/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.13292123]

how was this man so smart, and has anyone in recent history come close to his level? he was as close to a literal prophet as theres ever been.

[R Æ V S S Q A N D V S !KNDYYIIins No.13292145]

IS THIS THE TWOHUNDREDTH, OR THE THREEHUNDREDTH, NIETZSCHE THREAD OF THE DAY?

[Anonymous No.13292159]

>>13292123
suck his cock then why dontchya

[Anonymous No.13292189]

What the fuck? Why do people think this guy was so intelligent? How much philosophy have you actually read?

[Anonymous No.13292969]

>>13292123
I'm pretty sure prophets were the closest thing to prophets there's ever been.

[Anonymous No.13292980]

>>13292189
post2016 /lit/....I would guess they've skim read some wiki articles and watched some yootoober bullshit

[Anonymous No.13293018]

>>13292980
This

[Anonymous No.13293027]

>>13292189
name a few men more philosophically important

[Anonymous No.13293051]

>>13293027
No one is important, philosophy caters to people who had hard childhoods, reading isn’t for everyone.

[Anonymous No.13293462]

Nietzsche was the living proof that you can only achieve true greatness through a great amount of suffering. He was psychologically tormented. He was lonely. He had health problems. Went nuts before his death but now he's considered one of the greatest thinkers of all time, side by side with Socrates.

[Anonymous No.13293466]

>failed schopenhauer student
I'll pass

[Anonymous No.13293483]

nietzsche said everything and that means he said nothing.

[Anonymous No.13293638]

>>13292123
Why is Nietzsche at once so popular and yet so misunderstood. I've finished reading BG&E recently and it has been explicitly stated several times that he does not believe that humanity can bifurcated into "masters" and "slaves" and he's far too subtle to just say that masters need to rule the world or some shit and yet people talk about how they want to become a Nietzschian "ubermensch".

[Anonymous No.13294255]

>>13293462
People like kant are far more relevant in their impact upon philosophy though. Seriously, you can’t have read much if you think this guy is the be all end all

[Anonymous No.13294272]

>>13292123
>he was as close to a literal prophet
This is what happens when you read Nietzsche with no real knowledge of 19th century thought. You start to think everything he wrote was his own and not merely assumptions inherited from other thinkers as well as the general culture.

[Anonymous No.13294279]

>>13293027
Plato, Aristotle, Aquinas, Kant, Hegel, Marx, Descartes, Carlyle

[Anonymous No.13295175]

>>13292123
Jordan Peterson

[Anonymous No.13295200]

I like Nietzsche because he is overrated just as I was in high school. All the attractive girls with good minds treated me like a prophet even though I just talked about shit in an obtuse fashion.

[Anonymous No.13295217]

>>13293027
>appealing to authority
I hope you don’t think nietzsche would like you

[Anonymous No.13295222]

>>13295200
So why exactly are you saying they had good minds

[Anonymous No.13295292]

>>13292123
He was extremely well read. He was however totally wrong.

[Anonymous No.13295332]

>>13295292
If anonymous says so

[Anonymous No.13295348]

>>13295217
>Nietzsche never appealed to authority
I hope you don't think that you've read Nietzsche

[Anonymous No.13295355]

Because he spent his entire life in isolation. Gives you a lot of time to think. He's also closer to a literary theorist/poet than an actual philosopher.

[Anonymous No.13295377]

>>13292123
None of that’s true but if you want to read a 21st century person who’s on his level check out Mitchell Heisman.

[Anonymous No.13295384]

>>13293462
>one of the greatest thinkers of all time,

How is he?

[Anonymous No.13295390]

>>13295200
what did you tell them

[Anonymous No.13295392]

>>13293462
Maybe that’s why incels are so smart

[Anonymous No.13295398]

>>13293462
Only undergrads and brainlets would consider him on the same level as Socrates. He’s a second rate thinker. Which is still impressive.

[Anonymous No.13295404]

>>13295355
>closer to a literary theorist/poet than an actual philosopher.
His work is about the most important Philsophical issue, morality.

[Anonymous No.13295413]

>>13292123
I don't really get the hype

I only read l like 1/4th of beyond good and evil, but I read a lot of Evola who responds to him often.

