/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16312633]

I'm writing a book for western muslims to warn them about liberalism and marxism. Any books I should read for inspiration?

.t i'm a muslim

[Anonymous No.16312701]

>>16312633
Ibn taimiya and Salafi literature

[Anonymous No.16312705]

>>16312701
But I'm a Sufi

[Anonymous No.16312711]

>>16312633
Pic muthafuckin' related

[Anonymous No.16312716]

>>16312633
Islam is socialist

[Anonymous No.16312721]

>>16312633
>warn people about liberalism and marxism. Any books I should read for inspiration
just look at how they treat their own

[Anonymous No.16312723]

>>16312716
How can Islam be socialist, when socialist in itself is anti-religion and anti-tradition?
"ooga booga because sadaqah = socialism"

[Anonymous No.16312724]

>>16312633
I drive...

[Anonymous No.16312733]

>>16312721

[Anonymous No.16312750]

>>16312723
Socialism isn't anti-religion. Communism is.

>>16312716
Islam isn't necessarily socialist. Islamism is.

[Anonymous No.16312760]

>>16312750
Socialism, communism, both originate from marxism. USSR was socialist AFAIK.

[Anonymous No.16312766]

>>16312705
Sufism is the hole through wich liberalism seeps into Islam, it's a weak link. if you truly hate liberalism you're ought to become a salafi.

[Anonymous No.16312785]

>>16312760
Plenty of non-marxian socialists existed through the times, particularly prior to the cold war.

[Anonymous No.16312806]

>>16312633
I'm curious about this OP, i don't know much about islam or islamic societies. How is liberalism and marxism infiltrating your religion?
>>16312723
>He hasn't heard of christian socialism.
>>16312760
Wrong. Read more, socialism predates marxism.

[Anonymous No.16312808]

>>16312633
E Michael Jones, all

[Anonymous No.16312825]

>>16312806
Liberals and marxists have corrupted the western muslims with LGBTQ+, feminism, pornography and all the other degeneracies. And since they control the media and social media, they have impact on non-western countries too.

>christian socialism
Implying I want muslims to end up getting cucked and weakened like christians (especially protestants).

[Anonymous No.16312863]

>>16312806
Pic related

[Anonymous No.16312879]

>>16312825
>Liberals and marxists have corrupted the western muslims with LGBTQ+, feminism, pornography and all the other degeneracies. And since they control the media and social media, they have impact on non-western countries too.
You are fucked then. If you still want to try, i would do an historic research showing how they did exactly the same on the west, and using the current state of some of our countries to show what it's going to happen to muslims if they follow this route. You are not going to get this published in the west, tho.
>Implying I want muslims to end up getting cucked and weakened like christians (especially protestants).
I just used the example of christian socialism to explain that anon that socialism has been ideologically linked with religions in the past, is not impossible.

[Anonymous No.16312887]

The problem is that you're trying to do this as a "Muslim" instead of a "whatever-ethnic-group" thing. What is a Muslim? It's a construct rooted in ideals and certain material goods and practices. This isn't to say that there aren't very explicit rules, definitions, etc, but rather that because these can be changed or ignored AT ALL, then they CAN be changed and ignored. Halal becomes a product to be consumed, the Hijab becomes a product to be consumed, Muslim identity becomes a product to be consumed, and there's many varieties. "Queer Shariah" is something that's just on its face absurd, but yet it is a product that will be sold to you.

Biological identity, however, is something that cannot be. You can never be part of a family, or a clan, or a lineage, or whatever, by buying and consuming products. There's a certain structural soundness to these sorts of organizations that is more conducive to building the kinds of larger organizations that prevent the seeping in of Poz. Compare Saudi Arabia, which is a few decades away from legal homosexuality in fucking Mecca, to Iran. What does it mean to be "a Saudi"? To be a subject of the Saudi monarchy. What does it mean to be "Iranian"? A whole fucking bunch of bullshit.

