]

Marxism has always been by and for the intelligentsia. It never had anything to do with a worker's revolution, and had everything to do with a clique of sanctimonious ivory tower academics finding new ways to pat each other on the back for liberating the lower classes. Not much has changed in the last 150 years, Marxism is still touted by career academics who wouldn't know labor if it flew over their house, and largely ignored by actual working individuals.

[Anonymous No.16965293]

>>16965283
Not true. Most Marxists are middle to lower class

[Anonymous No.16965294]

>>16965276
have you ever met a chinese

[Anonymous No.16965296]

>>16965181
>why are the ideas of this book even discussed post-Soviet Union
They aren't. Nor were they in the pre-Soviet Union. Nobody has ever seriously discussed the Manifesto.
I'm rating this bait 4/10. It will probably get a few hundred posts on it, but they will probably only amount to about 3 posters arguing about vague socialism. If you had posted a pretty girl holding the Manifesto, it'd probably be significantly better bait, but as it is, 4/10.

[Anonymous No.16965301]

>>16965294
Yes, I have met plenty. What's your point? Are you going to disprove the bourgeoise exist or what?

[Anonymous No.16965308]

If Hitler faded into obscurity in the late 1920s and then his work was revived fifty years later and used by some other group it would be a more accurate comparison

[Anonymous No.16965310]

>>16965276
It doesn't refer to anything because they don't fucking exist it's completely arbitrary

[Anonymous No.16965317]

>>16965293
Have you ever met lower class working people? The vast majority of them tend to be conservative people. Why the modern fringe left thinks attaching trans and BLM shit to socialism would make it more attractive is beyond me.

[Anonymous No.16965322]

>>16965222
Have you read mein kampf? Which chapter discusses that jews must be eradicated?
Hitler and Marx had similar ideas, capitalist was just a marxist dogwhistle for jew.

[Anonymous No.16965323]

>>16965283
Ah yes those adjuncts who need to work two jobs and make 30k a year and who's departments' funds are constantly getting slashed. Ayo fuck college. Fuck education. Fuck literacy. Fuck that liberal bullshit.
Rightists are so fucking retarded.

[Anonymous No.16965327]

>>16965296
Marxist ideas aren't discussed? Are you a retard or just plain ignorant?

[Anonymous No.16965337]

>>16965293
Most PEOPLE are lower to middle class. Career academics are a class of their own however. The latte-sipping, glasses-wearing, bearded inner city gentrifier intellectual trope (a la Chapo Trap House) is not working class. The Starbucks Team Lead Anarchist is not working class.

[Anonymous No.16965340]

>>16965310
It's really not. Are you gonna disprove that some people own property and some people work for those people? You also know that bourgeoise and proletarian aren't the only classes right? Some people who both own property and work are petit-bourgeoise.
Sure, structure has changed since the 19th century but that doesn't mean the bourgeoise don't exist.
>>16965323
>fuck college
Yes, bourgeois faggot.

[Anonymous No.16965352]

>>16965337
If you don't own capital and your capital is not working for you then you are working class.

[Anonymous No.16965353]

>>16965323
>adjuncts who need to work two jobs and make 30k a year and who's departments' funds are constantly getting slashed.
Dishonest platitudes aren't going to get you anywhere.

[Anonymous No.16965354]

>>16965323
Those adjuncts are free to take a job at UPS if teaching college is too tough for them.

[Anonymous No.16965358]

>>16965337
But working class is defined as anyone who has a waged or salaried labor. Bourgeois are the owners of the means of production.

[Anonymous No.16965364]

>>16965354
>>16965353
typical anti-intellectual rightists

[Anonymous No.16965366]

>>16965340
Yeah they have to keep inventing classes because ...? Hmmmmmmm

[Anonymous No.16965371]

>>16965352
That's both patently false and hilarious evidence of how far the goal posts for "working class" have been moved by the very sanctimonious urbanites who wish to identify with it.

[Anonymous No.16965372]

>>16965366
Ok you clearly have no clue what you're talking about, please actually read Marx and come back with a principled critique rather than this shit.

[Anonymous No.16965374]

>>16965296
ahahahah holy shit, this is the most pseud commie hipster thing Ive ever read

[Anonymous No.16965382]

>>16965372
>This isn't on the wikipedia article!

