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/lit/ - Literature

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13983098 No.13983098 [Reply] [Original]

Having separate words for singular and plural is advantageous for clarity. We should all make "you" strictly singular and embrace "y'all" as
the plural.

>> No.13983102

>>13983098
You is already plural, nigger.

>> No.13983109

>>13983102
>You is already plural, nigger.
that's the point he's making, most languages distinguish between plural you and singular you

>> No.13983119

>>13983102
Chris anon, if your brain stops functioning of its own accord I'm not sure anyone around you would notice.

>> No.13983127

>>13983109
>>13983119
The implication being that nigger tier "y'all" is unnecessary. Name a more obnoxions term, go ahead.

>> No.13983128

>>13983109
No, thou misunderstandest. You is the plural. Just bring back thou instead of using y'all.

>> No.13983145

On occasions when I see "thou" used in 20th/21st century stuff, I get the impression a lot of people seem to think it was a formal version of "you", when it was actually an informal singular 'you'.

>> No.13983147

>>13983128
I don't care which is used, but I chose y'all simply because some people do actually use it already, so it would be easier to get people to adopt than reviving a dead word.

>> No.13983151
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13983151

>>13983098
>y'all
Never go full hick/nigger.

>> No.13983153

>>13983147
I've never "y'all" used outside of slang on American TV shows.

>> No.13983155

>>13983145
Well when it fell out of general use the only common use that wasn't literary was prayer when addressing God, so it makes sense that it developed a formal sense.

>> No.13983165
File: 42 KB, 400x400, 34434234432.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
13983165

>Howdy y'all

>> No.13983167

>>13983151
There are 100% valid linguistic reasons to use it. Your prejudice against blacks and southerners is irrelevant.

>>13983153
In the southern US, many people (typically in rural areas, where their speech is not influenced by people from the rest of the country) use y'all.

>> No.13983187

>>13983167
>There are 100% valid linguistic reasons to use it.
Name 5.

>> No.13983193

>>13983187
1. Clarity
2. Clarity
3. Clarity
4. Clarity
5. Clarity

>> No.13983202

>>13983193
There's all ways been clarity when it comes to "you". People just say "all of you" if they want to dispel additional doubts, which most of the time never happen. "y'all" is just the hick lingo version of that. It's not even a new word.

>> No.13983205

>>13983202
Y'all is easier to say than "all of you". I don't give a flying fuck about the fact it's associated with hicks.

>> No.13983208

>>13983098
In New Zealand and Australia there's already a distinction between the singular "you" and the plural "yous".

>> No.13983216

>>13983205
"All of you" sounds stronger and more Anglo. "y'all" sounds nigger tier. Difficulty is relative. Sorry, lad, just facts.

>> No.13983222

What if we all just started using "thou" again? Would it really be that hard? We could meme it into reality, maybe this would be /lit/ putting meme magic to good use for a change.

>> No.13983223

>>13983216
I don't care.

>> No.13983225

>>13983223
Neither do I, so use your nigger word.

>> No.13983228

>>13983222
Given the already low chances of success, I'd prefer we put that effort into pushing y'all instead.

>> No.13983255

>>13983109
Why do you want English to be like the other languages?

>> No.13983268

>>13983222
Langyage has to change organically, you'd have to organize an actual social movement to get that shit rolling
So the best way to do it is by fixing the american(america has massive amounts of influence on global culture even if no one wants to admit it) school system and making the new generation fall in love with shakespeare

>> No.13983309

>>13983098
>>13983193
Y'all is dialectal, overused incorrectly or poorly so as to conform to a niggerfied culture, and by the wrong sort of people. Don't pretend that this isn't the only way people express the plural because it's not.

>>13983205
He's saying it's unnecessary because plural 'you' is rarely confused and when it might be, you can specify. If it were necessary then every English speaker would regularly indicate the plural, and with that swifter ways of expressing it would already be so wellestablished in the language that we wouldn't think it worth discussing. Language invents new additions so that it can remain functional no matter how strictly it is kept stagnant. Given that plural 'you' of some kind is not mandatorily said in every dialect, that is it can't be implied through 'you', which would be singular-only, we can say it's unnecessary for functionality. Personally I don't like the sound of y'all nor do I think the natural (intimate) words of small number of people should be appropriated by cretins such as twitter activists or commercialised niggers broadly.

For literature purposes, there is no reason to not readopt the old pronouns. All it does is make it inaccessible for the uninitiated, which is what /lit and literary culture is all about, is it not?

>>13983208
I'm Australian and while this is true it has heavy stigma. I'd use it with certain people, but never in general. It's disadvantageous because you appear uneducated (and thus a stereotype easy to dismiss) even as they accept your use of it out of politeness.

>> No.13983357

>>13983309
Yeah, "yous" is obviously low-class. Most of my experience down under is with the Maori "true bro" crowd.

>> No.13983367

>>13983357
Probably came about independently several times given that it naturally follows plural-making. It won't work if mainstream society is averse to it, but perhaps one day it will be normal without evoking anything trashy. I don't mind either way.

