Guénon is a psyop

[Anonymous No.14789786]

Don't get cucked

The U.S. state department deliberately promotes Sufism/"traditionalism" (CIA Newspeak, Athari, "traditionalist" in Arabic, actually means anti Sufi) to counter political Islam, i.e. '"""fundamentalism""" (a buzzword for orthodoxy). Don't believe me? Read The Muslim World After After 9/11, prepared by the RAND Corporation for the USAF. Or read Building Moderate Muslim Networks, prepared by the RAND Corporation for the state department. Both documents are publicly available online. Check out Sufi Master Hakim Murad's lecture on YouTube, Riding the Tiger of Modernity. The man says he opposes secularism but in that lecture he overtly says quietism and accepting western culture even when it's haram is true Islam, because things like hijab are just "externals". Sufi Master Hamza Yusuf said "the Constitution is Sharia". Don't fall for the Jewry

Don't fall for it. If you want to learn about real Islam, go to New Muslim Academy, which offers plenty of free textbooks and lectures from scholars that don't work for either America or Saud. They also give live video courses (sex segregated) on learning Arabic and Qur'an.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YAb9-ZpCnJs

But wait, you will say. Saud is anti Sufi so Sufis must be the good guys. Not so. Bin Bayyah is an extremely prominent quietist Sufi who supports Saud. Yes Saud does support "Salafism", but only one strain, the Madkhalis, a Salafi cult that says disobedience to Saud is apostasy. Saudi (nationality) scholars differ completely on this from Saudi (employed by Saud) scholars. Don't believe me? The number one Salafi fatwa site, IslamQA.info, is banned in Saudi Arabia. Here is a sample fatwa from them, for a man who wants to have sex

https://islamqa.info/en/answers/175216/wants-to-fornicate-because-hes-out-of-patience

[Anonymous No.14789804]

European pagan revival it is then lads!

[Anonymous No.14789826]

>>14789804
Paganism was historically either extremely localized traditions,or worship of state leaders. Which were you interested in?

[Anonymous No.14789920]

>>14789786
the CIA is too stupid to do this

[Anonymous No.14789927]

>>14789786
Ecvjqnkekuo it is then

[Anonymous No.14789991]

>>14789920
The CIA is evil, not stupid. I cited my sources which you can Google instantly

[Anonymous No.14790068]

>>14789920
>>14789991
I was thinking about this a while back when someone was criticizing The Study Quran for not being progressive enough. If the only alternative to a modernized interpretation is radical political action, then that's the direction young energetic people will go. Dr Nasr is standing between the west and violent Islamists, and they don't even appreciate him for it.
If I had a passing thought about it and came to the conclusion that the western powers would benefit from supporting Traditionalism, then I'm sure someone at the CIA who is paid to do ideological analysis has thought of it.

[Anonymous No.14790071]

>>14789786
You need to relax anon... have a fap or smthing . Better yet read something difficult like DFW

[Anonymous No.14790076]

>>14790068
Nasr is a quietist who supported the Shah. He thinks stoning is barbaric. The Study Quran is perennialist

[Anonymous No.14790122]

>>14790076
Are you familiar with Wahid Azal? He's a total schizo Shi'a-Sufi-Communist hybrid who has his own tariqa where they regularly use Ayahuasca, but he has similar theories regarding Nasr, Schuon, Perennialism and the CIA. He has a paper on it on his blog.

[Anonymous No.14790160]

>>14790122
Most Shia are that hybrid. That sex changes are halal for them makes sense

[Anonymous No.14790164]

>>14790160

[Anonymous No.14790168]

>>14790164

[Anonymous No.14790171]

>>14790168

[Anonymous No.14790178]

>>14790171

[Anonymous No.14790183]

>>14790178
What a perplexing country Iran is. I think they are really beyond the comprehension of the Western mind.

[Anonymous No.14790184]

>>14790178

[Anonymous No.14790198]

>>14790183
More Shia are. They were established in Persia by the Safavids, a powerful Sufi order that genocided the Sunni Persians and imported Arab Shi'ites

[Anonymous No.14790204]

>>14790183
An interesting Shia principle is men and women can engage in a temporary marriage, say twenty minutes, based only on an oral contract. It is customary for the man to pay a dowry for this. In Shia jurisprudence, this is marriage rather than fornication or prostitution, so it's halal

[Anonymous No.14790205]

>>14790204
Yeah, I'm familiar with that. From what I remember reading it was also a principle of Sunni Islam but one of the Caliphs changed it??

[Anonymous No.14790207]

>>14790183
It's pretty simple. They pretend Trans is real to punish homos. If you're a homo and you don't repent they force a sex change i.e. castration on you. The Supreme Council probably sees this as eugenics.

If you think Iran gives a shit about the prestige of FIFA sports you're kidding yourself. They understand the reality of the situation: Iran against the pozzed Western world. Sending "trans" footballers out there to fuck up Euro teams is just an amusing troll to them.

