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/lit/ - Literature

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1627529 No.1627529 [Reply] [Original]

Sometimes I wonder why my mom's still lower middle-class if she graduated from an Ivy League school.

Then I remember she majored in Literature.

>> No.1627539

Sometimes I wonder why people think monetary wealth is the only important thing in life.

Then I remember America.

>> No.1627540

>>1627529
Sometimes I wonder why my dad beats me, my brother and my mother.

Then I remember he studied Engineering because he wanted a career that would make him money, even though he isn't happy with his work.

>> No.1627552

>>1627539
I think you might be the only Tripfag I actually like.

>> No.1627570

>>1627540

Except that isn't actually how things work. You actually have to do hard work and learn new things if you want to succeed in life. Anyone can be successful if they put in the effort, study and work hard.
Liberal arts majors like people who study religion and film are only doing that because they're lazy and want an easy 4.0 GPA they don't have to really work for. Too bad it will fuck them over in life.

True story, I have an uncle who grew up hating science. At the time my uncle wasn't good at anything. One day, he ran away from home. And with a little hard work he graduated from Penn with a degree in Chemical Engineering, did a stint teaching at Brown, and now works for a major firm making figures that are over the fucking rainbow. Both he and his family are very content with their lot in life.
Enjoy your little fantasies to justify your liberal arts major ineptitude.

>> No.1627585

>ivy league school

>lower middle class

your ma must be doing something wrong

>> No.1627586
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1627586

>mfw I'm an econ major who enjoy his field of study, so I will likely get a decent job and can fulfill myself with my literary interests in my free time

>> No.1627596

>>1627552
Second, but then again, most are forever on the ignore list.

Also there is only one thing that matters in life. And thats self-made goals, therefore this argument is impossible and this thread is over.

>> No.1627598

>>1627570
Most liberal arts majors are lazy bums. There have been plenty of people who've gone on to succeed with their liberal arts degrees, and there have been people who've gone on to work at McDonalds with MAs in physics. There are lazy people who will amount to nothing in every subject of study.

>> No.1627601

>lower middle-class
how does she survive?

>> No.1627629

>>1627601

State job lol

>> No.1627652

>>1627629
I Don't think you got the sarcasm in the person's post.

>> No.1627669

PRINCETON IS IN NEW JERSEY

>> No.1627687

Which Ivy?
Dartmouth guy here.

>> No.1627690

>>1627669

THE ARMPIT OF AMERICA

>> No.1627700

>>1627690
More like the smegma afflicted underball area

>> No.1628276

>>1627687

UPenn.

>> No.1628283

>>1627598

People who have MAs in Physics are offered work with everyone from NOAA to fucking CERN right after they graduate.

People with liberal arts can't do much other than work for the state or teach classrooms full of snot-faced eight year olds.

>> No.1628305

>>1628283
I have a BA and MA in Lit. Both are from decent schools but nowhere amazing. I got an internship immediately after my MA program ended, and now I have a decent job working for a publishing company in London. I'm not going to be a millionaire anytime soon but I'm comfortable, get to travel, and I'll bet I get laid a fuck ton more than any physics major.

>> No.1628306
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1628306

>>1627529

>> No.1628334

>>1628283

hahaha oh wow.

>> No.1628340

>>1628283
>People who have MAs in Physics are offered work with everyone from NOAA to fucking CERN right after they graduate.

Are you fucking retarded, son?

>> No.1628356

>>1628305
-What college did you go to?

-Is it difficult getting a job/internship in publishing?

>> No.1628359

>>1628340

I know a man who works as an astronomy professor, is a veteran of his nation's military, knows four languages, writes screenplays, and is pretty much just a fucking genius.
He has an M.S. in Physics from his country's oldest and most prestigious university. His first job right out of college was working on the large hadron collider. He was approached and offered work pretty much the moment he graduated.
I don't see someone like that working at McDonald's.

>> No.1628363

>>1628359
Right, I completely agree that THAT GUY isn't going to be working at McDonald's. But not every Physics MA is THAT GUY. You dig?

>> No.1628367

>>1628359
1/1000 situation. The other 999 people had to put in applications for work, and most wind up getting turned down.

>> No.1628378

>>1627570
>Anyone can be successful if they try hard enough
Good heavens no, where did you get that idea from?

>> No.1628384

>>1628356
Went to Maryland for BA, Leeds (UK) for MA. It's not so difficult to get an internship but you have to decide whether you want to shoot for a big company where you probably wont be doing much or a smaller company (which will def be unpaid) where you get a ton of experience. I went with the small company then got hired by a big one after 6 months.

