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/lit/ - Literature

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13780460 No.13780460 [Reply] [Original]

The complete works of Plato and Aristotle are thousands of pages, and that's not even all of Greek philosophy. But you guys keep telling me I need to read the Greeks for some foundation in philosophy. Do anthologies of the Greeks exist which cut down the volume to something manageable? I.e. only 1000 pages in total to read instead of 5000

>> No.13780462

>>13780460
You don't really need to read all of Plato and Aristotle.

>> No.13780467

>>13780460
Oh fucking fuck What fucking bullshit Why am I always subjected to such amounts of bullshit God What did I do to deserve your punishment?
FUCKING READ. YOU'LL BE DONE IN A COUPLE OF YEARS TOPS.

>> No.13780470

>>13780460
Id heavily reccomend reading standford edu articles and university lectures on youtube too. These nail down the core concepts, and do so much quicker than reading the whole book 3 times

>> No.13780487

>>13780470
yes what anon said, subscribe to school of life xd

>> No.13780586

>>13780462
Hence this thread

>>13780470
I might not want to invest 2 years into reading the Greeks but I still have standards

>> No.13781076

>>13780467
Just learn ancient Greek and study the original texts for 10 years because you want to read Nietzsche bro

>> No.13781201

Imagine thinking it takes too long to gain a quick foundation in Greek history myth politics and tragedy. Just read. Fuck. It's every day with you people. Just read. It takes 2 months tops to read Homer, Hesiod, Sophocles, Herodotus, and any other background you need. And then tops another couple months to read Plato and Aristotle.

>> No.13781209

>>13781201
Incorrect, it depends on how fast you read, how often you read, and how much time you have to read. Not everyone on this site is jobless NEET devoid of responsibilities.

>> No.13781220

>>13781201
You're not going to get anything out of speedreading Plato and Aristotle. It's not comparable with reading some Greek epic or history (which is fucking boring, way too long and unnecessary unless you're a Greek scholar btw)

>> No.13781222

>>13781209
>40 hour job
>Wife
>3 kids
>Lots of friends

I only read about 300 WPM and it slows down when I'm reading more antiquated stuff.
You are full of shit if you think it takes longer than a few months to read this stuff. You just have to find time.
I read on my lunch breaks and after the kids go to bed.
>NEET

How old are you, anon

>> No.13781228

>>13781220
>Fucking boring, way too long

The absolute state of this board

The background of Western culture is boring and too long and only scholars enjoy it.

I admit you shouldn't speed read Greek Philosophy (you shouldn't speed read any of it) but it really is not that dense

>> No.13781251

>>13780586
You won’t understand Aristotle don’t even bother to read primary besides the ethics

>> No.13781254

>>13781228
It absolutely is. I'm technically a scholar (I teach philosophy) and I didn't even enjoy Herodotus. You don't read him out of enjoyment anyhow, unless you're actually autistic I guess, but out of necessity when your research area is anything relating to the Greeks.

>but it really is not that dense
The Metaphysics is possibly the hardest and densest work of philosophy in existence. I dislike the /lit/ advice of "just read the Greeks bro" very much for this reason, as I suspect the majority of people who have done so have never properly understood any of the Greek philosophy they have read.

>> No.13781262

>>13781222
I don't read at 300 WPM as I said: how fast you read.
>You just have to find time.
Which is what I said:
>it depends on how fast you read, how often you read, and how much time you have to read.
I am not a fast reader; I am a very slow reader. Depending on the difficulty of the text, e.g., Golding's translation of Ovid, a rather difficult translation, I can only get about maybe three/four pages in 40 minutes.

>> No.13781273

>>13781254
How could a scholar not enjoy the first historian?

Come on man I'm not saying Plato and Aristotle are easy, but we grew up in the foundation of their thought.
We are not Greeks or Persians in 300 BC, we have been wrought in this stuff whether we realize it or not.

And my point in my original comment is, if you do not have a foreknowledge in Hellenism (Homer, Hesiod, Herodotus) you will miss out on the philosophers

>> No.13781281

>>13781262
Anon,

Reading Ovid and Homer and Plato is going to make you a better reader..so just keep at it.

Once you finish the Greeks (however long it takes) you will see how much better of a reader you have become once you move to the next subject

>> No.13781283

>>13781273
>How could a scholar not enjoy the first historian?
It's a rather dry subject.

>Come on man I'm not saying Plato and Aristotle are easy, but we grew up in the foundation of their thought.
>We are not Greeks or Persians in 300 BC, we have been wrought in this stuff whether we realize it or not.
It would be easier if we were Greeks in 300 BC. Ancient philosophy is still a very active field of research. There is much we don't know or understand.

>> No.13781317

>>13781281
I'm not against people reading the Greeks and Romans; my main point of dispute is how long it'll take. I've been reading the Greeks for about 2/3 years now and have covered:
All of
>Euripides
>Sophocles
>Aeschylus
>Aristophanes
>Homer
>Virgil
>Livy
>Menander
>Hesiod
>Theognis
>Theocritus
>Pindar
>Thucydides
>Aurelius
>Arrian
>Curtius
>Apollonius
>Apollodorus
Then
>Demosthenes, Loeb, Vol 1
>Audiobooks of Cicero and Plutarch

I won't say that I don't have bad habits and neglect reading, but my primary reason is I'm so slow that I feel like Sisyphus.

>> No.13781325

>>13781076
EXACTLY IS THAT SO HARD?

>> No.13781330

In fact, skip the middle ages and start with descartes

>> No.13781350

>>13781330
then hit up husserl, heidegger and gadamer and you've got the greeks plus extra treats

>> No.13781439
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13781439

>Hey guys I want to read the Greeks, as I have been made aware through all the material that is being shared here that it is necessary. However, I am constrained in several ways, and would thus inquire if you have a recommendation for a handy anthology that would accommodate me.
>WHAT DO YOU MEAN "ANTHOLOGY" FUCKING NEWFAGS EVERYDAY WITH THE SAME SHIT JUST READ THE GREEKS IS IT NOT ENOUGH WE SPAM THESE INFOGRAPHICS I HAVE READ ALL OF THE GREEKS AND ROMANS FOR THE LAST FIFTEEN YEARS OF MY LIFE YOU DONT SEE ME COMPLAINING NOW DO YOU? I WILL GET TO KANT EVENTUALLY AND WHEN I DO TRUST ME IT IS GOING TO BE SO EASY!!! CUNT

>> No.13781461

>>13780460
I know a philosophy teacher, he is my friend since we were both on high school. He told me I can skip the greeks and read any philosophy book I want, that I have to research autor's school of thought first, the time period in which he lived, to get familiar with his terminology, take notes and research unfamiliar concepts and ideas. Also I know basic phil (metaphysics, epistemology, ethics, logic) so that helps too. If you are a casual reader I guess this can help, if you want to excel at philosophy then yes, read every greek philosopher out there I suppose

>> No.13781471

>>13781461
Kant was only familiar with Plato through a history of philosophy and had only moderate knowledge of Aristotle. It's possible to get very far in philosophy without reading the Greeks. They're only really somewhat necessary for Nietzsche and Heidegger, and even then both of those provide us with a majority of the exegesis themselves. That being said, something like an anthology would be useful.

>> No.13782249

How is this? https://www.amazon.com/Readings-Ancient-Greek-Philosophy-Aristotle/dp/1603844627