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14834881 No.14834881 [Reply] [Original]

>all the apostles were asleep
>somehow we know what transpired
explain

>> No.14834885

Maybe they received the revelation at Pentecost thanks to the Holy Spirit.

>> No.14834907

>>14834885
yes that or the stories are fictional

>> No.14835019

its the constructs of faith we built along the way

>> No.14835033

>>14834881
The text doesn't say that only the apostles were there and also that all of them were asleep.

>> No.14835043

You can't 2+2 the bible

>> No.14835061

>>14834881
Probably the Lord itself told them

>> No.14835094
File: 203 KB, 835x835, 180723-shroud-thumb.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14835094

This thread is a cope

https://youtu.be/WRB16BARvz0

>> No.14835110
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14835110

>>14834881
>How can water chemically be converted to wine molecules?
Wow, with this level of big brained materialism I should just give up my beliefs...

>> No.14835120

>>14835110
Dumb prottie you are saved by works (material) not faith

>> No.14835196
File: 287 KB, 360x519, Divine Ladder.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
14835196

>>14835120
Not a prot.
>You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.
>James 2:24

Also works != material.
Works meaning a person's energies (energeia).
The materialism I'm criticizing is that of philosophical materialism; particular reductional science and classical foundationalism where critique lies on correspondence rather than coherence.

>> No.14835216
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14835216

>>14835120
You are saved by grace. Grace begins with faith but is maintained through works and the sacraments. Without faith, the works and sacraments give no grace, and without grace, you are not saved. Faith alone does not save you, but neither does works alone, which is the heresy of pelagianism.
Ultimately, whether or not you are saved depends on if you die in a state of grace or in a state of mortal sin.

>>14835196
Palamism is cringe

>> No.14835219

>>14835094
>sedevacantism.com

>> No.14835249

>>14835216
>For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

>> No.14835270

>>14835216
>Grace begins with faith
*Faith begins with grace

>> No.14835568
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14835568

>>14835219
Refute sedevacantism

>> No.14835587

>>14835120
There is no dialectical the soon between works and faith

>> No.14836161

>>14834881
Some gullible, insomniac fucker wasn't actually asleep so he focused on eavesdropping Jesus' schizo ramblings. Either that or it was just made up by some beliver.

>> No.14836165

It's almost like New Testament is just Jewish Bedside Tales: Repurposed Edition

>> No.14836168

>>14834881
Christians believe that the Bible was inspired by God. Today this is heavily qualified by emphasizing the human influence, that God was working through the writers' own abilities and experiences, and this is true to a degree, but in the past this was understood in a more strict manner more akin to something like automatic writing. Point being, no one needed to see it happen and the point you're making doesn't matter to Christian doctrine.