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File: 79 KB, 850x400, quote-one-of-the-things-that-makes-wittgenstein-a-real-artist-to-me-is-that-he-realized-that-david-foster-wallace-30-57-74.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
16677198 No.16677198[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Solipsism is literally the most logical philosophical theory

>> No.16677246

It's still wrong, though.

>> No.16677253

That's why I invented it

>> No.16677256

Wittgenstein's solipsism theory is so underdeveloped it is pathetic.

>> No.16677261

>>16677198
No it's not, it's just as valid as anything else.

>> No.16677278

>>16677198
No philosophy is the most logical, as it would imply there is one to be the most logically correct now and forever.

The fact is we're all wrong, its just different ways of being wrong.

>> No.16677285

>>16677278
Check mate.

>> No.16677292

can you elaborate on Wittgenstein's solipsism theory?

I read Markson's Wittgenstein's Mistress (which DFW writes a pretty dense intro) and the entire book is about solipsism (a woman who believes she's the only person left on Earth) but didn't really connect it to Wittgenstein in a clear way

>> No.16677309

we are all alone with whatever lies outside the world, whatever lies outside of language.

>> No.16677320
File: 189 KB, 1023x1638, Wittengenstein_-_Tractatus_Logico-Philosophicus,_1922.djvu.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
16677320

>>16677292

>> No.16677435

>>16677320
Absolutely based:

"It is better to cherish the notion of an ego-substance than to entertain the notion of emptiness derived from the view of being and non-being, for those who so believe fail to understand the fundamental fact that the external world is nothing but a manifestation of mind. Because they see things as transient, as rising from cause and passing away from cause, now dividing, now combining into the elements which make up the aggregates of personality and its external world and now passing away, they are doomed to suffer every moment from the changes that follow one after another, and finally are doomed to ruin."

>> No.16677454

>>16677278
Do you commit to this philosophical doctrine and does that mean it's wrong somewhere?

>> No.16677704

>>16677198
skepticism is the most logical philosophy from a non all knowing standpoint.

but logic itself isnt the determinor of truth as at some point logic is useless in understanding the qualities of reality (the circumstances responsible for logic's existance couldnt have been logical)

>> No.16677730

>>16677198
And the fact that I can verify by my experiencing of qualia that I am as real as you are, if not realer, shows the inherent error of a worldview founded on a so-called "pure logic."

>> No.16678060

>>16677730
>the fact that I can verify by my experiencing of qualia that I am as real as you are
lmao
Oh yeah? Then do it right now. I'm waiting for results.

>> No.16678069

>>16678060
My results are visible only to me, as yours are to you. You are the illusion. Prove otherwise, fag.

>> No.16678081

>>16678069
Nah, you are the illusion and so am I. Prove to me you're having this experience.

>> No.16678105

>>16678081
As before, it is transparently, intuitively, and instinctually true that we both are real- yet neither of us are capable of proving this to the other by the simple singular nature of the qualia we experience.
The only meaningful argument against a solipsist is to kill him, and in doing so prove that reality can happily exist independent of his masturbatory delusions, but civilization and law prevent us from implementing this simple fix.

>> No.16678242

>>16678105
First and foremost, you have to define what is real. What separates illusion from reality? Go on.
Second, you have to define how you have your experience and what you actually experience.

I can tell you're just vomiting words and you'll see it in a minute. Go on.

>> No.16678954

>>16678242
I cannot explain self-evident truths to a mental defective incapable of holding them.
Go on and die, you self-centered snake.

>> No.16679024

>>16677198
Proclaiming solipsism on a forum shows you don't know what it is (like 95% of people who use the word)

>> No.16679069

>>16678954
Self-evident because you said so? Do your words convince yourself of your perception of reality? In this case you're proving the case of solipsism.

>> No.16679081
File: 23 KB, 409x397, 1599617988093.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
16679081

>>16679069
>>16678954
You both don't exist, just projections of MY mind.
Owned

>> No.16679118

>>16679081
"I" don't exist, that's for damn sure. Thank God "Me" does not exist.

Now, do you?

>> No.16679140

>>16679118
I n I

>> No.16679156

>>16677198
If solipsism is true, why are you awkward around women? If you're the only one who can think, why do you care what women think of you?

>> No.16679168

>>16679156
Because I see them naked in my mind and superimpose kawaii uguu personalities that appeases to my delusions.

>> No.16679268

>>16677278
Then you admit you're wrong and the first sentence you asserted is false?

>> No.16679290

>>16679268
He's admitting both him and you are wrong in some degree. Now, can false be an absolute?

>> No.16679316

Is it not fair to assume that conscious experience is the same for other people?

>> No.16679331

>>16679069
>proving the case of solipsism
Nigger, I exist, and you exist.
This simple statement disproves solipsism. If you distrust your senses to such an extent that you consider the world itself to be one of your imaginings, you may as well commit suicide right now.

