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/lit/ - Literature

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16265901 No.16265901 [Reply] [Original]

Adorno: Capitalism is destroying our traditional culture.
Modern Right-wingers: Marxism is destroying our traditional culture.
Who is right?

>> No.16265978

>>16265901
I: technology is destroying traditional life

>> No.16265990

>>16265901
Both are.

>> No.16266007

Bit a both innit

>> No.16266041

Both destroy it in different ways.

>> No.16266254

>>16265901
adorno, although what modern rws notice is the same thing, they just need to maybe use more accurate terms. capital basically just uses marxism and marx-influenced ideas as controlled opposition to make elements of society they dont like (unions, currently police unions, small business, rural communities hollowed out by trade deals etc) weaker. but it's still the same people in control. most marxist revolutions ended very poorly but they did change who was in charge, in the west this stuff is just being used to keep the proles distracted with idpol and not asking real questions ala occupy wall street

>> No.16266263

Adorno: Fascists are homosexuals.
Modern Right-wingers: leftists are homosexuals.
Who is right?

>> No.16266351

>>16266263
both, extreme ideologies attract people who feel alienated by society. gay people will generally be more accepted by the left, while fascism can be a cope for insecurities they have about their sexuality (ie nick fuentes)

>> No.16266360

>>16265901
Ebola was right, capitalism and marxism are different sides of the same coin.

>> No.16266391

>>16265901
why can both not be true

>> No.16266427

>>16265901
>Adorno: Capitalism is destroying our traditional culture.
He was claiming capitalism develops a very inane culture not that "traditional" culture was being "destroyed" just not profitable. He thought Mozart was better than Jazz for technical reasons not because something old is good

>> No.16266435

>>16266351
as a nazi and a former homosexual let me offer a third view: nobody knows how fundamentally unfulfilling homosexual relationships are than somebody who's actually had one. without children, there's simply no commitment. for the leftist, that's okay because commitment just gets in the way of carnal pleasures, for people who want more than that, it's an insurmountable barrier to condoning and accepting homosexuality

>> No.16266442

>>16265901
Adorno.
Marxism died 30 years ago. All of the modern “Marxists” have the support of capitalist interests and curiously for Marxists care a lot less about seizing the means of production than they do about aggrandising minorities (which reduces cohesion of the workers). It’s more than capitalism specifically though, it’s liberalism. I find it hard to believe that communism, which was almost always intolerant of diversity in sexuality and culture, is responsible for the current love of diversity.

>> No.16266462

frankfurt school were liberals larping as marxists...they should have never written a single word

>> No.16266492

>>16265978
This.

>> No.16266503

>>16265901
I'm right
Me: Marxism is capitalism

>> No.16266587

>>16266435
"former homosexual" do you mean you know longer engage in homosexuality or do you mean that you lost the attraction

>> No.16266735

>>16266263
Both are. Fascism is leftist in many respects.

>> No.16266752

>>16266587
every sexual atraction is a fetish anon. you can psyop youself into liking anything.

>> No.16267050

>>16266752
>every sexual atraction is a fetish
Glad to know that cloppers are just as valid as monogamous Christian couples who didn't engage in sex until after marriage.

>> No.16267107

>>16266254
>occupy wall street
this is the real fucking scandal
funny how all idpol shit suddenly mainstreamed during occupy

>> No.16267548

>>16265901
None.

>> No.16267566

>>16265978
this.

>> No.16268908

Reminder that the frankfurt schools views modernity through the lens of holocaust trauma and does not have good intentions (just look at the work the authors did) The traditionalist school came to the same conclusions and did not revel in it.

>> No.16268923 [DELETED] 

>>16265901
Modern Right Wingers: My 'burbs looks a lot like a farm if i squint and eat lead paint chips

>> No.16268928

>>16268908
sure

>> No.16268969

>>16268908
that's just nonsense, they'd all moved to the united state well before the war started

>> No.16269375

>>16265901
Adorno hit the nail on the head.
Traditional languages, music, and cultures have continued their massive nose-dive in the last 20 years.

>> No.16269476

I'm trying to read the Culture Industry at the moment, but I'm finding it incredibly dull despite being very interested in the general topic. Moving along at a snail's pace, truth be told. Any advice on how to be a bit less of a brainlet?

>> No.16271182

The Authoritarian Personality is one of biggest piles of shit I have ever read. Adorno was not a Marxist but a butthurt liberal.

>> No.16271191
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16271191

>>16265901
Both

>> No.16271209

>>16265901
The Enlightenment is the true root of the cancer. Capitalism does not have to destroy tradition. It is entirely possible to be extremely reactionary and also capitalist, as is the case with Iran.

>> No.16271471

fuck traditional culture only losers care about this sort of thing

>> No.16271542
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16271542

>>16266735
dumb mutt

>> No.16271545

First they came for the capitalists

wait that's not how it goes

>> No.16271551

>>16266435
We all know the right is full of homosexuals. They entire cosmovision is just sucking dicks, eating swords and crosses with their butholes and then praying because they felt pleasure in that. The right is posmodernism, retardation and capitalism at his finest

>> No.16271561

>>16267050
didnt say it was equally valid or of any social equity, just that the stimulus for sexual excitement is moldable.

>> No.16271599

>>16271542
nazism is a subset of fascism. >>16271551
if that is true, and it very well may be, it is only a reaction to the equally postmodern and capital derived aesthetic leftism. I am assured that 80 percent of the “fascists” nowadays are only that in response to the retard flailing of “SJW” or whatever you call it. they litteraly created the alt right from their odious discourse. unironically i think people in general would have been more implicitly leftist if that group didnt spawn a reqction against them by portraying things so obnoxiously.

