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13555519 No.13555519 [Reply] [Original]

>talk to family about my anti-natalist beliefs
>they keep trying to convince me that im depressed
Fucking normies.

>> No.13555525

>>13555519
Kill yourself, that will ENORMOUSLY decrease suffering in the world.

No excuses, stop being selfish.

>> No.13555528

>>13555519
have sex

or dilate, if you hate life so much you're probably part of the 60%

>> No.13555535

>>13555519
This. If you display almost any philosophical belief that is outside of the norm, you are told to go to a therapist and check for signs of mental illness. I don’t have any friends as a result of this

>> No.13555538

I'm actually a supernatalist. If you aren't having 20 children, then you're as bad as a murderer.
It goes like thís:
1: Pleasure is good.
2: Humans feel pleasure.
3: Therefor, instrumentaly, the existence of humans is good.
4: We have a duty to do the good.
5: We have a duty to have children.

>> No.13555539

>>13555535
What are some of the "outside of the norm" philosophical beliefs that you hold?

>> No.13555562

>>13555539
I'm a hyperkantian, I don't lie, never. Not even to save the universe from certain destruction.

>> No.13555567

>>13555539
As a teenager I had pretty big Platonic and Hegelian phases

>> No.13555570

>>13555538
>1: Pleasure is good.
It has no moral value.
>2: Humans feel pleasure.
Some do.
>3: Therefor, instrumentaly, the existence of humans is good.
Does not follow.
>4: We have a duty to do the good.
We don't have any duties.
>5: We have a duty to have children.
Nope.

>> No.13555578

>>13555570
Okay retard.
>Doesn't know basic logic
>Doesn't know the metaethical Foundations that build on fenemology to defend utilitarianism
>Doesn't understand the concept of duty

>> No.13555583

>>13555562
>I don't lie, never
But wouldn't that be a violation of the golden rule? (I dont know much Kant)

>> No.13555590

>>13555578
>>Doesn't know basic logic
I do.
>>Doesn't know the metaethical Foundations that build on fenemology to defend utilitarianism
>utilitarianism
Lol!
>>Doesn't understand the concept of duty
Duty is a spook.

>> No.13555606

>>13555519
I love anti-natalists - by their very nature they are predetermined to wipe themselves and their stupid idea out of the gene pool.

>> No.13555613

>>13555578
Premise 1: Pleasure is good
Premise 2: Humans feel pleasure
Conclusion: Humans feel pleasure and pleasure is good.
Premise 3: ???

>> No.13555621

>>13555528
So the 40% that commit suicide love life?

>> No.13555629

Why would someone who isn't depressed be an anti-natalist though. It means they are enjoying life

>> No.13555634

>>13555519
>he hasn't read Julian Simon

>> No.13555640

>>13555606
Wrong. They can influence others and thus spread their mindset. Same reasons liberals are so numerous while having a lot fewer children than conservatives.

>> No.13555646

>>13555629
You can be not depressed and still not really enjoy life.

>> No.13555648

>>13555629
You can be an antinatalist and personally enjoy your life, at least to the extent other people do. It just means that you have a realistic understanding of life.

>> No.13555653

>>13555621
yes, and they kill themselves out of grief for what they've lost

>> No.13555657

>>13555562
lol

>> No.13555661

>>13555648
>realistic understanding of life
What do you mean by this? That anti-natalism is the only, or one of the realistic understandings of life?

>> No.13555667

>>13555567
kek

>> No.13555674

>>13555661
I am an antinatalist so I think that antinatalism is the correct understanding of life, or rather the correct implication of a correct understanding of life, yes.

>> No.13555676

>>13555648
>It just means that you have a realistic understanding of life.
No, it means you should kill yourself ASAP, because you are annoying the rest of humanity.
If you believe that life is on average positive (and how have you determined it isn't, and your person experience goes against it) how can you be an antinatalist?
Any birth will on average increase total happiness.