>> No.1628399

I'm trying to earn a BA from Florida State University but hopefully I can use it to get into a Master's program at Oxford when I'm older, since it's always been kind of a childhood dream of mine to either go there or teach there. I just need to get good recommendations from professors and peers and do really damn well on the GRE.

Does anyone have any advice?

>> No.1628403

>>1628399
Suck dicks for money.
Far more pleasurable.
Easier to succeed and make tons of money.

>> No.1628416

>>1628399
If you want to teach lit at Oxford you should start winning some Pulitzer Prizes / National Book Awards / Nobel Prizes as soon as possible.

In order to go there for your MA, it sounds like you already know what to do.

>> No.1628418

>>1628384
If I were to get a BA in English or Literature from a top-tier liberal arts college could I get a job at one of the major publishing companies?

>> No.1628426

>>1627570
middle class detected

>> No.1628437

>>1628418

Quite possibly, though a Literature degree just means you know how to read a book and interpret its meaning. A publishing company would probably expect you to have a more general English degree that includes classes that gave you an introductory background in publishing and where you learned how to proofread and edit manuscripts.

>> No.1628439

>>1628426
>He actually believes that the middle class exists
There are only two classes son.
The upper class, and the lower class.
And guess which one you're part of?

>> No.1628449

>>1628437
Thanks for your wisdom. Also, how good is the pay in the publishing industry?

>> No.1628450

>>1628418
Yeah, probably. Depending on what you want to be doing, they usually like people with some experience editing/proofreading and if you can work well with photoshop it's a plus. some work with the school paper looks good too, but don't worry if you haven't done that.

>> No.1628462

>>1628439
The upper class is a fairy tale that the lower class invented so they'd have someone to blame their failures on.

>> No.1628463

>>1628449

>publishing industry

>good pay

Don't count on it. If you want good pay, you're in the wrong field.

>> No.1628473
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1628473

>>1628462
>>1628462

>> No.1628479

>>1628463
Yeah, being a drug lord is better for getting rich.

>> No.1628480
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1628480

>>1628462

>> No.1628694

>>1628479

Or earning an honest living doing something that actually makes a man money.

>> No.1628702

>>1628694
What's wrong with being a drug lord? Christ, you psycho, stop fellating HONEST JOBS MANLY LIKE GOOD OLD AMERICAN VALUES. It's a world of thieves, man, ain't no honest jobs out there.

>> No.1628706

>>1628702

What's so dishonest about drugs? Dishonest drug dealers get guns pulled on them. Honest drug dealers get a steady stream of customers that will keep returning for more business.

>> No.1628712

>>1628706
Drugs ruin lives, bro.

>> No.1628723

>>1628712

No, the weak-willed ruin their own lives. People with no self-control bring about their own ruin.

>> No.1628729

>>1628712
So does booze. So do credit card companies and loan sharks. Fuck that, man. It's a world of crooks and gangsters, there's just some of it society frowns upon and the rest it encourages. Fuck that shit.

>> No.1628732

>>1628723
ikr

they should totally legalize weed brah

you can't even overdose!!!!!

>> No.1628736

>>1628732

Marijuana isn't really a drug that ruins lives, seeing as it's not physically addictive. That's more heroin, cocaine, methamphetamine.

But you'd know that if you had any life experience outside of those Above The Influence commercials.

>> No.1628741

>>1628729
Well, booze in moderation won't kill you. And I never said that the credit companies and loan sharks weren't dishonest.

>> No.1628751

>>1628741
Neither will drugs in moderation

>> No.1628752

>>1628751
What is the point of drugs in moderation?

>> No.1628754

>>1628752
The same as the point of booze in moderation.

>> No.1628755

>>1628752
*if taken in

>> No.1628758

>>1628752

Drugs in moderation won't kill you. It is important to still keep a few of your wits about you.

>> No.1628761

Exactly. People go to Ivy schools thinking a degree grants automatic status but it doesn't mean shit.

>> No.1628762

>>1628754
What exactly is moderate drug use? Drugs are consumed to reach a high. That isn't the case with all alcohol consumption.

>> No.1628767

>>1628762
So are you saying that getting drunk is wrong? Or that you can't get moderately high, the same way you can get buzzed or tipsy?

