Find the Flaw

[Anonymous No.16225611]

Pro tip you can't

[Anonymous No.16225618]

>>16225611
>they're all pedophiles

[Anonymous No.16225624]

>>16225618
>sources: my ass

[Anonymous No.16225630]

>>16225611
Spengler, Evola and Hobbes is a very specific organisation to construct a "worldview" if that is your intention, but for the fourth figure I recognise his face but have forgotten his name. Is it Heraclitus?

[Anonymous No.16225632]

>>16225630
Epictetus

[Anonymous No.16225634]

>>16225611
Different stages of hairloss

[Anonymous No.16225640]

>>16225624
you're a pedophile, I'm right about it all

[Anonymous No.16225647]

>>16225611
Hobbes' view on human nature is conclusively refuted by the fact that only 15% of soldiers in a given combat situation shoot to kill, and the rest aim high.

Take the whitepill you cringy edgelord fuck, humans are really cool and nice

[Anonymous No.16225653]

>>16225630
Spengler, Evola and Hobbes work together for the worldview, and Epictetus is about hardening up for the painful truths of mundane existence.

[Anonymous No.16225655]

>>16225647
Pic rel

>>16225634
Okay made me kek

[Anonymous No.16225656]

>>16225611
>Evola
A wheelchair-ridden flabby man, simultaneously espousing the view that hierarchy and the strong should reign supreme, while deep into cringy hot-topic goth occultism really is the perfect representation of the permanently online right-winger.

[Anonymous No.16225658]

>>16225655
>more individualistic than social
Darwinism shat all over this idea, regardless that it is often misconstrued to support extreme individualism.
You did not hunt a mammoth individually.

[Anonymous No.16225663]

>>16225656
He fought in WWI and loved hiking in his youth and got paralyzed in an allied bombing during WWII, Ad hom.

>goth
>hot topic
You have to go back

get filtered somewhere else

[Anonymous No.16225664]

>>16225647
>Hobbes' view on human nature is conclusively refuted by the fact that only 15% of soldiers in a given combat situation shoot to kill, and the rest aim high.
Not refuted, it just needs adjustments. So I've fixed OP's chart

[Anonymous No.16225678]

>>16225632
>>16225653
Yes see this is such a short-handed worldview. You need greater men than these wise ones, alas.

[Anonymous No.16225683]

>>16225663
You're under the mistaken assumption that I am making arguments, which very clearly, I am not. I am ridiculing the permanently online right-winger on aesthetic grounds, which is much more fun.

[Anonymous No.16225690]

>>16225647
Humanitarianism is a common power, mongoloid. Hobbes remains unrefuted.

[Anonymous No.16225703]

>>16225690
Which is apparently much stronger than so-called "human nature", and even reigns supreme when the actual, real, Hobbesian common power gives orders that are contradictory to it.

But staying on the topic of human nature, which is what he writes about, you must be saying that Hobbes was a social constructionist, and anytime he writes "human nature", we should chalk it up to some non-essentialist notion of "strong common power at the time", which actually is stronger than the sovereign authority who is telling you to shoot the enemy? This a hill you're willing to die on?

[Anonymous No.16225708]

Ah yes, the "I'm a loser fragile white man who thinks the world is ending" squad. Sad you think these dudes were anything more than delusional hax lol.

[Anonymous No.16225734]

>>16225708
It really is profoundly pitiable, and the fact that my reaction to it has moved from spiritual repulsion to everyday disgust is a testament to the too many hours I've wasted on this tedious hell of a website.

[Anonymous No.16225736]

>>16225708
I hope you get caught up

[Anonymous No.16225744]

>>16225736
With what? Spending the best years of my life reading /pol/ infographics and getting pissed at a simulacrum while wasting away in the pale glow of my screen?

[Anonymous No.16225750]

>>16225632
>>16225647
You know that study was incredible dishonest and falsified evidence, right anon?
You don't just uncritically consume everything thrown your way, right?

