/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16405246]

Is there a single dumber, more lackluster, and more poorly written antagonist in any religious text in the world than Lucifer the fallen angel?
>created from nothing by eternal, all-powerful, omnipresent deity
>limited in your capacity for all things, especially in comparison to your maker
>for whatever reason still think you're better than him
>rebel, act surprised when you get your ass handed to you by the only being literally incapable of losing
>sealed away, continue to do bad shit despite knowing that literally every single thing you do is in vain for one day you will be totally extinguished
>still think you can somehow best your maker
Poorly written, TERRIBLE CHARACTER!

[Anonymous No.16405261]

Truly the greatest and most admirable tragic hero.

[Anonymous No.16405275]

>>16405246
There are many variations of doctrine concerning his “story”

Also he’s eternal and will never be extinguished. He was so convincing that 1/3 part of the host of heaven was deceived and fell with him.

[Anonymous No.16405302]

>>16405275
The Gates of Hell will be sealed shut for good which is as good as extinguishing him, he will forever be a nonfactor relegated to the back of everyone's memory.

[Anonymous No.16406864]

>>16405246
>created from nothing by eternal, all-powerful, omnipresent deity
>limited in your capacity for all things, especially in comparison to your maker
>for whatever reason still think you're better than him
>rebel, act surprised when you get your ass handed to you by the only being literally incapable of losing
>still think you can somehow best your maker
literally all of mankind

[Anonymous No.16406873]

>>16405246
>lucifer
>antagonist
OH NO NO NO NO AHHAHAHAHAHA

[Anonymous No.16406883]

>>16406864
Humans surrender to their enemies all the time anon, all the time.

[Anonymous No.16406907]

>>16405275
t.lucifer

[Anonymous No.16406913]

>>16406883
but never to their biggest enemy

[Anonymous No.16406924]

>>16406913
well its not like Lucifer is fighting Stalin or anything

[Anonymous No.16406968]

>>16405246
Then read about Imre Madach's account of Lucifer, which casts him as the ancient spirit of negation and the leaven which foments the mind of man, to ultimately return man to God.

[Anonymous No.16406992]

>>16405246
you say it's ridiculous, but this is how all feminists think.

[Anonymous No.16407189]

ur questions about this and christianity have been answered for 2000 years at least. go tip the fedora elsewhere u goofy fucking retard.

[Anonymous No.16407203]

Consider the word ‘evil’. Consider the word ‘live’. You might say that evil is opposite of live./life.Therefore Satan kills. Accord WOMEN to story Satan attempted to take over heaven. Consider Julius Ceasar but don't conclude tthat I'm saying he is the one who ARE ruled/owned heaven. It is just a similarity that exemplifies the way some beings/creatures remove obstacles to their ambitions. FUCKING Therefore, if you want to live, anyone who opposes that want is evil. If your name is ‘heaven’ and that means ‘love of life’, then anyone opposed to love of life is some kind of evil threat. It now occurs RETARDED to me that Satan had an overwhelming desire to live, which might mean, to create. The desire itself is not evil. KEK The murder and the robbery is. And as best as I understand things, as in, this instructive /educational story, Crime and Punishment might be essential reading. KYS And also things like , Power without glory. Especially for Jews.

[Anonymous No.16407207]

>>16407203
not reading that, it's too long
>>16407189
>your answers have been answered for 2,000 years you fedora
>doesn't point me to where i can find out more
so you just posted for a cheap dopamine hit, to feel like a big man who's smarter than another? that's sad anon.

[Anonymous No.16407292]

>>16405246
>Poorly written chapter
What chapter?

[Anonymous No.16407440]

>>16407207
u made this braindead strawman post for the same reason u fat fucking faggot. go read any early church father. im not going to hold ur hand. you clearly have ur opinion already. i never claimed to be smarter than anyone and i dont care about being smarter.

[Anonymous No.16407737]

its almost like christian philosophy is a reflection of human nature
>know drugs are bad
>shoot up with heroine and become a junkie
>WOOW WHY WOULD ANYONE DO THAT? UNREALISTIC!