>> No.1628791

>A study completed in the late 1990s by Princeton economist Alan Krueger and researcher Stacy Berg Dale concluded that Ivy League graduates are better paid than others, but not because of what they learned in school, or even alumni connections. It's just that elite colleges select students for such characteristics as intelligence and drive, which also relate to earning potential. The study found that students who graduated from Ivy League institutions earned about the same as graduates with similar abilities who went elsewhere.

>The Post Hoc fallacy derives its name from the Latin phrase "Post hoc, ergo propter hoc." This has been traditionally interpreted as "After this, therefore because of this." This fallacy is committed when it is concluded that one event causes another simply because the proposed cause occurred before the proposed effect.

>> No.1628811

better question seems to be, what is wrong with society.

>> No.1628824

>>1628811

There seems to be a lot of people who identify that society is flawed, and many still who can identify precisely where this imperfection lies, but absolutely no one who is willing to do anything about it.

>> No.1628827

>>1628824
yap yap. does not make it less true though.

>> No.1628830

You both are implying society can be defined, that it somehow is a being unto itself and that there can be anything wrong with it. In the end, it's all subjective whims and desires. Go ahead. Fight over them.

>> No.1628843

>>1628830
>implying society can be defined, that it somehow is a being unto itself and that there can be anything wrong with it
>In the end, it's all subjective whims and desires
hey look, someone who doesn't have the slightest clue of what they're talking about

>> No.1628852

>>1628843

Are you implying that ">>1628830" or ">>1628824" haven't the slightest clue what they're talking about? Please clarify.

>> No.1628854

>>1628843
d&e you should read ruth barcan marcus. one of the bestest
i love her

http://punzel.org/Docdump/MR/Marcus-MoralDilemmasAndConsistency.pdf

>> No.1628859

>>1628762
>implying alcohol isn't a drug

>> No.1628865

With the current modes of production productivity does not contribute to our need. Rather, it contributes to our consumption of material goods.
The utopia of work may no longer present a viable solution for current societal ills. Liberation lies in the divorce from work and the reclamation of free time.

>> No.1628880

>>1628865

>implying that consumption of goods isn't a "need"

>> No.1628887

>>1628880
You misunderstand. The majority of the goods we consume cannot be classified as a "need". The need is not to ourselves, but to the health of our system of economy.

>> No.1628895

>>1628887
Who are you to tell people what they need and don't need? The difference only exists as an element of our reasoning, and not in reality anyway.

>> No.1628903

>>1628895
Who are you to say I'm wrong? EHUEHEUEHUEHEUEHUEHEUHEU ._.

>> No.1628906

>>1628887

We are dependent on our system of economy. Our system of economy is dependent on consumption of goods. Therefore, we are dependent on consumption of goods. Bare in mind, I use "we" as the collective identity, not the collective existence.

>> No.1628920

>>1628906
I am not denying that.
For our current system of economics (of both the established left and right) we cannot survive without the consumption of goods. However, that is not to say that humanity itself cannot live without the system.

Just as the traditionalist system fell to the industrialists, so too will the consumerist system fall.

>> No.1628927

>>1628920

You claimed precisely the opposite of that. And I quote...

>the goods we consume cannot be classified as a "need"

>> No.1628932

>>1628927
>The need is not to ourselves, but to the health of our system of economy.

no, I didn't.

>> No.1628934

>>1628920
Who are you to criticize what people consume? So what if we don't need TV's? We're past the point of a society of needs, we are a society of wants. When even the poor are fat, needs are irrelevant compared to what we want. There is nothing wrong with materialism, the material is all there is. I'm not even talking about the economy, there's nothing wrong with consumption for consumption's sake.

>> No.1628937

>>1628932


Need I repeat myself? We are dependent on our system of economy. Therefore, we need that which our system of economy needs.

>> No.1628942

>>1628934
To quote myself

>Who are you to say I'm wrong? EHUEHEUEHUEHEUEHUEHEUHEU ._.

Yes, yes! We are a society of wants, and rightly so. However, our wants remain in the world of material.
You can, of course, assume the next step.

>> No.1628953

>>1628942
It's not a question of whether you're wrong or not. It's a question of whether anybody cares. Yes, maybe there is a valid distinction, a priori, between wants and needs (there isn't), and maybe you have found it, but what does it matter?

>> No.1628956

>>1628937
Just as the weaver or the merchant was reliant on the traditionalist system to maintain his way of life, no?

People do not end with the revolution of the means of production and system of economy. Rather, it is their way of life that ends and is replaced by a new one.

>> No.1628958

>>1628953
Ideas exist so way may force them on each other.
Therefore, it matters because I say so.

