To argue against Christianity is to presuppose its falsity

[Anonymous No.15406884]

1 Cor 2:14
>But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1 Corinthians 3:19
>For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

Therefore, a sinful, natural, carnal man who argues against God through his reason alone is wasting his time, and only digging his hole even deeper.


Deuteronomy 4:29
>But from there you will seek the Lord your God and you will find him, if you search after him with all your heart and with all your soul.
Proverbs 8:17
>I love those who love me, and those who seek me diligently find me.
Jeremiah 29:13
>You will seek me and find me, when you seek me with all your heart.
Matthew 7:7-8
>Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives, and the one who seeks finds, and to the one who knocks it will be opened.
Isaiah 55:6-7
>Seek the Lord while he may be found; call upon him while he is near; let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts; let him return to the Lord, that he may have compassion on him, and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
Lamentations 3:25
>The Lord is good to those who wait for him, to the soul who seeks him.
James 4:8
>Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.

[Anonymous No.15406908]

>to argue against god is wrong because people who believe in god say so
whoa

[Anonymous No.15406922]

>>15406884
can't you stupid turds just fuck off?

[Anonymous No.15406924]

>>15406884
this. literally any supposed "argument" against Christianity is just a bugman hatred of the demands Christ makes of us.

[Anonymous No.15406929]

>>15406884
>Be God
>Create humans and command them to believe in you
>Implant in humans only two faculties of genuine truth-acquisition -- namely reason and the senses
>Give them a third one, """spiritual discernment""", but make it completely indistinguishable from emotion, so that there is really no way to know whether something is a spiritual revelation or an emotional sensation
>Because you have created emotion to be erratic and unreliable, humans conclude that it should be dismissed when investigating matters of truth
>Reveal your truth in a way that is repugnant to both reason and the senses, the only reliable faculties of truth-acquisition you gave humans, but command them to believe in it anyway
>If they don't believe in it, you torture them for eternity

[Anonymous No.15406943]

>>15406929
reason alone leads you everywhere and nowhere. The wisest philosophers know this. “I know that I know nothing.” Who are you to judge God?

[Anonymous No.15406991]

>>15406929
again, to judge God is to presuppose his non-existence

[Anonymous No.15407048]

>>15406943
>>15406991
God, according to your view, only gave us two faculties to discern the truth -- reason and the senses. Of course you believe he gave us a third one: spiritual discernment. But spiritual discernment is not a reliable faculty because it is phenomenologically indistinguishable from emotion, which we know is also not reliable. Thus, there being no way to tell if your sensation is a mere emotion or a cause of genuine spiritual discernment, we cannot take it to be veridical. We must then look to the two other, reliable, faculties -- reason and the senses -- to see if we can discern the truths of Christianity through these.
Well, it turns out we cannot. God revealed his truth to us in a way that is repugnant both to reason and to empirical investigation. It is all well and dandy to say 'Human beings do not have sufficient reasoning power to discern this truth; their empirical faculties are far too limited; God is beyond human comprehension', but then you cannot claim that God acted justly, from a human perspective, when he created us without the ability to comprehend him while also commanding us to believe in him. "But this is from a human perspective!" Yes, the human perspective is what I am limited to, because your God created me a human.

It is analogous to taking a child and exposing it to things it is not equipped to comprehend -- complex geometry, philosophy, etc. -- and, on the pain of torture, commanding the child to believe wholeheartedly in these things. The child, being a child, is restricted to the mindset of a child. He cannot transcend childhood and believe in things he does not comprehend. Same with God and humans.

[Anonymous No.15407078]

>>15407048
>Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
It’s easy to complain about the method of spiritual discernment when you have no real experience with it.