[Anonymous No.16965388]

>>16965371
It is true. Those "urbanites" in your head are working class. It seems like you are more absorbed in cultural issues and trying to divide others.

[Anonymous No.16965389]

>>16965358
>But working class is defined as anyone who has a waged or salaried labor.
This is a meme that upper class white collar academics made up because they wanted to identify with the poor's.

[Anonymous No.16965390]

>>16965382
Can you lay out what you're trying to say? I'm not a Marxist but this is just pathetic. Letting ESLs online was a mistake.

[Anonymous No.16965401]

>>16965358
That might have been a good definition in like 1850, but today everyone has partial ownership in companies through 401ks and pension funds. The days one on guy in a tophat personally owning a factory that cranks out "widgets" that then go directly to market is long gone and probably only existed for a few decades anyways.

[Anonymous No.16965404]

>>16965389
Academics are working class. You are more absorbed in cultural issues and dividing others.

[Anonymous No.16965405]

>>16965390
Maybe you should read more than just Marx dipshit

[Anonymous No.16965411]

>>16965405
I have, I've read plenty more than him. So how don't the bourgeoise exist? Still waiting.

[Anonymous No.16965412]

>>16965181
Well to start with, the author didn't kill a whole lotta people and start a war that nearly broke the earth.

[Anonymous No.16965421]

>It's another Marx thread where Wikipedia educated Marxists face off with lolbertarians who don't have any clue what Marx said
Sigh..

[Anonymous No.16965424]

>>16965388
That's literally not true. The proletariat was specifically defined as manual laborers within the Communist Manifesto. All you philosophy students who work at Starbucks born to land-owning families are not working class.

[Anonymous No.16965432]

>>16965404
Veblen and Schumpeter have less simplistic and childish "us vs. them" class divisions. Check them out some time if you didn't already learn about them in school like everyone with a degree already did.

[Anonymous No.16965441]

>>16965411
Yeah same I've read every philosophical work in the world and I still think Marx is 100% accurate

[Anonymous No.16965443]

>>16965404
>Academics are working class.

[Anonymous No.16965452]

>>16965441
you haven't read my philosophical book i'm writing which BTFO's all of western philosophy

[Anonymous No.16965455]

>>16965404
>Academics are working class.
I'm glad I ditched Marxism a year ago considering this is the average Marxoid opinion nowadays.
>>16965443
Based

[Anonymous No.16965469]

>>16965181
Because its ideals are the same as those in which our elites believe.

[Anonymous No.16965474]

>>16965469
That would be capitalism

[Anonymous No.16965477]

>>16965469
abolishing value and worker-abolition?

[Anonymous No.16965482]

>>16965181
ask butterfly she is the biggest pseud on this board

[Anonymous No.16965485]

>>16965474
Capitalism & socialism: Two forms of managerial ruled, technical slavery
No thanks! Take the distributism pill.

[Anonymous No.16965495]

>>16965474
>>16965477
No, an egalitarian utopia with no families, no hierarchies, and no states.

[Anonymous No.16965508]

>>16965485
Distributism and Georgism have their merits too, though I don't see how you got slavery out of socialism.

[Anonymous No.16965519]

>>16965508
By "slavery" I just meant lack of freedom and being ruled over, subjected to the elite's vision of a "greater purpose". And I mean, in the actual socialist countries there was actual slavery. So that too.

[Anonymous No.16965527]

>>16965495
>no families and no states
Yes I suppose the elite would want that
>no hierarchies
This makes no sense since the elite would do everything in their power to maintain their power. Why would they give it up to benefit the lower classes?

[Anonymous No.16965540]

>>16965404
Anyone who makes more than $70k a year is not working class and is a beneficiary of capitalism, and thus are class enemies aligned with the bourgeoisie and their interests.

[Anonymous No.16965541]

>>16965527
It's not about benefiting the lower classes. It doesn't even have to make sense. Look at how angry they get when JBP starts talking about hierarchy. They are really, really against the idea, for some reason.
Also, you sound like you've never actually had to live around them. Come out to California and you'll see how things are.

[Anonymous No.16965542]

>>16965327
>Marxist ideas aren't discussed
Not all Marxist ideas are in the manifesto! They're mainly in Capital, The German Ideology, etc.
>>16965374
I'm not anything resembling a Communist. I just don't like bad threads.

