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/lit/ - Literature

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1596583 No.1596583 [Reply] [Original]

What does /lit/ think of Slavoj Žižek?

>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjEtmZZvGZA

>> No.1596584

The chances are that most don't know anything about him, I don't. Why don't you put some thought into your posts and tell us what you think?
Go for it. Start over. K?

>> No.1596593

The interviewer is horrible. -_-

>> No.1596612
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1596612

>>1596584

I think he's a genius.

His views on universalism, religion and his interpretations of movies and popular culture are incredible.

He also makes sense of lacanian psycho-analytics.

He deconstructs things using marxism, but he doesn't really provide an answer or a solution to the problems.

He has a tendency to be pseudo-totalitiran and absurdly marxist, yet he never really tries to provide a rational answer for any of the problems he sees.

here is a better interview:
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8cIagiKwkw

>> No.1596619

his lacanian critiques are top notch, the jesus stuff and counter-democratic tendencies fail to persuade me however

>> No.1596628
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1596628

Is it too early in the thread to start talking about his conquests?

>> No.1596638
File: 87 KB, 467x627, zizek.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1596638

His stuff on the effects of progression in genetic modification on society is really interesting too.

>>1596628

It's the beard.

>> No.1596642

>>1596619
>lacanian critiques are top notch

Only on /lit/ would someone post something this fucking lobotomised.

>> No.1596652

>>1596642
Uh oh. The dreaded word--Lacan! You have been aroused to battle, positivist soldier!

>> No.1596672

Hey >>1596652

>>1596642, is right, he's an important lacanian scholar, but I find many other lacanian literary critics to be much better and far less obfuscatory.

Inb4 derrida shitstorm

>> No.1596676

>>1596672

I wouldn't say that to make that assertion you would need to be lobotomised, however.

Zizek isn't the best, but he is still very interesting.

>> No.1596691

Zizek on Grand Theft Auto IV:

“Grand Theft Auto explores the social ambiguity of violence … I don’t buy the theory that, ‘You think you are playing, but you are generating violence.’ I don’t think there is a clear connection between that kind of violence and real violence. This eternal fear of liberals who claim if you play video games, you’ll think reality is like this and you’ll go out and beat someone. It’s a much more complex system … If anything, playing Grand Theft Auto is more of a superstition. In order not to do something in reality, you play it virtually. I think it functions much more on that level. You know it is a very complex topic; psychoanalysis can learn something here.”

>> No.1596759

When he analyses films he never takes on any problems that his readings create. He gives you the snippets of where it fits and ignores what is problematic.

But maybe he's just more concerned with getting theory out to the masses.

>> No.1598449
File: 55 KB, 400x235, good_morning_son.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1598449

>"Nowadays, you can do anything that you want—anal, oral, fisting—but you need to be wearing gloves, condoms, protection."

-Slavoj Zizek

>> No.1598455 [DELETED] 

>This eternal fear of liberals who claim if you play video games, you’ll think reality is like this and you’ll go out and beat someone.
dat strawman

>> No.1598457

>>1596691
>This eternal fear of liberals who claim if you play video games, you’ll think reality is like this and you’ll go out and beat someone.
dat strawman

>> No.1598460

>>1598457

You've never seen a Fox News special on videogames, have you?

>> No.1598469

>>1598457
It's kind of sad that their actual argument is what he is referencing, but I think that it's intellectually immature to take arguments on the news not even purported and supported by actual studies as something to argue against.
It there really was a concern about these sorts of games there would be more funding, there is no amount of serious consideration of the stance he's going against.
>fox news
Being the most perfect example of why responding seriously to claims made on the news is a bad idea. They aren't making these reports seriously either, it's just an act to get parents onto their kids ass so they can act like real parents and feel good about their lives so they can get back to watching shitty news cable channels.

>> No.1598470

>>1598469
So we shouldn't take what people say seriously?

>> No.1598472

>>1598469

That's philosophy.

