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/lit/ - Literature

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13571909 No.13571909 [Reply] [Original]

This shit supposed to impenetrable? How much reference material am I supposed to know?

>> No.13571918

>>13571909
Mainly my diary desu

>> No.13571922

It's not that bad. Have you read Systems of Objects? I'd start there if not. If you've read Saussure and Marx then Baudrillard isn't so bad.

>> No.13571935

>>13571909

Every good work of philosophy assumes you've read every other good work of philosophy.

>> No.13571955

>>13571909
4real tho this aint even that hard lmao but i'd also suggest reading system of objects

>> No.13572157
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13572157

Maybe read America by Baudrillard alongside S&S, it helps to get into the general atmosphere and perspective of his philosophy.

>> No.13573065

>>13571922
I haven't read either. More books to buy/torrent I guess.

I think I can get through the book, just with gaps where references and phrases I don't have or understand.

>> No.13573108

Simulacra and Simulation is basically just a supplement to Symbolic Exchange and Death. No idea why in the English speaking world the former is so well known while the latter isn't.

>> No.13573122

>>13573065
Saussure's Course in General Linguistics is more a less a must-read if you're gonna start reading post-structuralists. I mentioned Marx because Baudrillard was a Marxist in his younger years and builds on/departs from Marx's theories of value.


Here's a nice lecture series that touches on some of these ideas: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD00D35CBC75941BD

I'd recommend lectures 8-12.

>> No.13573626

>>13571909
Along with the other suggestions, I'd recommend reading some Barthes. "Work to Text" "death of the author". I find him an easy intro to postruct. But honestly Baudrillard is fine to jump into. Just know that there's not gonna be any logical train of thought for his claims. Just roll with it and evaluate when done.

>> No.13573712
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13573712

read this first

>> No.13573768
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13573768

No, once the way Baudrillard thinks clicks with you it is smooth sailing. Because his way of thinking is unique, it is hard to offer reference material. He was hugely influenced by Bataille, Artaud, Nietzsche, Barthes, Marx, Saussure, Freud and the Frankfurt School in his early period, but by S&S those weren't really on his mind. Barthes is still probably the biggest influence, try his book Mythologies. Or try Baudrillard's The Consumer Society, which is much more straightforward than The System of Objects. Or try secondary-literature.
>>13573108
It's really not; Seduction is the supplement to Symbolic Exchange and Death. And its because SE&D wasn't translated into English in full for a while, and by then most people had lost interest in Baudrillard, while parts of Simulacra and Simulation were translated and published by Semiotext(e) right before Baudrillard blew up in the US and UK in the late 70s.
>>13573626
>there's not gonna be any logical train of thought for his claims.
There absolute is. He just doesn't bother with argument or empirical examples. If anything his work is only one thing logically implying another.
>>13573712
based

>> No.13573900

>>13573712
Suck my dick.

>> No.13575061

>>13573768
Not him, but is Marx hard to read? How are you so supposed to free the proletariat if he can barely read?

>> No.13575232

baudrillard isnt hard