>Name an ideology more cucked than nationalism. Imagine going off to war and dying for arbitrary lines on a map. cont: >>14119338

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Anonymous Wed Nov 6 12:07:45 2019 No.14123113 [Reply] [Original]

>Name an ideology more cucked than nationalism. Imagine going off to war and dying for arbitrary lines on a map.
cont: >>14119338

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 12:11:24 2019 No.14123125 [DELETED]

>>14123113
Nations aren’t imaginary. And why do you socialist faggots keep using the word cuck when it’s about yourselves, did the word hurt you that much? Pretending nations aren’t a thing and we are all one is literally a woman’s idea and you are a cuck for believing it. If you take this idea into the real world, your nation will be weak and your inhabitants will die because you didn’t protect them. This is so obvious that I have to assume this is bait. SAGE

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 12:19:06 2019 No.14123149 >>14123125 >And why do you socialist faggots keep using the word cuck when it’s about yourselves, did the word hurt you that much? IIRC Marx was the first person who used it ideologically.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 12:19:58 2019 No.14123158 >>14123113 >arbitrary lines Borders are obviously not arbitrary therefor your original proposition is false and not worth talking about.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 12:34:00 2019 No.14123215 It's manifest kin selection. Going against this natural grain is fundamental suicide. Why don't people get this?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 12:58:40 2019 No.14123309 Gloabalism

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 13:09:59 2019 No.14123353 >>14123215 >le appeal to nature >le post Westfalian nation state is just like a family Try harder

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 13:37:20 2019 No.14123465

>>14123353
Woah, now that I think of it, the family is an arbitrary and oppressive concept because no one is identical to their parents. I now conclude that the only reasonable and (most importantly) morally justified political-taxonomical unit is humanity. Thanks based anon

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 13:41:38 2019 No.14123480 >>14123125 Protect them from what? Nationalist cucks?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 13:43:03 2019 No.14123491 >>14123465 Far, far, far less retarded than thinking gubermint is your father

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 13:55:42 2019 No.14123555 >>14123465 One of the only times I've actually seen proper satire on /lit/. Good on you, anon. >Yet it is still better to abandon your family for yourself than to die for an imagined nation

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:08:21 2019 No.14123623 >>14123465 >the family is an arbitrary and oppressive concept This, but unironically

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:16:45 2019 No.14123665

>>14123113
Do you guys feel the same nihilism I do? The malaise that seeps into every aspect of life, every moment is without meaning, spending your free time split between indulging in and critiquing this shit-fuck of a society we live in? I'm close to offing myself, I would G L A D L Y die for something I subjectively and authentically believed in. It could be a government, a lover, a revolution, fucking anything. Meaning is an immanent indivisible lens that colors all subjectivity, if a nation gave me T H A T, well yes, I would gladly die for it and be happy that I was spared this nihilistic chasm of a life where I want to believe in something but cannot

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:23:30 2019 No.14123711 I wonder how anyone can look at the individual life and the nation state and think the former has more value. Are materialists even conscious?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:24:55 2019 No.14123716 >>14123665 Believe in God anon. He will never give up on you. You needn't even ask, you shall only receive.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:26:56 2019 No.14123730 >>14123665 Have you tried not being self absorbed?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:30:24 2019 No.14123759 Nationalism is obviously just a cope

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:31:01 2019 No.14123763

The concept of cucking requires 3 things, one who cuckolds another and an object of desire. For nationalism to be a "cucked ideology" requires one to have a desire, but for the Other to benefit from practicing the ideology. *
The apologist for nationalism will say that the desire is in common with the other citizens of the nation, in which case the benefit of the other is the benefit of the self* because the will of the two are aligned, in contrast to our Other, those outside of the community of the nation which may not be so aligned.
The counter is thus "If you die for the nation you are cuckolded" but what we must realize is that two things persist and are reproduced through our actions, namely the genes and the memes.* The great counter-argument to the anti-nationalists, I call them anationists, is that you too will die, and for nothing instead of the propagation of a community who will carry your will beyond death.
The truest cuck is not the nationalist, *who gains a benefit from their advocation that is not merely imaginary, but material and social and, if you believe in such things, transcendent, no the true cuck are those who are part of a nation, who pay their taxes and so on*, yet who is not part of the nation, they do not align with the will of their nation. This is really the tragedy of our predicament, that we are becoming cucks through the loss and degradation of our community, and yet we do not revolt against this*, we do not find those with whom we agree and break off like in Catalonia, Paris Commune, Nazi communities, and so on. Why have we not done so? That is a question for the reader to think on.

*sniff

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 14:40:58 2019 No.14123818 >>14123716 I do intellectually; there's a spiritual dimension I haven't found. I thought it would save me but it hasn't yet. >>14123730 Good point

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 15:41:16 2019 No.14124132 >>14123465 > the family is an arbitrary and oppressive concept My family is a bunch of mentally defective turds. So extrapolating based on experience... yeah.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 15:41:43 2019 No.14124137

>>14123818
Are you only chasing the Truth, and have stopped chasing everything else, seeing the lack of meaning in it? Have you forgiven all and asked for forgiveness? Have you repaid the debts you owe to those who matter and honored their sacrifice? That helped me get closer to the Truth, and it may help you too.

Know that you will never truly reach it, but it will give you more than any other Truth you've known, more than enough to live a fulfilling life.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 15:57:24 2019 No.14124237 What's long with loving your country, and wanting to protect it? It's not about the borders, it's about the geography, the culture, the history, the people, the food, etcetera... It's not cucked to die for something you love and believe in.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 15:58:54 2019 No.14124247 >>14123113 Nations aren't imaginary read Gellner.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 15:59:57 2019 No.14124251 File: 123 KB, 1200x700, bcfMeuQEfWs.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14123113 >Nation = lines on a map This is your brain on burgers. Americucks will forever try and destabilize nations because they are a mongrel country without nations.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 16:00:46 2019 No.14124254 >>14123125 >And why do you socialist faggots keep using the word cuck when it’s about yourselves Because its after the fact and its clear who has been cucked

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 16:01:28 2019 No.14124263 >>14124132 Why does it feel like everyone that is against nationalism has a terrible family?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 16:23:00 2019 No.14124364 >>14124251 Nations are a farce. Government is the price the honest pay to the deceitful. Corporations are it. They don't have borders, and while they do have faces they pretend to be one of you.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 16:49:00 2019 No.14124492 I'd rather die for my beliefs and principles. I wouldn't hesitate to fight my own nation if it were evil. A nation can be righteous, but never as much as righteousness itself.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:00:52 2019 No.14124559

>>14123711
There certainly were nation states that I would have valued above my own life, but the crapshoot of birth put me in one I do not value at all. My nation is full of retards I don't like who also mostly don't like me.
If I could find a revolutionary movement that aimed at transforming my nation state into something respectable, I'd certainly be willing to die for that, but I doubt I'd ever find one whose ideals line up with mine and whose goals would be furthered by my sacrifice.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:01:57 2019 No.14124570

i am just naturally critical and skeptical towards most things, and it seems nationalists and patriots are so thin skinned they can’t deal with people like me and if you ever say something like ‘dude maybe this war was a bad idea’ they have to say like THEN WHY DID THE SOLDIERS DIE IN THE TRENCHES OF WWI? and it’s like dude, i don’t know, maybe that’s something you have to think about not me

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:04:21 2019 No.14124586

In case this needs to be explained to the burgers in this thread, nationalism is – a relatively recent – idea on the basis of a country. This being that a group of people with a shared ethnic, cultural and linguistic background, i.e., a nation, will together form a state to rule them, that is, a nation-state.
Other ideas are a country formed on the basis of shared ideology, e.g., communism (in practice; in theory communism advocates disestablishment of states), shared religion, i.e., theocracies such as the Islamic State, or simply by being subjects to the same monarch who conquered the land where the different peoples lived, as was the case for most of history.
Nationalism as an idea makes no specific claims on how a country should be run: Although most nation-states tend to be democracies, nothing precludes a nation from having an absolute monarchy.
Finally, most of the advocates for nationalism tend to be people of smaller countries that have historically been under someone else's rule, such as most eastern European nations and peoples near, or nations that still remain stateless, e.g. Kurds.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:07:22 2019 No.14124600 File: 71 KB, 604x511, 1527383208693.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14124586 >tfw you don't have a shared ethnic, cultural, and linguistic background with anyone anywhere

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:12:26 2019 No.14124636 >>14124600 This may be the root cause of the ressentiment of the New Worlders.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:14:02 2019 No.14124642 Its just something bigger than yourself yet still familiar. Le citizen of the world types or humanism becomes very vague, idealistic and often unrealistic

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:36:34 2019 No.14124759 File: 2.40 MB, 2828x1968, 1520450391774.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14123113 >more cucked than nationalism Gynocentrism. Pic related is the apex of pure gynocentrism.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:43:45 2019 No.14124785 >>14124586 B-b-b-but, dude! Nations are just the natural genetic way that humans have always lived!! Living in a nation is simply a way to live in harmony with nature, similar to being a massive fucking chad alpha with a low IQ

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:51:16 2019 No.14124826 If nations don't exist than families don't exist, but families do exist, and by extension nations exist. Inside those lines are the collective identity and culture of a group of people.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 17:53:21 2019 No.14124835 >>14123113 nationalism is based

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 18:36:33 2019 No.14125015

>>14123353
I am not appealing to nature. I claim nations are natural, but not that they are good. Especially not because or in spite of this.
I'm presenting you instead with the threat of nature. These are the processes by which structure emerges from soup primordial. Abide by them or see your gene-self perish

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:01:54 2019 No.14125119 You are born nationalist. To be nationalist is to care for your home more than other people's home, it's a very basic instinct which has become politicised. The under tones of supremacy are forced onto it by lefties

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:04:26 2019 No.14125128

>>14124826
what kind of logic is this?

>if nations don’t exist then families don’t exist

i’m really tryna get on your wavelength here

>if families do exist then nations do exist

honestly, i’m really trying to understand how this proposition even works

>if A doesnt exist then B doesnt exist
>if B exists then A exists

right?

so if Big Foot doesn’t exist, then Big Feet don’t exist
and if Big Feet exist, then Big Foot exists

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:07:02 2019 No.14125139 >>14124263 Hehehe I feel like this is true as why would one wash their hands with their heritage unless they've already been hurt. Decadent society strikes again

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:09:44 2019 No.14125147 >>14125128 National identity is intrinsically tied to your ancestry/DNA/lineage.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:13:08 2019 No.14125160

Nationalism brings a lot of baggage and easy sway into propaganda of the population against an "other." It's also just not suited to the demands of the time. Nation state will also be on the way out, but what will replace it belongs to political philosophy, the kind that hasn't presented itself since ancient Greece.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:13:53 2019 No.14125165

>>14125119
>You are born nationalist.
Nope. You are educated so. It´s no coincidence that modern nationalism appeared roughly the same time as universal education. Without education you don´t know who are "your people" and what is their history. Your people might as well be people from your little village and the "other people" might be those cunts from across the river or those who worship Jesus in a different way.