>> No.1598477

>>1598470
not on tv you shouldn't
at least not when it's obvious that their paycheck is dependent on what they say
>>1598472
lost you

>> No.1598482

>>1598477

First off, the reason why fox news is so popular is because they whore their integrity to suit the prejudices of the people. That's why they're the most watched and most trusted news program (and those are official statistics)

Secondly, although Zizek isn't post-modern, it isn't exactly uncommon for philosophers to disregard statistical evidence when constructing an argument.

>> No.1598484

>>1598482
First part was my point, I think I stated that oddly. Best not to try to make a serious point with them in the sentence when they just fear monger.
As to the second philosophy can't really use statistics anyways, gotta be heavy on the sounding reasonable.

>> No.1598488

I've only read his book on Hitchcock (it was OK, I guess, read it for a paper, don't remember much) and watched some videos.

Is it possible that he's so fascinated by western pop culture cause he didn't have access to it while growing up? You know, the soviet block, etc...

>> No.1598490

>>1598488

Yeah, and I think it gives me a more objective position too.

>> No.1598492

>>1596583
>Slaovž Žeežek from Lžubana WUT??
Also this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwDrHqNZ9lo

>> No.1598493

>>1598490
Slavoj?

>> No.1598499
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1598499

>>1598493

Shit man, I'm in a cafe right now so it's difficult to concentrate. I do identify a lot with him though.

inb4 narcissistic freudian slip

>> No.1598502

>>1598488
As someone who is "compatriot" of Žižek I must protest.
I think it's just the other, his interest in western pop-culture comes from the strange position in which Yugolsavia was during cold war.
You see it was more liberal than the Soviet block, but still not to liberal. So we got more accurate vision of what western really was and that was just enough to get us even more interested in it.

>> No.1598507

>>1598488
Apart from the minor issue of Yugoslavia not being in the Soviet-bloc, that is an interesting point.

I've heard him say he makes so many pop-culture references both so that other people can understand his work but also because it aids in his understanding of what he's getting at. He's one of those thinkers that has a big exoteric/esoteric divide and his more technical works don't have as many pop-culture allusions.

>> No.1598508

>>1598499
A coffee shop in Amsterdam, maybe? Cause you have to pretty stoned to believe you are actually Slavoj Zizek.

Anyway, are you from eastern europe? What do you think about my analysis of his fascination for pop culture? The perspective must be completely different from that of someone that grew up with it.

>> No.1598510

>>1598508
Jesus Christ man, did you not read this thread? My Slovenian parents were hippies in the early 70s, they listened to Donovan and the Animals, wore kaftans and bellbottoms and dreamed of going to India by truck. How is that not the pop culture experience?

>> No.1598511

>>1598507
>Apart from the minor issue of Yugoslavia not being in the Soviet-bloc

Yeah, that's true. I actually got it confused with Czechoslovakia for some posts. Thanks.

>> No.1598513

I saw him give a talk at UC Irvine last summer. Shit was pretty cool.

Also if you're interested in film theory then A Pervert's Guide to Cinema is pretty much a much see.

>It's kind of sad that their actual argument is what he is referencing, but I think that it's intellectually immature to take arguments on the news not even purported and supported by actual studies as something to argue against.
It's a viewpoint that I'm sure more than a few people have.

Zizek being a Marxist and all uses "liberal" in a pretty wide sense and there are self-proclaimed liberals like Joe Liberman or Hilary Clinton who have advocated video game censorship.

>> No.1598515

>>1598510
>Jesus Christ man, did you not read this thread?

Yeah, I read it. Didn't see any reference to your parents, sorry, I'll read it again.

About, your parents, that's quite interesting. Did they have access to movies also?

>> No.1598519

>>1598515
Of course they did. Yugoslavians grew up with western pop culture since it first developed. There were Chuck Berry or Elvis soundalikes playing here even in the 50s. There was avantgarde cinema and playwriting in the 60s.