[Anonymous No.14790217]

>>14790205
That's the Shia opinion. Actually according to Aisha, radhi Allahu anha, Muhammad, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, banned it, but Shia think she was a witch so reject her account. Her father, Abu Bakr, rashi Allahu anhu, was the first Caliph, and he dealt extremely harshly with the practice, especially the pimps

[Anonymous No.14790225]

>>14790217
Also it was Aisha, radhi Allahu anha, who said Muhammad, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam, cursed men who imitatate women. Shia rejection of her account is why they allow trannies

[Anonymous No.14790299]

>>14789991
Maybe in the 1960s this was true, but not any more, they are too stupid to do anything correctly. The US IC is inept at everything but SIGINT and staffed by affirmative action hires.

[Anonymous No.14790308]

>>14790178
This is fucking great. Good play.

[Anonymous No.14790309]

>>14790299
Well anybody would be too stupid to listen to an Islamic scholar who says the Constitution is Sharia, right? And yet Hamza Yusuf founded the Zaytuna Institute and is the most influential Muslim scholar in America and
is openly supported by the Trump administration

[Anonymous No.14790322]

>>14790309
I think no Americans would listen to "Muslamics" talking about the Constitution desu

[Anonymous No.14790326]

>>14790322
I mean Muslims. This guy is considered the biggest authority on Islam and Sufism in America and exerts much control over Islamic schools there

[Anonymous No.14790331]

>>14790322
By this I meant he is saying America's Constitution is Sharia for Muslims, not that Sharia is the Constitution for Americans

Hamza Yusuf was born Chris Hanson btw

[Anonymous No.14790335]

>>14790326
They have Islamic schools here? I assumed Muslims in the US just read whatever was produced in the Middle East based on their sect.

[Anonymous No.14790366]

>>14790335
No, not at all. There are many scholars here, many convert scholars in fact. At New Muslim Academy most of the lecturerers are converts

[Anonymous No.14790988]

>>14790071
Another thing being pushed

[Anonymous No.14791012]

>>14789920
This. The CIA has never done anything that makes that much sense.

[Anonymous No.14791014]

>>14791012
Yet I cited sources

[Anonymous No.14791015]

>>14789826
>Paganism was historically either extremely localized traditions,or worship of state leaders. Which were you interested in?
Vedanta

[Anonymous No.14791019]

>>14789786
So you're saying fundimentalism is true Islam?

[Anonymous No.14791041]

>>14791019
If by fundamentalism you mean orthodoxy. Historically orthodoxy was pretty multifaceted though. Imam Abu Hanifa (this is the founder of the school the Taliban follow) believed strongly in reason as a faculty given to humanity to discover how to implement Sharia and understand theology. Ibn Hazm (who influenced the modern Salafi movement through al-Shwakani) rejected rationalism was strongly supported empericism as the primary epistemology humans should trust. Both would be classified as "fundamentalists" today, but they used completely different methodologies.

[Anonymous No.14791073]

>>14791041
Well if by fundimentalism you mean terrorism, they seem to be mostly modern ideologies or a reaction to modernity, which makes them modern in turn.

[Anonymous No.14791103]

>>14791073
Terrorism is a buzzword. Surely you aren't this naive?

[Anonymous No.14791111]

>>14789920
Damn that sucks. I wanted to join the cia and do some devilishly evils things. Now I know they will just be stupid evil

[Anonymous No.14791114]

Guénon actually never left free-masonry, that's why he kept promoting retarded orientalism, especially Islam. Don't fall for him he is a con, he quite correctly identifies the problems of modernity but his solutions are a con.

[Anonymous No.14791135]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5i2Ijv9w-Q

[Anonymous No.14791856]

>>14791073
By terrorism you mean militant partisans?

[Anonymous No.14792042]

Sufis are kuffar

[Anonymous No.14792398]

>>14792042
>prays to saints
>dances

This is true Islam!

[Anonymous No.14792470]

>>14789786
Guénon has nothing to do with islam. Read his works and tell me how much islam is referenced in his work. Lower than .01% of his content. You think the CIA would pick an author who actually talks about Islam right?

The schizos spamming him haven't read him either or they're low iq zoomers. the pbuh meme is just that, a meme, pushed by literal 14yo, also Guénon was against proselytism so the memers are doing a disservice to him. If anything the incessant spamming exists to discredit Guénon.

The anglo protestants larping about traditional values have completely misunderstood Guénon, as traditional values are moralistic and have nothing to do with metaphysics, other than being derived from the rejection of metaphysics. So in fact "trad values" are a symptom of modernity.

The butthurt exoterists (the masses) can't comprehend Guénon and that's normal. Guénon didn't write for them, he writes for those with intellectual intuition who comprehend the unity of tradition. There is nothing to 'learn' from Guénon.