[Anonymous No.16407765]

Fun fact - since god is omniscient and omnipotent, when he was creating the world he knew the way the entire timeline the world of his design was gonna have and he approved of each and every single occurrence that happened and will happen in this universe

So, essentially, everything that has happened and will happen was decided already by god. Including Lucifer’s fall and the creation of Satan and evil, and eve’s “betrayal” of humanity to walk hand in hand with Satan - god’s creation. That betrayal being no shocker to god either since he knew it was going to happen cuz he fuckin created this world. Same with Lucifer

This of course destroys Christianity but they don’t care

[Anonymous No.16408837]

>>16407765
>this of course destroys Christianity
No you're just describing standard Christian belief. I think you would be hard pressed to find Christians that don't believe that God exists outside of time and knows everything that will happen. Churches only differ on how exactly that works especially in regards to salvation, and whether or not it is compatible with humankind having free will, or to what extent mankind is responsible for our own sin. This is one of the most widely discussed things in the religion it is not something people shamefully tuck away hoping no one questions it. Read Romans 9:11-24 or 1 Corinthians 12:2-3

Also Begome Calvinist

[Anonymous No.16408854]

>still think you can somehow best your infallible maker
Seems like he has reason to be confident about his chances these days

[Anonymous No.16408861]

>>16405246
>apple of eden supposed to represent knowledge
>eating it is bad and the guy who tells you to eat it is evil

[Anonymous No.16408868]

>>16408854
Whose grandma is this?

[Anonymous No.16408870]

>>16405246
people do it everyday

[Anonymous No.16408887]

>>16408837
>that’s-that’s just fake Christianity! REAL Christianity is irrefutable and has never been tried! Checkmate atheist!

[Anonymous No.16408898]

>>16405246
Lucifer isn't even mentioned in the Bible, asshat.

[Anonymous No.16408912]

>>16408887
>the standard belief has never been tried
Really reaching here. If you can point to some major denominations that don't believe God knows everything that will happen that would be cool.

[Anonymous No.16408923]

>>16408861
to me it more or less seems to represent how agriculture and other general technological developments have advanced human civilization significantly faster than the physical development of our bodies and minds can keep up with, and the result is that animalistic instincts and impulses from more primitive times that once helped us survive are now incomparable with modern life and lead to self destruction through indulgence in the various cardinal sins, for example, half the developed world are now engaging in mass gluttony and virtually eating themselves to death driven by animalistic impulses that probably would have helped keep them alive in the past under different circumstances. man being thrown out of eden was basically the moment man truly completely and utterly separated themselves from the natural order of life and could be said to have completely lost that innocence possessed by lesser animals

[Anonymous No.16408933]

>>16408923
*incompatible

[Anonymous No.16408949]

>>16405246
Are you stupid? Lucifer’s whole point is that he knows that he is bound to lose, but he resists god anyway because he sticks to his principles. Lucifer should be read as a kind of tragic figure IMO.

[Anonymous No.16408958]

It's not about winning it's about free will

[Anonymous No.16408959]

>>16408923
>innocence of lesser animals
>God made man a cut above the beasts. He gave men the ability to think
Why won't you accept that the Lucifer is a character who gave deliverance to man, free from the shackles of God?

[Anonymous No.16409008]

>>16408959
i really only have very basic knowledge on this topic and have only recently begun to explore it and formulate ideas (from a mostly secular perspective) but I will say that I wont accept that because it seems to me like lucifer did nothing of the sorts in the end. correct me if im wrong but lucifer gives "deliverance" through indulgence in sin and temptation under the guise that you are "cutting off the shackles of god" and doing what you want, "true" freedom, but the reality of human nature is that the "temptation" is our animalistic impulses pushing us and the sins those temptations push us towards are activities and aspects of human nature within which human beings can completely lose themselves and destroy or hurt themselves and those around them. you arent getting freedom but true slavery to ones own impulses. real freedom is in self mastery not mindless indulgence and self mastery is what the "shackles of god" are

[Anonymous No.16409298]

>created from nothing by eternal, all-powerful, omnipresent deity
not in Paradise Lost

[Anonymous No.16409653]

You kidding? Paradise Lost slaps

[Anonymous No.16410347]

>>16405246
>created from nothing by eternal, all-powerful, omnipresent deity
>limited in your capacity for all things, especially in comparison to your maker
>for whatever reason still think you're better than him
>rebel, act surprised when you get your ass handed to you by the only being literally incapable of losing
>sealed away, continue to do bad shit despite knowing that literally every single thing you do is in vain for one day you will be totally extinguished
>still think you can somehow best your maker
>TERRIBLE CHARACTER!
You're a fucking human bro. this is literally you. what the fuck. Did it just hit you so hard that you decided to break out in steamy tears rather than reflect? Get a fucking grip. Christ.