[Anonymous No.16225753]

>>16225658
>Darwinism shits all over that idea
It doesn't
>Muh shallow five year old understanding of prehistoric society
Imagine being this retarded

[Anonymous No.16225759]

>>16225658
>MAN WOULDN'T HAVE MADE IT OUT OF THE ICE AGE WITHOUT WORKING TOGETHER IN ORGANIZED GROUPS.
Yep

Also compare a mound of termites to a pack of wild Dogs to a Caveman to a Modern Human. The introduction of cognition and the birth of ideas complicates the social circumstance necessarily as we have adapted/evolved.

There's Things, Actions, and Ideas. Things and Actions make up the Animal kingdom, where ideas aren't applicable. However humans are uniquely bound to ideas, the more different the ideas within a group the less humans can exist in any given state besides war and chaos. High culture (prime symbol) is the manifestation of a single idea to root a people in time and space.

So yeah, saying we're individualistic or social is kind of retarded because we are obviously both, and if one is good and one is bad then you end up with HUMANS ARE EVIL MURDERS WHO BURN NATURE vs HUMANS ARE GODS AMONG THE ANIMALS WHO BEND NATURE TO THEIR WILL. It's really just perspective to make two obvious truths of an object conflict eachother. And yes, I'm agreeing with you, humans are highly social, Hobbes is saying to help root the social in something higher so that the individuals may not ensue chaos amongst themselves.

[Anonymous No.16225800]

>>16225611
>find the flaw
Looks to be three of them.

[Anonymous No.16225809]

>>16225744
/pol/ is just one angle of the problem, Race, Jews and Marxism. Most of them can comprehend most of this stuff, but it never gets talked about because /pol/ is meant to be a fast pasted reactive setting a "breaking news! fuck niggers fuck jews fuck trannies. Hurr durr glowies mutts 1488 !" type of setting. Which can't in and of itself produce vast thoughtful inputs as this board was by design made for.

It's like cocaine and preworkout vs sipping coffee or tea. One is inherently more energized and built for a flurry of impulses, one bears a tame practicality.

"/pol/ is never wrong!" Is true but then again since there's no thoughtful discussion, people turn into asshole dumbasses by trying to think so hard in such a limited environment. I could play a game of chess with my bro anywhere, but it's kind of distracting to do it in a classroom of screaming fighting niggers throwing chairs and writing gibberish on the wall, that's like trying to have an intelligent debate on /pol/.

[Anonymous No.16225811]

>>16225750
No, I didn't.
>You don't just uncritically consume everything thrown your way, right?
No, I don't. Feel free to substantiate with some proofs.
>>16225753
Absolute cringe. Make your argument or shut up.
>>16225759
I agree somewhat with this overall, but I'd contest this:
>Hobbes is saying to help root the social in something higher so that the individuals may not ensue chaos amongst themselves.
Hobbes is clearly using the state of nature to hypothetically say something about essential human nature, and what he has to say is overwhelmingly negative. There is zero reason to believe these hypothetical assumptions about human nature, and indeed, there is reason to reject them, and thus, much of the force and impetus of Hobbes entire political philosophy falls away.
I'm not disagreeing that valuable insight can be gleaned from his writings, I am disagreeing with all the edgelords who take everything he wrote as irrefutable fact, and believe me, a lot of Hobbes fanboys are like this - just look at this thread.

[Anonymous No.16225822]

>>16225708
Look around and Explain to me how western civilization fixes all it's shit over the next 10-100 years.

[Anonymous No.16225836]

>>16225822
>all it's shit
And what would that be?

[Anonymous No.16225848]

>>16225836
>Faustian Cultural exhaustions in every facet of life
>prime symbol/cultural roots being eroded from every direction with no tangible defenses

Ohhnononono

Please stop trolling you fucking idiot

[Anonymous No.16225856]

>>16225848
>>prime symbol/cultural roots being eroded from every direction with no tangible defenses
They’ve been gone for over a century. The popularization of jazz and other syncopated pop music more or less replaces them with the hedonistic body cult we were raised in.