[Anonymous No.15407099]

Jesus is a combo of various middle eastern and Greek myths

[Anonymous No.15407114]

>>15407048
>He cannot transcend childhood and believe in things he does not comprehend.
Wrong??? It is quite easy to believe in things one does not understand. I would wager that you do not understand the inner workings of electricity, computing, and the internet, yet you believe in them enough to have made this post. If not - more likely a lie than truth - then you cannot deny that >99% of people on 4chan and indeed the internet in general lack those understandings.
>I haven't experience spiritual discernment, so nobody has, it's just emotions
kk

[Anonymous No.15407184]

>>15407078
>Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded.
I tried many times to do exactly this. I started going to church when I was 17, on my own volition, (What a disappointing conversation I had with a man at my local Baptist congregation! He told me: 'I don't really believe in all this; I only come here with my wife.' I felt that this was the attitude of everyone there. The service was incredibly tepid as well. It was then I became disillusioned with public religiosity and turned my gaze inwards to myself, trying to seek God internally.) and read the Bible from cover to cover, apart from maybe the minor prophets. I tried, really tried, to refrain from lust, greed, unkindness, disobedience to my parents, and other sins. I prayed every day. I accepted mockery and bullying in high school because I would thank God before every meal in the canteen. I once kneeled before my father, with my face to the floor, similar to how the biblical holy men would act in the Torah, and asked for his forgiveness when I got angry with him. I am being sincere when I say I tried with my entire soul to seek God. But heaven's silence was unmoving. The only 'spiritual revelations' I got were, to me, indistinguishable from emotions stirred up in me by personal crises or experiences with art. I was 21 when I ended this phase and became agnostic. I still have high respect for Christianity, and I wish I could have made it work, but in the end I lost my faith, probably forever.

[Anonymous No.15407210]

>>15407114
>Wrong??? It is quite easy to believe in things one does not understand. I would wager that you do not understand the inner workings of electricity, computing, and the internet, yet you believe in them enough to have made this post. If not - more likely a lie than truth - then you cannot deny that >99% of people on 4chan and indeed the internet in general lack those understandings.
Those are all empirically and/or rationally investigable. None of them are repugnant to the two faculties I mentioned.

[Anonymous No.15407227]

>>15407184
would you classify yourself as a Christian in that period of time? And how long was that period?

[Anonymous No.15407235]

Arguing about a collection of Jewish mythological stories, which contradict the laws of nature, and are easily debunked by modern historical/archeological records

There’s a reason this shit was left behind in the 18th century

[Anonymous No.15407252]

>>15407235
>which contradict the laws of nature
who do you think created nature, genius

[Anonymous No.15407275]

>>15407252
Clearly it was Jehovah cause the Bible says so!

[Anonymous No.15407282]

>>15407227
I think I started taking Christianity seriously at around age 15/16, when I found a Bible while visiting my grandmother's house where there was no internet and all I could do was read. I vaguely remember staying up late into the night to read it. After that I wanted to become close to God. Enoch, who is said in the Bible to have 'walked with God', and Moses, who was closest to him, were my inspirations. While there was definitely some hubris mixed in with my motivations, involving imagining myself as a prophet walking with God and the like, I genuinely did strive to get close to him and obey him as much as I could. As I said, the phase ended around age 21, but was declining even before that.

[Anonymous No.15407303]

>>15407275
>There have been an over 3000 gods so far but actually only your belief that none of them exist is real.
>All their worldviews are silly made up nonsense.
>But not yours.
>Yours is real.

[Anonymous No.15407307]

>>15407275
>pic

[Anonymous No.15407315]

>>15407282
is that a yes or no?

[Anonymous No.15407317]

>>15406884
masterful exegesis. i can tell you contemplated these passages for quite a while. youll go down as one of the greats

[Anonymous No.15407348]

>>15407315
Obviously yes. How could I do all the stuff I talked about without considering myself a Christian?

[Anonymous No.15407351]

>>15406884
Based presuppositionalist!
You should check out the transcendental argument for God. A lot of Calvinists use it but imo it only works in the context of orthodox theology.
Anybody know some good orthodox theologians that use this type of apologetic?

[Anonymous No.15407357]

>>15407348
2 Corinthians 13:5
>Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith; examine yourselves! Or do you not recognize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you—unless indeed you fail the test?

https://www.cgg.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Library.verses/ID/2381/Good-Works-Necessity-of-verses.htm

[Anonymous No.15407381]

>>15407303
>>15407307
Tbh senpai Genesis is just a rip off of the Enûma Eliš. So maybe Marduk created the world with the help of Zeus?

