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/lit/ - Literature

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13824386 No.13824386 [Reply] [Original]

Why has there never been a single good conservative novelist? Are they incapable of good art?

>> No.13824405

>>13824386
novels and propaganda are not the same thing

>> No.13824408

The interest of artists and business are at odds.

>> No.13824420

Evelyn Waugh

>> No.13824428

>>13824386
Mishima

>> No.13824433

>>13824386
I'm not sure if you could put G.K. Chesterton into that category. He's a great novelist nonetheless.

>> No.13824637

>>13824386
LOTR is the best book ever written.

>> No.13824661

>>13824386
Because good art transcends the political. There are good writers whose personal politics have been everything from very rightwing to very leftwing. But when you write, you need to set that aside. A political message shouldn't be the heart of a work

>> No.13824666

>>13824386
wyndham lewis

>> No.13824669

>>13824386
marinetti

>> No.13824687

>>13824386
>Why has there never been a single good conservative novelist? Are they incapable of good art?
>how about x?
>oh yeah, x was to the left of Stalin back in the day, didn't you know?

Every time.

>> No.13824692

>>13824661
Why tho? Are there really no great works with a politics at their heart?

>> No.13824694
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13824694

>>13824637
哈.

>> No.13824696
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13824696

>>13824386
>inb4 276 replies, 85 images

>> No.13824697

>>13824386
lovecraft

>> No.13824698

American conservativism is the hegemony, because America is most powerful. The hegemony has no need to criticize, create, subvert, or argue because it has already achieved its goal.

>> No.13824703

>>13824692
Politics are a spook, you fucking troglodyte. Art is a reflection of the human spirit. What you're after is nothing but trivial occurrences.

>> No.13824709

>>13824428
Mishima had an insanely radical nationalist imperialist traditionalist ideology. He was far from a conservative, which by definition is attempting to uphold the norms of the here and now.

>> No.13824720

you could argue a brave new world was in favor of conservatism

>> No.13824733
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13824733

>>13824703
Speak English you piece of fuck, or cite a source for this idea you seem to be trying to express.

But I do admit politics is spooky.

>> No.13824792

>>13824386
This man is not a conservative anon. He's a Jewish Supremacist LARPing as a conservative to better destroy America.

Should we still answer?

>> No.13824804

>>13824792
jewish supremacism is conservatism in america

>> No.13824807

>>13824733
>Speak English you piece of fuck

Why would you use that expression when English does not seem to be your first language.

>> No.13824817

>>13824386
>Nabokov
>Dostoevsky
>Knut Hamsun

>> No.13824825

>>13824807
I'm am not well educated but English is in fact my mother tongue.

>> No.13824830

>>13824817
>Nabokov
does being an insufferable prick who's wrong about everything make you a conservative ?

>> No.13824836

>>13824830
yes

>> No.13824883
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13824883

>> No.13824892

>>13824817
Dosto had conservative values, but other than that he's far from the today's belief of conservatism

>> No.13824910

>>13824825
Didn't mean to insult you, I've just never heard someone say piece of fuck before.

>> No.13824914

>>13824692
Some probably have, mostly south american novels such as Bad vibes by Fuguet or Some García Marquéz novels which reflected the state of his country with obvious disgust. Althoguh they didn't really stick to politics, but rather to a stand agaisn't them and their opinions.
No writer is truly apolitical after all, but I have yet to see a masterpiece written with politics as it's frontman.

>> No.13824920

>>13824386
You mean any American post-1965 conservative novelists? Because they're all freaks and weirdos

As others have stated, politics is a psyop as well

>> No.13824939

>>13824709
No it's not. There is no one under the label 'conservative' that is upholding the norms of here and now in Western countries. Most of them conserve nothing and merely use it to get an audience while accelerating the opposite, or pine after a dead age in effect being revolutionaries more than anything.

>> No.13824943

>>13824386
Book of the New Sun, Atlas Shrugged, Ender's Game, Starship Troopers, Dune.

You fuckin name it guy, there's tons of conservative lit.

>> No.13824946

>>13824804
Well yes, you're right.

>> No.13824951

>>13824910
Even if you were, it's no skin off my back. And I suppose I find crude language charming or alluring.

>> No.13824953

>>13824386

If you had just asked "what are some conservative novels I could read" you would have gotten 9 replies half of them from smart asses. You're a genius.

>> No.13824972
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13824972

>>13824386
>Why has there never been a single good conservative novelist?
Dostoevsky, retard

>> No.13824983

>>13824972
BASED ANON

>> No.13825011

>>13824951
Same desu

>> No.13825048

>>13824943
all of those are either not conservative or not literature

>> No.13825060

>>13824386
>conservative
>good
pick one

>> No.13825079

I wouldn't say he was a political conservative but Joseph Conrad had a very conservative sensibility.

>> No.13825084

>>13824386
For as much as I don't like conservatives, that's just not true. Go to a library.

>> No.13825090

Given the evolutionary nature of liberalism I'd imagine a lot of authors who were liberals in their time would come across as reactionary extremists today.

>> No.13825094
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13825094

By conservative, are we including religious? Because there were many religious authors who in my opinion were quite good. Dostoevsky, for one.

>> No.13825110

>>13824386
its the cost of 'being right', you have to sacrifice originality

>> No.13825113

>>13825079
This. I can say the same for VS Naipaul, Joan Didion, Ivo Andric and Mario Vargas Llosa, for example. None of them would be a MAGApede American conservative but none of them have any love for idealistic utopian social movements either.

