/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16747549]

“Socialism is a wonderful idea. It is only as a reality that it has been disastrous. Among people of every race, color, and creed, all around the world, socialism has led to hunger in countries that used to have surplus food to export.... Nevertheless, for many of those who deal primarily in ideas, socialism remains an attractive idea -- in fact, seductive. Its every failure is explained away as due to the inadequacies of particular leaders. ”

Whoa, he's right.

[Anonymous No.16747559]

Another thread to delete, tranny mods. Clean it up!

[Anonymous No.16747561]

[Anonymous No.16747587]

>>16747549
Wow China, Vietnam, and Cuba are all so hungry rn, Sowell is definitely a great authority on material conditions in socialist societies and should be taken super seriously(unlike in your last thread)

[Anonymous No.16747594]

sowell's about a yes master ass nigga

[Anonymous No.16747628]

>>16747587
What's actually socialist about any of those countries at the moment?

[Anonymous No.16747670]

>>16747628
Their understanding of markets and capitalism. All of those countries have seen workers have continued growth in their real wages in the last three decades wile real wages have remained stagnant in the west. Marx wrote that communism could only arise once capitalism has been played out. Chinese socialists understand capitalism better than western captialists soon they will out compete and replace united states as global hegemon leading to communism by 2050.

[Anonymous No.16747680]

>>16747549
>LOOK MOM I POSTED LE CONSERVATIVE BLACK MAN AGAIN!!!!

[Anonymous No.16747687]

>>16747670
>soon they will out compete and replace united states as global hegemon leading to communism by 2050
And then it will collapse in 2051 because they're a bunch of microdicks without a single creative bone in their bodies.

[Anonymous No.16747726]

>>16747687
Well you can believe your backwards race pseudoscience all you like but it won't change the fact that you don't have single good reason as to why the Chinese won't dictate the international order of this century.

[Anonymous No.16747782]

>>16747726
>backwards race pseudoscience
Anon, what art does China make, really? Maybe a few decent movies by Wong Kar-wai? Overall, their artistic projects severely pale in comparison to those of white-run capitalist countries. They mostly imitate, which is not the same as being creative. You can even see it in the craft of their industrial products. What reason is there to believe that such a country won't fold once the slightest wind over 10 mph blows towards it?

[Anonymous No.16747804]

>>16747726
sucking off a country that leads the world in like 2 industries. The U.S. leads innovation in every other industry

[Anonymous No.16747850]

>>16747782
Artistic creativity has little to do with economic or scientific creativity and besides the creative outouts of all societies vary wildly in quality from decade to decade or from century to century.
>>16747804
The Chinese economy is inevitably going to surpass the American in size and once it does they will undergo the transformation of industrial captial into financial capital that US did during the 20th century. Large amounts of financial capital will create a strong banking sector allowing for companies to engage in more research and development(which is where most tech innovation really happens)

[Anonymous No.16747853]

>>16747549
Obey massa

[Anonymous No.16747876]

>>16747549
>US and allies enforce international economic blockades against third world socialist nations and constantly fund insurrections
>Third-world country fails when quite literally most of the world is against it
>Hehe stupid gommies, just learn basic egonomigs
You fucks will see Cuba regularly exceed other comparable nations in education, healthcare, nutrition, sustainability, and human development DESPITE being internationally embargoed by most of the world economic order and still be like "Haha commie no food based neocon black man". Go read some actual basic economics and put down the Austrian nonsense.

[Anonymous No.16747895]

>>16747587
All of those countries starved under socialism and only stabilized and grew after adopting capitalist policies, fact. Imagine trying to suggest the millions of Chinese who died due to famine in the 20th century weren't hungry, lmao.

[Anonymous No.16747940]

>>16747850
>Artistic creativity has little to do with economic or scientific creativity
I don't think that's right, and China seems to demonstrate it for me, because they aren't innovative economically or scientifically either. They've accumulated wealth recently because they were given a monopoly over rare metals by capitalist globalist governments, and because they're cheaters (dodging health regulations, running scams on Amazon / through B2B channels, etc.). Where's this superior innovation, exactly? Aren't they just manufacturing what other countries tell them to manufacture?