Heck, even the USSR had prog bands in the 70s, it's not like we were living in Orwell land.

>> No.1598524

>>1598519
You keep going back to music. What about movies? Wasn't there censorship or they were watching your regular hollywood blockbuster every week? What about tv series or shows? I'm not saying that anything of that is good, just that the dominant presence of american entertainment was and is a constant of the whole western culture.

Also, I find it funny that you are so defensive about it. I'm just curious.

>> No.1598525
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1598525

>>1598508

I'm czech, but I was born shortly after the liberation of central and eastern europe and the fall of the berlin wall.

However, my brothers and father all lived inside soviet czechoslovakia and yes you are right you become enthralled by because after the revolution or after you leave the country you read the newspaper and the world is completely new, all the lies and propaganda about western culture evaporates and with it everything you thought you knew about that half of the world. It's a tremendously powerful experience and I think of course if you are an intellectual like ZIzek then you consider more the power of popular culture as a tool for seeing the reality of a country.

I agree with this guy too, >>1598502 , as soon as there is a trickle of information about reality which can't be suppressed, like through music and other art, your conviction to understand it becomes even more tantalising i think.

and I wish I was in amsterdam. Instead I am studying now in Glasgow.

>> No.1598528

>>1598519
Also don't forget the "golden-age" of music groups turing were in Yugoslavia. We had all the big and important bands of the day back then. Now since 1992 (the last "big" thing: Nirvana concert and to last year when finally we got a modern venue in Stožice) there were almost no big concerts here no famous musicians or things like that.
It's a bit paradoxial...
Anyway. Yeah I think we proved enough that Yugoslavia was as much imersed in western pop-culture than any other "western" state. we just mixed that with our type of Socialism and with a bit of eastern pop-culture (I still remember eastern cartoons).
And that's why Žižek even in his "communist" youth, when he was actually a member of the party (for a while) he was already refering to western pop-culture and all.
The actual fall-out with him and communist party came, with the fall-out of Socialist Youth with Communist Party.

>> No.1598530

>>1598524
Not the one you're wanting the answer from, but another Slovenian. AFAIK movies came here mostly uncensored (mostly I think there were few which were). But they came here with a bit of a delay.
I know my mothers first movie in cinema was 2001: Space Oddisey, and I think it was few years (cca 2) after the initial release.

>> No.1598533

He turned me from a socialist to a communist.

He's one of my favorite people.

>> No.1598536

>>1598528
>Anyway. Yeah I think we proved enough that Yugoslavia was as much imersed in western pop-culture than any other "western" state

I don't think so. Seems like there was part of the youth culture that had some access to music, but that's pretty far from being immersed. First of all cause it sounds like you had to look for it in order to get and had a counter-culture nuisance. Is not the same as going to the theater to see a hollywood movie, smoke lucky strike when you're done, get into your car and listen to some pop-rock music, get home, switch on TV and watch an american TV series.

>> No.1598539

>>1598524
>Is not the same as going to the theater to see a hollywood movie, smoke lucky strike when you're done, get into your car and listen to some pop-rock music, get home, switch on TV and watch an american TV series.

But that was exactly what people were doing from the late 60s onwards. Peyton Place, Picket Fences and Dynasty were huge here.

>> No.1598543

>>1598539
Peyton Place, Picket Fences and Dinasty? Apart from Picket Fences being from the late 90s that's quite interesting. Or did they show all of them during the 90s already?

>> No.1598544

Free music, films and fiction provide the foundation for revolutionary thought.

They don't make you free, but the help you to see that you are not.

>> No.1598546
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1598546

>He turned me from a socialist to a communist.

>> No.1598554

>>1598543
During the 90s there was kind of a lot of different wars going on in that area, if I remember correctly.

>> No.1598556

>>1598543
Let me rephrase: Stop, Slovenia's first celebrity gossip and pop culture magazine cum TV guide, was first issued in 1968 as a weekly complementary publication to Delo, the Party's officially sanctioned newspaper. Both are still the most read publications in the country in their respective niches.