This isn't to say that ethnic identity cannot be bought and sold, but rather, it's harder to do, and it's easier for people and organizations to come along and throw up roadblocks to outside forces buying and selling that identity.

[Anonymous No.16312908]

>>16312633
Abd al-Wahid Yahya

[Anonymous No.16312911]

>>16312633
They won't read it. Are you a convert? Majority of Muslims are too dumb to read this kind of thing

[Anonymous No.16312972]

Qutb already failed 70 years ago
Islam embeds itself wherever it spreads, there's always 'degeneracy' and 'authentic' following, but you guys in the West are still being funded and trained by the Turks, the Saudis, the Qataris etc. Your liberal 'tw*tter' degenerates are a small contingent against a steady core of patriarchical phallogocentric abrahamist beliefs

[Anonymous No.16312974]

You're already too late anon.

[Anonymous No.16313003]

>>16312633
Weird from a guy who's religion demands you to pay at least 10% of your income to be redistributed in the interests of equality.

[Anonymous No.16313008]

>>16313003
Socialism is when the workers control the means of production. Redistributing wealth within a capitalist system is no more socialist than an elected president wearing a crown would be monarchist. It's superficially similar but fundamentally different.

[Anonymous No.16313081]

>>16312701
>>16312766
Salafis are glorified security guards for American interests. It's like saying the Kurds are based.

Useful idiots all around.

[Anonymous No.16313136]

>>16313081
this has nothing to do with politics, we're talking about these idologies as they pretaon to an individual.

[Anonymous No.16313161]

>>16312716
Islam is capitalism with deeply ingrained ethics and empathy.

[Anonymous No.16313170]

>>16313161
Equality and empathy is socialist

[Anonymous No.16313180]

>>16312705
Fucking degenerate then don't worry about warning us about liberalism, you are deviant liberal scum yourself, go dance in circles

[Anonymous No.16313185]

>>16312633
Is that Ryan Gosling?

[Anonymous No.16313202]

>>16313180
ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU ALLAHU

[Anonymous No.16313209]

>>16312723
Socialism is against religion because it IS a form of religion itself. It divides in good and bad people, worships the idea of a strong nanny state and cancels any heretics who dare to critic its teachings. It also turns its followers into complete lunatics.

[Anonymous No.16313215]

>>16313202
More proof of your deviance.

[Anonymous No.16313229]

Watch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFAqQiIVsF8

Read:

https://www.amazon.com/Early-Islam-Capitalism-Benedikt-Koehler/dp/0739197452

https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Islamic-Law-Wael-Hallaq/dp/0521678730/ref=sr_1_2?crid=24MY5GIRRZMB4&keywords=wael%20hallaq&qid=1581939669&sprefix=wael%20%2Caps%2C234&sr=8-2

https://www.amazon.com/Islam-History-Modern-Library-Chronicles/dp/081296618X/ref=sr_1_1?crid=OYDMLUN54BWM&keywords=karen%20armstrong%20islam&qid=1581939561&sprefix=karen%20arm%2Caps%2C231&sr=8-1

[Anonymous No.16313254]

>>16312716
>a 7th century religious movement = a 19th century economic system

[Anonymous No.16313262]

>>16313136
Idiot

[Anonymous No.16313274]

>>16313161
is raping a child a sign of empathy?

[Anonymous No.16313297]

>>16313274
In marriage there is no such thing as rape

[Anonymous No.16313383]

>>16313274
Was normal at the time
Age of consent keeps going up, give it another 100 years or so and finding 18 year olds attractive will be considered pedophillia too

[Anonymous No.16313386]

>>16313297
muslim "empathy"

[Anonymous No.16313391]

>>16313003
Why do people think paying any sort of tax at all equates to being technically invalid with capitalism?

[Anonymous No.16313397]

>>16313383
>give it another 100 years or so and finding 18 year olds attractive will be considered pedophillia too

What a stupid cope. Literal human scum prisoners have greater empathy and ethics than what muslims consider the perfect human being.

