/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.15983359]

Which one are you and why?

[Anonymous No.15983371]

The Decline Of The West

[Anonymous No.15983376]

>>15983359
D+G GANG WW@

[Anonymous No.15983377]

>>15983359
Anti-Oedipus. Because I'm cute.

[Anonymous No.15983380]

>>15983359
The Holy Bible. Basing your life around fiction and secular philosophy is stupid, material and childish.

[Anonymous No.15983384]

I don't see Antifragile and Fight Club

[Anonymous No.15983394]

>>15983359
I haven't read any of these and I'm 21. I base my life around the wind and fire.

[Anonymous No.15983395]

>>15983380
no go away

[Anonymous No.15983397]

>>15983359
Anti oedipus, capital, zizek, foucault are really all the same

[Anonymous No.15983399]

>>15983359
is this what female cope looks like?

[Anonymous No.15983401]

>>15983359
The Sublime Object of Ideology unironically changed my life for the better.

[Anonymous No.15983407]

>>15983380
>bible
>fiction
Low hanging fruit but still

[Anonymous No.15983418]

>>15983407
Poetry is non fiction

[Anonymous No.15983428]

>>15983418
Poeticising something fictionalizes it. Unless (you) believe that Noah and his descendants literally lived for hundreds of years, in which case haha

[Anonymous No.15983468]

Horoscopes for philosophy nerds

[Anonymous No.15983532]

>>15983428
No i mean that poetry is in the non fiction section of the library

[Anonymous No.15983540]

>>15983468
Woah you made that quick

[Anonymous No.15983564]

>>15983359
Does anyone seriously choose any other than Fanged Noumena?

[Anonymous No.15983587]

I chose the Bible. Feels good man

[Anonymous No.15983599]

>>15983540
copy and pasting an image over another one takes like 15 seconds

[Anonymous No.15983684]

>>15983599
I'm still impressed. Bravo photoshop wizard anon! Bravo!

[Anonymous No.15983692]

>>15983587
Coonrod
Amazing

[Anonymous No.15983694]

Sein und Zeit

[Anonymous No.15983701]

>>15983380
Based

[Anonymous No.15983704]

>>15983587
Rod the coons, Sam

[Anonymous No.15983717]

>>15983587
Based. Jesus is king and George Floyd is a false prophet.

[Anonymous No.15983718]

>>15983418
The bible is mostly not poetry.

[Anonymous No.15983730]

>>15983359
I haven't read any of them.
Can't think of a book read around age 20 that defined my entire personality. The best candidate are Dante's Comedy, Baudelaire's Flowers of Evil and Kant's Critique of Pure Reason, and I read them all before turning 16.

[Anonymous No.15983739]

>>15983377
proofs

[Anonymous No.15983746]

>>15983717

>nigger
>a prophet, even a false one

[Anonymous No.15983748]

>>15983359

[Anonymous No.15983756]

>>15983718
Wrong

>>15983730
Nerd

[Anonymous No.15983762]

>>15983684
Thanks, I take pride in my work

[Anonymous No.15983764]

>>15983468
based desu

[Anonymous No.15983819]

>>15983359
/pol/ version:
>Bhagavad Gita
>Sun and Steel
>Holy Bible
>Ride the Tiger
>SIEGE
>Democracy: The God That Failed
>The Art of the Deal
>Mein Kampf
>Turner Diaries

[Anonymous No.15983840]

>>15983819
I thought the Siege meme ended

[Anonymous No.15983860]

>>15983359

Where are the Fountainhead, Fight Club and Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas?

[Anonymous No.15983883]

>>15983840
I don't use /pol/, but from what I understand it's heavily shilled there by O9A glowies.

[Anonymous No.15983914]

>>15983883
Lel not anymore. Maybe around 2017-18, but that was just spill over from 8ch. /pol/ doesnt really read anything other than Dinesh D'souza and twitter screenshots now.

[Anonymous No.15983954]

>>15983532
>fiction/non-fiction split instead of schöne literatur/sachliteratur split

[Anonymous No.15984482]

>>15983468
This meme format really speaks to the fact that the modern western man is obsessed with categorizing himself and others.

[Anonymous No.15985179]

Consider the following: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjjNsPorUXM

[Anonymous No.15985194]

>>15983371
no, you are the decline of the west

[Anonymous No.15985626]

Bros,I'm just getting into lit and haven't read any of these. Which will fit me if I'm a secular hedonist?

[Anonymous No.15985640]

>>15985194
Maybe the real decline of the west was the friends we made along the way.

[Anonymous No.15985759]

>>15985626
All of them

[Anonymous No.15985779]

>no Debord option
unironically, Marx and Marcuse but I'm pessimistic enough to realize it's just mental masturbation material

[Anonymous No.15985780]

People still read Marcuse?

[Anonymous No.15985796]

>>15983397
Foucault does not fit with those others imo

[Anonymous No.15985808]

>>15983359
Nietzsche and Foucault

[Anonymous No.15985839]

>>15983380
Based

[Anonymous No.15985853]

>>15983359
>Jordan Peterson on /lit/
Oh, /lit/, how the mighty have fallen!

[Anonymous No.15985867]

>>15983359
replace Peterson with "The Decline of the West" or "Ride the Tiger" and you have a more accurate picture of /lit/

[Anonymous No.15986934]

The only one that applies is Meditations.
I try to think for myself otherwise.

[Anonymous No.15987174]

>>15983380
>Basing your life around fiction is stupid, material and childish.
>Holy Bible

[Anonymous No.15987193]

>>15983359
>not including Quine's 'Word and Object'
Lame.

[Anonymous No.15987205]

>>15983380
Cringe. You've obviously never read the Bible.

[Anonymous No.15987216]

>>15983587
So what will Sam Coonrod do when he proposes to his girlfriend?