[Anonymous No.15407681]

every atheist needs to see this

[Anonymous No.15407877]

bump

[Anonymous No.15407946]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

[Anonymous No.15407950]

>>15407946
You are lost. But it is fine, you will be found. :3

[Anonymous No.15408046]

>>15407681
To argue in favor of Christianity is to presuppose its truth

[Anonymous No.15408107]

>>15407950

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

[Anonymous No.15408108]

Reason and the senses are given to man to confront the principle of individuation which is the fundamental obstacle to God.

[Anonymous No.15408115]

>>15406884
>Therefore, a sinful, natural, carnal man who argues against God through his reason alone is wasting his time, and only digging his hole even deeper.

To bad the West has an entire movement of people trying to arque against (orthodox) Christianity, through mysticism and the occult.

[Anonymous No.15408122]

>>15408046
the spiritual man is in a position to believe its truth or falsity, while the natural man is not. Often, those who practice semen retention and other will unexpectedly find God even when they weren’t looking. If you masturbate, or fornicate, or steal, or lie, or extort, or indulge in extreme pleasures of anything in the world, or have pride, then you’re not in a position to make a clear assessment without presupposing falsity.

[Anonymous No.15408128]

>>15407184
You should have looked for God in music, art, philosophy, nature, etc which are really inspired things.

[Anonymous No.15408153]

>>15406884
Holy based.... how will atheists ever recover????

[Anonymous No.15408162]

>>15407184
>local Baptist congregation
>Christianity

[Anonymous No.15408221]

>>15407950
Find deez nutz

[Anonymous No.15408234]

>>15408122
Cucked by Christ

[Anonymous No.15408241]

>>15408234
cucked by Satan

[Anonymous No.15408367]

>>15407184
>>15407282
This post makes me feel shameful for remembering the militant-atheist phase I went through at this same age where you truly wanted to be close to God. Please, anon, pray for Moses and Enoch who are in heaven with Christ right now to ask Him to show you the true path. I will pray for you too, brother.

[Anonymous No.15408468]

>>15406884
In order to argue one have to agree on definitions. This doesn't mean you have to accept them. If you have wildly different systems of thought then you have to argue from within the other person's system in order to break it down.

[Anonymous No.15408487]

>>15408046
presupposing a truth is trivial and logical.

[Anonymous No.15408817]

>>15407184
Did you get baptized? Shame you went to a shitty church. it makes a big difference when you find a genuine congregation. Anyway, all I could say is be patient. Sometime things take a long time to pan out. Remember the Jews doubted Moses when he was leading them to the holy land. Its a common motif.

[Anonymous No.15408864]

>>15406884
>To argue against Christianity is to presuppose its falsity
Yes, because your faggot religion is so blatantly wrong to anyone who doesn't have his head shoved several dimensions up his own ass.

[Anonymous No.15408939]

If I cannot find god through reason, what's the point? If gods existence is completely beyond a humans mind to find or believe, then for all intents and purposes he might as well not exist. I know this is hard to wrap your tiny dogmatic mind around, by something which cannot be found by either sight, taste, touch, hearing, smell, or the logic of the human mind cannot be considered to exist from the relative standpoint of a human. Even if it does exist it doesn't matter because no one can ever know, they can only "believe" which is something that requires a total abandonment of all common sense and which quite frankly will not be possible for a vast amount of humans. If after all that god really does exist, and will punish me simply for not believing, then he is not a god that I can ever consider good. If I did believe in such a god, I believe him evil. And, again, if your gods definition of good defies all human ability to understand it, it means nothing from the standpoint of a human. It's just pissing into the wind and calling it a riddle.

[Anonymous No.15408951]

>>15408367

[Anonymous No.15408984]

>>15408939
>I know this is hard to wrap your tiny dogmatic mind around
there’s your problem

[Anonymous No.15408986]

>>15408951
This
I went through a shameful c*tholic phase where I doubted exaltation and thought africans could be based (no, they have the mark of ham, always beware)
Mormonism is true Christianity

[Anonymous No.15409251]

>>15408986
>>15408951
Isn't mormonism just a form of masonry?
Their group worship is pretty demonic.
https://youtu.be/VngM80qCOJw

[Anonymous No.15409283]

>>15409251
>guys shaking hands in a room full of clean sheets
>this is somehow demonic compared to a pedophile ritually summoning the blood and flesh of a dead god to eat
what?