[Anonymous No.16313417]

>>16313397
Not a cope, I'm not trying to defend it. Just an observation. Criticizing Mohammed over the age of his wife is a relatively very modern criticism even though Islam's had enemies everywhere since it's inception, and like I said everything indicates that the generally perceived age of consent will keep going up over time.

[Anonymous No.16313470]

>>16313274
Such a flaccid critique. Your great great grandfather probably married a 16 year old.

[Anonymous No.16313502]

>>16313470
>16 is the same as 9

Such a flaccid rebuttal.

[Anonymous No.16313517]

>>16312633
You should warn them about liberalism and educate them about marxism. Marxism is great and offers key insights to how to liberate workers from their oppressive struggle.

[Anonymous No.16313522]

>>16312633
can't wait for the dictators who rule the m*slim world to force liberalism and u tards and to see the mental gymnastics you do to reconcile the contradictions until you become schizos, we are already seeing this with halal bars in mecca and the uae israel stuff. I think we will see the longbeards praise liberal values in their khutbahs by 2030

you are dogs for the powerful, nothing more

[Anonymous No.16313530]

>>16313517
No.

[Anonymous No.16313534]

>>16313530
yes

[Anonymous No.16313535]

>>16312633
I don't know Islam's theology, but the classic work in the west is George Orwell's Animal Farm. In it, the animals on a farm become communist, and rise up against the farmer. In the west we have a tradition of stories told to children called fables in which talking animals act like people in order to communicate truths about adult life in a way that is less inherently terrifying. I don't know if that's universal, but I digress.

The animals are flawed and sinful creatures however, so their rebellion merits them nothing, since the pigs exploit the situation to raise themselves up to become leaders, and eventually, dictators. This part of Orwell's book might translate into an Islamic context even better though. At the end of the book, the pigs have moved into the farmer's former house and are found playing cards with the farmers from the surrounding area. The pigs almost look the same as the other farmers, a metaphor for how communist leaders are the same as capitalist ones at bottom.

[Anonymous No.16313540]

>>16313517
Do not listen to this heathen.

[Anonymous No.16313541]

>>16313534
No.

[Anonymous No.16313555]

>>16313540
>>16313541
Yes. Read Marx, Engels and the people they influenced.

[Anonymous No.16313564]

>>16313555
>shows a pic of india

[Anonymous No.16313567]

>>16313564
Yes.

[Anonymous No.16313571]

>>16313502
What's the difference? Both has reached puberty and well bellow the magical 18 number and illegal in most states which is the basis of your presupposition. Or am I wrong?

[Anonymous No.16313576]

>>16313567
>shows a pic of kurds

[Anonymous No.16313581]

>>16313576
Yes.

[Anonymous No.16313621]

>>16313581
Okay, you can stop posting shia kurds.
There are two type of communist muslims.

1. The secular cultural muslim who like marxism (never read it), because of their "anti-imperialism".

2. The absolute progressive kafir-munafiq schizo's who went full feminism, full LGBTQ+, have non-binary pronounces and possibly piercings/colored hair - who still call themselves muslims, so they can stay in a sort of community.

[Anonymous No.16313639]

>>16313621
>either gay or secular
stfu bootlicking faggot, read instead.

[Anonymous No.16313679]

>>16313639
STFU and stop larping as a muslim.
Anyone who has read the Quran, hadiths and islamic history - knows that this jewish cringe ideology doesn't fit Islam. National socialism, clerical fascism and traditionalism comes WAY closer.

[Anonymous No.16313690]

>>16313254
Socialism isn't from the 19th century, moron.

[Anonymous No.16313699]

>>16313679
>had historical proof that the islamic system worked for 250 years
>cuck marxism still colonized minds of the ummah

[Anonymous No.16313709]

>>16313679
>Islamic socialism is a political philosophy that incorporates Islamic principles to socialism. As a term, it was coined by various Muslim leaders to describe a more spiritual form of socialism.