[Anonymous No.16225857]

>>16225811
You didn't actually make any arguements
You just made statements with no proof
Hitchen's razor and what have you
Your statements are completely unfalsifiable anyways, how does one even prove or disprove Darwinism in human history
Can you tell me about the Darwinist explanation of the 1768 soulstealer crisis in China?

[Anonymous No.16225869]

>>16225848
I'm not trolling, and the fact that you think so shows how deep you are in your tiny little bubble.

Some americans tore down statues of confederates, you don't like american rap music, and therefore the west is dead?

This is the closest I can come to reconstruct whatever argument you are trying to make, not because I am trying to be dishonest, but because I literally cannot parse what the fuck you mean from those two lines of text, and I am not part of whatever bubble you are.

[Anonymous No.16225871]

>>16225857
>he didn't make any arguments
Of course he didn't, modern intellectuals think it's all about disproving someones point and then walking away leaving nothing but relativistic academia approved peepeepoopoo unreliable shit positions and understandings none of which they came up with themselves or understand past basic dogma.

[Anonymous No.16225878]

>>16225857
>Hitchen's razor and what have you
Indeed.

[Anonymous No.16225879]

>>16225869
Yes, people who have adopted a contra-western culture are actively destroying the remaining elements of western culture. To anyone attached to the latter in any meaningful way, it is tantamount to the end of the world.

[Anonymous No.16225880]

>>16225611
>placing spergler and ebola next to hobbes and epictetus

[Anonymous No.16225884]

>>16225871
Maybe it's because you didn't actually read any of those authors up there and have absolute garbage as your starting context and just opted for calling everyone you don't like a racist virgin like a typical redditor subhuman that shit's this place up.

>ends conversation with "well guess I'm not part of your line of thinking herpa derp!"

Done replying, fuck off and kill yourself.

[Anonymous No.16225885]

>>16225880
Stoicism is more embarrassing than Evola’s wacky mysticism.

[Anonymous No.16225887]

Oh shit,
>>16225884 meant for >>16225869

[Anonymous No.16225888]

>>16225871
>Of course he didn't, modern intellectuals think it's all about disproving someones point and then walking away leaving nothing but relativistic academia approved peepeepoopoo unreliable shit positions and understandings none of which they came up with themselves or understand past basic dogma.

I am literally the one making the claim that pro-sociality is the more crucial part of intrinsic and non-relative human nature, against Hobbes who is making the claim that belligerence is a more crucial intrinsic and pervasive part of human nature.

We cannot have a discussion if you are incapable of reading.

[Anonymous No.16225891]

>>16225880
>not hiding and ignoring every pretentious anime profile neckbeard sack of shit

[Anonymous No.16225908]

>>16225879
>Yes, people who have adopted a contra-western culture are actively destroying the remaining elements of western culture.
What remaining elements? I see confederate statues being torn down in america, and I do not see how this marks the end of the west. No one has yet burned Shakespeare. No one has torn down the Duomo of Florence. Not a single man or woman has wiped his or her ass with the paintings of the great masters. Literally what the fuck are you talking about? What culture is actively being destroyed?

>>16225884
>Maybe it's because you didn't actually read any of those authors up there and have absolute garbage as your starting context and just opted for calling everyone you don't like a racist virgin like a typical redditor subhuman that shit's this place up.
1) I did none of those things, you're confusing anons 2) granted, my understanding of Evola is limited, but my understanding of the rest is sufficient for a discussion.
>Done replying, fuck off and kill yourself.
This is such a hilarious reply to even the most gloves-on opposition to your view. You're such a fucking baby.

[Anonymous No.16225911]

>>16225888
Can you falsify your claim?

[Anonymous No.16225916]

For me, its Evola and Rousseau

[Anonymous No.16225923]

>>16225891
>a-anime!
everytime

[Anonymous No.16225932]

>>16225908
>I've read Spengler but see no correlations with anything happening today

Dude teach me how to be an annoying prick fucking troll, seriously.