It would be very unlikely for one to form his identity along the lines of the language he speaks. Nations are way larger than any tribe comprehensible to our natural instincts.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:16:47 2019 No.14125175 >>14125147 Yes, but only to the point of plausible deniability. It´s not the primary determinant. Somali raised by Germans will never pass for a German, but a Pole, Dane, Frenchman or Czech could.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:17:26 2019 No.14125177 >>14125147 are you american? do you swear allegience to the flag each day at school, or are you born gay?

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:19:57 2019 No.14125185

>>14124570
If you knew that 100 years ago your grandaddy died so you could live the life you're living today you'd care.

As for good Vs bad, all wars are bad and show us the evil hidden within us all.

Trying to put yourself above this is offensive since you come off so ignorant, especially if you live in an allied country.

Nationalism has little to do with war for the most part. It's a pride in your identity and the people who came before you.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:22:40 2019 No.14125194 >>14125177 Ehh I'd say Americans have a harder time enjoying their national identity bc of their history but they're alive today and have no one to thank other than filthy revolutionaries

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:23:07 2019 No.14125198 >>14123113 They fought for slaves, not imaginary lines.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:27:30 2019 No.14125212 >>14125165 How is nationalism different from valuing your tribe more than another? Apart from being on a grander scale the morality is still the same. Education simply gave people the means to politicise their instincts.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:27:47 2019 No.14125213 >>14125194 my point was more about the fact they have a whole indoctrination program every day at school. hand on heart swearing an oath. how you can go through that and call it genetic is proof of something but i can’t think what

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:36:10 2019 No.14125239

>>14125212
>Apart from being on a grander scale
The scale is of utmost importance.

>Education simply gave people the means to politicise their instincts.
Lmao no. There was plenty of rivalries and heterogenity before education stamped it out to uniformity. For example in pre-nationalist France people from different areas would barely understand each other. Even today there are intra-national conflicts between south Italians and North Italians or Catalans whom the Spanish failed to fully integrate. You simply don´t understand that world used to be much simpler, the average peasant had no need for nationalism unless foreigners were looting his village.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:36:50 2019 No.14125242

>>14125213
Idk about American patriotism but I don't believe it's purely an "indoctrination programme". America for all of it's evils is still one of the most free places on the planet and the oath you swear probably used to be seen by most as genuine reminder of what you owe to the nation. Freedoms out the asshole Are just taken for granted in 2019.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:41:30 2019 No.14125255 File: 72 KB, 370x290, D331B179-A545-49E4-8ABC-677A27C2C8F2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14125242 this is what they do every day at school lol

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:43:23 2019 No.14125258 >>14125255 stay mad, commie fag

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:46:37 2019 No.14125268 File: 153 KB, 800x792, D83F3D07-9E2F-4837-B5E0-4976711B9DD2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14125258 lol every day no joke

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:52:34 2019 No.14125280

>>14125239
Hmmm I never considered how education and national identity are linked. I guess I just wanted it to be simpler than it is. I'd still say nationalism is an instinctual conclusion to a world full of nations and thus is common for people to believe whether or not they identify as a nationalist.

>>14125255
>>14125268
Bet Americans only joined the war BC Nazis were stealing Their salute

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:53:28 2019 No.14125285

>>14125212
The scale is everything. Tribalism is rooted in concrete relationships that you actually have with real people you see and interact with. Nationalism relies on abstract relationships with people you cannot possibly know.
In the case that your nation really, truly has some kind of embodied ideals and shared culture, it's a mostly valid feeling. In the 21st century west, where my neighbors have nothing in common with me, my nation has no firm ideals guiding it, and my culture is the same global Disney monstrosity as everywhere else, nationalism is a doomed attempt at necromancy.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 19:55:39 2019 No.14125293 >>14123113 Imagine if you loved your country, how nice it would be.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 20:01:39 2019 No.14125316 >>14125285 Agreed. Nationalism would have been quite a nice thing to experience but it's impossible for western countries in 2019 to enjoy any sense of it beyond liking the same brand or celebrity as your "countrymen".

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 20:06:56 2019 No.14125336

>>14125280
>I'd still say nationalism is an instinctual conclusion to a world full of nations and thus is common for people to believe whether or not they identify as a nationalist.
No. Even by WW2 there were regions, where people that lacked national identity. For example the Schläsinger from around Teschen were considered Polish by Poles, because their language was classified as Polish under Austrian rule; they were considered ethnic German by Nazis, who run a massive program to Germanize them and they were considered Czech by Czechs who considered them to be part of their historical territory. Schläsingers themselves held no identity apart from their regional one, altough they were somewhat sympathetic to the Czechs during the post-WW1 fuckery.

In order for nationalism to be instinctive, you need specific circumstances where both "us" and "them" make sense. It´s no instinctive to a simple minded peasant who identifies by his family and lord and it´s not instinctive to modern American who identifies by race.

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 20:17:31 2019 No.14125374

>>14125336
>and it´s not instinctive to modern American who identifies by race.

all your analysis has been great so far, although i may add there are competing identifications in terms of as well as simply race. ‘White Liberals’ simply love to hate on ‘White Trash’ etc etc etc

it’s a damn shame that indoctrination program didn’t quite work out as expected

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 20:50:49 2019 No.14125484

>>14125336
>Circumstances where us and them make sense
An instinct is a response to environmental stimuli, it's not far of a stretch to say education is an environmental factor. So would you still say nationalism isn't instinctual even though once they had been made aware of the nations of the world people generally would want to support their own? Regardless of national identity being a recent thing.

It's my mentality that us and them generally always makes sense. I have always had an ingroup and felt that certain people could harm that ingroup. Maybe that makes me too distrustful but I don't hold it against anyone unless they've shown me otherwise. I would say this is an instinct.

To be honest I can't think of a situation without the us and them dynamic. I don't view "them" as the enemy it's more so as other. "Us" on the overhand I view as the people I allow close to me. When this is scaled up to nations I still feel as though if a nation was truly threatened my idea of "us" would expand out of necessity. But I've never been in a situation like that so I can't say for sure how I and others would react.

I do however retract >eryyone born nationalist.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:12:39 2019 No.14125573 What if you're a left nationalist

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:24:57 2019 No.14125619

>>14125484
>It's my mentality that us and them generally always makes sense. I have always had an ingroup and felt that certain people could harm that ingroup.
Yes, but that mentality isn´t inherently nationalist. That ingroup/outgroup can be defined by plenty of other factors instead of just language. Nationalism in it´s early stage even had universalizing tendency, for example German nationalists wanted to cede Polish territory to the Poles, since they were only interested in German nation state on German territory and their main enemy were the German conservatives.

>"Us" on the overhand I view as the people I allow close to me
Would you let a hobo close to you, just because he speaks your language?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:31:09 2019 No.14125653 >>14125619 If you had a choice of the homeless who spoke your language, and one who didn't, who would you choose?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:41:24 2019 No.14125685 File: 71 KB, 960x932, 1536761511221.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14123125 fpbp

Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:42:42 2019 No.14125691

>>14125653
If you had a choice of the homeless who´s well read in the same books you are, and one who didn't, who would you choose? The point isn´t really about "what if all other identifiers were equal, apart from language", it´s about the primary group identifier and how strongly does one feel like "we are all members of the group, so we must cooperate regardless of our differences".

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:45:46 2019 No.14125704 >>14125691 >nation means we must cooperate regardless of our differences Who said that you nonce. Are you a socialist?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:53:16 2019 No.14125735 >>14125704 Such sentiment is a key part of nationalism.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:56:13 2019 No.14125747 >>14123113 globalism

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 21:56:34 2019 No.14125750 >>14125735 Even were I to agree with that statement, I didn't say nationalism, I said nation. And you didn't answer my question. Are you a socialist?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:01:25 2019 No.14125769 >>14125750 To be entirely honest, that doesn´t matter. Existence of nation depends on nationalism. No nationalism, no nation, no "us, the language speakers".

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Wed Nov 6 22:02:56 2019 No.14125776

>>14124759
>/r9k/ cuck meme
Do you even know how cuckoldry works?

>>14125293
I love the countryside, nature. The reality of the landscape. It is never nice to see a fence/wall/boarder checkpoint, it is never nice to see nationalist/capitalists screwing up nature for cash-grabs, poisoning the water and killing off the soil. How nice could it ever be? You imagine they’re there for your protection, but they’re not really.
How nice it would be to be rid of the nationstate

>>14125573
Hello Barrack Obama

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:03:09 2019 No.14125777 >>14125769 You seem to insist on not answering my question. Why? Are you scared? You don't even know what my political beliefs are.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:04:44 2019 No.14125784 >>14123113 The nation is the people not the land or boarders of the country you fucking moron

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:05:02 2019 No.14125786 >>14125776 >Barrack Obama >nationalist Yeah, I'm sure that was funny in your head you tranny dunce.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:08:02 2019 No.14125803 >>14125777 I´m afraid political believes don´t matter here. Personally I identify as a conservative, but nothing about the argument would change if I were to call myself Posadist.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Wed Nov 6 22:08:34 2019 No.14125807 >>14125786 Dude asked “left nationalists” Who invaded more nations, Bush or Obama? Get the dildo outta yer ass, thirsty lad

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:09:10 2019 No.14125813 >>14125803 What do you aim to conserve if you refuse to reference your nation?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:10:41 2019 No.14125819 >>14125807 I'm a Marxist-Leninist you annoying faggot

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:11:40 2019 No.14125828 >>14125807 >>14125819 Both of you kill yourselves and go back to plebbit.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Wed Nov 6 22:12:07 2019 No.14125830 >>14125819 A thirsty ML with a dildo up his ass. Are you drunk?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:12:13 2019 No.14125832 >>14125813 I´m sorry, I don´t understand what´s your point.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:13:41 2019 No.14125838 >>14125828 I've never used reddit in my life you actual nigger. No one cares about your autism

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:16:31 2019 No.14125854 >>14125832 I.e. Why are you a conservative if you reject the category of nations? What anchors your belief if not nation? >>14125830 I'm not interested in you fantasies, go away you tranny fuck

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:17:55 2019 No.14125862 >>14125854 >I.e. Why are you a conservative if you reject the category of nations There´s plenty of things to conserve like religion, tradition, community, family etc., but where have I rejected nations?

