/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.13944892]

What is /lit/'s opinion on Evola's esoteric/spiritual beliefs? Especially the one's in, 'Revolt Against the Modern World'? They are practically inseparable from his political aspect, so is it even possible for a person, who doesn't share his spiritual beliefs, to understand his political beliefs? His views on race are also unusual for the time period, as he doesn't support any form of scientific/biological racism, but instead considers race to be a spiritual/identity thing. For example, a Jew could posses the qualities of an Aryan, and thus, actually be an Aryan.

[Anonymous No.13945027]

What is there to think about it? Evolas was always concerned in the domain of Spirit. Even when he was wounded, being bound to a wheelchair, essentially disabled and unable to walk for the rest of his life he wrote:
>Not much changed in my life following the accident, as my handicap was merely physical: aside from the practical disadvantages, and the limitations it entailed from the point of view of my profane existence, the handicap hardly bothered me, for my spiritual and intellectual work remained unaffected by the accident

Evola was anti-materialist, anti-bourgeois (the materialism goes hand in hand with bourgeois) and concerned mainly about the domain of Spirit.

So even if you were wheelchair bound negroid mongoloid it probably was not a concern to Evola ever.

[Anonymous No.13945318]

>>13945027
It seems like Evola shares some similarities with Stoicism.

[Anonymous No.13945334]

>>13945027
What is his deal with "Magic"?

[Anonymous No.13945342]

He thinks real life is Middle Earth. If you're into Varg tier fedora mysticism Evola will be right up your alley.

[Anonymous No.13945344]

>>13944892
Evola is good, but it's important to grow out of him at some point but actually embracing a religious tradition and stop dilettanting around with a dozen or so of them, esp. the Asian religions (who fucking cares about them lmao). If you're European, you don't have many non-cringe options. Become Catholic or Orthodox. Don't become protty. Don't become a pagan.

[Anonymous No.13945356]

>>13945344
Why should one embrace Christianity?

[Anonymous No.13945361]

>>13945334
He was member of the UR group. Evola also praised Aleister Crowley's extreme approach to ceremonial magic, experiments with wild sex orgies and drugs etc.

http://www.gornahoor.net/library/EvolaOnCrowley.pdf

Evola is all about transcendence of the normal consciousness to something that can properly be called superconsciousness: this can be achieved many ways: tantrism, buddhism, heremticism, alchemy, magick etc.

[Anonymous No.13945405]

>>13945361
So basically he and a few other autists tried to do some Asian voodoo shit to influence the current world? Sounds kinda materialistic.

[Anonymous No.13945411]

>>13945318

[Anonymous No.13945452]

>>13945405
>Sounds kinda materialistic.

This is wrong view of the theory behind Ceremonial magic which Evola also practiced.

This is from De Arte Magica:
>For the Work is taking place in a World of Causes fluid and not soild, in Yetzirah (or even Briah) rather than in Assiah.

>It will be impossible or very difficult to move infantry from one wing of the engaged line to the other, but in the Quarters of the Staff it is indifferent whether that body, being at the base, is pushed forward to either. One cannot easily oxidize gold precipated from the chloride, but having the chloride, it is easy to prepare the oxide rather than the metal. And in all these matters reason must be the guide, and experience the teacher, so that the adept seek not to perform things impossible in Nature, and so blaspheme the Sacrament and bring it to comtempt. Yet let this be said, that to the consumate and sublime Initiate it may seem that of Himself was it written: "With God all things are possible." However, God Himself is not found to interfere arbitrarily with the course of Nature, but to work within His laws. Let the Adept act not otherwise.

The material outcome or result is rather a waste product or a necessary residue of such magical operation, according to the western ceremonial magical theory. It should never be performed a material outcome in mind; at least during an operation, for it must be performed without lust of result

Of course, we could debate does magick exist.

[Anonymous No.13945453]

Curious if anyone's read this and whether or not it's readable for someone without much background in the subject. I'm primarily interested from reading about the Futurists and their interests in alchemy, seances, Theosophy, etc, and while I know Evola was only briefly acquainted with the movement, I thought this might give some insight into the beliefs of that milieu.

