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/lit/ - Literature

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1401667 No.1401667 [Reply] [Original]

Fantasy novels with genuinely interesting forms of magic, e.g. music as magic (as seen in the Soprano Sorceress novels), wine as magic (as seen in the Vineart novels) etc, etc.

GIMME.

>> No.1401688

>>1401667

got nothing but wanted to say i like hopper as well!

>> No.1401703
File: 44 KB, 333x500, strangeandnorell.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1401703

I liked this book's depiction of magic as difficult, scholarly work, and wizards as nerds. You've probably already read it though.

>> No.1401737

>>1401703
You know, that's one I actually haven't read. I've been aware of it for years but I've sort of avoided it because I don't enjoy the period it evokes and according to all reviews I've read that's something it does very well.

I'll try to get over myself and give it a go. Thanks.

>> No.1401742

>music as magic (as seen in the Soprano Sorceress novels)

I am intrigued

>> No.1401755
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1401755

Sarah Monette, Melusine

Sex as conductor. Basically mage A uses mage B sexually to perform a spell he had no ability to perform otherwise.

>> No.1401757

>>1401742
It's some good shit. If I were you I'd give it a try (while avoiding descriptions of it because it might sound hokey and put you off). It's very well written and has some fantastic real politicking later on in the series (5 books altogether, finished).

>> No.1401776
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1401776

>>1401742
L.E.Modesitt wrote them. Rather good, but the author has an annoying habit of publishing prequels and sequels that don't actually add anything to the story. Soprano Sorceress (about opera singer who is transported into a world where perfectly executed classical songs with instructions actually happen (but even one false note can kill the spellcaster)) is rather good if you stop where the writer originally stopped (trilogy). He then stopped writing for several years, and continued with stories about the opera singer's apprentice.

The same author also did Recluse-series, about a world where a mage can either channel the forces of Chaos (fireballs etc.) or Order (differs from personality, but mostly making objects indestructible or weather manipulation), but both strain the mage's mental and physical wellbeing - chaos users look withered by the time they're 50 and might go insane as well, while Order-users become inflexible and unable to grasp new things. The books are mostly independent chapters in the world's history, how the main character (who is either Order or Chaos-user) has to find his place in the world while the nations of the world, led or "assisted" by either Chaos or Order-wizards try to gain influence, under the belief that their ideology is better than the another. Quite entertaining, and the author even wrote two books where the story is set in the same time period, while the main characters are in the opposing camps trying to get ahead.

Brandon Sanderson's The Mistborn-trilogy (certain people can do superhuman feats if they drink potions that are based on metals) and the stand-alone Elantris (there were demigods, who were immortal and haxor-magical powers, but 30 years ago something happened, and now they are just immortal.. but can't heal, and are slowly driven insane by the pain of thousands of papercuts) are also good reads and well worth your time.

>> No.1401782
File: 394 KB, 1100x1394, 03Corot_ViewNearNaples_1841_100.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1401782

There was a book about painters who could manipulate reality with their paintings.. it was written by a trio of women.. oh yes, Golden Key.

Very good.

>> No.1401797

>>1401776
HELLO LELAND.

>> No.1401803
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1401803

>>1401797
What are you talking about?

>> No.1401805

The Mistborn trilogy has a unique magic system. Magical power is gained by the gifted through the consumption and "burning" of certain metals.

>> No.1401821

>>1401803
nm it's a dumb joke. nice pics though.

>> No.1402543

OPBUMP. I'm sure you have some interesting ideas.

>> No.1402881

>>1401782
Will check this out. Overlooked this post for some strange reason.

>> No.1404382

BUMP.

>> No.1404556
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1404556

The "Alvin Maker" series by Orson Scott Card has one of the most original takes on magic I've ever read in a fantasy series.

>> No.1404569

>>1404556

how does it work?

>> No.1404576

If you read Mistborn, just read the first book and forget that there are two more. The second isn't so bad, but the third is horrendous and one of the characters literally becomes God and fixes everything at the end.

Brandon Sanderson cannot write a decent ending to save his life.

>> No.1404579

Xanth: everyone has a unique and unduplicated ability. Most are pretty useless or one-dimensional; Magicians are the ones with the most generally useful abilities. (YA)

Dexter: The first evil in the universe, an entity older than time, sends its spawn into broken and disturbed individuals, compelling them to murder. Dexter uses his bit of that evil to detect other murderers - and he is driven by it to kill them.

Spellsinger: 70s furry take on music as magic; guitarist from the real world is summoned into fantasyland and produces effects according to his level of emotion and the lyrics of whatever he sings. (YA)

>> No.1404588
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1404588

The Wheel of Time. Intricate and detailed, consistent and abiding by a complex and logical set of rules. It becomes such a living part of the world that you forget it's magic.

It's the best magic system ever devised by anyone, including Jack Vance.