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:24:04 2019 No.14125894 >>14125862 Sorry, you'll have to be more specific then - what do you reject about nationalism that can't be applied to any of the things you mentioned?

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Wed Nov 6 22:28:47 2019 No.14125915 >>14125854 I’m not interested in you. Not male. Leave me alone.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:32:32 2019 No.14125933 >>14125915 You replied to me you narcissist prick. Regardless, goodbye.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 22:34:17 2019 No.14125939 >>14123113 > so fucking stupid he calls said national boundary lines 'arbitrary' National boundaries are the absolute opposite of 'arbitrary', you intellectually dishonest mong. C'mon my dude, you can't be that fucking retarded.

>>	Anonymous Wed Nov 6 23:28:35 2019 No.14126101 >>14125939 Depends on the national boundary, there are inarguably some that are arbitrary, and the very fact that they are causes serious problems

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 00:35:37 2019 No.14126272 >>14123763 Is this real Zizek or fake Zizek? Good imitation, if you wrote that.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 01:58:48 2019 No.14126436 >>14123158 >Borders exist to define countries >Border definition of countries is arbitrary >Borders are arbitrary Is it that hard?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 02:55:11 2019 No.14126598 File: 254 KB, 1313x1080, 1313px-Australia_satellite_plane.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14123113 >arbitrary lines on a map

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 03:02:07 2019 No.14126622 >>14126436 We aren’t talking about countries, we are talking about nations. There is obviously a line somewhere close the border of France and Germany where more people speak French on one side and German on the other. That’s not arbitrary at all.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 03:10:48 2019 No.14126642

>>14126436
That's retarded. There's a logical reason for borders between nations to exist and if you can't fathom why there would be a need I advise you to get out of starbucks, head to a library and start fucking reading history books.

The fact that some are arbitrary does not mean that all are arbitrary, or that borders as a concept are bad. JFC these people.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 04:00:42 2019 No.14126779

>>14125484
>An instinct is a response to environmental stimuli, it's not far of a stretch to say education is an environmental factor. So would you still say nationalism isn't instinctual even though once they had been made aware of the nations of the world people generally would want to support their own?

whats up with all this poor use of reason and logic by pro-nationalists? i haven’t heard one sound argue why i should be convinced nationalism is something useful to me in the modern world, or why loyalty to people with my passport or ‘ethnic group’ would be a good idea for me in the modern world. try to see past your own shallow reasoning and convince me.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 04:03:57 2019 No.14126785
File: 315 KB, 750x1334, B51428CA-3DF6-422E-B5D7-E6349C8DC0D1.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>14126598
>arbitrary lines on a map

nice try dude, but look again

somone literally took a pencil and drew a square and called it ‘northern territory’

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 04:08:25 2019 No.14126795 >>14126785 charge your phone ifaggot

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 04:10:28 2019 No.14126800 File: 212 KB, 700x422, pho_08_01_switzerland.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14126622 Hi there, person who thinks languages create nations.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 04:19:19 2019 No.14126822 File: 254 KB, 750x1334, 345BC27D-32C5-4650-9379-E5A74405F844.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14126795 back again with another line in the sand, you idiot

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 04:57:44 2019 No.14126895 >>14126785 Who the fuck dies for the northern territory? Not that it's a nation anyway.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:01:29 2019 No.14126906 >>14126779 >i haven’t heard one sound argue why i should be convinced nationalism is something useful to me in the modern world so you don't get killed and or fucked in the ass by other nations

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:03:04 2019 No.14126911 File: 1.22 MB, 750x1334, 1CACB038-4A71-4D8E-8072-B0A1AE2E45A0.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14126895 >Who the fuck dies for the northern territory? i don’t know dude, probably these lads

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:04:40 2019 No.14126916 >>14126906 saying i need nationalism to protect me from nationalism is a self-defeating argument, anon

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:05:10 2019 No.14126918 >>14126911 >Northern Territory Force was an Australian Army force

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:07:06 2019 No.14126922 >>14126916 no it isn't

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:08:35 2019 No.14126928 >>14126918 >was a force yes i don’t know if you’ve noticed, but the war has been over for a while and basically no-one is threatening to invade at the mo >>14126922 so i should get insurance for my insurance, is that it?

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:15:33 2019 No.14126941

>>14126928
>was a force
I meant the Australian part.
>basically no-one is threatening to invade at the mo
m8 our closest neighbour has a population of 260 million radical Muslims.
>insurance for my insurance,
No. Other nations exist and so to should ours. That's not self defeating, it's just game theory. I don't get what you mean by the reinsurance thing.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:23:28 2019 No.14126957 >>14123113 Nations are there not for individuals but for other nations. Prove me wrong.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:26:27 2019 No.14126963 >>14123113 >Name an ideology more cucked than nationalism Internationalism. Imagine going to war and dying for someone else's country. The literal definition of cuckoldry.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:32:13 2019 No.14126973 >>14126963 >Imagine going to war and dying for someone else's country. sounds like a very noble thing to do, die for someone elses freedom... almost sounds like every argument i’ve ever heard for Nationalism!

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:43:29 2019 No.14126995 >>14125894 Is this some weird gaslight attempt? Where has been anything said about rejecting nationalism?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:45:47 2019 No.14127002 >>14126973 >cuckoldry is noble

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:51:29 2019 No.14127014

>>14123113
I do not care for nations. I do not care for family, related by blood or by "extension". I do not care for whatever ignorant ideas nationalists bring into the fray. I do not need a nation, I need only me
I do not care for socialism. I do not care for humanism. I do not care for others. I do not expect you to care for me. I do not care for race.
I only care for my greatest hunger, for I am eternally hungry, a hunger unrelenting rumbling in me. I am the great hunger.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:52:35 2019 No.14127016 >>14126800 Nice try you dishonest faggot, but nowhere does he say "nations are exclusively defined by languages".

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:54:16 2019 No.14127021

>>14126822

Even that border isn't arbitrary because there were reasons behind drawing that line there and not 50 km to east or to the west.
Not to mention that just because you can find EXAMPLES of arbitrary borders, that in no way implies borders are by definition arbitrary.

You see that would mean everyone is a faggot because you are an EXAMPLE of a person who is a faggot.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:56:23 2019 No.14127027
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>>14127014
>I'm an island
>the multi-housand-year-old civilizational development that precedes me is irrelevant to my present circumstance
>I could very well just b myself bro the same way in every part of the world

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:58:03 2019 No.14127032

>>14123665
You fucking coward. You are the lowest piece of shit in the world. You sit on your ass all day musing about the nihilism present in your life. Do something, and I do not mean "go outside, walk, physical exercise, meditation" or whatever yoga mom horseshit people are trying to sell, if you feel your current life is meaningless, then there is nothing to care for true? the absence of it is not something you would be hurt by? since it holds no value and is meaningless?
Sell all your comforting little snuggly toys, sell your home, sell everything, buy a one way ticket to wherever you want, then suddenly life is of interest again. The only way to save oneself from decaying inside their comfort is to break all barriers that can be broken, and be truly nude and at peace with the world.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:58:24 2019 No.14127033 >>14126436 You just repeated your same unsubstantiated claim "Border definition of countries is arbitrary". You didn't actually expand on your argument in any way, even though you might have thought you did by adding 2 extra lines.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:58:32 2019 No.14127034 >>14127014 Go live in the woods then

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 05:58:52 2019 No.14127036 File: 1.22 MB, 750x1334, 47FF833C-5EDC-4A77-B6CB-18C32D7DA65A.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14127021 >there were reasons behind drawing that line there and that reason is this biatch

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:00:20 2019 No.14127041 >>14127036 stupid phoneposter please kill yourself

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:02:44 2019 No.14127049 >>14127036 Aren't you just confusing 'social construct' for meaningless? Borders being 'arbitrary' doesn't make them worthless, or non-existent for that matter.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:03:24 2019 No.14127052 File: 3.68 MB, 750x1334, D1AA4F26-183E-45C5-8611-5548CF0D598E.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14127041 >stupid phoneposter please kill yourself

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:06:08 2019 No.14127061

>>14125280
"hmm, these people mogged me in an argument where I was a stupid reductionist, but I still believe exactly what I said before" I hate how every single political person is cheering like it´s for a fucking football team. People don't change even when their entire argument dissolves, just retreat back to " I still think". No, that is the thing, you dont think.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:07:49 2019 No.14127065 >>14127049 >Aren’t you confusing ‘social construct’ for meaningless? i’m not confused about anything, those are the descriptors you deduced from my circumstantial iphoneposting evidence

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:10:01 2019 No.14127070 >>14127065 Suit yourself. I'd rather not argue at the moment

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:10:57 2019 No.14127074 >>14127061 this thread: https://youtu.be/rYFQZFL0yoo

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:11:01 2019 No.14127077 >>14125813 You don't know how to argue, stop ad-homming and thinking you are smart, stop writing. Ben shapiro tier arguing.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:12:33 2019 No.14127086

>>14123113
>Name an ideology more cucked than nationalism
Globalism. Imagine ruining all of history and culture so that everybody will forever dress the same, live in houses that are the same, speak the same language and want the same consumer products.
Imagine seeing that as your life mission.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:14:14 2019 No.14127092

>>14126941
Yeah 260 million radical muslims, im guessing they all are foaming at the mouth at the thought of dismembering you and shitting on baby jesus or something, or injecting you with muslim gene so you become black or something.
Did you read that on a /pol/ chart?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:17:01 2019 No.14127100 >>14127027 Not saying that, there are surely a thousand and one different circumstances that make me the person I am right now, including where I was born. All im saying is that It is irrelevant in the question of self-fulfillment.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:18:46 2019 No.14127105 >>14127086 Absolute lol, so you want everyone to dress the same, live in the same houses, speak the same language, and consume the same things, but only in the vicinity of your country.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:18:49 2019 No.14127106

>>14127086
>Imagine ruining all of history and culture so that everybody will forever dress the same, live in houses that are the same, speak the same language and want the same consumer products.
Imagine seeing that as your life mission.

once again dude, that sounds exactly like nationalism

jesus f00king Xrist

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:19:36 2019 No.14127109
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Countries and nations are a relic of the past, archaic concepts from a time the world was thought to be the center of the universe and tribes fought, conquered and replaced each other ad nauseam.