[Anonymous No.13945473]

>>13945411
Alright faggot, try to refute it.
>protip: you can't

[Anonymous No.13945506]

>>13945356
Assuming you're European, then this is the only option you have since it's the only unbroken, long-standing tradition in Europe. Joining another religion, like Islam or Hinduism, is just cringe. You might not like Christianity but your ancestors liked it for 2 millennia and if it was good enough for the Romans and Greeks, it should be good enough for you. Also, it has the added bonus of actually being true.

[Anonymous No.13945551]

>>13945506
Christianity has lost it's traditional value, the younger christians are just shilling progressive propaganda. The Christian morals have decayed and are lost. At this point there is no difference what religion you embrace, it's all the same.

[Anonymous No.13945620]

>>13945344
>>13945356
>>13945506
>>13945551
Christianity was always nonsensical garbage. And its foundations lie in the prophecies of a tribe of racists. The only reason it became popular in Europe was because of brainlet Roman emperors preferring it to Paganism. Buddhism and Hinduism or nature-worship (i.e. Paganism) are the best religions, hands down.

[Anonymous No.13945638]

>>13945620
What good are religions and spiritual beliefs, if you can achieve the same result without following this or that god/ideal/etc

[Anonymous No.13945644]

>>13945620
All religion is a cope anyway, it's of no importance

[Anonymous No.13945668]

>>13945551
The Church is Satan's biggest target.
>At this point there is no difference what religion you embrace, it's all the same.
Absolutely 100% false, this is one of the stupidest things people say. Did you just take your first hit of weed or something? Only retards, psychedelic abusers, and dilettantes say that shit. Study ANY TWO religions side by side, and you'll see they're always more different than alike. Hence, the fact that the Jews voted to kill Christ. They didn't just say "ah, you know, this man may differ on doctrine with us in hundreds of ways but I think he is ultimately the same as us, let's therefore spare him."
>>13945620
Read the Book of John, Christianity isn't nonsense. It's literally rarified Hellenism.

"Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ λόγος, kαὶ ὁ λόγος ἦν πρὸς τὸν θεόν, kαὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος."

People who aren't sure about Christianity should learn Greek and study more Ancient Greek Philosophy alongside the Gospels. Heraclitus, Plato, Aristotle, and the Gospels. But it's important to learn Greek to see the similarities more clearly. THERE IS A REASON THE GREEKS AND ROMANS LIKED AND ADOPTED CHRISTIANITY OVER PAGANISM. Why? Because one is sincere and true, while the other appeared dead to them.

[Anonymous No.13945683]

>>13945638
Because a good religion like Hinduism, Buddhism, or Paganism naturally leads you to see that God is Everything and Everything is God. You can also get there with pure philosophy and a worse religion (for example Spinoza), but it's harder.

[Anonymous No.13945703]

>>13945683
>God is Everything and Everything is God.
I hate this bullshit

[Anonymous No.13945704]

>>13945668
Different religions have different ideals, dogmas, ways of practice, etc. But they are all ways of coping. Some better - more efficient - than others but the ideal that they strive for is the same - to be content. Generally any religion is good if it achieves it's purpose.

[Anonymous No.13945716]

>>13945683
>>13945703
"hurdur my poop and cum and queefs are god"
man, when will pagans stop this? hahaha

[Anonymous No.13945723]

>>13945703
>>God is Everything and Everything is God.
>I hate this bullshit
But thats a theme in Christianity too, you fucking mongoloid.

[Anonymous No.13945731]

>>13945716
>>13945723
Im not christian or pagan, explain to me what "god is everything' even fucking means. It's like the bullshit of 'non-duality' which nevertheless has to differentiate between the transcendence associated with realizing non-duality and the normal state of being.

[Anonymous No.13945735]

>>13945703
>Every ancient religion in the world which states this is bullshit because I prefer my super special retarded philosophy

[Anonymous No.13945740]

>>13945683
>God is Everything and Everything is God
literally a tenet of the christian faith but nice try.
>>13945344
Catholics are cringe because they rely too much on faulty human reason, there is a place for reason with regards to scripture, Martin luther wrote on this in his catechism. The best applications of reason (pretty much greek reason because everyone else is a fucking brainlet) is Aquinas' Five proofs in his summa. Proves God using logic. Doesn't contradict scripture. Also makes sense that it wasnt in scripture because you need faith to believe in God, using reason as a bridge for your faith is ok (weaker obviously than a direct faith) but reason requires faith, because as Kant will attest to be can't really know jackshit. So become protestant so you don't have to defend the shill pope and kiddy twiddlers. Dont know much about orthadox, but they have a great musical tradition (although not as great as the protestants, since we have bach sorry it wasn't really fair) like Rachmaninoff, Stravinsky, and Tchakovsky. Presently listening to
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmM4i7rj_3g&list=PLTweOPYeD0cFC5RoCp0NfCvXGrBphAu5X&index=8&t=1722s

