/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.14242446]

Can objective morality exist without God?

[Anonymous No.14242448]

>>14242446
Yes, since being objectively moral is equivalent to doing what’s best for you.

[Anonymous No.14242481]

You at least need a God-equivalent. If you take God to mean "the Divine," then yes.

>>14242448
Two problems: First, "objective" really means "irrespective of point of view," so something that depends on someone's perspective can't be objective. Second, if we could conclusively figure out the best thing to do, even on an individual basis, the world would be a hell of a lot less dysfunctional.

[Anonymous No.14242490]

Fuck off christian idiot atheists can still get morals without religion. People like you are why I hate rleigion. Aren't you supposed to not judge lest you be judged?? And you're going around and assuming atheists are all rapists and killers just because skydaddy won't punish us?? Fuck off man I'm fine with you being religious even if you're wrong but stop trying to push it on our faces on this board

[Anonymous No.14242494]

>>14242481
Er sorry, you need the Divine to have objective morality, so the answer is no. I just lost track of the question.

[Anonymous No.14242504]

>>14242481
You’re wrong on both accounts. First, morality is determined by my experience, and not necessarily my opinion. I might not understand that killing is wrong for me, but if I pursue that path, then my future will be less preferable than had I not killed. So morality is determined by my environment and my response to it, though it’s not necessarily known to me. Second, the world is dysfunctional because people are not doing what’s best for them...

[Anonymous No.14242511]

>There are 4 posters in this thread.

>>14242504
>>14242481
SAMEFAG LOOOOL
>both start with "First,"

[Anonymous No.14242525]

>>14242511
I was only mirroring his response

[Anonymous No.14242543]

>>14242490

[Anonymous No.14242552]

>>14242543
Pseud ass books man explain to me how i'm a rapist and killer because sky daddy wont torture me for eternity

[Anonymous No.14242562]

>>14242490
Incredibly low IQ post.

[Anonymous No.14242572]

>>14242552
Non-sequitur.

[Anonymous No.14242649]

>>14242572
You're the one saying atheists dont have morals
>>14242562
Nice adhominem dumb ass

[Anonymous No.14242703]

>>14242649
I am a separate poster. Low IQ people will always adhere to retard beliefs "NO BAD THING. LIVE LET LIVE DUDE" Intelligent people on the other hand, realize that in the absence of God, then obviously anything is permissible.

[Anonymous No.14242731]

>>14242703
Funny how all the christians are the real psychos...you're saying you would rape and murder because tehre isn't a sky daddy to punish you..

[Anonymous No.14242732]

>>14242703
>Intelligent people on the other hand, realize that in the absence of God, then obviously anything is permissible.
I’m a Christian, but that simply isn’t true. Sure, they have no good conception of an afterlife, and may see little value in this life, but they can still have a basic concept of what actions are good and bad. They might not know of Hell, but they know of prison, and shame, and isolation, even in this life.

[Anonymous No.14242819]

>>14242732
Funny how all the atheists are the real psychos...you're saying you would rape and murder because tehre isn't a prison, and shame, and isolation to punish you..

[Anonymous No.14242823]

>>14242446
>objective
spook

[Anonymous No.14242837]

>>14242819
Is killing wrong in itself? Then it would be the case that killing animals is just as wrong as killing humans, regardless of the consequences. But how many ants have you killed?

[Anonymous No.14242838]

>>14242446
no
but the existence of a God also doesn't automatically imply objective morality

[Anonymous No.14242850]

>>14242837
God gave man dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

[Anonymous No.14242879]

>>14242850
Then morality is determined by God, since your actions will have consequences based on His commandments. But unfortunately, it is often the case that people disobey some commandments because of their own earthly view of morality.

[Anonymous No.14242913]

>>14242837
>>14242448
>anime poster
>is fucking retarded
every time

[Anonymous No.14242919]

>>14242913
Not an argument

[Anonymous No.14242940]

>>14242919
I'm being objectively moral, like (You) said in >>14242448

[Anonymous No.14242946]

>>14242838

[Anonymous No.14242960]

>>14242940
You can’t determine that without first experiencing all futures of the possible decisions you could have made in that moment, though it might have been moral nonetheless.