[Anonymous No.16965545]

>>16965404
>>16965540
Both these opinions are retarded and it shows Marxoids have absolutely no clue about how capitalism works.

[Anonymous No.16965547]

>>16965542
>Not telling them to read Socialism: Utopian and Scientific
Eighty pages that summarize everything.

[Anonymous No.16965549]

>>16965542
Also, my point has been proven. Since I posted, the number of posts on this thread has increased to 62 from 16, yet the number of posters has only increased by 9, from 10. That means that exactly what I said would happen happened.

[Anonymous No.16965575]

So this thread is dead? Good. How about we never have another Marx thread?

[Anonymous No.16965771]

>>16965455
I hate delusional bugmen that treat philosophy and ideology as a fashion that they can switch out any time. They don't fundamentally understand the concepts they're advocating for and thus fail to realise it's them, not the ideas that suck.

[Anonymous No.16965811]

>>16965222
>Let's exterminate the Jew and invade other countries and exterminate their ethnic populations as well."
Absolutely kosher. You’ve never read one word of Mein Kampf

[Anonymous No.16965861]

Pretty obviously bc mein kampf is an autobiography, written by the leader of nazi Germany.

The communist manifesto is a work of political philosophy and not directly tied to the actions of an one country that took up the flag of Marx decades after he died. The 1:1 comparison would be the writings of Stalin and those are arguably even more difficult to get your hands on than even mein kampf.

A mainstream publisher like Verso has published a collection of Mao’s writing but with a lengthy preface that calls him the “Lord of Misrule”

[Anonymous No.16966519]

>>16965222
>>16965181
This. I have no idea why people always try to equate communists and nazis. One group explicitly says that they want a world in which all people are free and prosperous. The other group explicitly says that they want a world in which everyone who doesn’t look like them is dead. It should not be a mystery why the two groups get treated differently.

[Anonymous No.16966629]

>>16965243
TheThe consequences of freedom are murders, rapes, etc.

Ban being human.

[Anonymous No.16966666]

>>16966519
Nazi's wanted their people to be prosperous, wanted abolishment of classes. What a strawman, especially since everybody knows what regime has killed most people. Nazism posits that their way of living frees their people of oppression by corporations and bankers and the international community and thus wants freedom too.

[Anonymous No.16966679]

>>16965181
Because socialism is the only popular alternative

[Anonymous No.16966726]

>>16966666
WITNEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSED

[Anonymous No.16966748]

>>16965222
blessed post

[Anonymous No.16966832]

I want to read "mein kampf critical edition" but i don't know if there is and english translation or where can i donwload it.

[Anonymous No.16966972]

>>16965243
>the consequences of ideas
So just ban everything?

[Anonymous No.16966975]

>>16966666
>their people
Key words. Everybody else? Yeah just fucking kill them lmao xD ebin!!

[Anonymous No.16967124]

>>16966975
Stop swallowing war propaganda.

[Anonymous No.16967129]

>>16967124
It's clear why communism isn't hated as much as fascism

[Anonymous No.16967151]

>>16966519
>No gods! No masters! And that includes the communist party
That guys fucks

[Anonymous No.16967201]

>>16965181
Marxism and communism were Jewish movements. Jews in Frankfurt school also built their doctrines in a way that requires the entire western civilization be connected to Nazi death camps so that the western man be decried as a nazi and made feel guilty, should he object to his being erased and destroyed from history. Marxism and communism has always already been a Jewish movement to destroy the Christian civilization so despite its awful consequences it has never been decried, rather after its political failure it was instead transported through academia into the West.

[Anonymous No.16967237]

>>16967201
https://vocaroo.com/1kDDyCWpHNOp

[Anonymous No.16967241]

>>16967237
Sounds like a pre pubescent boy gross

[Anonymous No.16967272]

>>16965222
>>16966519
>we killed over 100 million people but it's fine because it was for the greater good

[Anonymous No.16967283]

>>16967272
>we killed over 100 million people

[Anonymous No.16968019]

>>16965181
its literally 50 pages long, its closer to a manual than a book. The only people that discuss it are baby lefties that haven't read Capital. Its achieved its goal of being an accessible, easy to digest explanation of communism for the layman but as a result people who haven't read anything else praise it like its the bible. It isn't treated the same way as Mein Kampf because the contents aren't nearly as vitriolic.