Do I just need to seriously sit down and get into his writings? I never hear his ideas being interesting when mentioned second hand

[Anonymous No.13295415]

>>13295404
Yup morality only exists because of literature. It's the poetic comprehension of the world.

[Anonymous No.13295416]

>>13295404
Ahah ahaha hahahahahahahahaha

[Anonymous No.13295421]

>>13295413
> Thinks Evola understood Nietzsche and second-hand interpretations are accurate
Go back to /pol anon. The big boy works aren't for you.

[Anonymous No.13295439]

>>13295415
>morality only exists because of literature
Literature is moralizing but never discusses morality

[Anonymous No.13295464]

>>13295439
Literature attempts to articulate our emotions using examples.

[Anonymous No.13295487]

>>13295413
>I don’t really get the hype
>I’ve never even read any of his works
Dude just fuck off

[Anonymous No.13295490]

>>13292123
People like him, Tesla, Van Gogh etc have this reverence from regular people which I don't understand. They're socially stunted autists who'd be shunned by people today if they were still alive (and not famous). And yet these fuckers have audacity to claim they relate to them.

[Anonymous No.13295494]

>>13295464
I don't disagree. I'm saying that philosophy studies these feelings, questions them and values them. It's what Plato does in most of his early work. He criticizes the popular notions of what's good and right, values them and challenges them using his dialectics; that's why he often cites poetry.

[Anonymous No.13295495]

>>13295490
Like Richard Spencer lol?

[Anonymous No.13295496]

>>13295421
>>13295487
Nobody has ever explained Nietzche's ideas where they sounded interesting.

When I first heard Evola's ideas explained, it instantly sounded interesting. That's why I bought and read the book.

[Anonymous No.13295504]

>>13295494
Plato was taught as a liberal globalist when I first read him in Philosophy years ago... Had to reread, but philosophy has become pure shit and all about how liberal globalism is so moral and right taught by overweight neckbeards and bald woman in shitty clothing.

[Anonymous No.13295507]

>>13295496
Because he has many ideas and most of them are contradictory. Don't read him if you're bored. The first 1/4 of BGAE was the establishment of Will to Power and a criticism of philosophy, so IDK what to tell you.

[Anonymous No.13295521]

>>13295496
Philosophy probably just isn’t for you then. Nietzsche, and philosophy in general, has a much more nuanced and complicated diagnosis of life beyond Evola’s esoteric approach which is that modernity = bad
I would still give BGE another try though, iirc it gets very interesting with much simpler ideas later into the book

[Anonymous No.13295529]

>>13295521
>Philosophy probably just isn’t for you then. Nietzsche
No I still read a lot of philosophy, I just don't get the Nietzche hype.

Evola said that Nietzche was smart and prophetic but his observations were just the dissolution of the epoch and there is no materialist solution to what Nietzche was observing.

[Anonymous No.13295531]

>>13295504
>Plato was taught as a liberal globalist
Even when he outright says that foreigners must not be allowed to spend too much time in the polis? Or when he scorns merchants? Or when he outright says that a perfect polis is a closed one? When he says it's a necessity to control who fucks whom and who is born?
You went to a shit uni, man

[Anonymous No.13295534]

>>13295529
You should read primary sources if you want to criticize an author

[Anonymous No.13295540]

>>13295529
So you're just basing your opinions exactly off Evola? A completely frivolous man who wanted to reach God. Also, somebody that uses "hype" describing anything other than a video game or sports ball game should not be reading Nietzsche to begin with. Philosophy does not exist for your sophomoric judgments on it. Read it and maybe you'll learn something. If not then waste your time with a midget Magician with a monocle.

[Anonymous No.13295543]

>>13295531
Funnily enough we just skipped those parts lol.

[Anonymous No.13295548]

>>13295529
Yes and that’s why Nietzsche wasn’t a materialist. The ubermensch is a metaphysical idea.
As other anons said, you should read Nietzsche for yourself and decide, rather than just taking someone else’s opinion

[Anonymous No.13295553]

>>13294255
>People like kant are far more relevant in their impact upon philosophy though.

Irrelevant. What old dusty academics jerk off to the most shouldn't be used to judge the values of though.