[Anonymous No.15987260]

>>15983371
Same

[Anonymous No.15987267]

>>15987174
i too browse r/atheism bro, fistbump!

[Anonymous No.15987280]

>>15983756
You're on an internet bookclub for manga-loving autists anon, we all are nerds.

[Anonymous No.15987281]

>>15985796
Well Foucault and Anti-Oedipus go together at the very least, both being anti-psychiatry.

[Anonymous No.15987285]

>>15983756
How many books of the Bible are entirely made of poetry, versus how many books are not made of poetry at all? I'll wait for you to count faggot.

[Anonymous No.15987297]

>>15983819
>siege, turner diaries and art of the deal in the same list as Bhagavad Gita, the Bible and Sun and Steel
Wew lad. I suppose trying to be edgy at all cost did force them into a strange form of ecclectism.

[Anonymous No.15987304]

>>15985853
There used to be daily JP threads on /lit/ when he got big.

[Anonymous No.15987340]

>>15983587
>Nuclear family
>Muh Christian tradition
Do these people honestly believe that the 1950s is really the embodiment of 2000 years of tradition? The nuclear family is degenerate and represents the breakdown of the traditional family community. It's a very new concept that's just barely old enough to seem old to people who think the world has always been the way it is right now.

[Anonymous No.15987384]

>>15987340
yawn
no one cares about your anti family propaganda, leftoid

[Anonymous No.15987400]

>>15987205
>Cringe. You've obviously never read the Bible.

[Anonymous No.15987404]

>>15987384
Whoever loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me, and whoever loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. And whoever does not take his cross and follow me is not worthy of me.
Mathew 10:37-39

[Anonymous No.15987411]

>>15987340
Extended family is objectively better, but nuclear family to a lot of people means that a man and a woman get married, stay married and raise children. This should be basic, but for some reason it has come into question. The Bible is pro extended family.

[Anonymous No.15987564]

>>15987260
Spengler bois in the house

[Anonymous No.15987571]

>>15987404

[Anonymous No.15987577]

>>15987571
would you like to provide some other piece of scripture, specifically from the gospels, that supports your own point?

[Anonymous No.15987596]

>>15983748
this

[Anonymous No.15987615]

>>15987577
>would you like to provide some other piece of scripture, specifically from the gospels, that supports your own point?
I don't really need to.
Its quite obvious that leftism is anti family.

[Anonymous No.15987638]

>>15987411
The nuclear family means getting married and having 2.5 kids. Moving to the suburbs and being completely isolated from your extended family. Only seeing them on holidays or birthdays.

[Anonymous No.15987639]

>>15987267
Lol cope bitch

[Anonymous No.15987645]

>>15983371
This

[Anonymous No.15987659]

>>15987638
No it doesn't

[Anonymous No.15987665]

>>15983359
manuel vuelvete a hacer memes a instagram pesada

[Anonymous No.15987684]

>>15985779
Debord didn't believe in personalities and thought it was all situational hence the situationalists

[Anonymous No.15987706]

>>15987297
Gita - esosteric Aryan Vedic warrior people
Sun and Steel - self improvement fanatics and /fit/ crossboarders
Holy Bible - various kinds of Christian identitarians
Ride the Tiger - the mystical reactionaries who talk about Jews being lesbian worshiping moon cultists and stuff
SIEGE - apparently this subculture went extinct, guess Spengler would be a better fit
Democracy: The God That Failed - ancaps
Art of the Deal - true believer Trumpers
Mein Kamf - the classic /pol/ nazi
Turner Diaries - luv white people, 'ate darkies. Simple as.
And there are countless intersections between them that create kooky worldviews. Like people thinking Trump is the Kalki avatar fighting Satan.

[Anonymous No.15987769]

>>15983819
>/pol/
>reading

The 5% of those motherfuckers that have even heard of evola are drinking the "superfascist" koolaid

[Anonymous No.15987780]

>>15987615
that's not the question, but rather whether a christianity true to the tenets of christ is 'pro-family'

[Anonymous No.15987802]

for me its a clockwork orange

[Anonymous No.15987843]

>>15983587
What an absolute snowflake.
I know this is bait, so I'll just hit the biggest criticism: there is no "they." Black Lives Matter is not a group, it's a hashtag.

"How do you feel about police brutality towards black people?"
>m-muh nuclear family... marxism!

[Anonymous No.15987911]

>>15987780
like I said:
yawn
no one cares about your anti family propaganda, leftoid

[Anonymous No.15988038]

>>15983359
D+G without question

[Anonymous No.15988216]

>>15983359
Das Kapital is more like a 30 something read. At twenty, you don't understand it, and lack the will to continue the read after a few pages or chapters.

[Anonymous No.15988381]

>>15983359
For me, it's "An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding"

[Anonymous No.15988390]

>>15988381
based

[Anonymous No.15988397]

>>15987615
You mean Christianity is anti-family.

[Anonymous No.15988405]

>>15987843
>What an absolute snowflake.
>I know this is bait, so I'll just hit the biggest criticism: there is no "they." Black Lives Matter is not a group, it's a hashtag.

[Anonymous No.15988416]

Anti Oedipus because it was also the time when i started to take estrogen

[Anonymous No.15988425]

My cousin started reading after years of consuming alt right echo chamber youtube videos. Good. He needs to read not consume audio as Ive told him a hundred times.
Goes right into Peterson.
Must have thought time spent in his first book was so valuable he needs to draw from all of it.. Now it seems his entire philosophy revolves around basic self help trash and evolutionary psychology.
Buys another Peterson book...

Giving up desu.

[Anonymous No.15988448]

>>15987384
Dont you feel bad for posting a poorly drawn image of Jesus used for modern political purposes?