>> No.13555679

>>13555570
Define your idea of morality

>> No.13555680

>>13555646
Then end it already, do us the favor.

>> No.13555697

>>13555676
I'm not a utilitarian, sorry.

>> No.13555701

>>13555680
Nah. It's like Buridan's ass. No point in ending it if it's not bad even if it's not great either.

>> No.13555707

>>13555697
Then why should we not reproduce?

Every anti-natalist told me that reproduction is evil, as it causes suffering, but you obviously can not believe that.

>> No.13555713 [DELETED] 
File: 6 KB, 192x263, prophetmani.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
13555713

I am both a cosmological dualist and antinatalist like Prophet Mani.

>> No.13555728

>>13555519
>they think I'm depressed

I am in some sense. That is the only reasonable reaction to knowing full well you are going to hell and everyone you care about is going to hell. The Bible is called a book of Hope but it cannot be called a book of Optimism. The Bible is called the Good book but it cannot be called the book of things one ought to be looking forward to.

>> No.13555736

>>13555707
Being born is a condemnation to death. Every being which is born must experience dying. I don't want to cause that.

>> No.13555744

The logical expression of antinatalism is gay dudes poopdicking each other and crying in between forum posts.

>> No.13555750

You we're already BTFO'd 40 years ago by a book anti-natalists never seem to read

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ultimate_Resource

>> No.13555762

>>13555736
Why is death bad?
You surely aren't a Christian and believe in no afterlife, thus death, for a person, is just return to the state as before birth.
Death here and now is only bad because it puts an end to happiness, which is obviously not desirable, but eventual death is just as bad as having never been born PLUS the happiness of having lived.

>> No.13555771

>>13555728
So you believe in the bible but it makes you depressed? What kind of Satan are you?

>> No.13555774

>>13555762
I said the problem was that people must "experience dying", not death.

>> No.13555789

>>13555774
So it's okay, if you get shot through the head at some random, totally unexpected, point in time?

Dying is obviously sad, but just because you have to leave happiness behind, which almost by definition, makes living and dying superior to not having lived at all.

>> No.13555797

>>13555640
The mindset they spread ultimately dies out though, it’s an idea that kills itself. A parasite bad at its job.

>> No.13555807

>>13555797
Not really, a parasite also can stop his host from successfully reproducing, but still spread.

>> No.13555809
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13555809

>>13555771
No Satan at all. Just someone who is willing to read the fine-print and crunch the numbers. I don't think Satan can be an antinatalist because then you'd have to impute human concern and empathy onto him. He has a singular purpose, to drag as many persons as possible to hell with him. One must first exist to be subject to this danger, so even Satan wants as many persons to exist as possible. This is why most religions are fertility cults and why he promotes abortion (yes there are fetuses in hell, for those are also souls who die without knowing Christ).

>> No.13555810

>>13555789
>So it's okay, if you get shot through the head at some random, totally unexpected, point in time?
Something like that would be an ideal form of death, in my opinion. I don't know if you've ever witnessed someone decay and slowly die over a period of time -- the humiliation and agony of natural death -- but if you haven't then I doubt you will understand what I mean.

>> No.13555835

>>13555810
>but if you haven't then I doubt you will understand what I mean.
Of course I have, but I do not think this is relevant and you have ignored my central argument.
Dying is awful, because life was so good, this pretty much means that life HAS to make dying worth it.

Also, you can just avoid natural death, if you have access to a small handgun you can end it anytime and you can tell your family to just pull the plug, if you are at a point where no recovery to a healthy life is plausible, as my mother did.

>> No.13555858

>>13555809
Children are innocent heathen.

>> No.13555866

>>13555835
>Of course I have .... Dying is awful, because life was so good, this pretty much means that life HAS to make dying worth it.
Dying is awful because it's quite often miserable, humiliating, and painful. It is not bad "in comparison." I think you are lying about having observed a prolonged death, as if you had I do not think you would make such a flippant comment like this.
>and you can tell your family to just pull the plug,
I don't know if you're aware of this, but when people are left to die "medically" what it means is that they are abandoned to starve and dehydrate to death. I find medical science to be one of the most horrific aspects of the modern life.

