/trg/ THEOLOGY AND RELIGION GENERAL

[Anonymous No.14726071]

St. Thomas Aquinas edition
Discuss about theology and religion.

[Anonymous No.14726095]

>>14726071
Yikes. Aren't you people ashamed to be like this?

[Anonymous No.14726108]

>>14726095
>it's another Anon who refuses to believe there can be religious people on 4chan

[Anonymous No.14726125]

>>14726071
Yikes. Your sky dad isn't real.

[Anonymous No.14726132]

>>14726108
I'm sure there are, but I'm also certain that no one who actually cares about his religion would bother discussing it on the dumbest board on 4chan.

[Anonymous No.14726133]

>>14726071
Since Aquinas is getting brought up I want to mention I find his theory on werewolves interesting. He says demons can transmute flesh consistent with the Bible describing the staffs turning into snakes in Egypt. However, he says the soul can only be transmuted by God. Therefore, a werewolf would have full human agency and mind. Does /lit/ agree with this?

[The Man !QkRJTXcpFI No.14726141]

>>14726071
>I love getting down on my knees daily... and begging Jesus to come.

[Anonymous No.14726157]

"God is love, and he who dwells in love dwells in God, and God in him." Let us take the first phrase, "God is love." That is so, because whatever can love and is capable of loving, that He pursues with His love, to love Him. "God is love," secondly, because everything God ever created and that is capable of loving, that pursues Him by its love to love it, whether He will or no. Thirdly, "God is love" because with His love He drives everything that is capable of loving out of all plurality. As far as God is lovable in plurality, the love that He is drives this out of all plurality into His own oneness. "God is love," fourthly, because with His love He gives all creatures their being and life, and maintains them with His love. Should anyone ask what God is, this is what I should now say, that God is love, and in fact so loveable that all creatures seek to love His loveableness, whether they know it or not, or whether they wish to or not. So much is God love, and so loveable, that everything that can love must love Him, whether it will or no. There is no creature so worthless that it could love anything evil; for whatever one loves must either seem good or be good. Now if we gather up all the good that all creatures can do-that is pure badness compared with God. St. Augustine says, 'Love what you can gain with love, and keep that which can satisfy your soul.' "God is love." Now, my children, I beg you to mark my words. God loves my soul so much that His life and being depend on His loving me, whether He would or no. To stop God loving my soul would be to deprive Him of His Godhead; for God is as truly love as He is truth; and as truly as He is goodness, He is love. That is the bare truth, as God lives. There were certain masters1 who declared that the love that is in us is the Holy Ghost, but that is not true. The bodily food we take is changed into us, but the spiritual food we receive changes us into itself; therefore divine love is not taken into us, for that would make two things. But divine love takes us into itself, and we are one with it.

[Anonymous No.14726163]

>>14726157
The paint on the wall is maintained by the wall; thus all creatures are maintained in existence by love, which is God. If you took the paint from the wall, it would lose its existence: so all things would lose their existence if deprived of love, which is God. "God is love and he who dwells in love dwells in God, and God dwells in him." There is a difference between spiritual things and bodily things. Every spiritual thing can dwell in another; but nothing bodily can exist in another. There may be water in a tub, and the tub surrounds it, but where the wood is, there is no water. In this sense no material thing dwells in another, but every spiritual thing does dwell in another. Every single angel is in the next with all his joy, with all his happiness and all his beatitude as perfectly as in himself; and every angel with all his joy and all his beatitude is in me, and so is God Himself with all His beatitude, though I know it not. Take the lowest angel in his pure nature: the smallest splinter or spark that ever fell from him would suffice to light up the whole world with bliss and joy. Just see how splendid he is in himself! Now I have sometimes said further that the angels are beyond all number and quantity. But now I will leave aside love and come to knowledge: if only we knew them, it would be easy to abandon a whole world. Whatever God ever made or shall yet make- if God were to give all that entire to my soul and God with it, and if so much as a hair's breadth remained behind, it would not satisfy my soul; I should not be happy. If I am happy, then all things are in me, and God. Where I am, there God is; and then I am in God, and where God is, there I am. "He who dwells in love dwells in God, and God dwells in him." If then I am in God, then where God is, I am and where I am, there God is, unless the scriptures lie. Where I am, there God is: that is the bare truth, and is as truly true as that God is God. "Faithful servant, I will set you over all my goods" (Matt. 25:21). That is to say, inasmuch as God is good in all creatures, so, in accordance with their manifoldness I will "set you over all my goods." Secondly, "I will set you over all my goods" means, whence all creatures derive their blessedness, in the pure unity that is God Himself, whence He draws His own felicity, that is to say, inasmuch as God is good, He will "set us over all His goods." Thirdly, He will set us over all His goods, that is to say, over everything that He is called, over everything one can put into words and over everything that one can understand.