[Anonymous No.16225939]

>>16225911
Potentially, yes.

However, I don't think that discussions of human nature should stand or fall under the auspices of questionable demarcation criteria of scientifc standards, and clearly, neither does Hobbes, which is who I am criticizing, and funnily enough, your angle of attack, were it to be succesful, would not only be devastiting to me, but to Hobbes as well.

What are you discussing? What is your point? It seems like all you're trying to do is get a gotcha in on me, and not to discuss the merits and especially the idiocies of Hobbesian philosophy. Do you spend a lot of time on youtube and twitter?

[Anonymous No.16225941]

>>16225891
>>16225923
also
>profile
way to out yourself twitterfag/redditor

[Anonymous No.16225967]

>>16225932
I've read it years ago and disagreed with it, acolyte. Go ahead and rehearse the arguments, if you please. Saying the words

>Faustian Cultural exhaustions in every facet of life
>prime symbol/cultural roots being eroded from every direction with no tangible defenses

and posting a picture of an american city on fire without further qualifications does not convince me at all. They're sweeping and stupid statements, and you have yet to give a single example from which we can discuss, which should be easy, given that these processes apparently permeate all aspects of culture - to which I countered that with the fact that the cultural roots of the canon of literature, architecture, painting, sculpture, theatre and so forth remains unharmed and are not being eroded.

What are you trying to achieve? You get the simplest opposition, the very bare-minimum question to substantiate, and you start crying. Do you want to discuss or hurl insults?

[Anonymous No.16225971]

>>16225891
brb, gotta sign into my 4chan profile to call this guy a faggot

[Anonymous No.16225977]

>>16225939
I instinctively attack anyone who tries to use Darwinism in an explanative way human history

[Anonymous No.16225998]

>>16225664
based, so now it's Spengler, Evola, Pareto and who?

[Anonymous No.16226017]

>>16225908
>What remaining elements? I see confederate statues being torn down in america, and I do not see how this marks the end of the west. No one has yet burned Shakespeare. No one has torn down the Duomo of Florence. Not a single man or woman has wiped his or her ass with the paintings of the great masters. Literally what the fuck are you talking about? What culture is actively being destroyed?
First we must understand what is signified by tearing down confederate statues. The reconciliation of the north and south as sunken into irrelevance as blacks have for various reasons(the ease which with they create mass-marketable culture, the great deal of social capital they’ve managed to accrue, the need to elevate the local subaltern to succeed in globalist politics, and their existence as the demographic whose turnout alone decides the fate of national elections) become more valuable than southern whites, and whites in general. In the space where the accommodation of the western and contra western are mutually exclusive, the contra-western has triumphed. The other examples you listed are ones where accommodation of of some vestigial aspect of western culture isn’t mutually exclusive from from the accommodation of the contra-western man, but that does not mean that western culture persists in any meaningful way.
We can only relate to to through the perspective of the contra-western tradition. What we know as Shakespeare isn’t Shakespeare, or even Johnson’s Shakespeare, we only know of Shakespeare through the lenses of the Baldwin-Morrison-Lorde literary hegemony and the values it instills within us. The same is true of western depiction of Christ by the great masters, which now make for nothing more than reminder if the villainous whitewashing done by Europeans and a reminder of the urgent needs to make white people worship a non-white god.

[Anonymous No.16226042]

>>16226017
>First we must understand what is signified by tearing down confederate statues. The reconciliation of the north and south as sunken into irrelevance as blacks have for various reasons(the ease which with they create mass-marketable culture, the great deal of social capital they’ve managed to accrue, the need to elevate the local subaltern to succeed in globalist politics, and their existence as the demographic whose turnout alone decides the fate of national elections) become more valuable than southern whites, and whites in general. In the space where the accommodation of the western and contra western are mutually exclusive, the contra-western has triumphed. The other examples you listed are ones where accommodation of of some vestigial aspect of western culture isn’t mutually exclusive from from the accommodation of the contra-western man, but that does not mean that western culture persists in any meaningful way.
At best, this supports the notion that the west is dying in the US south, which, when you type it out, is clearly nonsense.