[Anonymous No.16747942]

>>16747895
I did not deny the famines of the twentieth century I pointed out that China is thriving today under a government that remains socialist. Socialism and Capitalism are not incompatible in the same way that bud is not incompatible with the flower that emerges from it and fruit not incompatible with the flower.

[Anonymous No.16747947]

>>16747549
meme man

[Anonymous No.16747951]

>>16747895
China was literally better off under Mao than any other Chinese government in the last century up to that point. Even the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution were incredibly tame compared to the mass famine and death under the Qing and the disorder of the Kuomintang. What you gotta remember is that China is by default a pretty difficult and bloodthirsty nation, and therefore when you look at Chinese leaders up to that point, Mao was actually pretty decent, especially in bringing China back from the Century of Humiliation.

[Anonymous No.16747960]

>>16747940
Inovation comes from financial capital investment into research and development, China is mainly in possession of a large amount of industiral Capital which is yet to be transformed into financial capital. This transformation is the same one the US went through in 20th century.

[Anonymous No.16747972]

>>16747960
Innovation comes from race

[Anonymous No.16747987]

>>16747972
Lmao you can believe that if it helps you cope.

[Anonymous No.16747995]

>>16747876
why is Austrian economics nonsense?

[Anonymous No.16748005]

>>16747987

[Anonymous No.16748015]

>>16747960
You have to know what research and development to invest in. If you don't know that, your capital is pretty much worthless and you're going to lose it.

[Anonymous No.16748020]

>>16747942

What are the ghost cities of China for $400, Alex?

[Anonymous No.16748044]

>>16747549
>Among people of every race, color, and creed, all around the world, socialism has led to hunger in countries that used to have surplus food to export
That's not true
You're describing what capitalism is doing
We have enough food and goods for everyone, but 1% has it all

[Anonymous No.16748050]

>>16747995
Because it quite literally rejects empirical evidence and basic economic models in favor of "praxeology" and pure ideology. There's a reason why Austrian economics hasn't been academically relevant since Mises kicked the bucket. The only thing the Austrian School contributed was the subjective theory of value and the economic calculation problem (the latter of which is getting pretty regularly chipped away at as information technology improves), beyond that it's nothing but crackpots and heterodox theories that can't even get you a TA position.

[Anonymous No.16748054]

>>16748044
there is no hunger in capitalist countries, or practically none

[Anonymous No.16748064]

>>16748050
>There's a reason why Austrian economics hasn't been academically relevant since Mises kicked the bucket.
yeah the reason is that it points out the absolute scam of the ruling class, especially the Federal reserve

[Anonymous No.16748082]

>>16747549
And America, a capitalist country, officially has about 500,000 homeless people (the real number is surely higher).

[Anonymous No.16748102]

>>16748054
Ok lol

[Anonymous No.16748144]

Why is there so many commies and CIA niggers in this thread. Anyone trying to deny that Capitalism and Christianism, which are both closely intertwined, were the core values of the west, the greatest civilisation of all time.
The founding father of the US had it all right.

[Anonymous No.16748160]

>>16748144
>communism is being pushed by the CIA
Take your meds

[Anonymous No.16748179]

>>16748160
Proof that niggers can't read.

[Anonymous No.16748186]

>>16748144
This post reads like what an AI would make after feeding it /pol/ threads.