[Anonymous No.13295555]

[Anonymous No.13295559]

>>13295553
Academic philosophers are parasites. Reading any of their works that are longer than 100 pages is a waste of time.

[Anonymous No.13295570]

>>13295543
???
You're supposed to read the books cover to cover

[Anonymous No.13295576]

>>13295555
Spengler was an unironic time traveler so he doesn’t count

[Anonymous No.13295585]

>>13295570
No our teacher only assigned us certain sections. I read it on my own though.

[Anonymous No.13295594]

>>13295540
>>13295548
No the anon just brought up evola and said that his opinions were "modern=bad" and I was clarifying Evola's opinion of Nietzche

I'm still going to check out Nietzche just cuz I keep reading other authors responding to him and I don't know what they're talking about.

>You can't use "Hype" on a philosopher!!
Why not? Who do you think picks and chooses the philosophers that are remembered and "Relevant" to history? A bunch of faggots who hype and hide people depending on their agenda

[Anonymous No.13295600]

>>13295507
>he has many ideas and most of them are contradictory
Yeah, I found it quite weird how he would state something in one instance, but would contradict/say the opposite just 20 pages later.

[Anonymous No.13295607]

>>13295600
Typically happens with thinkers who aren't rooted in something static. They just shoot off anything interesting that comes to mind. Can be entertaining though

[Anonymous No.13295618]

>>13295594
I don't understand his historical relevance.** See you're already 5 iq points higher than you were a few minutes ago now that you clarified what you meant by hype.

[Anonymous No.13295620]

>>13295607
A lot of it is just thought experiments. That's why its written in aphorisms.

[Anonymous No.13295636]

>>13295618
I'm not saying whether he's objectively relevant or not. I'm saying that crooning about using the word "Hype" on a philospher's legacy is retarded and cringe

>IQ 5 points higher!
You are low IQ

[Anonymous No.13295638]

>>13295636
It's a dude-bro Campfire word that Hemingway would even laugh at. Fuck off anon, have fun with your Evola and magic kit.

[Anonymous No.13295640]

>>13295638
>It's a dude-bro Campfire word
So?
>Hemingway
Faggot
>Have fun with your Evola and magic kit
Evola didn't actually believe in magic you snarky woman

[Anonymous No.13295643]

>>13292145
kys

[Anonymous No.13295651]

>>13295640
> Evola denied being a fascist and instead referred to himself as a "superfascist".
Very intelligent and articulate man. I can see what the appeal is. I'm not a 4channer, I'm a super4channer.

[Anonymous No.13295662]

>>13295651
Pretty sure he was using this in terms of ‘supra’ the same as Nietzsche’s ‘superman’ mean’t ‘beyond man’. So he was ‘beyond fascism’

[Anonymous No.13295666]

>>13295651
Yeah he was mocking them. He wrote about fascism being too populist-modernist

>I'm a super4channer
good one

[Anonymous No.13295668]

>>13295662
So he can't even make his own terms. His philosophy is just the Divine Comedy with fascism as the means to transcendence.

[Anonymous No.13295677]

>>13295668
>His philosophy is just the Divine Comedy with fascism as the means to transcendence.
He wasn't even fascist you drooling retard, he literally has entire books critiquing national socialism and Italian fascism

[Anonymous No.13295682]

>>13295677
He clearly was a fascist and was close friends with Mussolini. He's effectively irrelevant today because of the Theocratic Multiculturalism establishment, so even if he is profound it'd be hard to say unless I actually read him. What have u read by him anon?

[Anonymous No.13295695]

>>13295682
>He clearly was a fascist and was close friends with Mussolini
He wrote a doctrine on spiritual race for the Italian Fascist government and then left because they weren't on board with his ideology. Then he went to Nazi Germany where they despised his rejection of biological race and actually ordered people to spy on him while in Germany to make sure he didn't undermine their agenda.

He sympathized with fascism because he thought it might be a stepping stone away from liberalism/modernity towards Theocratic Traditionalism.

>What have u read by him
Revolt against the modern world, ride the tiger, the metaphysics of war, the metaphysics of sex, and skimmed his books on nat soc/fascism

[Anonymous No.13295699]

>>13295695
I'll read Revolt.

