/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.16277334]

After reading pic related, I am fascinated with authors that see civilizations/countries/movements/religions as organisms.
Pls post more authors or books like this.

[Anonymous No.16277349]

Do a google search for “super organisms social theory”

[Anonymous No.16277357]

>>16277349
whats a google

[Anonymous No.16277368]

>>16277357
A super organism

[Anonymous No.16277469]

[Anonymous No.16277509]

>>16277334
Toynbee
Yockey

[Anonymous No.16277517]

>>16277334

[Anonymous No.16277557]

>>16277349
i gave your mom a super organism

[Anonymous No.16277678]

>>16277334
just read history books and apply the spenglerian method

>>16277509
>>16277517
retards

>>16277469
good book, not similar to spengler at all

[Anonymous No.16277801]

>>16277334
GIambatista Vico "new science" this book is a critique of descartes, rationality and "scientism"... apparently at the time of descartes the study of history was seen as an inferior subject, the mindset started to be : ""ancient peoples and religion were not driven by rationality so they are not worth studying, now we have science""... thats where the title of Vico's book comes from a new science of history, and I think Vico was proven right that pure rationality is not and it will not be the final driving force of history


>"even primitive theology gave birth to brilliant nations, for no nation has ever been founded on atheism"
Giambattista Vico

here's an excellent vid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8swo4fvHU4Y

[Anonymous No.16279160]

bump

[Anonymous No.16279187]

>>16277334
>authors that see civilizations/countries/movements/religions as organisms.
>Pls post more authors or books like this.
Deleuze, Land, Wiener, etc, etc, etc.

[Anonymous No.16279489]

>>16277334
Toynbee

[Anonymous No.16280088]

>>16277557
Thanks dad

[Anonymous No.16280330]

Culture of Critique

[Anonymous No.16280346]

>>16280330
Based
People still aren't reading it though

[Anonymous No.16280367]

>>16279489
Yeah he has a similar model of civilizational phases.

[Anonymous No.16280384]

>>16277334
They aren't, ignore rationalism. There is no progress or health to culture, only change. Also fuck your weak ass Spengler, read Junger and Schmitt instead.

[Anonymous No.16280398]

>>16280384
gay

[Anonymous No.16280399]

Othmar Spann was a contemporary of Spengler's and wrote about similar things

[Anonymous No.16280412]

Leo Frobenius

[Anonymous No.16280444]

>>16280384
Junger and Schmitt were both more pessimist as to the fate of their nation than Spengler, by virtue of actually being alive to see its downfall. Be truthful, you've never read any of these people have you

[Anonymous No.16280445]

>>16280412
Frobenius is not a retard though so unlike spengler

[Anonymous No.16280519]

>>16280444
Read a lot of Junger which was awesome. His pessimism is two wars, his son's death, his son's suicide, and having no friends. He only gave a shit about culture when he thought we could get le based futurism, which never happened. In fact the contribution of eumeswil and his metaphors gave me the impression that we shouldn't worry about changing our things too much and find promise in nature and bystander intellectualism. Schmitt I tried to read the concept of the political but put it down for now. Never read Spengler because he's a fag, as with almost all thinkers. Just read anthropology or art bro, thinkers don't know shit about culture unless they're creating something sublime (which spengler did not).

[Anonymous No.16280531]

>>16280519
>never read spengler
>still feels like he can have an opinion on him

[Anonymous No.16280574]

>>16280519
The absolute state of the "based and redpilled" community

[Anonymous No.16280590]

>>16280531
OP hasn't even read Spengler, so I don't feel I owe this thread a scholarly contribution. And yes because I don't value intellectuals, especially if they're balding. A man's worth is defined by his hair.