[Anonymous No.16968087]

>>16965771
Uhh no I mean by "dropped Marxism" I left the Communist party, idiot.

[Anonymous No.16968091]

>>16967272
You know, even the coauthors of the book which made that claim declared it an obsession-spawned clump of bullshit and distanced themselves from the entire project.

[Anonymous No.16968092]

>>16965181
Umm China exists sweetie

[Anonymous No.16968105]

>>16968092
>China
>Communist
Is this the new Marxist cope?

[Anonymous No.16968121]

>>16967201
Take your meds faggot. Marx was pro-white as hell, he thought communism was the next stage of human progress and would make people fulfilled, he also thought Jews should be exterminated. It's only with Lenin that it got "Jewish", Marx denounced vanguardism.

[Anonymous No.16968126]

>>16968105
I mean the ussr wasn't communist either. There has never been a communist state that's a contradiction of terms. Socialist? Arguably

[Anonymous No.16968145]

>>16968126
Marx used socialism and communism to mean the same thing so no there can't be "socialist states". China is obviously not socialist. They're capitalist with heavy state intervention.

[Anonymous No.16968149]

Here’s why the hammer and sickle will never be considered as heinous as the swastika. It’s really simple. Both of them resulted in mass murder and oppression, but the main difference between the two is that with the Communist Manifesto, this mass murder is an unintended consequence. If you read it, you’ll never find any mention of eradicating specific groups of people, in order to bring about a paradise. Paradise may be the goal, but systematic eradication is not seen as a means to achieve this goal.

Mein Kampf is different in this regard. It states explicitly that Judaism must be eradicated entirely before the world can be rid of Marxism. This is the significant difference. It specifically goes out of its way to mention the implementation of brute force and mass murder in order to achieve racial purity and establish the Third Reich

[Anonymous No.16968151]

>>16966519
>existential comics
>1C7C6D32-E18B-40F3-AB4E-E(...).png

>>16965181
>>16965222

Anon, just take the third positionist pill. Fascism and Communism have far more in common with each-other than they do with liberalized degeneracy. If the world keeps up as it is you won't even have any books left to own, it's all going to get zoomed in and enhanced by globohomo Amazon DRM shit

>>16965323
I dislike you, 30k is plenty and when you have a tenure track position I will feel bad for your students, especially those who may not have your political views. Seek help for your emotional problems before you project them onto your students

[Anonymous No.16968173]

>>16968145
Explain how you bring communism about (on a large scale) without a state transition. You can't just change hundreds of years of social relations/economic conditions overnight.

[Anonymous No.16968180]

>>16968149
>Implying Marx didn't advocate for the eradication of Jews too

"Since in civil society the real nature of the Jew has been universally realized and secularized, civil society could not convince the Jew of the unreality of his religious nature, which is indeed only the ideal aspect of practical need. Consequently, not only in the Pentateuch and the Talmud, but in present-day society we find the nature of the modern Jew, and not as an abstract nature but as one that is in the highest degree empirical, not merely as a narrowness of the Jew, but as the Jewish narrowness of society.

Once society has succeeded in abolishing the empirical essence of Judaism – huckstering and its preconditions – the Jew will have become impossible, because his consciousness no longer has an object, because the subjective basis of Judaism, practical need, has been humanized, and because the conflict between man’s individual-sensuous existence and his species-existence has been abolished.

The social emancipation of the Jew is the emancipation of society from Judaism."-Marx, On the Jewish Question

[Anonymous No.16968188]

>>16968173
That's the point of the transitionary state. But socialism and communism =/ transitionary state
Read Gotha

[Anonymous No.16968204]

>>16968149
>Judaism must be eradicated entirely
>heinous

[Anonymous No.16968212]

>>16968149
read dosto's demons

[Anonymous No.16968223]

>>16968188
So what's the transition called? I maybe a theorylet but I thought 'socialism' was the transitionary state

[Anonymous No.16968246]

>>16965181
>How isn't this treated in the way as Mein Kampf?
because it is good

[Anonymous No.16968249]

>>16968223
>The question then arises: What transformation will the state undergo in communist society? In other words, what social functions will remain in existence there that are analogous to present state functions? This question can only be answered scientifically, and one does not get a flea-hop nearer to the problem by a thousand-fold combination of the word 'people' with the word 'state'.
>Between capitalist and communist society there lies the period of the revolutionary transformation of the one into the other. Corresponding to this is also a political transition period in which the state can be nothing but the revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat.
Read Critique of the Gotha Program and State & Rev. Lenin made socialism and communism different things, but Marx uses them to mean the same thing. They both had the same ideas of the state though, just used different terms.