[Anonymous No.15988454]

>>15987843
>how do you feel about niggers burning down cities in protest for an alleged racial bias from the police that doesn't stand up to any scrutiny of actual statistics?
Fixed it for you.

[Anonymous No.15988459]

>>15987571
>implying there's something wrong with holding people to their own standards

[Anonymous No.15988473]

>>15983359
Hegel

Fuck all that edgy shit

[Anonymous No.15988479]

>>15987706
Ah, I see, I underestimated the diversity of the /pol/ niches. Rather fascinating in a way.

>the mystical reactionaries who talk about Jews being lesbian worshiping moon cultists and stuff
Have to admit I've never heard that one before. Especially surprising since Jewish culture is traditionally pretty male centered.

>Trump is the Kalki avatar fighting Satan.
This one is so funny I almost want it to be true.

[Anonymous No.15988496]

>>15988397
nope leftism is anti family.

[Anonymous No.15988506]

>>15988448
its actually a pretty good image

[Anonymous No.15988507]

>>15983359
Capital

[Anonymous No.15988544]

>>15983380

[Anonymous No.15988560]

>>15988454

[Anonymous No.15988569]

>>15987571
practise what you preach, god botherer

[Anonymous No.15988574]

>>15988496
Leftism is pro-family. Christianity is explicitly anti-family.

[Anonymous No.15988645]

>>15988560
If you do it for people arrested, white criminals are killed more. It's not that niggers are targeted more by the police, its' that they commit disproportionately more crime.

[Anonymous No.15988653]

>>15988560
https://twitter.com/LeonydusJohnson/status/1267466345844740098

[Anonymous No.15988655]

>>15988574
I mean, Jesus literally preaches the virtues of socialism, but modern Christianity is anti-family, yes.

[Anonymous No.15988680]

>>15988473
Based

[Anonymous No.15988692]

>>15983359
Maps of meaning and the Bible

[Anonymous No.15988699]

Machiavelli but never actually reading it

[Anonymous No.15988711]

>>15988473
Hegel wrote literal gibberish, pseud.

[Anonymous No.15989095]

[Anonymous No.15989125]

>>15987665
Cállate conchetumare

[Anonymous No.15989159]

>21 and read none of these and probably couldnt understand them, still struggling to get through hume despite getting a first in a philosophy module at uni last year
is there hope for me?

[Anonymous No.15989160]

>>15983384
>No anon is warranting your post with a reply.

[Anonymous No.15989170]

this was me at 20

[Anonymous No.15989334]

>>15989170
Baste

[Anonymous No.15989783]

>>15987404
That doesnt refute the nuclear family

[Anonymous No.15989806]

>>15987843
Black Lives Matter is literally an organization with a manifesto and leaders. Beyond that, it exists as a movement with a particular aim and people of particular ideologies who inhabit it. Saying its nothing more than a hashtag has to be the biggest gaslighting I've ever seen, especially after these niggers and communists have been burning down cities for months.

[Anonymous No.15989807]

>>15983401
Zizek helped me resolve my oneitis. What had been crippling me for the best part of three years dissipated upon reading his explanation of the objet petit a and jouissance.

[Anonymous No.15989822]

>>15983914
>Dinesh D'souza
must be ironic

[Anonymous No.15989869]

>>15989806
>rioters represent everyone I don't like
How intellectually stunted.

[Anonymous No.15989903]

Well yes.

[Anonymous No.15989904]

Bronze age mindset

[Anonymous No.15989911]

>>15983359
I just bought Beyond Good and Evil today so maybe that one

[Anonymous No.15989999]

>>15988425
I wouldn't worry too much about it, honestly. His only chance, and I hesitate to call it a chance because I've got no knowledge of his intelligence or general capacity for reason, is that he arrives at some understanding of slave morality and Peterson helps him reject it in favor of more rigorous philosophies. If he doesn't, then he is better fit to play the role of the slave. You simply cannot help these things.

[Anonymous No.15990192]

>>15983359
Mine was The Gay Science, but only like two or three passages. Philosophy sucks

[Anonymous No.15990210]

>>15983359
>basing your life or personality on a book someone else wrote
You guys don't seriously do that, r-right?

[Anonymous No.15990224]

>>15989159
Probably not but the fun thing about probabilities, is that a tiny, tiny chance always remains.

Keep reading more, even if you don't fully understand stuff you read. Some works require re-reads, others require more life experience.

[Anonymous No.15990276]

>>15983359
Get on my level.

[Anonymous No.15990298]

>>15983380
Ah yes, a book recounting ancient jewish laws for stoning non-virgin brides to death on their father's doorstep and with a section about a tribe being given a divine mandate to commit genocide but to keep the virgin women for sex slaves. You know, a normal book to base your life around

[Anonymous No.15990311]

>>15988655
Jesus was pretty heavy handed with socialistic values, it's kind of amazing how the ultra conservatives idolize him while ignoring his central message

[Anonymous No.15990324]

>>15990311
Charity =/= socialism, there's a reason the Christian founders of the US insisted upon a separation of church and state.

[Anonymous No.15990336]

>>15990324
Jej you're pathetic

[Anonymous No.15990343]

>>15990298
All of that sounds great though.

[Anonymous No.15990354]

>>15983359
Isn't it a bit redundant to have AO and FN in the same chart?

[Anonymous No.15990360]

>>15983359
Why is there no John Locke?

[Anonymous No.15990390]

>>15990336
Care to explain why?

[Anonymous No.15990447]

>>15983359
CCRU Writings 1997-2003 because I'm schizophrenic

[Anonymous No.15990701]

>>15990324
>Christian founders of the US
Many of them were deists who knew the corrupting power of the church on government. Also, Jesus was pretty clear that you should not pursue money and you should do your charity in private where no one knows it was you. In fact his words are "do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing" in regards to charity. A socialist structure that meets the basic needs of everyone through private taxation is literally exactly what Jesus was preaching

[Anonymous No.15990729]

>>15983564
Yes, non-brainlets.