>> No.1598565

>>1598556
Yeah, well, I'm not sure you have any idea of how the magazine was during the 60s or 70s.

>> No.1598584

I feel like it is only a matter of time before he publishes a book on the deconstruction of internet memes.

I wonder what he'd think of "The penis was"

>> No.1598587

>>1598584
I've been anxiously awaiting the day critical theory finally discovers the internet.

I mean, okay, movies are cool and all.... but to ignore the internet and how huge of a role it plays in culture and our day-to-day lives is ridiculous.

>> No.1598588

>>1596583
>>1596583
pederčina

>> No.1598589

>>1598587

It's just too big.

And it's all well to say that we could just analyze it's piece-parts, but none of them are really independent from the others.

>> No.1598597

>>1598588
Orly?

Yes I'm mad you don't give any reasoning...

>> No.1598599

>>1598597
ispravak - pretenciozna pederčina

>> No.1598603

>>1598599
Zizek is not really the kind of philosopher I would consider pretentious.

>> No.1598620

>>1598603
he knows nothing about real life. He lives a life sheltered from reality, that's why he's a shitty person to listen to when it comes to life and politics.

>> No.1598621

babby's first crit theorist?

check out early horkheimer, fromm, benjamin

>> No.1598626

>>1598620

Ad hom

>> No.1598627

>>1598621
I hope you also mean early Fromm.
Because the current or old Fromm is Self-help books sold as philosophy.

>> No.1598629

>>1598626
Ad hominems aren't always fallacious.

>> No.1598632

>>1598629

But this one is.

"He's sheltered so his politics are wrong"

Is fallacious.

>> No.1598634

>>1598629
Okay... But then please do explain how is he sheltered from reality?
And from which reality is he sheltered from?
And aren't you not also sheltered from "reality".

>> No.1598637

>>1598632
Why?

>> No.1598641

>>1598634
He never experienced life with all its ups and downs. Neither did most of philosophers, and that's why 99% of them don't pass the test of time.

People who really admire philosophers are the people who try to be philosophers. So it basically comes down to circle jerking.

>> No.1598660

>>1598641
>He never experienced life with all its ups and downs.

Everybody experiences life with ups and downs.

>> No.1598706

any one know where I can download the book:
The puppet and the dwarf

>> No.1598723

>>1598660
>>1598660
ive never had proper downs.

>> No.1598745

>>1598641
Except that philosophy has constantly influenced history to the point that entire cultures are based upon certain philosophers ideas.

Do you think this tolerance movement came out of nowhere? Who do you think is responsible for creating the american form of government? Who do you think was the first to say democracy was bullshit?

All philosophers, and they felt that shit from every angle, and they all questioned whether or not they were right at every turn. That's why it's kind of hard to understand them, because these people spent so much time wrapped in their own heads that not much translates.

Thus you see someone like this who is arguing against culture. Philosophy by nature is a rejection of culture.

>> No.1598747

>>1598723

digusting tripfags are a special case you're not even really human

>> No.1598756

>>1598747
im more human than you'll ever be anonymous.

>> No.1598762

>>1598706
Here you go
http://www.mediafire.com/?yiyww3evzzj

>> No.1598764

>>1598762
Thanks

>> No.1598788

>>1598756

>mistakes being hated on the internet with being human

>> No.1598795

>>1598756

don't go saging my heart
i couldn't if i tried
oh honey if i get saged
baby you're not the kind

ooh-oh, well nobody knows it
but when i was saged
you were my sage

etcetera

>> No.1598809

anyone knows where i can download The Pervert's Guide to Cinema ? Or watch online?

>> No.1598831

>>1596583
Too many lil' accent marks on his name.
Two too many
XD

>> No.1598832

>>1598488
>soviet block
You are now aware Zizek grew up outside of the Soviet Blok.

Come on, this is basic history guys.