[Anonymous No.16968262]

>>16966666
photo of Jesus
and almost double 666

[Anonymous No.16968281]

>>16965322
holy shit are you illiterate?

[Anonymous No.16968357]

>>16968281
>Thanks for proposing a point, it would indeed be troublesome if I had to address it. However, have you considered this non sequitur ad hominem attack?

[Anonymous No.16968422]

>>16965181
The real answer has been given multiple times so far.

1. Mein Kampf and The Communist Manifesto are formally different types of books. The former is an autobiography and a description of how Hitler came to form his particular worldview. The latter is a theoretical polemic that lays out a critique of capitalism. That difference is essential for the next point.

2a. Mein Kampf was written by Hitler, the leader and driving personality of the Nazi movement and leader of German Nazi state. It’s impossible to separate out any ideas described in Mein Kampf from the actions of the Nazi state because the author of the book and the supreme leader of that state were the same person. There is *no distance* between those two things and thus they must be talked about together. This is especially the case because Mein Kampf ISN’T a theoretical text, it’s a autobiography, and as such there it’s an edifice of concepts that can be abstracted away from the specific personage who wrote them.

2b. Conversely who the authors of the CM were is entirely irrelevant to reading and evaluating the document itself. There is also vastly more distance between the CM and the Soviet Union, which while certainly inspired by the CM was also being led by different people, in a different country, with a different language, nearly 70 years after the publication of the CM.

It’s also important that the CM largely doesn’t lay out a positive programme for how a communist government ought to be structured and governed. The ‘Ten Planks’ are instrumental goals aimed at solidifying political control after a communist party seizes power, they are categorically not in themselves ‘socialism’. They are basically good advice for *any* political movement that wants to seize power in a country.

3. Stalin’s writings ARE basically treated like a Mein Kampf. You can’t find them at regular book stores, people would generally be offended if you sat in public reading them etc. The only people who publish Stalin’s writing are the publishing arms of communist parties, not unlike how Neo nazi material is published and distributed by neo Nazi groups.

If somebody things there is a different reason why those two books are not the same I’d really like to hear it.

[Anonymous No.16968441]

>>16965222
you belong dead in a ditch with the rest of your race

[Anonymous No.16968454]

>>16968441
Go to bed Lee

[Anonymous No.16968569]

>>16968422
And as an addendum to this:

>>16968149
The Communist Manifesto should never be published with the image of the Hammer and Sickle because that’s a symbol that originated with the Russian Revolution and neither Marx nor Engels would have seen it during their lives. In their time a plain red banner was the standard symbol of the communist movement.

So if people want to be outraged at the hammer and sickle symbol as a symbol of Soviet crimes, by all means. But it’s not even close to identical with Marx.

>>16968180
You should read that work in its entirety. On ‘The Jewish Question’ is an essay responding to a book written by Bruno Bauer called The Jewish Question, and Marx was staking out a far more moderate position than Bauer, who was outrightly calling for the expulsion of Jews from Germany.

In that essay Marx points out that Jews have been put into the position of the usurer by the dominate Christian state and by capitalism, and the traits of Jewish diaspora culture that Germans hate is directly a result of their position within capitalism. He says that this position makes political emancipation of Jews inseparable from emancipation of all humanity from capitalism.

There’s no doubt that the essay is anti Semitic, but it was also from 1843, six years before he wrote the manifesto and decades before he published Capital. To treat it as being part of his mature political thought is just to play a game of pretend.


Marx’s corpus isn’t the Bible, you can’t just take random verses with no regard to where in the book they are and act like they are proof of anything.

[Anonymous No.16968588]

>>16968422
>>16968569
Thanks for the intelligent post but if we read what you wrote how will we get back to shitflinging

[Anonymous No.16968647]

Leftism doesn't work.

Every single time it has failed.

[Anonymous No.16968668]

>>16968422
Marx encouraged massacre and revolution in his life time, there's not a lot of distance.