[Anonymous No.15990733]

>>15987216
Marriage is a form of divinity.

[Anonymous No.15990737]

>>15983359
literally no one here likes peterson

[Anonymous No.15990740]

>>15983359
So this is why I don't get along with other humans.

[Anonymous No.15990746]

>>15983748
Surprised it took that long.

[Anonymous No.15990748]

>>15990324
THERE IS LESS CHANCES OF A RICH MAN TO ENTER HEAVEN THAN MY SLUT MOTHER LETTING JOSEPH HAVE SOME

[Anonymous No.15990751]

>>15983380
Why'd you base your life on Middle Eastern, Jewish and Roman/Greek fantasy then

[Anonymous No.15990964]

>>15988473
“Hegel, installed from above, by the powers that be, as the certified Great Philosopher, was a flat-headed, insipid, nauseating, illiterate charlatan who reached the pinnacle of audacity in scribbling together and dishing up the craziest mystifying nonsense.”

t. Shopenhauer

[Anonymous No.15991043]

>>15990276
this is the ultimate redpill

[Anonymous No.15991357]

>>15983371
Currently reading this. They say it's a sequel.

[Anonymous No.15991365]

>>15991357
Forgot to add pic

[Anonymous No.15991883]

>>15990390
>Care to explain why?
Not that guy but it's pretty sad to cling to 2 beliefs that are inherently contradictory. If you put even a minute of thought into what you believe you would realise that christianity and hating others for their political beliefs are incompatible. Christianity and greed are incompatible, and yet you support a society that enshrines greed and denigrate those who want to change it.
It's pathetic to never examine your core belief system, if you're a functioning adult you should spend at least a little bit of time thinking. You're so terminally online that you're only capable of spewing buzzwords and /pol/ propaganda, and your responses are less than 20 words apiece. You can't even justify what you believe, so you go on for response after response without providing an explanation. Imo that's pretty pathetic

[Anonymous No.15992130]

>>15983359
For me, it’s the oddess. Some Portuguese puta told me it’s about Indian spiritualism and some other gay horseshit his critical theory class came up with. I know it’s about a chad killing kikes, banging milfs and young sexy teenagers, before settling down with his his still hot Selma Hayek-esque wife.

[Anonymous No.15992142]

>>15988560
Check how many shootings there are per race with total police interactions, not per million population. Or even better have shootings based on how much crime each race commits lol

[Anonymous No.15992447]

>>15991883
read the grand inquisitor

[Anonymous No.15992559]

>>15989095
>>15990447
>>15988381
>>15987193
based

[Anonymous No.15992712]

>>15983359
Where's Kaczynski?

[Anonymous No.15992751]

>>15983359
None of them.

[Anonymous No.15992959]

>>15987639
seethe

[Anonymous No.15993020]

>>15983359
replace anti-oedipus with capitalist realism. no unexperienced 20 y/o would understand d&g's greatest work

[Anonymous No.15993850]

>>15991883
I'm sure you thought this was a really scathing critique when you wrote it, but the person you're critiquing is entirely imaginary. You've already assumed I'm a dimwit without any ground upon which to stand, so I'll just wish you a good day.
>>15990701
Many wrote a good deal about the importance of a civil society formed around generally Christian values to maintaining the moral integrity of the electorate. The state was meant to protect the ability of its citizens to pursue virtuosity (hence the mention of the right to pursue happiness in the declaration of independence, inb4 "that's not law!" it's referential to the ideals of the nation). The corrupting power of the church on government and vice versa are precisely why socialist structures are incongruent with Christianity. By forcing charity upon your populace, you strip them of the agency that should instill charity as a virtue within them. That isn't even to mention the general political madness inherent to the assumption that any body with as broad a coverage as the federal government could redistribute your wealth, from a purely pragmatic perspective, more effectively than a local church or personal anonymous donation.

[Anonymous No.15994252]

>>15993850

You have two contradictory beliefs
>socialism is bad capitalism is good
>following the teachings of jesus is good

Enabling the existence of the poor and homeless for the sake of greed is unchristian. That is the argument I'm making. Socialist democracies work, so viability isn't an issue. Jesus would rather have forced charity than a population that allows the homeless and poor to starve in pursuit of profits. The word of god tells you to pay your taxes (Romans 13:6-7). You can't disagree with socialism and be christian, unless you want to institute an even more radical system for helping the unfortunate. If you support our current neoliberal capitalism you cannot honestly claim to be christian. Have you read the bible anon?

[Anonymous No.15994254]

>>15993020
That's not necessarily true, but I think the substitution still is a good idea.

[Anonymous No.15994271]

>>15993850
One can still be charitable under socialism. What is more christlike, the poor man donating a week of his time to a cause or the rich man donating 5000 dollars to a cause?
Can one not donate their time and personal skills under socialism?

[Anonymous No.15994315]

>>15993850
You seem to view socialist programs as "forcing" people into helping the poor. In most countries, the culture itself is such that people who are well off willingly pay taxes knowing it will go to a good cause such as the universal healthcare program or education programs. Federal governments are absolutely capable of organizing large scale programs like universal healthcare which if you look statistically are far superior to the corporate/private model in the US which provides billions in profit to insurance companies while thousands go medically bankrupt yearly.

Also, in regard to protecting the citizen's right to pursue happiness, it is an economic fact that there is always a balance of power between employer and employee (which is why things like unions form and things like workers rights were instantiated by governments). The advance of technology and the globalization of the labor market has shifted the balance of power massively in favor of employers and crushed the power of employees. This core element of capitalism that when a person employs their capital to make a profit they generally need to hire labor which they pay out of their revenue is tilting dangerously in one direction which is why we see the most profitable time in human history while we also see a 40+ year wage stagnation.