[Anonymous No.13295713]

>>13295699
Revolt is probably the last of Evola’s books you ought to read because it’s extremely dense and hard to comprehend without understanding his esoteric philosophy.
I’d recommend Ride the Tiger to start to get an idea of his philosophy

[Anonymous No.13295724]

>>13295713
>I’d recommend Ride the Tiger to start to get an idea of his philosophy
Nah don't start with Ride the tiger, like 100 pages of that book are just him responding to 20th century philosophers. Honestly it's the worst of his books besides the last 50 pages where he talks about degenerate plebians going to the beach

I tell people to just dive into Revolt

[Anonymous No.13295753]

>>13295724
Yeah but his diagnosis of modernity, and responses to and critiques of all of the nihilist and existentialist canon gives a good outline of where he stands philosophically, as well as his remedy for it as esoteric transcendence.
Having read Revolt first, it seemed much more accessible.

[Anonymous No.13295911]

>>13295724
The beggining where he talks about Marx and Nietzsche was great though, it's after that that it became boring to me.

[Anonymous No.13296150]

>>13293483
wow jaden das deep

[Anonymous No.13296270]

>>13292123
Honestly I keep reading Nietszche and it's very frustrating because the writing is boring and the ideas themselves seem incredibly mundane and pedestrian and he just repeats himself over and over again and completely fails to participate in any meaningful introspection.

People talk about reading nietszche and it chaning their life but every one of his big gob smacking ideas seems incredibly obvious and simple-minded to me. please change my mind..

[Anonymous No.13296412]

>>13292123
>how was this man so smart
Because Classical Education, and lots of dedication to philology. The guy really immersed 24/7 into ancient Greeks and Romans since fucking childhood.

[Anonymous No.13296426]

>>13296412

[Anonymous No.13296463]

>>13294279
>Hegel
Isn't this the guy, whom Schopenhauer accused of being a literal charlatan?

[Anonymous No.13296486]

I’ve never met any good person who seriously likes Nietzsche. It seems as everyone who is obsessed with this man is diabolical and ill-intentioned, as well as particularly dogmatic in their evil notions. And the worst thing is, they usually believe themselves to be good, or to know the greater good. They are dangerous people.
Nietzsche causes a huge impression on particular men, almost always ones who are already hateful, presumptuous and weak.

[Anonymous No.13296501]

>>13296486
>good
>evil
What the fuck do these words even mean? You speak nonsense.

[Anonymous No.13296505]

>>13295398
Fuck off Socrates

[Anonymous No.13296541]

>>13295490
retard

[Anonymous No.13296632]

>>13295529
You don't "get the hype" because you have not read him thoroughly enough. If you did, you would know that all of philosophy and politics since him has either been an aping of him or backlash towards what he said.

[Anonymous No.13296636]

>>13296486
I believe in Jesus Christ and really enjoy Nietzsche, his prose is enjoyable and excuse my language - Really makes you think.

[Anonymous No.13297014]

>>13296636
This. I find myself cringing sometimes at his fedora-tipping treatment of Christianity but his ideas and prose are unparalleled

[Anonymous No.13297084]

>>13297014
>his fedora-tipping treatment of Christianity
Nietzsche is probably much more competent to speak on behalf of Christianity than you. He was a son of pastor and willingly memorized whole parts of Bible by heart in childhood.

[Anonymous No.13297102]

>>13296486
Define "good person"

[Anonymous No.13297132]

>>13297084
>A highly polemical figure is more competent to speak on Christianity because they memorised verse
What?

[Anonymous No.13297149]

>>13297132
Not who you replied to, but Nietzsche was a very diligent reader and articulate child. There is a reason why he became one of the youngest professors in the world at the time. Academic boards across Europe acknowledged his intelligence.

[Anonymous No.13297197]

>>13293638
Average reading comprehension is worse than you think and people here are especially zelous about "authors" and their "positions" as if something was so easily static

[Anonymous No.13298989]

>>13296486
>I’ve never met any good person who seriously likes Nietzsche.
>'good' person

get a load of this slave.