[Anonymous No.14726169]

>>14726163
Thus He will set us over all His goods. "Father, I pray Thee to make them one, as I and Thou are one" (John 17:21 ). Where two are to become one, one of them must lose its being. So it is: and if God and your soul are to become one, your soul must lose her being and her life. As far as anything remained, they would indeed be united, but for them to become one, the one must lose its identity and the other must keep its identity: then they are one. Now the Holy Ghost says, "let them be one as we are one." "I pray Thee, make them one in us." 'I pray Thee.' When I pray for aught, my prayer goes for naught; when I pray for naught, I pray as I ought. When I am united with That wherein all things are existent whether past, present or future, they are all equally near and equally one; they are all in God and all in me. Then there is no need to think of Henry or Conrad. If one prays for aught but God alone, that can be called idolatry or unrighteousness. They pray aright who "pray in spirit and in truth" (John 4:24). If I pray for someone, for Henry or Conrad, I pray at my weakest. When I pray for nobody and for nothing, then I am praying most truly, for in God is neither Henry nor Conrad. If we pray to God for aught else but God, that is wrong and faithless and a kind of imperfection, for it is to set up something beside God. As I said recently, that is wanting to make a nothing of God, and to make God out of nothing. "God is love, and he who dwells in love is in God, and God is in him." May we all attain this love of which I have spoken. So help us our beloved Lord Jesus Christ. Amen.
- Meister Eckhart, Sermon on 1 John 4:16 (And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.)

[Anonymous No.14726195]

"God's love was disclosed and revealed to us in this, that God sent His only-begotten Son into the world, that we might live with the Son and in the Son and through the Son," for all who do not live through the Son are indeed in the wrong. Suppose there were a mighty king who had a beautiful daughter, if he gave her to the son of a poor man, all those who belonged to that family would thereby be raised up and ennobled. Now a master says, 'God became man, and thereby the whole human race is raised up and ennobled. We must all rejoice that Christ, our brother, has risen of his own power above all the choirs of angels and sits at the right hand of the Father.' This master has spoken truly, but still I care little about it. What good would it do me to have a brother who was a rich man if I were a poor man? What good would it do me to have a brother who was a wise man if I were a fool? I say something different and more to the point: God not only became man, but he took on human nature. The masters agree in saying that all men are equally noble by nature. But I say in truth, all the goodness that all the saints have possessed, and Mary, God's mother, and Christ according to his humanity- that is my own in this nature. Now you might ask me, since I have everything in this (human) nature that Christ can perform according to his humanity, why then do we praise and magnify Christ as our Lord and our God? That is because he was a messenger from God to us and has brought our blessedness to us. The blessedness he brought us was our own. Where the Father bears His Son in the innermost ground, this nature flows in there. This nature is one and simple. Something may here peep out or hang on it, but that is not this One. I say something else, and even harder. Whoever would exist in the nakedness of this nature, free from all mediation, must have left behind all distinction of person, so that he is as well disposed to a man who is across the sea, whom he never set eyes on, as to the man who is with him and is his close friend. As long as you favour your own person more than that man you have never seen, you are assuredly not right and you have never for a single instant looked into this simple ground. You may indeed have seen a derived image of the truth in a picture, but it was not the best! And secondly, you must be pure of heart, for that heart alone is pure that has abolished creatureliness. Thirdly, you must be free of nothing. The question is asked, what burns in hell. The masters generally say it is self-will. But I declare in truth: nothing burns in hell.

[Anonymous No.14726199]

>>14726157
>>14726163
>>14726169
Imagine learning this useless shit instead of learning something useful like CS whilst making money instead of LARPing as a TRADChristian. Pathetic.

[Anonymous No.14726200]

Can somebody explain the Transfiguration?

[Anonymous No.14726203]

>>14726195
Here is a simile. Take a burning coal and put it on my hand. If I said the coal burnt my hand, I would do it injustice. Were I to say truly what burns me, it is negation, for the coal contains something that my hand has not. It is this not that burns me. But if my hand contained all that the coal has or can effect, it would be all of the nature of fire. Then, if anyone were to take all the fire that ever burnt, and poured it out on to my hand, that could not hurt me. In the same way, I say, just because God and all those who stand before His face have on account of their true blessedness something which they who are separated from God have not, this very not torments the souls in hell more than self-will or any fire. I say truly, insofar as not adheres to you, to that extent you are imperfect. Therefore, if you want to be perfect, you must be rid of not. This is what the text I have given you is concerned with: "God sent His only-begotten Son into the world." You should not take this to mean the external world, as when he ate and drank with us, but you should understand it of the inner world. As surely as the Father in His simple nature bears the Son naturally, just as surely He bears him in the inmost recesses of the spirit, and this is the inner world. Here God's ground is my ground and my ground is God's ground. Here I live from my own as God lives from His own. For the man who has once for an instant looked into this ground, a thousand marks of red minted gold are the same as a brass farthing. Out of this inmost ground, all your works should be wrought without Why. I say truly, as long as you do works for the sake of heaven or God or eternal bliss, from without, you are at fault. It may pass muster, but it is not the best. Indeed, if a man thinks he will get more of God by meditation, by devotion, by ecstasies, or by special infusion of grace than by the fireside or in the stable-that is nothing but taking God, wrapping a cloak round His head and shoving Him under a bench. For whoever seeks God in a special way gets the way and misses God, who lies hidden in it. But whoever seeks God without any special way gets Him as He is in Himself, and that man lives with the Son, and he is life itself. If a man asked life for a thousand years, 'Why do you live?' if it could answer it would only say, 'I live because I live.' That is because life lives from its own ground, and gushes forth from its own.

