/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.13375573]

Has a single man ever come closer to being completely right?

[Anonymous No.13375590]

>>13375573
>he so wrong Lenin had to do the revolution "his way" to make it work to the point he had to implement market economy through the NEP

And people still praise this brainlet.

[Anonymous No.13375593]

>>13375590
Marx said that the industrialized capitalist nations in western Europe would revolt first so even that didn't go correctly.

[Anonymous No.13375595]

>>13375573
Pic no related

[Anonymous No.13375601]

>>13375573

[Anonymous No.13375602]

>>13375590
>>13375593
Them claiming to be parties aligned with Marx does not make them the communists Marx predicted. They worked as a guide through the transition from feudalism to capitalism.

[Anonymous No.13375610]

[Anonymous No.13375611]

>>13375602
>it wasn't real communism
Every
single
fucking
time

[Anonymous No.13375615]

>>13375602
>Marx predicted
Faggot you think of Marx like mudslimes think of Muhammad, a fucking prophet. You're as delusional as it gets.

[Anonymous No.13375616]

>>13375611
Consider that there's a reason people keep saying that. Maybe because it's correct?

[Anonymous No.13375617]

>>13375611
Show me where the Soviet Union claimed to be communist. They saw themselves on the path to communism.

[Anonymous No.13375621]

>>13375616
>>13375617
No true scotman fallacy.

[Anonymous No.13375623]

The only thing right is the flesh

[Anonymous No.13375625]

>>13375621
whoa... a logical sir... i bet you know all about predicate logic

[Anonymous No.13375628]

>>13375623
What is your endgame?

[Anonymous No.13375630]

>>13375625
Cope harder, tankie. Eternally BTFO.

[Anonymous No.13375631]

>>13375621
That's not what true scotsman fallacy is

[Anonymous No.13375636]

>>13375628
A world of imminently transcendent and transcendentally imminent sensuality.

[Anonymous No.13375639]

Command economies have demonstrated themselves to be the quickest path to industrialization. This triggers the liberals and left libertarians.

[Anonymous No.13375646]

>>13375639
>Command economies have demonstrated themselves to be the quickest path to industrialization.
I agree but it heavily depends on who's in charge. Look at what happened to Venezuela.

[Anonymous No.13375649]

>>13375617
>>13375631
>Show me where the Soviet Union claimed to be communist
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_of_the_Soviet_Union

B-but they weren't communists! Jesus fuck, keep denying reality as much as you want. Going against all reasonable logic if necessary, like the religious zealot you're.

[Anonymous No.13375654]

>>13375649
>>13375617 meant that they never claimed to be in communism, which is correct. They never even saw themselves as beyond state capitalism (Lenin's words, not mine).

[Anonymous No.13375657]

>>13375623
She needs something... what do you think it is?

[Anonymous No.13375661]

>>13375657
A sparring partner (me)

[Anonymous No.13375662]

>>13375623
based sadeposter

[Anonymous No.13375663]

>>13375657
Tridentine baptism

[Anonymous No.13375675]

>>13375654
>They never even saw themselves as beyond state capitalism
Because they can't. Anyone who isn't a brainlet knows communism is an unattainable utopia, just like heaven for christians.

[Anonymous No.13375682]

>>13375675
based and ideologypilled

[Anonymous No.13375686]

>>13375649
>The party pursued state socialism, under which all industries were nationalized and a planned economy was implemented.
From the article you posted. Try again

[Anonymous No.13375689]

Why does this fag get all the attention on lit? Everyone knows social democracy is the right answer.

[Anonymous No.13375692]

>>13375689
Social democracy has failed though.

[Anonymous No.13375694]

>>13375692
based

[Anonymous No.13375703]

>>13375694
>based
upon what?

[Anonymous No.13375704]

>>13375623
What a perfect creature

[Anonymous No.13375714]

>>13375689
>social democracy is the right answer
>thinking there's such a thing as "the right answer" for politics

[Anonymous No.13375728]

>>13375573
Marx was a hack and he was wrong. The poor in capitalist countries aren't starving, they're dying of overeating.

Heinlein disproves of the Marxist theory of value in the span of two pages, in a book about space battles. Marx is a joke at this point.

[Anonymous No.13375733]

>>13375573
Luciferian Materialist. Credited with writing ghost-written material. A philosophy created by and for secret society elitists and international bankers. Guilty of anti-human conspiracism and pedophile apologism by association. Hated liberty. Prideless, stateless, and soulless grandson of Marx Levy (((Mordechai))), "German" rabbi and ethnic alien.

[Anonymous No.13375741]

>>13375728
>>13375728
>Heinlein disproves of the Marxist theory of value in the span of two pages
no he doesn't

[Anonymous No.13375752]

>>13375623
Sauce?

[Anonymous No.13375758]

>>13375573
Yes.