[Anonymous No.15409289]

>>15406929
>Reveal your truth in a way that is repugnant to both reason and the senses, the only reliable faculties of truth-acquisition you gave humans, but command them to believe in it anyway
You can get to God through reason though, read Aquinas as an example.

[Anonymous No.15409322]

>>15409289
>bro read aquinas
>be sure not to read kant tho
lol...

[Anonymous No.15409356]

>>15409322
>as an example

[Anonymous No.15409382]

>>15409356
>as an example
of cope
there is no such this as knowing god through reason
the only people playing this game are retarded mutt protties

[Anonymous No.15409417]

>>15407184
Reading the Bible, it may have seemed like God spoke to people often, but the Bible was written over a period of a thousand years, and taking into account the historical contexts, God only ever spoke to people on special occasions.

Given that, if you decide to continue down the path you're on, I will encourage you to seek truth about this whole crazy world we live in. Seek truth even if it leads to your death.

[Anonymous No.15409418]

>>15408367
>pray for Moses and Enoch who are in heaven with Christ right now
They died.

[Anonymous No.15409423]

>>15409289
>Aquinas
wasn't he a proto reddit bugman who trying to explain God away with reason?

[Anonymous No.15409435]

>>15409418
And got raised into heaven upon meeting Christ in Hades before the resurrection.

[Anonymous No.15409455]

>>15406908
Fpbp

[Anonymous No.15409494]

>>15409435
Moses and Enoch will simply be raised from the dead in paradise John 3:13

[Anonymous No.15409498]

Daily reminder it has been empirically proven religiosity stifles scientific innovation.

https://www.princeton.edu/~rbenabou/papers/Religion%20December%201g_snd.pdf
http://www.nber.org/papers/w21052.pdf

Daily reminder the overwhelming majority of leading scientists are atheists

https://www.nature.com/articles/28478
https://evolution-outreach.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1936-6434-6-33

Daily reminder most philosophers are atheists

https://philpapers.org/surveys/results.pl

Daily reminder religious people are less intelligent according to dozens of studies.

http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/pdf/The_Relation_Between_Intelligence_and_Religiosity__A_Meta-Analysis_and_Some_Proposed_Explanations.pdf

Daily reminder religious people are less educated

https://www.economist.com/news/international/21623712-how-education-makes-people-less-religiousand-less-superstitious-too-falling-away

Religious people are literally a lesser breed of human

[Anonymous No.15409529]

>>15409498
Most NP winners were Christians, I guess someone doesn't like history

[Anonymous No.15409606]

>>15409529
Citation needed
And no, Baruch Aba Shalev is not a reliable source

[Anonymous No.15409634]

>>15409498
most religious people don’t even follow their religion properly

[Anonymous No.15409649]

>>15409606
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_Nobel_laureates

[Anonymous No.15409667]

>>15409649
>source: Baruch Aba Shalev
Lmao
Look at the wikipedia list yourself, laureates confirmed as christians by actual sources are a minority

[Anonymous No.15409716]

>>15409667
Sure thing, pal

[Anonymous No.15409726]

>>15409716
Based retard

[Anonymous No.15409755]

>>15409726

[Anonymous No.15409763]

>>15409755
Christians are the ones who believe the universe came from nothing that's the entire point of creation ex nihilo.

[Anonymous No.15409771]

>>/his/

[Anonymous No.15410047]

>>15409763
Came from nothing and created from nothing by God are two different things.

[Anonymous No.15410059]

>>15406884
So?

[Anonymous No.15410447]

>>15407078
>It’s easy to complain about the method of spiritual discernment when you have no real experience with it.
Can you even hear yourself? Are your healing crystals broken or something?

[Anonymous No.15411216]

bump

[Anonymous No.15412281]

>>15410047
Creation ex nihilo comes from a misunderstanding of the text and taking modern scientific findings and trying to fit them into the Bible. In Genesis God creates the universe out of primordial waters. The earth in ancient Hebrew cosmology was a domed cavern surrounded by water, with Sheol below, and God residing on the top of the dome.

[Anonymous No.15412408]

>>15409494
BASED. SOUL KEKS BTFO

[Anonymous No.15412448]

>>15412408
https://www.gotquestions.org/John-3-13.html

[Anonymous No.15413530]

>>15410047
But God came from nothing?