Jordan had a degree in physics, and it showed.

>> No.1404606

>>1404576
>Brandon Sanderson cannot write a decent ending to save his life.

That doesn't bode well for the Wheel of Time.

>> No.1404608

>>1404588
The magic system in the WoT series had nothing to do with physics. What are you talking about?

>> No.1404609

>>1404608
>implying you don't have the ability to infer

CAN'T FOOL ME, TROLLOC.

>> No.1404610

>>1404576
That's pretty much the end of the Sword of Truth series.

>> No.1404614

>>1404576
Aww, fucking spoiler, I was planning to read that trilogy, well, at least now I won't waste that much time on it.

Recently, I was also looking for stuff like the OP's, but more on the lines of magic that is thoroughly described, made believable, making sense, one could say "if magic existed it would work this way", with the intricacies of how it works explained, its methodology and bound by logical rules listed.

For example:
I've been reading The Painted Man by Peter Brett recently, and the local magic is in the wards people inscribe on different surfaces. But its never exactly told of what shape or image any of them takes exactly. Herp derp, "learn geometry" this, "make a circle of wards" that.
People fill freaking grimoires full of them, with not a single shape described in the novel to the end.
And it works "because Creator".

So, does anyone have advice on what to read along the lines of what I'm looking for?

>> No.1404624
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1404624

>>1404609

I lold so hard.

>> No.1404634
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1404634

>>1404588
I was afraid WoT would turn out to be as boring for me as Martin's ASoIaF series were(couldn't handle more than a few chapters of the first book), so I've never read it, maybe I should.

Martin's fans dont hate on me.

>> No.1404656

>>1404634
I'm coming for you bro. Watch your back.

>> No.1404725

>>1404588
>>1404588

This. Although not sure what you're getting at with the physics thing. It is by far the most well fleshed-out system of magic ever.

>> No.1404737

>>1404725
It's funny LOTR, one of the seminal pieces of fantasy has the least fleshed out magic system.

>LOL I'M GANDALF THE GREY/WHITE, I FUCK SHIT UP.

>> No.1404821

>>1404614
Still need something to read!

>> No.1404849

WoT's a fucking trainwreck.
But the dude sure can describe dresses.

>> No.1404860

This poster crossed his arms under his balls and tugged his dick irritatedly.

>> No.1404864

>>1404849
Man, I loved the dresses in WoT! Especially when the girls are in Tel'aran'rhiod and they can change their clothes to whatever they want, the descriptions of what they (and especially Nynaeve) wore were awesome!

>> No.1404870

>>1404864
The trick is to learn to see the copypasta coming and skip to the next piece of dialogue. It's not like you're going to miss any subtle nuances or anything.
If I can get a future version of Calibre to do this automatically I'll be posting a link for the WoT trilogy.

>> No.1405489

>>1404860
TUG HARD. COS YOU'RE ANNOYED AND WANT TO BOX PERRIN/MAT/RAND ROUND THE EARS LIKE YOU USED TO. AND THEN CUM ON THEIR FACES. LIKE YOU USED TO.

>> No.1405510

The WoT criticism is way out of hand. I mean, you people are taking decades-old, lovingly-rendered fan joshing and magnifying it into some huge flaw. It's just a meme, really. Jordan's prose is actually really decent and his meanderings and self-indulgences are nowhere near the offensive level of, say, King in his Dark Tower series or Le Guin in Earthsea.

Anyway, for OP I'd suggest Zelazny's Amber. The main form of magic involves manipulating probability and shifting between parallel worlds which exist on a spectrum between Amber (the world of pure order; the "truest" reality) and the Courts of Chaos. Definitely worth a read if you're looking for an interesting magic system (or just a good series).

>> No.1405556

>>1405510
We're just continuing the tradition of "fun joshing". It's easy enough to skim those dreadful passages but that doesn't mean that we shouldn't mock them for what they are.

>> No.1405605

>>1405556
Some of the posts are. Others, like yours (encouraging readers to skim over or remove parts of the text) have taken an in-joke to the point of absurdity.

Also, if you do just skip any part that makes your Moghedien senses tingle, how can you even judge or call yourself a "fan" who's just participating in harmless nitpicking? You haven't had the full first-hand experience - you're just taking the bandwagon faux-opinion seriously, when in actuality it really isn't that bad at all.

The nothing-happening 1,000 pages of Crossroads of Twilight, now that's legitimately dreadful.

>> No.1405615

>>1405510
>>1405556
>>1405605

samefag

>> No.1405630
File: 92 KB, 500x375, 3091847734_378195b49c.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1405630

i like niven's eco allegory in the magic goes away

>> No.1405641

The Mathematics of Logic--L. Sprague De Camp

magic as manipulation of symbolic logic

>> No.1405642

>>1405605
It's quite easy, and doesn't affect the book at all - unless you're reading something into the embroidery?