Something needs to be done as this trend seems to be accelerating. To pretend Jesus wouldn't have advocated for cultural shifts to view the disadvantaged more sympathetically is laughable. This brings up another point, the fact that "Christian values" are directly incompatible with making money. Jesus overtly says you cannot serve two masters, so do not pursue money, just serve the Lord. This is why Rousseau referred to Christians as the worst citizens, because they never buy into the system like other more self interested citizens would

[Anonymous No.15994330]

>>15994252
This. Jesus is very clear, do not pursue money, serve the Lord. And also what you do for the least of your brother you do for the Lord. He is unequivocally and fundamentally against the spirit of capitalism

[Anonymous No.15994432]

>>15990311
This is about as obvious a misreading as you can get

[Anonymous No.15994433]

>>15994330
>jesus would be against capitalism!
its like these atheistcucks aren't even trying

[Anonymous No.15994507]

>>15994252
>Enabling the existence of the poor and homeless for the sake of greed is unchristian
Of course. We differ only in that I do not believe that is the responsibility of the government, but of the church or the community or the individuals comprising it. The rest of this post develops my thinking further.
>>15994315
>You seem to view socialist programs as "forcing" people into helping the poor
Not quite, I view them as stripping people of their agency to do so themselves - something that I believe develops virtue. I'd rather avoid the topic of universal healthcare on account of it being a more political topic with valid arguments both for and against. Likewise with globalization, though I'm actually in agreement that more needs to be done to protect workers, for what it's worth - globalization has very much dehumanized and commodified the individual in much the same way that I would argue socialist policy often does, stripping them of agency.

Anyways, to your last point, I'll contrast the pursuit of wealth with the pursuit of innovation, which does require capital, but can serve to improve the lives of all in a charitable way. With that, I also respond in part to >>15994271, to say that the rich man may donate both innovations and direct monetary wealth, and by merit of his contributions, be more wholly virtuous.

[Anonymous No.15994580]

>>15994315
>>15994507
I should also cite your own quotation:
>Jesus overtly says you cannot serve two masters
in support of my stance - with socialist policy, I would argue that your "charity" serves the master of government more so than God, or even your fellow man; even if that government serves the Lord, you, yourself, are not serving of your own volition. You MAY happen to believe in charity as virtuous, but whether you do or not, you will be forced to give. So, why believe in it as a virtue? Socialist policy does not compel you to recognize charity as virtuous and in service to the Lord. Hopefully this clarifies my thoughts on the matter.

[Anonymous No.15994594]

>>15983359
Males are knuckle-dragging apes who do not read.

[Anonymous No.15994825]

>>15983860
Those are the books 14-year-olds center their entire personality around, not 20-somethings.

[Anonymous No.15994841]

>>15983377
Post feet

[Anonymous No.15994955]

>>15994433
how badly did you misread weber, anon?

[Anonymous No.15995029]

>>15983359
I read bukowski in my 20s.

[Anonymous No.15995166]

[Anonymous No.15995178]

>>15994507
I'd be curious what your interpretation of Jesus' parable of "consider the lilies". Again, it seems pretty clear that Jesus is enjoining his followers to forgo the "pagan world" of material innovation and trust that God will clothe and feed them. In fact, he says explicitly "Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys."

And this is a sentiment echoed when he stated that its easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter heaven.

To me, this says that no matter how a rich person justifies their wealth, they cannot claim to be an adherent of Jesus' word unless they donate all their possessions to the poor. Jesus' words are extremely radical, and it seems like most "Christians" rehabilitate them into something of a hollow husk that is compatible with a materialistic, selfish, greedy lifestyle. In my view, you can't contradict his verbatim words. Rich people should sell their possessions and focus on the heavenly kingdom or they will never enter that kingdom

[Anonymous No.15995205]

>>15995166
This.

Hope I choose the right book.

[Anonymous No.15995249]

>>15983359

I'm the only one on this board with a brain.

[Anonymous No.15995259]

>>15983380

>The Holy Bible.
>Basing your life around fiction and secular philosophy is stupid, material and childish.

So, basically, the "Bible?" Not "The Holy Bible?"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoJ5ci0A8sY

[Anonymous No.15995473]

>>15994955
very, apparently

[Anonymous No.15995672]

>>15995178
My interpretation of the parable of the lilies places the emphasis on the fact that the lilies do not "spin," because it is not in their nature to do so. They are clothed so beautifully because they are in accordance with their nature. Like a lily clothes itself naturally, so too does a man naturally create comforts and the like.

My belief is that we are, however, unlike the lily, or the birds, or the grass in two ways. First, we are uniquely industrious by nature. Pursuit of one's nature is not inherently virtuous, however, because second: man is endowed uniquely with the ability to reason (Pslams 32:9 and Jude 1:10 come to mind as references) and therefore to sin (or not to, to pursue virtue instead).

I should therefore be clear in stating state that my defense of capitalism is by no means a defense of materialism, but I should be equally clear that I believe they are two separate things. I believe that material good pursued to the end of virtuosity (charity, altruism) is in accordance with our fundamental nature, and so may clothe us all as beautifully as the lilies.

Therefore, my view of socialism is that some agency in the pursuit of virtue is stripped from the individual in a way that makes his material pursuits more inclined towards sin. I should also clarify that I don't believe in strict theological determinism, which is relevant to my interpretation of Matthew 6:34. I feel like I still haven't articulated myself perfectly clearly here, since this is the first time I've ever actually attempted to articulate this belief, so I await your response to better patch any holes I may have left that I may be taking for granted.

[Anonymous No.15995698]

>>15987205
You don't need to read a book to base your life around it. That's essentially all /lit/ is.

