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/lit/ - Literature

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1588042 No.1588042 [Reply] [Original]

Recommend me a book about the limitations of language and the spoken/written word, if its ever been done.

>> No.1588046

bumping for interest

>> No.1588054

Tractatus (which was largely drafted in a WWI POW camp) is an easy place to start

anything by Wittgenstein and his progeny

>> No.1588055

>>1588054
this

>> No.1588196
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1588196

Anyone care to summarize his philosophy. I've read his wiki, but I still don't get it.

>> No.1588210
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1588210

Hitler and Wittgenstein knew each other as school boys.

>> No.1588216

for a counterpoint, consider reading penelope maddy's second philosophy.

>> No.1588226

>>1588216
>Second Philosophy can't be specified directly - 'trust only the methods of science!' or some such thing
> This Second Philosopher begins from perceptual common sense and progresses from there to systematic observation, active experimentation, theory formation and testing, working all the while to assess, correct and improve her methods as she goes. Second Philosophy is then the result of the Second Philosopher's investigations.

Noice. So she basically knocks science back several thousand years, does that babby science, and says it's not science, so naturalism is safe after all!

>> No.1588228

sure
20th century poetry

>> No.1588237

>>1588226
wat

>(PSY) above shows that Quine is wrong to think of ordinary physical objects as organizational posits. (ATM) shows that Quine is wrong to hold that we should believe theories that optimally possess the Quinean theoretical virtues. Once the distinction between experience and theoretical posit is undermined, so too is confirmational holism, underdetermination, and even Quinean naturalism.

>A primary lesson is that we ought not to build philosophical theories on anything as shaky as intuitions that things must be thus-and-so. Too often our intuitions -- whether inherited from our academic training, the workings of our language, or our natural make-up -- are no more than virtually irresistible impulses to think in certain ways.

>> No.1588241

>>1588226
she's not reworking science but philosophy. that blurb is a contrast to intuition based methods.

>> No.1588249
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1588249

>>1588237
Sounds just like plain old skepticism vs belief (religious). Radical skepticism is what it is. Nothing special here. Jesus, look at this lady.

>> No.1588254
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1588254

>>1588249

>> No.1588251

>>1588249

Indeed. Wittgenstein is much more attractive, I'll stick with him kthx

>> No.1588261

>>1588249
My favorite computer science professor in college looked exactly like her. Of course my comp. sci. professor was male.

>> No.1588265

>>1588249
not at all.
you can read this review here
http://ndpr.nd.edu/review.cfm?id=11903

on prelinguistic conceptual structure
>(PSY) Studies in infant cognition indicate that pre-linguistic infants perceive and represent ordinary physical objects and, starting around the time language emerges, gradually develop sortal concepts and the apparatus of quantification.

on empirical nature of philosophy
>Why shouldn't the empirical study of what conditions are a priori, what questions are well-formed, what objects are mind-independent be adequate without the need for some special, philosophical, extra-empirical account?

>> No.1588268
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1588268

robert anton wilson, nigguuuuh

>> No.1588611

1984 is a doupleplusgood book on this subject

>> No.1588626

i think you are the same guy that posted in another wittgenstein thread. But long story short, read something related to the philosophy of modeling, particularly from the perspective of complex systematics.

Essays on Life Itself by Rosen

Read the modeling section

>> No.1588646

>>1588196
There's a thread in the Philosophy of Language section of philosophyforums.com That breaks down Wittgenstein's writings. It's not completed I don't think, but it's well written and will keep you busy.

>> No.1588657

A couple of good films for this sort of thing in case you're interested;

The Third Man
Pontypool

I'm guessing the latter is based on a book but I've never heard of it.

>> No.1588677
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1588677

MOST OF HIS WORKS COVER THAT SUBJECT.

HE WAS GENIAL.

>> No.1588680
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1588680

I'm downloading the torrent of this right now.

>> No.1588703
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1588703

>>1588042
Several works of Robert Anton Wilson(already mentioned) dealing with the subject can be found here:

http://www.megaupload.com/es/?d=27X5LIHF

As well as a large number of books with related themes such as the Art of Memetics.

>> No.1588851
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1588851

Has a work of fiction ever been written on this subject? I'd like to know. I sure hope it hasn't, because If it hasn't, then my first novel shall been written about the limits of language and words.

>> No.1588852

>>1588851
One of Eugene Ionesco's plays deals with this subject. Can't remember the title, though, sorry.