[Anonymous No.14726206]

>>14726199
>learning servile arts
Pathetic pleb

[Anonymous No.14726207]

>>14726203
Therefore it lives without Why, because it lives for itself. And so, if you were to ask a genuine man who acted from his own ground, 'Why do you act?' if he were to answer properly he would simply say, 'I act because I act.' Where creature stops, God begins to be. Now all God wants of you is for you to go out of yourself in the way of creatureliness and let God be within you. The least creaturely image that takes shape in you is as big as God. How is that? It deprives you of the whole of God. As soon as this image comes in, God has to leave with all His Godhead. But when the image goes out, God comes in. God desires you to go out of yourself (as creature) as much as if all His blessedness depended on it. My dear friend, what harm can it do you to do God the favour of letting Him be God in you? Go right out of yourself for God's sake, and God will go right out of Himself for your sake! When these two have gone out, what is left is one and simple. In this One the Father bears His Son in the inmost source. Out of that the Holy Ghost blossoms forth, and then there arises in God a will which belongs to the soul. As long as this will stands untouched by all creatures and all that is created, this will is free. Christ says, "No man comes to heaven but he who came from heaven" (John 3:13). All things are created out of nothing, therefore their true source is nothing, and as far as this noble will inclines to creatures, it is dissipated with creatures in their nothing. The question arises, whether this noble will can be so dissipated that it can never return. The masters generally declare that it can never return insofar as it is dispersed in time. But I say, whenever this will turns back from itself, and from all creation for a moment into its primal source, then the will has its true birthright of freedom and is free, and in this moment all time lost is recovered. People often say to me, 'Pray for me.' And I think, 'Why do you go out? Why do you not stay within yourself and draw on your own treasure? For you have the whole truth in its essence within you.' That we may thus truly stay within, that we may possess all truth immediately, without distinction, in true blessedness, may God help us. Amen.
- Meister Eckhart, Sermon on 1 John 4:9 (In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.)

[Anonymous No.14726237]

How could God love me, knowing what it is I am? What I've allowed myself to become?

[Anonymous No.14726249]

Did you pray your daily Rosary yet, Anons?

[Anonymous No.14726253]

>>14726108
Yes but an Abrahamic one? You think the crucified Shlomo is actually coming back? Pure delusion.

[Anonymous No.14726262]

>>14726249
I meditated in accordance to the coming Maitreya and the six Buddha bodies.

[Anonymous No.14726264]

>>14726253
Christ has died, Christ is risen, Christ will come again.

[Anonymous No.14726269]

>>14726264
Any day now. Any day....

[Anonymous No.14726418]

Why does it seem like Jews always win, bros? I just saw a Christian left speechless in a debate with a Jew about the virgin birth in Isaiah 7:14, and after investigating the text myself it only seemed to be bolster the Jews' argument.

They cant keep getting away with this. This is seriously starting to affect my faith.

[Anonymous No.14726471]

>>14726071
https://discord.gg/hCjX58e

[Anonymous No.14726504]

>>14726418
>debate
lmao, who gives a shit about some nerd contest?

[Anonymous No.14726533]

>>14726418
Leave the debating to the priests, the ones actually trained in this stuff. Defending the faith as a layperson is what Protestants do.

[Anonymous No.14726597]

>>14726418
>debate
do you have a mandatum?

[Anonymous No.14726642]

>>14726533
St. Maximus was never ordained and he engaged in debate.

[Anonymous No.14726672]

Where should I go to learn about Shinto tradition? It's always interested me. I'm visiting Japan in March and want to see shrines.

[Anonymous No.14726724]

>>14726533
lol, it should be the other way around, priests should be focused on guiding the flock to heaven, whilst the laypeople engage in debate (read crusade)

[Anonymous No.14726766]

Why does nobody ever talk about massa damnata? The concept really spooks me

[Anonymous No.14726786]

>>14726766
There's a lot of spooky things in Catholicism, it's easily the most /x/ religion there is.