[Anonymous No.15996091]

>>15995672
I think you miss the principle behind capitalism as a system. Those who are most ruthless at accumulating capital are the ones who accumulate the most capital in a capitalist system. This is why large corporations tend not to care about workers rights unless forced to by government. The system itself is a competitive game of selfish enrichment.

I agree with your guiding principle about affording individuals the agency to be sinful or virtuous, however I believe our country should afford this to all at a basic level (meeting clothing and food and shelter needs, which is eminently possible with the current level of technology and productivity).

As I've stated before, I believe there needs to be a balance maintained within the system, and this is something economists like Adam Smith have recognized for centuries. Excessive concentration of wealth (most apparent in something like a monopoly) can effectively act as an oppressive force to the market and consequently the general public.

I don't advocate for absolute socialism, as I've said I hold individual agency as important, yet the principle you cite (that human innovation is virtuous in that it raises the standard of living of all) is best exemplified in having a base level of social programs to ensure these gains aren't monopolized by the very type people the system functionally promotes to the top.

On the topic of Jesus specifically, it's still hard to get past the fact that you still have to disregard Matthew 6:26 when He specifically says the birds don't sow or reap or store away in barns, yet are fed, and (paraphrasing) you are way more valuable to the Lord than birds so you will be provided for just like the birds. Again, this is radical but Jesus WAS a radical.

I hope I've outlined how a base level of socialism exactly fulfills the spirit of what Jesus taught and also that it is incumbent on Christians to advocate for those with riches to give them up (or even just a portion of them) to help those in need, the poor.

[Anonymous No.15996382]

>>15991365
Where the hell did you get a physical copy? I haven’t been able to find one that’s not overpriced

[Anonymous No.15996393]

>>15987843
BLM is an organization

[Anonymous No.15996399]

>>15988479
If you’re into Hitler being the Kalki avatar then look into Serrano

[Anonymous No.15996405]

>>15983359
Never read any of them, what now?

[Anonymous No.15996430]

>>15996091
I think we're in agreement by and large; I do certainly believe the government should intervene on behalf of the people to protect them from the most undesirable elements of capitalism and materialism (those which you mentioned tend to arise largely from monopolies, the dissolution of which I would agree is government's foremost role in economic regulation).

I don't really see 6:26 or even 6:30 as being incongruous with the idea that all life is provided for by God for living in accordance with its nature. It's partially a message about humility, in my eyes. Birds do not sow nor reap nor store away their grain in barns. Could they? Have they the will to? That question addresses the role of agency and virtue in man following his own nature. My readings of 27-28 and the passage in general are more stoic than primitivist, I suppose.

Anyways, on socialism. Consider tipping - some countries don't account for tips in calculating the pay of employees, but America tends to. Why? Well, it's thanks for a service provided - kindness/humility, an expression of virtue. In a society without virtue, the system breaks down. The government has to step in and regulate that the company reallocate some of its profits towards increasing the worker's wages to account for the loss in tips. They're likely to increase the price of the service, so that you're still "tipping," but are no longer aware of it - it requires no reflection, nothing is learned or internalized. Might some people still tip regardless? Of course. But I believe more strongly in the systemic assumption of tips as a kind of self-perpetuating virtuosity.

The question, I think, boils down to whether we can trust people to be virtuous in the first place. The extent to which one trusts them to be, I believe, generally determines one's stance on socialism. Will man clothe and feed his neighbors on his own? I would hope so, and thus somewhat disdain socialism. You wouldn't be wrong to call me a very strict idealist in that regard, though. It's very probably not a pragmatic belief, and more one that I present in opposition to the notion that a Christian could not possibly oppose socialism.

[Anonymous No.15996452]

>>15983359
I recently turned 24 and have never read any of those books

[Anonymous No.15996590]

>>15996430
Definitely in an ideal system those who accumulate the most capital would become philanthropists and work to raise the floor of their society, however this tends to be the exception rather than the rule when it comes to those who are ultra successful in capitalist systems. If you look at the donations of the Forbes top 400, the percentage of their wealth they donate is often the same level as an average citizen. Needless to say this also tends to correlate with a calculated amount for tax purposes and nothing beyond that.

I firmly believe this is a problem with the organization of the system itself. The mechanism which once regulated the distribution of wealth via the employer's reliance on laborers is no longer powerful enough to maintain the very qualities which made the capitalist system a desirous one to begin with

I think this is abundantly clear when you view graphs of generational wealth. The millennial generation is simply not accumulating wealth when at the same age their parents and grandparents were. This is largely in part due to the fact that, although the current model produces cheap goods, property value has skyrocketed and it is now practically unobtainable for new families to afford to buy a home leading to a rise of perpetual rent.

I'm reminded of a tract entitled "The Road to Serfdom" which warned against socialist control, yet it seems as though the capitalist model is quickly dividing the country into the landed elites and the renting serfs.

[Anonymous No.15996728]

[Anonymous No.15996932]

>>15990298
shut up incel

>>15983380
based, mature, logical, realistic, true

[Anonymous No.15996943]

>>15990298
yes

[Anonymous No.15996962]

I see way more wannabe stoic 20 year olds reading Marcus Aurelius than most of those.

I was one of them, still am

[Anonymous No.15997026]

>>15996590
With regards to the Forbes evaluations of wealth, I would urge paying more mind to salary than to individual net worth, since to some extent I would argue their capital investments constitute charity in that they serve to empower people and bring about good by putting them to work and such. You already pointed out, though, that the tendency there is towards serfdom. Ted Kaczynski had some interesting thoughts on the extent to which laboring for a capitalist in that capacity represents or upholds individual freedom, power, or virtue. He would certainly support the primitivist reading of the parable... Though I think he's firmly atheistic, all things considered.