[Anonymous No.13945743]

>>13945683
>You can also get there with pure philosophy and a worse religion (for example Spinoza), but it's harder.
It's much easier and more practical to achieve that with pure philosophy as you don't have to follow some of the more bullshit aspects (of which there are many) in any chosen religion.

[Anonymous No.13945751]

>>13945731
Go read the Bhagavad Gita, the Nikayas, Parmenides, a good translation of the New Testament without a garbage modern-day interpretation of Christianity in mind, etc. and you will see what it means.

[Anonymous No.13945763]

>>13945668
literally how do i learn greek. I've been wanting to for a while. I had to read a fucking commentary on Heraclitus because all the meaning comes from words in greek meaning two or more things. Is athenaze good? I breifly looked at it and was unsure.

[Anonymous No.13945782]

>>13945731
I'm not a Christian nor a Pagan, same as you. But my interpretation of the concept that 'God is everything, and everything is God' would be the following: Assuming, that the world we live in is made by intelligent design - God - then everything from His creation contains a part of himself, because without Him said thing couldn't exist. The logical step would be to live in accordance with Nature, as it is God's creation. The tricky part starts when you try to define what it means to 'live in accordance with Nature', and ultimately, everyone will have a different Interpretation on how it's supposed to be like. For Christians it would be to follow the 10 commandments.

[Anonymous No.13945792]

>>13945782
>'live in accordance with Nature',
Everything that exists 'lives in accordance with nature'. Especially if everything is God.

[Anonymous No.13945794]

>>13945740
huh?

[Anonymous No.13945808]

>>13945794

[Anonymous No.13945821]

>>13945792
Well yes, but no. That's your interpretation of it, that being said, I think the same. But a religion is useless if it's dictated way of living in accordance with nature is just any way of living. That idea does not fulfill the needs of a man who turns to such a religion in the first place, as it does not make him feel content.

[Anonymous No.13945831]

>>13945821
yeah but if everything is God then a man not feeling content is also God. A religion being useless is also God

[Anonymous No.13945840]

>>13945740
Thanks for the comfy music, fren. :)

[Anonymous No.13945864]

>>13945840
tchakovsky is a master of not only symphonies, but choral aswell, although I found his sonatas difficult to enjoy.

[Anonymous No.13945868]

>>13945831
Technically, yes. But again, such a thought, while true, is still useless.

[Anonymous No.13945877]

>>13945868
Why do care if it's useless, if everything is God why privilege useful things over useless ones?

[Anonymous No.13945881]

>>13945740
>Catholics are cringe because they rely too much on faulty human reason
>cites a Catholic as an example of someone who argued successfully for God using reason

????

[Anonymous No.13945884]

>>13945864
I've seen a few of his pieces performed by the Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra, and it was breathtaking. Although, I should note, that my knowledge in classical music is almost nonexistent, and it all depends on whether something sounds good or bad to me.

[Anonymous No.13945894]

>>13945763
Start with Modern Greek and work your way back. This is the best way for difficult languages like Ancient Greek. It'll save you a lot of time and hardship. Even if you only learned Modern Greek, you'd understand a great deal of Koine, since Greek is one unbroken language, despite its many changes.

[Anonymous No.13945908]

>>13945877
>why privilege useful things over useless ones?
Because it doesn't help cope with the current state of our existence. As I stated before, my beliefs do not include the idea that God is everything, because I just don't care about religious ideas for myself. They are definitely interesting to discuss, but are of no importance other than that.

[Anonymous No.13945923]

>>13945908
>my beliefs do not include the idea that God is everything,
Well m8 that is the topic I was discussing.