[Anonymous No.16280593]

>>16280519
Junger had lots of friends, he was extremely popular throughout his life and he never stopped writing letters until he died, stop projecting your own inadequacies onto a great man. His outlook was never predicated on being an angry incel

[Anonymous No.16280650]

>>16280593
>outlived literally everyone
He wasn't angry or an incel, but he has an eternal tear in his eye (as with most elderly) for the people who are no longer in his life. He is undoubtedly depressed, especially with his son's suicide, yet lived with it and was jovial at times. I'm not projecting, just listen to him:
https://youtu.be/NJPglTJUhiM

[Anonymous No.16280709]

>>16280650
Sure buddy *blocked*

[Anonymous No.16280839]

>>16280519
>decline of the west is 80% an art history book
>repeatedly slaps you over the head with the idea that history can only be interpreted through poetry
>thinkers don't know shit about culture unless they're creating something sublime (which spengler did not)
>Never read Spengler
>no shit

[Anonymous No.16281418]

>>16277801
based

[Anonymous No.16281458]

Sloterdijk is the best answer, by far. "Globes" is his macrohistorical masterpiece, but it helps if you read it as part of the trilogy. If that's too intimidating you can also start with Critique of Cynical Reason.

[Anonymous No.16281881]

>>16277334

[Anonymous No.16282259]

Where are you even supposed to buy a good copy of this shit? On Amazon all they have is either really expensive or abridged.

[Anonymous No.16282426]

Somewhat related

[Anonymous No.16282514]

>>16277801
Where can I get this book

[Anonymous No.16282529]

>>16280346
I keep putting it off

[Anonymous No.16282714]

>>16277334
The Annales school of history is great.
1,000 years of non-linear history by DeLanda and the Mediterranean by Braudel are great pieces.

[Anonymous No.16283770]

Is the artkos upcoming a new translation or thold when which can be found online?
I really like the old translation and want a physical copy of that, are there any good versions to buy, any online store links?
Google would not let me see list of new publishers.

[Anonymous No.16283903]

>>16283770
I think its just a reprint, Artkos is jewish so its gonna cost a million dollars

[Anonymous No.16283906]

>>16277334
I stalled on page 8 with all the talk about negation of time and polar not periodic pasts.

[Anonymous No.16283911]

>>16282514
https://www.bookdepository.com/search/New-Science-Giambattista-Vico-David-Marsh-Anthony-Grafton/9780140435696

[Anonymous No.16283964]

>>16279489
>Toynbee

As in the father of the Guardian columnist. Funny because she is probably the dumbest person in English political commentary, which is saying something.

[Anonymous No.16283977]

>>16281458
Does he really have an organismic philosophy? I found Cynical Reason boring as shit

[Anonymous No.16283981]

>>16283770
I got a 1932 English print off abebooks for 50 europoors

[Anonymous No.16283993]

>>16283903
The first unabridged translations of The Decline were published by Alfred Knopf (pic related).
>I think its just a reprint
It's almost certainly not.

>>16283964
The grandfather of Polly Toynbee, actually. The son of Arnold, and father of Polly, was Philip Toynbee, a communist who wrote for the Observer.
Arnold himself was not a communist. He had a particular definition of "proletariat" which included anyone disenfranchised by the current political powers - such as would include the disenfranchised Russian aristocracy upon the ascendance of the Bolsheviks. This is clearly not a definition any Marxist would use.
When I first began reading Toynbee, I was under the impression that his thesis was primarily one of recurrent cycles, not really going anywhere in the grand scheme of things. In this respect, Toynbee would differ from Marxists who see an end goal and an end of the historic process. By about volume 6 of 'A Study of History', Toynbee however re-appraised his thesis and inverted some of the principles, such as he too sees a definite direction to the historic process - but unlike communists, his end of history would be an overtly religious 'Civitas Dei'.
For Toynbee, the creation of an ecumenical religious body in a "Universal Church" was as he saw hit, human history's raison d'être.
You may not agree with everything Toynbee writes, but I recommend reading 'A Study of History' nevertheless.

Don't let the shenanigans of his son and granddaughter colour your opinion of him before becoming acquainted with his own works.

[Anonymous No.16284183]

>>16277334
You will find these videos really interesting:
https://youtu.be/4KkmtxZM8pI
https://youtu.be/B_mvx9jU4nQ
It’s basically some dude talking about his own macroscopic cyclical theory of history in terms of technological development.

[Anonymous No.16285356]

>>16277801
damn, Promethean Gnosis is one the best YT channels out there, also he sounds like a doomer, which is fitting because the type of books he´s talking

[Anonymous No.16285365]

>>16277334
Read Platos Republic