[Anonymous No.15413597]

>>15406884
Protestants and their retarded Bible-fetishism

[Anonymous No.15413926]

>>15407252
And how do you know it was your god? cuz my priest told me so!
Not knowing why something happens and then accepting the first answer you get is the mark of the unintelligent.

[Anonymous No.15413948]

>>15406908
fpbp

[Anonymous No.15413975]

>>15406884
To argue against fox spirits is to presuppose their falsity.
A sinful, natural, carnal man who argues against fox spirits through his reason alone is wasting his time, and only digging his hole even deeper.

[Anonymous No.15413984]

>>15406884
>To argue against Christianity is to presuppose its falsity
no shit, sherlock

[Anonymous No.15414044]

>>15412281
The very first verse in the Bible is "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth."
The Bible is not a book of science but a book of God's progressive revelation to humanity. Science changes throughout the ages, but God and His word do not change.
>But God came from nothing?
Due to the limitations of human reason, we can only understand anything in terms of either something or nothing. So when we try to understand God, we may say 'nothing came before God.' This is inaccurate though because God is the one who created the notion of somethingness and nothingness. Before God, there was no nothing. I'm afraid it is difficult to understand, but God is not capable of being fully understood.

[Anonymous No.15414060]

>>15406908
We've had three centuries of proof of the nature of the godless human being. When they are moral, it is because they axiomatically - and likely biologically - are tuned to Christian morality.
This means that Christianity has done its installation properly, and is no longer needed as itself.
At least from a materialistic perspective this would be the case, but there is a way for it to be the spiritual way as well, and this does not contradict Christianity; a new religion, an heir, must come to be. The desert is where the church will find itself in at the end, and it will give birth, even if the (((antichrist))) and all its followers are to stop it.

I presume Christianity will merge with the most pagan of pagan religions, Hinduism, and the synthesis will end Kali Yuga.

[Anonymous No.15414085]

>>15414044
>but God and His word do not change.
Only it does. God changes his mind about things all the time in the Bible.

[Anonymous No.15414099]

>>15414085
Jeremiah 8:8
Did you ever wonder how God talked to people? Did Christ ever imply things?

[Anonymous No.15414111]

>>15414044
>but God and His word do not change.
Nobody has ever heard the word of god we only have the accounts of mortal men who's bold claims could be rationalized in mental illness. Organised religion as a base form is faith based, the only place it should be observed is with hard scientific evidence else it is just contributing to the development of mental illness and metaphysical spooks. The purpose of mortality is to further the interests of those who developed it and for most that is the Church since that is what Western morality is based upon

[Anonymous No.15414112]

>>15414099
>Did you ever wonder how God talked to people?
No. Don't care.
>Did Christ ever imply things?
Yes, quite possibly more often than he spoke plainly.

[Anonymous No.15414128]

>>15414112
>Yes, quite possibly more often than he spoke plainly.
So do accept some level of relativity and ambiguity to these questions. Since translation kills much symbolism, we may end up doing the polar opposite of any particular teaching simply by relying on our stubbornness and lower IQ algorithm thinking, simply by being a species of organisms that relies on each other.

[Anonymous No.15414133]

>>15414128
So 'revelation' isn't clear at all and we have no way of definitively discerning the true content of revelation, thereby negating its entire purpose. Cool.

[Anonymous No.15414135]

>>15414112
>No. Don't care.
Why not? Isn't that at the core of the theist-X/theist-Y/atheist/deist... issue? If it's people channeling their organic radiobodies to phenomena they can't completely understand, then it will result in organic noise amidst the message. If it is an organism lying, then it will result in nothing but organic noise amidst the message. If it is an organism attempting to construct a fundamental metaphysical model and attributing qualities to its findings, it will result in something as well...

[Anonymous No.15414143]

>>15414133
You just want to outsource your life at an algorithm, you want it to be like school or army. It's not. There are metaphysical maps, timeless guidance and central themes found that help humans who accept the help. Despite our flaws as organisms.

[Anonymous No.15414146]

>>15414135
>Why not?
We have no way of knowing what by its very nature is outside of all of our channels of knowing. It all amounts to navel gazing.