[Anonymous No.13299002]

>>13296426
This isn’t that great for the time. De Quincey could already do a better greek oration than any of his professors by the time he was 9

[Anonymous No.13299065]

>>13295651
supra 4 channer.
>>13296150
truth can be spoken even from jaden's mouth.
>>13296501
slicing throats for no reason, what do you call that?

Nietzsche was great, however he should not be read by people with no grounding in philosophy because that creates people like >>13297102
>>13296501 who completely miss the point of slave master morality and subvert the terms unknowingly.

[« Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ » |mxvabloSIE No.13299078]

>>13299065
You're not getting Nitschke. Read more Stirner and Richard Wolff

[Anonymous No.13299094]

>>13299078
>implying nietzsche has only one facet in his writings that can be "gotten".
You have not understood him, probably didnt read him in german.

[Anonymous No.13300576]

>>13294279
you forgot Goonan

[Anonymous No.13300843]

>>13295398
Based Socrates BTFO Nicheboi even before he was born

[Anonymous No.13300847]

>>13295332
If anonymous says no

[Anonymous No.13300854]

>>13295543
>Funnily enough
It was on purpose.

[Anonymous No.13300861]

>>13295576
>was an unironic time traveler
Care to explain?

[Anonymous No.13300877]

Wilfrid Sellars :)

[Anonymous No.13300880]

>>13293638
Alot of it is because his sister was a German Nationalist and anti-semite and when Nietzsche went catatonic she inherited his estate. She was a far better publicist than Nietzsche could have ever hoped for and she managed to make him very popular in Germany, but she also published a lot of Nietzsche's unfinished writing and edited them to promote her own politics. Then in the 1930s his work was under threat of being banned and so Nietzsche's estate published reviews of his work that promoted the parts of his work that could be twisted to seem to fit Nazi ideology. He then became popular with the Hitler youth and this fact made its way over to the UK and America where it combined with the fact that there weren't any good translations of his work and you get the web of confusion and misinformation that we have today.

[Anonymous No.13300885]

>>13296486
I think I know what you're saying but I think it's you who are weak. I get the impression you don't want to take risk in assigning value to much. Your sentiment is in line with our times. The fewer and fewer strong men the world produces the greater and greater the fear of them coming back into style seems to be.

By not wanting to commit to a value system, judgment, etc., you are still implicitly condoning/selecting a value system and categorizing judgment. This is just cowardliness. There is no way around it. Leaving things alone to flow as they will is a particular direction is a vote in favor of that direction.

[Anonymous No.13300897]

>>13295570
It's pretty common in undergrad philosophy courses to only be assigned sections of a book that are relevant to the lectures. Especially in intro courses where they have to cover Plato, Aristotle, Aquinas, Anselm, Descartes, Locke, Hume, Kant and more in a single semester.

[Anonymous No.13301190]

>>13300897
not this poster but would like to add that it provides a sinister avenue towards radicalization and if anyone in undergrad is reading this please go above and beyond your assigned malarkey, it'll save you a lot of heartbreak later.

[Anonymous No.13301200]

You give him too much credit, Nietzsche has been debunked many times...

[Anonymous No.13301210]

>>13296463
Scopenhauer and Nietszche aren't relevant outside of online shitposting groups. Unlike Hegel who is a philosophical titan.

[Anonymous No.13301222]

>>13293027
Almost every single person in France from 1600 onwards

[Anonymous No.13301247]

>>13301210
Hurrrr

[Anonymous No.13301363]

>>13299065
>slicing throats for no reason, what do you call that?
You do realise that Roman word "bonus/duonus/duenos" (good) is etymologically related to "bellum" (war) and "duellum" (duel).

Furthermore, modern linguistics derive them from Indo-European *dew- (“to injure, destroy, burn”),
Also, Slavic "дoбpo" (good) is cognate of Armenian "darbin" (warsmith).

So, with that information, let me ask you again: what the fuck does "good" mean?
And why your judgement on "slicing throats" should matter here at all?

[Anonymous No.13301374]

>>13299065
>completely miss the point of slave master morality
NO U

[Anonymous No.13301375]

>>13301210
you have no idea what youre talking about lol, especially Nietzsche

[Anonymous No.13301441]

>>13301210
Hegel: teleology (debunked), dialectics (disregarded as worthless shit), idealism (undefendable claim nowadays), consciousness/matter dichotomy (eliminativism debunks this).