Ding-dong, it's the 20th century, with nuclear energy, and nukes. Any conflict between arbitrary, line-in-the-sand defined tribes now has the potential to escalate to a planet-destroying, species-erradicating event, in the light of which, king, country, race become even more evident spooks

Embrace globalism.
Embrace humanism.
Embrace peace.
And soon, embrace transhumanism.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:21:04 2019 No.14127114

>>14123480
From strong leaders in other tribes who understand how power works and are willing to assert themselves. Do you really think that China believes itself to be equal to the African countries it's beginning to colonize? Do you really think the rest of the world is so afraid of recognizing the validity/pursuit of their own interests in the way you (primarily leftist/progressive bourgeois white people) are?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:21:28 2019 No.14127117 >>14127077 actually, Ben Shapiro's idea on being gay / trans, is really easy to deconstruct

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:25:42 2019 No.14127125 >>14127109 Correct. Embrace one world government. Your individual freedom is largely overrated when there is a planet at stake

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:27:39 2019 No.14127129 File: 138 KB, 840x729, 253-2538368_104-kb-png-apu-apustaja-thumbs-up.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14127109 But I want planet destroying event, mr. Dingdong.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:28:01 2019 No.14127130 >>14127109 If transhumanism isn't historically immanent, you have to make it happen. This is where it bulges at the seams. Same as the Marxists who hate nationalism until they have a country and then they're nationalists.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:29:32 2019 No.14127137 >>14123125 >An invention literally just a couple hundred years old (not even in alpha) b-but need big daddy government to take care of my ass

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 06:43:37 2019 No.14127162

This whole thread is pure cringe. Have you fuckers ever read a book?

>>14123113
In no nationalist school of thought is there such a thing as dying for the lines themselves. You die for yourself by affirming your characteristics and by trying to protect and grow this what is yours. What that exactly entails is debateable but this is the fundamental notion behind in-group movement towards something. But you are bait anyway.

>>14123465
>>14123623
Thats a high level retard statement.

>>14123665
You dont perform the act because you believe in it. You believe in it by performing it. There is no happyness behind a sad face and there is no great idea behind a meaningless life. Perform faith and greatness to believe it.

>>14123711
Go hang yourself you fucking atomist.

>>14124251
What a beautiful pic

>>14124559
Then go somewhere and affirm that. There is such a thing as assimilation anon. But on the other hand your affect in which you dont see any value in what is immediate to you shows that you are intrinsically resentfull

>>14124586
I wouldnt call a communist "nationhood" understanding as fundamentally fused by ideology. Communism is a far more complex group-glue.

>>14124785
>B-b-b-but, dude! Nations are just the natural genetic way that humans have always lived!!
only fucking idiots believe in biological political personhood.

>>14125212
you dont need to negate something to affirm another. You can just affirm yourself and affirm the otherness of the other. Can you pls consume something else than introductions into hegel 101.

>>14125285
thats bullshit. there are tribal socities in which not every member is in relationship to every other. The last name is enough as a signifyer and that sounds a lot like what you would call nationalism.

>>14126785
Yeah you have to read more about the long and proud history of the northern territorys seperatist movement and identity. All those proud nothern-territoryites with their own dialect and culture, history and shared stories.

>>14126800
nobody said that linguistic culture is the ONLY signifyer.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 07:19:32 2019 No.14127239

>>14123113
Nobody went to die for lines on a map. A nation is defined as a people with common ancestry, culture and language, you dont even know what a nation means. People died for THE nation, for their families, because the central building block of a nation is the family unit. Now stop shitposting on 4chan and go read a book

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 07:25:18 2019 No.14127259

>>14127162
thanks anon, one of the first posters to bring some well thought-out, fresh arguments to the table

>Yeah you have to read more about the long and proud history of the northern territorys seperatist movement and identity. All those proud nothern-territoryites with their own dialect and culture, history and shared stories.

Oh yes, but this is how this shit works. the Texas seperatist movement exists, and once upon a time it was also a vast empty space on the map with practically drawn up lines. Seperatism itself is mostly a political-ecomonic thing. the USA was a british colony that no longer wanted to pay taxes to the king? ok sweet, American Ethnicity Invented

ok, i see why some nations exist, but i can also imagine they could not exist, and that’s too much of a headfuck for some apparently.

and if we were all a bunch of morris dancing fucklords with a culture worth saving, maybe i’d be in 100%, but as another poster mentioned, im not sure i’m gonna die for Disney

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 07:26:36 2019 No.14127263 >>14127259 backpedaling faggot

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 07:29:35 2019 No.14127269 >>14127263 what i am i backpedalling on you thick idiot?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 07:44:41 2019 No.14127291 >>14123113 >HurDur nationalism is bad The alternatives are just as bad

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 08:15:41 2019 No.14127346

>>14127092
Have you ever been to Indonesia? They absolutely loathe Australians and their way of life. 20 years of economic development and we'll be an easy target. It's not a particularly controversial statement, either. Certainly not /pol/. It's a real enough threat that our government and defense force take it seriously.
Not to worry, though; we'll just let them know that their nationalism is a self defeating argument.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 08:27:35 2019 No.14127382 >>14127346 let me know once the Gold Coast has officially become the Gold Caliphate so i can come surf in a burqini and roast another halal on the barbie m8

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 08:32:32 2019 No.14127399 >>14127382 < 50

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:27:46 2019 No.14127585 >>14125807 "Nationalist" doesn't mean neocon warmonger.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 09:41:12 2019 No.14127626
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>>14127585
Or neoliberal warmonger? Or an imperialist warmonger?
Yeah, it does. Anyone who supports the legal fiction of a state is by my definition a statist or nationalist.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:41:21 2019 No.14127628

>>14127259
>American Ethnicity Invented
>Invented
that's not how it works. It was a process of shared traits, values, and virtues that led towards it formation following unified struggle. You sound like a lazy Deconstructionist which is perhaps the laziest ideology to ever exist.

>but i can also imagine they could not exist
So provide something more concrete than a passive aggressive statement. I am entirely not convinced such a thing is remotely possible given in-group human preference which has always existed since the days of hunter-gatherer societies that battled and slaughtered other hunter-gatherer societies for hunting grounds.

>im not sure i'm gonna die for Disney
???????????

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:43:07 2019 No.14127636

>>14127626
And your alternative is...? Because unless you support a concept of technological ascendancy via human singularity then I am not at all convinced it is possible for human beings to communally live together as one entity mass. The great struggles of Communism in the 20th century tried and miserably failed in this process, often having to resort to insane amounts of violence (e.g. the purges of academia, displacement and genocide of the Lemko's etc etc) in order to even try and hold their formless beliefs together. It then of course just became a nation state, the fate of all human communities.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:44:22 2019 No.14127639 >>14123113 Say that to my face and see what happens

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:44:55 2019 No.14127641

>>14127585
The problem with people like whom you are trying to engage with in conversation is they are formless in beliefs and just jelly their way out of any critique. They are pointless to talk with because they aren't capable of having a debate and simply project their own lack of inner faith onto everybody else. Presumably the individual is a lazy Deconstructionist too afraid to blow their brains out or go on a mass shooting.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:46:00 2019 No.14127646 >>14127137 that is a stupid lie, why do you keep repeating it?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:47:36 2019 No.14127657 >>14127137 Yeah because there were no established hierachies in any part of history just at the advent of the rise of nation states holy fucking hell, Reddit garbage.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:50:34 2019 No.14127670 >>14123125 Fpbp

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:51:46 2019 No.14127677 >>14127641 They literally can't call conceive of politics beyond me human bid ea and the comforts that can be lavished upon them. There's nothing else in their heads.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:53:53 2019 No.14127687 >>14127677 It is the main reason why I do not believe in the concept of a universal vote. The more I talk with people the less I believe it is reasonable or even desirable.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:54:21 2019 No.14127689 >>14125807 >>14125776 this moron think zionism is representative of nationalism. Obama didn't bomb those nation for the sake of the US, he bombed them because AIPAIC told him to.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:54:44 2019 No.14127691

>>14127259
>American Ethnicity
Pretty sure the american ethnicity was and was meant to be anglo-saxon with protestant culture, which is why from the very first session of congress there were strong limits placed on migration which lasted in one form or another until the passing of the Hart–Celler act, which Emanuel Celler literally fought 40 years of his life to pass, he was very determined to get it passed for some reason really makes you think.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:58:38 2019 No.14127707 >>14127137 >he doesn't understand that fascism is a means to monarchism >he doesn't know that you can't monarchism without metaphysics Why do people on /lit/ refuse to read, I will never understand this

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 09:58:43 2019 No.14127708

>>14127636
>Submit
>Submit
>SUBMIT

STATE-socialism failed, fucknut.
>Insane amounts of violence
Do you not understand the world you're living in right NOW? There's insane amounts of violence NOW, and all to promote state and capital.
The alternative is to NOT do that.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 09:58:50 2019 No.14127709

>>14127628
>????????
The point sailing over the heads of many nationalists here is that what you're saying a nation is about - shared language, culture, values, and ideals - has been pretty thoroughly erased for most of the west, especially Americans.
I'm an American, and my ancestors have been here since the 1700s. They fought in the Revolution and the Civil War. But when I look at my culture today, I see nothing tying me to them. Not a single one of those aspects of a nation uniquely connect me to my neighbors - all of them are globalized and homogenized, watered down to the point that it doesn't matter where you're from, it's all the same dull shit.
Globohomo killed nationalism intentionally, and it can't be resuscitated. It's dead.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:02:22 2019 No.14127728

>>14127708
Are you on drugs?

>STATE-socialism failed, fucknut
And "State-Socialism" derived from the anarchistic Bolshevik communes as a natural course. The Red Terrors got out of hand, millions perished before order could be restored and even Stalin realized at some point it had to cease as a formless state of unchecked massacres. Let's also not pretend that expulsions of various demographic groups ONLY happened under Stalinism when we know the Bolshevik's routinely massacred ethnic groups (particularly in the East and to this day modern Russians are not welcome in many of these places e.g. Tuuva).

>There's insane amounts of violence NOW
Yes and that's okay with me. I have yet to see an aspect of our reality not grounded in some kind of violence. Even the stars themselves are composed of violence. I don't try to repress this fact, rather, it is more healthy in my opinion to be conscious of it lest it fester like a wound and turn into something even worse than what it is already.

>The alternative is to NOT do that.
You have said quite a lot about what we should do or not do but have not really added any depth to these demands of yours.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:06:52 2019 No.14127741 >>14123125 >socialist >presented as anti-nationalist kek, okay schizo

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:06:58 2019 No.14127743 >arbitrary thing me like good >arbitrary thing me no like bad

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:07:15 2019 No.14127746

>>14127709
>especially Americans
And I would say that America is in pretty rough condition right now. Many cities are barren or growing desolate (e.g. I think of Philadelphia which will presumably have some reduction in size as the poverty grows). Also, we know very well that the Hispanic population (just to use a major population group that is under the public eye) does very little to assimilate and has no interest in assimilating (e.g. many places in Southern California are predominantly Spanish speaking, to the point where one may not even need to use English at all). They are rightfully advancing their own ethnic interests (e.g. supporting the legitimization of illegal immigrants which would therefore bolster their own core population count).