Maybe it just happens to be the case that in any sufficiently industrialized society, virtue will always come second to progress. What I can't seem to shake, or perhaps reconcile, is the potential of industrial society to bring about virtuous good. I do truly believe that to be the message of the parable, I do believe that to be our nature, which we must abide by virtuously for salvation. Maybe we see this inequality and suffering because virtue is second to vice in all men by default. I mean, it was present even in Jesus' time such that he felt the need to speak on it. Same sins, different face. In that way, "solving" it feels like trying to grab a fistful of water.

Maybe it's coping, but as I wrote this I realized it's kind of a test of faith. If we lead by example in virtue, and our will is good, we can change the world for the better with the power of persuasion. I don't think the answer is politics, but rather faith, which... is a kinda startlingly obvious thing to say, now that I've said it. Like, in that sense, capitalism is a definite good - we just haven't done a good enough job spreading virtue to the capitalists! Maybe that's a naive failure to understand economics. It may very well be, my grasp of the science isn't great.

[Anonymous No.15997041]

>>15990298
yeah, why?

[Anonymous No.15997046]

>>15983359

[Anonymous No.15997068]

>>15983587
>Standing for the National Anthem
>replacing God with Country
>no one there can claim Christ

[Anonymous No.15997073]

>>15990298
Hi
Have you ever talked to people? what you have said is very silly if you have

[Anonymous No.15997193]

>>15983380
Hahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahaahahahaha. Top tier trolling

[Anonymous No.15997238]

>>15983359

[Anonymous No.15997257]

>>15983380
Based and Breadpilled. Praise the High Most King, Christ Jesus!

[Anonymous No.15997259]

>>15987780
>>15987615
>>15987571
>>15987411
>>15987404
RETARDS
YOU CAN LOVE SOME THINGS MORE THAN OTHER THINGS LOVE ISN'T BINARY. CHRIST IS DECLARING THAT IF YOU PUT FAMILY OVER FAITH YOU'VE FUCKED YOURSELF. YOU ILLITERATE FREAKS, TAKING VERSES OUT OF CONTEXT DESPITE THOSE VERSES COMPOSING AN OVERARCHING NARRATIVE. DESPITE THOSE VERSES BEING STRUCTURED AFTER THE BIBLE'S WRITING. DESPITE THE FACT THAT IF I POSTED SENTENCES FROM YOUR FAVORITE BOOK OUT OF CONTEXT, YOU'RE ALMOST CERTAINLY HAVE AN AUTISTIC SHITFIT BECAUSE "I DIDN'T GET IT" AND I WAS "FILTERED".
CONSIDER THE FOLLOWING: YOU AREN'T AS SMART AS YOU THINK, AND YOUR ARGUMENTS ARE INVALID. I AM ULTIMATELY THE PROTAGONISTS OF THIS SITUATION, AND ONCE I'VE POSTED MY REPLY YOU HEATHENS WILL CEASE TO BE. UPON MY DEATH THIS NARRATIVE WILL BE COMPLETE.

[Anonymous No.15997270]

>/pol/ rentfree in every board
Feels good lads.

[Anonymous No.15997299]

>>15983883
Last time I saw a thread about O9A (two months ago), at least half of the posts were calling it a glownigger op because they never heard of it.

[Anonymous No.15997306]

>>15983468
thank you for helping to further degrade the concept of meme by making terrible ones so we can finally be done with this phase.

[Anonymous No.15997510]

>>15997026
I am myself just an amateur economist but I'd make the modest claim that I'm somewhat well read. I think industrialization and technological progress in and of themselves are good things as they hold the potential to alleviate human suffering through abundance, however my central concern is that the very system which allows this abundance to grow is trending in a way where less and less of that growth is translating into worker's gains.

I must confess I do believe it is a bit naive to rely on faith to fix this problem. It's a bit like the conclusion of most of Dicken's novels where the ultimate solution is that the wealthy man has an epiphany and simply pays his workers more and becomes more charitable. I think it's safe to say there will always be economic sharks, and without proper provisions against them they will dominate the market itself. There is actually an evolutionary theory that sociopathy itself is an adaptation for leaders to make decisions regarding the lives of those beneath them, so this presents again a situation where balance between the will of the public and the caprice of those with power needs to be kept balanced.

It may be mocked here on 4chan, but I personally believe that the overall arc of human history broadly bends towards justice, fairness, and goodness. Perhaps the balance of vice and virtue within the human race itself can tilt one way or another, which does mean that each individual's choices effects the very balance of evil within their civilization, but it must be admitted that certain individual's vices have farther ranging effects than others.

[Anonymous No.15997524]

>>15997073
Hi
Have you ever read the bible? what you have said is very silly if you have

[Anonymous No.15997552]

>>15983359
Where’s the Quran

[Anonymous No.15997790]

>>15988574
other way around

[Anonymous No.15997805]

>>15988574
>Leftism is pro-family. Christianity is explicitly anti-family.
lmao you've dejected from reality

[Anonymous No.15997850]

>>15983380
based

[Anonymous No.15997887]

>>15983359
Infinite J(ohnny T)est.

[Anonymous No.15998009]

>>15997510
I guess my thinking is that there might be adequate provisions against them on the books, but inadequate action on those provisions' behalf. If not, then I'll have to take your word for it. If so, though, (and perhaps even if not) it would suggest a moral failure rather than a political one, even though the failure is on behalf of politicians. Further, then, because we elect those politicians, perhaps it is our moral failure, which is my expansion upon what you're alluding to in your last paragraph.

By ours I don't necessarily mean you and I, nor one generation even - death by a thousand cuts of bureaucratic expansion seems to play a huge role in this, from my humble outside perspective, and that certainly is not something that happened overnight. I'd attribute our contemporary feeling of helplessness to the moral failures of the past. Again, though, that's more political and economic than I'm personally equipped to address or really even comment on, and therefore do so without much pragmatic insight to provide, if not even irresponsibly given my lack of knowledge.