[Anonymous No.13375760]

Not a man, but a woman.

[Anonymous No.13375762]

>>13375741
lol, yes he does. I read it myself... If you make a shit apple pie, it doesn't matter how much work you put in. The value of the product decreases.

[Anonymous No.13375767]

>>13375573
Can you stop making /pol/ threads
Thanks
Sage

[Anonymous No.13375769]

>>13375762
Where does he disprove it? Post proof.

[Anonymous No.13375773]

>>13375762
Anon, your complete inability to bake pies is fascinating and all but I don't see the point of your post.

[Anonymous No.13375897]

yeah

[Anonymous No.13375906]

>>13375769
>>13375773

I don't have the book in front of me... But you could just google it... Like I did just now.

"He had been droning along about "value," comparing the Marxist theory with the orthodox "use" theory. Mr. Dubois had said, "Of course, the Marxian definition of value is ridiculous. All the work one cares to add will not turn a mud pie into an apple tart; it remains a mud pie, value zero. By corollary, unskillful work can easily subtract value; an untalented cook can turn wholesome dough and fresh green apples, valuable already, into an inedible mess, value zero. Conversely, a great chef can fashion of the same material a confection of greater value than a commonplace apple tart, with no more effort than an ordinary cook uses to prepare an ordinary sweet.
"These kitchen illustrations demolish the Marxian theory of value- the fallacy from which the entire magnificent fraud of communism derives- and illustrates the truth of common-sense definition as measured in terms of use."
Dubois had waved his stump at us. "Nevertheless- wap up, back there!- the dishevelled old mystic of Das Kapital, turgid, tortured, confused, and neurotic, unscientific, illogical, this pompous fraud Karl Marx, nevertheless had a glimmering of a very important truth. If he had possessed an analytical mind, he might have formulated the first adequate definition of value... this planet might have been saved endless grief."

That's just a small sample. As I said, if I remember correctly, he does it in about two pages.

[Anonymous No.13375911]

>>13375646
A small country whose economic sector consists largely of one thing and has sanctions and sabotage done against all the while?

[Anonymous No.13375925]

>>13375590
Lenin was in agreement with Marx.

>>13375906
I'm not even sure if this is bait or not. I might answer if someone manages to convince me it's not.

[Anonymous No.13375929]

>>13375925
>Lenin was in agreement with Marx, while also having to do things Marx predicted wouldn't happen
>tfw your proletarian revolution is just Czarist defectors, criminals and peasants but no proles

[Anonymous No.13375937]

>>13375929
>>13375925

>tfw you have to implement market economics to save your socialist revolution from going under.

[Anonymous No.13375949]

>>13375929
Marx never claimed to be a fortune-teller. And there were proles.

>>13375937
Developed capitalism is a precondition for communism according to Marx. Russia had barely escaped feudalism, and it was ruined by 8 years of war.

[Anonymous No.13375954]

>>13375949
Read some books, tankie! baka these dummies.

[Anonymous No.13375955]

>>13375954
I'm not a tankie you retard.

[Anonymous No.13375964]

>>13375955
you sound like a fucking tankie, tankie.

[Anonymous No.13375965]

>>13375733
Marx was antisemitic though.

[Anonymous No.13375968]

>>13375964
Then it's probably you who needs to read those books.

[Anonymous No.13375969]

Why the fuck is all discussion of Marx on this board so pedestrian? Read Capital you pseuds

[Anonymous No.13375976]

[Anonymous No.13375987]

>>13375623
Galatians 5:19-21 King James Version (KJV)
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

[Anonymous No.13375993]

>>13375969
Capital is the pseud reading of Marx moron. You get more marxism out of an ecology textbook than a propaganda book.

[Anonymous No.13376007]

>>13375993
I think you confused Capital with the Manifesto, somehow.

[Anonymous No.13376009]

>>13375993
You haven't read Capital

[Anonymous No.13376018]

>>13375611
maybe read marx then

[Anonymous No.13376041]

>>13375949
>Marx never claimed to be a fortune-teller. And there were proles.
No but the fact that the proles never rose up does undermine the entire concept of class consciousness

[Anonymous No.13376051]

>>13375965
Was literally the grandson of a rabbi, look on Wikipedia.

[Anonymous No.13376062]

>>13375616
>Maybe because it's correct?
it wasn't real communism because real communism can never be implemented you sheltered college rat

[Anonymous No.13376064]

>>13376041
They did, and they will again.

[Anonymous No.13376073]

>>13376064
>they did
no they didnt
>they will again
no they wont

[Anonymous No.13376079]

>>13375968
say's the apologist

[Anonymous No.13376085]

>>13376073
Read up on Paris Commune and on the October Revolution.