[Anonymous No.14726795]

>>14726533

St. Justin Martyr was not a priest and defended the faith against critics.

[Anonymous No.14727058]

Is apocatastasis heretical? It seems to be the most reasonable position in the debate.

[Anonymous No.14727467]

>>14726533
ummmm anon actually in the bible it says to only listen to tradcaths on youtube

[Anonymous No.14727474]

>>14726766
sometimes i fell like the only way I can be saved is to dedicate my life to charity in some 3rd world country.......

[Anonymous No.14727476]

>>14727058
No; only some versions of it are.

[Anonymous No.14727970]

Does anyone have any recommendations for Catholic personalism?

[Anonymous No.14728123]

Who else has been reading Newman since his canonization? I've been reading his sermons delivered before Oxford. They're from back when he was still an Anglican, but they're still so wonderful and insightful, and of course, the prose is great. Joyce was right to praise Newman's prose.

[Anonymous No.14728701]

Whats a good Cathotlic study bible?

[Anonymous No.14728795]

>discussing theology

How virginal can you possibly be

[Anonymous No.14728814]

>>14728795
>posting on 4chan
Bet you're already coping that it's all ironic.

[Anonymous No.14728924]

>>14726071
Religion is the biggest incel cope. Whilst you read your Bible Chad is fucking a new girl every night.

[Anonymous No.14728942]

>>14726199
I would rather study theology than being in this hellhole
t. CSfag

[Anonymous No.14729058]

>>14728814
No, I’m just here to laugh at incels like you

[Anonymous No.14729171]

>>14728123
What are your favorite sermons from him? Is there any collection I could find?

[Anonymous No.14729192]

>>14726199
why not both

[Anonymous No.14729193]

>>14728701
If you know spanish I'd recommend Straubinger

[Anonymous No.14729218]

>>14726253
>So you think Jesus is coming back?

[Anonymous No.14729271]

>>14728123
been reading some of his translations

[Anonymous No.14729276]

>>14729270
What do you guys think of this list?

[Anonymous No.14729284]

>>14727970
Patrizi, Mirandola, Ficino

[Anonymous No.14729289]

>>14727970
Borella

[Anonymous No.14729290]

>>14726418
This is what happens when you believe the Masoretic is Divinely Inspired and not just Jewish lies. The Septuagint is the only faithful Old Testament text.

[Anonymous No.14729297]

>>14726418
Christianity is a Jewish heresy, goy...

[Anonymous No.14729317]

>>14728123
i to stupid

[Anonymous No.14729324]

Has anyone read this bad boy? Apparently it deals with Heidegger and Hegel and the history of philosophy from a Catholic perspective. I am a cradle catholic but lapsed in favor of continental philosophy. Think it would prove an interesting read but pretty expensive...

[Anonymous No.14729325]

>>14726071
So, why do I have to go to Hell for not believing in the stories contained in the Bible? What's so unforgivable about it?

[Anonymous No.14729339]

>>14729324
>homo
you would want to read that you fag

[Anonymous No.14729355]

>>14729324
I want to read it but it's very expensive.

[Anonymous No.14729371]

>>14726132
You're actually retarded anon, you first accuse Fuentean zoomer-tradcaths for being over all dumb and irrational in themselves and their discussions on 4chan, then go to saying that everything on this website is nothing but bullshit in the first place?

Seems like you are salty anon, very salty, I am based, I am Catholic, I use Protestant, I admit nothing for I have done nothing 'cept before Jesus Christ. Amen.

[Anonymous No.14729534]

I just found out that Pope John Paul II did a fair amount of his PHD work on phenemenology. Quite interesting. Also didn't realize that Edith Stein influenced Heidegger, or so says her wikipedia entry.


>>14729324
I want to read this very much. If you are interested, there are a few lectures on vimeo by the translators and people who knew the author. It seems like quite a dense work but I plan to try it this summer. It's pretty cool that people are interested in it though.

[Anonymous No.14729608]

>>14729325
No one?

[Anonymous No.14729658]

>>14729325
Everyone is saved. Even the devil. Read Philo and Origen. Hell is just the purgatory of all impurities stripping away moments before eternity in heaven...

[Anonymous No.14729663]

>>14729339
>(you)
>>14729355
Word
>>14729534
I am planning on attempting it this summer after graduating community college. Looking forward to uni too. Apparently there are a lot of continentals at my school.

[Anonymous No.14729698]

What exactly is blasphemy against the holy spirit, the one sin that cannot be forgiven? I don't think I have committed such an action, but I'm not sure exactly what is meant by the phrase in a practical context. I've never cursed God or something, but I have had phases around middle school and high school where I didn't believe in him and a few times even after I believer I became frusturated with him.