>I see nothing tying me to them
Well this is simply because your nation is in its death throes and potentially going to Balkanize (in the most extreme scenario).

>it's all the same dull shit
And thus we have learned that the absence of culture, language, values, etc etc etc - all the many facets that compose a people are probably quite an important necessity for the health and well being of humanity. What we see mostly from the "globalized" streets of America is nihilistic, self-destructive rampages (mass shootings are a brilliant example of this) and slow but sure descent into oblivion.

I am simply not so pessimistic because we have seen similar occurrences in history and the American story is nothing unique. I imagine a citizen of the Ming, or Rome, or the Shogunate had similar feelings as yourself as their culture became a civilization which then inevitably led to dissolution and collapse. Like our own lives, every culture has its lifespan. Yet, like human life, new ones always begin. I don't think it's so doom and gloom you just happened to be born in an era of iron rather than gold.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:08:39 2019 No.14127753 >>14127708 'State' socialism is, and has been, far less of a failure than anarchism my friend.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:09:40 2019 No.14127758 >>14127728 >Lies >I'm a sociopath >Trying to make me feel bad You people drag this whole site down

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:11:46 2019 No.14127765 >>14127753 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jytf-5St8WU

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:12:29 2019 No.14127770

>>14127758
More irrelevant nonsense presumably from intoxication. Sober up and then present something clear or don't it doesn't matter to me.

>You people
You haven't posited a single concept.

>>14127765
>links a fucking youtube video because you can't speak for yourself
I think we're done here.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:16:17 2019 No.14127790 >>14127753 The anarchists in Spain, championed by contemporary anarchists had hard defined borders and shot their enemies in open combat. Of course, they will never admit such things.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:16:41 2019 No.14127796 >>14127758 Not watching a Kropotkin video, sorry. The Conquest of Bread was unsatisfying enough. I'll take the actual existence of 'state' socialist countries right now over anarchist scribblings.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:16:46 2019 No.14127798 >>14123113 >arbitrary lines on a map DILATE UNDERAGED FAGGOT

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:18:50 2019 No.14127807

>>14127790
Naturally they did, as does Rojava. The anarchists in Spain, or anywhere else for that matter, didn't fail because of 'betrayal', to preempt the talking point. Every socialist movement faces that. They failed because they were ideologically unequipped for their own ascendancy.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:20:23 2019 No.14127811

>>14127106
At least the world would have places worth visiting.
Besides, nationalism did not enforce the current dress code (suit and tie) across the planet. Multiple separate cultures with political power will naturally evolve distinct.
I actually want differences in this world. Far beyond restaurants that develop towards identicality due to capitalism.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:21:58 2019 No.14127815

>>14127807
Which fascinates me most about this is not so much the people participating in these conflicts (e.g. I can at least have some shared understanding with a Spanish anarchist who carried a rifle and shot at Franco's soldiers because there is at least a commonality of understanding in-group, out-group dynamics) but the people who sideline and, like sports fans, preach their "solidarity" to these movements without ever actively involving themselves in them. Then, they sit in college campuses deconstructing all human interaction (one could make numerous jokes about this) and then ... ? They don't really do much beyond this. I wonder if these types have always existed and I just lack the vocabulary that pin points them exactly. But these do-nothing sideline cheerleaders interest me.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:28:03 2019 No.14127843 Saying something is arbitrary is not a fucking argument, almost fucking anything humans do or care about can be made to be this reductionist.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:29:24 2019 No.14127844 >>14123113 >arbitrary lines on a map. so your house is just arbitrary walls?

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:32:31 2019 No.14127855

>>14127807
>It wasn't betrayal it was that they weren't prepared for the betrayal
DUHHHH

A huge group believes in something and implements it, and it works really well, but is invaded by a fascist. So you think it doesn't work? No, you just side with the fascists.
And over and over and over and over you make these threads on your home board, and now you've branched out to as many of the other boards to repeat the lies and slants and hope the propaganda seeps into young fools minds and you'll have idiot soldiers for the deep state to ascent to total power as they wage nuclear war on China and Russia and hasten our extinction, because you can't get a girlfriend. What a joke.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:33:18 2019 No.14127856 >>14127815 It's just reality failing to meet impossible hopes, thus, the fetishiation of the noble failure, thus, the withdrawal from politics into the purity of theory. I guess.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:35:18 2019 No.14127869 >>14127843 It's the start of an argument. And there's a damn good reason to unclinch this fist as it is crushing what we hold so tightly and drawing blood with the fingernails

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:37:42 2019 No.14127876

>>14127856
And we hear again that invisible lines drawn up by lawyers are just *reality*

Our hope is that you wake the fuck up from this sleepwalking nightmare.
Anonymous bitches and moans about the terrible world and promotes it all in one breath.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:38:13 2019 No.14127879

>>14127855
>but is invaded by a fascist
There were not only clashes with the "fascists", you know, but there was also growing resentment with Catalonian's who didn't want to live in their system they imposed on everyone around them. You make it sound as if anarchism in Spain blissfully appeared out of thin air one day, amid beds of roses and fine perfumes and everyone cheerily got along. Most of their foot soldiers that were sent to die in the fire fights were poor working men that had believed they could improve their lives by adopting to this ideology. They were simply taken advantage of. I will not pretend that Spain was in any great state prior to the Spanish Civil War but I am not convinced that anarchism was this "Voluntary" ideology its propagated to be.

Let's not also pretend that the anarchists wanted hard defined borders for their new found state.

>idiot soldiers for the deep state
You realize you are posting on 4chan which is typically a harbor for those with opinions contrarian to the status quo, yes?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:38:53 2019 No.14127883 >>14127844 False equivalence Not an argument

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:40:32 2019 No.14127889
File: 29 KB, 340x407, Please+everyone+knows+that+using+smug+anime+girl+pictures+_001752e948dd2bde7823a21670fa8ad0.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>there are people posting in this thread who would UNIRONICALLY die for their bourgeois overlords

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:40:40 2019 No.14127891 >>14123113 i think dying for fat whore women who treat you like untouchable trash is cucked to the core, all while you provide for their welfare through taxes and wageslavery i think doing anything for women is cucked

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:40:43 2019 No.14127892 >>14127883 But it is a border for shelter the same way a nation is for a culture community. But I have yet to see a single ideology that did not ultimately produce a border.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:41:01 2019 No.14127893

>>14127855
No, I said it didn't matter whether there was 'betrayal', that'll always be a matter of disagreement. What matters is the inherent flaws of anarchism that stack the world-historical odds against it. They were, and are, unequipped to do what's necessary to survive. So they don't. Or they do, but not enough, like Catalonia. Maybe you just find anarchism's irrelevance depressing. Not really my problem. The state is necessary to abolish the state.
Also, I only post here.

>>14127876
No, lines ENFORCED are reality. Protest however much you want, makes no difference. You're riled up aren't you.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:41:50 2019 No.14127897 >>14127889 Passive aggressive and non-contributing low tier anime pic garbage.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:42:18 2019 No.14127899 >>14127879 >with opinions contrarian to the status quo, yes? Irony no one sees yet they're so stupid.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:43:04 2019 No.14127900 >>14127899 Where is the irony? This is the usual jelly dialogue I expect from a deconstructionist of course. I wonder how you will derail the conversation next.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:43:20 2019 No.14127902 File: 84 KB, 780x475, NO.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14127892 >the same way a nation is NO

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:44:26 2019 No.14127904 >>14127902 >NO I see we're really getting into it now.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:44:42 2019 No.14127905 >>14127902 Give birth.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 10:47:40 2019 No.14127914 >>14127904 It's a false equivalence. It's not the same >>14127900 They DO support the status quo. They are or would be useful idiots for the status quo. Easily.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:51:20 2019 No.14127924

>>14127628
nahhh, there are always power plays happening, changing interests, and there are always arguments to persuade people to get onboard. why are all corporations jumping on the LGBT bandwagon, why are people quick to identify themselves as LGBT, why does LGBT have its own flag? i’m not saying social constructions arent real, they are, and by realising that we can form around more substantial common goals

>not sure such a thing is possible
ok my dude, all forms of organisation other than ethno-linguistic nationstates have been a figment of histories collective imaginaton

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:53:03 2019 No.14127930 >>14127889 >there are unironic utilitarian robots incapable of conceiving of anything greater than how much pleasure their body receives participating in politics Your type is horrifying, desu.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 10:53:27 2019 No.14127932 File: 119 KB, 583x482, 1548810236506.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >another /pol/ thread

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 11:05:35 2019 No.14127995
File: 19 KB, 205x307, max_stirner_smoking_black_on_white_t_shirt-r7410a749edc643a084ffbebcd1dd645e_k2gr0_307.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>you must help your nation
>you must help humanity
>you must help fellow humans
>you must help society
>you must help your people
>you must help your language
>you must help this ideology
>you must help progress
all of this and many other stuff are spooks. why should i help a society that alienated me because i am deemed not good enough? why should i exhaust myself with wage slaving to people who treats me like i am a monstrous verminous bug?
>"b-b-b-but muh continuation of humanity"
i won't live more than 100 years

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 11:51:38 2019 No.14128179

>>14127914
Let me add to this “they are”
Anonymous is a collectivist mass of followers. Empty headed when they arrive and full of poisonous thoughts ever after. You let the strong willed mold you, the ones thumping their agenda. Some anons even admitted to being fake fans of Hitler “trolling” people into reading and following that trash. Same BS with the Catholic posters, and now with a handful of Gounan posters. Always the same thing; join my cult, conform to this or that. You’ve no spine, no will of your own, and that’s what this NPC meme was all about. Lovers of bondage. Dumb humans aping ants because it’s easiest.