>> No.16271621

>>16271599
>I am assured that 80 percent of the “fascists” nowadays are only that in response to the retard flailing of “SJW” or whatever you call it.
correct, but that's mostly because fascists drive the SJW/cancel culture/etc narrative really hard in order to recruit impressionable youths

no one who actually leaves the house believes "SJWs" are a problem

>> No.16271633

>>16265901
do you live under capitalism or under communism nigger?

>> No.16271655

>>16271621
Yeah I go to a university in a massive city and there are more people bitching about sjws than there are sjws. Even online it's the same thing, massive right wing content creators make out these fringe opinions to be a problem when they're posted by tiny twitter acounts with like 4 retweets. Outrage sells.

>> No.16271700

>>16271621
>>16271655
idk about them not being a thing. Daily show, black bodies, etc. i dont want to be considered part of the anti-sjw croud, as most of them are just as maxim spewing idpol as the people they criticize, but i understand where the sentiment comes from. literally just turn on the news. I also attend UMASS Amherst, so that doesnt help. though of course, it all depends on what part of society you are more exposed to. in a different situation i would probably be more exposed to /pol/isms, but in my daily life, I am more exposed to “SJW”ism. but like i said, its polemics which feed each other. i just consider the “SJW”s to be the original catalyst in its modern form around 2014 ish.

>> No.16271721

>>16265901
considering marxism isn't in practice anywhere in the world, probably adorno.

>> No.16271734

Capitalism works

Marxism doesn't.

>> No.16271737

>>16271700
Yeah, idk. It's interesting how some people fall pray to extemely dogmatic online ideology though. I don't live in america but I see many of my peers fully latching on to american issues and taking stands about things that aren't even a problem where I live.

>> No.16271751

>>16271621
The issue with mass media is that it can present a small problem as a larger one, i.e. manufacturing consent. Whatever reality that can be seen first-hand isn't always the reality presented through a news lens.

>> No.16271758

>>16265901
Adorno. Maybe this is brainlet shit but Orwell was right when he said communism isn’t anything more than easier to control capitalism.

>> No.16271796

>>16265901
Isn't it about how Enlightment was the starting point of the west civilization decline? Didn't Carlyle and Burke also said so?
>>16266435
>as a nazi and a former homosexual
Cringe but I agree on what you said, glad you dropped the gay side of you.

>> No.16271798
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16271798

>>16266360
Based. Everyone should take the ebolapill

>> No.16271849

>>16265901
Traditional culture was thriving under XIX century capitalism and was destroyed with rising influence of Marxist thought.
Btw, obviously we currently live in a welfare social democracy with just enough capitalism to keep this bordello afloat but not to see the thriving society with rising living standards and distinct moral values.

>> No.16271850

>>16271621
My local government is run entirely by sjws, they ARE a real problem

>> No.16271897

>>16271850
and what exactly are they doing that's so problematic

>> No.16271928

>>16271737
agreed. I prefer pre-2014 general centrist liberalism, faults and all. Things seemed to be less political. people making a game or movie didnt have to hit you over the head with their brave opinion all the time and seemed more authentic. of course, that is probqbly nostalgia speaking. before the modern paradigm there was other polemic issues like pro/anti war, pro/anti abortion, etc. but it seemed less all consuming and people were less likely to assume the worst and just admit they didnt know all that much about it.

>> No.16271943

Neo capitalism does yes which came from Marxism

>> No.16271979

>>16271734
marxism works as a critique of capitalism and maybe a call to reforms. reading marx and some he inspired also led me to spend more time reading and less worrying about the rat race, although i think the whole lindy/bap thing also can help people get to that place

>> No.16271990

>>16267107
That's because it targeted banks, which are the actual seat of power. Marxists can talk about corporations as much as they want and nobody cares, but you can't talk about banks.

>> No.16272046

>>16271928
>people making a game or movie didnt have to hit you over the head with their brave opinion all the time and seemed more authentic
all art, even the commercial kind, has always done the. the definition of normal has evolved and left you behind.

>> No.16272052

>>16266351
No such thing as extreme ideology

>> No.16272144

>>16265901
Both are right. The marxism modern right wingers are criticizing is basically just one iteration of capitalistic mechanisms, which ”deconstruct” traditional ways of life

>> No.16272160

>>16266427
It's not as if Mozart is actually traditional either way.

>> No.16272181

>>16271734
>Marxism as an entity comparable to "capitalism" in terms of working function.
Extreme low IQ, even for /lit/.

>> No.16272252

>>16271621
>no one who actually leaves the house believes "SJWs" are a problem
/thread

>> No.16272266

>>16271621
>no one who actually leaves the house believes "SJWs" are a problem
you and your kind really are more transparent than you think you are.

>> No.16272871

>>16271621
When literally everyone I know is eating up BLM and LGBT nonsense on social media it's hard to not see it as a genuine problem.

>> No.16272899
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16272899

>>16265901

>>16271191
This

>> No.16272987

>>16265901
They are both wrong. The answer is niggers

>> No.16273029

>>16272987
women*

>> No.16273048

>>16272987
whites erased tons of traditional cultures.

>> No.16273102

>>16265901
Ironically they're both right ,the traditional culture will inevitably disappear due to the nature of the modern life style,consumerism and the rise of the radical left,It's a weird union when both capitalism and marxism seek to destroy the tradition.

>> No.16273127

>>16273102
capitalists and leftists both want power, which means reordering society such that they are in charge. The reactionary desire to retain pre-industrial cultural structures is probably futile either way.

>> No.16273181

>>16265901
Both. They just do it differently. Capitalism drowns out and marxism demolishes.