>> No.13983370

>>13983309
you're a dumbass and a poseur. y'all is practically lexicon now, alongside you guys.

>> No.13983380

>>13983309
based
>>13983370
cringe

>> No.13983385

>>13983370
Don't pretend to tell me what the speech of me and mine is, crawl back to your twitter hovel.

>> No.13983388

Thou comes from you (where the y is a thorn). Bring back the thorn

>> No.13983395

I thou thee, thou villain.

It was a formal/informal distinction, not singular/plural.

>> No.13983429

>>13983388
no it does not

>> No.13983436
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13983436

>>13983098
amen to that

>> No.13983437

>>13983395
The formal distinction was to use the plurals in place of singular, displacing the informal singulars and making singular/plural identical. It's like saying 'we' in the formal sense. Or as another example, in Australian English 'us' is used in place of 'me' in certain contexts. Except in these cases the plural has not displaced the singular.

>> No.13983457

How about "You'ns"?

>> No.13983499

>>13983098
>"y'all" as the plural.
I honestly 100% believe this is the correct course of action, and as such I began to use it that way years ago.

>> No.13983516

>>13983098
You sound like a jackass if you use y'all when it's not part of your dialect.

>> No.13983528

You.
Soldier boy up in this whore. Watch me crank it watch me roll. Watch me crank that soldier boy and super-soak that whore.

>> No.13983548

>>13983208
A very small number of people do this in the USA.

>> No.13983551

>>13983098
"ye" was used as the 2nd person plural for a long time

>> No.13983557

>>13983437
>>13983395
except you was formal, and thou was informal, see lear for examples of this

>> No.13983830

>>13983557
Yes that's what I said. You was plural and formal, thou was singular and informal. You, when used formally, was both singular and plural. The informal singulars were relegated to more intimate (informal) use and eventually dropped.

>> No.13984845

>>13983551
No, "ye" was just a typing contraction used in Old English. It carries over from the Anglo-Saxon/Old Norse/Germanic letter "Thorn" or "þorn" (Þ, þ). Quite literally, it is pronounced as "th-," and so when you say "ye," it literally just means "the/thee," but just spelled funny to save scribes and printers time.

Historically illiterate faggots love going to Renaissance fairs, and calling everything "Yeeeeeee Old Pub." The sign just fucking means "THE Old Pub," shut the fuck up.

>> No.13984858

>>13984845
ye olde pube

>> No.13984920

>>13984858
Fuck-e ye, and-e every-e one-e thou lovest.

>> No.13984954

>>13984845
Have ye sex

>> No.13984957

>>13984845
>But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
>But seek the first the kingdom...
What did they mean by this?

>> No.13985220

>>13983155
But why was G-d addressed in the informal?

>> No.13985236

>>13984957
>But seek [thee] first the kingdom of God...

>> No.13985240

>>13984845
ye (pronoun) =/= ye (the) (article)

>> No.13985246

you lot

>> No.13986173

>>13983098
Whenever I see the "word" y'all, I immediately stop reading.

>> No.13986180

>>13986173
this

>> No.13986230
File: 51 KB, 1024x576, 1508696009740.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
13986230

>>13986180
Also, when reading "nigga" or any kind of ebonics.
It's great for mental hygiene to not burden yourself with the writings of people who use those things unironically.

>> No.13986305

>>13983098
Thou isn't that good as everyone says. I mean I've heard better sludge and they are just dull. I much prefer The Body

>> No.13987579

>>13985220
Because that's what Jesus did. He called the father "abba" which is sort of like calling him "dad".

>> No.13987653

>>13987579
Eloi, eloi, lamma sabacthani?

>> No.13987951

>>13983167
Dixies are the nigger of America, so it doesn't say anything

>> No.13988972

I want to bring back "ich" for "I" and clitic "ch-" so we can have words like chad and chwas and chould.

>> No.13990244

>>13983208
I think the scots do this as well? Someone correct me

>> No.13990254

>>13990244
Probably in some places, I always thought it was more of a Geordie thing though. They still use thou/thee/thine in some parts of the north of England, the Kaiser Chiefs even used it in songs and shit. There's also the use of "us" as a first person singular for the record.

>> No.13990256

>>13984845
You're getting "ye" for "the" confused with the pronoun "ye".

>> No.13990267

Am I the only one who associates “y’all” less with rednecks and black people and more with yuppie paper belt types trying to appear more “folksy?”

>> No.13990268

>>13990267
When used by non blacks or non southerners I get that impression.

>> No.13990413

>>13983225
lol based rejection

both "all of you" AND "none of you" are more precise. additionally, this problem goes in the opposite direction if you're not fucking careful.

"the ROYAL 'we', man."

>> No.13990600

>>13983151

Y'allshd've

>> No.13990612

>>13983205
Because you're a hickey hillbilly jankey redneck already.

>> No.13990991

>>13983153
I grew up in the south and I’ve lost my accent and most of the vernacular but still use y’all for second person plural.