>> No.1598844

>>1598524
>>1598539
To add to this, for the retard who refuses to believe there wasn't mind control in Yugoslavia: I know some Moldovan guys who run a cool little shop in the UK, and they were smuggling stuff like Nike shoes and Run DMC in from Belgrade during the 80s. Yugoslavia even had a pretty decent music scene. Even on anti party sentiments it could be a bit of a joke, apart from if you'd fought against the communists during WWII.

>> No.1598854

>>1598832
>>1598832
Yugoslavia=communism

>>1598745
If you question something and think about it, that doesn't mean you're doing something. It's all talk, talk and talk.

Oh, and by the way, I hate today's society. And I grew up in communism. Hate that too. Am I a philosopher?

>> No.1598859

>>1598854
Yugoslavia also = Non-aligned movement, if you care to do what is known as basic fact checking.

>> No.1598863

>>1598859
NO! STALIN PERSONALLY RULED YUGOSLAVIA AND AFTER HE DIED HE BECAME A LICH KING AND CONTINUED TO RULE YUGOSLAVIA AKA "THE LICH KINGDOM". Come today to visit the beautiful lich kingdom. Our stunning lich beaches, glorious lich mountains, and hordes of undead will give you a vacation you will never forget. All glory to Comrade Lich Sorcerer Overlord Stalin!

>> No.1598890
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1598890

>>1598621

I prefer Zizek precisely because he doesn't take his literary criticism and ideologies very seriously at all, which is apt when you consider how absurd literary crit can be.

Also this video is the greatest philosophical rambling ever recorded:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJPhA9TGRls

>>1598809

http://www.archive.org/details/SlavojZizek-ThePervertsGuideToCinema2006

>> No.1598895

His alternative you ask?

Do nothing.

He be trolling you.

>> No.1599282

bump

>> No.1599327

>>1598525
what age are you truman?

>> No.1599336

>>1599327

18

>> No.1599349

Lacan has its shortcomings

>> No.1599412

a lot of what he says can be captured by the idea of moral residue. i don't care for the psychoanalysis stuff at all.

>> No.1599418

>>1598627
if you are talking about the late fromm's emphasis on will and whatnot, i don't care for that at all. still, it's not entirely dismissable.

>> No.1599422
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1599422

>>1599412

>I don't care for psychoanalysis

That's because you're a feminist.

>> No.1599430

wonder when he'll die on the toilet, ironic cuz he spends soo much time talking about em, from too many deep fried pb and j sandwiches

>> No.1599437

>>1599422
go be dumb somewhere else.

>> No.1599441

>>1599430
started my first BEE book today, D&E.

>> No.1599443

>>1599441
cool dude which one

>> No.1599464

>>1599437

Then why don't you explain why you don't think psychoanalysics are useful.

Or do you just dismiss it because you don't like it?

>> No.1599471
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1599471

>>1599430
fat is fabulous!

>> No.1599477
File: 109 KB, 545x568, zizek.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1599477

>>1599430
Someone is jelly of his bear mode.

Look at him. A man who could crush you with his mighty paw, then sleep like a baby.

>> No.1599488

>>1599471
who now?

>> No.1599507

>>1599443
i figured i should start with american psycho since i know kind of what to expect from the movie. its been ok so far though i lol'd that bateman thinks Toshiba is a good tv brand as well as at another few things. still early on though think theyre at harry's. put less than zero on my kindle too.

>> No.1599594

>>1599488

Looks like you were banned eh, hun?

>> No.1599599

>>1599594
wat

>> No.1599602

>>1599594
I'm just posting as anon from now on

the "F" posts were me not backspacing the whole name

>> No.1599606

>>1599602

Then I'm finished as well :D

>> No.1599616

>>1599606
how romantic

we shall die together

i cant promise that someday, many days from now, i might rise from the ashes

>> No.1599789

>>1599464
better question is why do you think you are worth my time.
go fuck yourself