[Anonymous No.13376089]

>>13375965

[Anonymous No.13376090]

>>13376051

"What is the worldly religion of the Jew? Huckstering. What is his worldly God? Money.…. Money is the jealous god of Israel, in face of which no other god may exist. Money degrades all the gods of man – and turns them into commodities…. The bill of exchange is the real god of the Jew. His god is only an illusory bill of exchange…. The chimerical nationality of the Jew is the nationality of the merchant, of the man of money in general." - Karl Marx, "On The Jewish Question", 1844

Maybe read more than just the Wikipedia article next time, tankie.

[Anonymous No.13376095]

>>13376090
Maybe read more than just a quote posted on /pol/.

[Anonymous No.13376097]

>>13375993
What better way for a propaganda piece to make itself understood to the masses, than to make it completely incomprehensible to most of them!

[Anonymous No.13376106]

>>13376090
>2.1 ‘On The Jewish Question’

>In this text Marx begins to make clear the distance between himself and his radical liberal colleagues among the Young Hegelians; in particular Bruno Bauer. Bauer had recently written against Jewish emancipation, from an atheist perspective, arguing that the religion of both Jews and Christians was a barrier to emancipation. In responding to Bauer, Marx makes one of the most enduring arguments from his early writings, by means of introducing a distinction between political emancipation — essentially the grant of liberal rights and liberties — and human emancipation. Marx’s reply to Bauer is that political emancipation is perfectly compatible with the continued existence of religion, as the contemporary example of the United States demonstrates. However, pushing matters deeper, in an argument reinvented by innumerable critics of liberalism, Marx argues that not only is political emancipation insufficient to bring about human emancipation, it is in some sense also a barrier. Liberal rights and ideas of justice are premised on the idea that each of us needs protection from other human beings who are a threat to our liberty and security. Therefore liberal rights are rights of separation, designed to protect us from such perceived threats. Freedom on such a view, is freedom from interference. What this view overlooks is the possibility — for Marx, the fact — that real freedom is to be found positively in our relations with other people. It is to be found in human community, not in isolation. Accordingly, insisting on a regime of rights encourages us to view each other in ways that undermine the possibility of the real freedom we may find in human emancipation. Now we should be clear that Marx does not oppose political emancipation, for he sees that liberalism is a great improvement on the systems of feudalism and religious prejudice and discrimination which existed in the Germany of his day. Nevertheless, such politically emancipated liberalism must be transcended on the route to genuine human emancipation. Unfortunately, Marx never tells us what human emancipation is, although it is clear that it is closely related to the idea of non-alienated labour, which we will explore below.

[Anonymous No.13376113]

>>13376095
>>13376106

Does any of this change the fact that he obviously thought Jews were mostly evil capitalists? Or that he thought the God of the jew was money?

Please be precise in your answers

[Anonymous No.13376121]

>>13375911
Sanctions are targeting individuals, not industries. Norway, Saudi Arabia and Russia are all going well despite the oil price, they're not running out of toilet paper anyway

[Anonymous No.13376126]

>>13376085
Anything that lasted more than a few months?

[Anonymous No.13376147]

>>13376113
"Ordo Ad Chao" - Motto of the eternal chosen ones.

[Anonymous No.13376150]

>>13376113
He thought that jews, the same as germans, needed genuine human emancipation. How in is that anti-semitic in any way? He wants the best for both Germans and Jews. Marx might have thought that capitalists (in general) were cunts, but his anti-capitalism doesn't stem from moral judgements.
Now, was the man racist? He was a 19th century white european, of course he was.

[Anonymous No.13376183]

>>13376150
So why are you disputing the fact that he was (by today's standards) an antisemite?

[Anonymous No.13376185]

>>13376126
Yes, the dictatorship of the proletariat in Russia lasted almost a decade.

[Anonymous No.13376188]

>>13376183
Why are you applying today's standards to a person from the 19th century?

[Anonymous No.13376191]

>>13375611
Maybe because it's true lol

[Anonymous No.13376215]

>>13376097
>implying Capital is comprehensible
I always think it's funny when leftcoms say "proles totally can understand Marxist theory" when most educated people already struggle with Capital, let alone the average factory worker.

[Anonymous No.13376229]

>>13376188
I wasn't, other people were. You tankies just got mad because someone spoke ill of your prophet. He was also an antisemite, because the one per cent and the bankers are mostly what?

[Anonymous No.13376255]

>>13376229
>one percent
>the bankers
Did you confuse Marx with Bernie Sanders or something?

[Anonymous No.13376270]

>>13376215
Grundrisse might be said to be difficult to comprehend as it isn't as coherent as Capital (and that's it's virtue in the potential of the concepts worked there), but Capital is pretty straightforward with a good reading comprehension and a basic training on social sciences. Ofcourse that's not the case of average workers.

[Anonymous No.13376323]

>>13375623
God, I wish that were me.