>> No.16679401

>>16679331
>Nigger, I exist, and you exist.
Oh yeah? All I see is a text saying me and you exist. Where is your "you" and my "me?" Show it to us.
>This simple statement disproves solipsism.
And I guess if I say I'm a woman I'm a woman. Does that satisfy you?
>If you distrust your senses to such an extent that you consider the world itself to be one of your imaginings, you may as well commit suicide right now.
Funny how you admit things in a manner that requires emotional superimposition for it having any effect whatsoever. You say it's self-evident, but you must make a forceful statement in order to "prove" it. Isn't that strange?

Now, what distrust of senses means? Because if you need faith in your senses, then something is going on and you haven't noticed. Is it self-evident or does it require faith? Do YOU trust your senses all the time? Where does this discrepancy come from? Why such doubts even arises in our minds?

>> No.16679402
File: 31 KB, 429x547, jesus_laughing21.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
16679402

>>16677435
>mfw dualists and vulgar materialists actually die in real life when their phenomenal is destroyed

>> No.16679586

Dfw is such a meme

>> No.16679670

>>16677198
>logical when it's based on the false idea you hold an intrinsically higher value and importance than others

>> No.16679686

>>16679670
Pssst, anon.

There's no you.

>> No.16679694

>>16679316
If you and your twin brother live in in the same household all your lives, one becomes a doctor and the other rock star, then clearly you both have a different consciousness that lead up to it.

>> No.16679700

>>16679401
If you were really a solipsist, you would see no value in arguing with a simulacrum.
In speaking to me, you acknowledge my realness, and in speaking to you I do the same, except on purpose because I'm not a fucking retard so brain-damaged by material reductivism that I doubt even my constant and thus proven experience.
The only compelling argument against you, to reiterate, is to kill you, and mocking you will do until I have the chance to end your simpering attention-whore "philosophizing" permanently.

>> No.16679725

>>16679700
>If you were really a solipsist, you would see no value in arguing with a simulacrum.
Why not? Humans love masturbation.
>In speaking to me, you acknowledge my realness, and in speaking to you I do the same, except on purpose because I'm not a fucking retard so brain-damaged by material reductivism that I doubt even my constant and thus proven experience.
I talk to myself all the time.
>The only compelling argument against you, to reiterate, is to kill you, and mocking you will do until I have the chance to end your simpering attention-whore "philosophizing" permanently.
There's no death and no "myself" to die. But you can believe you're going to die if want to--the REAL "you", that is.

>> No.16679738

>>16677198
>all in my head
>I exist because my mind exists
>my mind has the power to create the entire universe
>somehow experience similar experiences to other people who should be constructs of my mind

>> No.16679774

>>16679738
There's no "my head," anon.

>> No.16679782

>>16679774
It's a figure of speech

>> No.16679871

>>16679024
Isn’t the idea “we can’t prove an external world” rather than “there is no eternal world”?

>> No.16681015

>>16677198
proofs???

>> No.16681832

>>16677198

How much pretentious shit can you pack into one sentence, DFW?

>> No.16681857

>>16679725
>Why not? Humans love masturbation.
You mean YOU love masturbation, fucking coomer

>> No.16681866

>>16677253

>> No.16681870

guess i just wont be logical then

zeeplbe peep bop-bux

touchdown, rationalist

>> No.16681884

>>16677198
DFW— one of the most solipsistic writers of Generation X disses solipsism. Denial much, Dave?

>> No.16681943
File: 2.97 MB, 200x150, 1360975167727.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
16681943

>>16677253

>> No.16682038

>>16681884 yeah, he was always worried about our inability to ever truly connect with one another. i don't think there's any denial going on and you didn't happen in on any self-contradiction-- it just so happens that those topics on which he focuses in his writing also happen to really bother him quite a lot.

>> No.16682260

>>16677198
>>16677253
>>16677256
>>16677261
>>16677278
>>16677285
>>16677292
>>16677309
>>16677320
>>16677435
>>16677454
>>16677704
>>16677730
>>16678060
>>16678069
>>16678081
>>16678105
>>16678242
>>16678954
>>16679024
>>16679069
>>16679081
>>16679118
>>16679140
>>16679156
>>16679168
>>16679268
>>16679290
>>16679316
>>16679331
>>16679401
>>16679402
>>16679586
>>16679670
>>16679686
>>16679694
>>16679700
>>16679725
>>16679738
>>16679774
>>16679782
>>16679871
>>16681015
>>16681832
>>16681857
>>16681866
>>16681870
>>16681884
>>16681943
>>16682038

I'm such a retard

>> No.16682453

>>16682260
Yes you fucking are. Why do you say that, though?

>> No.16682473

>>16677198
perhaps so but why so much faith in logic

>> No.16682495

>>16677278
then you're a solipsist...

>> No.16682508

>>16677253
based

>> No.16682510

>>16677253
fucking got me

>> No.16682559

>>16677253
nice

>> No.16683780

>>16677253
Yeah, im thinking I'm based

>> No.16683861

>>16677198
You cant prove you exist....