>Muslim socialists believe that the teachings of the Quran and Muhammad—especially the zakat—are compatible with principles of socialism. They draw inspiration from the early Medinan welfare state established by Muhammad. Muslim socialists found their roots in anti-imperialism.

>Muslim socialist leaders believe in the derivation of legitimacy from the public.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_socialism

[Anonymous No.16313755]

>>16313679
Except there is no compulsion in religion. Read Quran 2:256.

[Anonymous No.16313773]

>>16312633
They're already muslims so that shit would be a step up. Also, "liberalism" and "Marxism" aren't real things anymore and the only thing the proponents of these ideologies are allowed to accomplish is worshipping brown poopyskins and ruining white people's lives.

[Anonymous No.16313791]

>islam offers zakat/welfare distribution
>concludes from this that islam is marxist
>ignores the marxist countries from USSR to Cambodja to China to North Korea etc.
where religions, spirituality and tradition got destroyed and were left with an absolute lack of human soul
>ignores the fact that modern marxists and marxist groups are exactly like that except radically progressive and feminine, being pro-LGBTQ+, pro-feminism etc - which is in absolute contradiction with islam.
>jewish ideology

You can give absolute no argument that Islam is more compitable with marxism than it is with third positionism.

[Anonymous No.16313802]

>>16313709

[Anonymous No.16313884]

>>16313791
>muh religion
>muh lgbt+
>muh jews
Dude, you are so fucking dumb. As far as I know there is only one quote from Marx about religion:
>The foundation of irreligious criticism is: Man makes religion, religion does not make man. Religion is, indeed, the self-consciousness and self-esteem of man who has either not yet won through to himself, or has already lost himself again. But man is no abstract being squatting outside the world. Man is the world of man – state, society. This state and this society produce religion, which is an inverted consciousness of the world, because they are an inverted world. Religion is the general theory of this world, its encyclopaedic compendium, its logic in popular form, its spiritual point d’honneur, its enthusiasm, its moral sanction, its solemn complement, and its universal basis of consolation and justification. It is the fantastic realization of the human essence since the human essence has not acquired any true reality. The struggle against religion is, therefore, indirectly the struggle against that world whose spiritual aroma is religion.

>Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.

>The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo.

And all the progressive lgbt stuff is a product of western society and not inherently part of marxism, and yes marx was a jew but who gives a shit. The Quran is filled with jews.

[Anonymous No.16313920]

>>16312633
Democracy is rule of the people,
A people are a racial and cultural coherent entity,
Most groups that are muslim do not have a race nor a culture,
Therefor most muslims will automatically reject democracy.

[Anonymous No.16314112]

>>16313180
>Chechens are degenerate

[Anonymous No.16314153]

>>16312633
>warn them about liberalism and marxism.
Imagine warning someone about the working class majority seizing property and the means of production from their wealthy plutocratic oppressors.

Also, Marxists are the enemies of Liberals. Why not leave your silly made-up desert faith behind and join the struggle of workers around the world? You'd end up writing a better book too and it would actually be useful.

[Anonymous No.16314159]

>>16313884
No, the LGBT stuff is pretty inherent to Marxism. Every Communist movement always ends up packed to the gills with fags and freaks, until some psychopath creates a religion dedicated to worshiping said psychopath.

Stalin didn't even get rid of all of them, just the dumb ones. Tankies often try to rehabilitate Beria, but I don't see how a literal child-rapist-murderer can be rehabilitated.

[Anonymous No.16314160]

>>16313185
What I came to post

[Anonymous No.16314289]

>>16314153
Made up desert faith
>revived entire civilisation and dynasties where thought and spirit coalesce into beautiful cultures and people
Marxism
>Gay retards coping mechanism

[Anonymous No.16314326]

>>16313571
>Both has reached puberty

Aisha was 9.

[Anonymous No.16314339]

>>16314289
>revived entire civilisation and dynasties where thought and spirit coalesce into beautiful cultures and people

Persians and Berbers doing some stuff. Some Shias in Egypt for a little bit and then it fossilized. Read Spengler.