>> No.1628962

>>1628956
As our system of economy changes so do our needs.

>> No.1628966

>>1628854
thanks onion

Needs are a construct of the capitalist system and intrinsic to consumer society.
To have proclaimed the existence of needs is to have assented one's viewpoint implicitly to the consumer society.

>> No.1628967

>>1628962
Indeed! Therefore, we may perhaps be able to live only within physical need and turn our want towards the pursuit of knowledge!

>> No.1628972

>>1628966
I believe it was the greeks who believed a man only to be capable of participation in the political process when he was above the obsession of need.

>> No.1628978

>>1628966
>needs are a construct of the capitalist system
wut

So every need of every kind, including age-old basic physical human needs, are constructs of the capitalist system?

>> No.1628991

>>1628978
Contrary to popular believe, capitalism did exist before Adam Smith formally declared it into being. The merchantry and their modes of trade were at their core a primitive form of capitalism.

>> No.1628994

>>1628991
*belief
ohohoho
silly me

>> No.1629001

>>1628978
You got it, chum. Metaphysical abstractions generated as part of a code of the system of production. There is also no way to differentiate between "wants" and "needs" in this system.

>> No.1629006
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1629006

>>1628991
>fails to distinguish different identification criteria for capitalism aand the issues involved there

>> No.1629012

>>1629006
It seemed to me as though he was implying that the ideas of capitalism haven't existed since the dawn of man.
Watered down in stewing in a large cossacks nutsack, but in existence.

>> No.1629013

>>1629012
okay

>> No.1629019

>>1629001

Is "the capitalist system" the name of some time traveling demi-god? As in pretty much every post of yours I've seen as of yet, you really need to clarify what it is you're talking about at all times. It may seem obvious in your head, but not *everyone* has over-the-internet telepathy.

>> No.1629020

>>1629013
Have you ever eaten Prairie Oysters?
They're actually quite nice.

>> No.1629024

>>1629020
i dont like seafood. unclean for the believers.

>> No.1629026

>>1629020

I may be a tad bit homophobic, but the idea of consuming bull testicles just seems like something I'd never do.

>> No.1629028 [DELETED] 

>>1629024
It's oddly enough cool for a fasting Orthodox Christian.

>> No.1629027

Hey D&E and onion if you guys come to LA I'll have a beer with you.

>> No.1629029

>>1629019
i can map out d&e nicely. he's stuck in logocentrism but a dose of strong logic shoudl slap him out of it. problem is he is too lazy and too proud for it.

>> No.1629033

>>1629024
There is no sea on the prairies.
Prairie oysters come from the animals of the wheat seas.

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
..
COW TESTICLES

>> No.1629035
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1629035

>>1629033
i wouldnt mind if strongly offered. exploration is a part of life.

>> No.1629036

>>1629026
Compared to other food out their, testicles are pretty simple to stomach.

The one thing I just could not for the life of me stomach was balut.

>> No.1629039

>>1629029
I don't understand how he still falls into that sometimes, since he's clearly read things that heavily criticize logocentrism.

>> No.1629040

>>1629035
If you're ever in the edmonton area, I'd be glad to buy you a pair.
>>1629036
*there
I am quite honestly a wreck today.

>> No.1629043

>>1629036

What it because it was a Duck? Were Ducks too cute for you to consume before they were born? I suppose you can think of it as like eating an egg.

>> No.1629045

>>1629028
they're not so bad. if i gave them to you breaded and fried, telling you they were fried mushrooms i doubt you'd know the difference.

>> No.1629050

>many of the richest people in the world never completed college
oh wat do we have here

>> No.1629053

>>1629027
Just one beer between 3 people.

>> No.1629055

>>1629040

HAH! Edmonton. Nothin' but a bunch of sissies who can't stand a little cold weather. You're a disgrace to the prairies. Get out.

>> No.1629057

>>1629043
I have no problem with it being a duck, or a chick
It's the fact I can clearly see that it is so.
Meat we consume does not resemble animals (save fish with the heads on, which come to think of it I can't stomach). You can clearly make out every detail of the chick.

Also, it tasted like ass.

>> No.1629058

sometimes i wonder why my family is middle class despite my dad attending a polytechnic

then I realise he studied something to do with buildings i dont know but its productive at least

>> No.1629060

>>1629055
hahahahahaahahah what's it like living in hicktown

I for one enjoy my life in the Paris of the prairies

>> No.1629061

>>1629043

*was it...

Damn, whatever's going on in here in regards to typos is incredibly contagious.