>The nation is all loving, bros! Submit!
That IS the status quo.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 11:52:24 2019 No.14128182

>>14127641
>Presumably the individual is a lazy Deconstructionist too afraid to blow their brains out or go on a mass shooting.

lol, dumb lazy people tryna think their way out of crisis, when they should just contribute to the inherent terrorist problems our society creates

not sure if you're being purposefully ironic, but if not then your inability to see how your arbitrarily enforced normativity creates unnecessary conflict that you probably just love to moan about is merely a sign of your own lack of ability to generate a hard on

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 11:58:22 2019 No.14128199

>>14123113
The only reason why nations exist is because having a universal government would be a disaster for society, so when people go on to tell you that the people across a river or a mountain are "different" I just can't understand it. We're all citizens of the world

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 12:01:26 2019 No.14128220
File: 1.58 MB, 360x270, C36D0B72-3909-4EA5-A70F-F409471297A1.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>14127689
Zionism is absolutely nationalism. Hahah. Your fucking unique flower nationalism is just the “white” variety. What a joke. 10/10 because you are serious.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 12:03:48 2019 No.14128229 >>14128220 >White Moronic America.. Meds aren't white.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 12:08:58 2019 No.14128250 >>14128229 >Meds I don’t know what anons color is, I guessed he was from predominantly white Dumbfuckerstan

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 12:43:33 2019 No.14128415 >>14123113 >name a more cucked ideology Green Anarchism, either faggots with no context for how hunter gather life actually was, or people who think we should live and die like animals, which inevitably would lead to our extinction.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 12:47:41 2019 No.14128434

>>14128415
I get the animosity, but we wouldn’t die from living harshly. We didn’t before, and this time we have various technology/general know-how to fall back on.
I doubt this is where humanity would or should go down. But you already see the conservative strains pine for it, don’t you? Some will live this way.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 12:49:45 2019 No.14128444 >>14127995 Have you tried not being a repulsive faggot that everybody hates? Convincing people to like you serves your self-interest in a more tangible way than whatever the hell you're doing to convince everybody you're so disgusting

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 12:56:30 2019 No.14128474

>>14128434
Firstly, the makeup of both the world and the species in it has changed dramatically to where the hunter gatherer lifestyle is no longer possible in most areas, secondly, I mean over a very long timescale we would inevitably be hit by a another extinction tier meteor or something. Hell there's like 4 within a 100 year time-span that have sub 1/1000 chances of hitting.
>Technology/general know-how.
When I say green anarchism, I mean full tier anti-civ people. Zerzan, Kackzinsky etc. Both advocate for literal burning down of everything possible, the mechanism for anything less than hunter gatherer lifestyle being eliminated, which is of course a self-defeating ideology, since you aren't going to be capable of removing the drive to recreate civ/agriculture infinitely like Kackzinsky seems to think. It didn't take much more than agriculture to develop Sumeria.

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:01:34 2019 No.14128499

>>14128474
I admit, either way is a possibility. I just think, if we are to survive past the hundred to eighty years crisis, people would incorporate both directions in various ways. Some absolutist an-prims but many more soft cheating variety, alongside the “transhumanist” sorts and their various levels.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:06:40 2019 No.14128520 >>14128499 >transhumanist an-prims Excuse me what the fuck

« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:10:26 2019 No.14128532
File: 551 KB, 600x800, AC25CD48-CA5E-49D2-936E-281DB81BFC1F.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>14128520
Rightwing anarchism vs leftwing anarchism. Once the cryptocurreny fags are neutralized, this is what we’ll have.
Or could have.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:12:48 2019 No.14128544 [DELETED]

>>14128532
>>14128520
>>14128499
>>14128474
>>14128444
>>14128434
>>14128415
>>14128250
>>14128229
>>14128220
>>14128199
>>14128182
>>14128179
>>14127995
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>>14127924
>>14127914
>>14127905
>>14127904
>>14127902
>>14127900
>>14127897
>>14127893
>>14127892
>>14127891
>>14127889
>>14127883
>>14127879
>>14127876
>>14127869
>>14127856
>>14127855
>>14127844
>>14127843
>>14127815
>>14127811
>>14127807
>>14127798
>>14127796
>>14127790
>>14127770
>>14127765
>>14127758
>>14127753
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>>14127709
>>14127707
>>14127691
>>14127689
>>14127687
>>14127677
>>14127670
>>14127657
>>14127646
>>14127641
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSlaaH4Kvd4

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:20:41 2019 No.14128596

>>14128520
>transhumanist anarchoprimitivism

like Avatar the movie, retard

we want to be both the man in the virtual reality isolation tank, and the magical fairy alien race living in harmony with nature, both at the same time

that’s still more realistic than actually enjoying living in a drab corporate ethnostate

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:24:28 2019 No.14128614 File: 44 KB, 397x600, CF8A0C91-41F6-490B-93C7-DC5BF4835667.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14128596 We would be made up of many individuals who will go in many directions, once set free.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:24:58 2019 No.14128619

>>14127114
>muh power
And look where being a strong imperialist leader leads. This planet has become a fucking trash heap. Anyone who invades other nations and builds up giant economies because he thinks power grants anything meaningful is a dumb fuck LARPer. When I see someone wave a flag of their nation I cringe because to me all it stands for is a specific historical ideology that is not worth the paper its stupid constitutions and code of law are written on.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:35:38 2019 No.14128690 >>14123113 A nation is it's people not it's borders. Everyone knows that especially the jews.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:38:43 2019 No.14128709

You’ve Got to Die for the Government - Anti-Flag

[Intro]
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit

[Verse 1]
There's a Gulf War vet, dying a slow, cold death
And the government says, "We don't know the source of his sickness"
But don't believe what they say, because your government is lying
They've done it before and don't you know they'll do it again

[Pre-Chorus 1]
A secret test, government built virus
"Subject Test Group: Gulf Battle Field Troops"

[Chorus]
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit

[Verse 2]
First World War veterans slaughtered, by General Eisenhower
You give 'em your life, they give ya a stab in the back
Radiation, agent orange, tested on US souls
Guinea pigs for Western corporations

[Pre-Chorus 2]
I never have, I never will
Pledge allegiance to their flag
You're getting used, you'll end up dead

[Chorus]
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit

[Bridge]
I don't need you to tell me what to do
And I don't need you to tell me what to be (fuck you!)
I don't need you to tell me what to say
And I don't need you to tell me what to think
What to think
What to think, what to think, what to think, think, think, think

[Outro]
Die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit

You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit
You've gotta die, gotta die, gotta die for your government
Die for your country, that's shit

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:39:53 2019 No.14128716 >>14128690 A people is a people. And they are made up of persons. A nation is a fictional device to make people into servants of an elite. Wake up dear boy.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:39:55 2019 No.14128719 >>14123125 >Nations aren’t imaginary. Yes they are.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:41:13 2019 No.14128725 >>14128716 kill yourself tripfag

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:46:11 2019 No.14128750

>>14128596
IDK about that. I feel that anti-corpratism is often just a reactionary stance rather than a well formed one. Yes you can point to specific things that are untastful about corporations, but unless you live in a chinese sweatshop, I doubt it has impacted you that greatly in a negative way.

I do think that corporations can be critiqued, but due to their non-specific nature with shareholders and no clear distinct indivigual personality, people have a rent free reason to hate some vague "bad guy". They are a body politic like any other, and most critiques are tangential and look at things from a face value.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:49:19 2019 No.14128762

>>14128716
Elite is a vague term. a nation or body politic of any kind is just that. a conglomeration of seperate indiviguals forming a singular one. If you want to critique it, critique its conglomerative nature of consciousness rather than "The Man" or "The elite" That is one part of the greater whole and conflates close correlating with direct causality.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:52:56 2019 No.14128777 File: 882 KB, 1920x2458, 5C04CF78-A49F-4E3E-8FD6-C53C19612BCB.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14128762 It’s fitting as they feel themselves the people’s better, you sap

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:54:52 2019 No.14128786 >>14128716 Jokes on you I believe in a return to pure tribalism and rejection of technology. I think the best thing that could happen is an epidemic of mass infertility. I would rather be hunting and fishing right now.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:55:19 2019 No.14128789 >>14128750 Sweatshop? Anyone working feels their sting. Anyone not working feels their sting. Anyone in prison feels their sting. The only ones not feeling the sting are the sociopaths themselves, though stung as the rest of us are

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 13:58:07 2019 No.14128800 File: 310 KB, 1658x1240, D01FECAA-9FE4-425E-B72A-EAA8EE27A72A.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14128786 Than why stick up for nation-states, my rightwing anarchist friend?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 13:59:27 2019 No.14128807 >>14128800 Believing in the good of your people and the unity of them is an atavistic principle. The accumulation of wealth is the problem not the treatment of your tribe as an extension of yourself.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 14:01:20 2019 No.14128816 >>14128807 Would you support a non-accumulative currency?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:02:23 2019 No.14128820 >>14128816 Barter system and nomadic. Agriculture was always a mistake.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:04:15 2019 No.14128833

>>14128777
Yes, and I would too if i was born affluent and well educated. its a form of causality, and I dont feel petty enough to revolt for revolts sake. If there are specific issues that I believe should be changed I learn its context and try to adress it, not mindlessly tear. Its the same semi-real boogyman as the man, or the white, etc. Yes those are correlative development that proceeded through history and the interplay of the society and the individual. Likewise, the elite is not a singularity, it is a spectrum. Latching onto the color read does not allow you to apreciate the whole palate and deludes you into seeing the whole thing as solely red.

>>14128789
And I think this is from a specific idealist lense. again. It is easy to see the red.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:10:57 2019 No.14128866

>>14128833
>>14128816
AS an adition. I do not disagree with your convictions, I personaly believe in relitivity and that the zeitgeist inexorably influences our veiws. Left Anarchism could very well be a solution, but I think it is important to not see things as be alls and end alls.

For example:>>14128820 could be true from a specific angle of naturalism, but if we want to go for a purely utilitarian view, than i think one could disagree. Tribal life was emencly violent and there was a high overall death toll due to the small levels of tribal groups, so inter-tribe violence was proportionaly very distructive (surface area increases as the square of its radius), so larger conglomerates tend to loose less of their proportional population over time.

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Thu Nov 7 14:17:30 2019 No.14128897 >>14128820 It could lead to it. Or a shared economy too. >>14128866 Good posts, thank you.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:17:30 2019 No.14128898

>>14128866
The death rate was high but the happiness of individuals, mental health, community, and gaia herself were all better off. There is a reason whites ran off with the Native Americans and didn't want to come back. There is something primally good about living in a natural state of tribalism. And pain and death and grief are shared among the entire group. People are closer together and not isolated which is good for the psyche which is why people actually feel better in war torn countries than when peace comes.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:31:57 2019 No.14128971

>>14128898
And I agree with most of this. All I am saying is that it simply depends on what values people find most central. If one believes that contentment is the operative moral agent, then yes. But again eliminating a particularly irratating population or identity group could be going towards that same goal too.

And Personaly, I am glade that most w. European nations cracked down on minority languages in the 1800's, because now we have one less problem that people will bring up and be upset about since it is morally not very rellivent anyone. In this way you can see morality as a function of distance, (ends justify the means).

However, on the other hand, some people believe that virtue is more important than eventual contentment. That it is the struggle to do what we believe is right atm rather than what will eventually be productive to happiness.

But again, this is an argument of morality. Is there an imparitive factor. Is there a balance between factors? is it freedom? Security? contentment? etc.