[Anonymous No.14242965]

>>14242446

Can the Tooth fairy exist without Magic?

[Anonymous No.14242975]

There is no objective morality, but we have evolved in such a way as to prize forms of morality.

[Anonymous No.14243014]

>>14242731
>>14242731
Rape and murder are meaningless without establishing the species that spawn them, viz., lust and hatred, whose manifestations are present in far more numerous insults day in and day out. In fact, these preceding two actions can be justified, insofar as the one can to childbirth thus fulfilling the natural end of procreation, and the other through accomplishing a logical purpose (elimination of a bad person such as a rapist for instance). Now, you view these as wrong not through the use of reason but rather because the the egregiousness is so apparent it becomes self-evident to even the most blind of sinners and secondly its consequence terminally affects another person. But Christ said any man that hates his brother is a murderer and every man who thinks impure thoughts in his heart is has already committed adultery.

[Anonymous No.14243108]

>>14242731
are you 35+ be honest

[Anonymous No.14243146]

>>14242446

Yes.
If there is a metaphysical version of the world as it should be, that can be achieved through certain action, than whatever action achieves that goal is objectively moral.

[Anonymous No.14243155]

>>14243108
Yes but i dont see how that is relevant
>>14243014
"Rape an murer are meaningless" heaer yourself when you speak you evil person

[Anonymous No.14243162]

>>14242731

[Anonymous No.14243419]

>>14242946
Holy low IQ. Profound.

[Anonymous No.14243423]

No. We need God

[Anonymous No.14243468]

>>14242446
Nothing can exist without God so no

[Anonymous No.14243476]

>>14243155
t. brainlet

[Anonymous No.14243480]

>>14242446
"Without God" isn't a coherent concept

[Anonymous No.14243594]

>>14242446
"Object" cannot exist with G-d. (H)e created time. How can morality exist outside without time?

[Anonymous No.14243609]

>>14242490
You can led an fool to water but he'll usually drown himself instead of drinking.

[Anonymous No.14243620]

>>14242446
yea

[Anonymous No.14243631]

>>14242552
Hell is a Catholic heresy. Yeshua was just a man. Only G-d redeems sin. Your punishment is your distance from your Lord and protector. Read Proverbs.

[Anonymous No.14243651]

>>14243631
based and sheol-pilled

[Anonymous No.14244036]

>>14242481
Is morality "irrespective of the point of view" of God? If it is, then why is God necessary for objective morality to exist? If it isn't, then in what way is it objective at all?

[Anonymous No.14244046]

>>14243631
”Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire.” (Matt. xxv. 41.) Some will say: The fire, but not the punishment of the damned is everlasting. Such the language of the incredulous, but it is folly.

For what other purpose would God make this fire eternal, than to chastise the reprobate, who are immortal? But, to take away every shadow of doubt, the Scriptures, in many other places, say, that not only the fire, but the punishment, of the damned is eternal. ”And these, ”says Jesus Christ, “shall go into ever lasting punishment.” (Matt. xxv. 46.)

Again we read in St. Mark, ”Where the worm dieth not, and the fire is not extinguished.” (ix. 43.) St. John says: ”And the smoke of their torments shall ascend up for ever and ever.” (Apoc. xvi. 11.) “Who,” says St. Paul, ”shall suffer eternal punishment in destruction.” (2 Thess. i. 9.)

[Anonymous No.14244059]

So many seething Christians in this thread dont realise its already been proven objectively in "The Moral Landscape"

[Anonymous No.14244072]

>>14242490
You must be at least 18 to post on this board

[Anonymous No.14244074]

>>14244059
please do not bait me like this

[CLITORIS REX MACHINA, INTENSE (...) No.14244081]

>>14242446
sure.

gods unnecessary for most things except justifying slavery and hatred and shit like that.

[Anonymous No.14244082]

>>14242504
>So morality is determined by my environment and my response to it
materialists gtfo

[Anonymous No.14244089]

>>14242446
No, obviously not. Any sort of moral axioms require a massive leap of faith. Even the "suffering" reductionists make such broadly subjective statements theyre basically worthless.

[Anonymous No.14244105]

I wish there was at least one person in this thread who read the bible before they opened their STUPID FUCKING MOUTHS