>>14791114
The concept of counter-tradition proves you wrong. He doesn't promote orientalism, in fact he's against it. He doesn't promote anything since promotion and proselytism derive from sentimentalism, a rejection of true intellectuality. He doesn't advocate for exoterism of any kind either. He talks about metaphysics and that's it. He also talks about how free masonry is counter-traditional, not tied to any metaphysics, useless; superstition basically.

[Anonymous No.14792530]

>>14792470
The pbuh meme is fucking hilarious though.

[Anonymous No.14792598]

>>14792470
>He doesn't advocate for exoterism of any kind either.
Ok CIA, none of us have read his essay "Haqiqa and Sharia", we're all illiterate lol

[Anonymous No.14793485]

>>14789804
No one believes it anymore

[Anonymous No.14793526]

I don't know, I'm gay but I'm sort of turned on that my bf fufills his straight best friends cuck fetish by fucking his wife in front of him and that his wife desires my bfs larger dick.

[Anonymous No.14793917]

>>14793526
>why yes, I am a kaffir, how could you tell?

[Anonymous No.14794060]

>>14790207
good analysis

[Anonymous No.14794080]

>>14790335
>PROUDBURGER enters the chat

[Anonymous No.14794196]

>>14789786
Don't care /pol/ virgin. Praise Guenon.

[Anonymous No.14794470]

>>14790207
>Sending "trans" footballers out there to fuck up Euro teams is just an amusing troll to them.
Holy based...

[Anonymous No.14794514]

>>14792470
>who comprehend the unity of tradition
how does one ascend to this state of being?

[Anonymous No.14794546]

>>14792398
That's orthodox though? Wasn't there a hadith stating that the Prophet (ﷺ) meditated and danced to induce in himself ecstatic prophetic/angelic states?

[Anonymous No.14794557]

>>14794546
No. In fact he hated dancing

[Anonymous No.14794560]

Is Sufism a good fit if I just want to marry middle-eastern cunny and LARP as a great saint and mystic who will be respected by his neighbors? I am mostly attracted to the attire Sufis wear and to Arab cunny. Also, I'm pretty smart and multilingual so I could even learn Arabic and LARP out the five daily prayers.

[Anonymous No.14794567]

If it means fucking muslim dogs over it's a psy-op I would gladly fall for.

[Anonymous No.14794602]

>>14794560
No,Sufis oppose child marriage and think women should go to college before marrying

[Anonymous No.14794626]

>>14794602
Seems cringe, I don't know why Guenon followed this. So what group should I join as a Westerner if I have these goals in mind?

[Anonymous No.14794634]

>>14794626
You don't join a "group", just say your Shahada with intent. If you want a younger bride I suggest anti Sufi Muslims.

[Anonymous No.14794975]

are there sufi schools which are still considered orthodox? how do I know which Islamic view is the original unchanged one?

[Anonymous No.14795398]

>>14791019
Yes. Fundamentalism is the only true Islam. In particularly, one should look into Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab – he was a great man, he advocated for a return to pure Tawheed and called out bidʻah and shirk wherever he saw it.

[Anonymous No.14795447]

>>14792530
>The pbuh meme is fucking hilarious though.
It’s insulting to even joke that Guénon is anywhere near one of the Prophets

[Anonymous No.14795462]

>>14795447
Indeed. The Prophets (pbut) were fine men, but none of them had the insight into metaphysical truth that Guénon (pbuh) displayed.

[Anonymous No.14795477]

>>14789786
So what’s it like being schizophrenic?

[Anonymous No.14795493]

>>14795398
>called out bidʻah and shirk wherever he saw it
What are some daring examples we see in the modern world by Sufis and other secularized Muslims? I have a group of them near me and I want to get into debates with them and BTFO them like Shankara did to the Buddhists.

[Anonymous No.14795504]

>>14794975
The Four Great Imams are the foundation of orthodox jurisprudence, along well with Ibn Hazm. If you follow any of their rulings (they differed but are all orthodox) plus Athari aqidah, you're good

>>14795398
Protip, no Muslim uses the term fundamentalist. I also doubt you can tell me what that man's fiqh is

[Anonymous No.14795510]

>>14795493
They pray to saints

[Anonymous No.14795519]

>>14795504
Hanbali

[Anonymous No.14795530]

>>14795519
That's his school, I mean what made his fiqh distinct from Hanbali fiqh in general which has existed for over a thousand years

[Anonymous No.14795532]

I’m about to trigger this whole thread:

You can be a Sufi without being a Muslim. The Sufism rabbit hole goes much deeper than most automatons — oops, I meant “intelligent modern scholars and believers” — guess. And yes, I am being extremely arrogant and insulting YOU directly. I’m not sorry.