>>14128897
And thank you.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:39:05 2019 No.14128996

>>14128971
Tribalism and return to nature just stir the limbic and feel correct internally and mythologically. We have no quality of life in comparison to tribal peoples so what is the death toll or measurement for? Is not dying together as a community better than alone in a bed ridden with diabetes and alzheimers?

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:51:05 2019 No.14129054

>>14128866
>Tribal life was immensely violent and there was a high overall death toll due to the small levels of tribal groups, so inter-tribe violence was proportionaly very distructive (surface area increases as the square of its radius), so larger conglomerates tend to loose less of their proportional population over time.

>>14128898
>death rate was high but the happiness of individuals, mental health, community, and gaia herself were all better off.

this is definitely the key area worth thinking about when it comes to the utilitarian worldview, reduce suffering increase happiness. what we end up with is a bunch of lonely geriatrics on life support who have gone senile from lack of human interaction and life purpose. the right not to die isn’t necessarily the right to live while alive

you see the same shit with tribes and native populations today, they take the sweet ass offer of healthcare and end up fucking miserable and directionless, which many in free world can relate to

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 14:55:41 2019 No.14129073

>>14128996
I think you are talking rather specificly, though I understand the jist of what you say. IMO, and I admit this is opinion here, I believe that form follows function and visa versa. As such natural and unnatual are flexible terms. We adapt to sercumstance and civilization just as a species adapts to a new biome. The problem, I admit, is the rate of adaption. Our civ. development exponentialy outpaces our biological and social adaptation. Tribalism, for me, seems like an arbitrary "biome" of such.

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 15:26:35 2019 No.14129199

>>14128996
>Feel correct internally and mythologically.
I see nothing of the sort either anecdotally or in anything regarding statistics.
And the whole "Hunter Gatherers had were free, happy, and had only worked 2 hours" is a massive meme.
http://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/ted-kaczynski-the-truth-about-primitive-life-a-critique-of-anarchoprimitivism

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 15:38:10 2019 No.14129239

Natural selection is a process of gene selection, not self selection. This precipitates a form of altruism that is qualified by the relatedness of it's recipient(s) as the most naturally vigorous way of living. Such selection is imperfect and random, so despite trending towards this ideal we can't properly reach it. Especially when we live in conditions so separate from our prehistoric crucible.
The relationship between Nationalism and man should always be tempered by this principle. Too much and you excessively brutalize your fellow man and self, too little and you risk your extended families death. I struggle to specifically identify this proper medium but I know it exists. Any Anarchist or Nazi that lives in the extremes is certainty wrong. I say this not because they "feel' wrong, but because though this eternal process but must abide by to preserve our genes, I KNOW they are wrong.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 15:42:31 2019 No.14129253 >>14129199 keep on looking for those statistics on prehistoric peoples anon, you might find them eventually >>14129239 i value my genes too, but sometimes i just wanna wear something more comfy, you know?

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 16:34:01 2019 No.14129523 >>14129253 Yeah most genes dont fit right I find, but a well fitting pair can be pretty mmm spants

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 18:30:29 2019 No.14130195 >>14129239 well said

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 18:32:29 2019 No.14130207 >>14123125 you aren't supposed to announce sage you goddamn faggot

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 18:34:08 2019 No.14130221
File: 188 KB, 797x1000, 1570176246916.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

It's not about any lines, it's about what you feel, it's about the place where you fucking idiot was born. Do you think that people are fighting for every inch of the map and this one outside can be taken over? Think a little fucking before you write something, you idiot.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 19:03:11 2019 No.14130370 >>14130221 That sign is so crisp and clean, wow

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 20:49:26 2019 No.14130851 >>14130221 Toxic

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 20:53:23 2019 No.14130876 >>14130851 Define toxic

Anonymous Thu Nov 7 20:59:35 2019 No.14130914
File: 69 KB, 636x637, Consider the Following.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

It's impossible to refute nationalism because any attempt to refute nationalism is really just a veiled attempt to refute a particular nation's nationalism in order to forward the interests of another nation. Marxists will bash the amorphous "nationalism" all day long when in reality what they are doing is bashing the nationalism of Europeans and their colonies while holding "anticolonialism" (aka the nationalism of those nations that were once subjugated by Europeans) up as righteous. Social democratic Jews in America will attack American white nationalism all day long yet they'll never make any similar attack on Zionism. Everyone is a nationalist because humans are social animals and we all belong to some tribe even if we're not willing to admit it in the sunlight.

>>	Anonymous Thu Nov 7 23:11:20 2019 No.14131540 >>14129199 Go hunting, eat what you kill, and get back to me.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 00:10:22 2019 No.14131739 >>14128619 >muh coexist and look at what you cuck world fantasy leads to

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 00:24:02 2019 No.14131763 >leftoids whose ideology, especially this decade, revolves around identity and consent don't understand why borders and nations are important if you going to deconstruct something at least do it logically and without refuting yourself nigger

>>	« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » !mxvabIoSIE Fri Nov 8 00:27:15 2019 No.14131768 File: 12 KB, 360x240, 9CD30E6F-968A-48F5-90B5-595F6B3C76CA.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14131763 >yourself If you’re going to approach this topic, you’re going to have to understand who you’re talking to and about.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 01:03:21 2019 No.14131860

>>14130914
Mostly true, but the phenomenon you describe isn’t exactly restricted to struggle between coherent ethnic groups. Don’t forget that excluded and casteless people exist in every nation; I’d wager that Lennonite Imagine-ism is also self-refuting but not in so evident a way. Your veiled conflict theory, in this circumstance, pits an international coalition of gray consumers (not an ethnos) against nationalists of all nations (not an ethnos). But the dynamic remains essentially the same, one group conflates it’s own interest with “universal principles”; principles that are suspiciously antagonistic to their immanent political enemies

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 07:46:50 2019 No.14132825 >>14131540 Gladly https://youtu.be/AxM9FYSs8V4

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 08:03:10 2019 No.14132871

>>14130914
it’s pretty easy to refute nationalism. You are clearly under the impression that a bunch of generically similar people need a political border of some sort to remain ‘clean’, linguistically, ethnically, politically. And you probably think this idea is inherent in our DNA and has always been the case since the test of time.

All of these ideas are categorically sjd demostrably false. You can have borders without an ethnic state: Feudalism. You can have an ethnic group without a border: Kurds. You’re political ideal isn’t genetic: Why would we even need this conversation if it was?

I’m not a marxist, but even marxism needs a border. this whole conversation has turned ill because of the American Democratic party

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 11:15:50 2019 No.14133476 >>14126436 cope harder

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 11:17:39 2019 No.14133486 >>14126800 yeahhhhhhh you're actually retarded lmao

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 12:49:52 2019 No.14133849 >>14132871 >You are clearly under the impression that a bunch of generically similar people need a political border of some sort to remain ‘clean’ Where did he say that you strawmanning cunt

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:04:43 2019 No.14133901 >>14133849 >linguistically, ethnically, politically. isn’t that the textbook definition of a nation state you absolute you ad hominem homo?

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:20:20 2019 No.14133966

>>14123665
Develop a skill that you enjoy.
You don't need some life or death situation to find meaning.
It could be any sport, craft, or even a video game. It can be people, art, or food. Something you can focus on and improve every day is all you need to stop feeling so disillusioned with society, because society will stop mattering. The key is letting go of the idea that what you care about needs to be important, because importance is relative and time will wash away anything you ever do. Have you ever met a skateboarder? By common metrics skateboarding is completely useless and even pointless, but skateboarders do it every day and regularly say how they would rather die than not be able to skateboard. This is what you say you want.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:46:24 2019 No.14134074 >>14132871 Nothing you've said addresses what I actually said. You ignored what I said and said "what you clearly meant was X and that's wrong because of Y". What the fuck was the point of even replying to me?

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:51:42 2019 No.14134088 >>14130914 >Social democratic Jews in America will attack American white nationalism all day long yet they'll never make any similar attack on Zionism Evidence says otherwise. Even the one who runs for american president attacks isreal.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:53:21 2019 No.14134093
File: 194 KB, 880x440, 1554815749795.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>14123113
Nationalism is good but the more local the better. Tribalism etc.

>>14123465
The sad part is that many retards do agree with your satirical description of the family, mainly due to having been brought up in dysfunctional families but completely oblivious towards the societal machinations that caused that. No, it's hurr durr family must be bad.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:55:51 2019 No.14134102 >>14134093 >but the more local the better Point of nationalism is that it´s not local, nationalism is contradictory to regional identities.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 13:58:53 2019 No.14134117

>>14134102
It's the most local we can get in the modern world with modern technology, if nations are also federalist. And it's good as a bulwark against globalism.
To be fair we are simply not made to live in such big and complex systems, and this is allowed and forced only because of our level of technological development.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:01:04 2019 No.14134125 >>14133901 The important part was GENETICALLY SIMILAR and 'CLEAN' retard where did the other guy say that, nothing about his post even implied approval for nationalism per se, just explaining why it still exists

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:03:23 2019 No.14134134

>>14134074
well first off you said Nationalism can’t be refuted, which i refuted

then you said a bunch of stuff that i disagree with so hard i didn’t feel it was even worth refuting.

some random stuff about marxists hating white nations or some other incoherent nonsense.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:04:34 2019 No.14134139 >>14134117 >if nations are also federalist Why should they? Nationalists seek to create unitary culture, ruled by one nation state, living on the land "it deserves". There´s no reason to federalize.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:07:04 2019 No.14134150 >>14134125 press F to pay respects

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:09:42 2019 No.14134167

>>14134139
I'm just speaking of what I think is best, but in any case I don't think a national consciousness or identity has to preclude a more regional one, but rather contain it. It's different levels of abstraction; in the same way you can have an European identity without giving away your national one.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:10:45 2019 No.14134176 >>14134150 >i disagree with so hard i didn’t feel it was even worth refuting Yeah you're tough faggot lmao goodbye

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:21:14 2019 No.14134230 File: 66 KB, 900x900, kot.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>14134167 >in the same way you can have an European identity without giving away your national one What the fuck is that even supposed to mean?

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:24:55 2019 No.14134251 >>14134230 >What is pan-regionalism For an analogy, it's the same relationship with being both of Nordic ethnicity and of the white race. They are not mutually exclusive, quite the contrary.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:27:03 2019 No.14134261 >>14134251 >Nordic ethnicity and of the white race You are an American, aren´t you?

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:29:17 2019 No.14134271 >>14134261 No, I'm not a Burgerstani. Did your European sensibilities get attacked by the mention of race in relationship to nationhood?