>> No.13825173

>>13825084
which one

>> No.13825201

>>13824914
>>13824692
There can be fine political lit but it has to be done in a way that doesn't bash the audience in the head while shouting THIS IS HOW YOU SHOULD FEEL ABOUT TODAY'S HEADLINES

I think good political fiction tends to be either historical while addressing perennial conflicts in society (Under Western Eyes, The War of the End of the World) or fantastical and metaphorical (The Napoleon of Notting Hill, Arslan)

>> No.13825216

Dostoyevsky

>> No.13825221

>>13824830
>Nabokov
>an insufferable prick who's wrong about everything

Literally /ourguy/

>> No.13825343

>>13825048
They are all conservative but ok.

>> No.13825351

>>13824666
He was conservative? I'd always imagined he was an upper-class socialist like Orwell, or at least a libertarian. I'll have to check him out.

>> No.13825363

>>13825221
based and reflection-pilled

>> No.13825420
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13825420

>>13824386

>> No.13825425

Why is libertarianism considered conservative? It's literally the opposite of conservative by definition.

>> No.13825429

>>13825420
Not a bait at all anon. Shitiro is shit, more news at eleven. Conservatives are failing to adapt in some republics, and are slipping into reactionary territory because of it.

>> No.13825456

>>13825425
Conservative means red tribe. This is a purposefully vague category because the point is to argue, not to ascertain truth

>> No.13825469

>>13825425
because reagan fused libertarian economics with reactionary religious politics in the 80s

>> No.13825470

>>13825048
Starship Troopers is definitely both. Robert Heinlein and JRR Tolkien are two easy answers to OPs question. Although Heinlein kind of became a nudist colony dude weed lmao libertarian later on

>> No.13825490

>>13825425
It's useful to think of the right wing as bipolar. So instead of a simple left-right spectrum, you have a left pointing triangle.

The left is unipolar. A neolib/neocon is in the center, and a socialist is a more extreme version of a neolib, who is just a watered down commie.

The right, on the other hand, has the traditionalist/religious pole and economic or staunch capitalist pole. These two poles are fundamentally incompatible with one another

>> No.13825598

>>13824386
dosto was conservative i think

so is mccarthy i think.

>> No.13825635

Conservatives conserve and progressives progress

>> No.13825638

>>13825490
>a socialist is a more extreme version of a neolib
???

>> No.13825644

>>13825490
I dun get it. Draw a picture of this autism.

>> No.13825656

>>13825425
Because conservative and liberal are terms relative to what's being conserved and overturned or changed. European party politics are not the same, and never have been. America (at least in government) was traditionally libertarian, compared to European society hundreds of years ago, in terms of the markets and philosophical/religious beliefs, and libertarians want to conserve that at least that tradition. They've taken over a lot of the baseline Republican standing, so all they do is bitch about fiscal issues and lowering taxes and regulation while drag queens read to school children, liberalized immigrants replace the US population, abortion remains legalized, and violent criminals and sex predators get minimal sentencing.

>> No.13825670

Tolstoy
Hamsun
Etc.

>> No.13825768

Henry James

>> No.13826190

>>13825490
Hello fellow Duginite

>> No.13826389

Balzac

>> No.13826442

>>13824698
American conservatism has literally no cultural power

>> No.13826494

Trump

>> No.13826614

Evelyn Waugh

>> No.13826975

>American conservatism has literally no cultural power
Sweet jesus. Its only the dominant cultural hegemony over the entire planet.
I'm guessing you don't consider eg Hollywood to be part of American conservativism. It really is though. You probably don't like it because it features blacks and Jews and women or something, but the underlying assumptions about capitalism, private property, the nation state, militarism etc etc that underpin all American movies are deeply conservative

>> No.13826998

>>13824972
Dosto wasn’t conservative. Religious=/=conservative.

>> No.13827168

>>13824386
dostoevsky was pretty good

>> No.13827185

Ayn Rand

>> No.13827188

>>13824637
The closest political stance LOTR takes is proto environmentalism.

>> No.13827200

>>13826998
Demons is a conservative book

>> No.13827304

>>13827188
Eco-Monarchia

>> No.13827482

>>13824386
Hoffmann, Goethe, Giovanni-fucking-Verga, D’Annunzio, J. L. Borges, Alessandro Manzoni....

>> No.13827517

>>13824428
>mishima is conservatism in the same sense an american is
go shit in a cup and eat it

>> No.13827532

Dostoevsky obviously

>> No.13827536

>>13824386
Most novelists have a conservative bent. Please refrain from androidposting.

>> No.13827741

Any example gets shot down as not actually conservative because they didn't adhere to every plank of the 21st century GOP.

>> No.13827757

Every decent novelist ever has been a conservative.... Cervantes onwards. Read a book FFS.

>> No.13828771

>>13824386
Why does he tilt his head like this. Is he trying to hide his double chin? It makes him look like a scared kitten, ready to be plucked up and eaten.

>> No.13828797

>>13827188
It's almost like you've only ever seen Jackson's Hobbit films.

>> No.13828804

>>13824420
>Conservative woman
>Good novelist

Yikes

>> No.13828903

>>13828804
I will not take the bait. I will not take the bait. I will not take the bait. I will not take the bait.