>We can only relate to to through the perspective of the contra-western tradition. What we know as Shakespeare isn’t Shakespeare, or even Johnson’s Shakespeare, we only know of Shakespeare through the lenses of the Baldwin-Morrison-Lorde literary hegemony and the values it instills within us. The same is true of western depiction of Christ by the great masters, which now make for nothing more than reminder if the villainous whitewashing done by Europeans and a reminder of the urgent needs to make white people worship a non-white god.
The fact that I had to google both Baldwin and Lorde, despite being well-versed not only in Shakespeare but in Shakespeare scholarship, disproves your notion of hegemony, and is proof enough that what you are decrying as the universal death of the west full stop are incredibly provincial american phenomena.

[Anonymous No.16226059]

>>16225822
>fixes
It doesn't. In Spenglerian and Evolian worldview all result of grand cycles that no one really influences. Also far as I know, Epictetus was a stoic, so according to him you shouldn't care about things that aren't in your control.

[Anonymous No.16226082]

>>16226042
>At best, this supports the notion that the west is dying in the US south, which, when you type it out, is clearly nonsense
Then you misunderstand what’s occurring. Through rejecting the reconciliation narrative which resulted in former secessionists becoming perhaps the most patriotic of all Americans for one which me must atone for our sins against the black race and condemn those who did them harm says a great deal about the national consciousness, which is being echoed throughout all of Western Europe at the moment. The is the societal affirmation of the contra-western at the expense of the western.
> The fact that I had to google both Baldwin and Lorde, despite being well-versed not only in Shakespeare but in Shakespeare scholarship, disproves your notion of hegemony, and is proof enough that what you are decrying as the universal death of the west full stop are incredibly provincial american phenomena.
If you don’t know who James Baldwin is, you’re far too ignorant of both literature in general and trends among the literary/intellectual elite to be worth talking to. I think it might be you who needs to leave his bubble. You also underestimate the extent to which American phenomena remain local.

[Anonymous No.16226121]

>>16226082
>Then you misunderstand what’s occurring. Through rejecting the reconciliation narrative which resulted in former secessionists becoming perhaps the most patriotic of all Americans for one which me must atone for our sins against the black race and condemn those who did them harm says a great deal about the national consciousness, which is being echoed throughout all of Western Europe at the moment. The is the societal affirmation of the contra-western at the expense of the western.
You're doing it again, you're being provincial. The national conscioussness of america is not the west.
Further, the more extremist elements of the western european alignment with american blacks is being put down widely for being an unreflected import of american issues with no applicability or relevance here. No one really cares now that the news cycle has moved on.
I also fail to see how any of the worthwhile elements of western culture would be harmed by this specific "contra-western" sentiment. You're trying to turn the anger of blacks in the US south at statues of people who worked to keep them enslaved into a general contra-western sentiment which remains unaccounted for. This only works if the only aspect of the west you value is the former subjugation of other people.

The Cologne Cahtedral was not built by black slaves. Tell me how current US sentiments will lead to it being torn down.

>If you don’t know who James Baldwin is, you’re far too ignorant of both literature in general and trends among the literary/intellectual elite to be worth talking to. I think it might be you who needs to leave his bubble. You also underestimate the extent to which American phenomena remain local.
I did not know he had done anything interesting on Shakespeare, and I still doubt he has. You're being provincial yet again as well. Knowledge of american writers is not the end-all-be-all measure of literature in general, and the fact that you think so is further evidence that you are taking american local problems and blowing them out of proportion to fit the notion of the death of the west. These american problems will remain local because it is only in america that there is a historical substrate for them. Western europe does not have a significant current population of people whose ancestors were slaves.
Finally, the canon will survive the "elites". When american (again, local) "prestigious" universities remove it from the syllabus, they are not eroding the eternal aesthetic of it, they are merely embarrassing themselves, and it is just yet another aspect of how the US is not the west, and how US hegemony is dwindling.