[Anonymous No.14795539]

>>14795532
>You can be a Sufi without being a Muslim.
Based. That's what guenon did, right?

[Anonymous No.14795541]

>>14795532
No you make perfect sense,most wannabe Sufis are western ding dongs who like Rumi but don't care about the Prophet, salla Allahu alayhe wassallam

[Anonymous No.14795548]

>>14795539
No, Guénon said a Sufi must perfect Sharia before getting to the esoteric, see "Haqiqa and Sharia"

[Anonymous No.14795551]

>>14795532
The last thing we need is more LARPers like Schuon and his naked hugs

[Anonymous No.14795556]

>>14795539
>>14795548
I don’t give a fuck what Guenon said. Who made this French fuck an authority on Sufism? Sufis are everywhere and nowhere. Just because someone calls themselves a Sufi doesn’t mean they are one. Maybe the janitor you meet is a Sufi, and the renowned writer nowhere near being one.

[Anonymous No.14795564]

>>14795556
Maybe they're astronauts too

[Anonymous No.14795568]

>>14795564
Maybe.

[Anonymous No.14795571]

>>14795556
Look to his teachings, brother, lest you stray from your appointed radii and never reach the Haqiqa.

[Anonymous No.14795574]

>>14795568
But of course now we're making terms useless when you say the orders that coined them aren't authorities, you are

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=51xGE-S7KSs

[Anonymous No.14795581]

>>14795571
>>14795574
Show me an actual Sufi instead of someone with a big ego calling themselves “Sufi”.

[Anonymous No.14795582]

How do I get Muslim friends? I want to convert at some point but I don’t want to be some weird loner white dude who can barely speak MSA, let alone the dialects

[Anonymous No.14795594]

>>14795582
I'm a white convert, currently can read the Arabic alphabet and can recite and write multiple chapters from the Qur'an from memory.

First of all, don't look for Muslim friends. Any Muslim who is "friends" with kuffar except formally is probably secular. Convert as soon as you can, go to a mosque. To learn practice go to an online site, newmuslimacademy. Grow your beard, trim your mustache, wear a brimless hat. You will quickly assimilate

[Anonymous No.14795601]

>>14795594
Thank you for the advice, anon. I will check that website out. I’ve been thinking about it for a while and have currently taken two semesters MSA, hopefully I can take some classes on the Qur’an soon, which was the main reason I started learning the modern language. I’ll have to start looking for a mosque in my area

[Anonymous No.14795619]

>>14795601


If you already can read the alphabet, memorize this https://quran.com/1

And this: https://quran.com/112

That's nearly all the Arabic you need to pray, but you will want to learn more later. If this is intimidating, just do newmuslimacademy

[Anonymous No.14795627]

>>14795619
Also set translation to Maududi for a good tafsir

[Anonymous No.14795645]

>>14795619
I’ll still definitely look into the website. Luckily If there’s one surah that I have memorized in Arabic already it’s al-Fatihah. I’d have to study al-Ikhlas a bit since I like to have a grasp on the meaning of each part of the sentence though, but if that’s really all I need prayer is easy than I thought, I thought it seemed very complex when I first looked into over a year ago.

[Anonymous No.14795668]

>>14791103
I too think terrorism is a buzzword but
>snhr
Come on now

[Anonymous No.14795685]

>>14795645
You can click each word for the definition

>>14795668
I mean, let's be honest, if you are a committed Assadist you will say that about literally every single source, account and even video.

[Anonymous No.14795741]

>>14795685
>white muslim convert who shills for the neoliberal global order to destroy an enemy of Israel
Now this is some next-level judaism.

[Anonymous No.14795765]

>>14795741
I don't think you know what neoliberalism is. I certainly don't support it. Not do I support Muslims coming to any western country except as an army Insha Allah. I was planning on moving to a Muslim country but I have been offered a very good job by an extremely orthodox enclave that seems nearly as good. I hate the filthy west

https://twitter.com/dawahmanreturns/status/1188892007571345408?s=19

[Anonymous No.14795768]

>>14795765
Yeah but you're jewish.

[Anonymous No.14795774]

>>14795768
I'm not at all, I'm Scandanavian and Scottish

[Anonymous No.14795785]

[Anonymous No.14795788]

>>14795774
That's a funny way to spell jewish.

[Anonymous No.14795803]

>>14795788
May your slander be repaid in hell, ameen

[Anonymous No.14795850]

>>14795803
Praise Moses!

[Anonymous No.14795856]

>>14795850
May you suffer as the Umnah. As you established brutal secular tyrants over the Umnah, may you be given the the harshest Muslims to be enslaved to. May your homeland experience hourly bombs as ours does. Ameen

[Anonymous No.14795971]

>>14795856

[Anonymous No.14796046]

>>14794560
They will find you out eventually.

[Anonymous No.14796061]

>>14796046
The religion itself is one big larp. He'll fit right in.