[Anonymous No.15414157]

>>15414060
We've had millions of years of evolution by natural selection of the godless human being. When they are moral, it is because they evolutionarily - this is, biologically - are tuned to evolutionarily succesful morality.
This means that evolution has done its role properly, and is no longer needed as itself.
At least from a materialistic perspective this would be the case, but there is a way for it to be a dogmatic way as well, and this is by producing Christianity; an aberration of cognition, a religion, must come to be. The brain is where the church will be conceptualized, and it will sprout many random beliefs, even if the [[[schizos]]] and all of their brainlets are to accept it.

I presume evolution will produce many religions which will merge and evolve over time, and the synthesis will end with gene-editing to prevent brainlets from being born

[Anonymous No.15414162]

>>15414146
>It all amounts to navel gazing.
I would say the opposite is true. Exploring the metaphysical framework of yourself and the Universe - including or excluding yourself - is anything but. Ignoring, living intentionally obscured on the subject, never taking risks on the topic, that is navel gazing.

[Anonymous No.15414165]

>>15414143
So does reading horoscopes, the farmer's almanac, or looking at a particularly interesting looking patch of grass. You can find your 'metaphysical maps, timeless guidance' in interpreting literally anything. That doesn't make it try, nor does it make it particularly interesting to me.

[Anonymous No.15414167]

>>15414085
I'm not entirely sure which passages you're referring to. Progressive revelation means as human beings change into the next stage of spiritual development, God reveals the new stage of his undertaking, that being the sanctification of His creation to Himself. As it says in Isaiah 11:
6 The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them.

7 And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.

8 And the sucking child shall play on the hole of the asp, and the weaned child shall put his hand on the cockatrice' den.

9 They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.

This may seem like fantasy, but God is referring to an age in the distant future where humanity and even the whole of creation will live in peace and harmony as He originally created it.

[Anonymous No.15414168]

>>15414157
>We've had millions of years of evolution by natural selection of the godless human being.
When was the last time you were in nature? Godless? Hah! Nope.
The anathema of existence is found in post-Revolution Europe. Grey cubes! Hah, that is truly godless.

[Anonymous No.15414171]

>>15414165
>You can find it anywhere so you should ignore it
t. man in bushes, hiding from God

[Anonymous No.15414172]

>>15414162
'Exploring metaphysical framework of yourself and the universe' is a very fancy way of saying you like playing make believe, from my perspective.
You know nothing about my life or how I conduct myself in it. I would like if if you would stop romanticizing on your behalf, and stop postulating on mine.

[Anonymous No.15414176]

>>15414171
pantheist hippie detected
I suggest your next area of 'metaphysical mapping' be in your schizophrenia medication. I think your have been putting it off for a bit too long.

[Anonymous No.15414177]

>>15406924
Shut up you fucking slave

[Anonymous No.15414179]

>>15414162
Larping this hard lmao

[Anonymous No.15414186]

>>15414172
>is a very fancy way of saying you like playing make believe, from my perspective.
"Make-believe" is a way humans are human software engineers, create laws (just an elaborate game of 'the floor is lava'), money...
What I want to do is the opposite. What is the truth? The core truth, what even makes our belief-interaction so fundamentally powerful? Who are we? Why are we, if there even is a why? Things of this nature. And the answer I find, does not need to be in words. Words are limited. Aesthetics and experiences are pure.

[Anonymous No.15414190]

>>15414176
>Everything is socially determined
>You've gone past my mental scarecrows, so you get a label! I mean three!

[Anonymous No.15414196]

>>15414186
Sad to say, but this level of abstraction still isn't going to make your rent payments go away.
I'm really done talking to you. If I wanted to waste posts like this I would just go on /x/.

[Anonymous No.15414201]

>>15414176
>this chemical pile is erroneous according to categorically unimportant value judgement (materialistic / atheistic) of an anon, therefore it should be chemically (materially) changed
Kek. You're just a modern witch hunter.

[Anonymous No.15414205]

>>15414196
>waste
Tell me about your priority structure, and why you even bother implying that it can be more important than any alternative. You can't without a metaphysical narrative.

[Anonymous No.15414208]

>>15414179
Carnal man calls it 'larping.'

[Anonymous No.15414213]

>>15414168
based schizo