Nietzsche: the problem of nihilism (relevant still); the environmentally-based nature of morality;
the illusionary nature of subjectivity/consciousness/etc (the "It" that thinks; true, neuroscience confirms it); the fallibility of knowledge due to cognitive biases ("God" as the product of grammar); etc.
The guy at his 19th century was ahead of his time, pinpoiting what is now the fucking common sense (of intellectual people at least).

[Anonymous No.13301540]

>>13301374
what is the point exactly? not him, just wondering if im interpreting it right. i take it very literally

[Anonymous No.13301549]

>>13295392
kek, this

copelets

[Anonymous No.13301567]

>>13301540
"Master morality": dude tells others what is "good". His definition of "good" is what makes him powerful via constant overcoming. If he's successful, others are convinced in his defintion.
Also, the dichotomy is not "good/evil", but rather "good/despicable"

"Slave morality": people hate master's morality, because they don't fit in into that definition. Therefore, they brand master's virtues as "evil" and build their image of "good" as a grotesque mirror of their master's.
Wherether master's definition of "good" was environmentally/externally based, the slaves internalise it, and literally persist with whatever dogma they had adopted. Even if it doesn't fit in environment at all, literally killing or degrading them.

[Anonymous No.13301576]

>>13300880
His sister sounds alot more based and redpilled then Nietzsche

[Anonymous No.13302368]

bump

[Anonymous No.13302716]

>>13301441
It was already common sense you fucking idiot

[Anonymous No.13302746]

>>13302716
Nope. In 19th century we had:
1. Fucking socialists. Either prudonian "capitalism is immoral" variety or marxist "dialectics laws of history" shit.
2. Fucking Spencer and other social-darwinists with their teleology.
3. Fucking schopenhaurians with their "Life is suffering, therefore living is bad".
4. Fucking hegelians and other idealists with their world-spirit.
5. etc.
Nietzsche was in stark contrast to the mainstream philosophy of that time.

[Anonymous No.13302874]

>>13301441
>the illusionary nature of subjectivity/consciousness/etc (the "It" that thinks; true, neuroscience confirms it);
Can you expand on this?
t.brainlet.

[Anonymous No.13302951]

>>13302874
Your "I" is a product of your body - your cognition is predetermined by your physiology and by reactions of your physiology to the outside world. You are literally constantly being externally MADE to think what you think.
Your will is a consequence and not a cause - you merely acknowledge the actions your body has already commited.
You mistake causality and falsely attribute causes to other abstract notions.

That's pretty much the same gist that neurosciences give you. Split-brain experiments, where humans (with surgically split brain due to epilepsy) confabulate and assume agency and responsibility of their actions, despite being externally manipulated, for example.

[Anonymous No.13303052]

>>13302951
So we just "ARE".

[Anonymous No.13303099]

>>13303052
Pretty much

[Anonymous No.13303106]

>>13301441
>Hegel: teleology
Read the Science of Logic

[Anonymous No.13303107]

>>13302746
Cringe. 9/10 of his ideas preceded him. I can’t think of anything that didn’t save his useless classification of master/slave morality

[Anonymous No.13303118]

>>13302951
>sometimes you think you will what you don’t, therefore you never really will anything
Brilliant

[Anonymous No.13303144]

>>13303118
It's experimentally proven, that your volition happens post hoc. It's science already.

[Anonymous No.13303169]

>>13303107
And all philosophy is just mere commentary on Plato.

[Anonymous No.13303183]

>>13303169
nice dodge

[Anonymous No.13303192]

>>13303144
>It's experimentally proven
>sometimes, you don't will what you think you do, therefore you never do
>you report that you felt this way, therefore you really did feel this way during a complex process that occurs in a fraction of a second and your memory of it is totally accurate

[Anonymous No.13303197]

>>13301576
Tautological.

[Anonymous No.13304301]

>>13295175
this

[Anonymous No.13304470]

>>13303169
*Footnotes to Plato.
Plagiarise properly nigga.

[Anonymous No.13304519]

>>13292123
Big man Nietzsche with the big brain