[Anonymous No.16748226]

>>16748144
FFs were delusional, Washington should have just declared himself king

[Anonymous No.16748240]

>>16748005
Lol I'm not asian
>>16748015
Thats really not a major issue once you have banking sector like the american one massive loans counterintuitively reduce risk
>>16748020
They're a way of increase gdp through continuing to engaging in massive amounts of infrastructure spending

[Anonymous No.16748253]

>>16747587
>China
Everyone starves until they adopt their current state capitalist model. Hmmm

[Anonymous No.16748265]

>>16748240
why don't they just build more useful stuff then lol

[Anonymous No.16748266]

>>16748102
China's great leap forward killed as many as the others put together/

[Anonymous No.16748400]

>>16748266
The chart literally mentions 60 million dead in Qing China from 1850-1873 and another 13 million dead from 1876-1879. I hate to tell you this anon, but even if we were to accept the 45 million figure, it still wouldn't put Mao anywhere near some of China's worst rulers. This is even coming from someone who thinks that Mao was an incompetent fuck. It's just that China has such a long history of bloodshed and horror, particularly in the last couple centuries, that the Mao era is a RELATIVE bright spot, all things considered.

[Anonymous No.16748431]

>>16748400
So there's nothing wrong with capitalism. There's a problem with communism and Chink culture.

[Anonymous No.16748462]

>>16747549
Many leftists implicitly assert the zero sum fallacy, so genuine discussion of economic policy is difficult and frequently devolves into presumptions of ill-will rather than fidelity.

[Anonymous No.16748468]

>>16748431
Yes, there's a problem with Chink culture, and when you remove the Chinks the whole "commie famine mass-murder worse than Hitler" fantasy collapses under itself.

[Anonymous No.16748986]

>>16748144
America was founded as a secular state.

[Anonymous No.16749019]

>>16748054
Lol

[Anonymous No.16749040]

>>16748226
A fucking MEN

[Anonymous No.16749066]

>>16748044
lol the biggest problem with food in capitalist countries is that fucking insane levels of people are literally eating themselves to death with over priced and over processed garbage, but that has more to do with liberalism than capitalism

[Anonymous No.16749692]

>>16748044
>but 1% has it all
And the vast majority of the current top 1% of income earners will cease to have it all in the span of a decade or so, as those in the top whose incomes fall logically will not continue to be the top 1%. There is a difference between statistical categories and actual human beings, and it is extremely uncommon for the same people to remain in that 1% for very long. Yet your words insinuate that the 1% is a prolonged class of elites, rather than just the top earners in a given year.
The perceived goals of capitalism are stability and utilitarianism, not equity in outcomes. The pursuit of equity of outcomes will logically come at the cost of stability and create great inequities in the power to dispense wealth, whereas in capitalism wealth is not dispensed and thus is created separately from political control.
When wealth is created by the masses of uncontrollable forces in the free market, all are made better off by competition stemming from a utilization of individual personal greed to seek lower production costs, and some are therefore made better off than others. In a controlled market, wealth is distributed by an anointed minority in political power, whose knowledge and wisdom are limited by their innate mental capacities as human beings, and thus must take on the grand task of intelligect and wisdom to dispense wealth in the way most benefiting society, a notion virtually every notable economist in the last 400 years would deem impossible, including Marx and Engels. What Marx had which most socialists did and do not have, however, is a formal understanding of economics and the actual systemic incentives and constraints of capitalism.

[Anonymous No.16749697]

>>16749692
>intelligect
intellect*

[Anonymous No.16749712]

>>16747972
4chan brain

[Anonymous No.16749736]

>>16747782
seriously? china has a mind-bogglingly rich artistic tradition going back thousands of years. literally back to the earliest traces of human writing.

[Anonymous No.16749745]

>>16747940
the chinese R&D behemoth is absolutely and very easily going to overtake the US in this century. half their politicians were trained as engineers, technological innovation is one of their core national values.

[Anonymous No.16749749]

>>16747549
Sowell threads and the imbeciles who post in them can suck my dick if they're so interested in how "seductive" socialism is

[Anonymous No.16749821]

>>16747549
His name is literally 'tom' . https://www.instagram.com/defectedmelody/

[Anonymous No.16749855]

>>16749736
Not only that, there is a really vibrant contemporary art scene in China as well. It just doesnt make it out of the country because of things like the great firewall .