>> No.1629067

>>1629061
I am truly sorry if you caught it from me.

>> No.1629070

>>1629058

>attended a polytechnic

I have no respect for such people. Nor, I think, does most of society.

>> No.1629071
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1629071

>>1629019
It's just baudrillard, look him up. Don't if you hate the notion of postmodernism.

>>1629029
>logocentrism
>accused of this by Onion
Why can't I hold all this irony

>>1629027
cheers

>> No.1629077
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1629077

>>1629071
why is it ironic.

>> No.1629078

>>1629060

Ever been to Paris, darling? Filthiest and stinkiest city I've ever had the displeasure of visiting.

Saskatoon is not a "hick-town".

>> No.1629080

Sometimes I wonder why im in the top 2% wealthiest people.

Then I remember that I studied industrial engineering and finance and went to work at goldman sachs. After making good friends we went on to make a hedge fund where we handle a little more than a billion dollars.

Now I have time to read as much literature as I want and to write the book I always wanted too. Good thing I actually enjoyed engineering and finance.

>> No.1629082

>>1629070
I dont care, I dont think he does either, hes getting big money working in abu dhabi.

Also he attended what is now leeds met. I'm the only person in my family to attend a real university.

>> No.1629085

>>1629078
I find it funny when people wrongfully label Saskatoon as the Paris of the Prairies.
As if it has culture!

A clean city is the mark of a tasteless one!

>> No.1629086

>>1629078

I like paris

>> No.1629087

>>1628378
Not anyone. But hard work is much more important than genius.

>> No.1629089

>>1629078
Two friends lived in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada. They were sick of winter, so they went to a travel agent and booked a trip to Australia.
When the two friends got off the plane - still wearing their down jackets, wool hats and snow boots - they wandered into a pub and sat down. The locals wondered about these strangers, so one of the Aussies walked over to the visitors and said, "G'day, mates. Where're you from?"
"Saskatoon, Saskatchewan," one of the Canadians replied.
"Oh," said the Aussie, returning to his table.
"So where are they from?" the other locals asked.
"Don't know," replied the Aussie. "They don't speak English."


Also, Paris is clean. Putain ta merde.

>> No.1629096

>>1629089
eheuheueheue I lol'd

but on a serious note
>he's only visited the clean parts of Paris
That's like going to Vancouver and skipping East Hastings!

>> No.1629101

>>1629096

man even the shitty little suburbs of paris are nicer than most cities

aberdeen for example

>> No.1629103
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1629103

>>1629077
Pretty sure you are supposing a fixed, transcendental center in your work somewhere along the lines if you are an empiricist philosopher in the Analytic tradition

>> No.1629105

>>1629085

I could vomit on an average street in Paris and it'd be much, much cleaner than it was, for the vomit would hide all of the indescribable filth beneath it.

>> No.1629109

>>1629096
No man. I've been to other large cities, and Paris is clean. Go visit Manchester in the UK, place is a rubbish tip. Compare London and Paris and Paris is a cleaner. Compare nowheresville, Canada, with the population of a small town, to the capital city of a country is ridiculous at best.

>> No.1629111

>>1629105

but it will still be paris

and you will still be a gayboy

>> No.1629112

>>1629101
>implying the banlieues are nice in any way

>> No.1629115

>>1629109
If you can call Paris clean you quite obviously ignored its poorer areas.

>> No.1629119

>>1629109

Know what? You're completely right.Europe is just filthy in general. Awful, disgusting continent. Valid point, good sir!

>> No.1629120

>>1629109

yeah most british cities are way dirtier than paris. Manchester is probably one of the cleaner ones.

>> No.1629124

>>1629115
>if you call something clean you obviously ignored the dirt
Way to be retarded bro. Read the whole comment, and try and work out a reply. Don't rush yourself.

>> No.1629129

>>1629109

Saskatoon has a population greater than that of a "Small Town".

>> No.1629135

>>1629115

the poorer areas in paris are as dirty as the average northern industrial town in britain. That is to say dirty but not so dirty that I feel uncomfortable

>> No.1629140

>>1629129
Maybe marginally. But less than 250,000 is nothing, seriously. Paris has over 10,000,000 people.

>> No.1629144

>>1629140
2,000,000, not 10.

>> No.1629279

>>1629103
NOPE.
i am kicking that away in my magnum opus forthcoming etc. this still preserves all the nice things about realism essentialism etc. linguisic philosophy is mostly a mistake but it did uncover some nice things.