[Anonymous No.16314383]

>>16312863
>implying that Africans in Somalia wouldn't move to Europe in a heartbeat

[Anonymous No.16314388]

>>16312633
You should read Das Capital

[Anonymous No.16314419]

>>16314339
I mean, I will read Spengler. I heard Decline of The West is quite good but what you said is completely retarded. Probably based his research on orientalists materials which truly are the worst people on earth.

[Anonymous No.16314428]

>>16314326
>Aisha was 9.
Yes.

[Anonymous No.16314561]

>>16314326
Yes

[Anonymous No.16314566]

>>16313517
no

[Anonymous No.16314569]

>>16314428
Eww

[Anonymous No.16314589]

>>16312705
Ibn Taymiyyah is one of the most important Sufi Mystics in history. This orientalist view on Sufis is so fucking exhausting.

[Anonymous No.16314640]

>>16312633
Sorab Amani, Patrick Deneen and their cohort of religious conservatives are putting out content criticizing liberalism from a religious perspective. It's catholic, but I imagine that you could translate those critiques into an Islamic context.

[Anonymous No.16314767]

>>16314289
>Marxism
>Gay retards coping mechanism
What a sound, constructive, rational and thoroughly stated argument. I would expect nothing less than such convincing intellectual prowess from /lit/.

[Anonymous No.16315069]

I'm pretty sure they have a handle on it already. I was pretty dismayed to see all the commies in Turkey though

[Anonymous No.16315208]

>>16313003
Where did you get that number? It's 2.5%

[Anonymous No.16315293]

>>16313571
>>16313297
Pedophiles like you deserve death by a slow chainsaw.

[Anonymous No.16315383]

>>16312705
>>16312766
>>16313180
>>16314589
In general some of the most influential, orthodox and serious Muslims in history have been Sufis. Sufism is a broad term, and the most concrete definition you can give to its application historically is the various orders that traced their lineage to Muhammad, Ali, or Abu Bekr that are known as Sufi orders. Frequently having esoteric rites, rituals, and withheld knowledge all their own for their respective brotherhoods, and practicing such things as saint worship which even at the time many Muslims with differing interpretations of what was considered idolatry had an issue with.

The point is the modern association of Sufism as liberal is a fairly recent thing, it only started in the 20th century when you had a wave of figures calling themselves Sufis, some of them knowing genuine masters in the link of successors of various orders through the ages, finding ways to market Sufism to a new western audience. It would be too simple to say that Sufism isn't Islam just as it would be to say all these various liberal practices are Islam. Historically Sufis absolutely were practicing Muslims, and for the most part this holds true today.

The Naqshibandi order has been responsible for many political acts of violence over the years, and the scholar Ibn Arabi is near universally considered by Muslims to be a great seminal scholar. (except Wahabis/Salafis which hate everything, and only exist to mame and kill in cooperation with the US and destroy important historical sites, even homes of the Prophet, family and companions. (sallalhu aleyhi wa salam.) As Shaykh Noorudeen Durkee (RA) said, they would destroy the Prophet, Salatu Salam, himself if they could.

[Anonymous No.16315635]

>>16312633
The Looming Tower

[Anonymous No.16315716]

>>16313541
cum town

[Anonymous No.16315729]

[Anonymous No.16316689]

>>16315383
>except Wahabis/Salafis which hate everything, and only exist to mame and kill in cooperation with the US and destroy important historical sites, even homes of the Prophet, family and companions. (sallalhu aleyhi wa salam.) As Shaykh Noorudeen Durkee (RA) said, they would destroy the Prophet, Salatu Salam, himself if they could.

this guy gets it

[Anonymous No.16317073]

Abdal Hakim Murad already wrote a book about this earlier this year.

[Anonymous No.16317428]

>>16312825
they disrespected the word of god so much
i dont even have words what the fuck
allah save us