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:34:57 2019 No.14134302

>>14134271
>""""""european identity"""""" can exist along the national one
>Nordic ethnicity
>white race
You aren´t fooling anyone, colonial. To be honest with you, you don´t understand what nationhood means. Go learn about 19th century unification of Italy, Germany, internal conflicts in Austrian empire or development of centralized French republic so you could get at least a basic clue.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:38:14 2019 No.14134329 >>14134230 imagine being so openminded and versatile you are able to use both 4chan snd reddit, instead if picking one and hating the other

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:39:59 2019 No.14134343 >>14134329 More like "imagine being so versatile you can have two personalities, without one knowing about the other".

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:47:44 2019 No.14134376

>>14134302
I don't know why people have such trouble with the concept of there being different levels of abstraction. "Me against my brother, me and my brother against my cousin, me my brother and my cousin against the world"

>unification
Of course regional differences have to be sublimated somewhat in the creation of a nation state, especially in the process of creation itself. But not entirely at all.

>internal conflicts in Austrian empire
A multiethnic, multicultural empire as an example? Come on.

And I still don't get European aversion to talking about ethnicity. Maybe you live in one of the countries that haven't been as affected by mass migration like say the UK, but you can't ignore the topic either.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:50:21 2019 No.14134387 >>14134343 if that is your go-to response, for such a simple analogy, you’ve got a proper brain malfunction desu can you eat both a mcdonalds and a burger king without having a split personality disorder you fucking fag?

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:51:00 2019 No.14134393

>>14134093
>The sad part is that many retards do agree with your satirical description of the family, mainly due to having been brought up in dysfunctional families but completely oblivious towards the societal machinations that caused that. No, it's hurr durr family must be bad.
oh yeah? And what societal machinations were that? Maybe something to do with nationalism.

I tell you all this. Man's spirit is dead. The family is dead, there is no society but a collection of individuals, there are no nations. Nations are products, marketing tools. What once were myths that once filled mens hearts have been debased. We must go PAST them not BACK to them.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:52:55 2019 No.14134402 >>14134393 I agree but the root here is industrial technology rather than nationalism

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:54:37 2019 No.14134406 >>14134376 And before you ask, no I'm not a "white nationalist" and think it's the same if France is populated by Frenchmen or by Germans. That's completely retarded.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 14:57:41 2019 No.14134416

>>14134376
>in the creation of a nation state
You are creating nation first, state second. Nationalists aimed to erase the regional differences. e.g. Parisians enforcing their dialect on the rest of France, homogenizing French language

>A multiethnic, multicultural empire as an example?
What? Nationalism within the empire was critical issue for the Habsburgs to manage, it was the issue which tore it apart and had it´s succesors tear each other apart.

>And I still don't get European aversion to talking about ethnicity.
What aversion? If anything we are obsessed about it. I mean we are talking about it, or at least I hope that you understand that nation and ethnos are synonyms.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:00:17 2019 No.14134426 >>14134387 Tribal loyalty isn´t fucking mcdonalds, you deracinated creature. You can support only one side, or do you thing you can fight one day for your paternal tribe and the second day for the one where you immigrated to?

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:07:34 2019 No.14134469

>>14134416
>Nationalists aimed to erase the regional differences
Yes, and I know why what I mean seems contradictory. Ultimately, if you make me choose between regionalism and nationalism, I choose the former. Balkanize.
But I favor nationalism insofar it's an effective counter to globalism, and that's our main threat today. I don't think being further divided, for now, is fruitful for any one people.
Also, let's say you balkanize, and Spain is divided into the Basque country, Catalonia, etc. We could reasonably claim those are now nation states where nationalism is reasonable, couldn't we?

>Nationalism within the empire was critical issue for the Habsburgs to manage
I know, I mean that, effectively, they had two nations in there, the Hungarian and the Austrian peoples, and so the differences were too big to bridge.
If we're talking about the differences between Italian regions, they're gonna be much more specific and easy to manage, without the need for homogeneization. Maybe it wasn't so during unification but it is now and that's what matters for the future.

>I mean we are talking about it, or at least I hope that you understand that nation and ethnos are synonyms.
Sorry, my bad. I meant race as a larger set that also contains ethnicity.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:09:08 2019 No.14134473 >>14134469 I feel it ultimately it keeps coming back to the problem of technology and how it ultimately seeks to standardize and unify, a cult of efficiency

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:29:24 2019 No.14134571

>>14134469
>I know, I mean that, effectively, they had two nations in there, the Hungarian and the Austrian peoples
Anon.........I take this as a trolling attempt.

>Ultimately, if you make me choose between regionalism and nationalism, I choose the former. Balkanize.
Actual balkanization was manifestation of nationalism.

>We could reasonably claim those are now nation states where nationalism is reasonable, couldn't we?
It´s possible, altough I don´t know much about Spain. Some separatism can be branded as nationalism, some can´t.

>But I favor nationalism insofar it's an effective counter to globalism, and that's our main threat today.
Why not eurofederalism, if you don´t like divison?

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:30:42 2019 No.14134580

>>14134426
nah bro, plenty of people do exactly that. why do you think america got involved in european side of WW2 if not to just help a friend out? how many indians etc fought for the british in the same war?

do you act differently in a strip club to in a library? do you act differently on a bus than in a bar? if you can, then you can imagine being perfectly comfortable existing in two different cultures without having a complete fucking panic attack

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:38:32 2019 No.14134638

>>14134580
>nah bro, plenty of people do exactly that. why do you think america got involved in european side of WW2
Great example. You just forgot the specific group relevant to the issue: German GIs. They had to choose if they return to Reich and fight for their Volk or if they become Americans.

>how many indians etc fought for the british in the same war?
I somehow doubt the indians considered themselves English while doing so.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:41:49 2019 No.14134659

>>14134571
>Anon.........I take this as a trolling attempt.
I know it wasn't just that, but for this argument's sake it can be simplified into the fact that it had multiple different peoples, with strong and irreconciliable identities

>Actual balkanization was manifestation of nationalism.
>Some separatism can be branded as nationalism, some can´t.
Yeah you're right. The examples in Spain I mentioned are part of that, IIRC Franco tried but could not suffocate the Catalonian identity, for instance forcing them to learn Spanish in schools.

>Why not eurofederalism, if you don´t like divison?
You mean something like the EU, but actually in favor of European cultures? Sure why not, maybe that would work. In any case people would have to find their identity again, or construct it anew, in opposition to just being an uprooted cosmopolitan "citizen of the world"

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:42:22 2019 No.14134664 >>14134638 fantastic. i’m glad that you agree

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 15:48:10 2019 No.14134700

>>14134659
>it had multiple different peoples
Then why have you said it had only two nations? Dude..you are confusing.

>You mean something like the EU, but actually in favor of European cultures?
I guess, but eurofederalism is in direct contradiction with self-determination of European nations, so you can´t pick it along nationalism.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:06:25 2019 No.14134820

>>14134700
Even with only two major nations that are incompatible with each other it can happen. But yeah I kinda glossed over the other peoples in that region, plus the Balkans are always a clusterfuck.

>eurofederalism is in direct contradiction with self-determination of European nations, so you can´t pick it along nationalism
Is something like a modern (rather descentraliced, federalistic) Holy Roman Empire too idealistic?

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:21:25 2019 No.14134915

>>14134134
You didn't refute anything except some strawman you created, nothing you said was in my post you stupid nigger. Every state is not a nation-state and every nation does not have a state.

>>14134088
Stop listening to rhetoric and look at actions. None of these people take strong-armed anti-Israel positions as a matter of actual policy. The most anti-Israel you get from actual Jews is J-street, which is explicitly pro-Israel.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:23:41 2019 No.14134931 >>14123113 Read.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:24:59 2019 No.14134939 File: 640 KB, 1161x1800, download4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:34:20 2019 No.14134986

>>14134402
and what is your goal? To forget technology? I say, we should forget nationalism. Nationalism means competition. Nations are always in competition, to simply affirm themselves as different they must compete. Alliances are merely just taking sides in a greater political / economic / militaristic / ideological global war. As soon as a nation has sufficient power over another, it annihilates it, or at least subjugates it. Nations that are subjugated in power relationships are always trying to become more powerful so that they may get a better deal in their subjugation, or invert this subjugation. Look at China vs. USA. Once, China was just a fucking factory for the US, a source of cheap labour. This is slowly reversing itself, China is pushing back in the west pacific ocean, and using their economic power to get to do what they want to do, for themselves, rather than what the Americans want. The same power struggle is true worldwide.

Now, what is power? It is simple thermodynamics, it is work per unit time, and it takes the form of yearly GDP. Generating value comes from doing work, whether its a machine or a man that does it. For a motor, it's watts, units of Joules/Second, for a nation, its yearly GDP, units of Dollars/Year.

This is why nationalism and industrialization cannot be untied. As a nation exists, it wants to affirm its own will, it wants to do what it wants. To do that, it needs to have power. To have power it needs to increase GDP at all costs. And where does lead us? It turns the entire planet into a trash heap, full of traffic jams, marvel movies, and dying species, including the now infertile human one.

This is why nationalism must be forgotten by all men.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:45:27 2019 No.14135048

>>14134986
I agree. In fact, you should start a group of likeminded people and begin the fight against the world-system. You'll need a base of operations though. From there you can spread out, take territory through force or persuasion. And you'll need to defend yourself from those who militarily oppose you. Some kind of governing strucuture to take care of the day=to-day perhaps. Anyway, good luck.

Anonymous Fri Nov 8 16:48:31 2019 No.14135071

>>14134820
>Even with only two major nations that are incompatible with each other it can happen.
Magyars were the most compatible nation of the bunch. It´s not saying much, but they certainly were more compatible than the Slavic nations.

>Is something like a modern (rather descentraliced, federalistic) Holy Roman Empire too idealistic?
Totally out of question. Besides SIR lasted for many centuries, being either a clusteruck of principalities, free states and bishoprics at one time and Habsburg apendix other time.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 17:01:06 2019 No.14135148 >>14123623 mad at your jail cell. bummer stop living in bad faith.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 17:05:33 2019 No.14135166 >>14135048 Having an industrialized nation is fucking suicide!!! Why would anyone do it voluntarily when they know that!!!

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 17:13:58 2019 No.14135215 >>14135166 cool bro I will hit the everyone co-operates to create surplus for a peaceful transition to syndicates button right now I'm Immanentizing the eschatron as we speak.

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 17:23:26 2019 No.14135267 >>14135215 fool, no one would ever cooperate. Things are the way they are because that is the only way they can be and they must always be like this, nations are forever! Gloria Britannia!

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 19:05:46 2019 No.14135780 >>14135267 >Gloria Britannia Ashamed of your real home eh lmao

>>	Anonymous Fri Nov 8 19:10:57 2019 No.14135805 >>14134939 Terrible book

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/lit/ - Literature