My hope, ultimately, comes from agreement that human history broadly bends towards justice, fairness, and goodness. Principally, I think these things arise from the pursuit of truth. I'm not equipped to tackle these problems per se (not in a pragmatic sense, anyways - I'm an electrician), but I can share in this pursuit of truth with people like you who might more directly impact things. That's basically what I meant by my last paragraph in the previous post, and the object of my posting any of this in the first place.

[Anonymous No.15998102]

>>15997552
>mfw his religion was founded by a child molester and warlord rapist murderer who ripped off (ew) judaism and (Based) Christianity and found a way to make both worse

[Anonymous No.15998107]

>>15983359
That Anti-Oedipus one because the rest are gay, jewish, or appear politically incorrect for the sake of appearances.

[Anonymous No.15999133]

>>15983359

[Anonymous No.15999368]

>>15997046
come back to /b/ where you came from

[Anonymous No.16000654]

>>15983380
Look at all the atheist brainlets you triggered, how dare you.

[Anonymous No.16000858]

>>15999133
I've read some excerpts of this guy which I enjoyed, and I recently acquired 'You Must Change Your Life', what am I for? How much and which kind of a psychologist is he?

[Anonymous No.16001200]

What a stupid thread
>>15997046
Send this shit to /v/

[Anonymous No.16001205]

>>15983359
Where is Mein Kampf?

[Anonymous No.16001242]

>>15983359
the ego and it's own

[Anonymous No.16001427]

>>15983359
JP + Nietzsche so atleast you'll get your shit together.
Otherwise i would pick JP+Zizek for the memes

[Anonymous No.16001443]

>>15983359
Thus Spoke Zarathustra. Why? I’m based and I’m redpilled.

[Anonymous No.16001981]

>>15984482
One of my friends does this shit incessantly, always trying to find ways to justify treating others as inferior. I understand that sometimes there is limited to devote to judging others, but is it so hard to take a little extra time to get to know people before condemning them as stupid or evil?

[Anonymous No.16003290]

I WANT TO HAVE SEEEEEEEEEEEEEX

[Anonymous No.16003518]

>>16001981
Everyone just wants to fit themselves into a group but all the system approved identities are retarded or made up bullshit.

[Anonymous No.16003554]

>>15983359
Various poorly understood works by Jung, but I was a schizo in my early 20s.

[Anonymous No.16003561]

>>15983359
If you had put Storm of Steel on there, you would have gotten me.
>pic unrelated, I just think blood elves are cute

[Anonymous No.16004539]

>>15983380
Philosophers and theologians are really playing the same game. They're just pretending they're not.

[Anonymous No.16004580]

>>15983587
REEEEE he is disrespectful to the troops!

[Anonymous No.16004858]

>>15983359
Im too dumb to understand any of those books to base my personality around it

[Anonymous No.16005263]

>>15987639
i dont have to, i can intelligently tackle complex issues in a reasonable manner without needing to repeat the same strawman insult each time. If you are going to be a fedoratipper such as myself, do it without making the rest of us look like faggots.

[Anonymous No.16007463]

Herman Hesse was my 20 yr old spiritual guide.

[Anonymous No.16009425]

I'm going to read now, but here's a bump.
Have fun with another hour of this shit thread, niggas.

[Anonymous No.16009951]

>>15983380
based
god bless you

[Anonymous No.16009964]

>>15983359

[Anonymous No.16010045]

For me?

[Anonymous No.16010069]

>>15990701
>literally exactly what Jesus was preaching
No it wasn't

[Anonymous No.16010073]

I read pic related at age 13 and it defined my life thereon.

[Anonymous No.16010146]

>>15997510
Your understanding of things is so impossibly shallow it's not even worth a proper response
Read a book, you're not well read in any sense of the word

[Anonymous No.16010581]

>>15983380
Holy based, based and holy

[Anonymous No.16010627]

>>15983359
I don't see roadside picnic on there


This is my first time on this board, I'm taking my bag of swag and leaving.

[Anonymous No.16012130]

>>16010146
Your insult kind of falls flat if it's shallower than my post. You just come off as being triggered. If you can't compose yourself to make a decent response then don't pipe up at all

[Anonymous No.16012144]

>>16010069
Have you read the bible? Jesus is ultra hippy, he's pretty clear you should dedicate your life to helping the poor and not pursuing money

[Anonymous No.16012231]

>>15983359
all those guys are complete charlatans though with the possible exception of the spanish guy and peterson. you won't find any serious people engaging with them. only posturing, secretly intellectually insecure pseudo-intellectuals and academic frauds.

[Anonymous No.16012274]

>>15998009
I appreciate your perspective. I think individual engagement is something that can help to change things for the better, particularly engagement on ideas, not just the surface level of issues.

You may have heard there was an antitrust congressional hearing for the CEOs of 4 major companies. Although it's encouraging that such a hearing took place, it's hard to ignore the fact that many of those who are supposed to be interrogating these individuals for violations of the public trust are themselves receiving large campaign donations from those companies.

This may be straying into a whole other topic but it pertains to my contention that there are structural flaws in the current system, namely, the overabundance of corporate money in the political system. I'm reminded of one of the democratic debates over whether medicare for all was a good idea when they went to a commercial break for a health insurance company's ad.

It's always nice to converse with a thoughtful person who can talk about core value issues in a friendly way. Cheers!

[Anonymous No.16013047]

>>15983359
The only true religion, life philosophy and the future path for humanity.

[Anonymous No.16013052]

I'm this

[Anonymous No.16013529]

>>15988574
nope leftism is anti family

[Anonymous No.16013547]

>>15988574
omg so much this.
brb, late for my abortion.

[Anonymous No.16013582]

This thread sucks