>> No.1405644
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1405644

>>1405641
Laundry series, anyone?

>> No.1405646

>>1405642
'sup, Reader's Digest?

>> No.1405649

>>1405646
Well done, you've mastered the art of saying something condescending and utterly meaningless.

>> No.1405653

>>1405649
Nigger'll have a trip soon.

>> No.1405662

>>1405649
O humorless prick, it was a reference to their longstanding tradition of abridgement, which you seem to wholeheartedly support.

Anyway, cut out all of the text you find unnecessary to your heart's delight. I think that's the method Sanderson has used to create his write-by-numbers WoT sequels, and many here seemed to enjoy those. Whatever works for you.

>> No.1405672

>embroidery
>>1405662 thinks I was referring to superfluous prose, rather than mind-numbing descriptions of actual embroidery.

Either/or. Holy fuck, RJ liked to pad the fuck out of his books.

>> No.1405689

Clive Baker - Weaveworld.

>> No.1405723

>>1401667

James Clemens - Godslayer Chronicles

>> No.1406265

bump

>> No.1408304

>>1406265

>> No.1408314

Jonathan Strange & Mr. Norrell by Susanna Clarke

>> No.1408351

The codex alera- jim butcher

>> No.1408363

>>1408351

good choice EXCEPT FOR THE SHIT WRITING.

>> No.1408407

>>1408363
Sir, you obviously need help. Get some.

>> No.1408420
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1408420

>>1408407
I agree

ps valium and whisky and mj is fucking rad

>> No.1409462

just remembered these OP
Perfume, Patrick Suskind
Jitterbug Perfume, Tom Robbins

Maybe unconventional choices, but well-written period fantasies nonetheless. Actually the latter is kind of uncategorizable. Working through it right now. Definitely a trip worth tgaking.

>> No.1409474

>Fantasy

>Magic systems

bwahahahaha

Silly children. Grow the fuck up.

>> No.1409483

>>1409474
look everyone. baby's first troll. they grow up so fast these days.

>> No.1409491
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1409491

>>1409483

>Implying that's a troll.

>Implying fantasy isn't childish escapist shit.

pic related to people itt

>> No.1409517

>>1409491
keep on bubbing bub

>> No.1411306

newyearbump

>> No.1411320

>>1409491
why the fuck would I read fiction about something that could have happened when I can read about things that actually did happened?
it's not proper fiction unless it has at least one wizard

inb4 hurrr durrr trying to get an idea across, has something to say duurrrrrr

>> No.1411360
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1411360

>>1409491
I've studied history and computers. It's painful to read pretty much any "serious" book without getting thrown out by the ignorance of the writer and his lack of motivation when it comes to research (Mona Lisa is painted on wood, not on canvas; you can't actually hack into Pentagon just because your cell phone cost over 300 dollars at the store and you're really good at using it etc).

At least with Science Fiction and Fantasy, when the writer comes up with their own stuff instead of sourcing, it's a GOOD thing, not something that makes me regret that I actually paid money for this shit.

>> No.1411361
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1411361

>>1404556
Noticed that nobody bothered to explain what the story was about. Basically, it's set in an alternative North America in the early 1800's. The Indians still roamed free in the forests, but the White nations - British from Canada, United States from East and the slave-driven country led by exiled George III from the South (also few other small states that didn't join the Union).

The magic system is that some whites have a magic power, "a knack". It might be about detecting truth, or making the best bread ever. It might also be the ability to fit anything together so that it stays together forever, be it two pieces of wood, or making friendships etc. Alvin the Maker is the seventh son of seventh son. This makes his power as the ability to do pretty much anything. However, unlike some of the lesser powers, Alvin doesn't have inherent understanding of how his power works, and the books are about his trying to learn and build his vision of "Crystal City", where all the citizens are Makers and radiating enlightenment to the world around. However, there's a counterforce, The Unmaker, a bodiless force that just wants to destroy generally everything, but especially Alvin.


cont..

>> No.1411366
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1411366

>>1411361
cont..


Not just Whites have magic. The Indians also have powers that allow them to travel hundreds of miles in the forest in a matter of hours, The Blacks can do something akin to Voodoo and there's also the possibility of learning a few spells in the good old European tradition.

The books are rather good, and mix history and fantasy in a way that's not frustrating. My biggest problem with the books is that basically Card is writing the "Alvin is the Second Coming of Jesus, as Told In The Book Of Mormons and in a Fantasy Setting", but if you can get past that, it's all good. Sometimes I've wondered if Card realizes he's writing Fantasy and not just alternative history (eg. does he really think that some people have knacks), but that's all besides the point.

It's a very good series, and has won several prestigious awards. You should read it.

>> No.1412810

>>1411366
Powers are determined by race?

That sounds like retarded shit.