>> No.13555876

>>13555858
If the idea of Children in Hell, even little ones, offends you then that just means you take offence to God. At least I'm not so hypocritical that I say I find no offence with God but rather that he happens to believe everything I already believe anyway, which is the vocation of most Christians. Here is the scripture concerning even the most incipient soul that dies without Christ.

Romans 4:12- Wherefore as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed upon all men, for that ALL have sinned. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression.

>> No.13555886

>>13555807
I think you’re missing my point. If everyone successfully follows anti-natalist rhetoric then eventually all those people will cease to exist and will have removed themselves from the gene pool. Yes, you can pass on anti-natalism before you die, but as more anti-natalists die the less chance you will be able to influence someone who is sympathetic to your cause.

>> No.13555902

>>13555525
Have sex
But use a condom

>> No.13555911

>>13555886
I am the dystheistic antinatalist. To me, its worth it if I can persuade one single child not to be born. I don't concern myself with the pretenses of a movement. I can't keep God's elect from him as it says nothing can pluck them from his hand. I can only persuade that persons who would in any case be damned not be entered into the world in the first place. There really is no downside.

Also what does the Christian who defends natalism have to say for their limited exercise of the procreative discipline? If they have only 1 or 2 children aren't even they conspiring to pluck the elect from God's hand since they could surely have more?

>> No.13555916

>>13555886
anti-natalism is a eugenic program that removes retards who can be convinced of it from the gene pool

>> No.13555942

>>13555916
That’s my point.

>>13555911
Surely you realise that it’s a case of diminishing returns though? That you’ll eventually run out of people gullible enough to fall for it?

>> No.13556007

>>13555535
No. If you literally explain it in a non autismo way and have social tact you can definitly get away with it easy. of course most people here dont have that.

>> No.13556020

>>13555774
Id say pain or dread would be a better arguement.

>> No.13556047

>>13555809
But everything not of God is of your father The Devil. That includes the entire diversity of the philosophies of men, antinatalism included.

>> No.13556049

>>13555578
Duty and utilitarianism? Boy I want 10 pounds of whatever shit you’re on

>> No.13556071

>>13556047
It may be of the Devil in that sense but then so is the entire field of mathematics. It is not chief among the Devil's doctrines though. I mean he who reigns over this earth with God's assent and has "the power of the air" could certainly do more to promote antinatalism than send the idiot David Benatar to entirely discredit it with nonrobust argumentation. The devil has no interest in the nonexistence of persons.

>> No.13556226

>>13555519
psychology is a scam
the'rapists will always find a non-existent "mental disease" so they can profit on

>> No.13556283

>>13555538
why are you not raping women right now instead of posting on this forum?
you are denying people the right of existence and pleasure

>> No.13556294

If anti-natalists hold their beliefs so strongly why not go and spread the good word in Africa where the population is booming?

>> No.13556301

>>13555810
>Something like that would be an ideal form of death, in my opinion.
The ideal form of death is dying in glory and valour you fucking bugman.

>> No.13556312

>>13556294
I unironically have considered this.

>> No.13556328

>>13556312
Every moment you spend in considering is another moment that this "suffering" increases! Go now Anon! Don't stop for shots or anti-malaria! There's no time for that. Get a ticket and go to the Congo.

>> No.13556329

>>13556294
good luck convincing people with lack of basic education

>> No.13556332

>>13556328
You're being ridiculous. Were I to actually follow through with this, I would bring the company of an entire mission.

>> No.13556339

>>13556329
>making excuses
Okay, how about India?
>>13556332
I'm sure you could find others from r/anti-natalism to go with you.

>> No.13556379

>>13556339
I'm not proselytizing