[Anonymous No.13945927]

>>13945881
too far would be something like their views on the eucharist. I was citing an example of a good use of it, I was not trying to say that other denominations have abandoned reason, I apologize if that was unclear.
>>13945884
you are one lucky man and have filled me with envy. I don't believe anyone could say that they "have an understanding" of classical music, most have massive discographies (to use a contemporary term) and theres simply too much to get without devoting a lifetime to it. But your take on it is entirely correct, you should like music that sounds good, it is not complex, as some more snobbish takes like to make it appear. I listen to classical music as if it were pop music, picking a song and playing it listening on repeat to songs that I like (have heard teh goldberg variations a million times) its fucking music, just listen to it, you can't control how you do, you can't control your ears, so as long as your listening to it, your doing it right.
>>13945894
any particular method? Site? If I went at it now I would probably download a vocab app (like lingquist) and use duolingo. I am already using those two for german, but I feel there could be ones better catered towards greek.

[Anonymous No.13945963]

>>13945927
Duolingo isn't good for Modern Greek, in my opinion. A good start might be Language Transfer. It's free and online. It's basically a series of vocal lessons. It won't teach you how to read though, just to start thinking in Greek and about Greek. For reading, the Teach Yourself book is kind of outdated but it isn't bad. It has some orthographical anachronisms but it's a decent place to start.

[Anonymous No.13945973]

>>13945963
have you learned greek? can u read plato? how long did it take? Im expecting semi-proficiency within a year due to my steady practice regimen.

[Anonymous No.13945988]

>>13945923
As was I, but from a theoretical point of view, not my own.
>>13945927
Yes, seeing musicianship of that level is really a sight to behold.

[Anonymous No.13946007]

Hey Smitty why don't you go dick that soviet bird you used to go steady with? By the way, why did you stop going steady with her? Are you gay? –No Chundoan, I'm... –Say no more. Give Doris a call, tell her I'm coming over to drop off a package. Chundoan slowly scrambled around the office for dating particulars. A bottle of wine and a diamond necklace were in his pockets on the way out. –Have a swell time Chun. –It's gonna be a swelly alright Smit. Chundoan turned around quickly and whipped the bottle full force past Smitty's face, exploding on the wall pouring forth red squeeze and gales of detective's laughter. –Tell what's her name to qive the office a once over while I'm out getting straight drained. –Chindoan, she doesn't have a name, we got to calling her Betty remember? –Ok mon.

[Anonymous No.13946009]

>>13945988
>Because it doesn't help cope with the current state of our existence.
From a theoretical perspective this has the same problem as before. Whether something helps us cope or not should be irrelevant if everything is God. This is my problem with these monisms, and I why I brought it up

[Anonymous No.13946017]

>>13945973
My Greek isn't perfect. I studied it for about a year and was able to read and understand a significant amount of Modern/Koine/Ancient Greek, then I started to focus more on Latin. I want to get back into Greek soon. The great thing about Greek is that it's an organic language, you can see the thought behind the creative impulses of the language reflected in the language itself, something most modern languages don't have. It's really beautiful, probably Europe's greatest linguistic possession.

[Anonymous No.13946020]

>>13944892
Evola was a brainlet. Follower of Nietzsche larping as a traditionalist, what a bad joke.

[Anonymous No.13946042]

>>13945344
Seconded without cucktholicism, it's now cringe incarnated. The real still standing tradition is orthodoxy.

[Anonymous No.13946074]

>>13946009
Well, religions that have the idea of 'God is everything, everything is God' also follow up on the idea to live in some sort of accordance with this God/Nature/God's Ideal/etc. And then the religion gives itself meaning by providing some sort of guidelines by which it's follower are supposed to live by. And it is at that point that it becomes functional cope under the idea that 'God is everything, everything is God'. Or that's just how I view it.

[Anonymous No.13946096]

>>13946074
>Well, religions that have the idea of 'God is everything, everything is God' also follow up on the idea to live in some sort of accordance with this God/Nature/God's Ideal/
This is the contradiction though. If god is everything than living in accordance to god=living in accordance to everything(anything?). What does that even mean?
>functional cope
You don't believe in it though so of course you think that.

[Anonymous No.13946120]

>>13946096
>This is the contradiction though. If god is everything than living in accordance to god=living in accordance to everything(anything?). What does that even mean?
As I said, the religion itself dictates an idea of what it means to live in accordance with God. Without that idea, it indeed means that living in accordance with God = living in accordance with anything, if you follow just the idea that God is everything