[Anonymous No.16968681]

>>16968121
>two destructive individuals working within the same destructive ideology differ in some minor point

That must mean it's not true!!!

[Anonymous No.16968699]

>>16968249
>revolutionary dictatorship of the proletariat.

How do people come up with this kind of bullshit and not realize that it's not possible?

[Anonymous No.16968704]

>>16968422
>There is *no distance* between those two things and thus they must be talked about together.

We should abolish everything the French Revolutionaires championed then.

[Anonymous No.16968716]

>>16968569
> To treat it as being part of his mature political thought is just to play a game of pretend.
Is there any indication that he changed his thoughts on the issue? Why can’t that phrase be considered sufficient? People can hold onto their beliefs for a lifetime

[Anonymous No.16968719]

>>16968647
https://sci-hub.st/10.2190/AD12-7RYT-XVAR-3R2U
read this and keep in mind that every socialist country has been under constant threat, sanctions, trade wars, actual wars or straight up invasions by capitalist powers, especially the USA.

[Anonymous No.16968725]

>>16965181
Because Russia wasnt occupied by foreign army, dummy. Most of the people still consider communism to be a good thing, if you start banning shit people like it will undermine your legitimacy more than if you just let the shit circulate.

[Anonymous No.16968739]

>>16968647
Liberal democracies dabbed on every other regime during past two centuries. Only regime that has potential to defeat liberal democracies atm is chinky socialism.

[Anonymous No.16968831]

>>16968719
>read this
How about no.

[Anonymous No.16968963]

>>16968831
what are you doing on a literature and philosophy board? let me summarise it for you.
its a study showing that every socialist country has had better living conditions at the same level of economic developement than any capitalist country.

[Anonymous No.16968978]

this board is so low iq it hurts. it hurts if you read marx. it hurts if you read guénon. it hurts if you read it all.

[Anonymous No.16969119]

>>16968704
The difference here is between Rousseau and Robespierre. Examining the thought of Robespierre cannot be divided from the events of the French Revolution and the actions he took during those events.

Examining the role Rousseau’s thought played in the revolution is an interesting and important context but how we evaluate and understand Rousseau’s political thought doesn’t live or die on our evaluation of the revolution.

Same goes for our evaluation of Locke’s politics and the American revolution, versus Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton.

All these comparisons are false to some extent because unlike Stalin, Robespierre, and Jefferson, Hitler’s book *isn’t principally a theoretical text*, it’s an autobiography. There is no set of arguments or theoretical system explicitly laid out, there is just the collection of things Hitler believes and the experiences he had that led him to those beliefs.

The point of the book is to make the case for his leadership. Not about the nature of inequality between men, the pursuit of liberty, the alienation of man in the division of labour etc. Hitler hoped you would finish his book and say ‘wow I really believe in this Hitler guy’.

>>16968716
First is that it’s before Marx had begun series study on the texts that would form the major influence for his mature work. It’s like talking about Heidegger before he read Husserl, or Kant before he read Hume. There is a reason why people make a distinction when talking about what Kant thought, and what ‘pre-critical Kant’ thought.

The second reason is that unlike a number of his contemporaries, antisemitism or any discussion about the Jews is extremely sparse in his mature published works, and has no structural importance to his system of politics or economics. This is in complete contrast with the Anarchists Proudhon and Bukharin for whom antisemitism was an integral part of their public politics.

The question isn’t ‘was Marx antisemitic’, the question is ‘was antisemitism a feature of Marx’s mature politics’, and the answer to that is no.

I’d even go further an say that even if Marx was writing antisemitic tracts on the side, it’s entirely possible to conclude that such a belief is in contradiction to the rest of his politics. I believe this is the case with Kant and Hegel’s racism. It’s very obvious that Kant’s racism is in clear contradiction to his ethics, and attempt to ‘cancel’ Kant for comments he made about Africans is absurd and counter to any standard of rational sympathy necessary for communication.

[Anonymous No.16969131]

>>16965181
Because the theory of fascism is inherently despicable, whereas the theory of communism is at the very least debatable. There is a peaceful, "correct" way to practice communism. Not so with fascism. Also, Mein kampf doesn't even represent fascism, it's just the memoir of a psychopath.

[Anonymous No.16969423]

>>16965181
how retarded are you?

[Anonymous No.16969448]

>>16969131
Spurious and strawmanning

[Anonymous No.16970378]

>>16965222
You haven't read Mein Kampf. Not that it's any good, but you haven't read it.

[Anonymous No.16970407]

>>16966519
> One group explicitly says that they want a world in which all people are free and prosperous

That's the nazis, yeah. Commies want an anti-human religious dictatorship that forces people to become what they are not.

[Anonymous No.16970419]

>>16969131
How would you know, you haven't the faintest idea what fascism is besides the cartoonish representations used to indoctrinate you. To understand fascism you'd have to be able to think critically, and read independently.

[Anonymous No.16970456]

>>16969131
Hitler was not a psychopath. If you had basic knowledge about his thinking and personality, you'd know that. I think it's fairly revealing that Hitler is just some boogeyman in your head rather than a human being.
Fascism is not inherently despicable, it is an ideology with a powerful, positive drive behind it. But of course, fascism is one of those words that can mean whatever you want it to mean, so whatever. It's probably little more than just a loose image-category in your head referring to the *other*

[Anonymous No.16970484]

>>16968963
I may ask you the same, there are numerous places where you can apologize and shill for leftism, /lit/ is not one of those places.

Now kindly fuck off you retarded leftist.

[Anonymous No.16970494]

>>16968719
Yes, the Soviet Union was an innocent little bunny bullied by big evil capitalist countries like Finland. No wonder it collapsed!

[Anonymous No.16970529]

>>16970484
And yet here you are, shilling for the right. Why should only we shut up? There's no rule that says "no leftism." I've been here for years and I'm not leaving.

[Anonymous No.16970680]

>>16968719
>read this and keep in mind that every socialist country has been under constant threat, sanctions, trade wars, actual wars or straight up invasions by capitalist powers, especially the USA.
Every capitalist country was under constant threat of fellow capitalist countries and the Soviet Union who was literally invading other countries to impose its system in

[Anonymous No.16970709]

>>16968719
Holy shit, they manage to get a p-value of <0.001 from a single observation! One can only marvel at such statistical wizardry that must have made such a conclusion possible! Alternatively, they don't know what the fuck they're doing. One of those.
Seems like they're not aware of MLR.3, AND they assume homoskedasticity of the error term. Given their "variance analysis" section I'm not even sure they're aware of the existence of heteroskedasticity robust standard errors, which is not unlikely given the articles age.

[Anonymous No.16970727]

>>16968719
Yeah, Sweden was really under such sublimation.

Or, perhaps, the socialist experiment doesn't work.

[Anonymous No.16970740]

>>16968719
This study isn't even remotely good because it reeks of selection bias; of course communism looks better when you compare it to African countries, that are capitalist, and mostly underdeveloped due to colonialism. Why not compare those countries before their revolutions; I guarantee you they were better off than Africa.

[Anonymous No.16970881]

>>16970740
The study is horrible, it use statistical methods the authors do not understand, which do not apply. Not only is it not i.i.d., there's multicollinearity and assumed homoskedasticity.

[Anonymous No.16970995]

anyone got that jordan peterson greentext about his family/ daughter and how fucked up it all is?

[Anonymous No.16972153]

>>16967129
Yeah, because of war propaganda and decades of left-leaning media and academic figures being wary fo putting as severe anti-communist propaganda into peoples' heads as anti-fascist. By the way, in countries with an intimate relationship with communism it is hated plenty. Too few people today have a real relationship with fascism to understand why it is bad, instead resorting to strawmen. Fascism is not the third way it promised to be, but it's core beliefs pay much more respect to the human soil than communism ever did. They also, like communism, allowed tyrannical governments to commit war atrocities. Both are inferior to what came before them, so get off your commie high horse

[Anonymous No.16972206]

>>16965181

Because to judge Marx as a failed father and deadbeat procrastinating faggot is to engage in Ad Hominem. It is also a personal attack on every professor who contributes nothing. To attack his ideas is to attract pseud faggots who will say anything that is blatantly wrong in capital is intentionally wrong to confound the fake readers from the real ones. The understanding on inputs has changed so much since his time, LTV is embarrassing. Also people tend to read the Manifesto and Capital and apply our current definitions to the words used, when the words in the books meant something else entirely. Like a lot of Marx's economics are in the ricardian sense (such as wages) and not how you would understand them now.